Tom Wright & James Dunn The New Perspective on Paul

[thesuikerlounge]

paul's understanding of "being in christ" is a mystical world view. in his opinion - if you are in christ - you do not need to have a law no more, since you automatically act like a holy person. ok, i admit we as people living some hundered years later do have a hard time to grasp this conception. but this is how paul thought. instead of reading the same passages in galatians and romans over and over again, just have a look into 1. korinthians and you will understand.

[thesuikerlounge]

...that paul might exhibit a partially wrong picture of first century judaism does say what exactly about his antinomist tendencies??? nothing, sir. but thanks a lot. it was his opinion (an opinion of a historical person that might well be wrong) so either you follow him, or you don't. however, paul's understanding of justification by faith isn't at all affected. do you get this? just to make things sure: i don't follow paul. but this bold thesis has to fall!!!

[thesuikerlounge]

it's generally frightening for me how anti-lutheran (anti-german?) biased, or simply self-obsessed scholars (that also might make "good" money with a bold thesis) can have so many followers. ...and i am not even a believer. i just look at it with a historical interest.

by the way a look into the bible would show that (if they all got paul so terribly wrong) not only luther and augustin, but also jews from jerusalem themselves must have "completely misunderstood" paul. (acts 21,21-22.28)

[thesuikerlounge]

"Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but DUNG, that I may win Christ. And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the LAW, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith." (phil 3,8-9)

paul says EXPILCITLY that his jewish past is DUNG. how do these "smart" scholars explain these words away???

[TheFunkyTheist]

@thesuikerlounge Paul explicitly said that the law was upheld by the righteousness of God-- by faith in (and the faith of) Christ Jesus (Romans 3 and 4). Paul didn't have a problem with the law. He just didn't think the law ALONE was good enough.

[Jen8973]

@AnglicanApologist72 Well this simple mind has indeed spent time in the scholarly tower and has a BA in Theology and a Masters to boot ! it was Luther who argued and quite rightly that the Church stands of falls on the doctrine of Justification. I think Piper has said some unhelpful things yet the main trust of the Gospel is the Just making the Unjust Just. the same argument can be found in the 39 articles of the Anglican faith. Or don't you believe that either ? mmmh!

[Jen8973]

while its good to look at the contect yet this is just over complicating the isssu ! those of us who are not jews need to hear that we are saved by faith in christ and we make the scirptures relevant to those who we share it with. So we don't need to go into complex arguments about the law and morality but we show that we are not saved by our works because were not good enough. Scholars spend to much time in thier towers and not with the ordinary peolple !

[martalog121]

justification in the future..hhmmm?

[Tristaths]

Finally a sane understanding of justification!!!

P.S. at 4:38, where is he pointing?