Hear what God of Israel YAHUSHUA-YAHUWAH (Son and Father are ONE) saying to our generation by His chosen prophets: Trumpetcallofgodonline. com ; Letter called "Purify Your Faith, and Come to the Father as It is Written": EXCERPT: "Only in the Bible and through these very Letters, of which I have given to My prophet of the end of this age, shall you find Him and know Him."
@FFreeThinker i know this video is very old but.. is there any way to flip the annotations around so that the previous vid in the series is in the top left and the next is in top right? thanks for reading this :)
Christians have NO "theories", they have unsubstantiated BELIEFS. There is a huge difference between a scientific theory and a belief. A scientific theory must have EVIDENCE to support it and it must be able to be falsified and to predict a future connected to that theory.
A belief has no evidence, it cannot be falsified, it cannot predict and ANYTHING can be believed which is why there are so many religions and "gods".Without a active brain, there is NO conscious state.
Do you have any EVIDENCE that anything other than being recycled happens to us when we die?
Sure, we would like to BELIEVE that we have another life after death but there is NO EVIDENCE to support that belief.After death WE CEASE TO EXIST, PERIOD. When the brain dies, we as an individual cease to exist, there is no recovery from brain death.
Where is the EVIDENCE for your belief of an afterlife?
There is NONE! Science has looked, NO EVIDENCE has ever been found, never! Dead IS dead!
The only evidence of what happens to us after death is that we are recycled.
Life feeds on life, death feeds other life, we as an individual cease to exist, no "heaven", no "hell", nothing.There is no mystery to death, our fear of death has invented lies that feel good, that we are not like other animals, that we are excluded from death - not true, dead is simply - dead.
@2sheilach Whoa, you're taking that beyond evidence man. Try to hold back your ego and overzealous nature. Naturally, a geographical interpretation of the concept of "heaven and hell" is illogical...but, to outright say "there is no mystery to death" is to be..well, blatantly wrong. Science has not yet discovered what happens to consciousness as a whole yet. We can say that memories and personalty traits held in the brain would cease, but any conscious state? We're working on it!
@2sheilach You'd do yourself and us a lot better to not make assumptions based on what we have not proven. There is no evidence to support especially many Christian theories and some to counter act them (how we came to be and when, for example)...but, we have not proven that we in no sense exist after death. By definition the energy that makes us up currently can not "die." Does that mean that any sense of our consciousness or individuality remains? Not necessarily. We don't know!
Please visit my channel for the unpopular truth about homosexuality.
A person does not need hatred or any kind of phobia in order to acknowledge important differences between heterosexual attraction / behavior / marriage / adoption and homosexual attraction / behavior / marriage / adoption. Even non-religious people know this.
Homosexual activists, with support from the media, have succeeded at framing themselves as noble victims; it's an effective way to push a social agenda.
Imagine that, if we make it, we finally advance enough, and reach that sought-after threshold, to travel to the stars, to populate other worlds, to reach our true potential as a species. Those willing and courageous enough to leave our home planet will board ships to set out and start a new life, a new chapter. And every deluded religious zealot and "righteous believer" will be left on Earth to die in one last withering, pathetic whimper with no savior in sight.
Interesting video I think Sam Harris is well spoken on the subject and has the humility to admit to not knowing, unlike the religions who all know, but they all know different things. Where's the consistency? There is but one consistency within all religions, deception. My personal take on death is that it is something that we never experience, except that it happens to others around us. If we need brain function to experience, and in death there is no brain function, there is no experiencing it
Love Sam, but the thing about death is subjective. People fear death because of the way it is viewed and taught. I teach my kids that death is a natural part of life. That it is a recycling process that we all will go through and explain how that process works under natural conditions, far from the chemicals they put into dead bodies which is damaging to the environment. Missing loved ones is also natural but not to a point where you can not function simply because they are no longer here.
i think the reason why harris causes an uproar in the public is because he is calling a spade a spade. so in a way he then has to circumvent the problem
Christian fascism is on the rise among the right, a response from the left has been clearly to speak up against this. But that is not enough, we must call a spade a spade. Religious fanatism and christian fascism have no place in a civilized society. Question, struggle and fight with all the religious morons who promote ignorance in the face of reason.
@TheOzomahtli So what is the first sign of facistic thinking? It is to make broad generalizations and stereotypes. It particularly enjoys the tactic of namecalling and ridiculing the sincerely held beliefs of others.
Gee Sam, when you focus on only the negatives that can be associated with religion its easy to make the case that its effect is only bad. But that is a overly simplified
way of looking at it. The debates over cultural issues like gay marriage and stem cell research are only a waste of our time and energy if one completely accepts your worldview.
Its is also not enough to write off belief in an after life as just a way to make ourselves feel better.
If we all thought the way you think we'd still be living in the stone age. I'm thankful we still have many forward thinkers still around, that can reach out in faith instead of being always limited to what they can only see, hear, taste, touch and smell. Unfortunately for you, that you are going to be totally shocked by what you see, when you take your last breath.
@GodofCider Yes, you all can be rest assured that when your brain and your sensory organs cease to function, that it'll be over. Who you are and what you are is entirely dependent on your body functioning. We already can altered, or even turn off parts of our consciousness. It's suceptible to chemical and physical damage. Take that notion to it's logical conclusion, and you'll soon find something that at least approximates the answer.
I wouldnt want to go to heaven or hell when i die i mean what am i going to do in heaven for the rest of my imortal life. Sit on a bench... I like to call apon a quote from the matrix when the agent was talking to morpheous saying how they created a world for us humans and how they made it perfect with no crimes no wars nothing bad happening. And then they started to lose their crops of humans because we rejected the idea of a perfect world. I believe the same thing would happen in heaven&hell
Sam Harris, you hit the nail on the head when you say it's indicative of a psychosis in this country when we as a collective whole fret about abortion and especially gay marriage these days as THE moral crisis of our time, yet totally neglect nuclear proliferation and global warming. And continue in utter denial about the coming resource availability problems. And you are right that this psychosos has been brought about by something called "faith."
I take Sam Harris as attempting to be as honest as he can be in speaking of the legacy of faith and it's impact on the social human psyche. He's articulate, which I think is probably his best quality, and is saying what needs to be said. I think that our society desperately needs to have this conversation before it's too late. We are at the edge of planetary destruction and we need to wake up, grow up, and fix our world before it's too late.
In case you hadn't noticed, the researchers fudged the evidence on global warming. Take the fudge factor out and it really looks like the planet has been cooling.
appear to have the very essence of the charges you've leveled on both Harris and other comments in here. Maybe thouest should'st look in thy mirror befor'st casting stones.
God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real.
@SmalltimR "Classic atheistic foolishness" thou sayest... all he said was that we have REAL problems in the world to deal with and we're treating the gay marriage issue as if its THE biggest and most urgent issue of the day.
I think your statement could be labeled "Classic religious ignorance and judgement"
PS. Referring to him as a "poor sap" only weakens your statement further
Actually he completely buffoons himself on both of this opening arguments. The guy just isn't bright enough to reason on behalf of atheism as he awkwardly uses religion as the epicenter of world problems.
And despite your attempt to swing this into a religious argument(quite poorly), your response does nothing to advance your own understanding of the obvious discrepancies in this video.
Otherwise, you wouldn't need anyone to spell it our for you.
@SmalltimR hmmm...there seems to be a trend in your posts. They start with a gross misrepresentation about either the argument being made (..."completely buffoons himself"...) or about the person making the statement (..."poor sap") and then flow into another attack on the character and/or argument (..."The guy just isn't bright enough")
You might have a better time making a point if you didnt act like a buffoon yourself. I'm not saying you are a buffoon, I dont know you, but your comments
The guy willingly puts himself out with incoherent thoughts and delusions on middle east conflict and human social behavior.
Now of course, anyone can retaliate with name calling. But who carries the burden of proof here? Is it the guy peddling nonsense or the guy pointing out the nonsense?
I don't care either way, I'm just saying... when I see stupidity at this level, it makes me want to poke fun at those taking part in it.
Wait, so you don't think that religion takes center stage in causing problems in the Middle East? So extremists want Israel out of the picture so they can get beach front property, right?
Whatever the case, if you end-up with tangible information, you'll soon find that the fool talking in this video was never worthy of an audience to begin with.
"You don't get anything worth getting by pretending to know things that you don't know." I have some level of respect for religious believers, but that statement pretty much sums up why I am not among them. Religious dogma allows people to say they know things like why we're here, how the universe began, how it will end and what happens after we die. But in reality, NOBODY knows these things, and I think it can in fact be harmful to pretend that you do.
@mrw21 The problem is that Harris assumes that because he doesn't know, it is not possible that anyone else does. There are many ways of knowing, some of which cannot be empirically tested. There is a tendency among secularists to dismiss anything that does not fit their worldview.
Believing in an after life does not mean we pretend that death does not happen or that losing loved ones is not painful, it only ADDS the hope of seeing them again. No one can say it is a false hope either.
@TruthWatch I'm open to the possibility of life after death. I just don't accept the religious superstitions that surround it. Christianity's view of the afterlife leaves almost no room for an open conversation about whether there really is an afterlife and if so, what it might be like (could be entirely different from concious experience). These are conversations worth having, and I think people like Harris are simply arguing in favor of conversation in the face of appeals to revealed truth.
@mrw21 What do you consider "superstition"? There is always room for
conversation, but if your prerequisite for dialogue is that Christians abandon their
beliefs to make you feel better that is ludicrous. A good starting place for a conversation is that both sides positions be treated with respect. This is something which seems too hard for some to grasp. Dogmatism, whether religious or secular is not helpful.
@TruthWatch I mean "superstition" by the dictionary definition. A non-religious example would be a basketball player who insists on bouncing the ball 3 times and then touching his right cheek before shooting every free throw. There would be no way to prove that this behavior increases his free throw % (and there are lots of reasons to believe that it doesn't). This is what religious people do. They think that if they behave a certain way and believe certain things, they will go to heaven.
@TruthWatch Despite the goodness of many Christians, Christianity doctrine does indeed have its shallow, childish elements. Doctrines of eternal reward and punishment (heaven and hell) are inescapable core elements of traditonal Christian belief. As a result, many Christians have struggled with fearfulness, and much Christian "piety" has been motivated by superstitious fear or by self-interest. It would be helpful if Christians like yourself denounced such doctrines as childish.
@StudAward Sorry SA, but the shallowness and childishness is not in the doctrines but in the people who ignore the promise of eternal joy and focus only on the very real consequences associated with rejecting the grace of God. The good news is that people have a choice and can escape the eternal separation that sin brings. I'l lagree that a morbid focus upon the negeative is indeed childish, but believing in heaven and hell are not.
@TruthWatch Sin doesn't exist it only exists to the stupid. We arnt rejecting we are not Believing in Your fairy tails. Anyting Eternal is a curse. Life is only good Because it ends Meaning everything you do has a meaning and you won't have a chance to live again. Ignorant idiot.
@yuo252 Either sin exists or it doesn't. It can't exist only to some people and not others and truly exist.
It is always amusing to called an idiot by someone with no comprehension of the rules of grammar and spelling. Perhaps you should work on that bit first, then we can move on to the more complicated tasks of writing a coherant sentence and making a valid logical argument.
@TruthWatch "Christian beliefs reflect the way that Christians see the world and conceive of it's intrinsic reality."
I'm pretty sure that's the problem. When you're basing your understanding of reality on fantasy fairy tales and authoritative interpretation of texts that can, and are, interpreted in ways that completely contradict each other, you are not working in the realm of reality at all. At best it's hypothetical conjecture and asserting reality based on such is just plain crazy.
@AliburX Just what basis does your view of reality have? Any view of reality must have a ground upon which
meaning can be derived. If you are one of those who say a materialist view of reality is to be preferred, that only science can provide a satisfactory ground for a concept of reality, then answer this: How does science provide a ground for morality and meaning? Science is good at describing how things work. How does it help us know what what we ought to do?
@TruthWatch Morality is an issue that isn't that simple. Where it comes from, is your brain. Whether or not a scientist can draw a diagram and show you exactly how it works is irrelevant (although there are multitudes of studies that point to morality being a natural function of a social creature that relies on their society to live). Meaning is another thing that is a very individualistic pursuit. My life gets meaning from loving humanity, friends, family, activities, and universal exploration
@TruthWatch And there you go jumping to extremes and telling people what they believe. I suppose if you can just pigeonhole people it may give you some psychological security blanket and protect what you have to know be be your fantasy beliefs. You're both over complicating and over simplifying morality with almost every statement you make. I would suggest perhaps reading up on some more philosophy and science. Sure looks like you could use it.
@AliburX Did I misstate the essence of your argument? If so show me how I did so. Otherwise just own up to your true beliefs and quit whining. It easy to call someone ignorant but not so easy to demonstrate it.
@TruthWatch There is nothing wrong with ignorance, unless you choose to stay that way. If you genuinely want to explore what morality is really all about with me, OK, write me directly and we can read some books together and discuss them. We'll take turns, you suggest one, then we read it and talk about it for a week or something, then I'll suggest one. Doesn't matter if we ever see eye to eye, it would be a much more useful discussion.
@AliburX Does that mean that you cannot show me how I am ignorant? Or was it your own ignorance that you were referring to? Or were you going to try to psychoanalyze me again? Tell you what, lets see if you can handle presenting a coherent argument before we commit to any substantive investment of time and resources.
Show me which comments I have made which indicate ignorance and demonstrate HOW this is the case.
@TruthWatch Yes, I cannot explain what it means to have real knowledge, explain all of where morality comes from and educate you out of your fantasy beliefs in 500 characters on a youtube chat channel. I can read books with you and discuss it. Obviously you're not actually interested in doing anything except blowing smoke. OK, revel in your fantasy, enjoy your ignorance of reality, continue to believe in nonsense. It's your choice.
@AliburX very convenient. I know that 'real knowledge' is a subjective thing, but you could at least try.
After all, the comments which display my overwhelming ignorance fit into the space provided. Surely someone
of such advanced learning as yourself could apply only the logic and facts necessary to refute a single point or two. Just enough to show us that your pronoucements of great knowledge are not a gigantic bluff. This is certainly the impression given by your reluctance on a minor level
@TruthWatch Um, which part is convenient? Taking my personal time for the next few months to work at expanding both of our education? Doesn't sound very convenient to me. You seem to be the one avoiding doing anything real when it comes to learning a perspective outside your own. I even offered for you to suggest the first book. You obviously don't want to learn anything. OK, if you want to continue with your fantasy and not be bothered by reality, it's your decision. Good luck with that.
@AliburX "OK, if you want to continue with your fantasy and not be bothered by reality" Here is a good example of WHY I would rather test your sincerity by seeing how you handle presenting a small point or two before launching into a project like the one you suggest. After all why would you consent to an ongoing dialogue with someone whose point of view you obviously don't have any respect for? It should be a simple exercise for someone of your alleged great intellect. Is it too much to ask?
@TruthWatch You're right. I don't respect your opinion. I don't respect the way you present yourself, and it would be a waste of my time to try to educate a brainwashed halfwit. Enjoy your fantasy. Know the the human race is outgrowing your nonsense. I'm sorry you're stuck with an 11th century brain. Good luck with that too.
@AliburX Good thing I didn't take you up on your offer then. What absolute torture it would be for you to be exposed to my lunatic ravings for weeks on end as we discuss the scientific basis for the intelligent design theory in books like "Signature in the Cell" by Stephen Meyer. Then you could suggest your favorite book the pop-up version of Richard Dawkins "The God Delusion". Sorry your stuck with no braIn at all. Good luck with THAT.
@TruthWatch News flash buddy, I'm a scientist and there is no scientific basis for intelligent design, zero, zip, nada, none. If you think there is then you are describing yourself very accurately as a raving lunatic. BTW I have read zero atheist books, (never read The God Delusion) I have read the bible and many christian apologist books and it's nonsense. I've tried to understand your point of view. It's the point of view of a child who doesn't want to give up their Santa Claus figure.
@TruthWatch Intelligent design is just another form of creationism and it's a joke in the scientific community. I have yet to meet a single real scientist who gives any credence to ID. It's a ridiculously silly proposition and there is nothing scientific about it. You can't test the proposition that magic man in the sky did it.
condom is cheaper and less harmful than an abotion. abortion in cases where the baby is defective is perfectly understandable, but a health baby of a few weeks is an issue.
Abortion deserves the time it is given. Yes there should be more time given to problems based outside of religious claims, but abortion has to do with where life begins. Unless of course your saying it is no problem to take the life of another human being? Is the preservation of life simply a religious ideal, or is it a human right? That is the real abortion debate today, not some sort of out of date argument from a source written in a completely different era.
Christian nihilism emptys the world and especially human existence of meaning, purpose, comprehensible truth, or essential value. Christian nihilism is a false belief, when it leads individuals to discard any hope of meaning in the world and thus to invent some (imaginary) compensatory alternate measure of significance (in some unknown/unknowable future/realm).
The world just IS surely, it's wonderful, terrifying, beautiful, ugly, depending on where you are standing at the time. Many people can live moral, honest, courageous lives, trying to be happy without harming others. Religion does NOT teach this, even though some religious people do live like this. My mother was religious and like this - I am a devout atheist and also try to live this way. There is no sense of lack in my life, but a real joy in trying to understand nature for what it is.
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this guy is a stupid jew. he has a very big problem with elected officials believeing in absolute truth, or a creator? well why? 'um ug, because then they believe in magical bears'. 'no stupid jew, a real issue, how in a practical sense is it an issue. um uh, then they won;t worship satan.. 'jew, worshiping satan is bad. nice try evil one. shoot the jew
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the only one gettign a free ride is the liberal. now you should be ridden with bullets and then told to leave. slop you broken body out of the existance. liberal provide nothing, and take everything.
Christian: Hey, I found this book that explains how we should live and it makes sense to me so I believe it.
Rational Person: Just like that? No evidence required? No explanation needed, you'll just do anything the god of everything asks of you? That seems stupid to me.
C: Why? I'm smart.
RP: Cause you're saying freedom is worthless, we're free sure, but if we don't follow the recipe for salvation we're doomed, and if we do it doesn't much matter what else we do. Its a recipe for disaster.
It's sort of like drunk driving. It's not a problem until someone gets hurt. You might be the kind of person that never drinks too much to drive safely, even though technically over the limit. But if even a very small number of people with "too much" religion do enough damage, it makes it hard not to worry about how many others may be too religious to be allowed in public.
Ananiasacts: "But if even a very small number of people with 'too much' religion do enough damage, it makes it hard not to worry about how many others may be too religious to be allowed in public." -- You cannot demand or have freedom for yourself while denying others their freedoms as well. That's the height of the double-standard/hypocrisy which has divided this country thus far. Freedom for the few, or the one, is tyranny. Freedom for all is THE priciple this country was founded upon.
Don't be absurd. Your freedom stops where it poses a significant enough risk to others. You wouldn't, for example, be allowed to manufacture explosives in your own home. You wouldn't be allowed to advocate harming others, and Christians have been forced, by our law, to stop publishing hit lists (of doctors willing to perform abortions, etc.) And more recently from protesting at funerals. Your scripture is filled with reprehensible directives. The few good ideas it has do not redeem it.
ananiasacts: If all folks followed the basic tenets of any major religion (i.e. do unto others, love thy neighbor, honor thy parents, don't steal, don't lie, don't commit murder), there would be peace. However, there are those who misinterpret/ignore the basic tenets & commit atrocities in the name of their religion. That's wrong, I agree. However, abolishing all religion isn't the solution, either. For every opportunity to do great good there also exists the opportunity to do great evil.
The irony is that the only thing getting in the way of their delivering those messages (and only those or similar ones) is the claim that the scripture is true. That mistake completely legitimizes any interpretation that can be effectively marketed. How does admitting it is just mythology impair its ability to preach respect and mutualism? Religion could be our finest science--the deliberate attempt to find those beliefs most socially and personally empowering. As it is, it's self-defeating.
ananiasacts: This entire debate is unwinable. You're not going to convert me to your beliefs & I never had any intention of trying to convert you to my beliefs. All I'm saying is that we can, however, agree to disagree & leave each other alone. Why is it that atheists have to crusade against the complete destruction of religion? You can't scientifically prove or disprove the existence of God. You're no better than the Popes of the Middle Ages who ordered millions to their deaths in the Crusades.
"You're no better than the Popes of the Middle Ages who ordered millions to their deaths in the Crusades."
But I'm not advocating harming them in any way. Why should anything be sacred? Least of all an idea. I'm afraid you can't simply declare something off limits to ridicule. If it looks like a fraud, acts like a fraud, and has left a long trail of victims then decent people are likely to abhor it. Holding people responsible for their behavior is social infrastructure--a just & good thing.
ananiasacts: My whole point is this, I disagree w/atheism, but I have dealt w/you all with respect & courtesy in spite of my disagreements. You may wish for all religion to be abolished & I may wish for all atheists to find religion, but it just isn't going to happen. Therefore, instead of making things miserable for each other, why can't we just agree to disagree, treat each other with respect for the things we do have in common & move on? That's the decent, courteous & responsible thing to do.
But your point is based on a false premise--that the claims are equivalent when nothing could be further from the truth. You are claiming both that there is a creator, and that you know what it wants from us. This is a fantastic claim and demands an extraordinary proof, yet your evidence could hardly be more feeble. My position is only that everything we do know--a fair bit--strongly suggests we got here by purely mechanical means. There's nothing even remotely mysterious about any part of it.
Yet your claims are likewise based upon a false premise. The proof of the existence of any creator is not possible at this time & it is highly doubtful it ever will be possible to prove by science. You can deny all you want, but there is no proof to back your claims. Likewise, there's no proof to back mine. It's a philosophy of faith we're talking about. You have faith (i.e. belief) that there is no God. I have faith there is. Neither of us can be proven right or wrong. So why cause strife?
You can assert both claims are equivalent all you wish, but that only suggests that either you are genuinely incapable of seeing how fantastically different they are, or you are being disingenuous. So take your pick, but your position limits you to being either a fool or a fraud. And I see no compelling reason to pretend otherwise in dealing with you.
ananiasacts: Then you need to explain to me how they aren't equal. All I can see is atheists & believers are making fantasic claims for & against the existence of any deity without any irrefutable evidence to support their claims. Both views are diametrically opposed, but neither has any irrefutable proof to back their claims. I am neither a fool nor a fraud. However, I'm trying to find common ground to foster peaceful co-existence between us rather than blind hatred, animosity & derision.
The claim that scripture is true is a more fantastic assertion because it so violently contradicts everything we can see around us. The earth is a great deal older than any interpretation the bible allows. You cannot live inside a fish for three days. You can not put two of each creature on any boat, even today, for weeks and expect to regenerate the biosphere when you return to shore. Asking anyone to believe this is no different than calling them an imbecile. I'm just more to the point.
ananiasacts: The scripture is divinely inspired, yes, but it was transcribed by fallible man. The key points in the Bible are true & correct, but a great portion of the Bible is written in allegory & parable which is subject to individual interpretation. The Bible isn't the reveal-all source to religion, but rather a guidepost & a way to bring you closer to God so that He may reveal his divine presence to you from within. God works within folks each & every day. It's not foolishness.
You're as full of shit as your scripture. Claim all the bullshit you like. Your filthy industry absolutely depends on raping the minds of children and you're going to find that more an more difficult as the net brings the perspective of science to younger and younger audiences. Like your misrepresentation of my perspective on religion here (I have never advocated anything except teaching it.) I have also never deleted a post in my entire life. Anywhere. So lie all you like. It suits you.
ananiasacts: "You're as full of shit as your scripture." Same thing can be said for you, buddy boy. I never insulted you at all in any of my posts but now you've proceeded to bring profanity into the conversation. So, since you've proven that you are unwilling to hold a civilized dialogue, I bid my adieu to you & hope that you find some comfort in this life because unless you own up to the truth, your afterlife will be full of pain, suffering & misery all thanks to your arrogance. Good day!
You are an insult to humanity in general. You support a dictator. You;re just a cowardly worm. I think it's great that our ancestors invented a way to get imbeciles to waste their lives exploring a fantasy kingdom in their own minds. It's a shame you scumbags have to rape children, persecute gays, attack education, women's right's, medical technologies, etc. But that's what ignorant scum does--stupid dysfunctional stuff like that. Keep up your advertisement for cowardice. It suits you.
ananiasacts: nevertheless, Jesus loves you. Keep spouting your nonsense. It only reveals you as the heartless deceiver you are. I pity you & wish peace upon your tortured soul. You might wish to rein in your venom a tad, however, because if you ever spout off this way to the wrong person face-to-face, they could cause you considerable harm. But, if you wish to be an evil, arrogant, ignorant & abusive troll who abuses others in this manner, then you deserve the punishment you will receive.
as anania said,its great that our ancestors invested a way to keep feeble minds sch as yours entrapped in a fantasy world...unforuntately it backfired because its causing too much an interference wit humanity.
ok,so you admit that man is imperfect yet you,without second thought,just jump on the bandwagon when they tell you heaven exists and you are only eligible if you accept the path of christ?
TLSlayer: Life does go on beyond corporal death. The human soul is comprised of energy & even science confirms this. Those neural impulses are electricity which is energy. Einstein states that energy is constant. Therefore, an afterlife (whether Heaven, Hell or whatever) does exist. I never said one has to be a Christian. The point is, regardless of what you believe, don't attack one another over it. Live & let live. But atheists antagonize believers so don't wonder why you're treated in kind.
Our energy is constant, we rot in the ground and are turned into worm food and nutrients for other life to spring. The constant of energy is not simple proof of an afterlife.
ananiasacts: "But I'm not advocating harming them in any way." Actually, by forcing people to turn away from their religion, you are. Religion gives folks peace -- a purpose in life. To deny them that, is to cause them undue stress & harm. Atheism looks & acts like a fraud all the time, but I'm not preventing you from holding true to your beliefs. However, you have advocated doing just that to all believers. You can't have your cake & eat it, too. Live & let live is the best & only policy.
Since I can't know what happens when I die, as concerned as I am, I must live for the here and now and what makes sense.
I want loving people around me. People who love me, yet may bdisagree with me. It is OK to disagree on some points...but let's find that common ground...neither of us has to "win" we just need to move forward...let's not kill one another...let's love one another...I honestly extend my hand...please, take it!!
Here's a theist's projection of his own fear. I often hear "life must be sad" from theists, but it's quite the opposite. Life is extremely valuable, since we only have it once. When loved ones die, it's always sad. But don't you see you're admitting that you base your belief in god in your fear of death, and not in anything substantial? Missing my dead grandmother is what it is. I won't lie to myself to sweeten the blow. We move on with the fond memories, and then we die ourselves.
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I was an atheist for fifteen years after the age of nineteen. I've heard enough of the moral inversion and confusion of atheists to persuade me that atheism is by no means the answer to much of anything. He ridicules people for believing in God? What about global warmism? Atheists can believe in all kinds of hokum--some of it much dumber than belief in God.
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Atheism does not lead significantly to a better society than theism does. One can believe that there is no God and be morally confused. They are mutually consistent.
I brought up global warmism because Sam Harris himself mentions it as a major problem in this very video. Global warmism is a surrogate religion--one in which Sam Harris believes. In ten years, this catastrophism will have been replaced by a new one. Why doesn't he show some healthy skepticism toward it?
You'll need to substantiate your claim. There is a correlation between atheistic countries and lower crime rates, lower poverty, better health, and lower unemployment.
Regardless, what does lead to a better society is clear, rational thinking. America is full of god-fearing nut-jobs with guns. Our last president believed that he took orders straight from God to wage war.
"In ten years, this catastrophism will have been replaced by a new one."
I beg your pardon, but there isn't anything like an "atheistic" country on the face of the earth. Every country has some form of religion or another & some with more than one. Even at the height of communism in the USSR, there were still folks practicing eastern orthodoxy & judaism in some form or another whether overtly or clandestinely. Even the native americans have their spirit-guides. So, your example has no merit as such a place doesn't exist & your "evidence" is worthless & incorrect.
I could say the same for you. Faith is belief in that which can't be proven by fact. You have faith there is no God. I have faith there is. Yet, neither of us can prove w/ scientific fact that either of us is correct or not. That's faith. The "young-Earth" believers misrepresent fact & that is wrong. The Earth is billions of years old. However, when God created the Earth in 6 days, who's to say a day to God isn't 500,000,000 yrs or that evolution wasn't His method to create life as we know it?
who's to say a day to God isn't 500,000,000 yrs or that evolution wasn't His method to create life as we know it?" ? Yes, who but the high priests of all organised religions.
thecatsman: my point is that God is infinite & limitless & we can't force Him to conform to our finite & limited perspectives. God works in His own time & method & He has profound love for us, His children. Like all parents, He lets us make our own choices but we, as His children, have to accept the consequences of our actions when we mess up. Humanity is fallible & makes mistakes, so you have to open yourself to allow God to work w/in you to show you the way. The Bible is the guidpost to Him.
Atheists accuse those with any type of religious faith of being close-minded, stupid and any other negative connotation you can think of. You desire tolerance & acceptance yet you emphatically deny believers that same tolerance & acceptance. Who's being close-minded now? Believe what you want. I don't care, but don't tear me down for my beliefs & then demand I accept & tolerate yours with open arms. Atheism is just another "misguided" religion - the faith of no-faith - & you can't deny that.
@ tchapman Most atheists are "agnostic atheists", in that they do not believe there is a god, but do not claim absolute knowledge of it. There is a difference between disbelief and absolute certainty that you don't seem to comprehend. The close-mindedness is often reserved for people who claim absolute knowledge that a certain god exists, and in exclusive monotheistic religions, that it is the only true God. Scientific reasoning is not supposed to be hurtful, but enlightening.
@ Zonkin: The hypocrisy that irritates me the most regarding atheism, however, is that atheists vehemently demand their right to have their own beliefs (i.e. no God), yet, if I wish to go to a secluded corner of any public space on my own time & observe my beliefs, then I'm all of a sudden a misguided fool & am shunned. You want to openly profess/practice your beliefs? Fine, go ahead & do so until you turn blue in the face. But don't shun or deny me the freedom of doing the very same thing.
@tchapman Again, you do not see the distinction between belief and unbelief. They are opposites, and not the same. If I am a non-believer, I will shun all "believers", disregarding what you believe. In a democratic society, you should have the right to say anything, at the same time it is my right to deny outlandish claims, that do not relate to the real world.
Zonkin: I don't agree with the Islamic faith. However, does that mean I hurl insults at them & degrade them at every opportunity? No. I simply agree to disagree & leave them be because they are free to believe what they want. Why can't you do the same w/believers? Seems simple enough. I respect your right to choose your own beliefs for yourself whether I agree/disagree with them. Why must you attempt to deny me that very same courtesy & right?
tchapman: that's because you're religous and they're religious, we're non-religious. I don't see how this can be explained any franker. It's like you are coming from the right wing of politics, thinking we're on the left side, we're not, we're religious anarchists. The religious system isn't working. We don't care which side you are on.
It has nothing to do with any specific faith, christianity just seems to be the biggest target, as it is prominent in western, educated societies.
Zonkin: You're totally missing my point. Regardless whether one believes in God, Allah, Buddha or NOTHING AT ALL, there's NO POINT in verbally bashing folks for their beliefs, especially when one has no scientific fact to back up their position. You have dealt with me in a respectful manner, but you're in the minority amongst your atheist brethren. My whole point is why do atheists in general have to respond with hate, insults & rudeness when we can simply just agree to disagree & move forward?
tchapman: If you have been verbally abused I see your point exactly. There shouldn't be any excuse for it. Though if you have spent your time on youtube, there are asstrolls here to last a lifetime. The reason many cannot agree to disagree, is that religion is causing damage from our point of view, not always major, not always directly, but damage all the same. It fights progress, openness, the understanding of other cultures and it promotes biggotry. The moderate make the extreme possible.
Zonkin: Being Christian, I can only base my views on that set of beliefs. With same-sex marriage, if you view that as progress, then we have fought that progress. I personally don't care either way if it passes or fails, but that's my own opinion. With abortion & embryonic stem cell research, if you have to destroy life for progress, then the ends aren't really worth the means to me. However, religious groups also do great good for society (i.e. The Salvation Army, Habitat for Humanity, etc.)
maryellen728: You talk of contradictory evidence but there is none. There's no scientific proof of the non-existence of God. ust like there's no scientific proof of the My beliefs are reality so there's no fear or guilt involved. Rather, it seems atheists fear God's existence & rightly so. For in denying God, they earn his wrath & enmity & are cast out of Heaven into the lake of fire to burn & suffer for eternity.
That set of beliefs changes over time but you don't seem to know it. Which parts of the Bible do you reject/accept?
Stoning women who aren't virgins at marriage? Killing disobeient children? Killing non-believers?
For once tell the truth. You pick & choose the Biblical beliefs you like & reject the others because you don't like them. No FAITH in them? You USE the name of god to support YOUR beliefs. Do you believe the Bible is the word of god, all of it, or not?
maryellen728: The Bible is divinely-inspired, but it is written by fallible man & it is largely written in allegory & parable form so there are many different possible interpretations. However, the basic tenets are a guidepost to lead one to God so that God can reveal Himself to us from within, not from without.
Zonkin: (continued from previous post) there's also God's Pantry, Christ's Closet & a whole host of other beneficial programs administered by religious groups that benefit all of society, not just believers. You don't have to believe to benefit from those programs. The extremists (of which every religion has) give religion a bad reputation. I'm not proud of the moronic zealots from the Westboro Baptist Church. They are derided by the rest of Christianity for using God's name to do harm.
And Hamas does a lot of good social work too, does this mean we should ignore the suicide bombers? Christianity has a long history and for 9/10s of that history is has been killing people. Just because it can't get away with that strategy any longer and has adopted more modern forms of propaganda to market itself does not redeem any part of it. It is still far more socially dysfunctional than useful and will always be because it is ultimately just fiction; yesterdays conjecture on our origin.
The Bible supports their beliefs. Are you denying your own religious text, the Bible? Or don't you READ the Bible?
You want respect for your beliefs but call those who know the Bible better than you do "moronic zealots" & "extremists!"
The Salvation Army DOES discriminate against non-believers. Only Christians can get into some of their programs. Attending their church is required, period.
Bias, bigotry & arrogance is inherent in religion. Your faithful, they're not.
maryellen728: Again, the Bible, while divinely-inspired is written by fallible man & is written in allegory & parable. Many possible outcomes & conclusions can be drawn from most of the Bible. Extremists twist & contort the word of the Bible to fit their own self-serving designs. As for the Salvation Army, none who are in need are turned away. You may have to sit through a short sermon or prayer group, but you aren't required to convert to receive assistance. The only arrogance lies w/atheists.
But why? If I told you I think math would be a lot easier to teach if we just rounded off all those pesky irrationals (Pi is close enough to 3 anyways) you'd know I didn't know what I was talking about at the very least. You would not be concerned with whether you should "respect" my opinion on that matter. Religion is making scientific claims in the most disreputable way possible and then trying to leverage the microscopic possibility it could be true into a 50/50 chance. It's willful deceit.
maryellen728: Faith is belief w/o proof, plain & simple. Misconstrue words all you like to fit your twisted views, but reality is what it is. Science has yet to prove or disprove the existence of God, therefore atheism is based on FAITH. There is no proof to make atheism truth. Science needs not be separated from God. God created all that we see in the world therefore, the scientific principles that govern it are also created by God. You can deny Him all you want, but it makes you no more right.
So with that logic you must believe in Santa Clause, the easter bunny, leprechauns and also hindu half man/half elephant Gods. One things for sure, science has disproved the bible, so if you still think theres a heaven and hell i dont know what to say.....
In that case science has yet to disproof zeus, thor, odin, flying spaghetti monster, you are atheist of all of those gods, so do you actually need faith to NOT believe in them? how funny
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Hear what God of Israel YAHUSHUA-YAHUWAH (Son and Father are ONE) saying to our generation by His chosen prophets: Trumpetcallofgodonline. com ; Letter called "Purify Your Faith, and Come to the Father as It is Written": EXCERPT: "Only in the Bible and through these very Letters, of which I have given to My prophet of the end of this age, shall you find Him and know Him."
Watch:
" youtube.com/watch?v=YZPmTH6sloo"
"youtube.com/watch?v=lutJYDxP6ys"
"youtube.com/watch?v=R9ike7PKd8U"
Regards.
TrumpetCallofGodLT 4 weeks ago
@FFreeThinker i know this video is very old but.. is there any way to flip the annotations around so that the previous vid in the series is in the top left and the next is in top right? thanks for reading this :)
skwiggs103 1 month ago
Love you,Sam,love,love,lol but true !!!!
Gwynsek 1 month ago
Christians have NO "theories", they have unsubstantiated BELIEFS. There is a huge difference between a scientific theory and a belief. A scientific theory must have EVIDENCE to support it and it must be able to be falsified and to predict a future connected to that theory.
A belief has no evidence, it cannot be falsified, it cannot predict and ANYTHING can be believed which is why there are so many religions and "gods".Without a active brain, there is NO conscious state.
2sheilach 1 month ago
Do you have any EVIDENCE that anything other than being recycled happens to us when we die?
Sure, we would like to BELIEVE that we have another life after death but there is NO EVIDENCE to support that belief.After death WE CEASE TO EXIST, PERIOD. When the brain dies, we as an individual cease to exist, there is no recovery from brain death.
Where is the EVIDENCE for your belief of an afterlife?
There is NONE! Science has looked, NO EVIDENCE has ever been found, never! Dead IS dead!
2sheilach 1 month ago
The only evidence of what happens to us after death is that we are recycled.
Life feeds on life, death feeds other life, we as an individual cease to exist, no "heaven", no "hell", nothing.There is no mystery to death, our fear of death has invented lies that feel good, that we are not like other animals, that we are excluded from death - not true, dead is simply - dead.
2sheilach 2 months ago in playlist More videos from FFreeThinker
@2sheilach Whoa, you're taking that beyond evidence man. Try to hold back your ego and overzealous nature. Naturally, a geographical interpretation of the concept of "heaven and hell" is illogical...but, to outright say "there is no mystery to death" is to be..well, blatantly wrong. Science has not yet discovered what happens to consciousness as a whole yet. We can say that memories and personalty traits held in the brain would cease, but any conscious state? We're working on it!
TheEnlightenedTruth 1 month ago
@2sheilach You'd do yourself and us a lot better to not make assumptions based on what we have not proven. There is no evidence to support especially many Christian theories and some to counter act them (how we came to be and when, for example)...but, we have not proven that we in no sense exist after death. By definition the energy that makes us up currently can not "die." Does that mean that any sense of our consciousness or individuality remains? Not necessarily. We don't know!
TheEnlightenedTruth 1 month ago
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Please visit my channel for the unpopular truth about homosexuality.
A person does not need hatred or any kind of phobia in order to acknowledge important differences between heterosexual attraction / behavior / marriage / adoption and homosexual attraction / behavior / marriage / adoption. Even non-religious people know this.
Homosexual activists, with support from the media, have succeeded at framing themselves as noble victims; it's an effective way to push a social agenda.
lightandbeautiful 3 months ago
Imagine that, if we make it, we finally advance enough, and reach that sought-after threshold, to travel to the stars, to populate other worlds, to reach our true potential as a species. Those willing and courageous enough to leave our home planet will board ships to set out and start a new life, a new chapter. And every deluded religious zealot and "righteous believer" will be left on Earth to die in one last withering, pathetic whimper with no savior in sight.
CarlSagan6 3 months ago
@CarlSagan6 What if it was the other way round. What if you had to be a believer to get on the ship, would you lie to get on board?
TruthWatch 3 months ago
Interesting video I think Sam Harris is well spoken on the subject and has the humility to admit to not knowing, unlike the religions who all know, but they all know different things. Where's the consistency? There is but one consistency within all religions, deception. My personal take on death is that it is something that we never experience, except that it happens to others around us. If we need brain function to experience, and in death there is no brain function, there is no experiencing it
StephenWebb1980 6 months ago
Wakappaka and Pheepheemoomoo are real.
That's why I am a Wakappapheemoo religion follower.
Hell yeah...
0299792458 6 months ago
"You don't get anything worth getting by pretending to know things you don't know." That's a keeper.
drumrnva 8 months ago
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"You don't get anything worth getting by pretending to know things that you don't know."
WRONG!
If you're a Priest/Minister you get MONEY!
You get to tell people what to do, and how to do it at a VERY vulnerable and suggestable point in their lives.
You get CONTROL of them.
A sad truth, but one with great explanatory power.
LeoAutodidact 8 months ago
Comment removed
tabibitosama 8 months ago
Love Sam, but the thing about death is subjective. People fear death because of the way it is viewed and taught. I teach my kids that death is a natural part of life. That it is a recycling process that we all will go through and explain how that process works under natural conditions, far from the chemicals they put into dead bodies which is damaging to the environment. Missing loved ones is also natural but not to a point where you can not function simply because they are no longer here.
moety2 9 months ago
i think the reason why harris causes an uproar in the public is because he is calling a spade a spade. so in a way he then has to circumvent the problem
cnestudy1 9 months ago
Christian fascism is on the rise among the right, a response from the left has been clearly to speak up against this. But that is not enough, we must call a spade a spade. Religious fanatism and christian fascism have no place in a civilized society. Question, struggle and fight with all the religious morons who promote ignorance in the face of reason.
TheOzomahtli 10 months ago 2
@TheOzomahtli So what is the first sign of facistic thinking? It is to make broad generalizations and stereotypes. It particularly enjoys the tactic of namecalling and ridiculing the sincerely held beliefs of others.
Think about it.
TruthWatch 9 months ago
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Karma & Rebirth means We are ACCOUNTABLE for our actions. We take Responsibility.
Karma & Rebirth means that we enjoy the Gift of Life, over & over again!
Karma & Rebirth means there is no place for a Hell, no sadistic God running a torture chamber
Karma & Rebirth means We Hindus don’t Cut & Run
Karma & Rebirth means we Hindus earn Praise FROM God! Anyone fool can praise God, but Blessed are the Hindus that aim to earn Praise FROM God!
ramaraksha01 1 year ago
I nominate Sam Harris for president!
perfectionbox 1 year ago 15
people of faith are the only ones that can CONSTANLY lie, and get away with it. which is wrong
kiddhitta 1 year ago
Gee Sam, when you focus on only the negatives that can be associated with religion its easy to make the case that its effect is only bad. But that is a overly simplified
way of looking at it. The debates over cultural issues like gay marriage and stem cell research are only a waste of our time and energy if one completely accepts your worldview.
Its is also not enough to write off belief in an after life as just a way to make ourselves feel better.
TruthWatch 1 year ago
Screw it. I'm gonna say it. Sam Harris is sexy as HELL.
revelwoodie 1 year ago
He is right! Jesus said the same thing, religion is corrupted and always has been.
This is why a personal relationship is the only way.
So many people say that they cant find God, but look at your life and there is always a reason.
If you are not even doing the basic things that God asks, then why would he show you more?
If you are ignoring the simple things, it is ignorant to think That God would reveal more to you.
brandisify 1 year ago
oh that music is so annoying
insanewarlock666 1 year ago
I'm getting fond of this Sam Harris guy.
Elvisdogg 1 year ago 8
If we all thought the way you think we'd still be living in the stone age. I'm thankful we still have many forward thinkers still around, that can reach out in faith instead of being always limited to what they can only see, hear, taste, touch and smell. Unfortunately for you, that you are going to be totally shocked by what you see, when you take your last breath.
jedribit 1 year ago
@jedribit ...you mean nothing. Since if he's taken his last breath, then he's dead and no sensory input continues.
GodofCider 1 year ago
@GodofCider Yes, you all can be rest assured that when your brain and your sensory organs cease to function, that it'll be over. Who you are and what you are is entirely dependent on your body functioning. We already can altered, or even turn off parts of our consciousness. It's suceptible to chemical and physical damage. Take that notion to it's logical conclusion, and you'll soon find something that at least approximates the answer.
TheFortressMaximus 1 year ago
@jedribit Amen, good answer!
brandisify 1 year ago
I wouldnt want to go to heaven or hell when i die i mean what am i going to do in heaven for the rest of my imortal life. Sit on a bench... I like to call apon a quote from the matrix when the agent was talking to morpheous saying how they created a world for us humans and how they made it perfect with no crimes no wars nothing bad happening. And then they started to lose their crops of humans because we rejected the idea of a perfect world. I believe the same thing would happen in heaven&hell
kille6525 1 year ago
Sam Harris, you hit the nail on the head when you say it's indicative of a psychosis in this country when we as a collective whole fret about abortion and especially gay marriage these days as THE moral crisis of our time, yet totally neglect nuclear proliferation and global warming. And continue in utter denial about the coming resource availability problems. And you are right that this psychosos has been brought about by something called "faith."
EdM021 1 year ago
I take Sam Harris as attempting to be as honest as he can be in speaking of the legacy of faith and it's impact on the social human psyche. He's articulate, which I think is probably his best quality, and is saying what needs to be said. I think that our society desperately needs to have this conversation before it's too late. We are at the edge of planetary destruction and we need to wake up, grow up, and fix our world before it's too late.
therogdude 1 year ago
Education > Religion
MarvelsofaLifetime 1 year ago
Sam Harris is really amazing. I love that guy!
karadan100 1 year ago 5
All because fear!!!
TheBrightconscious 1 year ago
In case you hadn't noticed, the researchers fudged the evidence on global warming. Take the fudge factor out and it really looks like the planet has been cooling.
DeanCo7777 1 year ago
what's the "fudge factor"
sorry, just curious.
rbshow211 1 year ago
Wrong
redsunpro 1 year ago
You obviously listened to fox news, then. You deny global warming exists?
karadan100 1 year ago 2
appear to have the very essence of the charges you've leveled on both Harris and other comments in here. Maybe thouest should'st look in thy mirror befor'st casting stones.
tacgroup2 1 year ago
God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real. God isnt real.
bobojangles6900 2 years ago 4
@bobojangles6900
LMAO
Working yet?
SmalltimR 2 years ago
@SmalltimR
what do u mean..
bobojangles6900 2 years ago
@bobojangles6900 lol
MarvelsofaLifetime 1 year ago
Speaking of ignorance, this poor sap totally fails to recognize the true underpinnings of gay marriage in society.
Classic atheistic foolishness.
SmalltimR 2 years ago
@SmalltimR "Classic atheistic foolishness" thou sayest... all he said was that we have REAL problems in the world to deal with and we're treating the gay marriage issue as if its THE biggest and most urgent issue of the day.
I think your statement could be labeled "Classic religious ignorance and judgement"
PS. Referring to him as a "poor sap" only weakens your statement further
tacgroup2 2 years ago 3
@tacgroup2
Actually he completely buffoons himself on both of this opening arguments. The guy just isn't bright enough to reason on behalf of atheism as he awkwardly uses religion as the epicenter of world problems.
And despite your attempt to swing this into a religious argument(quite poorly), your response does nothing to advance your own understanding of the obvious discrepancies in this video.
Otherwise, you wouldn't need anyone to spell it our for you.
SmalltimR 2 years ago
@SmalltimR hmmm...there seems to be a trend in your posts. They start with a gross misrepresentation about either the argument being made (..."completely buffoons himself"...) or about the person making the statement (..."poor sap") and then flow into another attack on the character and/or argument (..."The guy just isn't bright enough")
You might have a better time making a point if you didnt act like a buffoon yourself. I'm not saying you are a buffoon, I dont know you, but your comments
tacgroup2 1 year ago
@tacgroup2
The guy willingly puts himself out with incoherent thoughts and delusions on middle east conflict and human social behavior.
Now of course, anyone can retaliate with name calling. But who carries the burden of proof here? Is it the guy peddling nonsense or the guy pointing out the nonsense?
I don't care either way, I'm just saying... when I see stupidity at this level, it makes me want to poke fun at those taking part in it.
Whatever the case, the dude isn't very bright.
SmalltimR 1 year ago
Wait, so you don't think that religion takes center stage in causing problems in the Middle East? So extremists want Israel out of the picture so they can get beach front property, right?
MyJimminyCricket 1 year ago 2
Try doing some research and find out.
You might be surprised at what you'll find.
Whatever the case, if you end-up with tangible information, you'll soon find that the fool talking in this video was never worthy of an audience to begin with.
SmalltimR 1 year ago
Sam Harris is actually a very intellectual scholar who has quite a bit great public works of speech along with his books.
ichleibemeinenvr6 1 year ago 2
"You don't get anything worth getting by pretending to know things that you don't know." I have some level of respect for religious believers, but that statement pretty much sums up why I am not among them. Religious dogma allows people to say they know things like why we're here, how the universe began, how it will end and what happens after we die. But in reality, NOBODY knows these things, and I think it can in fact be harmful to pretend that you do.
mrw21 2 years ago 34
I was thinking the same thing about that last quote of his.
AMP3G 2 years ago
@mrw21 The problem is that Harris assumes that because he doesn't know, it is not possible that anyone else does. There are many ways of knowing, some of which cannot be empirically tested. There is a tendency among secularists to dismiss anything that does not fit their worldview.
Believing in an after life does not mean we pretend that death does not happen or that losing loved ones is not painful, it only ADDS the hope of seeing them again. No one can say it is a false hope either.
TruthWatch 1 year ago
@TruthWatch I'm open to the possibility of life after death. I just don't accept the religious superstitions that surround it. Christianity's view of the afterlife leaves almost no room for an open conversation about whether there really is an afterlife and if so, what it might be like (could be entirely different from concious experience). These are conversations worth having, and I think people like Harris are simply arguing in favor of conversation in the face of appeals to revealed truth.
mrw21 1 year ago
@mrw21 What do you consider "superstition"? There is always room for
conversation, but if your prerequisite for dialogue is that Christians abandon their
beliefs to make you feel better that is ludicrous. A good starting place for a conversation is that both sides positions be treated with respect. This is something which seems too hard for some to grasp. Dogmatism, whether religious or secular is not helpful.
TruthWatch 1 year ago
@TruthWatch I mean "superstition" by the dictionary definition. A non-religious example would be a basketball player who insists on bouncing the ball 3 times and then touching his right cheek before shooting every free throw. There would be no way to prove that this behavior increases his free throw % (and there are lots of reasons to believe that it doesn't). This is what religious people do. They think that if they behave a certain way and believe certain things, they will go to heaven.
mrw21 1 year ago
@mrw21 You demonstrate a very shallow understanding of religious thought.
Christian beliefs reflect the way that Christians see the world and concieve of its
intrinsic reality. It is much more than simply behaving in a certain way, but understanding the relationship that exists between God and man.
Its not as if people were trying to "be good" to score enough points to be on Santa's nice list instead of his naughty list.
Do yourself a favor and abandon that childish notion.
TruthWatch 1 year ago
@TruthWatch Despite the goodness of many Christians, Christianity doctrine does indeed have its shallow, childish elements. Doctrines of eternal reward and punishment (heaven and hell) are inescapable core elements of traditonal Christian belief. As a result, many Christians have struggled with fearfulness, and much Christian "piety" has been motivated by superstitious fear or by self-interest. It would be helpful if Christians like yourself denounced such doctrines as childish.
StudAward 1 year ago
@StudAward Sorry SA, but the shallowness and childishness is not in the doctrines but in the people who ignore the promise of eternal joy and focus only on the very real consequences associated with rejecting the grace of God. The good news is that people have a choice and can escape the eternal separation that sin brings. I'l lagree that a morbid focus upon the negeative is indeed childish, but believing in heaven and hell are not.
TruthWatch 1 year ago
@TruthWatch So you are saying Atheists sin and only sin? hypocracy Go fuck your self Creotard.
yuo252 10 months ago
@yuo252 How exactly did I say that? All humans are sinners, not just atheists.
TruthWatch 10 months ago
@TruthWatch Sin doesn't exist it only exists to the stupid. We arnt rejecting we are not Believing in Your fairy tails. Anyting Eternal is a curse. Life is only good Because it ends Meaning everything you do has a meaning and you won't have a chance to live again. Ignorant idiot.
yuo252 9 months ago
@yuo252 Either sin exists or it doesn't. It can't exist only to some people and not others and truly exist.
It is always amusing to called an idiot by someone with no comprehension of the rules of grammar and spelling. Perhaps you should work on that bit first, then we can move on to the more complicated tasks of writing a coherant sentence and making a valid logical argument.
TruthWatch 9 months ago
@TruthWatch "Christian beliefs reflect the way that Christians see the world and conceive of it's intrinsic reality."
I'm pretty sure that's the problem. When you're basing your understanding of reality on fantasy fairy tales and authoritative interpretation of texts that can, and are, interpreted in ways that completely contradict each other, you are not working in the realm of reality at all. At best it's hypothetical conjecture and asserting reality based on such is just plain crazy.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX Just what basis does your view of reality have? Any view of reality must have a ground upon which
meaning can be derived. If you are one of those who say a materialist view of reality is to be preferred, that only science can provide a satisfactory ground for a concept of reality, then answer this: How does science provide a ground for morality and meaning? Science is good at describing how things work. How does it help us know what what we ought to do?
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch Morality is an issue that isn't that simple. Where it comes from, is your brain. Whether or not a scientist can draw a diagram and show you exactly how it works is irrelevant (although there are multitudes of studies that point to morality being a natural function of a social creature that relies on their society to live). Meaning is another thing that is a very individualistic pursuit. My life gets meaning from loving humanity, friends, family, activities, and universal exploration
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX So you are saying that morality and meaning are purely subjective. You don't believe that there are any
acts that are inherently immoral, like rape or genocide. Good to know. I always like to give people like you a wide berth. Cheers.
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch And there you go jumping to extremes and telling people what they believe. I suppose if you can just pigeonhole people it may give you some psychological security blanket and protect what you have to know be be your fantasy beliefs. You're both over complicating and over simplifying morality with almost every statement you make. I would suggest perhaps reading up on some more philosophy and science. Sure looks like you could use it.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX Did I misstate the essence of your argument? If so show me how I did so. Otherwise just own up to your true beliefs and quit whining. It easy to call someone ignorant but not so easy to demonstrate it.
I challenge you to try to do that.
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch There is nothing wrong with ignorance, unless you choose to stay that way. If you genuinely want to explore what morality is really all about with me, OK, write me directly and we can read some books together and discuss them. We'll take turns, you suggest one, then we read it and talk about it for a week or something, then I'll suggest one. Doesn't matter if we ever see eye to eye, it would be a much more useful discussion.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX Does that mean that you cannot show me how I am ignorant? Or was it your own ignorance that you were referring to? Or were you going to try to psychoanalyze me again? Tell you what, lets see if you can handle presenting a coherent argument before we commit to any substantive investment of time and resources.
Show me which comments I have made which indicate ignorance and demonstrate HOW this is the case.
Should be simple enough.
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch Yes, I cannot explain what it means to have real knowledge, explain all of where morality comes from and educate you out of your fantasy beliefs in 500 characters on a youtube chat channel. I can read books with you and discuss it. Obviously you're not actually interested in doing anything except blowing smoke. OK, revel in your fantasy, enjoy your ignorance of reality, continue to believe in nonsense. It's your choice.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX very convenient. I know that 'real knowledge' is a subjective thing, but you could at least try.
After all, the comments which display my overwhelming ignorance fit into the space provided. Surely someone
of such advanced learning as yourself could apply only the logic and facts necessary to refute a single point or two. Just enough to show us that your pronoucements of great knowledge are not a gigantic bluff. This is certainly the impression given by your reluctance on a minor level
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch Um, which part is convenient? Taking my personal time for the next few months to work at expanding both of our education? Doesn't sound very convenient to me. You seem to be the one avoiding doing anything real when it comes to learning a perspective outside your own. I even offered for you to suggest the first book. You obviously don't want to learn anything. OK, if you want to continue with your fantasy and not be bothered by reality, it's your decision. Good luck with that.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX "OK, if you want to continue with your fantasy and not be bothered by reality" Here is a good example of WHY I would rather test your sincerity by seeing how you handle presenting a small point or two before launching into a project like the one you suggest. After all why would you consent to an ongoing dialogue with someone whose point of view you obviously don't have any respect for? It should be a simple exercise for someone of your alleged great intellect. Is it too much to ask?
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch You're right. I don't respect your opinion. I don't respect the way you present yourself, and it would be a waste of my time to try to educate a brainwashed halfwit. Enjoy your fantasy. Know the the human race is outgrowing your nonsense. I'm sorry you're stuck with an 11th century brain. Good luck with that too.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX Good thing I didn't take you up on your offer then. What absolute torture it would be for you to be exposed to my lunatic ravings for weeks on end as we discuss the scientific basis for the intelligent design theory in books like "Signature in the Cell" by Stephen Meyer. Then you could suggest your favorite book the pop-up version of Richard Dawkins "The God Delusion". Sorry your stuck with no braIn at all. Good luck with THAT.
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch News flash buddy, I'm a scientist and there is no scientific basis for intelligent design, zero, zip, nada, none. If you think there is then you are describing yourself very accurately as a raving lunatic. BTW I have read zero atheist books, (never read The God Delusion) I have read the bible and many christian apologist books and it's nonsense. I've tried to understand your point of view. It's the point of view of a child who doesn't want to give up their Santa Claus figure.
AliburX 4 months ago
@AliburX So what is your field of study? Hold any advanced degrees? Actually read "Signature in the Cell"
or just trusting what some website told you? How much credibility do you have? zero, zip, nada, none.
TruthWatch 4 months ago
@TruthWatch Intelligent design is just another form of creationism and it's a joke in the scientific community. I have yet to meet a single real scientist who gives any credence to ID. It's a ridiculously silly proposition and there is nothing scientific about it. You can't test the proposition that magic man in the sky did it.
AliburX 3 months ago
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@AliburX So you have no idea what you are talking about. It is official now.
You really should actually do some reading before you embarrass yourself like this.
TruthWatch 3 months ago
condom is cheaper and less harmful than an abotion. abortion in cases where the baby is defective is perfectly understandable, but a health baby of a few weeks is an issue.
tociph 2 years ago
Abortion deserves the time it is given. Yes there should be more time given to problems based outside of religious claims, but abortion has to do with where life begins. Unless of course your saying it is no problem to take the life of another human being? Is the preservation of life simply a religious ideal, or is it a human right? That is the real abortion debate today, not some sort of out of date argument from a source written in a completely different era.
shadowwalker03 2 years ago
"God"?
What is that?
qaplatlhinganmaH 2 years ago
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jews were not killed in germany for being nice. they were killed for being the same people they are now.
nVei06 2 years ago
harmless coward, you wouldn't say that to my face chicken shit
emperorzong 2 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
evil jews are real, they're everywhere. they believe in what is evil.
nVei06 2 years ago
Christian nihilism emptys the world and especially human existence of meaning, purpose, comprehensible truth, or essential value. Christian nihilism is a false belief, when it leads individuals to discard any hope of meaning in the world and thus to invent some (imaginary) compensatory alternate measure of significance (in some unknown/unknowable future/realm).
qaplatlhinganmaH 2 years ago 41
The world just IS surely, it's wonderful, terrifying, beautiful, ugly, depending on where you are standing at the time. Many people can live moral, honest, courageous lives, trying to be happy without harming others. Religion does NOT teach this, even though some religious people do live like this. My mother was religious and like this - I am a devout atheist and also try to live this way. There is no sense of lack in my life, but a real joy in trying to understand nature for what it is.
thecatsman 2 years ago
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this guy is a stupid jew. he has a very big problem with elected officials believeing in absolute truth, or a creator? well why? 'um ug, because then they believe in magical bears'. 'no stupid jew, a real issue, how in a practical sense is it an issue. um uh, then they won;t worship satan.. 'jew, worshiping satan is bad. nice try evil one. shoot the jew
nVei06 2 years ago
You aren't ignorant at all, are you?
Jayroc3 2 years ago
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the only one gettign a free ride is the liberal. now you should be ridden with bullets and then told to leave. slop you broken body out of the existance. liberal provide nothing, and take everything.
nVei06 2 years ago
Christian: Hey, I found this book that explains how we should live and it makes sense to me so I believe it.
Rational Person: Just like that? No evidence required? No explanation needed, you'll just do anything the god of everything asks of you? That seems stupid to me.
C: Why? I'm smart.
RP: Cause you're saying freedom is worthless, we're free sure, but if we don't follow the recipe for salvation we're doomed, and if we do it doesn't much matter what else we do. Its a recipe for disaster.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
has any proclamed athest run for office and lost?
shedininja001 2 years ago
I think so. I remember a mayor somewhere being the first elected atheist.
AtheistRocketMan 2 years ago
sorry didn't see your question. I think an atheist has run and lost.
AtheistRocketMan 2 years ago
"You don't get anything worth getting by pretending to know things you don't know."
~simply genius.
siciliano29 2 years ago 3
I like that as well.
dannukesem 2 years ago
It's sort of like drunk driving. It's not a problem until someone gets hurt. You might be the kind of person that never drinks too much to drive safely, even though technically over the limit. But if even a very small number of people with "too much" religion do enough damage, it makes it hard not to worry about how many others may be too religious to be allowed in public.
ananiasacts 2 years ago 8
Ananiasacts: "But if even a very small number of people with 'too much' religion do enough damage, it makes it hard not to worry about how many others may be too religious to be allowed in public." -- You cannot demand or have freedom for yourself while denying others their freedoms as well. That's the height of the double-standard/hypocrisy which has divided this country thus far. Freedom for the few, or the one, is tyranny. Freedom for all is THE priciple this country was founded upon.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
Don't be absurd. Your freedom stops where it poses a significant enough risk to others. You wouldn't, for example, be allowed to manufacture explosives in your own home. You wouldn't be allowed to advocate harming others, and Christians have been forced, by our law, to stop publishing hit lists (of doctors willing to perform abortions, etc.) And more recently from protesting at funerals. Your scripture is filled with reprehensible directives. The few good ideas it has do not redeem it.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: If all folks followed the basic tenets of any major religion (i.e. do unto others, love thy neighbor, honor thy parents, don't steal, don't lie, don't commit murder), there would be peace. However, there are those who misinterpret/ignore the basic tenets & commit atrocities in the name of their religion. That's wrong, I agree. However, abolishing all religion isn't the solution, either. For every opportunity to do great good there also exists the opportunity to do great evil.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
The irony is that the only thing getting in the way of their delivering those messages (and only those or similar ones) is the claim that the scripture is true. That mistake completely legitimizes any interpretation that can be effectively marketed. How does admitting it is just mythology impair its ability to preach respect and mutualism? Religion could be our finest science--the deliberate attempt to find those beliefs most socially and personally empowering. As it is, it's self-defeating.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: This entire debate is unwinable. You're not going to convert me to your beliefs & I never had any intention of trying to convert you to my beliefs. All I'm saying is that we can, however, agree to disagree & leave each other alone. Why is it that atheists have to crusade against the complete destruction of religion? You can't scientifically prove or disprove the existence of God. You're no better than the Popes of the Middle Ages who ordered millions to their deaths in the Crusades.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
"You're no better than the Popes of the Middle Ages who ordered millions to their deaths in the Crusades."
But I'm not advocating harming them in any way. Why should anything be sacred? Least of all an idea. I'm afraid you can't simply declare something off limits to ridicule. If it looks like a fraud, acts like a fraud, and has left a long trail of victims then decent people are likely to abhor it. Holding people responsible for their behavior is social infrastructure--a just & good thing.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: My whole point is this, I disagree w/atheism, but I have dealt w/you all with respect & courtesy in spite of my disagreements. You may wish for all religion to be abolished & I may wish for all atheists to find religion, but it just isn't going to happen. Therefore, instead of making things miserable for each other, why can't we just agree to disagree, treat each other with respect for the things we do have in common & move on? That's the decent, courteous & responsible thing to do.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
But your point is based on a false premise--that the claims are equivalent when nothing could be further from the truth. You are claiming both that there is a creator, and that you know what it wants from us. This is a fantastic claim and demands an extraordinary proof, yet your evidence could hardly be more feeble. My position is only that everything we do know--a fair bit--strongly suggests we got here by purely mechanical means. There's nothing even remotely mysterious about any part of it.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
Yet your claims are likewise based upon a false premise. The proof of the existence of any creator is not possible at this time & it is highly doubtful it ever will be possible to prove by science. You can deny all you want, but there is no proof to back your claims. Likewise, there's no proof to back mine. It's a philosophy of faith we're talking about. You have faith (i.e. belief) that there is no God. I have faith there is. Neither of us can be proven right or wrong. So why cause strife?
tchapman1977 2 years ago
You can assert both claims are equivalent all you wish, but that only suggests that either you are genuinely incapable of seeing how fantastically different they are, or you are being disingenuous. So take your pick, but your position limits you to being either a fool or a fraud. And I see no compelling reason to pretend otherwise in dealing with you.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: Then you need to explain to me how they aren't equal. All I can see is atheists & believers are making fantasic claims for & against the existence of any deity without any irrefutable evidence to support their claims. Both views are diametrically opposed, but neither has any irrefutable proof to back their claims. I am neither a fool nor a fraud. However, I'm trying to find common ground to foster peaceful co-existence between us rather than blind hatred, animosity & derision.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
The claim that scripture is true is a more fantastic assertion because it so violently contradicts everything we can see around us. The earth is a great deal older than any interpretation the bible allows. You cannot live inside a fish for three days. You can not put two of each creature on any boat, even today, for weeks and expect to regenerate the biosphere when you return to shore. Asking anyone to believe this is no different than calling them an imbecile. I'm just more to the point.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: The scripture is divinely inspired, yes, but it was transcribed by fallible man. The key points in the Bible are true & correct, but a great portion of the Bible is written in allegory & parable which is subject to individual interpretation. The Bible isn't the reveal-all source to religion, but rather a guidepost & a way to bring you closer to God so that He may reveal his divine presence to you from within. God works within folks each & every day. It's not foolishness.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
You're as full of shit as your scripture. Claim all the bullshit you like. Your filthy industry absolutely depends on raping the minds of children and you're going to find that more an more difficult as the net brings the perspective of science to younger and younger audiences. Like your misrepresentation of my perspective on religion here (I have never advocated anything except teaching it.) I have also never deleted a post in my entire life. Anywhere. So lie all you like. It suits you.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: "You're as full of shit as your scripture." Same thing can be said for you, buddy boy. I never insulted you at all in any of my posts but now you've proceeded to bring profanity into the conversation. So, since you've proven that you are unwilling to hold a civilized dialogue, I bid my adieu to you & hope that you find some comfort in this life because unless you own up to the truth, your afterlife will be full of pain, suffering & misery all thanks to your arrogance. Good day!
tchapman1977 2 years ago
You are an insult to humanity in general. You support a dictator. You;re just a cowardly worm. I think it's great that our ancestors invented a way to get imbeciles to waste their lives exploring a fantasy kingdom in their own minds. It's a shame you scumbags have to rape children, persecute gays, attack education, women's right's, medical technologies, etc. But that's what ignorant scum does--stupid dysfunctional stuff like that. Keep up your advertisement for cowardice. It suits you.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
ananiasacts: nevertheless, Jesus loves you. Keep spouting your nonsense. It only reveals you as the heartless deceiver you are. I pity you & wish peace upon your tortured soul. You might wish to rein in your venom a tad, however, because if you ever spout off this way to the wrong person face-to-face, they could cause you considerable harm. But, if you wish to be an evil, arrogant, ignorant & abusive troll who abuses others in this manner, then you deserve the punishment you will receive.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
as anania said,its great that our ancestors invested a way to keep feeble minds sch as yours entrapped in a fantasy world...unforuntately it backfired because its causing too much an interference wit humanity.
TLSlayer 2 years ago
you didnt have to insult us,your mentality is offensive enough to be an insult to all of mankind,same goes with the rest of your kind.
TLSlayer 2 years ago
ok,so you admit that man is imperfect yet you,without second thought,just jump on the bandwagon when they tell you heaven exists and you are only eligible if you accept the path of christ?
TLSlayer 2 years ago
TLSlayer: Life does go on beyond corporal death. The human soul is comprised of energy & even science confirms this. Those neural impulses are electricity which is energy. Einstein states that energy is constant. Therefore, an afterlife (whether Heaven, Hell or whatever) does exist. I never said one has to be a Christian. The point is, regardless of what you believe, don't attack one another over it. Live & let live. But atheists antagonize believers so don't wonder why you're treated in kind.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
can you provide a trusted source of this information tchap?
yeah,youre telling me to live and let live all the while people kill eachother over belief and disbelief.
WRONG,religion has always been shoved in everyones faces.how can you say atheists antagonize believers?
lets see here,they call us devil worshippers,sinners,blasphemers and try threatening us with hell.
TLSlayer 2 years ago
Our energy is constant, we rot in the ground and are turned into worm food and nutrients for other life to spring. The constant of energy is not simple proof of an afterlife.
AMP3G 2 years ago
ananiasacts: "But I'm not advocating harming them in any way." Actually, by forcing people to turn away from their religion, you are. Religion gives folks peace -- a purpose in life. To deny them that, is to cause them undue stress & harm. Atheism looks & acts like a fraud all the time, but I'm not preventing you from holding true to your beliefs. However, you have advocated doing just that to all believers. You can't have your cake & eat it, too. Live & let live is the best & only policy.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
Since I can't know what happens when I die, as concerned as I am, I must live for the here and now and what makes sense.
I want loving people around me. People who love me, yet may bdisagree with me. It is OK to disagree on some points...but let's find that common ground...neither of us has to "win" we just need to move forward...let's not kill one another...let's love one another...I honestly extend my hand...please, take it!!
youknowwhatimean1 2 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
You are a boob.
Life must be sad for you when people you love pass away with no hope of seeing them again.
Or do you love?
cmcguiga 2 years ago
Here's a theist's projection of his own fear. I often hear "life must be sad" from theists, but it's quite the opposite. Life is extremely valuable, since we only have it once. When loved ones die, it's always sad. But don't you see you're admitting that you base your belief in god in your fear of death, and not in anything substantial? Missing my dead grandmother is what it is. I won't lie to myself to sweeten the blow. We move on with the fond memories, and then we die ourselves.
infideluxe 2 years ago 10
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I was an atheist for fifteen years after the age of nineteen. I've heard enough of the moral inversion and confusion of atheists to persuade me that atheism is by no means the answer to much of anything. He ridicules people for believing in God? What about global warmism? Atheists can believe in all kinds of hokum--some of it much dumber than belief in God.
DerWille1200 2 years ago
Atheists believe there is no god. What is the "moral inversion and confusion" you're talking about?
Where did "Global Warmism" come from? Do you realize your post is a bunch of non-sequiturs stuck together in support of . . . nothing?
infideluxe 2 years ago 5
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Atheism does not lead significantly to a better society than theism does. One can believe that there is no God and be morally confused. They are mutually consistent.
I brought up global warmism because Sam Harris himself mentions it as a major problem in this very video. Global warmism is a surrogate religion--one in which Sam Harris believes. In ten years, this catastrophism will have been replaced by a new one. Why doesn't he show some healthy skepticism toward it?
DerWille1200 2 years ago
You'll need to substantiate your claim. There is a correlation between atheistic countries and lower crime rates, lower poverty, better health, and lower unemployment.
Regardless, what does lead to a better society is clear, rational thinking. America is full of god-fearing nut-jobs with guns. Our last president believed that he took orders straight from God to wage war.
"In ten years, this catastrophism will have been replaced by a new one."
Wonderful way to avoid responsibility.
infideluxe 2 years ago 3
I beg your pardon, but there isn't anything like an "atheistic" country on the face of the earth. Every country has some form of religion or another & some with more than one. Even at the height of communism in the USSR, there were still folks practicing eastern orthodoxy & judaism in some form or another whether overtly or clandestinely. Even the native americans have their spirit-guides. So, your example has no merit as such a place doesn't exist & your "evidence" is worthless & incorrect.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
"highest proportion of atheists/agnostics/nonbelievers," from
Zuckerman, Phil. "Atheism: Contemporary Rates and Patterns", chapter in The Cambridge Companion to Atheism (2005).
Sweden81%
Denmark 43 - 80%
Norway31 - 72%
Japan 64 - 65%
Czech Republic 54 - 61%
infideluxe 2 years ago
Sweden (81% Atheist) does seem "anything like" an Atheist country..."
In fact it seems very much like an Atheist country.
Of course, if you're speaking in absolutes, then there isn't anything like a Theist country on the face of the earth.
After all there most likely is at least one Atheist in a highly religious country such as a Theocracy like Iran.
What percentage of Atheists would be required to define a country as an Atheist country? 75%, 85%, 99%, 99.9999%?
maryellen728 2 years ago
Me thinks thou doth protest too much.
maryellen728 2 years ago
I could say the same for you. Faith is belief in that which can't be proven by fact. You have faith there is no God. I have faith there is. Yet, neither of us can prove w/ scientific fact that either of us is correct or not. That's faith. The "young-Earth" believers misrepresent fact & that is wrong. The Earth is billions of years old. However, when God created the Earth in 6 days, who's to say a day to God isn't 500,000,000 yrs or that evolution wasn't His method to create life as we know it?
tchapman1977 2 years ago
who's to say a day to God isn't 500,000,000 yrs or that evolution wasn't His method to create life as we know it?" ? Yes, who but the high priests of all organised religions.
thecatsman 2 years ago
thecatsman: my point is that God is infinite & limitless & we can't force Him to conform to our finite & limited perspectives. God works in His own time & method & He has profound love for us, His children. Like all parents, He lets us make our own choices but we, as His children, have to accept the consequences of our actions when we mess up. Humanity is fallible & makes mistakes, so you have to open yourself to allow God to work w/in you to show you the way. The Bible is the guidpost to Him.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
Atheists accuse those with any type of religious faith of being close-minded, stupid and any other negative connotation you can think of. You desire tolerance & acceptance yet you emphatically deny believers that same tolerance & acceptance. Who's being close-minded now? Believe what you want. I don't care, but don't tear me down for my beliefs & then demand I accept & tolerate yours with open arms. Atheism is just another "misguided" religion - the faith of no-faith - & you can't deny that.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
@ tchapman Most atheists are "agnostic atheists", in that they do not believe there is a god, but do not claim absolute knowledge of it. There is a difference between disbelief and absolute certainty that you don't seem to comprehend. The close-mindedness is often reserved for people who claim absolute knowledge that a certain god exists, and in exclusive monotheistic religions, that it is the only true God. Scientific reasoning is not supposed to be hurtful, but enlightening.
Zonkin 2 years ago
@ Zonkin: The hypocrisy that irritates me the most regarding atheism, however, is that atheists vehemently demand their right to have their own beliefs (i.e. no God), yet, if I wish to go to a secluded corner of any public space on my own time & observe my beliefs, then I'm all of a sudden a misguided fool & am shunned. You want to openly profess/practice your beliefs? Fine, go ahead & do so until you turn blue in the face. But don't shun or deny me the freedom of doing the very same thing.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
@tchapman Again, you do not see the distinction between belief and unbelief. They are opposites, and not the same. If I am a non-believer, I will shun all "believers", disregarding what you believe. In a democratic society, you should have the right to say anything, at the same time it is my right to deny outlandish claims, that do not relate to the real world.
Zonkin 2 years ago
Zonkin: I don't agree with the Islamic faith. However, does that mean I hurl insults at them & degrade them at every opportunity? No. I simply agree to disagree & leave them be because they are free to believe what they want. Why can't you do the same w/believers? Seems simple enough. I respect your right to choose your own beliefs for yourself whether I agree/disagree with them. Why must you attempt to deny me that very same courtesy & right?
tchapman1977 2 years ago
tchapman: that's because you're religous and they're religious, we're non-religious. I don't see how this can be explained any franker. It's like you are coming from the right wing of politics, thinking we're on the left side, we're not, we're religious anarchists. The religious system isn't working. We don't care which side you are on.
It has nothing to do with any specific faith, christianity just seems to be the biggest target, as it is prominent in western, educated societies.
Zonkin 2 years ago
Zonkin: You're totally missing my point. Regardless whether one believes in God, Allah, Buddha or NOTHING AT ALL, there's NO POINT in verbally bashing folks for their beliefs, especially when one has no scientific fact to back up their position. You have dealt with me in a respectful manner, but you're in the minority amongst your atheist brethren. My whole point is why do atheists in general have to respond with hate, insults & rudeness when we can simply just agree to disagree & move forward?
tchapman1977 2 years ago
tchapman: If you have been verbally abused I see your point exactly. There shouldn't be any excuse for it. Though if you have spent your time on youtube, there are asstrolls here to last a lifetime. The reason many cannot agree to disagree, is that religion is causing damage from our point of view, not always major, not always directly, but damage all the same. It fights progress, openness, the understanding of other cultures and it promotes biggotry. The moderate make the extreme possible.
Zonkin 2 years ago
Zonkin: Being Christian, I can only base my views on that set of beliefs. With same-sex marriage, if you view that as progress, then we have fought that progress. I personally don't care either way if it passes or fails, but that's my own opinion. With abortion & embryonic stem cell research, if you have to destroy life for progress, then the ends aren't really worth the means to me. However, religious groups also do great good for society (i.e. The Salvation Army, Habitat for Humanity, etc.)
tchapman1977 2 years ago
"I can only base my views on that set of beliefs"
Only? Really? Why? You can't ever think for yourself? Never consider any other beliefs?
No matter how much evidence contradicts your beliefs you can never think about it?
What would happen if you based your beliefs on reality? Is it fear or guilt? Is there some paranoid delusion stopping you from thinking for yourself?
You want to be respected for not thinking? For mind control? You deserve ridicule not respect for willful ignorance.
maryellen728 2 years ago
maryellen728: You talk of contradictory evidence but there is none. There's no scientific proof of the non-existence of God. ust like there's no scientific proof of the My beliefs are reality so there's no fear or guilt involved. Rather, it seems atheists fear God's existence & rightly so. For in denying God, they earn his wrath & enmity & are cast out of Heaven into the lake of fire to burn & suffer for eternity.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
"that set of beliefs"
That set of beliefs changes over time but you don't seem to know it. Which parts of the Bible do you reject/accept?
Stoning women who aren't virgins at marriage? Killing disobeient children? Killing non-believers?
For once tell the truth. You pick & choose the Biblical beliefs you like & reject the others because you don't like them. No FAITH in them? You USE the name of god to support YOUR beliefs. Do you believe the Bible is the word of god, all of it, or not?
maryellen728 2 years ago
maryellen728: The Bible is divinely-inspired, but it is written by fallible man & it is largely written in allegory & parable form so there are many different possible interpretations. However, the basic tenets are a guidepost to lead one to God so that God can reveal Himself to us from within, not from without.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
ok,if the bible is of such DIVINE scripture then why is it modified over and over by man?
why are these holy figured excempt from hellfire?after all,theyre fucking with GOD's WORD
TLSlayer 2 years ago
Zonkin: (continued from previous post) there's also God's Pantry, Christ's Closet & a whole host of other beneficial programs administered by religious groups that benefit all of society, not just believers. You don't have to believe to benefit from those programs. The extremists (of which every religion has) give religion a bad reputation. I'm not proud of the moronic zealots from the Westboro Baptist Church. They are derided by the rest of Christianity for using God's name to do harm.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
And Hamas does a lot of good social work too, does this mean we should ignore the suicide bombers? Christianity has a long history and for 9/10s of that history is has been killing people. Just because it can't get away with that strategy any longer and has adopted more modern forms of propaganda to market itself does not redeem any part of it. It is still far more socially dysfunctional than useful and will always be because it is ultimately just fiction; yesterdays conjecture on our origin.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
"moronic zealots"
The Bible supports their beliefs. Are you denying your own religious text, the Bible? Or don't you READ the Bible?
You want respect for your beliefs but call those who know the Bible better than you do "moronic zealots" & "extremists!"
The Salvation Army DOES discriminate against non-believers. Only Christians can get into some of their programs. Attending their church is required, period.
Bias, bigotry & arrogance is inherent in religion. Your faithful, they're not.
maryellen728 2 years ago
maryellen728: Again, the Bible, while divinely-inspired is written by fallible man & is written in allegory & parable. Many possible outcomes & conclusions can be drawn from most of the Bible. Extremists twist & contort the word of the Bible to fit their own self-serving designs. As for the Salvation Army, none who are in need are turned away. You may have to sit through a short sermon or prayer group, but you aren't required to convert to receive assistance. The only arrogance lies w/atheists.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
But why? If I told you I think math would be a lot easier to teach if we just rounded off all those pesky irrationals (Pi is close enough to 3 anyways) you'd know I didn't know what I was talking about at the very least. You would not be concerned with whether you should "respect" my opinion on that matter. Religion is making scientific claims in the most disreputable way possible and then trying to leverage the microscopic possibility it could be true into a 50/50 chance. It's willful deceit.
ananiasacts 2 years ago
tchapman1977
Faith & belief are NOT the same thing. Faith is belief without evidence. Superstition is belief without evidence.
I don't have "faith" in science because it doesn't require faith. Science is based on evidence. It's natural not supernatural.
The laws of physics & nature, & common sense for that matter, must be suspended for all religious faith to be true.
The evidence contradicts your beliefs because they aren't based in reality.
If reality offends you, don't blame me.
maryellen728 2 years ago
maryellen728: Faith is belief w/o proof, plain & simple. Misconstrue words all you like to fit your twisted views, but reality is what it is. Science has yet to prove or disprove the existence of God, therefore atheism is based on FAITH. There is no proof to make atheism truth. Science needs not be separated from God. God created all that we see in the world therefore, the scientific principles that govern it are also created by God. You can deny Him all you want, but it makes you no more right.
tchapman1977 2 years ago
So with that logic you must believe in Santa Clause, the easter bunny, leprechauns and also hindu half man/half elephant Gods. One things for sure, science has disproved the bible, so if you still think theres a heaven and hell i dont know what to say.....
tubester4567 2 years ago
the problem there,tube,is that they have no respect for the STUDY of nature and the universe so there is no disproving to them of the bible.
TLSlayer 2 years ago
In that case science has yet to disproof zeus, thor, odin, flying spaghetti monster, you are atheist of all of those gods, so do you actually need faith to NOT believe in them? how funny
Ryosuke1208 2 years ago