Bobby Jones - Clearing The Left Side

[rojm]

the sound they add in for hitting the ball is timeless hah

[Vazquez71]

damn.. bobby jones had small ass feet! LOL

[fradaja]

priceless



[emncaity]

You didn't. I did, as part of the response to your post regarding the possibility of holding a tournament with only the old equipment. Point was--I think you'll see it below--that the Tour would never allow it, because it would tarnish their product, because the players are _not_ as flawless as the Tour makes them out to be, and game-improvement equipment is part of what helps create that illusion.

[dschultz6072]

pretty good for someone who just golfed on the weekends. kind of makes you wonder if there's no excuse for the weekend warrior to be shooting above 90.

[emncaity]

@dschultz6072

Welllll...not _just_ on the weekends, but your point is still right. There are multiple milllions of dollars to be made in complicating the swing and the game, you know. "Follow the money" is a good principle in this matter, as in so many others.

[jcking33]

nice shot!!!

[stevepising]

the greatest.

[Inmotion70]

it is blasphemy to include Tiger Woods in a video with Bobby Jones.

[teewoods]

One of the best golf videos on YT

[robertschelly]

Looks like Riviera CC in Pacific Palisades - can anyone confirm?

[smithersandburns]

@robertschelly Yeah, it's Riviera. Shot there because back in those days if you wanted to "make a movie" it had to be in Hollywood, or close to it, because that's where they had the cameras. Plus, he would get old school celebrities like WC Fields to be on his golf instruction show.

[emncaity]

@robertschelly

Has to be.

[Nightwing690]

did Jones hit a draw or a fade?

[smithersandburns]

@Nightwing690 Both, he hit it straight a lot too. Did whatever he wanted. The guy was ridiculously good and had shitty equipment.

[emncaity]

@smithersandburns

State of the art for the day, but I know what you mean. You may have heard of the time one of the equipment vans (I think it was MacGregor) brought out some of the old blades-persimmon-and-balata for some of the modern pros only a few years ago. Not one of them could hit those clubs as far or as straight as Nicklaus could--and that equipment was miles ahead of hickory, of course, depending on how you look at it.

[smithersandburns]

@emncaity Yeah, there is a lot to be said for how equipment effects the game. To be fair, a player is going to make his swing fit the current technology so when they get a swing to perform with lightweight oversized high moi clubs it will not be as optimum for a heavy steel shafted little wooden head. But I liked the old equipment better in a lot of ways since it's unforgiving and may require more skill. They should play one tournament a year with old equipment. That would be fun to watch.

[emncaity]

@smithersandburns

I'd pay to see it, but the PGA Tour would never allow it. They have too much invested in the perpetual "these guys are good" campaign. I mean, those guys _are_ good, but not for the typical reasons most amateurs think. 

[emncaity]

@smithersandburns

They miss shots; they didn't make a "good play" by aiming at a tiny area to the right of the green and getting a good bounce (despite what TV announcers say); etc. But they do save par all the time when they miss a green, hardly ever incur penalty strokes, rarely make more than a one-stroke mistake, and rarely three-putt. But that truth is too boring for public consumption, so the Tour and its sponsors play into the myth of near-perfection, nowhere more so than with Tiger.

[smithersandburns]

@emncaity When did I say they didn't miss shots?

[emncaity]

@Nightwing690

Generally, you mean? Definitely a draw.

[emncaity]

@Nightwing690

Are you asking because you think clearing the left side generally leads to a fade? If so, generating power from the ground up and clearing is critical to getting the club coming at the ball from the inside on a relatively shallow approach (so the force goes mostly forward instead of being dissipated into the ground). You _can_ hit a draw by coming over the top (which involves little lower-body motion), or hit a fade by coming over the top and holding on...

[emncaity]

@Nightwing690

...but a better fade comes from the same inside path a draw comes from, just with a slightly open clubface relative to the path. That's what Nicklaus used to do. Trevino did too. In Nicklaus's case, he ended up getting steeper and steeper, though, and in '79-'80 had to go back to thinking about inside path, shallow approach, etc. Later on he said he thought that happened partially because of the tendency to underuse the lower body as you age. Anyhow...FWIW.

[Vazquez71]

damn.. bobby jones had small feet... LOL

[mhmltn]

Nobody today knows anything about the incredible flex they had with those hickory wood shafts. He was doing what he needed to do to make the equipment he had work for him.

[golfaholicXx]

how are people criticizing this swing... it was possibly the most fluent swing of all time and the first of its kind.

[MrLuigiFercotti]

@golfaholicXx

Because they are too stupid to realize they don't know what they are talking about. 

[may7charlie]

wonderful clip. Thanks

[silgneb]

I bet he rarely hit a bad shot, he was so focused

[sulakleo]

all the greats look the same at IMPACT just a little different ways to get there. watch the back of the left at and through IMPACT, emblem on the glove turns down for a full release...IMPACT the moment of truth,,,we mortals just have to learn how to get there??????

[whammydoom]

Bobby has the club across the line at the top though, it seems

[emncaity]

Very much so--but that was common in Jones's time because of the way hickory had to be swung...looser in the lower body and in the hands, relatively gentle change of direction, etc. Plus, he came a little over the top (like Snead). But as for the power source, if you look from about shoulder-high to shoulder-high, it's amazingly similar to a modern swing, esp. in its from-the-ground-up quality.

[emncaity]

...coming back here again and again to see the beauty of the thing, not to mention the timelessness. You could learn everything you needed to know about the swing, the short game, the mental game, and competition from reading Jones's books, provided you made the relatively minor adjustments from hickory to steel. You just can't believe how similar the principles are to what Nelson, Hogan, Snead, Nicklaus, and now the modern players employ.

[emncaity]

Different language, different terms, etc.; there's a lot of money to be made in pretending there's a "new secret" or "new system." But if you look at Jones's books, you'll see everything about starting the downswing from the ground up, keeping the lead side in control (contrary to the popular myth that hickory players like Jones "threw their hands at the ball"), keeping the head back, restraining the movement of the shoulders on the downswing while the lower body leads...

[muddywater661]

@emncaity Too true.

[emncaity]

Main differences have to do with the lower body action on the backswing--specifically, how much resistance you want there with steel v. hickory.

[emncaity]

Oh, and get this: Decades ago, Jones was already talking about how he figured out that you want to reduce excessive backspin on tee shots, and to do that, he experimented with as deep-faced a driver as he could and teed the ball high. This was in the '20s and '30s. And here we are, talking about spin rate today and building big-ass drivers you need to hit high on the face. (Check his "On Golf," pp. 129-130.)

[sandwah9]

my old teacher in college in Austin played on the tour in the 30's, 40's and 50's, and was good friends with most of the guys out there. he told me once of his rounds playing with jones in the mid 30's when jones was out of competition. he said you literally could not believe how well jones hit the ball - most beautiful iron shots he ever saw. he wouldnt play for a month, come out and scorch a course. and he was hitting 300 yd drives with a junk ball and wood shafts.

[DFORCE8228305]

guys..tis swing givs u deadly precision shots. 90% u hit the target..its simple to use..and because of this swing i turned pro.u get spin 70% of the time u make an approach shot.from driver to sand wedge.study wat jack, arnold and bobby do it.their records just cuts the rest of the others off..my advice is observe..

[sloppyoscar]

the natural swing, it seems, is no longer very common. It may look natural but it sure isn't easy to do. I guess that it is easier to teach and learn the modern power swing

[str8upptalent]

thank you who uploaded this the modern swing shit these days r crap imo. stack and tilt gives u no power. the other modern swing of almost no shoulder turn and keeping the left foot down is bull****. the old time teechniques like jones, watson, and nickalous r the best. gives u accuracy, power and is easy to keep from injury by getting over ur back foot with lifting up ur left foot

[brian8292205]

He won what 13 majors.

And retired from competitive play when he was 30.

I'll take his flawed swing because whatever he did he did it right/

[cgasucks]

Just remember..he won all those majors while still an amateur..

[chopperdeath]

Yeah, he comes in over the top.

Armed with my "modern" swing, I would have no problem losing 10 and 8

[smashedbros420]

his left heel moves up like woah.  Very nice hip movement though.

[rappug]

Jones' swing has some serious flaws compared to the modern swing. His left heel comes up on the backswing, and he turns his hips, rather than keeping his left heel down, his legs "quiet" and making a core-activating shoulder, not hip turn.

impact. He also takes the club way to far back at the top of his swing (even despite the flexibility of hickory), which causes him to come over the top.

[brh5934]

yeah but he didnt have a modern swing. And his swing was as natural as it could be, the man was arguably the greatest golfer of all time- that being said, I believe his swing is flawless.

[pointspreadpros]

"Flaws" ?... Are you kidding me?. We should all be so lucky. A flawed swing is one that doesn't repeat. Jones had one of the best swings ever. Forget the "modern" swing crapola, most of the golfers today couldn't carry Jone's jock.

[swooshjr]

He'd still crush you and most of us, LOL His swing has to do with his clubs he used.

[jmschneider1]

@rappug He definitely does not come over the top of the ball. They have a swing plane view at 1:22. His downswing is on plane. Jones played a draw. If his swing was over the top, his ball flight would have been a pull hook.

The only things that have ever mattered in the golf swing are the plane of the club on the downswing and the impact position, as these are the only two things that affect the flight of the ball.

[forexjunkie]

If you notice the first thing to move from the top of his backswing to the start of his downswing is the clubhead. The first thing he does is uncock his wrist, no delay.

[markponi]

As long as the foot doesn't spin before impact, it is ok. The foot is pulled up by the left hip and left shoulder rising.

[rw5791]

jones said it,right there.The hips shift slightly,what we call today a lateral slide.

[pointspreadpros]

No, he said the hips move FORWARD, not backward (as in a lateral slide). That is a MAJOR distinction.

[rw5791]

I should have been more specific.Yes,the hips shift slightly forward on the downswing ,HOWEVER ,the head must be held steady througout the swing.

[fdballer50]

don't tell jack nicklaus that.

[MikePedersenGolfTips]

This "hip cleaing" is exactly what I am desperately working on. I do just what Bobby said. My hip stops in the downswing, and my arms get disconnected. I'll keep working on it, but videos like these really help.

[11carraghers]

look at his right foot and right knee action to clear the hips. all the great ball strikers are the same, right knee drives towards the target and no gap between the knees. youre probably driving the knee towards the ball leaving a gap between the knees

[emncaity]

Some of you guys are spot on, I think. If you take out the few hickory-related and anachronistic stylistic elements (dragging the club back at first, handsiness at the top), it's really astounding how little has changed in the central engine of the swing.

Jones could hit it absolutely stupid distances, for his equipment. I mean crazy. Watching some of his old film, it's no wonder why.

[emncaity]

To clarify: Some differences have to do strictly with hickory. E.g., it seems to me the looser appearance at the top (left heel up, etc.) is necessary rather than stylistic because creating more resistance between upper and lower halves makes too strong a braking action at the top and way too much shaft bend with hickory. You have to be a little gentle on the backswing and transfer the power on the downswing more gradually. If you've ever swung hickory, you know what I'm talking about.

[emncaity]

As for Jones' across-the-line position at the top, that tends to happen with a handsy backswing coupled with a big turn. Then there's a tendency for even good players to compensate by aiming a little right and pulling the ball back on target (cf. Snead, who started on wood shafts). It's not fatal to guys like Jones and Snead (who was less handsy, as you know) as long as the pull isn't too extreme and isn't accompanied by a "quit," as Jones illustrates here, where the lower body stops moving.

[cryogenics66]

you can't deny that solid contact just about every time. His DL is almost flawless

[no1eltonjohnfan]

Discounting the backswing.... from the transition downwards this is about as textbook a golfswing as you are likely to get in whatever era.

[emncaity]

I was just thinking the same thing. Hickory had everything to do with it. It would stand to reason, I guess, that once you set the downswing in motion--that is, once momentum had built along the entire club--from that point on the club might play about like steel. The guys who played both, or who straddled both eras, in other words (like Snead), say the biggest differences were when you first set the club in motion in a specific direction--takeaway and start of the downswing.

[trespasstoland]

what a gay post

[timlin0607]

Not the most technically sound swing but his impact is beautiful, which is the only thing that counts.

[cjad2515]

bobby jones does the stack & tilt swing

[SHAKEnBAKE224]

yea he does. i never even realized it

[proslayar]

no he doesnt, his left heel is off the ground in the backswing

[emncaity]

The whole notion of the S&T swing is inapplicable to a hickory-shaft-era player, even if it may be true that Jones hits some of the "positions" or makes moves as described by S&T advocates.

[jborra17]

the greatest golfer ever. and we share a birthday

[Alextipton]

he has a great swing but there is no way possible that u can swing that way with today's big drivers they are longer and to big to take back like that u can see daly's swing is similar but wider and not as smooth

[Con7ent]

I don't see how Jones kept on plane or square at all at impact with the way he moved his feet and hips... in fact, from the waist up his position at the top and unwinding motions on the downswing remind me of Tiger Woods. His swing was just his brand... timeless beautiful motion.

[ambush923]

I love how Bobby doesn't restrict his hip turn during his backswing. Gives his swing a relaxed motion look. Unlike today players who restrict the hip going back which creates tension throughout.

[lhwood777]

it that how you swing

[tongzilla]

jango, where can we see the last part of the video when Tiger comes on?

[jango1000]

This is from a clinic with jack nicklaus 04,

it's just a summary of his shots

[tongzilla]

do you think you can put this up some time?

cheers!

[jango1000]

Sorry I no longer got that it's 2 years ago