Advanced Wing Chun Competition at Atlantic City, 2010

[TheLycan11]

why no trapping?

[monkeyographer]

absolutely terrible

[thefallintomatter]

advanced ?

[chickpizza]

was that donnie yuen in the background?

[richrolls22]

Guys with guts !

[terryb0y]

are u serious that's the wing chu from ip man??? you kidding me??? it's like a gay punch damn !! iam a jiujitsu man and i loove ip man but that's please iam not ok !

[TheNinjawolf666]

@terryb0y this is called Chi Sao, also know as the Wing Chun game, it tests your nerves and reactions to that your opponent is doing. yes i agree that it weird but when 2 people of wing chun do Chi Sao they can get muddled up.

[combatives]

Pummeling Drills will improve your inside game, much more than CS as it is competitive in nature and puts you in a better position to launch explosive WC attacks. CS maintains a "false distance", I prove it with my 3/1 Ratio Principle, that once an opponent is that close to you a strike or deep close in would be exacted in a split second. Not enough time to use the articulacy methods shown off in most WC. Just a suggestion. Best wishes to you and your Kwoon brothers and sisters.

[combatives]

Peace Out. Best wishes in your training, always happy to speak with you.

[combatives]

...teaching them, but to high level functional students that can use it as a reference. However, a better reference is the skill as applied in a freestyle unexpected sparring match. Yes, competitiveness is good, it breeds aggressiveness and control, an understanding of timing, efficiency, and workable methods goes a long way compared to rote memorization of forms, or drills that dispose of attacks with real intent. If I had a time machine to show WSL what I am speaking- I think he would agree

[combatives]

I agree that the Luk Sau components if used correctly such as Bong, Tan, Fuk are exceptional. I view all the systems as shapes that are taken based upon point of contact, energy, pressure, and given vectors. Techniques are example or at the best allusions to what is happens at given points of interaction. I do shadowboxing and get a greater ratio of performance against resistance compared to doing a form. Forms are too fixed, and are more like documents learned verbatim. Sifu can keep ...

[combatives]

I would like to share that in a real fight where speed and power in punching, and footwork is employed that CS trapping/striking skills are hard if not near impossible to do. Even in your CS demo/match it is more difficult to apply. Imagine having only seconds needed to defeat the opponent of being surrounded by a few attackers? This specialized skill concentrates on a range and circumstance that appears and is gone in a split second. WC can work, but it must be very proactive, aggressive!

[combatives]

Best wishes, sincerely to you.

[combatives]

...then I say follow his teachings, but ask him (Oh BTW, kudos for your MT experience and ring matches), what particularly was WC when you fought? Did it work as we train? If not- then make changes so it will work in real fighting range, real time, with real power. I just want to cry when I see people doing other than what equates to real dangers, real timing. Training that reinforces rehearsed, predictable, non-contact paradigms are not in any way training to be effective for real situation

[combatives]

I just challenge WCist/MAist everywhere to look at what they are spending time doing and compare it to necessities based on modern forms of threats, crime trends, statistical and scientific analysis, and pitting your skills against numerous trained fighters from various systems and see what really results from it. WC plain and simple must be, according to principles, one of the most-if not the top fighting system today. Yet, what do we see. If a real Sifu fought in MMA (I did Shootboxing, MT)

[combatives]

..time spent learning Chi Sau vs scenario based training, time spent learning antique weapons vs modern weapons including firearms. I hate it when I see WC'ist do a demo against "boxing", "anti-grappling" against an untrained boxer, or a guy pretending he is good at a shoot or takedown. Most WC is commercialized and not worthy of the WC title. You know what I am saying. I know I have tested my system against real experts and plenty of real fights and military combat experience. I do know.

[combatives]

My goodness, e.g. all respect to Ip Chun, but he has never fought, at the least WSL did, and that I give credit. Yet, that was back then, this is now, a very different world. Imagine an Army that has never had fighting experience claim to be effective? You said you appreciate the ground fighting integration, but other integration/changes to suit modern threats are not needed? Best of luck. Just think time learning forms vs learning real application, time learning Mook vs time in sparring..

[combatives]

All respect to WSL lineage, as LT system sucks. Your Sifu, Scott Baker, is intelligent and has many good perspectives on WC application. However, no matter how well you are taught WC, and yes WSL system is a better fight art than most WC, it lacks big time in a necessary element. Not all systems can have everything, but there are those that get very close. I am not picking on a brand. I am saying ALL WC/VT systems should take a closer look at what enables real Effectiveness- not tradition!

[combatives]

Ving Tsun has nothing to do with Leung Ting? That is an accusation, LOL! You have no idea what a VT nut you are...sad to say. I need nothing but PROOF to modernize. It isn't just "humans", but VIOLENT humans with no code. Not a WC/VT system vs Manchurian/other Kung Fu systems. Modern threats with new faces with new tactics- MODERNIZATION is absolutely necessary if one thinks LOGICALLY. Hope you are safe and start comparing your training to REALITY! Kiser WC is an example of many that do!

[combatives]

Preserving an fighting system has a lot to do with keeping it on the edge of development. If you think your "methods" are sufficient, fine with me. I just hope you realize that Chi Sau does not a good fighter make, and that if you listen to what I am saying, it has nothing to do with your Ving Tsun skills. I am sure that you worked hard to learn it, just as I did to learn Ho Kuen Ng's system, Ip Man, etc. If I were "CogDis" then I would not ask questions and seek answer about effectiveness.

[combatives]

Pt 2 of 2: Although it would be nice to know you, its is irrelevant to the point. I have not guessed, this is research based on data that shows time and time again that the "system as it is being taught" is not as combat-proofed as it should be, especially when looking at the principles that it was based. In fact, look at the Joh Fun #9 Gai Gwong Sueih Hon Chih Joh Fan" actually guides us to "polish" the system. To claim it effective, it must be cutting edge. I am not knocking your efforts.

[K4ne91]

@combatives

First you say it was once a working system, then you say most of the wing chun needs to be modernized. I assure you I learned a very good wing chun, because my teacher learned at "philipp bayer" who was a student of wong shun leung for 20 years. Watch some of his videos and you finally know my ving tsun iam talking about, after your "research" :) We kept principles and effectiveness, its like the opposite of LT WT.

Maybe we talk at cross-purposes a little. Watch my VT and tell me

[K4ne91]

@combatives I have to add that I agree 100% with the sentence "the 'system as it is being taught' is not as combat-proofed as it should be" if I look at systems like LT WT.

[combatives]

Best of luck to you, to each their own; but don't say that somebody didn't fairly warn you. Peace, Humanity, and no hard feelings.

[combatives]

Even in my old WC days, that way that you do Luk Sau is by no means an exemplification of the forward Energy of WC. Admit it, you made a competition out of a training tool so that you could somehow make it seem as an endorsement to your "skill". Keep up that hopscotch, it's real impressive.  What is next; patty cake demonstrations?

[combatives]

Let's take a look at most fighters that can hold their own against real tough and dangerous opponents in differing situations. Rare will you see the structure used in WC forms, demos, and when WCist get in a fight most that try the WC as they are taught it gets them hurt or worse. Look at WC guys in MMA, most "revert" to other than WC methods. Is WC wrong? In essence, No..as status-quo WC...YES! WCist need to be honest detach from traditions and look at what really works in fighting. DYU?

[MrQapo]

@combatives agreed.. however wing chun works real wing chun not this watered down crap, My Sifu is a fighting WC guy so our approach is more applied and less...this shit but it would be foolish to not absorb what works in real fighting, I came to WC from Thai boxing had a few fights in ring and out but feel in love with WC. Its all about the teacher I credit Sifu Edwards and Sifu leung for giving me "key to the pot of gold"

[combatives]

I am an innovator and hard core thinker that has maintained WC principles and purpose and deep research of WC to develop a more hardcore, modernized system. It is cognitive dissonance and delusion why others train without revaluing the system and comparing it to real needs as a fighting art. It must change! 99% of GMs are fake or not fighters. Forms, Chi Sau, Mook Jong, Weapons all must change or go away and be replaced with better means of training to be a great fighter. So few understand

[K4ne91]

@combatives i bet you dont even know real ving tsun

[combatives]

@K4ne91

I bet you wouldn't know the real stuff until it ripped that which so depend upon to shreds. A WC man that knew real fighting wouldn't waste his time is such shallow and meaningless "competitions". It is demeaning. I bet you don't know Kiser Wing Chun System, and that is sad. Your Ving Tsun is a real mess.

[combatives]

@K4ne91

Maintain your cognitive dissonance at your own risk, as for me I am sticking to true progression as it is the heart of Wing Chun. Anything else is a preservation society or an intellectual insult to those that understand the real Wing Chun way.

[K4ne91]

@combatives

I don't know Kisers wc system, so what!? I dont need to.

Why would you change a working system which is logical? You can optimize it or adapt it to your own fighting experience. But you shouldn't change the basic philosophy of wing chun, because its based on economics. Systems like WT changed too much and have a different interpretation. The VT i learned isnt ripped or "shreds".. You're just guessing, while knowing nothing about me or my VT.. THATS cognitive dissonance

[combatives]

@K4ne91

Actually, it once was a working system against the past paradigm of threats for which was originally designed. WT/WC/VT against it's own methodology is a non sequiter. The basic philosophy of economics is not to be held higher than effectiveness. What you call reinterpretations are attempts by others to bring the system into a more modernized approach against the threats that face us (humans) today. VT, aka, Leung Ting branch, is not the standard....PT 1 of 2

[K4ne91]

@combatives Wing Chun was created for self defence against humans. So the threat today is something else? What a piteous try of justifying the need of modernization. I never said reinterpretations. If you think you could integrate any muay thai techniques for example, you didn't understand wing chun. Ground fighting is another thing, i'd appreciate that as modernization. Sadly you're still pretending to know something about my ving tsun. It is NOT in LT lineage. Pathethic accusations

[vyvial]

Uncle Pete!



[laylowtech]

wtf 

[EBB47]

Bruce lee wasn't that literal with his "Formless Water" saying

[zonic101]

WACk!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!­!!!!!

[arahim1231987]

Black tshirt guy is flailing like hes in the middle ages

[spinningtop321]

muaythai all the way!!!

[spildaleidodomo]

lol

[AnamiLoka]

why do i have a feeling 90% of the people givin comments here have 0% to like 10% real wing chun/wing tsun/ Ving Tsun experience? Like they are all sifu's, training over more then 10 years then come saying shit to other practitioners who also is trying to learn this beautiful but deadly art. People should stop acting like they went from nothing to a grand master and learn to have respect for another, especially another practitioner.

[MrRastaVibrations]

@AnamiLoka the video does say "advanced". I was kinda expecting better skills when I started watching the video, too, so you can forgive some people for being a little critical, but yeah, some people are just dicks.

What I love about this video though is that it shows quite well the disparity in size and height works in the smaller guys favour (not that he's particularly small...)

[purefhate]

Sumo-wresting???

What the fuck???

[UnitedKorean]

BRUCE LEE WAS RIGHT ALL ALONG. BE FORMLESS LIKE WATER MY FRIEND.

[EBB47]

@UnitedKorean hahahahahaha

[pokkai988]

haiz no competition from wing chun just have a chi sao form.. nobody fight with u start from chi sao la bro at real life...

[MrRastaVibrations]

@pokkai988 that's true, but the Chi Sao rolling drill is just a training exercise, designed to hone the sensitivity of the practitioner.

To put it another way - in archery, the bowman uses a stationary target for practice and competition. In hunting you aren't likely to find a stationary target but all of that practice shooting one makes it that bit easier to hit a moving one.

[DocrintiboltFTW]

probably the worst wing chun ive ever seen rolling like a bunch of girls in a tickle fight  wheres the pillows?

[giuliocc]

I have to admit that real chi sao in semi-contact is hard to do. This stuff is a bit sloppy. Posture all over the place, force is all wrong, (ie both are leaning into it to much). Keep training guys..

[DuckyDuckyDuckDuck]

This is legit Chi Sao .. Real Deal ... 2 Thumbs up

[MrMjlove101]

this is the true example of ...it's not the martial art that fail ...it's the martial artist that fail lol

[MontyMuZ]

You are a f...... disgrace to all Wt / wc families in the world. The beginners in my family would rip youre head off in a second.

Both of you should go play chess!! DAMN that was bad!!!!

[juicespirit]

the guy at the back is donnie ?

[universal80]

the Mac Donalds of wing chun ,

[KStylez05]

Is this a contest to see who can grab who's man boobs first?

[talon115]

This is hilarious!

[TheSaltywalrus]

Wow, I could take both of those guys and the sad thing is they have probably been doing that for years

[ramp31]

lol i love how they hug each other after shaking hands as if they just fought in a real fighting tournament.

[TheIpmanFan]

the guy in white sucks look how his body is u all his weight is on the other guy rofl

[kletyop]

those guys should lose some weight.

[bananaman22]

..... wow. diasgrace.

[xilence1984]

Its not a horse stance. Its a goat riding stance.

[WellingtonWrightTv]

I see no proper horse stance at all!

[hotdrummerdude]

@WellingtonWrightTv wing chun does not apply the horse stance. i suggest you at least study the principles of a martial art before attempting to critique it. not trolling, just anti trolling bro.

[WellingtonWrightTv]

@hotdrummerdude I guess this is the problem people tell me about on youtube. Most kung fu systems apply the the horse stance. Ip Chun, Ip man's son, has said the Horse Stance is the Paramount of propelling the oppenets energy in the chi sao drill. These guys also, don't have their hands in Wu Sao, and neither of them use Bong Sao, or a Loping technique. I practice wing chun by the way, only for a month now, but my Sifu has taught me somethings I should be able to see in a video.

[keejay241]

tsk.. its a shame..

[jorgecbooc]

GAYS...

[imy786786]

Can't believe some1 actually named this vid "ADVANCED chi sao", what a joke, lol.

[imy786786]

Wt a load of rubbish, chi sao isnt sparring or fighting, cant hav a chi sao competition, dsnt mke sense, its purely a training exercise, its like 2 boxers having a punch bag competition, wdnt mke sense and wdnt determine whos a betta fighter. PS these guys cnt do chi sao t save their lives, very poor.

[TheDreamersDisease4]

garbage.

[underpantswedgy]

be

[underpantswedgy]

if the guys had no pot belly they wouldn't bee hit more often.

[1234S1234S]

How do you want to defend yourself with this bullshit ???

[LOLittleHero]

nice clean technique. impressive

[THAKNIVEZRHOT]

GOOD