Actually there is at least one verse that talks about God choosing people "for salvation" or "to be saved" 2 Thessalonians 2:13 "God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth"
It's amazing to see that this man does not actual Scriptural Exegesis. Steve's church doesn't even have a doctrine of the Trinity, he doesn't even believe in the universal church so therefore he must think that there is no salvation outside of his ranting hall. He doesn't believe in the bible either NO SOLA, Scriptura, Fide, Gratia, Christos, Soli Deo gloria ! He believes that man has the capacity to choose God by an act of his will. IT'S A MATTER OF THE HEART STEVE NOT THE WILL!!!!!
Try reading the London Baptist confession and the writings of Charels Spurgeon sounds like new baptist have left the old faith not the other way around so actually Arminism has creeped into baptist churches.
Urgh! Typical Arminians... teaching doctrines of men, not Christ!
Mr. Anderson probably has a shrine in his house somewhere, with pictures of Jacobus Arminius and Erasmus of Rotterdam, that he worships and prays to five times a day. These people disgust me!
I'm sorry dude, but you just don't get it. You don't need to demonize people who believe differently than you. Don't you even know that Calvinists were the founders of the modern missions movement?
Wait a minute, the Baptist notion that one cannot lose one's salvation is pure calvinism. The Baptist faith historically is a modified form of Calvinism. This guy is a mess.
As a staunch Five Point Calvinist, I actually find this amusing. The Arminians are so afraid that their false doctrine will finally be brought down that they are trying to incite a witch hunt.
@sonofgilnockie Calvinism is Heresy, Anderson and myself are not Arminians we believe in eternal security, that's not Arminian doctrine so you show yourself a fool. "(God) who will have ALL MEN TO BE SAVED." 1Tim 2:4. "..we trust in the living God who is the savior of ALL MEN." 1Tim 4:10. "He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD." 1John 2:2. God is not willing that any should perish but that ALL should come to repentance." 2Pet. 3:9
@sanderson....would you debate James White on this? Just curious, not trying to start fire, but it is always easier to shoot fire at another theological position when the other position is not there to defend itself and shoot fire at your position. So, would you be willing to debate him? He is in AZ with you.
Anderson is not man enough to debate men like James White. Would you really want to watch Anderson attempt this? It would be like Einstein entering a 5th grade science project competition.
@HeresyHunter1711 lol. It would be a bit of a disaster for Anderson. But I just thought it would be a challenge to actually seek what the other side has to say, accurately, and accurately representing it to people because we must remember that teachers of God's law are judged more harshly so we need to be seeking truth in our own theology and in accurately representing other people's theology so that we can accurately refute or accurately submit it. All in the pursuit of truth, whom Jesus is.
@Keruaran You are a danger to anyone who is seeking to know and understand the gospel 1) You would lead them astray with damnable heresies and with the wicked error and false doctrine/ teaching that you hold to.You are very stubborn.You need to read Galatians chapter 1 KJV You have been warned by many people,i am not the only one telling you.
"And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" Revelation 5:9
Your comment is hilarious on two levels: Firstly its hilarious coming from someone as completely ignorant of Reformed Theology as you are. Secondly its hilarious because the verse does not teach a semipelagian unlimited atonement, it teaches that Jesus redeemed a people from every tribe, tongue, people and nation - this is particular redemption.
@Keruaran I expected you to give these comments.You should read the gospel according to Mark chapter 1 KJV because It states what Jesus preached with authority.
As usual, you have nothing to offer in response. You are incapable of actually engaging with the issues or presenting any reasonable exegesis of scripture relevant to the issues.
Reformed Theology affirms these verses of scripture along with scripture as a whole, you are simply ignorant. You dare to say "His cross is sufficient" but you deny and nullify the efficacy of Christ's finished work on the cross. Yours is a worthless gospel in which God does not powerfully save men by decree of the Father, the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit and the atonement of Christ upon the cross - No, your gospel makes God powerless and subject to the will of man.
Reformed Theology teaches that God actually, and powerfully saves men and that this is all of Grace, all of God, from first to last. Your gospel teaches that God has done all He can and only hopes men will come of their own free will, a 'gospel' in which sinful man by his own will is made the author of his own salvation.
Why am I not surprised at all that when confronted with statements that you cannot deal with, you simply go running back to your corner spouting your usual one line attacks which, as usual, do not address any issue and show that you are incapable of dealing with the issues.
If you are a believer with a reasonably sound knowledge of scripture, who knows how to rightly divide the scriptures, and solid scriptural theology to stand on, why can't you deal with these issues?
@Keruaran You know why i reject the strange reform theology.You know very well why those who love and follow Jesus reject calvinistic doctrine If you don't believe John 3:16.17.18 and 2 peter 3:9 KJV then you are teaching damnable heresy....
There's nothing "strange" about Reformed Theology. And I absolutely believe all of scripture, including John 3:16.17.18 and 2 peter 3:9. You don't like the fact that I allow scripture to speak for itself in its own context and divide the word of God correctly by applying proper exegesis to these texts. You do no such thing, you apply emotion and tradition while ignoring every other text of scripture that does not agree with your sub-biblical gospel.
How do you deal with Jon 6:44 in which Jesus says, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day". And how do you deal with John 17:9 in which Jesus prays only for believers, differentiating them from "the world" saying, "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.".
You simply ignore it because you cannot deal with scripture on its own terms.
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
You said:
"How do you deal with Jon 6:44 in which Jesus says, No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day"
I deal with John 12:32 by reading properly in its context, within the passage it is from and not in isolation, totally divorced from that context and the circumstances we see in this passage of scripture. Recognizing the context of the passage (If we read from verse 20 we can see that the Greeks were coming in search of Jesus, and Jesus is speaking about his death), we allow the phrase to have its natural meaning: all kinds of men, Jew and Gentile.
Furthermore, considering how much Jesus actually says that is specific about who are His in John's gospel, how can you take John 12:32 in a universalist sense as being "ALL" men who ever lived and then turn to John 10:26-29, and exegete that consistently? If "ALL" means everyone who ever lived, does that include those of whom Jesus said, "But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep"?
Back to your old ways again I see. Nothing to offer but baseless slanderous attacks. This is exactly the type of behavior that got you blocked on another channel. Actually dealing with the issues and with scripture consistently is just something you don't do.
How am I twisting the scriptures? It is not good enough for you to continue making empty accusations when you cannot back those accusations up with facts. If you can not provide any reasonable exegesis of scripture to demonstrate error on my part then you have no business making slanderous remarks.
This scripture that you like twisting is the one that Christ gave to men to bring light into theirs hearts so that they would believe him so that they would believe in him ,that they would not perish but have everlasting life It is very clear.
So, not only do you refuse to answer any questions that are actually relevant to the issues and the text of scripture, you insist on asking irrelevant questions that are completely off topic.
I've never been to a Bible college (though I would like to start a course at the local Reformed Theological College at some stage) and I'm not a woman so you can forget about 1 Timothy 2:12.
You said "Salvation is given to all". If salvation is "given to all", why aren't "all" saved? Trolling me on some other channel with your usual poor comments isn't going to deal with the question.
Does that include those whom Jesus explicitly said are not His sheep? Does that include people who end up in hell? Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the propitiation for the sins of people who are in hell?
If "all" always means universally "all", does "all" apply to those Jesus explicitly said were not His sheep?
"ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." John 10:26-29
@tgillspy1 Yes my friend i have read john in its entirety and love the gospel of john.Jesus does teach many elective truths such as "unless the father draws you to me, you cannot come to me" and many other teachings. at the end of the day i dont agree with everything calvin taught but election does hit at our human pride. the other issue i really have iis with this preacher, i have seen his other sermons and looks to be a very angry man with pride issues
@tgillspy1 we need to remember not to take scriptures out of their context , and both calvinists and arminians have done that. But we need to read scripture as a whole, and we do see Gods purposes through the canon of scripture. God chose israel among all nations, (we see his elective work there) that through israel people from all nations would come to him. The other fact is you cannot deny that ephesians clearly speaks of election as does romans 9 to11.
Mr anderson, your beef isnt really with calvinists, but with God because as with all arminians they dont like the fact that the scriptures are clear about Gods sovereignty over all things, even peoples salvation!! ive noticed the type of people that hate calvinism/predestination are the ones that love to work hard for the gospel, its all up to you is there belief. there is a hidden pride lurking within them. how do i know? i used to be the exact same myself. God be praised for his mercy.
@ronathanedwards "Where EVER does ANYBODY know who is saved or not? WHERE? You have totally embarrassed yourself with that statement. It is beyond absurdity." "These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life." How can you yourself know that you are saved, unless you believe so you have already been born of God according to you? Even though the demons believe, and they are not born of God..
@clearedtoengage It might really help you to understand the Bible if you know grammar and follow pronouns. YOU may know about whose salvation? Someone else's? .. NO. YOU. Embarrassing? I think what is embarrassing is not knowing grammar and following it's intentions. You can't even tell me that an embryo has to be fertilized first because it would destroy your infantile understands..pure pride. God fights the proud my friend, but gives grace tot he humble. Humble yourself to God and his grammar
"And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect (Rom. 12:2)." Now, why would Paul tell them to not be conformed to the world if it was impossible for them to be conformed to the world because they were already predestined to salvation? Same with be transformed- they had already BEEN transformed. Why is it still commanded?
@clearedtoengage UMMM first of all a command is given to all, it is the INSTRUMENT by which God gives us to know what we are to do. Secondly, Paul doesn't know who is born again or not, there is no halo hanging over the elect. 1 Jn 2:19 Thirdly, the command is for our sanctification. If commands weren't given, then we wouldn't grow in it! Even those who are born again still fight sin (or are you perfect?).
@ronathanedwards The instrument or the power? You lie against the Spirit. Romans 1:16 explicitly states that the GOSPEL IS THE POWER OF GOD TO SALVATION. The Holy Spirit has revealed God's will through the Word. All men can be saved. Titus 2:11-12.
@clearedtoengage You know, Satan is an accuser, funny how you accuse me of lying. I didn't say it's an instrument and NOT the power of God. You are making a false assumption and thinking it can be either/or were the Bible says it is His instrument ALSO it is the Power of God....
Answer me this one EASY question and I will prove to you by your answer it is an instrument. How does God communicate His Gospel?
@clearedtoengage So, Jesus communicates to everyone? I thought we were talking about His WORD, the Bible? Isn't Jesus WHAT is communicated BY the Word? Would you agree with that?
@ronathanedwards God spoke to us THROUGH His Son, and John 1:1 says Jesus is the Word of God. I will draw all men unto myself, He said. How is He to do that if His Word, His message, His gospel, the Bible is not powerful to save anyone who thirsts?
@ronathanedwards Jesus DOES communicate to everyone, or He could not have meant what He said in John 12:32. Not all hear and list to the call, though.
@ronathanedwards Yes, we hear by the Word of God. It's not something that comes over us, because many heard the word of God but refused to heed it- see Pharisees, Sadducees, Judaizers.. etc.
@ronathanedwards It means that without the message of the gospel, the Bible, hearing and understanding God's will is impossible. The only way to hear, to understand God's will is to read it.
@ronathanedwards Here is where it gets into vain discussion 1 Tim. 1:6. We understand what this phrase means in context, so there is no reason to ask what "by" means? By means what causes the action. It is a preposition. It shows place, time, relationship between words, etc.
@clearedtoengage No,it isn't vain, there is a very good reason why. Why is it so difficult for you to answer my questions? How is asking for a definition of a word so difficult? You can just look it up on the internet! It took you two weeks to answer my grammar question and now how long before it takes to answer a vocabulary question? Both should have taken 5 seconds! I'm trying to show you something... are you afraid of the word "by" for some reason?
@ronathanedwards I just defined it for you.. what causes the action. What is the action? Hearing. So hearing is caused by the Word of God. -shrug- That's what I believe.
@clearedtoengage So the dictionary says By is : A MEANS of conveyance. .... Do you agree with that? God's Word is the MEANS - conveying His message to be heard. You'll agree with that, right?
@clearedtoengage Yes, although "by" is just a preposition and is very confined on what it can mean. I agree. NOW, What is the definition of an "instrument"?
Instrument: NOUN - a MEANS by which something is effected or done.
"BY the Word of God" The word "BY" is a word that introduces a "INSTRUMENTAL" clause.
Therefore: BY indicates that the "WORD" is the INSTRUMENT God uses to CONVEY His message. Hence, I was correct by properly stating earlier, that the Word of God is an instrument. BECAUSE it is the SUBJECT of the instrumental clause.
@ronathanedwards Yes, however, you were limiting it to an instrument which can only save the elect. There is the vital difference under consideration.
@clearedtoengage QUOTE: ME-"first of all a command is given to all, it is the INSTRUMENT by which God gives us to know what we are to do"
YOU: "The instrument or the power? You lie against the Spirit".
By your statement you told me I was lying in saying that it was an instrument. You were wrong. It has nothing to due with the argument, but you accused me of being wrong and I lier. But in fact you were incorrect. I wasn't limiting either, I said the command was "for all". go back and read it.
Romans 1:16 God's power for salvation for "who? Every single person? OR everyone WHO BELIEVES? It's a substantival. It is power for salvation for THOSE who believe, not for everyone (period). You are implying any other understanding. Read what it says, not what you want it to say.
@ronathanedwards -shrug- You still say that the gospel isn't powerful to save anyone who believes, only the elect who believe. I stand by my statement.
Yes, every single person who believes. I am not saying all men are saved. However, who can believe? Whosoever will may come. John 3:16. You say that we cannot believe unless we are already born of God. If that is the case, John 1:12 is simply a lie and ANOTHER infinite loop. Were they sons of God before belief or after belief?
@clearedtoengage I really wish you could read the words of the Bible and know what they say instead of glossing over them and imposing a presupposition on them. You didn't even read what I said. The gospel is the God's power for... what does it say? EVERYONE? ... NO... Everyone who believes ... or the Greek says EVERY BELIEVING ONE. Therefore it IS powerful... to the believing ones... every one of them. Same exact phrase in John 3. EVERY BELIEVING ONE. It doesn't say every single individual.
@ronathanedwards John 1:12 is not sequential? Those who BELIEVE in Him, He GAVE the right to become children of God, not they were ALREADY born of God. Your interpretation of 1 John 5:1 is wrong and causes disunity of the Bible. John 5:21- who does the Son raise? "he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life," V 24.. Whom does the Father give? The church, Eph. 5:25-27. Who is drawn? John 12:32 all.
I explained John1:12 to you. It is NOT sequential. They are aorist verbs. It is describing facts, not WHEN they occur. The verb tenses don't allow it. Secondly 1 John 5:1 DOES tell you. The perfect tense is the CAUSE, you haven't addressed that yet. I'm still waiting for you to show how an embryo growing is the CAUSE of it's fertilization! LOL
@ronathanedwards Not describing when the facts occur? Please. "to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name" Those are FACTS. To those who believe in His name, He gave the RIGHT to become children of God, not to those who believe in His name, He already made sons of God. Otherwise, God could have written "to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who are dead", because it's not SEQUENTIAL. -.-
@clearedtoengage Please, what ever you do, don't even attempt to go into verb tenses. You are totally ignorant when it comes to understanding Greek verb usage and understanding. The day you can tell me the aspect of a punctiliar aorist as it relates to present tense participle to another aorist with another aorist is the day we can have this conversation. Believed is AGAIN in the PRESENT tense, "who were born' in 13 is in the AORIST tense. There is NO sequence only connection,not HOW they are.
@ronathanedwards Gal. 3:26 You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. Wait, what? Paul must have been deceived when he wrote this, he should know we can't believe until we are sons of God...
You are totally ignorant when it comes to understanding the Bible. You are worse than a Pharisee, seeking to be justified by your intense studies in Greek, when God is NOT a God of confusion, and the gospel went to every nation, stop trying to confuse yourself and just READ the BIBLE!
@clearedtoengage Confusing? Sorry, knowing Greek makes things more clear not less. You can't even get theological terms based on English correct, let alone grammar. Sons of God is a TITLE referring to adoption NOT regeneration. You become a son by the effect of being regenerated but they are not the same. You confuse so many terms. You should not just read the Bible, but start studying it. We believe when we are regenerated- 1 John 5:1.
@ronathanedwards Sorry, knowing Greek makes things more clear, but you twist it in every imaginable fashion. If you are BORN OF GOD you are a SON OF GOD. Let's think logically now. You become a son by being regenerated and when are you a son of God? THROUGH faith in Christ Jesus.
@clearedtoengage You are believing BECAUSE you HAVE BEEN BORN of God. Still haven't gotten that yet? The perfect tense is defined as the CAUSE of a Present effect ! You have to deal with the CAUSE. You run away from that point!
@ronathanedwards And what does born of God mean? Interpret Scripture with Scripture. You completely ignore verses that contradict your erroneous theology (which again is wrong because of 1 Cor. 1- it is named for man).
@clearedtoengage Born of God literally means "fathered" or "generated" "fertilized". I don't ignore anything. You are ignoring that the "fathering" is the CAUSE of the believing. You can not get around it. The perfect tense is use for the purpose of showing that the verb in the perfect tense it the CAUSE. The present tense when used with a perfect tense is the EFFECT. Look it up in any grammar book my friend. Read it, and believe it, because it is the truth.
@ronathanedwards The facts are at one time. They RECEIVED Him. To THOSE He gave the right to become children of God. Otherwise what does it mean? By the way, Calvinism doesn't even believe that man can have any right to become anything, because everything is fore-ordained..
@clearedtoengage The RIGHT is GIVEN by God. Yes you are correct. "Right" here means AUTHORITY as in Adoption. MANKIND is NOT God's children, we become God's children by regeneration and then ADOPTED (in their culture even a son isn't given rights/title "the fathers signet ring until "adopted") before that he has no more rights than the family slaves. Fore-ordination only guarantees what is going to happen IN TIME. The act still has to be carried out in time. U don't understand Calvinism.
@ronathanedwards Um okay. They were not even children of God at belief. Being BORN of GOD means that you are a CHILD of GOD. Stop trying to beat around the bush.
@clearedtoengage We are all children of the Devil until God gives us a new heart, we BELIEVE with that new heart and are adopted into the family of God. Eph. 1:5. You should go to a website that has theological terms so you know what you are talking about.
@ronathanedwards Sorry, no. God gives us a new heart after sprinkling of pure water. Look at the prophecy back in Ezekiel. And no, I'm not getting this off a website.
They believed but they were not yet free. HMMM.. doesn't that say something? They believed but were STILL SLAVES OF SIN. They WERE believers, the BIBLE SAYS SO.
@clearedtoengage Sorry, no reference to "sprinkling of pure water" in Ezk 11:19 or 36:26-27; adding to the text again.
The Bible doesn't say they were TRUE Believers. I already shown you the aorist tense shows false belief. Do you actually read and study my posts? You are arguing against JESUS, not me. Read 8:46. He is talking to the ones that John said "believed" (note: aorist tense), it's in the very same conversation! In vs 46 Jesus uses "believe" in the "PRESENT" tense... hmmm TRUE belief.
@ronathanedwards ""Then I will (AJ)sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean" Ezekiel 36:25... You are a fool. The aorist tense does not show false belief. You presuppose that. HE SAID THEY BELIEVE. Not they were FALSE believers. You don't even believe in the Bible.
@clearedtoengage It does not say AFTER sprinkling water again you are adding words to the text. This is a ceremonial act of cleansing, again learn what a covenant is. EZK 36 is the promise of the NEW COVENANT (New Testament). I'm a fool? Really? "The aorist tense does not show false belief". Prove to me otherwise !
@ronathanedwards The burden of proof lies on you to show that the aorist tense shows false belief, a statement that could have been plainly made by a separate Greek word.
Wow. You really are dense, aren't you? He says He will sprinkle them with clean water and give them a new heart. Not give them a new heart SO THAT they can obey. Plus Ezekiel 11:18ff shows that before He gave them a new heart, they cleansed the land. v21 then shows that their hearts could STILL go after the evil things.
@clearedtoengage He didn't give them a new heart, that is the promise of the New Covenant, of course they did evil, they weren't given a new heart... lol
I already gave you the proof. I can believe in FACTS that isn't true FAITH. Faith PRODUCES action. I can believe that a chair can support me given the facts, but until I sit on it, I don't have faith in it. Believing in Jesus can be false given the HEART and it's intentions. The Jews "believed" falsely they followed Him for what He was giving them (food) and healing them (comfort) all selfish ambitions, NOT because of who He was, they loved Him out of what they get, not for who he is.
@clearedtoengage "BELIEVED" in WHAT? For WHAT? Jesus said of them John 2:23-24 Many believed (aorist AGAIN!) Did Jesus then say they were saved because they "believed"? LOL nope, He didn't entrust himself to them BECAUSE He KNEW them. Their hearts weren't changed, they were believing in him to get their own selfish desires fulfilled, not for their salvation, BIG DIFFERENCE. One is a True faith, one is "THAT faith" as James says that is a FALSE faith.
@ronathanedwards Can WHAT faith? Faith ALONE not faith with works. You're proving my point each time you reference James. Faith alone does not save... They believed but they didn't TRULY believe... because their faith was not accompanied by works.
@clearedtoengage "They believed but they didn't TRULY believe... because their faith was not accompanied by works" I believe that! AH, now you are changing what you said earlier, (If they "believe" it is REALLY belief!) Now you are seeing that there is a difference between REAL belief and a profession of belief that isn't real. THAT is what is being described by John in John 8. The Jews didn't have a REAL faith. Real faith produces works, REAL faith let's me sit in the chair and not just talk.
@ronathanedwards Real faith is accompanied by works, not produces works. Faith without works is dead. I'm not changing what I said earlier, I'm just showing how their faith was not FALSE, but it was DEAD.
@clearedtoengage Well, I think I'm the one putting heavy emphasis on EVERY word and their meaning (grammar). I'll pray that you take the time to humble yourself and know God created grammar for a reason. Learn it, and you'll understand the Bible for what it SAYS and not what you have learned from your tradition.
@ronathanedwards The Bible says they HAD believed. Jesus said they DON'T believe [now, that is]. I'm not arguing with Jesus. But they HAD believed at one time. You make God out to be a God of confusion and not the author of simplicity (1 Cor. 2:1-5).
@clearedtoengage The only person that is confused here is you. They didn't believe, Jesus said so right after the fact of John describing that they (falsely) believed! Do you understand that this is a literal conversation? What did they do, go from believing (truly) and in 15 seconds went to "unbelieving again" ? LOL They were of their father the DEVIL, Jesus' WORDS were not in them, they couldn't even BEAR to hear him, they wanted to kill him! Wow, big change in 15 seconds! LOL
@ronathanedwards They didn't believe? John 8:30-31. The BIBLE says it. I love how you can make such idiotic statements directly against the Bible. Verse 31 shows a change in time or break. It wasn't necessarily 15 seconds later. They HAD believed -> they DIDN'T believe.
@ronathanedwards "many came to believe in Him. So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him" THEY BELIEVED. The BIBLE says so. And you say that 1 John 5:1 guarantees that ANYONE who believes in Jesus has already been born of God [which is a lie, being born of God, or being a son of God {think logically, use the brain God gave you} comes when you obey- you become a slave to righteousness, a son of God, born of God]. They were born of God then, but then they went astray..???
@clearedtoengage Funny how they professed to be free and Jesus said they were slaves to sin. Sounds like you (the Jews) verses me (Jesus).. I'll take his side. They were slaves to their sin and needed to be set free, and the only one who has that power is Jesus and He gives it ONLY to those He wishes, John 5:21
@ronathanedwards LOL. You are so dumb. I am no longer a slave to sin, but thanks be to God that I obeyed from the heart that form of teaching to which I was committed, and was FREED from sin. You are stubbornly resisting God's will, you refuse to subject yourself and proclaim that if God wanted to save someone, He would FORCE them to obey whether they willed it or not. WHOM does JESUS give salvation to? READ JOHN 5:24!!! HE WHO HEARS AND BELIEVES!
@clearedtoengage I'm dumb but yet you can't answer 4th grade grammar questions... okay... "Thanks to God that ""I"" obeyed.. the glory goes to the subject of the sentence.. guess who the subject is.. U don't know grammar, I'll tell you... it is "I". Way to glorify yourself!
God doesn't FORCE anybody, you don't understand regeneration.
Yes Jesus saves those who HEARS and Believes... Yep nice explicit verse, and I believe it. Who CAN'T hear? The fleshly mind Rom 8:5-8 John 8:43-45 John 10:26-27
@ronathanedwards When you are a NATURAL man, when you have SET your mind on the flesh [NOT when God sets your mind on the flesh, JAMES 1:13-15], you CANNOT obey. You must first HEAR the Word- if you are unwilling to hear it is impossible for you to have faith, and I do not mean the act of physical hearing, but actually LISTENING (Rom. 10:17). That is the entire point of these passages- the NATURAL man, the man of the DEVIL, CANNOT obey until he actually LISTENS and HEARS. He must OPEN his mind!
@clearedtoengage "You must first HEAR the Word" (in the natural state). You are having a person while natural do something that only a spiritual person can do! Only a spiritual person CAN hear. 1 Cor. 2:14 The natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God... he is NOT ABLE to understand them BECAUSE they are spiritually DISCERNED. They must be regenerated, problem solved. The are regenerated, they hear, they believe, they follow, they obey.
The text says nothing of the "natural man must 'open his mind' " THAT is not Biblical. Romans 5:8 also says that "those who live according to the flesh" (they are NATURAL) " have their outlook SHAPED by the things of the flesh.[NET]" That's all they can do, their fleshly living (outlook) is SHAPED by their nature. It does not say "BUT they can change their nature to think spiritually". Stop adding words to explicit verses, just accept them, it will bring you to the truth!
@ronathanedwards Sigh. Romans 6:17-18- they were dead in their sins. They obeyed first or the Bible is not true. Not glorifying self, you dummy... thanks be to God that though you were dead, YOU OBEYED... that's glorifying self? OBEYING God's commands is giving me the glory?? Wow. God DOES force people if you believe in Calvinism, you don't understand foreordination... Again Rom 6:17-18.
@ronathanedwards I really don't feel like continuing this discussion. You are a fool, and you refuse to open your ears so that you might hear the truth of God's explicit statements. I have answered your folly as it deserves (Pr. 26:5). There is nothing more to say. Yes, from Him are all things, but does that include sin? God created everything GOOD, and that means EVERYTHING. Satan made a choice to disobey and deceive Eve. James 1:13-15 GOD DOES NOT TEMPT. That means He DOES NOT DECREE SIN.
@clearedtoengage I've been telling you what explicit MEANS, you're the one using nothing but implication, that is hilarious. From Him are ALL things. Is sin a thing? YES. The verse is quite explicit, you just don't want to HEAR it.
Everything God does is good, that includes decreeing that sin be. God doesn't tempt, but He uses (with intent) Satan do accomplish His will which is good. He controls Satan to do His plan, his Decree to use Satan to accomplish His plan stays and no man can stay it.
@ronathanedwards James 1:13-15 the verse is quite explicit, you just don't want to HEAR it. HE does NOT make man sin. You blaspheme against the Spirit. 1 Cor. 2:14 the natural man is not natural because God made him natural, there is the difference. God created man GOOD. Eccl. 7:29.
@clearedtoengage Nope, you said SATAN does. Can Satan do something God doesn't want, or is He under God's sovereign rule? God used Satan to destroy Job, He used the Assyrians to destroy Israel (then He DESTROYED Assyria for doing what He commanded! lol) He 1Kings 22:21-23 God sent a lying spirit to ENTICE them? 1 Sam 2:25 But they would not listen to their father, FOR (reason clause) it was the WILL of the LORD to put them to DEATH.
God MADE man (creation), not MAKES man after fall.. Psalm 51:5
Thank you for clarifying this, some evil doctrines are creeping up on the church deceiving the saints..
tthannah 4 days ago
Great sermon Bro!!
rivervalleyretriever 6 days ago
I think he may be one of the worst preachers I have ever seen.
mastercheef12345 1 month ago
Some of the worst exegesis I've ever heard.
mastercheef12345 1 month ago
Calvinists do not believe you can lose your salvation.
ZIONISTMAN1 2 months ago
Actually there is at least one verse that talks about God choosing people "for salvation" or "to be saved" 2 Thessalonians 2:13 "God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth"
ZIONISTMAN1 2 months ago
It's amazing to see that this man does not actual Scriptural Exegesis. Steve's church doesn't even have a doctrine of the Trinity, he doesn't even believe in the universal church so therefore he must think that there is no salvation outside of his ranting hall. He doesn't believe in the bible either NO SOLA, Scriptura, Fide, Gratia, Christos, Soli Deo gloria ! He believes that man has the capacity to choose God by an act of his will. IT'S A MATTER OF THE HEART STEVE NOT THE WILL!!!!!
NB3K 3 months ago
When I need a laugh on my lunch break...I listen to steven anderson :P They guy's such a raving idiot that it's funny!
mastercheef12345 3 months ago
Try reading the London Baptist confession and the writings of Charels Spurgeon sounds like new baptist have left the old faith not the other way around so actually Arminism has creeped into baptist churches.
Ismaelpa 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I could wile away the hours
Conferrin' with the flowers
Consultin' with the rain
And my head I'd be scratchin'
While my thoughts were busy hatchin'
If I only had a brain...
...Anyone else hear a "strawman?" ;-)
HeReformedMe 4 months ago
180movie.com help stop abortion
rom116rom 4 months ago
Urgh! Typical Arminians... teaching doctrines of men, not Christ!
Mr. Anderson probably has a shrine in his house somewhere, with pictures of Jacobus Arminius and Erasmus of Rotterdam, that he worships and prays to five times a day. These people disgust me!
hranonym 6 months ago
I'm sorry dude, but you just don't get it. You don't need to demonize people who believe differently than you. Don't you even know that Calvinists were the founders of the modern missions movement?
NewPuritan07 6 months ago
Wait a minute, the Baptist notion that one cannot lose one's salvation is pure calvinism. The Baptist faith historically is a modified form of Calvinism. This guy is a mess.
woodmason 8 months ago
As a staunch Five Point Calvinist, I actually find this amusing. The Arminians are so afraid that their false doctrine will finally be brought down that they are trying to incite a witch hunt.
sonofgilnockie 8 months ago
@sonofgilnockie Can the book of life be modified by God? Names can be blotted out, so yes.
chapmaned 8 months ago
@sonofgilnockie Calvinism is Heresy, Anderson and myself are not Arminians we believe in eternal security, that's not Arminian doctrine so you show yourself a fool. "(God) who will have ALL MEN TO BE SAVED." 1Tim 2:4. "..we trust in the living God who is the savior of ALL MEN." 1Tim 4:10. "He is the propitiation for our sins: and not for our's only, but also for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD." 1John 2:2. God is not willing that any should perish but that ALL should come to repentance." 2Pet. 3:9
cbat36 8 months ago
@sanderson....would you debate James White on this? Just curious, not trying to start fire, but it is always easier to shoot fire at another theological position when the other position is not there to defend itself and shoot fire at your position. So, would you be willing to debate him? He is in AZ with you.
npotts89 8 months ago 2
@npotts89
Anderson is not man enough to debate men like James White. Would you really want to watch Anderson attempt this? It would be like Einstein entering a 5th grade science project competition.
HeresyHunter1711 8 months ago
@HeresyHunter1711 lol. It would be a bit of a disaster for Anderson. But I just thought it would be a challenge to actually seek what the other side has to say, accurately, and accurately representing it to people because we must remember that teachers of God's law are judged more harshly so we need to be seeking truth in our own theology and in accurately representing other people's theology so that we can accurately refute or accurately submit it. All in the pursuit of truth, whom Jesus is.
npotts89 8 months ago
@HeresyHunter1711
I imagine Anderson would throw a tantrum and walk out... or he'd throw a trantrum and be escorted from the premises... Tasers anyone?
Keruaran 1 month ago
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tgillspy2 1 month ago
@Keruaran You are a danger to anyone who is seeking to know and understand the gospel 1) You would lead them astray with damnable heresies and with the wicked error and false doctrine/ teaching that you hold to.You are very stubborn.You need to read Galatians chapter 1 KJV You have been warned by many people,i am not the only one telling you.
tgillspy2 1 month ago
@tgillspy2
"I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain." Galatians 2:21
Keruaran 4 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God" Ephesians 2:8
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran The scriptures do not fit with reform theology That was a typo.The Lord wants everyone to come to salvation.His cross is sufficient.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
"And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" Revelation 5:9
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran That scripture is true,but it isn't calvinist.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Your comment is hilarious on two levels: Firstly its hilarious coming from someone as completely ignorant of Reformed Theology as you are. Secondly its hilarious because the verse does not teach a semipelagian unlimited atonement, it teaches that Jesus redeemed a people from every tribe, tongue, people and nation - this is particular redemption.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran I expected you to give these comments.You should read the gospel according to Mark chapter 1 KJV because It states what Jesus preached with authority.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
As usual, you have nothing to offer in response. You are incapable of actually engaging with the issues or presenting any reasonable exegesis of scripture relevant to the issues.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Reformed Theology affirms these verses of scripture along with scripture as a whole, you are simply ignorant. You dare to say "His cross is sufficient" but you deny and nullify the efficacy of Christ's finished work on the cross. Yours is a worthless gospel in which God does not powerfully save men by decree of the Father, the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit and the atonement of Christ upon the cross - No, your gospel makes God powerless and subject to the will of man.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Reformed Theology teaches that God actually, and powerfully saves men and that this is all of Grace, all of God, from first to last. Your gospel teaches that God has done all He can and only hopes men will come of their own free will, a 'gospel' in which sinful man by his own will is made the author of his own salvation.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran Reform theology is insane......
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Why am I not surprised at all that when confronted with statements that you cannot deal with, you simply go running back to your corner spouting your usual one line attacks which, as usual, do not address any issue and show that you are incapable of dealing with the issues.
If you are a believer with a reasonably sound knowledge of scripture, who knows how to rightly divide the scriptures, and solid scriptural theology to stand on, why can't you deal with these issues?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran You know why i reject the strange reform theology.You know very well why those who love and follow Jesus reject calvinistic doctrine If you don't believe John 3:16.17.18 and 2 peter 3:9 KJV then you are teaching damnable heresy....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
There's nothing "strange" about Reformed Theology. And I absolutely believe all of scripture, including John 3:16.17.18 and 2 peter 3:9. You don't like the fact that I allow scripture to speak for itself in its own context and divide the word of God correctly by applying proper exegesis to these texts. You do no such thing, you apply emotion and tradition while ignoring every other text of scripture that does not agree with your sub-biblical gospel.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
How do you deal with Jon 6:44 in which Jesus says, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day". And how do you deal with John 17:9 in which Jesus prays only for believers, differentiating them from "the world" saying, "I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.".
You simply ignore it because you cannot deal with scripture on its own terms.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran How do you deal with John 12:32?
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me.
You said:
"How do you deal with Jon 6:44 in which Jesus says, No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day"
sanderson1611 3 weeks ago
@sanderson1611
I deal with John 12:32 by reading properly in its context, within the passage it is from and not in isolation, totally divorced from that context and the circumstances we see in this passage of scripture. Recognizing the context of the passage (If we read from verse 20 we can see that the Greeks were coming in search of Jesus, and Jesus is speaking about his death), we allow the phrase to have its natural meaning: all kinds of men, Jew and Gentile.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@sanderson1611
Furthermore, considering how much Jesus actually says that is specific about who are His in John's gospel, how can you take John 12:32 in a universalist sense as being "ALL" men who ever lived and then turn to John 10:26-29, and exegete that consistently? If "ALL" means everyone who ever lived, does that include those of whom Jesus said, "But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep"?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran You have the arrogance to add and take away from the words of Christ....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Back to your old ways again I see. Nothing to offer but baseless slanderous attacks. This is exactly the type of behavior that got you blocked on another channel. Actually dealing with the issues and with scripture consistently is just something you don't do.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran For heaven sake stop twisting the scriptures.....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
How am I twisting the scriptures? It is not good enough for you to continue making empty accusations when you cannot back those accusations up with facts. If you can not provide any reasonable exegesis of scripture to demonstrate error on my part then you have no business making slanderous remarks.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran Because you know that the words of Christ state clearly that God wants to save his creation from hell....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
I note that yet again you offer no scriptural exegesis to support your comment. Are you a Universalist?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran It is very simple John 3 :16 KJV
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
...... 2 peter 3:9 KJV.....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Why don't you tell me how you interpret this verse and why?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran It is written in plain english......
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
2 Peter 3:9 says God is longsuffering toward who?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
This scripture that you like twisting is the one that Christ gave to men to bring light into theirs hearts so that they would believe him so that they would believe in him ,that they would not perish but have everlasting life It is very clear.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
What scripture am I twisting and why do you think yourself above having to answer any questions or challenges to your thinking?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran Tell me this do you go to a calvinist bible college?
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Start answering some questions tjillspy2.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran By the way are you a man or woman?
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
So, not only do you refuse to answer any questions that are actually relevant to the issues and the text of scripture, you insist on asking irrelevant questions that are completely off topic.
I've never been to a Bible college (though I would like to start a course at the local Reformed Theological College at some stage) and I'm not a woman so you can forget about 1 Timothy 2:12.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
You just love to evade the issues with nonsense like this don't you?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran Women shouldn't be in teaching positions having authority over a man.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
This is not the first time you've resorted to false witness because you cannot deal with the issues.
"A faithful witness will not lie: but a false witness will utter lies." Proverbs 14:5
"A true witness delivereth souls: but a deceitful witness speaketh lies." Proverbs 14:25
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
When you're done playing dumb, perhaps then you could get back on topic Sherlock.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran We were talking about the scriptures.Salvation is given to all by what Christ has done on the cross.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
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@tgillspy2
If "Salvation is given to all", why aren't "all" saved?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
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Keruaran 3 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@tgillspy2
You said "Salvation is given to all". If salvation is "given to all", why aren't "all" saved? Trolling me on some other channel with your usual poor comments isn't going to deal with the question.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2 His action of dying is not what saves you. What he said is what saves you.
KillinDaWelfareMCs 2 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 1 week ago
@tgillspy2
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
It's not "whosoever", its "whosoever believeth". That sounds pretty specific to me.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran The offer is given to all obviously.....
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Does that include those whom Jesus explicitly said are not His sheep? Does that include people who end up in hell? Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the propitiation for the sins of people who are in hell?
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
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tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran Yes,how do you deal with John 12:32 ?
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
Read my response to sanderson1611.
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@Keruaran All means all. Furthermore "all" reformed theology is wrong, heretical and erroneous.All.
tgillspy2 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy2
If "all" always means universally "all", does "all" apply to those Jesus explicitly said were not His sheep?
"ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." John 10:26-29
Keruaran 3 weeks ago
@tgillspy1 Yes my friend i have read john in its entirety and love the gospel of john.Jesus does teach many elective truths such as "unless the father draws you to me, you cannot come to me" and many other teachings. at the end of the day i dont agree with everything calvin taught but election does hit at our human pride. the other issue i really have iis with this preacher, i have seen his other sermons and looks to be a very angry man with pride issues
08greeks 8 months ago
@tgillspy1 we need to remember not to take scriptures out of their context , and both calvinists and arminians have done that. But we need to read scripture as a whole, and we do see Gods purposes through the canon of scripture. God chose israel among all nations, (we see his elective work there) that through israel people from all nations would come to him. The other fact is you cannot deny that ephesians clearly speaks of election as does romans 9 to11.
08greeks 8 months ago
Mr anderson, your beef isnt really with calvinists, but with God because as with all arminians they dont like the fact that the scriptures are clear about Gods sovereignty over all things, even peoples salvation!! ive noticed the type of people that hate calvinism/predestination are the ones that love to work hard for the gospel, its all up to you is there belief. there is a hidden pride lurking within them. how do i know? i used to be the exact same myself. God be praised for his mercy.
08greeks 9 months ago
I love being a Calvinist!
Godpleaser77 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards "Where EVER does ANYBODY know who is saved or not? WHERE? You have totally embarrassed yourself with that statement. It is beyond absurdity." "These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life." How can you yourself know that you are saved, unless you believe so you have already been born of God according to you? Even though the demons believe, and they are not born of God..
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage It might really help you to understand the Bible if you know grammar and follow pronouns. YOU may know about whose salvation? Someone else's? .. NO. YOU. Embarrassing? I think what is embarrassing is not knowing grammar and following it's intentions. You can't even tell me that an embryo has to be fertilized first because it would destroy your infantile understands..pure pride. God fights the proud my friend, but gives grace tot he humble. Humble yourself to God and his grammar
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
"And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may prove what the will of God is, that which is good and acceptable and perfect (Rom. 12:2)." Now, why would Paul tell them to not be conformed to the world if it was impossible for them to be conformed to the world because they were already predestined to salvation? Same with be transformed- they had already BEEN transformed. Why is it still commanded?
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage UMMM first of all a command is given to all, it is the INSTRUMENT by which God gives us to know what we are to do. Secondly, Paul doesn't know who is born again or not, there is no halo hanging over the elect. 1 Jn 2:19 Thirdly, the command is for our sanctification. If commands weren't given, then we wouldn't grow in it! Even those who are born again still fight sin (or are you perfect?).
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The instrument or the power? You lie against the Spirit. Romans 1:16 explicitly states that the GOSPEL IS THE POWER OF GOD TO SALVATION. The Holy Spirit has revealed God's will through the Word. All men can be saved. Titus 2:11-12.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage You know, Satan is an accuser, funny how you accuse me of lying. I didn't say it's an instrument and NOT the power of God. You are making a false assumption and thinking it can be either/or were the Bible says it is His instrument ALSO it is the Power of God....
Answer me this one EASY question and I will prove to you by your answer it is an instrument. How does God communicate His Gospel?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Jesus Christ. Heb. 1:1-2
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage So, Jesus communicates to everyone? I thought we were talking about His WORD, the Bible? Isn't Jesus WHAT is communicated BY the Word? Would you agree with that?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards God spoke to us THROUGH His Son, and John 1:1 says Jesus is the Word of God. I will draw all men unto myself, He said. How is He to do that if His Word, His message, His gospel, the Bible is not powerful to save anyone who thirsts?
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Jesus DOES communicate to everyone, or He could not have meant what He said in John 12:32. Not all hear and list to the call, though.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage How do we "hear" or should I say "What do we hear" TODAY? Do we hear his message BY the Word of God, the Bible?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Yes, we do. Rom 10:17- "Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." What is the Word of God? The Scriptures.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage So, it is BY the Word of God? Rom 10:17 ? correct? I just want to be clear.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Yes, we hear by the Word of God. It's not something that comes over us, because many heard the word of God but refused to heed it- see Pharisees, Sadducees, Judaizers.. etc.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Hearing comes by the word of God. But you have to make a choice on that hearing whether you will believe it or not.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Great, I'm glad we agree. Now what does the word "BY" mean, in "BY the Word" ?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards It means that without the message of the gospel, the Bible, hearing and understanding God's will is impossible. The only way to hear, to understand God's will is to read it.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage I'm not asking what "By the Word" means, just the word "BY" what does it signify?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The word by signifies what causes the hearing, the Word of God. Without a message there would be nothing to hear.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage NO, I mean the "definition" of the word...
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Here is where it gets into vain discussion 1 Tim. 1:6. We understand what this phrase means in context, so there is no reason to ask what "by" means? By means what causes the action. It is a preposition. It shows place, time, relationship between words, etc.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage No,it isn't vain, there is a very good reason why. Why is it so difficult for you to answer my questions? How is asking for a definition of a word so difficult? You can just look it up on the internet! It took you two weeks to answer my grammar question and now how long before it takes to answer a vocabulary question? Both should have taken 5 seconds! I'm trying to show you something... are you afraid of the word "by" for some reason?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards I just defined it for you.. what causes the action. What is the action? Hearing. So hearing is caused by the Word of God. -shrug- That's what I believe.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage So the dictionary says By is : A MEANS of conveyance. .... Do you agree with that? God's Word is the MEANS - conveying His message to be heard. You'll agree with that, right?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Correct, but it is also a cause, contextually. Don't limit a word to one single definition when the context implies more.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Yes, although "by" is just a preposition and is very confined on what it can mean. I agree. NOW, What is the definition of an "instrument"?
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards An instrument is something that is used for a purpose.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage
BY: A MEANS of conveyance...
Instrument: NOUN - a MEANS by which something is effected or done.
"BY the Word of God" The word "BY" is a word that introduces a "INSTRUMENTAL" clause.
Therefore: BY indicates that the "WORD" is the INSTRUMENT God uses to CONVEY His message. Hence, I was correct by properly stating earlier, that the Word of God is an instrument. BECAUSE it is the SUBJECT of the instrumental clause.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Yes, however, you were limiting it to an instrument which can only save the elect. There is the vital difference under consideration.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage QUOTE: ME-"first of all a command is given to all, it is the INSTRUMENT by which God gives us to know what we are to do"
YOU: "The instrument or the power? You lie against the Spirit".
By your statement you told me I was lying in saying that it was an instrument. You were wrong. It has nothing to due with the argument, but you accused me of being wrong and I lier. But in fact you were incorrect. I wasn't limiting either, I said the command was "for all". go back and read it.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Back on the discussion about Rom. 1:16, not the discussion about the command. Sorry if I was unclear which I was replying to.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards You still are limiting the gospel's power to the elect only.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage No apology? ... o.k.
Romans 1:16 God's power for salvation for "who? Every single person? OR everyone WHO BELIEVES? It's a substantival. It is power for salvation for THOSE who believe, not for everyone (period). You are implying any other understanding. Read what it says, not what you want it to say.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards -shrug- You still say that the gospel isn't powerful to save anyone who believes, only the elect who believe. I stand by my statement.
Yes, every single person who believes. I am not saying all men are saved. However, who can believe? Whosoever will may come. John 3:16. You say that we cannot believe unless we are already born of God. If that is the case, John 1:12 is simply a lie and ANOTHER infinite loop. Were they sons of God before belief or after belief?
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage I really wish you could read the words of the Bible and know what they say instead of glossing over them and imposing a presupposition on them. You didn't even read what I said. The gospel is the God's power for... what does it say? EVERYONE? ... NO... Everyone who believes ... or the Greek says EVERY BELIEVING ONE. Therefore it IS powerful... to the believing ones... every one of them. Same exact phrase in John 3. EVERY BELIEVING ONE. It doesn't say every single individual.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards John 1:12 is not sequential? Those who BELIEVE in Him, He GAVE the right to become children of God, not they were ALREADY born of God. Your interpretation of 1 John 5:1 is wrong and causes disunity of the Bible. John 5:21- who does the Son raise? "he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life," V 24.. Whom does the Father give? The church, Eph. 5:25-27. Who is drawn? John 12:32 all.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
I explained John1:12 to you. It is NOT sequential. They are aorist verbs. It is describing facts, not WHEN they occur. The verb tenses don't allow it. Secondly 1 John 5:1 DOES tell you. The perfect tense is the CAUSE, you haven't addressed that yet. I'm still waiting for you to show how an embryo growing is the CAUSE of it's fertilization! LOL
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Not describing when the facts occur? Please. "to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name" Those are FACTS. To those who believe in His name, He gave the RIGHT to become children of God, not to those who believe in His name, He already made sons of God. Otherwise, God could have written "to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who are dead", because it's not SEQUENTIAL. -.-
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Please, what ever you do, don't even attempt to go into verb tenses. You are totally ignorant when it comes to understanding Greek verb usage and understanding. The day you can tell me the aspect of a punctiliar aorist as it relates to present tense participle to another aorist with another aorist is the day we can have this conversation. Believed is AGAIN in the PRESENT tense, "who were born' in 13 is in the AORIST tense. There is NO sequence only connection,not HOW they are.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Gal. 3:26 You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. Wait, what? Paul must have been deceived when he wrote this, he should know we can't believe until we are sons of God...
You are totally ignorant when it comes to understanding the Bible. You are worse than a Pharisee, seeking to be justified by your intense studies in Greek, when God is NOT a God of confusion, and the gospel went to every nation, stop trying to confuse yourself and just READ the BIBLE!
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Confusing? Sorry, knowing Greek makes things more clear not less. You can't even get theological terms based on English correct, let alone grammar. Sons of God is a TITLE referring to adoption NOT regeneration. You become a son by the effect of being regenerated but they are not the same. You confuse so many terms. You should not just read the Bible, but start studying it. We believe when we are regenerated- 1 John 5:1.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Sorry, knowing Greek makes things more clear, but you twist it in every imaginable fashion. If you are BORN OF GOD you are a SON OF GOD. Let's think logically now. You become a son by being regenerated and when are you a son of God? THROUGH faith in Christ Jesus.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage You are believing BECAUSE you HAVE BEEN BORN of God. Still haven't gotten that yet? The perfect tense is defined as the CAUSE of a Present effect ! You have to deal with the CAUSE. You run away from that point!
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards And what does born of God mean? Interpret Scripture with Scripture. You completely ignore verses that contradict your erroneous theology (which again is wrong because of 1 Cor. 1- it is named for man).
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Born of God literally means "fathered" or "generated" "fertilized". I don't ignore anything. You are ignoring that the "fathering" is the CAUSE of the believing. You can not get around it. The perfect tense is use for the purpose of showing that the verb in the perfect tense it the CAUSE. The present tense when used with a perfect tense is the EFFECT. Look it up in any grammar book my friend. Read it, and believe it, because it is the truth.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The facts are at one time. They RECEIVED Him. To THOSE He gave the right to become children of God. Otherwise what does it mean? By the way, Calvinism doesn't even believe that man can have any right to become anything, because everything is fore-ordained..
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage The RIGHT is GIVEN by God. Yes you are correct. "Right" here means AUTHORITY as in Adoption. MANKIND is NOT God's children, we become God's children by regeneration and then ADOPTED (in their culture even a son isn't given rights/title "the fathers signet ring until "adopted") before that he has no more rights than the family slaves. Fore-ordination only guarantees what is going to happen IN TIME. The act still has to be carried out in time. U don't understand Calvinism.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Um okay. They were not even children of God at belief. Being BORN of GOD means that you are a CHILD of GOD. Stop trying to beat around the bush.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage We are all children of the Devil until God gives us a new heart, we BELIEVE with that new heart and are adopted into the family of God. Eph. 1:5. You should go to a website that has theological terms so you know what you are talking about.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Sorry, no. God gives us a new heart after sprinkling of pure water. Look at the prophecy back in Ezekiel. And no, I'm not getting this off a website.
They believed but they were not yet free. HMMM.. doesn't that say something? They believed but were STILL SLAVES OF SIN. They WERE believers, the BIBLE SAYS SO.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Sorry, no reference to "sprinkling of pure water" in Ezk 11:19 or 36:26-27; adding to the text again.
The Bible doesn't say they were TRUE Believers. I already shown you the aorist tense shows false belief. Do you actually read and study my posts? You are arguing against JESUS, not me. Read 8:46. He is talking to the ones that John said "believed" (note: aorist tense), it's in the very same conversation! In vs 46 Jesus uses "believe" in the "PRESENT" tense... hmmm TRUE belief.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards ""Then I will (AJ)sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean" Ezekiel 36:25... You are a fool. The aorist tense does not show false belief. You presuppose that. HE SAID THEY BELIEVE. Not they were FALSE believers. You don't even believe in the Bible.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage It does not say AFTER sprinkling water again you are adding words to the text. This is a ceremonial act of cleansing, again learn what a covenant is. EZK 36 is the promise of the NEW COVENANT (New Testament). I'm a fool? Really? "The aorist tense does not show false belief". Prove to me otherwise !
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The burden of proof lies on you to show that the aorist tense shows false belief, a statement that could have been plainly made by a separate Greek word.
Wow. You really are dense, aren't you? He says He will sprinkle them with clean water and give them a new heart. Not give them a new heart SO THAT they can obey. Plus Ezekiel 11:18ff shows that before He gave them a new heart, they cleansed the land. v21 then shows that their hearts could STILL go after the evil things.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage He didn't give them a new heart, that is the promise of the New Covenant, of course they did evil, they weren't given a new heart... lol
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
I already gave you the proof. I can believe in FACTS that isn't true FAITH. Faith PRODUCES action. I can believe that a chair can support me given the facts, but until I sit on it, I don't have faith in it. Believing in Jesus can be false given the HEART and it's intentions. The Jews "believed" falsely they followed Him for what He was giving them (food) and healing them (comfort) all selfish ambitions, NOT because of who He was, they loved Him out of what they get, not for who he is.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The Jews BELIEVED. The SCRIPTURE ITSELF says it.
Again, you believe in a tyrannical God, who is angry at His own creation for sinning when HE foreordained them to. The LORD rebuke you.
I have no more words for you, save this one: 2 Pet 1:10.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage "BELIEVED" in WHAT? For WHAT? Jesus said of them John 2:23-24 Many believed (aorist AGAIN!) Did Jesus then say they were saved because they "believed"? LOL nope, He didn't entrust himself to them BECAUSE He KNEW them. Their hearts weren't changed, they were believing in him to get their own selfish desires fulfilled, not for their salvation, BIG DIFFERENCE. One is a True faith, one is "THAT faith" as James says that is a FALSE faith.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Can WHAT faith? Faith ALONE not faith with works. You're proving my point each time you reference James. Faith alone does not save... They believed but they didn't TRULY believe... because their faith was not accompanied by works.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage "They believed but they didn't TRULY believe... because their faith was not accompanied by works" I believe that! AH, now you are changing what you said earlier, (If they "believe" it is REALLY belief!) Now you are seeing that there is a difference between REAL belief and a profession of belief that isn't real. THAT is what is being described by John in John 8. The Jews didn't have a REAL faith. Real faith produces works, REAL faith let's me sit in the chair and not just talk.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Real faith is accompanied by works, not produces works. Faith without works is dead. I'm not changing what I said earlier, I'm just showing how their faith was not FALSE, but it was DEAD.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards I have no desire, nor time to continue this discussion. I pray that you will read the Scriptures and take every word.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Well, I think I'm the one putting heavy emphasis on EVERY word and their meaning (grammar). I'll pray that you take the time to humble yourself and know God created grammar for a reason. Learn it, and you'll understand the Bible for what it SAYS and not what you have learned from your tradition.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards The Bible says they HAD believed. Jesus said they DON'T believe [now, that is]. I'm not arguing with Jesus. But they HAD believed at one time. You make God out to be a God of confusion and not the author of simplicity (1 Cor. 2:1-5).
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage The only person that is confused here is you. They didn't believe, Jesus said so right after the fact of John describing that they (falsely) believed! Do you understand that this is a literal conversation? What did they do, go from believing (truly) and in 15 seconds went to "unbelieving again" ? LOL They were of their father the DEVIL, Jesus' WORDS were not in them, they couldn't even BEAR to hear him, they wanted to kill him! Wow, big change in 15 seconds! LOL
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards They didn't believe? John 8:30-31. The BIBLE says it. I love how you can make such idiotic statements directly against the Bible. Verse 31 shows a change in time or break. It wasn't necessarily 15 seconds later. They HAD believed -> they DIDN'T believe.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards "many came to believe in Him. So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him" THEY BELIEVED. The BIBLE says so. And you say that 1 John 5:1 guarantees that ANYONE who believes in Jesus has already been born of God [which is a lie, being born of God, or being a son of God {think logically, use the brain God gave you} comes when you obey- you become a slave to righteousness, a son of God, born of God]. They were born of God then, but then they went astray..???
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Funny how they professed to be free and Jesus said they were slaves to sin. Sounds like you (the Jews) verses me (Jesus).. I'll take his side. They were slaves to their sin and needed to be set free, and the only one who has that power is Jesus and He gives it ONLY to those He wishes, John 5:21
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards LOL. You are so dumb. I am no longer a slave to sin, but thanks be to God that I obeyed from the heart that form of teaching to which I was committed, and was FREED from sin. You are stubbornly resisting God's will, you refuse to subject yourself and proclaim that if God wanted to save someone, He would FORCE them to obey whether they willed it or not. WHOM does JESUS give salvation to? READ JOHN 5:24!!! HE WHO HEARS AND BELIEVES!
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage I'm dumb but yet you can't answer 4th grade grammar questions... okay... "Thanks to God that ""I"" obeyed.. the glory goes to the subject of the sentence.. guess who the subject is.. U don't know grammar, I'll tell you... it is "I". Way to glorify yourself!
God doesn't FORCE anybody, you don't understand regeneration.
Yes Jesus saves those who HEARS and Believes... Yep nice explicit verse, and I believe it. Who CAN'T hear? The fleshly mind Rom 8:5-8 John 8:43-45 John 10:26-27
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards When you are a NATURAL man, when you have SET your mind on the flesh [NOT when God sets your mind on the flesh, JAMES 1:13-15], you CANNOT obey. You must first HEAR the Word- if you are unwilling to hear it is impossible for you to have faith, and I do not mean the act of physical hearing, but actually LISTENING (Rom. 10:17). That is the entire point of these passages- the NATURAL man, the man of the DEVIL, CANNOT obey until he actually LISTENS and HEARS. He must OPEN his mind!
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage "You must first HEAR the Word" (in the natural state). You are having a person while natural do something that only a spiritual person can do! Only a spiritual person CAN hear. 1 Cor. 2:14 The natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God... he is NOT ABLE to understand them BECAUSE they are spiritually DISCERNED. They must be regenerated, problem solved. The are regenerated, they hear, they believe, they follow, they obey.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
The text says nothing of the "natural man must 'open his mind' " THAT is not Biblical. Romans 5:8 also says that "those who live according to the flesh" (they are NATURAL) " have their outlook SHAPED by the things of the flesh.[NET]" That's all they can do, their fleshly living (outlook) is SHAPED by their nature. It does not say "BUT they can change their nature to think spiritually". Stop adding words to explicit verses, just accept them, it will bring you to the truth!
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards Sigh. Romans 6:17-18- they were dead in their sins. They obeyed first or the Bible is not true. Not glorifying self, you dummy... thanks be to God that though you were dead, YOU OBEYED... that's glorifying self? OBEYING God's commands is giving me the glory?? Wow. God DOES force people if you believe in Calvinism, you don't understand foreordination... Again Rom 6:17-18.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards I really don't feel like continuing this discussion. You are a fool, and you refuse to open your ears so that you might hear the truth of God's explicit statements. I have answered your folly as it deserves (Pr. 26:5). There is nothing more to say. Yes, from Him are all things, but does that include sin? God created everything GOOD, and that means EVERYTHING. Satan made a choice to disobey and deceive Eve. James 1:13-15 GOD DOES NOT TEMPT. That means He DOES NOT DECREE SIN.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage I've been telling you what explicit MEANS, you're the one using nothing but implication, that is hilarious. From Him are ALL things. Is sin a thing? YES. The verse is quite explicit, you just don't want to HEAR it.
Everything God does is good, that includes decreeing that sin be. God doesn't tempt, but He uses (with intent) Satan do accomplish His will which is good. He controls Satan to do His plan, his Decree to use Satan to accomplish His plan stays and no man can stay it.
ronathanedwards 9 months ago
@ronathanedwards James 1:13-15 the verse is quite explicit, you just don't want to HEAR it. HE does NOT make man sin. You blaspheme against the Spirit. 1 Cor. 2:14 the natural man is not natural because God made him natural, there is the difference. God created man GOOD. Eccl. 7:29.
clearedtoengage 9 months ago
@clearedtoengage Nope, you said SATAN does. Can Satan do something God doesn't want, or is He under God's sovereign rule? God used Satan to destroy Job, He used the Assyrians to destroy Israel (then He DESTROYED Assyria for doing what He commanded! lol) He 1Kings 22:21-23 God sent a lying spirit to ENTICE them? 1 Sam 2:25 But they would not listen to their father, FOR (reason clause) it was the WILL of the LORD to put them to DEATH.
God MADE man (creation), not MAKES man after fall.. Psalm 51:5
ronathanedwards 9 months ago