I love these people. I know this video is almost 3 years old but how could I get in contact with them. All these muslims in my school give me questions I find hard to answer, especially as a 16 year old
muslims are not wise enough to give us the straight goods on their own diabolic belief system let alone to know anything about Jesus and Christianity....
@alineferreirademello you said that mohammed was pedophile(sala allah aleihi wa salam)cause He married his first wife when she was 9 years .
Let's agree that a female can have sex at the age of consent Let us take a look at the age of consent
Did you know that this age in Canada 100 years ago was only 12 years, France 150 years ago was 13, England was 12 years old, Spain to end 1995 was 12 years and then became 13 to day this, let alone to 1400 years ago (information all from Google Wikipedia)
@alineferreirademello Did you know that St. Joseph married Mrs. Mary when he was 90 years old while Mary did not exceed 12 years- this topic information is recognized by all Christian Almnaús-Do we have the right to say that St josef .was pedophile .Never cause islam interdit Lies and false accusations .i tell you more : in your book Jehoiachin King of Judah Married at the age of 10 years and he Can not have married a woman older than him. means his wife was about 9 or 8years.Read yr book frsT
Allah is a pathetical moon god of the arabs before mohammad,mohammad was just a psycho qith so mauch mental problems and probably the family that toke care of him abused him sexually that Aisha needed to use a plate ....
@alineferreirademello The moon god accusation as been debunked time and time again (YAWN). Also, it doesn't prove anything you believe. Unless you enjoy entertaining fallacious arguments.
@MrLoudmouthspeaker You're referring to the solstice cross, the Feast of Ishtar, Christmas, the trinity, the plurality of a god, his fatherhood and sonship?
Christianity has already failed, what are these guys trying to prove? The bible has been changed by humans while the Quran is unchanged since 1400 years back. The bible has forgeries while the Quran is free from any defects. If you dont believe me read and to reserach on both books, if you really want the truth you will come to know. So these guys only have their own arguments to come with from their own minds, like every other christian. You always get a new response from christians...
@zzaarrker quran was changed since Aisha when the goat ate part of it, after it was changed by the first kalifa,also it is changed everyday when translate it for christians countries, but the worse is, the quran is rubish with many mistakes because mohammad pedophile was a retard pedophile
@zzaarrker Ignorant is you which dont know your religion, read a bit of hadiths and some history book instead to read only what the Mosque tells u to read, anyways u can try to insult me, never mind, what can i wait from someone which fallow a pedoiphile?
@alineferreirademello We´ll see who´s right or wrong... In the meantime you should read a bit about your own book, the bible. Dont come and tell me about hadith and history when you dont even know who wrote your "bible" (collection of 60 books). Jesus the messenger of God and no partnership with God and no one has. Prove to me that even 1 verse, 1 single verse in the new testament is from Jesus directly. Peace be upon him.
bible is not my book, i dindt wrote any of the bible books
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before ask me any proof abt anything, why not u proof me that Mohammad, a pedophile, was really a prophet.. because the only place where we can find that he is prophet is the quran, and the quran is a big fat lie of mohammad the pedo
@zzaarrker 3... according to muslims mohammad couldnt write, so honey, who wrote the quran? was not allah,was not mohmmad, who was? because the papers that aisha had the goat ate
@alineferreirademello The Quran doesn't need to be in book form. Millions upon millions of Muslims have memorized the Quran. That's the point you care not to entertain for good reason. That whole "papers the goat ate" is about as flimsy as Matthew being the author of Matthew. Do you use the logical fallacy to try and sweep the anonymity of Biblical authorship under the rug? The Quran could've gone unwritten and still maintained its authenticity. Avoiding our oral tradition is sheer ignorance.
@tadpoleposition why the quran doent need to be a book if this shit of word means book? what the hell abt Mathew? u talk aloy abt fallacy but nothing of what u talk make sense.. i will ask again a simple question, who the hell wrote the shit quran? millions and millions of people memorized this shit? u know what it proof? that mohammad nor allah wrote this shit
@alineferreirademello Also, character assassination of the Prophet Muhammad (salla allahu alaihi wa sallam) shows just how desperate you really are. Peace!
@zzaarrker : You said: "Prove to me that even 1 verse, 1 single verse in the new testament is from Jesus directly. "
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That is just a red hearing since christians are NOT BIBLIOLATRES like MUHAMMADANS. The bible is a collection of traditions, lettres, witness etc - every christian understands that and by the way - I'm an atheist.
@zzaarrker islam is a joke just know that. The quran contradicts itself and has scientific errors. Its surely not the words from God. Just like what every other muslim say "The Bible has been changed by humans" I love it when you infidels say that, it proves your fools, The quran is ambiguous is purely false. Your false prophet had 9 wives and 1 of them were 9 years old. That is normal in islam, thats why you people can have 4 wives at a time. Thats Bigamy.
@MrStefan135 Huh kid? Plz ur words r of uneducated ppl. U dont know shit champ. Ur just a dum blind 16 year old. u dont know nothing bout ur religion so dont comment on islam kid. Uneducated is a understatement. If u were really educated u would engage in proper dialogue.
@MrStefan135 Wow how smart u are. Able to spell Dumb. Super smart my friend. Listen, U christians always have something negative to say but do not know how to back it up. If u wanna say something back it up and show me how smart u r. Otherwise just shut up coz u look stupid. U dont want to get owned by a "kid" now do u
@MrStefan135 1)Prof Yoshihide Kozai 2)Prof T.V.N Persaud 3)Prof William W Hey
4)Prof E Marshall Johnson 5)Prof Gerald Goeringer 6)Prof Keith Moore 7)Prof Joe Simpson 8)Prof Alfred Kroner 9)Dr Maurice Bucaille..All these scientist confirm wat the quran says is true.
-Were does the bible say it is forbidden to marry more than 1 wife?no where.Jesus didnt marry so y dont u follow christianity & not get married.
-Who cares if he married a 9 yr old. Y do u judge sum1 1400yrs ago by todays morals?
@naznab111 "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced from her husband commits adultery" (Luke 16:18)
So obviously it shows that Christians should not re-marry.
Who cares about what scientists say? What do they know about God?
Only God can judge what religion has truth and indeed it's Christianity as they are the worlds biggest population and has most followers, because it makes sense.
@MrStefan135 Christianity is the largest but islam is the fastest growing.U can have more than 1 wife n should not divorce them. its obvious divorce is wrong. divorce is high amongst the christians.There are many ppl in the bible with multiple wives but the bible didnt forbid it. Majority of these scientist converted to islam bcoz a 1400yr old book assisted science. let me ask u. If ur a true follower of jesus and jesus didnt get married than WHY do christians marry? thats not following christ
@naznab111 You speak like a kid. Jesus was perfect, does it mean we should be perfect? No because every human is a sinner. The Bible teaches us to Worship the Lord Jesus Christ. Why does your religion depend on Science? Science proves nothing, it cannot proof to you what religion you should be in. The only reason why Islam is the fastest growing religion is because you have a lot a kids (cos you have like 4 wives) and you bring them up to Islam, but is Christians SPREAD the word. WE R LEADERS!!!
@MrStefan135 We dont depend on science at all. it is just another proof that islam is from god that a 1400yr old book has advanced science in it at a time when no technology existed. u cant accept that tho. Islam has the highest CONVERT Rates, yes we have high birth, but we have the highest converts. its a fact! Were does the bible say to worship jesus?LOL u cant translate hebrew to english n expect the same meaning. Y pray to jesu wen jesus himself prayed to ONE god. ur not a follower of jesus
@naznab111 You are really lost, may God help you. I hope you have a vision of Jesus one day so you can seek truth. Do you know the meaning of the name Jesus? It means salvation and even his other name which is Immanuel means God with us. The truth is not islam, I promise it. If you reject Jesus, he will reject you.
@MrStefan135 If u think im lost then prove it to me. I follow jesus more than u do without any doubt. Muslims love n accept jesus as a prophet. He was the light, way n truth. just like moses was n abraham etc. do not translate hebrew into arabic bcoz u can never ever do it justice n would lose its meaning. "God with us" meaning god sent him with a msg n he spoke from wat god commanded. Just like jesus done, muslims pray to 1 god, the first commandment. ISlam is the truth and there is no doubt.
Long time ago, I also have a confusion about Trinity. But I prayed and asked God directly. You can do the same thing like I did. God surely answer you.
The simplest example is the two persons who cooperate together to run business, they are "one company" but "two person."
In Hindusim, one god can fight against other god, there are no unity, that's why we can categorize it into polytheist... Trinity is monotheist.
Hi there. I too was confused abt tht. Also remember even this is only an approximation to the triune natur of God coz humanS even whilst running a company r NEVER IN COMPLETE harmony. infact our own "persons" within ourselves e.g. spirit, soul and heart are oftennot in 100% harmony. ANOTHER example one cld give is tht of Mr. Smith in the movie, Matrix. He is numerous persons in different locations BUT ONE PROGRAM/ESSENCE. This IMU comes even closer BUT YET isnt perfect...
...though the example demonstrates that all the persons have ONE MIND AND ONE GOAL. But their roles are different and the status is also different WHILST AT THE SAME time all this being willingly done by all persons. Regarding the son being ETERNALLY begotten even the early Church fathers gave a marvellous example. that is the sun and it's rays where the sun gives the allegory of the Father and the rays of the son. There was never a time when the sun was without rays or vice versa...
...EVEN if u read modern cosmology on how a star or sun is formed ULL FIND tht long before THE REACTING CLOUD IS DEFINED AS A STAR it is alredy sending of rays Albeit in infrared. By the time it is defined as a star orsun THE RAYS R ALSO DEFINED AS SUCH n r visible light. BUT EVEN on the nuclear level i.e. if we take particles like quarks(who never exist alone) and electrons AS SOON AS THEYRE FORMED, GRAVITONS N OTHER particles n virtual photons r SIMULATANEOUSLY RADIATING FROM THEM such tht...
ALSO i forgot to point out that human beings are not only different persons BUT ALSO DIFFERENT BEINGS IN SUCH THT WE ALSO do not share the same essence. Even twins and conjoined twins do not perfectly share the same essence. Thats why i used the example from the matrix which i think appx it better.
@ABYARE bro we are being fooled by Church. When Prophets in bible got tempted by Satan then why not Church. Why Church was so holy. They were the one who tried to kill Jesus pbuh. Church was responsible for Killings OF Million Muslim and Christians altogether in Crusades. In dark ages etc !!!!
"Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies the Father and the Son."- 1 JOHN 2:22
2 John 1:7 Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.
The Sheikh spent more time attacking them than he did answering the questions...for which he stumbled, stuttered and really had no answer for and in actual fact, he proved Christianity right by contradicting himself time and time again... Thank God I'm Catholic. Thank God Almighty that Christianity came to this world. Praise God. Jesus saves! Thank you Jesus!!! I long for the moment I can meet you, I know then that I can finally rest. Gobless you all.
@izlamiztruth see you keep saying he lies but you never prove he is lying he always quotes from the quran and he always answers you honestly so how is sam lying exactly please tell me ?
@pulman7 you Just proved Jesus is God. Because as you said Jesus is the word of God and you believe that the word of God is eternal no man or prophet is eternal exept God so if Jesus is the word of God and the word of God is eternal that means Jesus is eternal meaning Jesus must be God.
@pulman7 you see you don't even know your own qu'ran yes there is. also prophet mohammad is a pedofile. he married a six year old girl and had sex with her at 9 years old he killed thousands of people.
@bfddanny1987 THE First verse of genesis is not red letter bible mate it is said that that verse was said by some jewish pope a century before Jesus peace be upon him himself.
@bfddanny1987 nowhere in bible it is written that he was son of God mate. Go read Bible correctly. Even paul letters and Jesus family bible confirms that he was " servant " of God not son of God.
@flexpape John 1:49 then Nathaneal declared, " rabi you are the son of God, you are the king of Israel." then Jesus said. " you belive me because i saw you under the fig tree, you shall see greater things than that he added." I think you need to read the bible mate, because you clearly know nothing of the bible i have just shown you wher the bible says jesus is the son of God. as for paul he did not believe that Jesus was the son of God at first but he later converted to christianity.cont
@bfddanny1987 lmFAO. Dude the word Son dont give me a laugh. Adam was son of God, according to bible all those who are lead by spirit of God are sons of God. THESE WORDS you have used are NOT THE sayings of Jesus. INfact this means that he was a godly person. one who believes in God. Abraham was son of God,. david was son of God. if u use the word son then BIBLE GOT SONS BY TONS. sorry Jesus is not claiming divinity anywhere.
@flexpape yes but the diffrence is they are referd to as a son of God Jesus is referd to as the son of God.they also refer to Jesus as lord they also refer to Jesus as the messiah. no other prophet or servant of god was called the messiah or knows as (The) son of God not (A) son of God But (The) Son of God. or the Word of God.nither wher they able to perform mirecles and none of them wher borne a vergin birth.Also Jesus was the one who could not be tempted byh the Devil.
@flexpape so if Jesus is Just a Prohpet. why wasn't Muhammed called the messiah why wasn't any other man or prophet the messiah.? why was jesus the onley one who was borne a of a vergin why was Jesus able to do mericles ? why was Jesus the onley one who could not be tempted by the devil ? why was Jesus able to ressorect the dead why was Jesus able to create life ? why wher no other prophets incliding muhammed able to do any of the things Jesus could do ? why was Jesus so speciel ?
@bfddanny1987 why ain't any other father of whole humans why only adam. Why Abraham is a friend of God but not others? Every prophet was given different attributes dude. We believe that he was a savior, a mercy from God and he will return to rule the world. And i am sorry to say NO other prophet has been reported to be tempted by Devil. We don;t give a shit to satan , he is nothing to Muslims just a lousy jinn. You guys have interpreted it as something who have godly power.
@flexpape also you say no othee prophet was tempted by the Devil muhammed was. Muhammed sind and needed forgivness. in other words he gave in to temptation into sin. so did the other prophets. Jesus did not give in to temptation. meaning the devil could not temp Jesus no matter how hard he tried. the point is God is the onley one who cannot be tempted Jesus could not be Tempted Because Jesus is God.
@bfddanny1987 Muhammad pbuh was innocent he was never tempted if you are referring to the article or book wrote by shulman rushdi then you should know that he used a very unauthenticated hadith compiled 300 years after prophet Death. Abraham never sinned. Lut never did bible contain shit about him but he was pure. Jerjis never sinned, Noah , Uzair, the people of kahaf, Idrees etc sinned???? peace be upon all of them . Every human prayed to God for his mercy so does Jesus peace be upon him.
@flexpape Surah 40:55" ask for forgivness for thy sin " thers your proof. what proof have you shown me so far ?
muhammad was not sinless meaning he gave in to temtation. Jesus Did not. muhammad is supposed to be your greatest prophet? also nice try for trying to avoid what i said. muhammad was a pedofile. he was also possesed by the Devil when he gave the prophoses and your telling me he did not give in to temptation open your eyes the quran is not the word of God far from it.
@flexpape also you said Jesus prayed for mercy you show me wher in the bible Jesus prays for mercy. he may pray for mercy for his followers and for other people but he does not pray for mercy for himself Because he was sinless and God would never punish his son. If Jesus was just a prophet why did he exist evan befor the world and unverse was created also do you know that the universe and earth was actually created through and for Jesus the word of God. not Because god needed it as in th quran
@flexpape Al Hijr >>39 (Iblis) said: "O my Lord! because Thou hast put me in the wrong, I will make (wrong) fair-seeming to them on the earth, and I will put them all in the wrong,-
40. "Except Thy servants among them, sincere and purified (by Thy Grace)."
verily those who are servants of God , satan can't tempt them. He is just a lousy bug who can tempt only bad people
@bfddanny1987 Jesus was not been able to split water in half like moses. Jesus hadn't have the miracle of camel like Prophet Saleh. Every prophet had diff attributes. Now resurrection is a problem. For he never died. IT WAS judah who was crucified that's why he yelled oh lord why have you forsaken me because he was the traitor. God punished the judah. Jesus was taken to heaven n he will return. Look at Prophet Uzair, he was resurrected after 100 years and now jews consider him as son of God wtf.
@bfddanny1987 Adam was most special , he aint got any father or mother. He should be son of God !!!! NO he aint , no one. Do you really think God will send his "son" to get crucified? God son can kill with the flick of his finger. But you are materializing God. Allah is not a human to have son. Then zeus is right he had sons to worship zeus then !!! . mate its all devil game. The antichrist followers using same trick over and over again. make saints and prophets son of God and bo to the ya.
@flexpape you still don't Get it the prophecies told by muhammed who said Jesus was never cricified was possesed by the devil. thats exactly what the devil wants you to think. Jesus was crucified and he was also ressurected there is historical and biblicle evidence for it. hundreds of eye witnesses saw Jesus die. and yes God did send his son but not to die His body died but he did not he sits on the throne in heaven as 1 with the father. if you believe the quran is the word of God you are crazy
@flexpape also to the first point you made saying ther is nothing that say Jesus is the son of god or God. maybe this will open your eyes. ISAIAH 9:6 "for to us a child is born,to us a son is given,and the government will be on his sholders. And he will be called the Wonderful Counceller,Mighty God,Everlasting father,prince of peace there will be no end.revolation 22:13 " I am the Alfa and the Omega the first and the last,the beggining and the end".
@bfddanny1987 "Jesus was crucified and he was also ressurected there is historical and biblicle evidence for it."
So, God sent Himself in the form of His son and was killed by His inferior creation in order for humans to reestablish a relationship with Him. Imagine a judge sentencing his son to death for someone else's crime. Jesus's teachings were sane, logical, and just. God killing Himself or His son or whoever for the sins of other is unjust. God is just.
@tadpoleposition Yes that's right well sort of when the son died for our sins he didn't die it was onley the body that died Jesus the son of God did not die. and he has now reterned to the father and is one with the father. Jesus has always been one with the father Jesus is the voice of the father the word of the father when Jesus was on earth the mind and sprit and the son Jesus worked as 1 in perfect unity together as one whole Almighty God. Jesus is a part of one God. He Always has being
@tadpoleposition there is not three Gods but three parts that make up 1 whole Almighty God. thers Gods mind=the father thers Gods spirit=the holy spirit and Gods voice= the son the word making 1 Almighty God Jesus is Gods voice the word. he always has been.God the father sent down his voice=the word the son and the word became man who was named Jesus when Jesus died he became once again the word or Voice of God. and he still 1 with the mind and spirit. as 1 Almighty God. onley the Body died.
@bfddanny1987 Listen, I can guarantee fellow Christians would refute your rambling. It's nonsensical. The trinity leaves you grasping at straws vainly attempting to explain what exactly it is and that's due to lack of Biblical clarity on the matter. God and Jesus are one according to you, yet when a simple verse like, "The Father is greater than I," is mentioned, you have no clear explanation. Why not leave Jesus and the Holy Spirit out of the equation and unify your worship for God alone?
@tadpoleposition No they would not the I have explained the trinaty is how the bible discruibes it. I know you may not Understand it But what I have said does make sence and it is true. the onley christians that may refute what i Have said are Jahovah's witnesses wich we do not class as a christian. yes other people or christians may have other ideas of what the trinity is but that's because they do not understand. cont
@tadploleposition and when you said Jesus says to the father you are greater than I thats because at the time as i have Explained Jesus was Onley a part of God. God the father and holy spirit are Greater Than God the son Because there is more of God in Heaven than on earth. thats why God the father is Greater Because there is more of the father still in Heaven. God the father is the mind and spirit of God wher as Jesus was Onley the Word thats why he is God the son But Still a part of God .
@bfddanny1987 So, a part of God is lesser than God but they're one in the same at the same time and the other two parts are greater than the other? You see what I mean? Listen, leave off the false worship of Jesus and the Holy Spirit and unify your worship for God alone without the extra parts.
@tadpoleposition yes thats write whats so hard to believe about is 2 not greater than 1 ? and when i said three diffrent parts I'm not saying they are distinctive parts I'm saying they are all 1 in the same Jesus is a part of God not a seprate part. you are made up of your mind body and soul made up of hundrads of difrent body parts Yet you are still one. and they all work together as 1 it was the same for God Jesus worked as one with the father because he is one with the father. Not sepratley
@tadpoleposition The Father is greater than the Son by office, but not by nature, since both are God. Just as an earthly father is equally human with, but holds a higher office than, his son, even so the Father and the Son in the Trinity are equal in essence, but different in function. Jesus is equal to the Father in essence, nature, and character, but the Father is greater than Jesus in function, office, and position. But are still one in the same.
When Jesus was worshiped, He never corrected His followers when they bowed down and worshiped Him. He never said, “Please, don’t worship me…only my Father should be worshiped.” Jesus considered such worship as perfectly appropriate. That Jesus is worshiped says a lot about His true identity, for it is the consistent testimony of Scripture that only God can be worshiped.
@bfddanny1987Jesus does not only accpeted being worshiped as well as He had authority to forgive sins, and the pharisees though that He was blaspheming God. Who eles had this authority ? Jesus has the same nature and essence of the Father, and God has not a physical form. He manifest Himself through His Creation as The Father of all of us and everything else, through His Holy Spirits and HeDID manifested Himself through His son Jesus Christ, His livingand Etenal Word.
@bfddanny1987 "The Father is greater than the Son by office..."
God is not a law firm. He is One without associates or partners. This whole "they're different, but equal, yet function differently, but are still one in the same" stuff is nonsensical. What is there to prove? The intellect's rejection of this concept is proof enough. Then you jump right into verses where Jesus was supposedly being worshipped. You're upholding a theology that isn't supported historically or textually.
@tadpoleposition wow thats a really strong argument. the stuff is nonsence? so tell me why this is nonsence ? saying it dose not make sence is not an argument tell me why it dosn't make sence. and what intellect rejection ? you have nothing to suport your rejection. again I'm waiting for you to show me how what I'm saying is wrong ? and you say ther no historical evidence for Jesus being woshiped the bible is your historical evidence. the bible was not made yesterday was it ?
@bfddanny1987 If saying it doesn't make sense isn't an argument, then what you're saying is Jesus could've gone on rambling nonsensically about something that not a single verse of the Bible nor a single Christian can clearly explain. Jesus is free from such a notion. Jesus' message was simple as he preached to illiterate fishermen and the like. The trinity is self-contradictory and anything self-contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect.
@tadpoleposition John 1:1 in the Beginning was the word and the word was with god,and the word was God, he was with God in the beginning. who do you think He is ? John is clearly talking about Jesus because as you know Jesus is the word of God. John 1:14 the Word=Jesus became flesh,and made his dwelling amung us. john 1:11 Holy Father, protect them in your name the name that you gave me,so that they may be one as we are one. Jesus was not from earth he was from heaven.
@bfddanny1987 John was written some 60 years after Jesus ascended by an anonymous author who wasn't an eyewitness to Jesus' life nor did he reference who he got his information from. It would be nice to know where the author got his information from, but before we do that, it's a must we find out who exactly the author is.
@tadpoleposition, Allah allowing man to choose freely and then creating some of them for Hell is self-contradictory and "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect" as your logic follows. You see the flaws in your logic? It depends on perception here, not understanding the Trinity is your problem, not Christians.
@LogosTheos "Allah allowing man to choose freely and then creating some of them for Hell is self-contradictory..."
If Allah somehow didn't possess the knowledge of who is or isn't going to hell, then we would be describing a false god. Why? Well, God is the All-Knower, His knowledge is all-encompassing.
@tadpoleposition, So how can you believe that Allah desires men to work righteousness (Sura 9:105) but creates some purposefully for Hell and leads them astray (Sura 7:178-179)? Isn't he refuting himself? Self-contradiction? Isn't this automatically rejected by the intellect? Or is it rational? And if so from what basis? Do you determine this from finite man or from the infinte knowledge Allah? As a man this is clearly a contradiction.
@tadpoleposition, It seems you cannot answer these questions by your own standard of reasoning. From a Christian perspective God has a nature that trancends our human intellect and we may perceive them as contradictions especially plurality + singularity. God having no beginning and no end is one such contradiction but does that make it irrational just because I can't understand? You would apply the same line of reasoning to Sura 9:105 and Sura 7:178-179 would'nt you?
@LogosTheos You don't seem to get it. With regards to God, anything is possible as long as those things maintain God's eternal and absolute status. You're stretching big time attempting to find a contradiction along these terms. But, when you say God became man and existed in the very elements He created, and even died, it's as flush a contradiction as you will find. The infinite becoming finite, the eternal becoming temporary, the All-Living becomes dead? What is that? It's a mystery.
@LogosTheos "You would apply the same line of reasoning to Sura 9:105 and Sura 7:178-179 would'nt you?"
That doesn't help you. Even if your argument was valid, which it's not even close, how does that solve the self-contradictory trinity? Surah 9:105 describes a scene on the Day of Judgment. Regarding Surah 7:178-179 , I ask you, what connection does Allah's infinite knowledge have with you? Do you think it means we're all hanging by strings and have no choice in any matter? That's desperation.
@tadpoleposition, Actually it does by exposing your inconsistency and hypocrisy, my point is human incomprehension does not negate the truths of a incomprehensible being. In one palm Allah wants man to perform righteousness and on the other palm he causes them to go astray, one implies freewill and the other doesn't. Allah having no beginning and no end is another incomprehensive contra for human logic.
@LogosTheos So, basically what you're saying is because what you perceive to be something contradictory is found in Islam, then the trinity is legitimized? The two are not the same. One is the Creator becomes creation, and the other is based on God's qualities and His wisdom. One is obviously nonsensical, and the other is explained by the knowledge of God.
@tadpoleposition, "God's very nature doesn't allow Him to, for example, become creation. It's self-contradictory."
Hold on...Are you admitting that Allah has a knowable nature by which man can measure? You don't even know your on islamic theology! Allah is absolute will! There is no nature or essence in Allah according to which he must act! Since Allah is a false God unknown to Jesus and the prophets of course he could'nt control the physics of his own universe by indwelling flesh.
@LogosTheos "Hold on...Are you admitting that Allah has a knowable nature by which man can measure?"
That's a ludicrous inference. My maintaining God's Supreme and Eternal (un-created) status, I am now able to measure His Sublime nature? Actually, Christians are guilty of what you charged me. My claiming God became man, Christians nullify God's immeasurable qualities and nature. Oh, not to mention, you believe He died.
@tadpoleposition, This whole discussion is centered around that statement you made, not around omniscience and freewill. I only used that to make a point that to a rational human point of view from the physics of this world this is self-contradictory, in order for you to be consistent you must condemn your god the same way you condemn the trinity on the same basis that ""anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect". YOU KNOW MY POINT, don't play it off...
@tadpoleposition, I am not contrasting the Christian and Islamic view of God, I was only pointing out your ignorance of tawhid. In Christianity God is knowable through Christ and therfore we can have an intimate relationship with him. Allah is unknowable and you cannot know if he is truly loving or unloving because he has no essence which means he variable, concepts like these are unknown to Judaism (Micah 5:2) and Chrisitianity (James 1:17) and are found in pagan philosophies like neo-platonism
@LogosTheos "Allah is unknowable and you cannot know if he is truly loving or unloving because he has no essence which means he variable, concepts like these are unknown to Judaism (Micah 5:2) and Chrisitianity (James 1:17) and are found in pagan philosophies like neo-platonism"
How can I intellectually refute something void of intellect?
@tadpoleposition, "So, basically what you're saying is because what you perceive to be something contradictory is found in Islam, then the trinity is legitimized?"
Not exactly, this is aimed at your inconsistent standards of reasoning, that if you "perceive" something contradictory about an incomprehensible aspect of God it must be false but by the same token I can flip it on you and say Allah is false since he leads astray those who he doesn't want to go astray.
@LogosTheos Again, before you falsely accuse me of breaking the revered commandments of debate, what in the world does God knowing everything have directly to do with the choices a human makes? Your failure to make that connection caused me to present a new angle to this discussion. One which you falsely perceived was going "Red Herring".
@tadpoleposition, It's called a "logical fallacy", you tried to avoid my previous rebuttals by posing a question to me in another arena of discussion.
"what in the world does God knowing everything have directly to do with the choices a human makes?"
The topic is based off your erroneous statement that "anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect". ALLAH wants man not to go astray but at the same time causes him to go astray. Is this not self-contradictory?
@LogosTheos "The topic is based off your erroneous statement that "anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect"."
Exactly! By interpretting what I said in an absolute sense, which, by the way, is a Christian's forte', i.e., extremism, you caused me to have to clarify what I meant with another example which you then played the Red Herring card and proclaimed utter destruction of Islam. Your argument lacked a crucial connection which you've failed to produce.
@tadpoleposition, This is why I stopped responding to you, you never refute anything and you love to play the semantic word puzzle games. Fine if you think that my arguments lack crucial connections then you're blinded by pride, any outside observer would see this as not so. But one thing you have failed to do during this whole exchange of words is to prove that you are not for double standards.
Leave that darkness of Islam and embrace the light of Christ...
@tadpoleposition, #2 - YOU SAID: " I ask you, what connection does Allah's infinite knowledge have with you?"
Why does Allah comprehend the complete meaning of suras and man cannot? Do you understand my implication? If I can't comprehend something that only God can fully comprehend does that make it false? How come you continue to play dumb with me? You already know my point is refute your statement "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect"
@LogosTheos "You already know my point is refute your statement "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect""
Are Christians known for taking statements in their absolute sense and not qualifying them? For example, when a Muslim argues God can't become human, the Christian replies "God is able to do all things". Without qualifying that statement, a Christian blasphemes. God's very nature doesn't allow Him to, for example, become creation. It's self-contradictory.
@tadpoleposition, You indirectly accepted your refutation by circumventing the topic by red herring. Thank you for your patient reading and discussion.
@LogosTheos "You indirectly accepted your refutation by circumventing the topic by red herring."
Oh no! A violation of the sacred code of conduct! You never proved the connection between the whole 100% Creator, 100% creation at the same time bit, and God's infinite knowledge and wisdom. The former nullifies God's supreme status, and the latter maintains it. Are all red herring users guilty of what you accused me? I digress.
@tadpoleposition you see the problem you have. is no matter what you have said to me so far I have stood and corrected your missunderstandings of Jesus and the bible. yet I have said the quran is not the true Word of God. I have also said muhammed was possesed when he told his prophosies I have also said muhammad was a pidofile.and Also said he is a fals prophet. you have dynied all of these but I can back up everything i have said. and the reson I can is Because its true.you cont
@tadpoleposition I have given you proof of everthing i have said so far and if i have not I can. yet everything i have said to you that is against the quran and prophet muhammad you have not had a stong argument against it. All you have done is denyed what I have said. when you denied what I said I have showen you profes and backed up what I have said you could not do the same.All you do is show me somthing in the bible what you think dispoves what I have said. But Does not.
Of course the followers will bow down to Jesus because Jesus IS God. he came down to Earth as human and flesh. So coming down in this form he was made man, and therefore he was known as the son of God because he was human. So when Jesus prayed to his father (God) he made it necessary that he was not praying to himself because he was in a different position and represented all human beings as a perfect, sinless man.
@Andy2542 yeas i Know that is what I am saying. Also Jesus did not tell them not to worship Him. Thats my argument, the followers would not bow down and worship Jesus if he was not God. for some reson people Believe that nowhere in the bible does it say Jesus is God and that Jesus did not claim be God. clearly they do no understand the bible or Jesus if they did they would no without a doubt that Jesus is God.
@Andy2542 "So when Jesus prayed to his father (God) he made it necessary that he was not praying to himself because he was in a different position..."
when God came down to earth he was made man. As man, he was born of a virgin to represent his uniqueness, he was named Jesus. So he was born as the son of mankind. So when he prayed to God he was behalf of all humans and prayed to the father of all.
@Andy2542 God was made man? Sorry, God's eternal qualities don't allow Him to assume a lesser position than the Eternal Creator. The Creator can't be creation and vice versa. It's not limiting God's ability, it's maintaining His Supreme status, otherwise we've basically defined a false god. One that is one minute Eternal and Almighty, and the next minute, subject to those elements He Himself created. It doesn't befit God that His Majesty becomes lowered in any way.
Well God can do anything he wants and that's something. So you are saying YOUR God can't do anything he wants and that's false so therefore your God is false to. May Jesus Christ one day bring peace upon you.
@Andy2542 ya we believe in same God as christians do. so when you call our God bad you call your as well. Allah in arabic, Elah in Arahmic, Eloh in hebrew. Dude grow up
actually no. Islam is a false religion and Satan is behind it. And We don't believe the same same God because we believe Jesus Christ is God, the lord and savior. And that The Father, the son ,and the holy spirit make up the one true God.
@tadpoleposition Yes sort of the body of Jesus died but Jesus didn't he has reterned to the father and is one with the father. and Yes God sent his onley son to die for us as a complete expression of his love for us. God loves us as he loves his own son Jesus. Jesus was the expression of his love. thats how much God loves all of us. yes evan you a none believer. God sent a part of himself the word wich became man wich has the tittle son of God and was named Jesus. Cont
@bfddanny1987 now adam is "THE" Son of God and he hadn't even got mother and father , both missing. Then he should be MORE son of God than Jesus (PBUH). Bro we all follow one God, one God. it was Church blaspheme. Jesus pointed out in the bible itself.
Here this is uploaded by a muslim but NOT made by a Muslim watch?v=ogXWwKcHPNc
@flextape if you new anything about paul you would realise that befor he was converted he was known as saul this is when he did not believe Jesus was the son of God. he later changes his name to Paul when he was converted. the conversion of Paul proves he later believed and accepted Jesus as the son Of God our lord and savior. so befor you tell me to read the bible correctly you read the bible correctly then come back untill then stop talking about somthing you know nothing about .
@flexpape LUKE 1:31 " You will be with chilld and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus,He will be Great and he will be called the son of the most high, Luke 1:35 the Angel answerd, " the holy spirit will come upon you,and the power of the most high will over power you, so the holy one who is to be born
@flexpape YOU ARE WRONG MY FRIEND U READ THE BIBLE THEN. Luke 2 : 31
When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying, heaven was opened and the holy sporit descended in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came down from heaven: "You are my son whom I love ; with you I am well pleased."
if you read BEFORE that it says Joseph THOUGHT OF . so after God claimed Jesus his only begotten son,Joseph thought f the other people he thought are the sons.
@Andy2542 lol do you know That NRSV of Bible have removed the word begotten saying that this is an interpolation , a fabrication, a concoction and they threw it out of bible? Because Begotten is one who begets. Are you making God a man?
@Andy2542 according to bible all those who are led by spirit of God are sons of God...... Further more John is a bible that has some close verses of Jesus saying that he is son of GOD but they never clearly says that he is son of God however other Gospels are entirely different and give a very different view of Jesus
well Adam can't have a father because he was the first man. If he had a father then he's not the first man. So there was circumstances that made it necessary for him not to have a father or mother because he's the first human being.
@pulman7 Jesus is not racist wher do you get that from ? Jesus loves everyone. your quran tells you to hate those who do not belive in islam and hate those against you. the bible teaches to love those who hate you and love those who are aganst you. we pray for people who is against us we love muslims we dont hate you nither does jesus he hates the fals religon not the person who teaches or believes it he loves and forgives can you say the same for allah ?
@izlamiztruth no Jesus did not die his body died not his spirit wich is the spirit of God and will never die that is why Jesus is eternal you believe that Jesus is the word of allah and the word of allah is eternal so that makes Jesus eternal you also believe that Jesus is the spirit of God if Jesus is the spirit of God then Is God spirit is the same as Jesus ? that would make Jesus God. am I wrong ?
we muslims never use such disrespect full words for jesus and we also belive in them as a prophet , but christan do for Mohammed s.a w.s no bodies is born with religion but the reality will feel with your affection can tell you that islam is the last choice so shut your mouth with ass hole beliefs .
@TheCutebarbieslover the poblem with that is you believe Jesus as a prophet that's why you don't disrespect him. Chistians believe that Jesus is the son of God. We Also believe that mohammed is a fals profit that is why we disrespect him. if you didn't believe Jesus was a prophet then you would show him the same disrespect. secondly as your mislim friend said Jesus is the word and spirit of God so god must also be the spirit of Jesus meaning they are the same spirit the same God. Jesus=God
@TheCutebarbieslover No Jesus has always existed he has always been one with the father. He is has Always been the word of God the world was created through Jesus and for Jesus. Hes always been at the side of the father since the begging of time.
non-Muslims ask how Muslims can blow themselves up & chop heads
Simple, Quran 8:12, I will cast terror into the hearts of those who do not believe in Allah
Muslims follow Muhammad. He insisted that his followers take a "pledge to death" Q 48:9 which says "those who pledge to die for Muhammad pledges to die for Allah."
Muhammad turned Arabia & Coptic Egypt into Islam through Terror Q 8:67 & Bukhari:V4B52N220
Muslims say Paul corrupted Jesus message and Bible....yet Paul died 67AD...Muhammad born 569AD...502 years after Paul died.
YET Quran 5:33 says when Allah said, "O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection
Muhammad said in Quran Jesus Followers SUPERIOR but Bible ALREADY created, Paul dead. DO MATH.
@00ismaeL0015:33 The recompense of those who wage war against Allâh and His Messenger and do mischief in the land is only that they shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off from the opposite sides, or be exiled from the land. That is their disgrace in this world, and a great torment is theirs in the Hereafter... .. UR MISQUOTING
AMEN
I love these people. I know this video is almost 3 years old but how could I get in contact with them. All these muslims in my school give me questions I find hard to answer, especially as a 16 year old
MrStefan135 2 weeks ago
muslims are not wise enough to give us the straight goods on their own diabolic belief system let alone to know anything about Jesus and Christianity....
GTCism 3 weeks ago
Mohammad was a pedophile and a raper it is a fact, everybody knows it but still muslims follow a criminous
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
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@alineferreirademello you said that mohammed was pedophile(sala allah aleihi wa salam)cause He married his first wife when she was 9 years .
Let's agree that a female can have sex at the age of consent Let us take a look at the age of consent
Did you know that this age in Canada 100 years ago was only 12 years, France 150 years ago was 13, England was 12 years old, Spain to end 1995 was 12 years and then became 13 to day this, let alone to 1400 years ago (information all from Google Wikipedia)
azzoumor 3 weeks ago
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@alineferreirademello Did you know that St. Joseph married Mrs. Mary when he was 90 years old while Mary did not exceed 12 years- this topic information is recognized by all Christian Almnaús-Do we have the right to say that St josef .was pedophile .Never cause islam interdit Lies and false accusations .i tell you more : in your book Jehoiachin King of Judah Married at the age of 10 years and he Can not have married a woman older than him. means his wife was about 9 or 8years.Read yr book frsT
azzoumor 3 weeks ago
Allah is a pathetical moon god of the arabs before mohammad,mohammad was just a psycho qith so mauch mental problems and probably the family that toke care of him abused him sexually that Aisha needed to use a plate ....
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello The moon god accusation as been debunked time and time again (YAWN). Also, it doesn't prove anything you believe. Unless you enjoy entertaining fallacious arguments.
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
@tadpoleposition so much you know... about the historical evidence of the pagan gods in short same pagan god... different name... same pagan worship
MrLoudmouthspeaker 1 month ago
@MrLoudmouthspeaker You're referring to the solstice cross, the Feast of Ishtar, Christmas, the trinity, the plurality of a god, his fatherhood and sonship?
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
@tadpoleposition You should know about the islamic trinity... or are you to ashamed to mention it
MrLoudmouthspeaker 1 month ago
@MrLoudmouthspeaker In other words, you're guilty as charged.
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
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@MrLoudmouthspeaker In other words, you're guilty as charged.
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
No MOhamad nor Allah wrote the shit book of quran, mohammad was a pedophile which couldnt write and Allah is just a leg and a leg can not write
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
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sam shamoun IS NOT REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY.... he knows that this religion is out of the right path!
the thing is that HE IS DOING HIS BEST IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FUNDS FOR HIS POCKET!
:-)
ASUSM2VMXSE 1 month ago
Christianity has already failed, what are these guys trying to prove? The bible has been changed by humans while the Quran is unchanged since 1400 years back. The bible has forgeries while the Quran is free from any defects. If you dont believe me read and to reserach on both books, if you really want the truth you will come to know. So these guys only have their own arguments to come with from their own minds, like every other christian. You always get a new response from christians...
zzaarrker 1 month ago
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@zzaarrker its a shame you dont know the truth about your religion
dadondutta 1 month ago
@zzaarrker quran was changed since Aisha when the goat ate part of it, after it was changed by the first kalifa,also it is changed everyday when translate it for christians countries, but the worse is, the quran is rubish with many mistakes because mohammad pedophile was a retard pedophile
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello Where is your evidence? You only comment to mock, well mock on with your ignorance. You´re only lying to your self.
zzaarrker 1 month ago
@zzaarrker Ignorant is you which dont know your religion, read a bit of hadiths and some history book instead to read only what the Mosque tells u to read, anyways u can try to insult me, never mind, what can i wait from someone which fallow a pedoiphile?
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello We´ll see who´s right or wrong... In the meantime you should read a bit about your own book, the bible. Dont come and tell me about hadith and history when you dont even know who wrote your "bible" (collection of 60 books). Jesus the messenger of God and no partnership with God and no one has. Prove to me that even 1 verse, 1 single verse in the new testament is from Jesus directly. Peace be upon him.
zzaarrker 1 month ago
@zzaarrker First
bible is not my book, i dindt wrote any of the bible books
2
before ask me any proof abt anything, why not u proof me that Mohammad, a pedophile, was really a prophet.. because the only place where we can find that he is prophet is the quran, and the quran is a big fat lie of mohammad the pedo
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@zzaarrker 3... according to muslims mohammad couldnt write, so honey, who wrote the quran? was not allah,was not mohmmad, who was? because the papers that aisha had the goat ate
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello The Quran doesn't need to be in book form. Millions upon millions of Muslims have memorized the Quran. That's the point you care not to entertain for good reason. That whole "papers the goat ate" is about as flimsy as Matthew being the author of Matthew. Do you use the logical fallacy to try and sweep the anonymity of Biblical authorship under the rug? The Quran could've gone unwritten and still maintained its authenticity. Avoiding our oral tradition is sheer ignorance.
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
@tadpoleposition why the quran doent need to be a book if this shit of word means book? what the hell abt Mathew? u talk aloy abt fallacy but nothing of what u talk make sense.. i will ask again a simple question, who the hell wrote the shit quran? millions and millions of people memorized this shit? u know what it proof? that mohammad nor allah wrote this shit
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello Also, character assassination of the Prophet Muhammad (salla allahu alaihi wa sallam) shows just how desperate you really are. Peace!
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
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@zzaarrker : You said: "Prove to me that even 1 verse, 1 single verse in the new testament is from Jesus directly. "
--
That is just a red hearing since christians are NOT BIBLIOLATRES like MUHAMMADANS. The bible is a collection of traditions, lettres, witness etc - every christian understands that and by the way - I'm an atheist.
januk36 2 weeks ago
@zzaarrker islam is a joke just know that. The quran contradicts itself and has scientific errors. Its surely not the words from God. Just like what every other muslim say "The Bible has been changed by humans" I love it when you infidels say that, it proves your fools, The quran is ambiguous is purely false. Your false prophet had 9 wives and 1 of them were 9 years old. That is normal in islam, thats why you people can have 4 wives at a time. Thats Bigamy.
You bunch of animals
haahaha
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 YOur a idiot. u have no education on islam. based on ur comment ur very uneducated
naznab111 1 week ago
@naznab111 im uneducated?
rephrase yourself kid
Get a life
and go and suck your prophet muhammad
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 Huh kid? Plz ur words r of uneducated ppl. U dont know shit champ. Ur just a dum blind 16 year old. u dont know nothing bout ur religion so dont comment on islam kid. Uneducated is a understatement. If u were really educated u would engage in proper dialogue.
naznab111 1 week ago
@naznab111 Your a fool islam is a stupid religion full of terrorists, just shut your mouth, your a kid, u cant even spell dum, its "dumb"
Whos the fool
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 Wow how smart u are. Able to spell Dumb. Super smart my friend. Listen, U christians always have something negative to say but do not know how to back it up. If u wanna say something back it up and show me how smart u r. Otherwise just shut up coz u look stupid. U dont want to get owned by a "kid" now do u
naznab111 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 1)Prof Yoshihide Kozai 2)Prof T.V.N Persaud 3)Prof William W Hey
4)Prof E Marshall Johnson 5)Prof Gerald Goeringer 6)Prof Keith Moore 7)Prof Joe Simpson 8)Prof Alfred Kroner 9)Dr Maurice Bucaille..All these scientist confirm wat the quran says is true.
-Were does the bible say it is forbidden to marry more than 1 wife?no where.Jesus didnt marry so y dont u follow christianity & not get married.
-Who cares if he married a 9 yr old. Y do u judge sum1 1400yrs ago by todays morals?
naznab111 1 week ago
@naznab111 "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced from her husband commits adultery" (Luke 16:18)
So obviously it shows that Christians should not re-marry.
Who cares about what scientists say? What do they know about God?
Only God can judge what religion has truth and indeed it's Christianity as they are the worlds biggest population and has most followers, because it makes sense.
SIMPLE!
ISLAM=MYTH
CHRISTIANITY=TRUTH 100%!!!!!!!
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 Christianity is the largest but islam is the fastest growing.U can have more than 1 wife n should not divorce them. its obvious divorce is wrong. divorce is high amongst the christians.There are many ppl in the bible with multiple wives but the bible didnt forbid it. Majority of these scientist converted to islam bcoz a 1400yr old book assisted science. let me ask u. If ur a true follower of jesus and jesus didnt get married than WHY do christians marry? thats not following christ
naznab111 1 week ago
@naznab111 You speak like a kid. Jesus was perfect, does it mean we should be perfect? No because every human is a sinner. The Bible teaches us to Worship the Lord Jesus Christ. Why does your religion depend on Science? Science proves nothing, it cannot proof to you what religion you should be in. The only reason why Islam is the fastest growing religion is because you have a lot a kids (cos you have like 4 wives) and you bring them up to Islam, but is Christians SPREAD the word. WE R LEADERS!!!
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 We dont depend on science at all. it is just another proof that islam is from god that a 1400yr old book has advanced science in it at a time when no technology existed. u cant accept that tho. Islam has the highest CONVERT Rates, yes we have high birth, but we have the highest converts. its a fact! Were does the bible say to worship jesus?LOL u cant translate hebrew to english n expect the same meaning. Y pray to jesu wen jesus himself prayed to ONE god. ur not a follower of jesus
naznab111 1 week ago
@naznab111 You are really lost, may God help you. I hope you have a vision of Jesus one day so you can seek truth. Do you know the meaning of the name Jesus? It means salvation and even his other name which is Immanuel means God with us. The truth is not islam, I promise it. If you reject Jesus, he will reject you.
PEACE
MrStefan135 1 week ago
@MrStefan135 If u think im lost then prove it to me. I follow jesus more than u do without any doubt. Muslims love n accept jesus as a prophet. He was the light, way n truth. just like moses was n abraham etc. do not translate hebrew into arabic bcoz u can never ever do it justice n would lose its meaning. "God with us" meaning god sent him with a msg n he spoke from wat god commanded. Just like jesus done, muslims pray to 1 god, the first commandment. ISlam is the truth and there is no doubt.
naznab111 1 week ago
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sam shamoun IS NOT REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT CHRISTIANITY.... he knows that this religion is out of the right path!
the thing is that HE IS DOING HIS BEST IN ORDER TO CONTINUE THE FUNDS FOR HIS POCKET!
:-)
ASUSM2VMXSE 2 months ago
Jesus u akbar !!!
ChristelijkOrthodox 2 months ago
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@ChristelijkOrthodox "Jesus u akbar !!!"
John 14:28, Jesus said, "...for the Father is greater than I,..." Umm, what'd you say?
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
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why are muslims so confused
bestinfadel 2 months ago
Long time ago, I also have a confusion about Trinity. But I prayed and asked God directly. You can do the same thing like I did. God surely answer you.
The simplest example is the two persons who cooperate together to run business, they are "one company" but "two person."
In Hindusim, one god can fight against other god, there are no unity, that's why we can categorize it into polytheist... Trinity is monotheist.
pengendownload 2 months ago
@pengendownload
Hi there. I too was confused abt tht. Also remember even this is only an approximation to the triune natur of God coz humanS even whilst running a company r NEVER IN COMPLETE harmony. infact our own "persons" within ourselves e.g. spirit, soul and heart are oftennot in 100% harmony. ANOTHER example one cld give is tht of Mr. Smith in the movie, Matrix. He is numerous persons in different locations BUT ONE PROGRAM/ESSENCE. This IMU comes even closer BUT YET isnt perfect...
jonnykzj 2 months ago
...though the example demonstrates that all the persons have ONE MIND AND ONE GOAL. But their roles are different and the status is also different WHILST AT THE SAME time all this being willingly done by all persons. Regarding the son being ETERNALLY begotten even the early Church fathers gave a marvellous example. that is the sun and it's rays where the sun gives the allegory of the Father and the rays of the son. There was never a time when the sun was without rays or vice versa...
jonnykzj 2 months ago
...EVEN if u read modern cosmology on how a star or sun is formed ULL FIND tht long before THE REACTING CLOUD IS DEFINED AS A STAR it is alredy sending of rays Albeit in infrared. By the time it is defined as a star orsun THE RAYS R ALSO DEFINED AS SUCH n r visible light. BUT EVEN on the nuclear level i.e. if we take particles like quarks(who never exist alone) and electrons AS SOON AS THEYRE FORMED, GRAVITONS N OTHER particles n virtual photons r SIMULATANEOUSLY RADIATING FROM THEM such tht...
jonnykzj 2 months ago
...AGAIN there is no time when even these particles were without their "begotten" radiated particles/rays.
jonnykzj 2 months ago
@pengendownload
ALSO i forgot to point out that human beings are not only different persons BUT ALSO DIFFERENT BEINGS IN SUCH THT WE ALSO do not share the same essence. Even twins and conjoined twins do not perfectly share the same essence. Thats why i used the example from the matrix which i think appx it better.
jonnykzj 2 months ago
This muslim shik is ignorant and I can't believe people listen to this Moran where he go to school at ? Never never land haaha
jomahajjat 2 months ago
allah = satan = wo hates israel
God = The True One = The One who Loves Israel
Jesus = The Christ = The Living and Eternal Word of God who came in flesh
Muhammed = a violent pig
humbleman9 2 months ago
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@humbleman9 "allah = satan = wo hates israel
God = The True One = The One who Loves Israel
Jesus = The Christ = The Living and Eternal Word of God who came in flesh
Muhammed = a violent pig"
That is the single most awesomely ignorant comment of all time. #1 without a shadow of a doubt.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@ABYARE bro we are being fooled by Church. When Prophets in bible got tempted by Satan then why not Church. Why Church was so holy. They were the one who tried to kill Jesus pbuh. Church was responsible for Killings OF Million Muslim and Christians altogether in Crusades. In dark ages etc !!!!
flexpape 2 months ago
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GOD CAME AS A HUMAN THAT WE ALL COULD BE SAVED AND BE HIS TRUE FAMILY!
AND IT IS NOT SIMPLE! YOU JUST DENY SOMETHING THAT YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO UNDERSTAND
JOHN 10:30
"Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a man is the antichrist--he denies the Father and the Son."- 1 JOHN 2:22
2 John 1:7 Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.
JezusSlave 3 months ago
May Allah Guide these brothers.
Amatullah83 3 months ago
@Amatullah83 May Jesus Guide you my friend
bfddanny1987 2 months ago
The Sheikh spent more time attacking them than he did answering the questions...for which he stumbled, stuttered and really had no answer for and in actual fact, he proved Christianity right by contradicting himself time and time again... Thank God I'm Catholic. Thank God Almighty that Christianity came to this world. Praise God. Jesus saves! Thank you Jesus!!! I long for the moment I can meet you, I know then that I can finally rest. Gobless you all.
SublimeShooterGamer 3 months ago
@izlamiztruth see you keep saying he lies but you never prove he is lying he always quotes from the quran and he always answers you honestly so how is sam lying exactly please tell me ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@pulman7 you Just proved Jesus is God. Because as you said Jesus is the word of God and you believe that the word of God is eternal no man or prophet is eternal exept God so if Jesus is the word of God and the word of God is eternal that means Jesus is eternal meaning Jesus must be God.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 you vulgar lair stray sheep
your bible is full of hate and blood and racist
even Ask Chines why they banned it !
and nothing in Quran about what you bark about son of sicko stray sheep
pulman7 3 months ago
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@pulman7 you see you don't even know your own qu'ran yes there is. also prophet mohammad is a pedofile. he married a six year old girl and had sex with her at 9 years old he killed thousands of people.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 THE First verse of genesis is not red letter bible mate it is said that that verse was said by some jewish pope a century before Jesus peace be upon him himself.
flexpape 3 months ago
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pulman7 3 months ago
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@bfddanny1987 no i didnt stray sheep
who is said the word of God is eternal ?
God sent 137 holly book and they have been twisted
or the Lang of it no one speak it now
for example Moses was speak Smartin and the real Torah by sumartin
and the real christ son of Merry was speak Aramaic and the real Gospel to
pulman7 3 months ago
@ABYARE Jesus was not a man he was God in the image of man in a human body also he was not the son of man he was the son of God.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 nowhere in bible it is written that he was son of God mate. Go read Bible correctly. Even paul letters and Jesus family bible confirms that he was " servant " of God not son of God.
flexpape 3 months ago
@flexpape John 1:49 then Nathaneal declared, " rabi you are the son of God, you are the king of Israel." then Jesus said. " you belive me because i saw you under the fig tree, you shall see greater things than that he added." I think you need to read the bible mate, because you clearly know nothing of the bible i have just shown you wher the bible says jesus is the son of God. as for paul he did not believe that Jesus was the son of God at first but he later converted to christianity.cont
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 lmFAO. Dude the word Son dont give me a laugh. Adam was son of God, according to bible all those who are lead by spirit of God are sons of God. THESE WORDS you have used are NOT THE sayings of Jesus. INfact this means that he was a godly person. one who believes in God. Abraham was son of God,. david was son of God. if u use the word son then BIBLE GOT SONS BY TONS. sorry Jesus is not claiming divinity anywhere.
flexpape 3 months ago
@flexpape yes but the diffrence is they are referd to as a son of God Jesus is referd to as the son of God.they also refer to Jesus as lord they also refer to Jesus as the messiah. no other prophet or servant of god was called the messiah or knows as (The) son of God not (A) son of God But (The) Son of God. or the Word of God.nither wher they able to perform mirecles and none of them wher borne a vergin birth.Also Jesus was the one who could not be tempted byh the Devil.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@Nathaneal did not say "you are a son of God." he says again and i quote. "you are (The) son of God the king of Israel".
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 we believe that jesus is messiah but we don't believe he is son of God.
First give the authenticity of bible. NRSV has taken out all trinity major verses and words do you know that?
Genesis 6:2 and 4)
"...Thus saith the Lord, Israel is MY SON even my FIRSTBORN." - Exodux 4:22
"Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the (THE lol) SON OF GOD." - Luke 3:38
".and Ephraim is my FIRSTBORN." - Jeremiah 31:9
They are all sons of God
flexpape 3 months ago
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@flexpape Do you Believe Jesus is the Word of Allah ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape so if Jesus is Just a Prohpet. why wasn't Muhammed called the messiah why wasn't any other man or prophet the messiah.? why was jesus the onley one who was borne a of a vergin why was Jesus able to do mericles ? why was Jesus the onley one who could not be tempted by the devil ? why was Jesus able to ressorect the dead why was Jesus able to create life ? why wher no other prophets incliding muhammed able to do any of the things Jesus could do ? why was Jesus so speciel ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 why ain't any other father of whole humans why only adam. Why Abraham is a friend of God but not others? Every prophet was given different attributes dude. We believe that he was a savior, a mercy from God and he will return to rule the world. And i am sorry to say NO other prophet has been reported to be tempted by Devil. We don;t give a shit to satan , he is nothing to Muslims just a lousy jinn. You guys have interpreted it as something who have godly power.
flexpape 3 months ago
@flexpape also you say no othee prophet was tempted by the Devil muhammed was. Muhammed sind and needed forgivness. in other words he gave in to temptation into sin. so did the other prophets. Jesus did not give in to temptation. meaning the devil could not temp Jesus no matter how hard he tried. the point is God is the onley one who cannot be tempted Jesus could not be Tempted Because Jesus is God.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 Muhammad pbuh was innocent he was never tempted if you are referring to the article or book wrote by shulman rushdi then you should know that he used a very unauthenticated hadith compiled 300 years after prophet Death. Abraham never sinned. Lut never did bible contain shit about him but he was pure. Jerjis never sinned, Noah , Uzair, the people of kahaf, Idrees etc sinned???? peace be upon all of them . Every human prayed to God for his mercy so does Jesus peace be upon him.
flexpape 3 months ago
@flexpape Surah 40:55" ask for forgivness for thy sin " thers your proof. what proof have you shown me so far ?
muhammad was not sinless meaning he gave in to temtation. Jesus Did not. muhammad is supposed to be your greatest prophet? also nice try for trying to avoid what i said. muhammad was a pedofile. he was also possesed by the Devil when he gave the prophoses and your telling me he did not give in to temptation open your eyes the quran is not the word of God far from it.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape also you said Jesus prayed for mercy you show me wher in the bible Jesus prays for mercy. he may pray for mercy for his followers and for other people but he does not pray for mercy for himself Because he was sinless and God would never punish his son. If Jesus was just a prophet why did he exist evan befor the world and unverse was created also do you know that the universe and earth was actually created through and for Jesus the word of God. not Because god needed it as in th quran
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape Al Hijr >>39 (Iblis) said: "O my Lord! because Thou hast put me in the wrong, I will make (wrong) fair-seeming to them on the earth, and I will put them all in the wrong,-
40. "Except Thy servants among them, sincere and purified (by Thy Grace)."
verily those who are servants of God , satan can't tempt them. He is just a lousy bug who can tempt only bad people
flexpape 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 Jesus was not been able to split water in half like moses. Jesus hadn't have the miracle of camel like Prophet Saleh. Every prophet had diff attributes. Now resurrection is a problem. For he never died. IT WAS judah who was crucified that's why he yelled oh lord why have you forsaken me because he was the traitor. God punished the judah. Jesus was taken to heaven n he will return. Look at Prophet Uzair, he was resurrected after 100 years and now jews consider him as son of God wtf.
flexpape 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 Adam was most special , he aint got any father or mother. He should be son of God !!!! NO he aint , no one. Do you really think God will send his "son" to get crucified? God son can kill with the flick of his finger. But you are materializing God. Allah is not a human to have son. Then zeus is right he had sons to worship zeus then !!! . mate its all devil game. The antichrist followers using same trick over and over again. make saints and prophets son of God and bo to the ya.
flexpape 3 months ago
@flexpape you still don't Get it the prophecies told by muhammed who said Jesus was never cricified was possesed by the devil. thats exactly what the devil wants you to think. Jesus was crucified and he was also ressurected there is historical and biblicle evidence for it. hundreds of eye witnesses saw Jesus die. and yes God did send his son but not to die His body died but he did not he sits on the throne in heaven as 1 with the father. if you believe the quran is the word of God you are crazy
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape also to the first point you made saying ther is nothing that say Jesus is the son of god or God. maybe this will open your eyes. ISAIAH 9:6 "for to us a child is born,to us a son is given,and the government will be on his sholders. And he will be called the Wonderful Counceller,Mighty God,Everlasting father,prince of peace there will be no end.revolation 22:13 " I am the Alfa and the Omega the first and the last,the beggining and the end".
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 "Jesus was crucified and he was also ressurected there is historical and biblicle evidence for it."
So, God sent Himself in the form of His son and was killed by His inferior creation in order for humans to reestablish a relationship with Him. Imagine a judge sentencing his son to death for someone else's crime. Jesus's teachings were sane, logical, and just. God killing Himself or His son or whoever for the sins of other is unjust. God is just.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition Yes that's right well sort of when the son died for our sins he didn't die it was onley the body that died Jesus the son of God did not die. and he has now reterned to the father and is one with the father. Jesus has always been one with the father Jesus is the voice of the father the word of the father when Jesus was on earth the mind and sprit and the son Jesus worked as 1 in perfect unity together as one whole Almighty God. Jesus is a part of one God. He Always has being
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition there is not three Gods but three parts that make up 1 whole Almighty God. thers Gods mind=the father thers Gods spirit=the holy spirit and Gods voice= the son the word making 1 Almighty God Jesus is Gods voice the word. he always has been.God the father sent down his voice=the word the son and the word became man who was named Jesus when Jesus died he became once again the word or Voice of God. and he still 1 with the mind and spirit. as 1 Almighty God. onley the Body died.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 Listen, I can guarantee fellow Christians would refute your rambling. It's nonsensical. The trinity leaves you grasping at straws vainly attempting to explain what exactly it is and that's due to lack of Biblical clarity on the matter. God and Jesus are one according to you, yet when a simple verse like, "The Father is greater than I," is mentioned, you have no clear explanation. Why not leave Jesus and the Holy Spirit out of the equation and unify your worship for God alone?
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition No they would not the I have explained the trinaty is how the bible discruibes it. I know you may not Understand it But what I have said does make sence and it is true. the onley christians that may refute what i Have said are Jahovah's witnesses wich we do not class as a christian. yes other people or christians may have other ideas of what the trinity is but that's because they do not understand. cont
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@tadploleposition and when you said Jesus says to the father you are greater than I thats because at the time as i have Explained Jesus was Onley a part of God. God the father and holy spirit are Greater Than God the son Because there is more of God in Heaven than on earth. thats why God the father is Greater Because there is more of the father still in Heaven. God the father is the mind and spirit of God wher as Jesus was Onley the Word thats why he is God the son But Still a part of God .
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 So, a part of God is lesser than God but they're one in the same at the same time and the other two parts are greater than the other? You see what I mean? Listen, leave off the false worship of Jesus and the Holy Spirit and unify your worship for God alone without the extra parts.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition yes thats write whats so hard to believe about is 2 not greater than 1 ? and when i said three diffrent parts I'm not saying they are distinctive parts I'm saying they are all 1 in the same Jesus is a part of God not a seprate part. you are made up of your mind body and soul made up of hundrads of difrent body parts Yet you are still one. and they all work together as 1 it was the same for God Jesus worked as one with the father because he is one with the father. Not sepratley
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 "I'm saying they are all 1 in the same..."
"The Father is greater than I." Jesus just refuted you.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition The Father is greater than the Son by office, but not by nature, since both are God. Just as an earthly father is equally human with, but holds a higher office than, his son, even so the Father and the Son in the Trinity are equal in essence, but different in function. Jesus is equal to the Father in essence, nature, and character, but the Father is greater than Jesus in function, office, and position. But are still one in the same.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
When Jesus was worshiped, He never corrected His followers when they bowed down and worshiped Him. He never said, “Please, don’t worship me…only my Father should be worshiped.” Jesus considered such worship as perfectly appropriate. That Jesus is worshiped says a lot about His true identity, for it is the consistent testimony of Scripture that only God can be worshiped.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987Jesus does not only accpeted being worshiped as well as He had authority to forgive sins, and the pharisees though that He was blaspheming God. Who eles had this authority ? Jesus has the same nature and essence of the Father, and God has not a physical form. He manifest Himself through His Creation as The Father of all of us and everything else, through His Holy Spirits and HeDID manifested Himself through His son Jesus Christ, His livingand Etenal Word.
humbleman9 2 months ago
@bfddanny1987 "The Father is greater than the Son by office..."
God is not a law firm. He is One without associates or partners. This whole "they're different, but equal, yet function differently, but are still one in the same" stuff is nonsensical. What is there to prove? The intellect's rejection of this concept is proof enough. Then you jump right into verses where Jesus was supposedly being worshipped. You're upholding a theology that isn't supported historically or textually.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition wow thats a really strong argument. the stuff is nonsence? so tell me why this is nonsence ? saying it dose not make sence is not an argument tell me why it dosn't make sence. and what intellect rejection ? you have nothing to suport your rejection. again I'm waiting for you to show me how what I'm saying is wrong ? and you say ther no historical evidence for Jesus being woshiped the bible is your historical evidence. the bible was not made yesterday was it ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 If saying it doesn't make sense isn't an argument, then what you're saying is Jesus could've gone on rambling nonsensically about something that not a single verse of the Bible nor a single Christian can clearly explain. Jesus is free from such a notion. Jesus' message was simple as he preached to illiterate fishermen and the like. The trinity is self-contradictory and anything self-contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition John 1:1 in the Beginning was the word and the word was with god,and the word was God, he was with God in the beginning. who do you think He is ? John is clearly talking about Jesus because as you know Jesus is the word of God. John 1:14 the Word=Jesus became flesh,and made his dwelling amung us. john 1:11 Holy Father, protect them in your name the name that you gave me,so that they may be one as we are one. Jesus was not from earth he was from heaven.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 John was written some 60 years after Jesus ascended by an anonymous author who wasn't an eyewitness to Jesus' life nor did he reference who he got his information from. It would be nice to know where the author got his information from, but before we do that, it's a must we find out who exactly the author is.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition, Allah allowing man to choose freely and then creating some of them for Hell is self-contradictory and "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect" as your logic follows. You see the flaws in your logic? It depends on perception here, not understanding the Trinity is your problem, not Christians.
LogosTheos 3 months ago
@LogosTheos "Allah allowing man to choose freely and then creating some of them for Hell is self-contradictory..."
If Allah somehow didn't possess the knowledge of who is or isn't going to hell, then we would be describing a false god. Why? Well, God is the All-Knower, His knowledge is all-encompassing.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition, So how can you believe that Allah desires men to work righteousness (Sura 9:105) but creates some purposefully for Hell and leads them astray (Sura 7:178-179)? Isn't he refuting himself? Self-contradiction? Isn't this automatically rejected by the intellect? Or is it rational? And if so from what basis? Do you determine this from finite man or from the infinte knowledge Allah? As a man this is clearly a contradiction.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "As a man this is clearly a contradiction."
Good thing we know the eternal and absolute qualities of the Creator.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, It seems you cannot answer these questions by your own standard of reasoning. From a Christian perspective God has a nature that trancends our human intellect and we may perceive them as contradictions especially plurality + singularity. God having no beginning and no end is one such contradiction but does that make it irrational just because I can't understand? You would apply the same line of reasoning to Sura 9:105 and Sura 7:178-179 would'nt you?
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos You don't seem to get it. With regards to God, anything is possible as long as those things maintain God's eternal and absolute status. You're stretching big time attempting to find a contradiction along these terms. But, when you say God became man and existed in the very elements He created, and even died, it's as flush a contradiction as you will find. The infinite becoming finite, the eternal becoming temporary, the All-Living becomes dead? What is that? It's a mystery.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "You would apply the same line of reasoning to Sura 9:105 and Sura 7:178-179 would'nt you?"
That doesn't help you. Even if your argument was valid, which it's not even close, how does that solve the self-contradictory trinity? Surah 9:105 describes a scene on the Day of Judgment. Regarding Surah 7:178-179 , I ask you, what connection does Allah's infinite knowledge have with you? Do you think it means we're all hanging by strings and have no choice in any matter? That's desperation.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, Actually it does by exposing your inconsistency and hypocrisy, my point is human incomprehension does not negate the truths of a incomprehensible being. In one palm Allah wants man to perform righteousness and on the other palm he causes them to go astray, one implies freewill and the other doesn't. Allah having no beginning and no end is another incomprehensive contra for human logic.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos So, basically what you're saying is because what you perceive to be something contradictory is found in Islam, then the trinity is legitimized? The two are not the same. One is the Creator becomes creation, and the other is based on God's qualities and His wisdom. One is obviously nonsensical, and the other is explained by the knowledge of God.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, "God's very nature doesn't allow Him to, for example, become creation. It's self-contradictory."
Hold on...Are you admitting that Allah has a knowable nature by which man can measure? You don't even know your on islamic theology! Allah is absolute will! There is no nature or essence in Allah according to which he must act! Since Allah is a false God unknown to Jesus and the prophets of course he could'nt control the physics of his own universe by indwelling flesh.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "Hold on...Are you admitting that Allah has a knowable nature by which man can measure?"
That's a ludicrous inference. My maintaining God's Supreme and Eternal (un-created) status, I am now able to measure His Sublime nature? Actually, Christians are guilty of what you charged me. My claiming God became man, Christians nullify God's immeasurable qualities and nature. Oh, not to mention, you believe He died.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, This whole discussion is centered around that statement you made, not around omniscience and freewill. I only used that to make a point that to a rational human point of view from the physics of this world this is self-contradictory, in order for you to be consistent you must condemn your god the same way you condemn the trinity on the same basis that ""anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect". YOU KNOW MY POINT, don't play it off...
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, I am not contrasting the Christian and Islamic view of God, I was only pointing out your ignorance of tawhid. In Christianity God is knowable through Christ and therfore we can have an intimate relationship with him. Allah is unknowable and you cannot know if he is truly loving or unloving because he has no essence which means he variable, concepts like these are unknown to Judaism (Micah 5:2) and Chrisitianity (James 1:17) and are found in pagan philosophies like neo-platonism
LogosTheos 2 months ago
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@LogosTheos "Allah is unknowable and you cannot know if he is truly loving or unloving because he has no essence which means he variable, concepts like these are unknown to Judaism (Micah 5:2) and Chrisitianity (James 1:17) and are found in pagan philosophies like neo-platonism"
How can I intellectually refute something void of intellect?
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition gosh u believe allah is a leg and mohammad pedophile is his prophrt and to fuck a mellon is ok, dirty religion
alineferreirademello 1 month ago
@alineferreirademello I used to think an eternity in Hell was too harsh a punishment. Thanks to dopes like you, I'm now convinced it's appropriate.
tadpoleposition 1 month ago
@tadpoleposition, "So, basically what you're saying is because what you perceive to be something contradictory is found in Islam, then the trinity is legitimized?"
Not exactly, this is aimed at your inconsistent standards of reasoning, that if you "perceive" something contradictory about an incomprehensible aspect of God it must be false but by the same token I can flip it on you and say Allah is false since he leads astray those who he doesn't want to go astray.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos Again, before you falsely accuse me of breaking the revered commandments of debate, what in the world does God knowing everything have directly to do with the choices a human makes? Your failure to make that connection caused me to present a new angle to this discussion. One which you falsely perceived was going "Red Herring".
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, It's called a "logical fallacy", you tried to avoid my previous rebuttals by posing a question to me in another arena of discussion.
"what in the world does God knowing everything have directly to do with the choices a human makes?"
The topic is based off your erroneous statement that "anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect". ALLAH wants man not to go astray but at the same time causes him to go astray. Is this not self-contradictory?
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "The topic is based off your erroneous statement that "anything self-contradictory is rejected by the intellect"."
Exactly! By interpretting what I said in an absolute sense, which, by the way, is a Christian's forte', i.e., extremism, you caused me to have to clarify what I meant with another example which you then played the Red Herring card and proclaimed utter destruction of Islam. Your argument lacked a crucial connection which you've failed to produce.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, This is why I stopped responding to you, you never refute anything and you love to play the semantic word puzzle games. Fine if you think that my arguments lack crucial connections then you're blinded by pride, any outside observer would see this as not so. But one thing you have failed to do during this whole exchange of words is to prove that you are not for double standards.
Leave that darkness of Islam and embrace the light of Christ...
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos That's you throwing in the proverbial towel.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, #2 - YOU SAID: " I ask you, what connection does Allah's infinite knowledge have with you?"
Why does Allah comprehend the complete meaning of suras and man cannot? Do you understand my implication? If I can't comprehend something that only God can fully comprehend does that make it false? How come you continue to play dumb with me? You already know my point is refute your statement "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect"
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "You already know my point is refute your statement "anything self contradictory is automatically rejected by the intellect""
Are Christians known for taking statements in their absolute sense and not qualifying them? For example, when a Muslim argues God can't become human, the Christian replies "God is able to do all things". Without qualifying that statement, a Christian blasphemes. God's very nature doesn't allow Him to, for example, become creation. It's self-contradictory.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition, You indirectly accepted your refutation by circumventing the topic by red herring. Thank you for your patient reading and discussion.
LogosTheos 2 months ago
@LogosTheos ...
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@LogosTheos "You indirectly accepted your refutation by circumventing the topic by red herring."
Oh no! A violation of the sacred code of conduct! You never proved the connection between the whole 100% Creator, 100% creation at the same time bit, and God's infinite knowledge and wisdom. The former nullifies God's supreme status, and the latter maintains it. Are all red herring users guilty of what you accused me? I digress.
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition you see the problem you have. is no matter what you have said to me so far I have stood and corrected your missunderstandings of Jesus and the bible. yet I have said the quran is not the true Word of God. I have also said muhammed was possesed when he told his prophosies I have also said muhammad was a pidofile.and Also said he is a fals prophet. you have dynied all of these but I can back up everything i have said. and the reson I can is Because its true.you cont
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition I have given you proof of everthing i have said so far and if i have not I can. yet everything i have said to you that is against the quran and prophet muhammad you have not had a stong argument against it. All you have done is denyed what I have said. when you denied what I said I have showen you profes and backed up what I have said you could not do the same.All you do is show me somthing in the bible what you think dispoves what I have said. But Does not.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987
Of course the followers will bow down to Jesus because Jesus IS God. he came down to Earth as human and flesh. So coming down in this form he was made man, and therefore he was known as the son of God because he was human. So when Jesus prayed to his father (God) he made it necessary that he was not praying to himself because he was in a different position and represented all human beings as a perfect, sinless man.
Andy2542 3 months ago
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@Andy2542 yeas i Know that is what I am saying. Also Jesus did not tell them not to worship Him. Thats my argument, the followers would not bow down and worship Jesus if he was not God. for some reson people Believe that nowhere in the bible does it say Jesus is God and that Jesus did not claim be God. clearly they do no understand the bible or Jesus if they did they would no without a doubt that Jesus is God.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@Andy2542 "So when Jesus prayed to his father (God) he made it necessary that he was not praying to himself because he was in a different position..."
Explain what you mean by different position.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition
when God came down to earth he was made man. As man, he was born of a virgin to represent his uniqueness, he was named Jesus. So he was born as the son of mankind. So when he prayed to God he was behalf of all humans and prayed to the father of all.
Andy2542 3 months ago
@Andy2542 God was made man? Sorry, God's eternal qualities don't allow Him to assume a lesser position than the Eternal Creator. The Creator can't be creation and vice versa. It's not limiting God's ability, it's maintaining His Supreme status, otherwise we've basically defined a false god. One that is one minute Eternal and Almighty, and the next minute, subject to those elements He Himself created. It doesn't befit God that His Majesty becomes lowered in any way.
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition
Well God can do anything he wants and that's something. So you are saying YOUR God can't do anything he wants and that's false so therefore your God is false to. May Jesus Christ one day bring peace upon you.
Andy2542 3 months ago
@Andy2542 "Well God can do anything he wants and that's something."
So, can God become poop?
tadpoleposition 3 months ago
@tadpoleposition
your muslim Allah is already shit. Good bye.
Andy2542 2 months ago
@Andy2542 Caught in a self-contradictory creed, are you?
tadpoleposition 2 months ago
@Andy2542 ya we believe in same God as christians do. so when you call our God bad you call your as well. Allah in arabic, Elah in Arahmic, Eloh in hebrew. Dude grow up
flexpape 2 months ago
@flexpape
actually no. Islam is a false religion and Satan is behind it. And We don't believe the same same God because we believe Jesus Christ is God, the lord and savior. And that The Father, the son ,and the holy spirit make up the one true God.
Andy2542 2 months ago
@tadpoleposition Yes sort of the body of Jesus died but Jesus didn't he has reterned to the father and is one with the father. and Yes God sent his onley son to die for us as a complete expression of his love for us. God loves us as he loves his own son Jesus. Jesus was the expression of his love. thats how much God loves all of us. yes evan you a none believer. God sent a part of himself the word wich became man wich has the tittle son of God and was named Jesus. Cont
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 now adam is "THE" Son of God and he hadn't even got mother and father , both missing. Then he should be MORE son of God than Jesus (PBUH). Bro we all follow one God, one God. it was Church blaspheme. Jesus pointed out in the bible itself.
Here this is uploaded by a muslim but NOT made by a Muslim watch?v=ogXWwKcHPNc
flexpape 3 months ago
@flextape if you new anything about paul you would realise that befor he was converted he was known as saul this is when he did not believe Jesus was the son of God. he later changes his name to Paul when he was converted. the conversion of Paul proves he later believed and accepted Jesus as the son Of God our lord and savior. so befor you tell me to read the bible correctly you read the bible correctly then come back untill then stop talking about somthing you know nothing about .
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape LUKE 1:31 " You will be with chilld and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus,He will be Great and he will be called the son of the most high, Luke 1:35 the Angel answerd, " the holy spirit will come upon you,and the power of the most high will over power you, so the holy one who is to be born
will be called( the Son of God) "
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@flexpape YOU ARE WRONG MY FRIEND U READ THE BIBLE THEN. Luke 2 : 31
When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying, heaven was opened and the holy sporit descended in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came down from heaven: "You are my son whom I love ; with you I am well pleased."
Andy2542 2 months ago
@Andy2542 so son of God? mate bible has so many sons who is real one?
"...Thus saith the Lord, Israel is MY SON even my FIRSTBORN." - Exodux 4:22
"Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the SON OF GOD." - Luke 3:38
"...and Ephraim is my FIRSTBORN." - Jeremiah 31:9
two FIRSTBORNS?!?!
Thou (o David) ART MY SON; this day have I (God) BEGOTTEN thee. " PSALMS 2:7
flexpape 2 months ago
@flexpape
if you read BEFORE that it says Joseph THOUGHT OF . so after God claimed Jesus his only begotten son,Joseph thought f the other people he thought are the sons.
Andy2542 2 months ago
@Andy2542 lol do you know That NRSV of Bible have removed the word begotten saying that this is an interpolation , a fabrication, a concoction and they threw it out of bible? Because Begotten is one who begets. Are you making God a man?
flexpape 2 months ago
@Andy2542 according to bible all those who are led by spirit of God are sons of God...... Further more John is a bible that has some close verses of Jesus saying that he is son of GOD but they never clearly says that he is son of God however other Gospels are entirely different and give a very different view of Jesus
flexpape 2 months ago
@Andy2542 not that Adam was " THE " SON of God. he Didn't have any father or Mother..... So he is bigger son than Jesus? lol not.
flexpape 2 months ago
@flexpape
well Adam can't have a father because he was the first man. If he had a father then he's not the first man. So there was circumstances that made it necessary for him not to have a father or mother because he's the first human being.
Andy2542 2 months ago
@pulman7 Jesus is not racist wher do you get that from ? Jesus loves everyone. your quran tells you to hate those who do not belive in islam and hate those against you. the bible teaches to love those who hate you and love those who are aganst you. we pray for people who is against us we love muslims we dont hate you nither does jesus he hates the fals religon not the person who teaches or believes it he loves and forgives can you say the same for allah ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@izlamiztruth you are brainwashed
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@izlamiztruth no Jesus did not die his body died not his spirit wich is the spirit of God and will never die that is why Jesus is eternal you believe that Jesus is the word of allah and the word of allah is eternal so that makes Jesus eternal you also believe that Jesus is the spirit of God if Jesus is the spirit of God then Is God spirit is the same as Jesus ? that would make Jesus God. am I wrong ?
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
we muslims never use such disrespect full words for jesus and we also belive in them as a prophet , but christan do for Mohammed s.a w.s no bodies is born with religion but the reality will feel with your affection can tell you that islam is the last choice so shut your mouth with ass hole beliefs .
TheCutebarbieslover 3 months ago
@TheCutebarbieslover the poblem with that is you believe Jesus as a prophet that's why you don't disrespect him. Chistians believe that Jesus is the son of God. We Also believe that mohammed is a fals profit that is why we disrespect him. if you didn't believe Jesus was a prophet then you would show him the same disrespect. secondly as your mislim friend said Jesus is the word and spirit of God so god must also be the spirit of Jesus meaning they are the same spirit the same God. Jesus=God
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
@bfddanny1987 jesus so of god what dose it mean is that god give birth to him
TheCutebarbieslover 3 months ago
@TheCutebarbieslover No Jesus has always existed he has always been one with the father. He is has Always been the word of God the world was created through Jesus and for Jesus. Hes always been at the side of the father since the begging of time.
bfddanny1987 3 months ago
What a childish ending.... You wanna take reference of religion from this bunch of idiots? Hallelujah? Do some research about it....
shahadan1985 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
non-Muslims ask how Muslims can blow themselves up & chop heads
Simple, Quran 8:12, I will cast terror into the hearts of those who do not believe in Allah
Muslims follow Muhammad. He insisted that his followers take a "pledge to death" Q 48:9 which says "those who pledge to die for Muhammad pledges to die for Allah."
Muhammad turned Arabia & Coptic Egypt into Islam through Terror Q 8:67 & Bukhari:V4B52N220
Muslims doing the same today
So long as Muslims follow Quran, terror remains
MYSPEAR.OR G
miladmeah 3 months ago
this muslim speaking on the phone is a perfect example of how twisted their understanding is
MrLoudmouthspeaker 4 months ago 2
Muslims say Paul corrupted Jesus message and Bible....yet Paul died 67AD...Muhammad born 569AD...502 years after Paul died.
YET Quran 5:33 says when Allah said, "O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection
Muhammad said in Quran Jesus Followers SUPERIOR but Bible ALREADY created, Paul dead. DO MATH.
00ismaeL001 4 months ago
@00ismaeL001 5:33 The recompense of those who wage war against Allâh and His Messenger and do mischief in the land is only that they shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off from the opposite sides, or be exiled from the land. That is their disgrace in this world, and a great torment is theirs in the Hereafter... .. UR MISQUOTING
sicker57 4 months ago
Quran says Jesus was born of a virgin?
So who was his father?
00ismaeL001 4 months ago