You people are crazy... you realise that baibes.. are probably the LEAST in need ofANY medical care as they are so BRAND NEW. Unless they have some disease or something else just leave them alone. You may be damaging their development.
Back in the '80s the big chiropractic selling pitch, which made sense, was, "A back adjustment unlocks surrounding muscles and tissue etc and returns the spinal cord to the virgin shape it was in when you were a newborn." They explained how life's daily stresses, sitting, standing etc. alters spines from their original state: that of a newborn baby! So now the medical profession has created a new market. No body is more pliable, wonderful, brand new and pure than a newborn's. What total CRAP!
@ceetheflush Did you go to school? Do you know nothing of the human body? Your 37 and have no idea how the human body works? You probably think Physics is a joke too.
@ChoochWrestlingMerch You idiot, the neck at this age is not "cracked", its a non osseous movement. Go by a dictionary for the holidays and look it up
@ChoochWrestlingMerch They dont "crack" infants necks you ignoramous. Go watch babies necks getting twisted 180 degrees during the birth process and then tell me they don't need gentle spinal care.
@ChoochWrestlingMerch What's "cracking" That sounds bad. I didn't see any cracking here. What I saw was a timely, specific and holy adjustment. Chiropractors are so intensively trained they are qualified to be primary care physicians. They read radiographs better than medical doctors and treat the cause of disease and not just the symptoms. You really need to do more research on this before you make another erroneous comment.
No as a neuroscientist I get my facts from the facts. How about this sunshine (notice that I have refrained from lowering myself to your level and calling you what you obviously are). The Canadian College of Physicians and Surgeons has recommended banning all chiropractic manipulations in infants and children and that the data are that currently over 300,000 persons have died or been left completely bedridden from brain stem strokes caused by neck manipulations. Sandy Nette's story.
@drneurochick Maybe you will also realize that those "cases" that you have noted are incorrect. There hasn't been a single case of anybody dying from a chiropractic adjustment. Maybe you can cite where you got this information?
like I care what you think. The medical world is backed by scientific proof. If you took a minute to read the context, you'd see I was replying to the idiot that said chiros had the same medical training as real doctors. I haven't been duped by anyone. Facts are facts. Go back to your quack you stupid bitch.
For those of you who are fighting over chiropractors being quacks or anything else related to belittling the profession. Grow the hell up! They have the exact same medical training as any other doctor, they just have a different style of treatment. I love chiropractors and everything they do. They helped me with my scoliosis and it's completely cured. Btw if you don't like them don't watch the videos.
@sonnyofagunny they do not have the same medical training. they go to a 4 year school for chiropractors. the learn nothing of medicine or how to apply it. You were not helped by a chiropractor, you were just duped into believing so.
Unfortunately, your ignorance is worse than the chiropractors who are 'quacks'. I think the medical world of drugs and surgeries have duped you into thinking pain killers and anti-inflammatories for muscle and joint pain are the best way to go. But you are right, chiropractors have chiropractic training, medical physicians have medical training. I cannot be more impressed with your intelligence.
@dcho1990 like I care what you think. The medical world is backed by scientific proof. If you took a minute to read the context, you'd see I was replying to the idiot that said chiros had the same medical training as real doctors. I haven't been duped by anyone. Facts are facts. Go back to your quack you stupid bitch.
@davidkyle77 lol what planet are you from? I was helped by a chiropractor. It took me years to get to one, and I spent so much money and dealt with side effects from pain medicine, and then finally I had relief from years of pain - after ONE visit.
@ChoochWrestlingMerch Why don't you look into a live birth and see how much force and rotation is put on the child's neck during delivery. Do I expect you to go do this? Not at all considering your name includes wrestling merchandise.
If you're logic is that baby cry when baby upset only, then you are the ignorant one. An added stimulus can make anyone upset. If you happen to know the effect of the parasympathetic nervous system after an adjustment, you would know that there is an increase in activity. And the baby was never upset for the record.
@ChoochWrestlingMerch It's bigots like you who shame this world. Do you even know the extent of the human body and what it can withstand even at a birth? Or even how the ligaments and joints work of the human body? How about even counting to 100? Professionals know what they are doing so do come here writing some BS you know you are just basing off of your own opinion. Go touch a hot stove or drown yourself in a puddle of water or whatever dumbasses like yourself do in their spare time.
If anyone has ever witnessed a live vaginal, or C-Section birth, and seen the TRAUMA of it all to the baby's head, neck, spine, pelvis, and hips by the process you'd realize the forces applied by a skilled therapist are meager. Clamping a suction cup to child head and twisting/ pulling for 1 to 4 hours through a tiny hole is barbaric in comparison. We are very resilient. People should be more concerned with the questionable series of immunizations the kids get than mild joint manipulations.
"The pelvic diaphragm was locked up because of the right side of his sacrum..." Are you kidding me?! Does that make sense to anyone? Do people not ask questions??
It refers to the musculature of the pelvic floor. It plays a large part in bowel control/function. 4 muscles referred to as the levator ani. 2 of them directly attach to the coccyx which is attached to the sarum. The others attach to the pubic rami of the individual pelves. Kids will colic will at times "crap" within seconds of properly manipulating the sacrum. Quick, effective, painless, drugless option for some. Its been utilized safely for over a century by DO's and DC's.
@Lechelover The fact that you support the mere existence of DC's for over a century shows you lack the cognitive capacity to rationally question what they are doing.
She was being facetious...it's called baby talk. If I said you were the dumbest person on the planet, I would be facetious...you may score extremely well on standardized exams for all I know.
Grostic, NUCCA, and FUCA are good techniques for infants. Traction does not help. When the atlas is shifted It will remain in the same dynamic, and will not change. Only an outside force will correct the shifted atlas.
@noliesundead not when you're an infant, most aren't. Hence why your skull can expand to accommodate your growing brain as you age. They're mostly fused after a year or so. But I do doubt she's "adjusting" anything with the baby's skull.
Stanford460c is a paid homo who trolls around youtube and facebook spreading lies about vaccines and how good they are because he is paid to do so by PR people who represent GSK and Taylor&Hilt aka vaccine makers.
The vaccine Gardisill has caused 1,409 cases of instant death in the united states, 640 in Japan, and was banned in Norway, sweeden and germany, sense 2009 431 cases of Paralysis due to neuro auto immune responses have been recorded directly from THIS vaccine, not to mention it contains Sodium Fluoride, a deadly neuro toxin known to cause bone cancer. fuck stanford640c he is a disinformation idiot, paid to post pro vaccine propaganda.
Dont EVER listen to idiots like Stanford640c, instead go look up what the top neurologists and medical doctors have to say about vaccines, just google Nutrimedical Report, Dr. Bill Deagle, Dr. Rebeca Carley Dr. Joseph Mercolia, Dr. Henery L Nmyman, the facts cannot be debated, vaccines are ALL designed to give you illness, the very sicentific idea of vaccines defies every point of logic in medicine, unless you give people shit illnesses that they must by your product for to stay alive.
now i get the point of theres baby chiropractic care they create problems when theyre a baby so when there older theyll continue to come in the future
My advice is stop poisoning your children with vaccines and other drugs. Get them adjusted or not, I really don't give a shit. But to all you uninformed and ignorant assholes spewing your uneducated comments....fuck you. If you believe the the bs your family dr and the drug companies tell you, you are a fool. MOST doctors don't even vaccinate their children. Noah wasn't vaccinated and he lived to be over 450 years old and I am pretty certain things were not as sanitary in his day as now.
@kmckamey I'm going to copy your comment and post in on my facebook page as I want everyone to read this. Your comment needs to be read by everyone who vaccinates their children! Best comment I've read in ages.
what you fail to understand is the science behind this. vaccinations are an essential part of human survival. some of the greatest diseases have been eliminated as a result of vaccinations such as small pox. ofcourse there are going to be anomalies with any treatment but given the effects of vaccinations are so powerful it is incorrect and extremely in poor judgement to place a blanket comment that all vaccinations are bad for you.
@stanford640c you are a mother fucking idiot moron lying piece of shit. VACCINES ARE EUGENICS THEY HAVE NEVER CURED ONE ILLNESS ONLY CAUSED AUTO IMMUNE ILLNESSES LIKE Parkinson's, ALZHEIMER, MS, NEUROLOGICAL DISORDERS, a vaccine is NOT an inoculation, nor does it work in the same fashion, small pox and other illness were NOT wiped out by vaccination, because all VACCINES are MAN MADE IN A LAB USING ENGINEERED CULTURES, INOCULATION WAS TOTALLY DIFFERENT, GET YOU FUCKING FACTS STRAIGHT.
The fact you have lost your temper means you have lost the argument. Given the lack of your grammatical ability you have not made any valid points other than just swear. Are you even a medical professional to justify your points? or have you just picked up on random incidences and blown it out of proportion.
@stanford640c no it means you are a fucking disinformation lying faggot idiot and that im a real man because i want to fucking rip your jaw apart for lying to people, only a weak little coward bitch hides behind his fake lies and ignores the facts and proof and tries to sound smart by covering his lies with more lies. WHen it comes to the choice between beleiveing what a neurologist says and some faggot on youtube, i wonder who is right. Neurologist says all vaccines are eugenics.
@Burnpnac "Neurologist says all vaccines are eugenics'......That nice billy, can they prove this? no. can you? no. no matter how good their OPINION is, its just that, until they can prove that claim.
@stanford640c Whoah there big man we dont have to get a big boner on the internet, Yeah... thats right, THE INTERNET!!!! Not realy life so nobody gives a shit about your opinion or that you can sound fancy with your comments.
You made a comment regarding the intrepretation of vaccination and inoculation (both of which I have not mentioned in my previous post). If you truly get into the definition of both terms, inoculation referes to the introduction of a live substance whereas a vaccination refered to the introduction of weakend stubstance. Both induce an antibody response to protect the individual.Anyway i wish you well on your crusade to stop vaccines. Don't give up on your day job as an uneducated individual.
@stanford640c you are a fucking moron, vaccines are mutated, recombinant DNA and merge with the bodies T cells what the FUCK are you even talking about, you dont even know the first thing between the two, must suck to be owned by someone who is uneducated like me. Somehow im going to believe one of the top doctors on earth, Dr. Bill Deagle instead of some retard who cant even get the definition of what a vaccine IS right.....
Bill Deagle??!!?? Firstly i'm not a paid person to post propaganda on the internet, I was correcting your ignorance. Secondly Bill Deagle is one of the biggest fraud in medical history. I do not even live in United States and we have heard of Bill Deagle here. The reason why I am replying is that I am a medical professional and work with colleagues who are leading in their profession and not some random youtube, paid, propagandist.
@stanford640c yea the top NASA doctor who worked on the star wars project and invented MiCell d-3 is a fraud....now your showing YOUR ignorance, ok dont like him, how about Dr. Rebecca Carley, Joseph Mercollia, Dr. Russel Blaylock, you cant say SHIT about blaylock he is the most sought after neurologist and neuro surgeon in the world, so your trying to tell me that you know more than all of these TOP doctors, the best of the best, who are telling people, vaccines are eugenics ??? fuck you
I see there is a big argument going on, just going to say that's a really cute baby. Idk if this actually works, I probably wouldn't do it but really cute baby.
@RealityGrapple Really, and you mess up functional hypothesis and theory. You would think someone who writes scientific papers would know the difference.
So get back to me in a few months, after you've had time to actually learn something about this subject you're so certain about. Because to this point, from where I sit, this is as pointless as any other discussion with any other brand of delusional fundamentalist.
@RealityGrapple So get back to me in a few months, after you've had time to actually learn something about this subject you're so certain about.
Yes, that's right. I have so much to learn. From you apparently. Like how to link journals to prove my point and yet avoid reading them, their methods and their conclusions. Apparently I should learn that scientific consensus isn't really needed, I just have to cherry pick what I want to read.
Someday, when you grow up, IF you grow up, you'll come to understand that what you're actually doing here, is arguing from belief. Certainly not from evidence. As is clear, you haven't familiarized yourself with the research of the field (Acupuncture). That much is obvious. You're just another member of the self important youtube brigade of pseudointellectual know nothings who somehow trick themselves into thinking they champion rationality or science. It's pathetic.
@RealityGrapple You're right of course. Why should, someone who has spent years of his life earning a bachelor of science in biochemistry ignore your clear superiority of "basic science in college". I should defer to your interpretation of what is "scientifically valid" based on your generic entry level grounding in all the sciences, despite you never even having to critically analyze a paper. :D
@Rundvelt Sigh. You don't know shit about my education, and I'm certainly not impressed by whatever yours did for you. My only point is, you have nothing to teach me about science or its methods, and you for damn sure don't know anything at all about this particular subject. You get hung on on irrelevant points, you can't understand simple analogies, and you lie.
you're a disgrace. you're as hopeless as any other fundamentalist know nothing.
@RealityGrapple You get hung on on irrelevant points, you can't understand simple analogies, and you lie.
Oh poopsy woopsy, it's all right. Did the mean man say some nasty words? Don't worry, mommykins will make it all better. Come sit down and have a glass of milk with your cookie.
@RealityGrapple You don't know shit about my education, and I'm certainly not impressed by whatever yours did for you. My only point is, you have nothing to teach me about science or its methods, and you for damn sure don't know anything at all about this particular subject.
Yes, mine only allowed me to objectively analyze claims made by people like you. People who despite being shown evidence that disagrees with their position state "you don't know crap." An intelligent retort.
@RealityGrapple Sigh. You don't know shit about my education,
You're right. I don't. Just like how you don't know mine. I have to use clues to discover what level of education you have. Like the clue that you think it's a reasonably good idea to go to a biased source for information. I doubt that any educated person would advise this as a reasonable method about learning about a subject. Because clearly, for me to make judgements on terrorism, I should head over to Tehran. :)
I'm not gonna do this dance with you all day, but maybe, if you posessed legitimate intellectual curiosity, you could contact the folks at the American Academy of Medical Acupuncture for information more to your liking. Before you after you read the work of Dr Eddy and wrap your little head around the idea that 80% of modern medicine, doesn't meet the definition of 'evidence based'. My only point here is to tell you what an arrogant prick you are. You truly are.
@RealityGrapple , but maybe, if you posessed legitimate intellectual curiosity, you could contact the folks at the American Academy of Medical Acupuncture for information more to your liking.
Yes, that makes so much sense. I'll contact the organization that would become bankrupt if acupuncture was shown to be a sham. Clearly they wouldn't be biased in their analysis of the information.
@Rundvelt "I'll contact the organization that would become bankrupt if acupuncture was shown to be a sham." Idiot, it's just a bunch of doctors sharing research. They all have private practices. It's not a source of income. Fucking moron.
@RealityGrapple you said: and wrap your little head around the idea that 80% of modern medicine, doesn't meet the definition of 'evidence based'.
You don't seem to grasp the concept of foundation. Scientific hypothesis based on previous proven work are far more valid then hypothesis that are based on cultural healing practices. By your "logic", an experimental drug that is based off of lab tests on rats is equally as valid as a belief that ki pinpoints being priced increase your health
@RealityGrapple you said: My only point here is to tell you what an arrogant prick you are. You truly are.
The resounding sound of the loser. The stuides you present do not pass scientific muster despite claiming they are, you mix up hypothesis with theory, you don't grasp the concept that everything in science is questionable and you seem to think it's a good idea to ask a biased organization for information.
Dude, you've got to be a troll. No one is this slow. You got me.
@Rundvelt I gave you a bit of help in terms of finding studies validating SOME uses of acupuncture. There are many, many more, some appearing in high quality peer reviewed journals. You're just as capable of looking on pubmed as I am, but I have nothing to prove here. Quit pretending to be some kind of expert. I've taken graduate courses in biology, microbiology, chemistry, orgo. chem, bio chem, A&P, a few in pathology, statistics, and research methodology.
@RealityGrapple Ever heard of the 'baghdad battery'? Think they understood much about how electricity 'works' back then? The thing worked, no matter how they thought it functioned.
Wow, so your point is that because there was a battery back thousands of years ago then we should accept things that have mixed reviews. What an intelligent and reasonable position.
@RealityGrapple Actually, I explained quite clearly the relevance of that example,
Funny, all I heard is whining and complaining. I heard a child trying to defend his position with emotion rather then hard facts. I heard someone who doesn't have the smarts to check his evidence before presenting it.
What example did you provide? All I saw was the moronic claim that because there's no money to support studies we should logically accept them.
@Rundvelt This happens all the time. It really says volumes about your intellectual limitations that this is difficult for you to understand. Criticism of the hypothetical mechanism of chiropractic, OR acupuncture, is not a valid argument against their efficacy. And at least in terms of acupuncture, there is plenty out there on conditions you haven't even considered. Technically, you're just ignorant.
@RealityGrapple Criticism of the hypothetical mechanism of chiropractic, OR acupuncture, is not a valid argument against their efficacy
So you're making up arguments for me now? Come on Reality. I never said that a lack of evidence doesn't mean something doesn't work. I said that you'd have to be a fool to believe it worked without reasonable evidence. There's a difference. Think about it and get back to me.
@Rundvelt More dishonesty. What a shock. Never mind the more fundamental problem of pretending to know about something you've put literally zero time into understanding...
@RealityGrapple Please provide examples. Like how I provide examples of how you're a complete tool and out of school on science. Then maybe I can address your nonsense.
@Rundvelt In terms of larger scale studies... how much of an idiot do you have to be to not understand how expensive they are, and to understand that there aren't monied parties out there eager to throw cash at this thing? Instead of running your mouth on a subject you've put ZERO time into, why not go read some articles abotu research done on the biological actions of certain points? There's plenty to keep you busy.
But of course, you're not interested in more than running your mouth.
@RealityGrapple So what? I could care less if there isn't money going towards it. Maybe respectable scientific organizations know something I don't. Perhaps they're not satisfied with the concept of "ki points" curing everything from red blood cell count to arthritus to fertility to viral infections. Maybe, just maybe, after critical analysis, people who study the human body say "Wow, this is nonsense." Maybe?
There's a LOT more research done and continuing to be done on acupuncture than the knee/back pain studies you see trotted out in the news from time to time. But you'd have to actually want to understand the practice, which you don't. You'e just a lazy, off the cuff, know-it-all youtube debunker, and that's just pathetic. Like I said earlier: update your programming. You haven't even begun to research this shit.
@RealityGrapple you said: Just enter: acupuncture nausea "pc 6"
First study: 30 test patients. Unacceptable due to low numbers. Statistical confidence is low.
Second Study: This originates in China. Papers from that area in the world are sometimes questionable.
Third Study: Same as second.
But this also brings up an interesting question. Why is it that acupuncture can do all sorts of different things? Can you think of a single body manipulation that can make so many claims?
@Rundvelt Ugh. It's really hard to get large numbers of people in an acupuncture study. Just consider money and where funding usually generates from. If you're just going to flat out dismiss all the Chinese studies, I'm not sure I can help you. Why can so many effect be achieved? Wouldn't we all like to know. Some theorize it has to do with excitation of the immune system, which will 'decide' how to intervene by itself. But again, this isn't known yet.
@RealityGrapple Well, I can excuse you for not accepting the Chinese paper issue. When I was taking my BSc one of my projects was to evaluate the work coming out of China. There are some great papers, but there are some that are not so great. Some where the data is clear and concise, some where the data is maninpulated.
There isn't the same scientific culture of publication like here in north america or europe, and papers from China are viewed differently.
@RealityGrapple uh huh. and then, ignore the european studies.
I addressed the studies. They have a low sample size and therefore are easily skewed by randomness. A study of 2 people (one control and one subject) could pretty much prove anything, like coke being a cure for prostate cancer.
@RealityGrapple uh huh. and then, ignore the european studies.
You're not listening to what I'm saying and not reading your own evidence. The number 11 study had a study case of 39. With a control group that means you're having about 20, yes 20, people taking part.
That's not a reasonable sample size to make conclusions. Because a good draw of patients vs. a bad one can change the paper drastically.
@RealityGrapple There's a LOT more research done and continuing to be done on acupuncture than the knee/back pain studies you see trotted out in the news from time to time.
I don't rely on the newspapers. That's nonsense.
> But you'd have to actually want to understand the practice, which you don't.
That's right. I don't understand the practice and I must to analyze the studies saying it's not working right? Nonsense.
And here's the point: they got results regardless of anyone's opinion of 'qi' as an explanatory mechanism. There's research going on all over the globe right now attempting to understand the physical actions of certain points. For example, research has discovered that needling ST 36 (on your tibialis anterior muscle) has a homeostatic effect on certain white blood cells - and remarkably, it's a traditional point for immunity vs. things like, colds and flus (as we'd term them today).
@RealityGrapple And here's the point: they got results regardless of anyone's opinion of 'qi' as an explanatory mechanism.
They got results which are in CONFLICT with other studies. Why is that? How can the same mechanism give relief to one and nothing to the other? Isn't that odd?
The only source of this problem could be either interpretation of the data or faulty method on either side.
In that case, it's illogical to take any position and by default, not believe it works.
Rubienstien et al proved in their paper "Spinal manipulative therapy for chronic low-back pain." that there is no clincially signifigant difference between chiro and other lower back pain treatments such as rehab and/or massage therapy.
When you see things like this, what is your repsonse? 6,000 patients studied isn't a large study, but it's not a small one either.
The problem here is that the parents don't know what is wrong with the baby. How can they make a call that the baby "needs chiro". Most problems from babies come from bacterial or viral infections (excluding birth defects).
How do you treat something which you cannot test for? Or is it that chiro is so formless that a generic treatment is "good for what ails you".
If my parents had had me checked over when I was a kid I wouldn't have all the problems with my legs that I have now.At 22 I finally decided I needed to see a chiropractor and I've been much better since, but I am taking a long time to adjust because I've had these problems since I was a child. I will deffinately get my kids checked early on.
I have been adjusting my 4 year old since he was only 3 days old. I checked him immediately after they weighed him. Unbelieveable enuff, he didn't need an adjustment immediately after birth. My wife and I opted for water birth with a midwife, so there was no kamikaze md on the other end trying to extract him from the birth canal. His birth was very pleasant for him and mom. We did not get any vaccines and never would. He has not been sick in over 3 years.
As a healthcare professional who has taken medical school anatomy courses and countless other courses, I offer a few thoughts.
After watching several chiropractors perform treatments here on youtube, my personal opinion is that 60% of what they say and "perform" is completely holistic (i.e., is mostly in the mind but does not physically do anything) .
> Even medical. You treat the scientific method (and it's not a pure science) like a religion. It'd be interesting to see, over your lifetime, how much care you'd be able to accept if you held it to your "standards".
Name me a single better model for learning about the natural world then. Go ahead. What should we use instead if it's so flawed. Obviously you don't care for it, given that pubmed only publishes scientifically proven papers. What is your standard?
@Rundvelt Are you exaggerating his comment? Yes. His point, obviously, is that the scientific method is not nearly as reliable as physics laws, which are science. It's pretty clear you're just trying to pick a fight on youtube. Good luck.
@trulyheaven777 So, the laws of physics don't rely on the scientific process to be shown? That's a new one on me.
And no, I'm not trying to pick a fight. When he says "You worship the scientific method" I rightly ask him "Which one is better for learning about reality." IF there's nothing better, why shouldn't I apply it to all things naturalistic in this world?
@Rundvelt Here's a good example. If the doing research, RCT, as it currently stands incorporated a way to measure every process in the body after an intervention, it would be almost a science. When you rely on patient feedback, as many RCT's do, it is not a science or even all that close. Especially with hands on therapies.
Next time you go to the drug store, find for us, all the OTC cold medicine/symptom relievers (cough, sneeze, etc...) for under two year olds available.
@trulyheaven777 So, because there is not a methodology that you're aware of, then we should accept whatever evidence we have? That doesn't make sense. And furhermore, so what if there aren't medications for people under 2. Just because your child has a cough or sneeze doesn't mean you have to remedy it. Take it to a paed and then get his/her opinion on the matter.
@Rundvelt You really aren't getting the point. Then again, you're pretty fixated. Ask a ped what they can prescribe for under 2 years old. Maybe that will help you. You're really not getting it. In any way. Oh well, I tried....
metknott1 youre an idiot and everyone thinking that cracking a babies kneck will make him smarter or give him a bigger brain is an idiot what if she pulled to hard broke his kneck or paralyzed him then what
That's what I was doing wrong. When the baby is adjusted it makes that squeaking noise. I know when you try walking on their back they just make a pitch squeal. Great how to video can't wait to give this a try.
Why are you faggots fighting over chiropractic adjustments over the internet, like little kids do nowadays. Chiro is good, dont let queers make up stories that people have died cause of this stuff. That doesnt make any sense.
@cormega006 you said: or at the least, the best thing we can focus our research into.
Research into anything that might work is more then welcomed. But don't expect to be accepted until your methodology has been proven. That's all I'm saying.
For example, chiro has been proven to increase the incidents of stroke. It's a fact. Acupuncture has been proven to be a placebo effect. Homeopathy as well.
It's all on Pubmed, research done by scientists to better the world.
@Rundvelt It has far from been "proven to increase teh incidents of stroke". That's false and not "a fact". Same with acupuncture, which has been proven beneficial for several things.
@docsrocks Actually it has been proven. Time to read up on Pubmed, you know, medical journals. And acupuncture has been shown to have a placebo effect. Also on pubmed. Knowledge is power.
@docsrocks Really, perhaps you can link me the studies you're referring to. I'd like to be informed on the matter. All the information I've seen disagrees with your statements. Where are you getting your information?
@Rundvelt I will clue you in that there is no study that directly shows an increased risk of TIA/Stroke with cervical manip. None. Indirect relationships do not mean causation. Most studies show no causation at all and there is no plausible, specific mechanisim of injury (even in theory). Acupuncture.....a Canadian pediatrician (yes, an MD) was the one who clued me in on the studies of it's usefullness. Prior to that I didn't think it did a whole lot either. The rest? Look harder.
@docsrocks Your comparison is faulty. You're comparing the lack of methodology for a non-determined event in this case, stroke, with one hat is determined, ie, going to the chiropractor. They're not the same. It would be very simple to test the effect of chiro. However, the studies that have been done that I've seen show that there is only a moderate amount of benefit (ie, slightly greater then the error rate), to lower back pain while having an increased risk of stroke based on mean pop.
@Rundvelt Wow, you need to look at more studies. I think you're relying on quackwatch for your info, since it's not very accurate. No study has show SMT to be a smoking gun. None. Correlations are not causations. As for backing SMT, there are loads of studies of varying degrees to back usefullness. Some very good, some not. Doesn't stop people from getting well in my clinic.
@docsrocks > Doesn't stop people from getting well in my clinic.
That's the typical response from someone who doesn't have a clue about patients. Patients claim to get well in homeopathy clinics. They claim to get better due to praying. They also claim to be healed by taking herbal remedies from the far east. What they claim isn't fact. And if you had any knowledge into the medical field, you'd know that the claim "People get better' is bogus. I think you're just a chiro fanboi.
@Rundvelt Not when they are paying for it and very skeptical. Your comment is overstated and claiming "placebo" effect on more than 40% of patients is ludicrious. What you don't get is that not even close to every healthcare procedure has overwhelming evidence for it's use. Even medical. You treat the scientific method (and it's not a pure science) like a religion. It'd be interesting to see, over your lifetime, how much care you'd be able to accept if you held it to your "standards".
@docsrocks Objective testing? It's not about whether it's objective, the methodology is what's at core. You can objectively test shamanism. That is to say, not take sides. But if you rely on "getting the willies' as evidence for something happening, you're going to have very different results. Chiropractors by trade do not have the requisite knowledge to form a methodology or analyze medical problems and the efficacy of the treatment.
You people are crazy... you realise that baibes.. are probably the LEAST in need ofANY medical care as they are so BRAND NEW. Unless they have some disease or something else just leave them alone. You may be damaging their development.
Beast9156 1 month ago in playlist CHIROPRACTIC
Back in the '80s the big chiropractic selling pitch, which made sense, was, "A back adjustment unlocks surrounding muscles and tissue etc and returns the spinal cord to the virgin shape it was in when you were a newborn." They explained how life's daily stresses, sitting, standing etc. alters spines from their original state: that of a newborn baby! So now the medical profession has created a new market. No body is more pliable, wonderful, brand new and pure than a newborn's. What total CRAP!
mrsuckcessful 1 month ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch if you dont know what ur talking about shut your hillbilly mouth.
Nater4442 2 months ago
how ignorant of a mother to think tis is ok unreal
ceetheflush 2 months ago
@ceetheflush Did you go to school? Do you know nothing of the human body? Your 37 and have no idea how the human body works? You probably think Physics is a joke too.
MoeTuesday13 1 month ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch You idiot, the neck at this age is not "cracked", its a non osseous movement. Go by a dictionary for the holidays and look it up
jnd080895 2 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch They dont "crack" infants necks you ignoramous. Go watch babies necks getting twisted 180 degrees during the birth process and then tell me they don't need gentle spinal care.
9pt9 2 months ago
HAVE YOU PEOPLE LOST YOUR FUCKING MINDS?
TEHTYMEKITTEH1 2 months ago 3
@TEHTYMEKITTEH1 Ah no, chiropractic is awesome for babies. Especially after they get their neck twisted around during the birth process.
9pt9 2 months ago
@9pt9
Um. No
TEHTYMEKITTEH1 2 months ago
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Bull fucking shit
bunnygopoke 2 months ago
A baby doesn't need an adjustment!
CrazyConeClan 2 months ago
I don't understand why a child needs adjusting...
vicaroffattytown 2 months ago
looks like my son
RatchetSouth 2 months ago
Ummmm, I highly doubt babies need chiropractic adjustments. This is such a crock. The only one getting the benefits is the fucking doctor.
thatgirlkelly1 3 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch What's "cracking" That sounds bad. I didn't see any cracking here. What I saw was a timely, specific and holy adjustment. Chiropractors are so intensively trained they are qualified to be primary care physicians. They read radiographs better than medical doctors and treat the cause of disease and not just the symptoms. You really need to do more research on this before you make another erroneous comment.
catshavesouls 3 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch You obviously know next to nothing about the joints or the popping sound you hear when the adjustment is made.
NewEnglanddur 3 months ago
@kevarchery
No as a neuroscientist I get my facts from the facts. How about this sunshine (notice that I have refrained from lowering myself to your level and calling you what you obviously are). The Canadian College of Physicians and Surgeons has recommended banning all chiropractic manipulations in infants and children and that the data are that currently over 300,000 persons have died or been left completely bedridden from brain stem strokes caused by neck manipulations. Sandy Nette's story.
drneurochick 3 months ago
@drneurochick Maybe you will also realize that those "cases" that you have noted are incorrect. There hasn't been a single case of anybody dying from a chiropractic adjustment. Maybe you can cite where you got this information?
tmack1634 3 months ago
@drneurochick
Chiro's have lower insurance rates than traditional medical doctors because --- guess why? -- less deaths.
yardape99 2 months ago
like I care what you think. The medical world is backed by scientific proof. If you took a minute to read the context, you'd see I was replying to the idiot that said chiros had the same medical training as real doctors. I haven't been duped by anyone. Facts are facts. Go back to your quack you stupid bitch.
davidkyle77 3 months ago
4:12 he farted xD
Marth123465 3 months ago
For those of you who are fighting over chiropractors being quacks or anything else related to belittling the profession. Grow the hell up! They have the exact same medical training as any other doctor, they just have a different style of treatment. I love chiropractors and everything they do. They helped me with my scoliosis and it's completely cured. Btw if you don't like them don't watch the videos.
sonnyofagunny 4 months ago
@sonnyofagunny You are really stupid to believe that.
zeidar 3 months ago
@zeidar At least I have evidence to support my theory. So don't insult me.
sonnyofagunny 3 months ago
@sonnyofagunny they do not have the same medical training. they go to a 4 year school for chiropractors. the learn nothing of medicine or how to apply it. You were not helped by a chiropractor, you were just duped into believing so.
davidkyle77 3 months ago
@davidkyle77
Unfortunately, your ignorance is worse than the chiropractors who are 'quacks'. I think the medical world of drugs and surgeries have duped you into thinking pain killers and anti-inflammatories for muscle and joint pain are the best way to go. But you are right, chiropractors have chiropractic training, medical physicians have medical training. I cannot be more impressed with your intelligence.
dcho1990 3 months ago
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@dcho1990 like I care what you think. The medical world is backed by scientific proof. If you took a minute to read the context, you'd see I was replying to the idiot that said chiros had the same medical training as real doctors. I haven't been duped by anyone. Facts are facts. Go back to your quack you stupid bitch.
davidkyle77 3 months ago
@davidkyle77 oh and don't forget the fact that medical doctors have 850 MORE credit hours than a m.d.
tmack1634 3 months ago
@davidkyle77 lol what planet are you from? I was helped by a chiropractor. It took me years to get to one, and I spent so much money and dealt with side effects from pain medicine, and then finally I had relief from years of pain - after ONE visit.
NewEnglanddur 3 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch uh...they are professionals
aprilschone1 4 months ago
@aprilschone1 professional quacks
excaliburtation 3 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch Why don't you look into a live birth and see how much force and rotation is put on the child's neck during delivery. Do I expect you to go do this? Not at all considering your name includes wrestling merchandise.
jrye0485 4 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch
If you're logic is that baby cry when baby upset only, then you are the ignorant one. An added stimulus can make anyone upset. If you happen to know the effect of the parasympathetic nervous system after an adjustment, you would know that there is an increase in activity. And the baby was never upset for the record.
jrye0485 4 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch It's bigots like you who shame this world. Do you even know the extent of the human body and what it can withstand even at a birth? Or even how the ligaments and joints work of the human body? How about even counting to 100? Professionals know what they are doing so do come here writing some BS you know you are just basing off of your own opinion. Go touch a hot stove or drown yourself in a puddle of water or whatever dumbasses like yourself do in their spare time.
MoeTuesday13 4 months ago
If anyone has ever witnessed a live vaginal, or C-Section birth, and seen the TRAUMA of it all to the baby's head, neck, spine, pelvis, and hips by the process you'd realize the forces applied by a skilled therapist are meager. Clamping a suction cup to child head and twisting/ pulling for 1 to 4 hours through a tiny hole is barbaric in comparison. We are very resilient. People should be more concerned with the questionable series of immunizations the kids get than mild joint manipulations.
Lechelover 4 months ago
She gets paid $50 to abuse an infant. Sick!
mrichman 4 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch -I bet wrestling isn't stupid though. Maybe you need an adjustment!
Jaclucy 4 months ago
chiropractors are complete crap
indisoccer 4 months ago 2
@indisoccer
not really.
LovelyInfected 4 months ago
@LovelyInfected so your saying its ok to fucking crack the tiny fragile bones in a babys neck. your such an idiot.
indisoccer 4 months ago
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LovelyInfected 4 months ago
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LovelyInfected 4 months ago
@indisoccer
Excuse me? I'm not an idiot. Chiropractors work. Did i say anything about a baby? No i didn't. And for your information, The baby may need it.
LovelyInfected 4 months ago
@ChoochWrestlingMerch Shut up douche.
dakota31898 4 months ago
"The pelvic diaphragm was locked up because of the right side of his sacrum..." Are you kidding me?! Does that make sense to anyone? Do people not ask questions??
803badmutha 4 months ago
@803badmutha
It refers to the musculature of the pelvic floor. It plays a large part in bowel control/function. 4 muscles referred to as the levator ani. 2 of them directly attach to the coccyx which is attached to the sarum. The others attach to the pubic rami of the individual pelves. Kids will colic will at times "crap" within seconds of properly manipulating the sacrum. Quick, effective, painless, drugless option for some. Its been utilized safely for over a century by DO's and DC's.
Lechelover 4 months ago
@Lechelover The fact that you support the mere existence of DC's for over a century shows you lack the cognitive capacity to rationally question what they are doing.
803badmutha 4 months ago
@803badmutha please inform us all. What are they doing?
Lechelover 4 months ago
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@803badmutha please inform us all. What are they doing?
Lechelover 4 months ago
I guarantee your kid was not cranky because of a maladjusted pelvis. If that were the case, raising kids would be a hell of a lot easier.
chibi013 4 months ago
A bigger brain means jack shit. The size of the brain has nothing to do with intelligence.
junkietomato 4 months ago 12
@junkietomato
She was being facetious...it's called baby talk. If I said you were the dumbest person on the planet, I would be facetious...you may score extremely well on standardized exams for all I know.
jrye0485 4 months ago
@junkietomato Actually, within a species a larger brain does have a small correlation with intelligence.
AmzitheSoldier 3 months ago
@junkietomato it helps the baby sleep ,eat , better .
kevarchery 3 months ago
@kevarchery yes because they are brain damaged and so are now quiet
drneurochick 3 months ago
@drneurochick Lol where you getting your facts fox news ....cunt go fucking die
kevarchery 3 months ago
Grostic, NUCCA, and FUCA are good techniques for infants. Traction does not help. When the atlas is shifted It will remain in the same dynamic, and will not change. Only an outside force will correct the shifted atlas.
kobidobidog 5 months ago
OMG Your nuts.......What a quack....
ladysherri01 5 months ago 2
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kobidobidog 5 months ago
this dumb bitch fake doctor does not realize, the bones in the skull are fused!!!!!
she is not adjusting shit
noliesundead 5 months ago
@noliesundead not when you're an infant, most aren't. Hence why your skull can expand to accommodate your growing brain as you age. They're mostly fused after a year or so. But I do doubt she's "adjusting" anything with the baby's skull.
vitaminsrgud 4 months ago
This lady is a moron
333pinkitty 5 months ago
Stanford460c is a paid homo who trolls around youtube and facebook spreading lies about vaccines and how good they are because he is paid to do so by PR people who represent GSK and Taylor&Hilt aka vaccine makers.
Burnpnac 5 months ago
The vaccine Gardisill has caused 1,409 cases of instant death in the united states, 640 in Japan, and was banned in Norway, sweeden and germany, sense 2009 431 cases of Paralysis due to neuro auto immune responses have been recorded directly from THIS vaccine, not to mention it contains Sodium Fluoride, a deadly neuro toxin known to cause bone cancer. fuck stanford640c he is a disinformation idiot, paid to post pro vaccine propaganda.
Burnpnac 5 months ago
Dont EVER listen to idiots like Stanford640c, instead go look up what the top neurologists and medical doctors have to say about vaccines, just google Nutrimedical Report, Dr. Bill Deagle, Dr. Rebeca Carley Dr. Joseph Mercolia, Dr. Henery L Nmyman, the facts cannot be debated, vaccines are ALL designed to give you illness, the very sicentific idea of vaccines defies every point of logic in medicine, unless you give people shit illnesses that they must by your product for to stay alive.
Burnpnac 5 months ago
I was hoping the doctor would walk on baby's back
for the spine adjustment
tachyon1979 5 months ago
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tachyon1979 5 months ago
awsome you can kill people with uppercuts. haha who the bully now
Mdonkin961 5 months ago
now i get the point of theres baby chiropractic care they create problems when theyre a baby so when there older theyll continue to come in the future
Dragonbreath2011 6 months ago
@kmckamey
I got my doctorate at Cleveland State and my undergrad at Ohio U. Why do you ask?
ouduke 6 months ago
My advice is stop poisoning your children with vaccines and other drugs. Get them adjusted or not, I really don't give a shit. But to all you uninformed and ignorant assholes spewing your uneducated comments....fuck you. If you believe the the bs your family dr and the drug companies tell you, you are a fool. MOST doctors don't even vaccinate their children. Noah wasn't vaccinated and he lived to be over 450 years old and I am pretty certain things were not as sanitary in his day as now.
kmckamey 6 months ago
@kmckamey I'm going to copy your comment and post in on my facebook page as I want everyone to read this. Your comment needs to be read by everyone who vaccinates their children! Best comment I've read in ages.
reido82 6 months ago
@reido82 okay, just please omit the profanity. I really could have chosen my words more wisely, but didn't. Glad you liked my response.
kmckamey 6 months ago
@kmckamey
what you fail to understand is the science behind this. vaccinations are an essential part of human survival. some of the greatest diseases have been eliminated as a result of vaccinations such as small pox. ofcourse there are going to be anomalies with any treatment but given the effects of vaccinations are so powerful it is incorrect and extremely in poor judgement to place a blanket comment that all vaccinations are bad for you.
stanford640c 5 months ago
@stanford640c you are a mother fucking idiot moron lying piece of shit. VACCINES ARE EUGENICS THEY HAVE NEVER CURED ONE ILLNESS ONLY CAUSED AUTO IMMUNE ILLNESSES LIKE Parkinson's, ALZHEIMER, MS, NEUROLOGICAL DISORDERS, a vaccine is NOT an inoculation, nor does it work in the same fashion, small pox and other illness were NOT wiped out by vaccination, because all VACCINES are MAN MADE IN A LAB USING ENGINEERED CULTURES, INOCULATION WAS TOTALLY DIFFERENT, GET YOU FUCKING FACTS STRAIGHT.
Burnpnac 5 months ago
@Burnpnac
The fact you have lost your temper means you have lost the argument. Given the lack of your grammatical ability you have not made any valid points other than just swear. Are you even a medical professional to justify your points? or have you just picked up on random incidences and blown it out of proportion.
stanford640c 5 months ago
@stanford640c no it means you are a fucking disinformation lying faggot idiot and that im a real man because i want to fucking rip your jaw apart for lying to people, only a weak little coward bitch hides behind his fake lies and ignores the facts and proof and tries to sound smart by covering his lies with more lies. WHen it comes to the choice between beleiveing what a neurologist says and some faggot on youtube, i wonder who is right. Neurologist says all vaccines are eugenics.
Burnpnac 5 months ago
@Burnpnac "Neurologist says all vaccines are eugenics'......That nice billy, can they prove this? no. can you? no. no matter how good their OPINION is, its just that, until they can prove that claim.
noliesundead 5 months ago
@stanford640c Whoah there big man we dont have to get a big boner on the internet, Yeah... thats right, THE INTERNET!!!! Not realy life so nobody gives a shit about your opinion or that you can sound fancy with your comments.
like50somalians 5 months ago
You made a comment regarding the intrepretation of vaccination and inoculation (both of which I have not mentioned in my previous post). If you truly get into the definition of both terms, inoculation referes to the introduction of a live substance whereas a vaccination refered to the introduction of weakend stubstance. Both induce an antibody response to protect the individual.Anyway i wish you well on your crusade to stop vaccines. Don't give up on your day job as an uneducated individual.
stanford640c 5 months ago
@stanford640c you are a fucking moron, vaccines are mutated, recombinant DNA and merge with the bodies T cells what the FUCK are you even talking about, you dont even know the first thing between the two, must suck to be owned by someone who is uneducated like me. Somehow im going to believe one of the top doctors on earth, Dr. Bill Deagle instead of some retard who cant even get the definition of what a vaccine IS right.....
Burnpnac 5 months ago
@Burnpnac
Bill Deagle??!!?? Firstly i'm not a paid person to post propaganda on the internet, I was correcting your ignorance. Secondly Bill Deagle is one of the biggest fraud in medical history. I do not even live in United States and we have heard of Bill Deagle here. The reason why I am replying is that I am a medical professional and work with colleagues who are leading in their profession and not some random youtube, paid, propagandist.
stanford640c 5 months ago
@stanford640c yea the top NASA doctor who worked on the star wars project and invented MiCell d-3 is a fraud....now your showing YOUR ignorance, ok dont like him, how about Dr. Rebecca Carley, Joseph Mercollia, Dr. Russel Blaylock, you cant say SHIT about blaylock he is the most sought after neurologist and neuro surgeon in the world, so your trying to tell me that you know more than all of these TOP doctors, the best of the best, who are telling people, vaccines are eugenics ??? fuck you
Burnpnac 5 months ago
baby twisting mother fucker!!!!
Igotmyvanson20 6 months ago
ARE THESE PARENTS IDIOTS? YOU DON'T FIX SOMETHING THAT ISN'T BROKEN!
VentriloServer 6 months ago
*squeek* *squeeek* hmm that must be that other little toddler playing with a toy....*gets to 6:12* -_-
ToriPeebs 6 months ago
I am no Chiropractor, nor do I play one on TV, but I adjust my 2 week old daily.
FreeBlago1 6 months ago
dfdjalj
FreeBlago1 6 months ago
I see there is a big argument going on, just going to say that's a really cute baby. Idk if this actually works, I probably wouldn't do it but really cute baby.
therealhatianprinces 7 months ago
I can't believe people fall for this junk science. How did babies survive all these years without getting their necks cracked?
ouduke 7 months ago
@ouduke.......and you got your Doctorate from where?
kmckamey 6 months ago
Chiropractic totally helped my baby daughter sleep at night and to stop being constipated. I am so grateful for chiropractors!!
bikaholic1 8 months ago
SIDS i swear officer i think it was SIDS
zacatetas 9 months ago
"despite you never even having to critically analyze a paper" Just wanted to mention, yes, I have. In addition to writing them.
go suck a dick.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Really, and you mess up functional hypothesis and theory. You would think someone who writes scientific papers would know the difference.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
So get back to me in a few months, after you've had time to actually learn something about this subject you're so certain about. Because to this point, from where I sit, this is as pointless as any other discussion with any other brand of delusional fundamentalist.
You're that stupid.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple So get back to me in a few months, after you've had time to actually learn something about this subject you're so certain about.
Yes, that's right. I have so much to learn. From you apparently. Like how to link journals to prove my point and yet avoid reading them, their methods and their conclusions. Apparently I should learn that scientific consensus isn't really needed, I just have to cherry pick what I want to read.
You're silly. I like you.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
Someday, when you grow up, IF you grow up, you'll come to understand that what you're actually doing here, is arguing from belief. Certainly not from evidence. As is clear, you haven't familiarized yourself with the research of the field (Acupuncture). That much is obvious. You're just another member of the self important youtube brigade of pseudointellectual know nothings who somehow trick themselves into thinking they champion rationality or science. It's pathetic.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple You're right of course. Why should, someone who has spent years of his life earning a bachelor of science in biochemistry ignore your clear superiority of "basic science in college". I should defer to your interpretation of what is "scientifically valid" based on your generic entry level grounding in all the sciences, despite you never even having to critically analyze a paper. :D
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt Sigh. You don't know shit about my education, and I'm certainly not impressed by whatever yours did for you. My only point is, you have nothing to teach me about science or its methods, and you for damn sure don't know anything at all about this particular subject. You get hung on on irrelevant points, you can't understand simple analogies, and you lie.
you're a disgrace. you're as hopeless as any other fundamentalist know nothing.
you're cut off.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple You get hung on on irrelevant points, you can't understand simple analogies, and you lie.
Oh poopsy woopsy, it's all right. Did the mean man say some nasty words? Don't worry, mommykins will make it all better. Come sit down and have a glass of milk with your cookie.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple You don't know shit about my education, and I'm certainly not impressed by whatever yours did for you. My only point is, you have nothing to teach me about science or its methods, and you for damn sure don't know anything at all about this particular subject.
Yes, mine only allowed me to objectively analyze claims made by people like you. People who despite being shown evidence that disagrees with their position state "you don't know crap." An intelligent retort.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Sigh. You don't know shit about my education,
You're right. I don't. Just like how you don't know mine. I have to use clues to discover what level of education you have. Like the clue that you think it's a reasonably good idea to go to a biased source for information. I doubt that any educated person would advise this as a reasonable method about learning about a subject. Because clearly, for me to make judgements on terrorism, I should head over to Tehran. :)
Rundvelt 11 months ago
I'm not gonna do this dance with you all day, but maybe, if you posessed legitimate intellectual curiosity, you could contact the folks at the American Academy of Medical Acupuncture for information more to your liking. Before you after you read the work of Dr Eddy and wrap your little head around the idea that 80% of modern medicine, doesn't meet the definition of 'evidence based'. My only point here is to tell you what an arrogant prick you are. You truly are.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple , but maybe, if you posessed legitimate intellectual curiosity, you could contact the folks at the American Academy of Medical Acupuncture for information more to your liking.
Yes, that makes so much sense. I'll contact the organization that would become bankrupt if acupuncture was shown to be a sham. Clearly they wouldn't be biased in their analysis of the information.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt "I'll contact the organization that would become bankrupt if acupuncture was shown to be a sham." Idiot, it's just a bunch of doctors sharing research. They all have private practices. It's not a source of income. Fucking moron.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple you said: and wrap your little head around the idea that 80% of modern medicine, doesn't meet the definition of 'evidence based'.
You don't seem to grasp the concept of foundation. Scientific hypothesis based on previous proven work are far more valid then hypothesis that are based on cultural healing practices. By your "logic", an experimental drug that is based off of lab tests on rats is equally as valid as a belief that ki pinpoints being priced increase your health
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple you said: My only point here is to tell you what an arrogant prick you are. You truly are.
The resounding sound of the loser. The stuides you present do not pass scientific muster despite claiming they are, you mix up hypothesis with theory, you don't grasp the concept that everything in science is questionable and you seem to think it's a good idea to ask a biased organization for information.
Dude, you've got to be a troll. No one is this slow. You got me.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt I gave you a bit of help in terms of finding studies validating SOME uses of acupuncture. There are many, many more, some appearing in high quality peer reviewed journals. You're just as capable of looking on pubmed as I am, but I have nothing to prove here. Quit pretending to be some kind of expert. I've taken graduate courses in biology, microbiology, chemistry, orgo. chem, bio chem, A&P, a few in pathology, statistics, and research methodology.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@Rundvelt I made on casual use of 'hypothesis' that was irrelevant to the discussion, and you want to hang your hat on that as if it means something.
You're just a troll, and nothing more. I'll leave you with one last example of how a thing can 'work', even if the 'why' is poorly understood.
Ever heard of the 'baghdad battery'?
Think they understood much about how electricity 'works' back then?
The thing worked, no matter how they thought it functioned.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Ever heard of the 'baghdad battery'? Think they understood much about how electricity 'works' back then? The thing worked, no matter how they thought it functioned.
Wow, so your point is that because there was a battery back thousands of years ago then we should accept things that have mixed reviews. What an intelligent and reasonable position.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt Actually, I explained quite clearly the relevance of that example, and now you're being willfully dense. Which is tantamount to dishonesty.
what a loser.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Actually, I explained quite clearly the relevance of that example,
Funny, all I heard is whining and complaining. I heard a child trying to defend his position with emotion rather then hard facts. I heard someone who doesn't have the smarts to check his evidence before presenting it.
What example did you provide? All I saw was the moronic claim that because there's no money to support studies we should logically accept them.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt This happens all the time. It really says volumes about your intellectual limitations that this is difficult for you to understand. Criticism of the hypothetical mechanism of chiropractic, OR acupuncture, is not a valid argument against their efficacy. And at least in terms of acupuncture, there is plenty out there on conditions you haven't even considered. Technically, you're just ignorant.
Moreover, you're a prick.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Criticism of the hypothetical mechanism of chiropractic, OR acupuncture, is not a valid argument against their efficacy
So you're making up arguments for me now? Come on Reality. I never said that a lack of evidence doesn't mean something doesn't work. I said that you'd have to be a fool to believe it worked without reasonable evidence. There's a difference. Think about it and get back to me.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt More dishonesty. What a shock. Never mind the more fundamental problem of pretending to know about something you've put literally zero time into understanding...
get a life.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Please provide examples. Like how I provide examples of how you're a complete tool and out of school on science. Then maybe I can address your nonsense.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple This is fun. It's like fighting a four year old midget. Mentally speaking. It's easy and rewarding!
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt In terms of larger scale studies... how much of an idiot do you have to be to not understand how expensive they are, and to understand that there aren't monied parties out there eager to throw cash at this thing? Instead of running your mouth on a subject you've put ZERO time into, why not go read some articles abotu research done on the biological actions of certain points? There's plenty to keep you busy.
But of course, you're not interested in more than running your mouth.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple So what? I could care less if there isn't money going towards it. Maybe respectable scientific organizations know something I don't. Perhaps they're not satisfied with the concept of "ki points" curing everything from red blood cell count to arthritus to fertility to viral infections. Maybe, just maybe, after critical analysis, people who study the human body say "Wow, this is nonsense." Maybe?
Rundvelt 11 months ago
You're also overlooking the first hit on that page, which was a study done in germany. Hit 11 ws published in the british journal, 'rheumatology'.
Not very honest of you.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
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@RealityGrapple You're also overlooking the first hit on that page, which was a study done in germany.
I addressed the german one. It only had 30 case studies. Did you read the summary? :)
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Similarly, the british journal only had 39. Seeing a trend yet?
Rundvelt 11 months ago
There's a LOT more research done and continuing to be done on acupuncture than the knee/back pain studies you see trotted out in the news from time to time. But you'd have to actually want to understand the practice, which you don't. You'e just a lazy, off the cuff, know-it-all youtube debunker, and that's just pathetic. Like I said earlier: update your programming. You haven't even begun to research this shit.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple you said: Just enter: acupuncture nausea "pc 6"
First study: 30 test patients. Unacceptable due to low numbers. Statistical confidence is low.
Second Study: This originates in China. Papers from that area in the world are sometimes questionable.
Third Study: Same as second.
But this also brings up an interesting question. Why is it that acupuncture can do all sorts of different things? Can you think of a single body manipulation that can make so many claims?
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt Ugh. It's really hard to get large numbers of people in an acupuncture study. Just consider money and where funding usually generates from. If you're just going to flat out dismiss all the Chinese studies, I'm not sure I can help you. Why can so many effect be achieved? Wouldn't we all like to know. Some theorize it has to do with excitation of the immune system, which will 'decide' how to intervene by itself. But again, this isn't known yet.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
@RealityGrapple Well, I can excuse you for not accepting the Chinese paper issue. When I was taking my BSc one of my projects was to evaluate the work coming out of China. There are some great papers, but there are some that are not so great. Some where the data is clear and concise, some where the data is maninpulated.
There isn't the same scientific culture of publication like here in north america or europe, and papers from China are viewed differently.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt uh huh. and then, ignore the european studies.
whatever gets you through the night, as they say.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
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@RealityGrapple uh huh. and then, ignore the european studies.
I addressed the studies. They have a low sample size and therefore are easily skewed by randomness. A study of 2 people (one control and one subject) could pretty much prove anything, like coke being a cure for prostate cancer.
Low numbers means low confidence. :)
Rundvelt 11 months ago
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@RealityGrapple uh huh. and then, ignore the european studies.
You're not listening to what I'm saying and not reading your own evidence. The number 11 study had a study case of 39. With a control group that means you're having about 20, yes 20, people taking part.
That's not a reasonable sample size to make conclusions. Because a good draw of patients vs. a bad one can change the paper drastically.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
@Rundvelt You aren't telling me anything I don't already know about China, or about anything else, at all. Not even a little bit.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
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@RealityGrapple There's a LOT more research done and continuing to be done on acupuncture than the knee/back pain studies you see trotted out in the news from time to time.
I don't rely on the newspapers. That's nonsense.
> But you'd have to actually want to understand the practice, which you don't.
That's right. I don't understand the practice and I must to analyze the studies saying it's not working right? Nonsense.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
And here's the point: they got results regardless of anyone's opinion of 'qi' as an explanatory mechanism. There's research going on all over the globe right now attempting to understand the physical actions of certain points. For example, research has discovered that needling ST 36 (on your tibialis anterior muscle) has a homeostatic effect on certain white blood cells - and remarkably, it's a traditional point for immunity vs. things like, colds and flus (as we'd term them today).
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
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@RealityGrapple And here's the point: they got results regardless of anyone's opinion of 'qi' as an explanatory mechanism.
They got results which are in CONFLICT with other studies. Why is that? How can the same mechanism give relief to one and nothing to the other? Isn't that odd?
The only source of this problem could be either interpretation of the data or faulty method on either side.
In that case, it's illogical to take any position and by default, not believe it works.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
Rubienstien et al proved in their paper "Spinal manipulative therapy for chronic low-back pain." that there is no clincially signifigant difference between chiro and other lower back pain treatments such as rehab and/or massage therapy.
When you see things like this, what is your repsonse? 6,000 patients studied isn't a large study, but it's not a small one either.
Rundvelt 11 months ago
The problem here is that the parents don't know what is wrong with the baby. How can they make a call that the baby "needs chiro". Most problems from babies come from bacterial or viral infections (excluding birth defects).
How do you treat something which you cannot test for? Or is it that chiro is so formless that a generic treatment is "good for what ails you".
Rundvelt 11 months ago
this is terrible thts child abuse if u ask me! poor kid hes prolly gonna be mentally retarded bc of u parents =(
Jenn2790 11 months ago
I would never to do this to my baby.
kekedj214 11 months ago
If my parents had had me checked over when I was a kid I wouldn't have all the problems with my legs that I have now.At 22 I finally decided I needed to see a chiropractor and I've been much better since, but I am taking a long time to adjust because I've had these problems since I was a child. I will deffinately get my kids checked early on.
teddie552 11 months ago
I have been adjusting my 4 year old since he was only 3 days old. I checked him immediately after they weighed him. Unbelieveable enuff, he didn't need an adjustment immediately after birth. My wife and I opted for water birth with a midwife, so there was no kamikaze md on the other end trying to extract him from the birth canal. His birth was very pleasant for him and mom. We did not get any vaccines and never would. He has not been sick in over 3 years.
kmckamey 11 months ago
@kmckamey vaccinate your dang kid. so far, you're banking on luck, and other people being responsible.
what a horror show.
RealityGrapple 11 months ago
As a healthcare professional who has taken medical school anatomy courses and countless other courses, I offer a few thoughts.
After watching several chiropractors perform treatments here on youtube, my personal opinion is that 60% of what they say and "perform" is completely holistic (i.e., is mostly in the mind but does not physically do anything) .
dmdstudent 11 months ago
You gives ME yo babyz.
I Fixez it.
nikker1985 1 year ago
> Even medical. You treat the scientific method (and it's not a pure science) like a religion. It'd be interesting to see, over your lifetime, how much care you'd be able to accept if you held it to your "standards".
Name me a single better model for learning about the natural world then. Go ahead. What should we use instead if it's so flawed. Obviously you don't care for it, given that pubmed only publishes scientifically proven papers. What is your standard?
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt Are you exaggerating his comment? Yes. His point, obviously, is that the scientific method is not nearly as reliable as physics laws, which are science. It's pretty clear you're just trying to pick a fight on youtube. Good luck.
trulyheaven777 1 year ago
@trulyheaven777 So, the laws of physics don't rely on the scientific process to be shown? That's a new one on me.
And no, I'm not trying to pick a fight. When he says "You worship the scientific method" I rightly ask him "Which one is better for learning about reality." IF there's nothing better, why shouldn't I apply it to all things naturalistic in this world?
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt Here's a good example. If the doing research, RCT, as it currently stands incorporated a way to measure every process in the body after an intervention, it would be almost a science. When you rely on patient feedback, as many RCT's do, it is not a science or even all that close. Especially with hands on therapies.
Next time you go to the drug store, find for us, all the OTC cold medicine/symptom relievers (cough, sneeze, etc...) for under two year olds available.
trulyheaven777 1 year ago
@trulyheaven777 So, because there is not a methodology that you're aware of, then we should accept whatever evidence we have? That doesn't make sense. And furhermore, so what if there aren't medications for people under 2. Just because your child has a cough or sneeze doesn't mean you have to remedy it. Take it to a paed and then get his/her opinion on the matter.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt You really aren't getting the point. Then again, you're pretty fixated. Ask a ped what they can prescribe for under 2 years old. Maybe that will help you. You're really not getting it. In any way. Oh well, I tried....
trulyheaven777 1 year ago
@trulyheaven777 So, because they typically don't prescribe things for the cold, that means what? You're not making a point at all.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
oh well
metknott1 1 year ago
You basically hurt babies for money.
SwissCamel 1 year ago
metknott1 youre an idiot and everyone thinking that cracking a babies kneck will make him smarter or give him a bigger brain is an idiot what if she pulled to hard broke his kneck or paralyzed him then what
slick181991 1 year ago
That's what I was doing wrong. When the baby is adjusted it makes that squeaking noise. I know when you try walking on their back they just make a pitch squeal. Great how to video can't wait to give this a try.
braveheart98 1 year ago
its a bad idea to crack a babys not formed bones
ionrocket 1 year ago
@ionrocket The bones aren't being cracked.
docsrocks 1 year ago
crack that fcking neck ! :d
infoformulier 1 year ago
Why are you faggots fighting over chiropractic adjustments over the internet, like little kids do nowadays. Chiro is good, dont let queers make up stories that people have died cause of this stuff. That doesnt make any sense.
metknott1 1 year ago
@cormega006 you said: or at the least, the best thing we can focus our research into.
Research into anything that might work is more then welcomed. But don't expect to be accepted until your methodology has been proven. That's all I'm saying.
For example, chiro has been proven to increase the incidents of stroke. It's a fact. Acupuncture has been proven to be a placebo effect. Homeopathy as well.
It's all on Pubmed, research done by scientists to better the world.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt It has far from been "proven to increase teh incidents of stroke". That's false and not "a fact". Same with acupuncture, which has been proven beneficial for several things.
docsrocks 1 year ago
@docsrocks Actually it has been proven. Time to read up on Pubmed, you know, medical journals. And acupuncture has been shown to have a placebo effect. Also on pubmed. Knowledge is power.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt You're quite incorrect. And you have no clue, no power.
docsrocks 1 year ago
@docsrocks Really, perhaps you can link me the studies you're referring to. I'd like to be informed on the matter. All the information I've seen disagrees with your statements. Where are you getting your information?
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt I will clue you in that there is no study that directly shows an increased risk of TIA/Stroke with cervical manip. None. Indirect relationships do not mean causation. Most studies show no causation at all and there is no plausible, specific mechanisim of injury (even in theory). Acupuncture.....a Canadian pediatrician (yes, an MD) was the one who clued me in on the studies of it's usefullness. Prior to that I didn't think it did a whole lot either. The rest? Look harder.
docsrocks 1 year ago 2
@docsrocks Your comparison is faulty. You're comparing the lack of methodology for a non-determined event in this case, stroke, with one hat is determined, ie, going to the chiropractor. They're not the same. It would be very simple to test the effect of chiro. However, the studies that have been done that I've seen show that there is only a moderate amount of benefit (ie, slightly greater then the error rate), to lower back pain while having an increased risk of stroke based on mean pop.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt Wow, you need to look at more studies. I think you're relying on quackwatch for your info, since it's not very accurate. No study has show SMT to be a smoking gun. None. Correlations are not causations. As for backing SMT, there are loads of studies of varying degrees to back usefullness. Some very good, some not. Doesn't stop people from getting well in my clinic.
docsrocks 1 year ago
@docsrocks > Doesn't stop people from getting well in my clinic.
That's the typical response from someone who doesn't have a clue about patients. Patients claim to get well in homeopathy clinics. They claim to get better due to praying. They also claim to be healed by taking herbal remedies from the far east. What they claim isn't fact. And if you had any knowledge into the medical field, you'd know that the claim "People get better' is bogus. I think you're just a chiro fanboi.
Rundvelt 1 year ago
@Rundvelt Not when they are paying for it and very skeptical. Your comment is overstated and claiming "placebo" effect on more than 40% of patients is ludicrious. What you don't get is that not even close to every healthcare procedure has overwhelming evidence for it's use. Even medical. You treat the scientific method (and it's not a pure science) like a religion. It'd be interesting to see, over your lifetime, how much care you'd be able to accept if you held it to your "standards".
docsrocks 1 year ago 2
@docsrocks And, believe or not, exams consist of objective testing. It isn't just good enough for a patient to think they are alright.
docsrocks 1 year ago
@docsrocks Objective testing? It's not about whether it's objective, the methodology is what's at core. You can objectively test shamanism. That is to say, not take sides. But if you rely on "getting the willies' as evidence for something happening, you're going to have very different results. Chiropractors by trade do not have the requisite knowledge to form a methodology or analyze medical problems and the efficacy of the treatment.
Rundvelt 1 year ago