.99! occupy youtube! i stand i solidarity of the men and women who sweat and build the country/world! not the cheeky bastards who profit from our blood sweat and tears.
This song and others like it need to be heard..For to long the Employers have taken advantage of its employes....Stand up anf vote..The union sets the wage so that everyone union and non union alike can get a fair wage.but we fight collectivley. And i stand behind any one of my brothers,they stand behind me and we work as one... United Roofers-Waterproofers-Allied Workers Local Number 12 New Haven Connecticut.. Support the E.F.C.A.
Vikingblood, I wouldn't say it's an insult to say this sounds like DKM - the Dogs' singer fronted the Murphs before Al Barr came along. Hell of a guy, and a great labor supporter. Check out their performances from OH and WI. Just awesome guys.
Im union and my entire mothers side has been also..how can anyone bad mouth unions..hell..we should be thanked..i mean damn..we arent mexicans..why should we be worked like them..
@streetpunkoi94 that is an insult to this song. This song predates Dropkick by almost 20 years. If anything worker's song sounds like this song. Billy Bragg wrote this song back in the early 80's and that version is almost better than this one.
I think @pukedragon just made this video so he can argue with people and spread his "free market" rhetoric. Shame on you. Based on your statements, you don't know what the "old unions" stood for either. And you obviously have no idea what communism or socialism is, or you wouldn't be calling Obama one. Before speaking on a subject, please read up on it a little bit. Fool.
They still stand for that... at least the membership still does... in some cases, we're fighting our own managers, lol! We NEED to take our country back from the cushy fat asses who are in positions of power right now. I fear that it won't happen unless we hit levels of financial disaster akin to Argentina in the late 1990's. Worse... a part of me wants it, just so we can get it over with.
@fittergal I agree, what the unions once stood for was just getting enough to be able to live, from bosses who shut down anywhere else for them to go, who put them in debt, who made them nearly slaves. They got way off track at some point, but having honor in my work, not having to be an animal just to have a job, is something i owe those guys who fought.
@pukedragon If you have those things you are luckier than most. Also, unions didn't wander off track; they were never perfect. What has changed is that the forces of capital have castrated them. Now when everyone is getting shafted they haven't any meaningful recourse because they've been convinced that any radical direct action is for commies and extremists. But given a little time, they will realise that the wealthy elite are a kind of extremist activist too. Maybe realise too late.
@pukedragon We all owe them. For the 8 hour day, the 40 hour week, the weekend, coffee and lunch breaks, being allowed to go to the bathroom during work hours, sick days, paid vacation, and the list goes on.
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I love the photos, on one hand the old photos of people being exploited by their employers, and the new pictures of fat lazy people whining so that they can retire when they're 45. Bunch of lazy fucken whiners
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@ccpper When i made this video i just did it cause i liked the Tune and have respect for workers, and it was labor day. But over the last few years the modern unions have shown themselves to be nothing like the old unions. Just tools of commies and democrats who think they can thug themselves free crap without having to work as long as they support obama and other socialists.
@ccpper yeah because progress became redundant 50 years ago you 'tard. Hell even Fukuyama have decided that "end of the world" was bullshit - why do people still argue for it when the writer don't?
the union is bulshit thier bleeding our country dry, its not right that other hard working people that are not in the union have to pay for thier health care and other shit with our tax money, oh yah and no one is trying to take thiere rights away you dumb fucks, we just want them to pay for a little bit of thier health care like everyone else, plus its not like the union gets all the things they deserve its some fat fucking union boss puling in millions while the hard workers get screwed
the union is bulshit thier bleeding our country dry, its not right that other hard working people that are not in the union have to pay for thier health care and other shit with our tax money, oh yah and noone is trying to take thiere rights away you dumb fucks, we just want them to pay for a little bit of thier health care like everyone else, plus its not like the union gets all the things they deserve its some fat fucking union boss puling in millions while the hard workers get screwed
@55destructo The unions are bleeding us dry? Strange, I thought it was the richest people in the country who get free money handed to them by the government and who almost brought the entire world economy to collapse not two years ago.
You realize wages have declined in step with the decline of union membership, right?
@55destructo ...how in the fuck do unions make non-union members pay for their health care?
in reality, the vast majority of people who are very wealthy were born to either wealthy or upper middle class families. most people who are born poor come from poor families as well. we don't live in a meritocracy. when life becomes fair and pigs can fly, then you can complain about people trying to improve conditions for labor
Go Wisconsin! This fight right now is in Madison,WI people. Help them out. Send food, water. Come and visit us! If you know the Street Dogs...get them here!!!
epic !!!!!! overtly sentimental immature socialist manifestos combined with horrible music, i cant believe there are people dumb enough to enjoy this noise.
@TheManolakis I agree totaly, these people are fucking idiots, the union can suck my balls, all they do is bitch and complain while non union workers pay for them to fucking protest
@55destructo i never mentioned unions.In fact my father was a union iron worker and i'm grateful for the life that a fair wage allowed me to have.i commented on teenage wanna be commies with their idiotic ramblings and talentless poser blue collar, faux tough guy punk bands that should be out laying bricks. At least producing something besides this garbage that passes for "punk" music. As for your plight you don't like your life do something about it and quit bitching to people who dont give a f
Only thing I don't like about this cover: Reducing the villains to the GOP. They may be the most powerful and most organized and most dedicated of workers' enemies in Washington, but Democrats shouldn't get a free pass. Enough Democrats stood against the EFCA to keep it from passing. Democrats helped bail out Wall Street.
They may be the lesser of two evils, but let's not forget they serve plenty of bosses, too. People power comes from the bottom up.
If Capital has the right to unionize (in Corporations), than so does labor. In the end, as working class people, all we have is each other. Working people of all lands, unite! We have nothing to lose but the chains that bind us! End of story.
In the gilded age of transnational corporations, which lead the world every day to neo-feudalism and chase the lowest wages from one region of the globe to the next in a grim race to the bottom, there must rise the age of the _transnational union_. The right in the U.S. hyperbolize Obama into some sort of socialist, which is laughable on the face of it, but if they continue to get their way they ain't seen nothing yet--eventually labor will wake up and the Hamptons will become a prison camp.
To the strikers at the Congress Hotel and Hilton Hotel in the heart of Chicago: Good Luck guys. This one is for you. To those fellows I met, chatted, and hung out with today - though I do not know your names, you taught me a real lesson today:
@pukedragon It's easy to forget that Marx spent much more time analyzing capitalism than he did the plan for a socialist future. This means that the question of "what comes after capitalism?" is largely unanswered. You could have a system which combined worker ownership of business with free-market buying and selling of products, BTW.
The only real difference between Adam Smith and Karl Marx is that Smith was cautiously optimistic about people being able to keep plutocracy from going too far.
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@ComradeSephiroth in true capitalism there is nothing to stop those who are capable of it from starting their own business. There are some things i believe in that make excessive socialism and communism impossible. For one, you cannot consume more than you produce. For two, competition and freedom yeild prosperity for workers unheard of in ANY system that a government controls the economy. Just don't confuse the Working Class with the Moocher Class.
@pukedragon No I'm not a fan of any kind of planned economy, whether communist, fascist, mercantilist or a late-stage plutocracy. Actually there is a lot of effort on the political right to confuse worker-to-worker redistribution with worker-to-moocher redistribution. They're afraid that too many people might question the distribution of wages/salaries or, worst of all, realize that economic mooching (rent-seeking, windfalls, etc.) is actually very widespread at the top.
@pukedragon That's not necessarily so. Robert Kennedy once said that "You can't measure happiness with GNP." While it's true that the US has the highest total output of any nation in the world and has for some time, it does not have the happiest citizens, the broadest shared wealth, the highest output per capita or even the freest markets. The old soviet nations, for all their flaws, managed to provide universal access to housing, education and employment-- all with much less money than the USA.
@ComradeSephiroth This is simply wrong. Marx devoted quite a bit of time to criticizing models of socialism which retained markets - see The Poverty of Philosophy. Marx's theoretical system is also quite different from Smith's, insofar as Marx sees violence and domination at the heart of capitalism, and Smith didn't There are a host of other differences, but the main point is that Marx's critique of capitalism implies that markets are incompatible with a just society.
@ComradeSephiroth haha, that is actually already theorized. A socialist workplace (i.e. worker's self management) producing goods within a free market (i.e. lack of illegitimate authoritarian dictates about market interaction) is called mutualism.
"Mutualism is an anarchist school of thought that envisions a society where each person might possess a means of production, either individually or collectively, with trade representing equivalent amounts of labor in the free market."
@pukedragon If you're interested in ideas which combine worker ownership with markets look into Proudhoun and his philosophy of mutualism which actually preceded Marxist socialism.
Many men and women spilled blood to gain decent pay, safer working conditions and generally begrudging respect from the ruling class...I am grateful to be in a union...THE UNION FOREVER!
Let's change the subject, at least momentarily. Who made this video, which I suspect has been thrilling and encouraging all of us? If pukedragon did, he did a great job. If not he's got good taste.
The Janitors and unskilled labourers of America do a great job too; and yet Pukedragon attacks them. He believes that although they are hard working, tax paying members of society, they should should rely on charity for their healthcare. So why should anybody praise that sly, treacherous toad? If this deceitful little scab had an ounse of taste, then maybe he would not try to contradict the words of this song. Pukedragon is a traitor to his fellow countrymen, his family and his class.
should an assemblyline worker get the same pay as an archetect? should a janitor get the same pay as a doctor? if you think they should your an idiot too infected with communism to even exist. Why is getting charity from a private charity an insult, but forcing your company out or business by asking for pay thats twice what your work is even worth so great? How many unions forced their company to close so they could go stand in unemployment lines?
If you weren`t such an ignoramus, you might have been able to comprehend my previous posts. I have already stated that I do not advocate that all workers are paid the same regardless of career, but I do however support all workers whose conditions of employment are under attack. The thought of just one hard working, tax paying citizen (of the richest nation on earth) having to go cap in hand for healthcare makes me want to throw up. Hang your head in shame class traitor.
You really cannot tell the difference between your arse and your elbow. In one breath you accuse trade unionists of being communists; the next they're great! Do you enjoy paid holidays and sick pay? Do you enjoy a company pension scheme? Are there laws in place that ensure that you work in a safe environment? None of these conditions miraculously fell out of the sky. They were fought for and won by trade unions to ensure that we all live in a more civilized society.
i'm sure i will be, communism only murdered 200 million people last century. With commies like yourself and obama on the loose, maybe you'll double that number this century?
Organization, making deals with the bosses, and unifying against bullies and thugs. Those are wonderful things that the Unions did. But the jobs bank and pensions after only 30 years, you've shot yourselves in the foot.
the majority of unions sold out the worker long ago but the american worker has a right and must organize again . we live in a country where wages and benefits are declining while the cost of everything is astronomical we need sound money ,end the fed, and we also need REAL working class representaion
@logan1776 i with you a hundred percent on that buddy or should i say comrade!!!!!!!!!!!! But what people in this country think is a working class representaion changes quicker the the seasons thats the reson Obama won we hate the way Bush was leading us and people jumpship and voted Democratic or independent. This is a long and anyonning problem of America as no one party is actually going to do anything because when they do people decide that what they are doing is wrong.
@logan1776 to fix this problem we must have a independent run that has never run for anything before and get into congress and get more people like him and get a person to run for president in a few decades from that party we need a independent or third party to take over. Or just have a socialist or Anti-capitalist revolution as that might be the only way.. as we will be stuck with careerist politicians as we Americans suck at making up our minds or we are just afraid of change.
Second of two posts - sorry, y'all I mentioned syndicalism because I
was trying to find common ground with pukedragon. He baffled me by posting this song, with its phrase "Let's fight the right wing", and then talking libertarian, which I consider a right-wing philosophy. Such was also my reason in ideating about a wholesome, progressive, labor-friendly government "withering away" to leave a wholesome, humane anarchism.
i like alot of songs i don't necessarily agree with. In this particular case, i believe unions are absolutely necessary in cases of abuse, in cases of being used just one step above that of a slave. Today, you will almost never find such cases. Not so even just 30 or 40 years ago. But today, in many cases, unions have gone too far, actually destroying their own jobs by asking for way too much. Look up "Jobs Bank" on wikipedia or google and you should see what i'm talking about.
It is obvious that you, just like redchannels, is not a trade unionist. With the demise of trade unions in the 'land of the free', how many of your citizens are employed as casual labour? Do they enjoy sick pay, paid holidays and the same employment rights as those who are organised? How many working class Americans have to work until they drop? How many hard working, tax paying citizens, of the richest and most powerful nation on earth, rely on charity for their health care?
you want to replace private charity with government charity for the sake for 5% or less of americans? Business are competitions, and businesses can't compete paying janitors and unskilled laborers the same as doctors and lawyers. If your a skilled laboror, you could start your own business if the left and the socialists in government would just get out of your way.
Competition gluts our markets, it enables the the rich to take advantage of the necessities of the poor. Competition drives down the wages of the worker! Just over a century ago, Britain with her empire was the richest country in the world; and yet 55% of children in the East end of London were dead before their fifth birthday. Thanks to the trade union movement, a Labour government and those with a social conscience, we have enjoyed a National haealth service for the past 51 years.
It's just a new brand of socialism that doesn't just steal from the productive in a society, but steals from future generations. It means that you've lowered the bar so much that no one can be prosperous, therefor, everyone is equal. It's the exact opposite of being free. Slaves who instead of farming a cash crop, are just used to harvest votes for a socialist side of the government. It's a pathetic existance.
Yeah right! Your rotton principled tumour will not allow you to comprehend any kind of socialistic act what so ever. Instead you jealously attack trade unionists by accusing them of of being communists. Are you really that ignorant?
A communist is someone who believes what you believe. That everyone should get the same benefit regaurdless of ability. That nothing should be bought, but rather divided out equally by a totalitarian government. That is communism. You are a communist.
You pay tribute to Labour day by uploading a song and video depicting the working class struggle; and yet you attack trade unions. In defense of the unions, I have mentioned some of the conditions that most workers now enjoy, most notably the NHS. In your ignorance, you have proceeded to rant about executions, famines and the population being turned into slaves. I am an active trade unionist who enjoys a good salary, holiday pay, sick pay and an excellent final salary pension scheme.
I do not advocate that all workers should get paid the same regardless of ability, but I do however support workers from other trades whose pay and conditions are under attack. This is a principle that your rotton tumour will not allow you to comprehend. It is nice to know that McCarthyism is alive and well!
No body today but people who are paid under the table are comparable to workers before the 1970's. If you don't like your job, if you don't like how your boss treats you, start your own company. Oh thats right, you leftists have made that impossible with your red-tape and bullshit. You made your bed, now lie in it.
So your advise to an employee who has been the victim of racial or sexual discrimination would be: "start your own business". What advise could you offer to a person who is being bullied in the work place or has been unfairly dismissed? Are there laws in place that protect you from unsafe working practices? Do you run your own company? If so, what conditions do your employees work under? Do you find that as you`re in competition with other firms, you need to cut expenditure?
i don't have any employees you filthy communist trash. Since you don't speak or read english anyways, go live in north korea with the other commies and tell me how much you love it then. What use is a union if the government controls your working conditions for you? None. A useless middleman between government and business. If a woman is being (honestly) sexually harassed or abused at work, she should kill whoevers doing it and/or leave. Being a commie, you rely on the government of course.
When you set off for work, do you wear a cheap suit and carry a breifcase with nothing in it but a jam sandwich? Do you kid yourself that you`re some sort of executive; but in reality you obediently take all the crap that is thrown at you? Do you jealously attack trade unionists because you`re unable to controvert the principles of dignified workers, without contradicting yourself? Please tell me how an awful individual like you, with a backbone that is made of jelly, is able to stand alone?
what did Communist Russa, Communist China, Communist Cambodia, and Communist North Korea do for workers that you so desperately need to happen everywhere else.
Unions are great. Communism, not so much. Unions are an agreement between workers and business owners. Communism is nothing more than fascism in a disguise. Real Unions died out long ago now.
@pukedragon Those weren't really communist societies. What is Marxism? Marxism is in essence direct democracy. Marx & Engles advocated for a society where workers democratically controlled the state, the factories and the means of production. What you had under Stalin and in China was privately owned states that controlled the means of production. This is how Tony Cliff coined the concept of state capitalism which is what you essentially had under the societies you listed. Read more mate
@queerveganliberal There are no communist societies. The two terms are mutually exclusive. There's only idiots who want communism and so give absolute power to the first monster to come and promise it to them.
This National health service provides all the healthcare that a Janitor, Doctor, Lawyer or Unskilled Labourer would require for themselves and their families. No need for them to endure the degradation and indignity of credit scoring. It is abhorent that the richest country in the world cannot provide this basic human right to all of its citizens. You would rather snatch bread out of the mouth of your neighbour than provide for your fellow countrymen!
from each according to his abilities to each according to his needs? Sorry, the world tried that last century and it was a failure resulting in the deaths of hundreds of millions of people due to purposefully caused famines, execution of political enemies, etc. Your dream world cannot happen without a totalitarian government controlling all aspects of society and the economy. This always results in mass graves. Socialists eventually run out of other peoples property and wealth.
The National Health Service was founded here in Britain in 1948. There were no executions of political enemies, there were no mass graves and not one single person died of starvation. If you lived here in the UK, you would be able to have your rotton principled tumour removed for free. It would then be possible for a selfish individual like you to comprehend our wonderful institution we call the NHS.
1. The UK, Germany, France, and Canada are not socialist countries. These countries all have capitalist economies. However, they do have national healthcare. To insist that government-run healthcare makes a country socialist is like insisting that a government-run mail service or military makes a country socialist. Is the US socialist?
Also the survival rate has little to do with the issue at hand. Yes, the US's healthcare system may be able to provide better cancer care for the individual consumer. But there are many people in the US who cannot afford to pay for this treatment (or can pay for it only by impoverishing themselves), where as any cancer patient in the UK would get treatment for free. That's the issue.
Interestingly, you will find examples of abuse in many countries today that are not in the first world, thanks to the globalized nature of capitalism. Do you not think that sweatshop workers in Burma or China or Mexico should unionize themselves? Remember that in many cases these are workers employed by American companies to make American consumer goods, and they are exploited because their countries lack the progressive laws that our countries have thanks to the labor movement.
@Ceraziefish You speak the truth man i have heard that in Texas it is illegal to have Unions. As i live in Texas i can't wait to get out as i can't stand the way we are.
People complain about government but then they complain when people what to change it there is no hope unless we take it from under their feet. I am not saying Europe is better but they do a better job at pretending they care for there people.. Not the bail-out thought that is just one stupid plan!!!
@Ceraziefish We who want something different wither it is socialism or communism or something different all together we must rise up and claim our right and kick out the old habbits and give rise to a new freedom and laws. Let people have a voice and not pretend like they do.
I'm an artist, and there's no artists' union, at least not in my town. I'd suppose for you about my starting one, but it'd result in more of the overelaborate speech you're complaining about. My political fantasia was elaborately phrased because it was a fantasia. I understood that it would be the workers who made the union in my fictional world. I was just supposing, to no real point, about who would create the workplaces where these workers would have to organize themselves.
You speak of syndicalism and yet you`re not a trade unionist. You are a socialist and yet you cannot organise as there is no artists` union your town. It is obvious to me that you are a principled and dignified worker; but you are also a fantasist.
I didn't say I couldn't organize. I said I wouldn't run my mouth on the subject, essentially because I've been running my mouth on this string too much lately. I spoke of syndicalism even though I'm not in some as-yet-to-be-created artists' union because I was trying to dialogue with pukedragon, and trying to work out whether I'd want to live in a society where the lines of supply and substantial political power were in syndicalist hands.
Artists ARE fantasists. For the sake of new ideas.
of our present-day corporate empires? The government? Any way you want to complete the picture is cool. To get away from this playtoy concept of the situation, I'll close by saying this: If the people do not make of themselves a government, given any workable degree of democracy whatsoever, then the people are behaving like shmoes. And oh yeah, a good government is a precondition for any evolution toward any practical and humane anarchism.
this situation would have been the removal of the threat of predatory private capital, in a sort of civil war, in which the government and the unions were allies. After that, class struggle would resume, more precise, more focused, mostly non- violent (?) between the two entities I name. Who would the workers in the unions be working for after that? You pick. Sensibly- -sized worker's cooperatives they also owned? Forcibly downsized corporations, the vestiges (next post)
I`ve got a rough idea what you`re on about, but would you please be so kind as to translate your argument into plain english. Are you a trade unionist? If so, you would know that the workers are the union.
As punkhippe put it, removing government and asking nicely for big business to be nice is not a worker's paradise. Some time ago I was toying with an idea, more for an unwritten work of social science fiction than as anything that might readily come to pass, about a society in which the main expression of social or class struggle was, indeed, an antqgonism between the government and the trade union movement. However, a precondition for (please see next post)
melange of independent, democratically administered productive entities supplies the needs of the public. (Don't ask me who prints the money the public buys the stuff with, it's not my concept. It probably isn't even pukedragon's, come to that.) Just in case this is what pukedragon is thinking about, permit me say that the problem of Really Big corporations would still be around as the syndicalist productive communes were trying to get up and running. (please see next post.)
months or so. -- I would say that in general libertarian politics are quite bad for working people. -- I think pukedragon may be trying to develop a concept of some form of syndicalism, in which worker's cooperatives enjoy a high degree of autonomy, freely trade with, help, or ignore one another; and in which this (see next post)
when did we become more about the bullshitting,lie'ing polititions, and less about our working brother's and sister's(and our family's)???? they don't care about us!!!! they just use us for photo op's and stolen votes...
the unions have definately lost sight of workers. Supporting obama and the liberals? How many jobs will be lost by their pseudo-enviromentalist laws? limiting coal, gas, and oil drilling, for what? to limit the amount of Plant Food in the atmosphere? the earth isn't even being affected by CO2, it was all a fraud and a lie. Get back on track unions.
its seems like some unions are just as corrupt as the corporations but unions are still needed and really both parties are good to unions politics in this nation should more towards being libertarian
i think the vast majority of people are libertarian, they just don't know it. It'll be a long time before libertarians, or libertarian minded republicans gain any real power though. Unions are a good thing, but unions should negotiate with employers, not become a branch of the government.
and libertairian ideas are very negative for workers. without goverment involvement buisness is free to exploit workers in america and all over the world. i feel like if your looking for workers rights you wanna look into liberal ideas, like socialism, or communism but removing goverment and asking nicely for big buiesness to play nice is not a workers paradise
Communism? you think the workers "employed" by the government at gunpoint in communist countries have it right? There is no difference between communism and fascism, they are one in the same.
yea but free people starve in the streets because no ones protecting them from the people with money ( i dont mean cops ether). yea belive having a job (forced or not) is better than starving on your own account. i think you may be wrapped up in this idea that libertarianism is a party that flips the man off but really, goverment or buisness can screw you over the difference is goverment is not souly working for profit
who in any 1st world country is starving in the streets? The only people i can think of are the mentally ill and neglected elderly and children. Freely run charities can find people to fill their beds and to pass out their free food too. Yes, the government isn't working for profit, they are working for Idealism and power. Thats why the government wastes so much of the money it takes in.
Very few people starve in the streets in first-world countries (probably more than you think, but still very few), but it doesn't change the fact that without people starving or barely eking out a living elsewhere, the current system could not sustain itself, hence opposition to the whole current system of things. Even if worker's rights are earned and means of education secured in countries that currently supply cheap labour [cont. in next comment]
[...] as is slowly happening in China and India, the same volume of cheap labour must be kept up in order to maintain the prices, for us, in first-world nations, anything like what they are now. If many Chinese and Indian people hold educated, high-paying jobs, there will still be a need for manual labour, and the cycle of industrialisation and fight for labour rights will repeat itself until the system breaks, most likely, unless something is seriously changed.
ohh i have a basic eduaction. its a lesser of two evils, the liberal party has shown to be the party for working class and the unions. yes eviormental issues will hurt laborers but the conservatives economic policys destroy jobs to due to lazie fair economics encourageses out sourcing. the deference is the liberal party wants to help unions. and all of the global warming is a lie conspiracys are dumb and baseless
Democrats are the party of slavery. Instead of farming cash crops we're now asked to farm votes. Being totally dependant on government for food, shelter, healthcare, and education makes a person a slave. Free people don't need to work in factories or for big corporations, they can innovate, produce, and live on their own means. Giving their time in exchange for their pay, not being forced to do something in exchange for it.
well sure at one point in history they were the party of oppression, but thats only till the 1940's when Charles wallace championed racism for the republican party. i like your speech but im not sure its practical in reality. do free people no longer need food or shelter. goverment or no goverment to make money you need to compeat and doing so against corporations is impossible with the differnce is total capitcal, goverment or no goverment
How much power and wealth do you think the government should hold? All of it? Sorry, i'll never trust any government THAT much. If you look at history, all monopolies are only made possible through government intervention. All cases of depression, famine, and war too.
but your wronge here. ok heres an example the depresion in america right now is caused by bank giving large loans to people they know wont be able to pay it back, the idea being this would generate insain amounts of intrest money, it did until the people physically could not affored the loans and had to leave there homes as a result of the poverty the banks created, this is the american banking and housing crisis
had the goverment stepped in and universalized the banks the goverment (whos main goal isnt profit unlike buisness) would not issue unpayable loans and cause the crisis. i could go on and on about how its not goverment, its goverment not sticking it to buisness enought that creates problems, and though libertarianism is a nice idea your not solving the problems you think you are
so you have no idea what Fannie Mae and Freddie Mack was? the government beurocracy that forced banks to give out the rediculous unpayable loans. Do you really think the banks want to give loans to people that can't pay the loans back? where is the profit in this? Why did the banks need corporate welfare if they were making so much money doing this?
to answer your second question, yes. its called sub prime morgage. people wanna live beyond their means and if they are willing to pay out the nose in the long run their able to thanks to sub prime morgages. initially banks were making rediculose amounts of money because of this the problem was no one was expecting the water to run out at the same time. this immediate drop in bank revenue caused them to collapse. this isnt a dark conspiracy theory. this has preatty much been proved.
Billy Bragg's original version is much better.
gentryracing 1 day ago
UFCW 371!
matt143450 1 week ago
LOVE IT!
petiteAlicious 3 weeks ago
.99! occupy youtube! i stand i solidarity of the men and women who sweat and build the country/world! not the cheeky bastards who profit from our blood sweat and tears.
hitchains 1 month ago
The UNION, it's your only lifeboat.
GreenmanXIV 1 month ago
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THEY SAY SIMPLE PLAN, I SAY STREET DOGS. HAIL THE COOL MIKE McCOLGAN. GREETINGS FROM THE PHILIPPINES.
mabuhayguy 1 month ago
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....the 6 laziest people I know all ended up in unions,....coincidence???....I think not....
corksterism 1 month ago
NO ON ISSUE 2 OHIO!
MagnumPI4 2 months ago
" ITOO MY BROTHERS,AM SO DARN PROUD TO BE A UNION MAN !!" MAY GOD BLESS US ALL UNION WORKERS THIS ELECTION AND FOREVER.
whipkeys 3 months ago
This song and others like it need to be heard..For to long the Employers have taken advantage of its employes....Stand up anf vote..The union sets the wage so that everyone union and non union alike can get a fair wage.but we fight collectivley. And i stand behind any one of my brothers,they stand behind me and we work as one... United Roofers-Waterproofers-Allied Workers Local Number 12 New Haven Connecticut.. Support the E.F.C.A.
MrFathips 3 months ago
it will allways be betwen those who are priviliged and those who are not it seems, well i know where i stand
hejsvejk 3 months ago
Props on the video! Good job!
AnarchyDavey 3 months ago
This should be the anthem of Occupy America.
DvineINFEKT 3 months ago 3
Proud to be UNION and a productive member of America's Working Class. We kick ass for the working Class.
proudteamster135 3 months ago
"The Union Forever, Defending Our Rights
Let's Fight The Right-Wing, All Workers Unite!"
Working-Class Pride World Wide
IClassStruggle 4 months ago 2
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IClassStruggle 4 months ago
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IClassStruggle 4 months ago
ETU (Electrical Trades Union) TILL I DIE!
IntertubeTr0ll 4 months ago
Vikingblood, I wouldn't say it's an insult to say this sounds like DKM - the Dogs' singer fronted the Murphs before Al Barr came along. Hell of a guy, and a great labor supporter. Check out their performances from OH and WI. Just awesome guys.
CaptainCharisma1988 4 months ago
@vikingblood82 Even Billy Bragg's version was a cover version. The song was written by Joe Hill in 1913.
AlcuinHimself 4 months ago
DON'T MOUM ORGANIZE!! FFS!!
ryskpompa 4 months ago
street dogs are becoming the most important band of the decade.
logansdad77 5 months ago
Im union and my entire mothers side has been also..how can anyone bad mouth unions..hell..we should be thanked..i mean damn..we arent mexicans..why should we be worked like them..
LumberZack1 5 months ago
@streetpunkoi94 that is an insult to this song. This song predates Dropkick by almost 20 years. If anything worker's song sounds like this song. Billy Bragg wrote this song back in the early 80's and that version is almost better than this one.
VikingBLOOD82 6 months ago
FUCK SCOTT WALKER FOR TAKING THE WORKER'S RIGHTS!!!! THE WORKERS ARE THE ONES THAT NEED THE POWER!!!!
streetpunkoi94 6 months ago
Up the Unions! An injury to One is an Injury to All! I.W.W. IU 640 and proud.
WobblyWolverine 6 months ago 3
this reminds me of dropkick's worker's song.
streetpunkoi94 6 months ago
billy bragg forever
makes me think soley for ihm
toydolls1979 7 months ago 3
I think @pukedragon just made this video so he can argue with people and spread his "free market" rhetoric. Shame on you. Based on your statements, you don't know what the "old unions" stood for either. And you obviously have no idea what communism or socialism is, or you wouldn't be calling Obama one. Before speaking on a subject, please read up on it a little bit. Fool.
watchthiscityfall 8 months ago
They still stand for that... at least the membership still does... in some cases, we're fighting our own managers, lol! We NEED to take our country back from the cushy fat asses who are in positions of power right now. I fear that it won't happen unless we hit levels of financial disaster akin to Argentina in the late 1990's. Worse... a part of me wants it, just so we can get it over with.
fittergal 9 months ago
Unions are the firewall between dignity and slave wages. That's the truth, whether or not you like them.
fittergal 9 months ago 89
@fittergal I agree, what the unions once stood for was just getting enough to be able to live, from bosses who shut down anywhere else for them to go, who put them in debt, who made them nearly slaves. They got way off track at some point, but having honor in my work, not having to be an animal just to have a job, is something i owe those guys who fought.
pukedragon 9 months ago 5
@pukedragon true
WVliberty 8 months ago
@pukedragon fuck corporate america, bring back the "power" to the workers!
dualityofmen22 6 months ago 3
@pukedragon If you have those things you are luckier than most. Also, unions didn't wander off track; they were never perfect. What has changed is that the forces of capital have castrated them. Now when everyone is getting shafted they haven't any meaningful recourse because they've been convinced that any radical direct action is for commies and extremists. But given a little time, they will realise that the wealthy elite are a kind of extremist activist too. Maybe realise too late.
FrogmortonHotchkiss 3 months ago
@pukedragon We all owe them. For the 8 hour day, the 40 hour week, the weekend, coffee and lunch breaks, being allowed to go to the bathroom during work hours, sick days, paid vacation, and the list goes on.
ExUSSailor 1 day ago
@fittergal Honest brother R.W.A.W #12 NewHaven Ct.
MrFathips 2 weeks ago
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I love the photos, on one hand the old photos of people being exploited by their employers, and the new pictures of fat lazy people whining so that they can retire when they're 45. Bunch of lazy fucken whiners
ccpper 9 months ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
@ccpper When i made this video i just did it cause i liked the Tune and have respect for workers, and it was labor day. But over the last few years the modern unions have shown themselves to be nothing like the old unions. Just tools of commies and democrats who think they can thug themselves free crap without having to work as long as they support obama and other socialists.
pukedragon 9 months ago
@pukedragon like you know what the old unions were about or what socialism is aptly named puke.
ricknelms 9 months ago
@pukedragon Your absolutely correct. Fuck these communist pussy Union supporters. Goddamn socialist obama supporting un-American dirtbags
tactical2bagpipes 4 months ago
@ccpper yeah because progress became redundant 50 years ago you 'tard. Hell even Fukuyama have decided that "end of the world" was bullshit - why do people still argue for it when the writer don't?
ohyran1 7 months ago
Power in the Union? Somebody tell PBA 105 in NJ! Christie is really Fat!
uncivalservant 9 months ago
This is a great theme song for the book "The Grapes of Wrath"
wrenchturner1980 9 months ago
Yes! And here's to solidarity with folks in Wisconsin, Ohio, and other afflicted states.
EcoRover 10 months ago 3
Teamster 4 Life!!!
Bulldogwhu 10 months ago
This is the Dropkick Murphys original singer right?
chisox100 10 months ago
@chisox100 Original and best.
handyrotc 10 months ago
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jdr88172 11 months ago
We at the Underhill home are very pro-union.
poppakind1 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
the union is bulshit thier bleeding our country dry, its not right that other hard working people that are not in the union have to pay for thier health care and other shit with our tax money, oh yah and no one is trying to take thiere rights away you dumb fucks, we just want them to pay for a little bit of thier health care like everyone else, plus its not like the union gets all the things they deserve its some fat fucking union boss puling in millions while the hard workers get screwed
55destructo 11 months ago
the union is bulshit thier bleeding our country dry, its not right that other hard working people that are not in the union have to pay for thier health care and other shit with our tax money, oh yah and noone is trying to take thiere rights away you dumb fucks, we just want them to pay for a little bit of thier health care like everyone else, plus its not like the union gets all the things they deserve its some fat fucking union boss puling in millions while the hard workers get screwed
55destructo 11 months ago
@55destructo The unions are bleeding us dry? Strange, I thought it was the richest people in the country who get free money handed to them by the government and who almost brought the entire world economy to collapse not two years ago.
You realize wages have declined in step with the decline of union membership, right?
You're not a bright one, man.
TheLoveschach 11 months ago
@55destructo ...how in the fuck do unions make non-union members pay for their health care?
in reality, the vast majority of people who are very wealthy were born to either wealthy or upper middle class families. most people who are born poor come from poor families as well. we don't live in a meritocracy. when life becomes fair and pigs can fly, then you can complain about people trying to improve conditions for labor
BenkaiDebussy 10 months ago
Come on Wisconsin teachers! The Union FOREVER!
alphawolfoi 11 months ago 2
Go Wisconsin! This fight right now is in Madison,WI people. Help them out. Send food, water. Come and visit us! If you know the Street Dogs...get them here!!!
hitforhit 11 months ago
Dedicated to the people of Wisconsin! Fight them, don't let them take your rights away!
ExUSSailor 11 months ago 2
pukedragon u got awesome music man
WVliberty 1 year ago
epic !!!!!! overtly sentimental immature socialist manifestos combined with horrible music, i cant believe there are people dumb enough to enjoy this noise.
TheManolakis 1 year ago
@TheManolakis I agree totaly, these people are fucking idiots, the union can suck my balls, all they do is bitch and complain while non union workers pay for them to fucking protest
55destructo 11 months ago
@55destructo i never mentioned unions.In fact my father was a union iron worker and i'm grateful for the life that a fair wage allowed me to have.i commented on teenage wanna be commies with their idiotic ramblings and talentless poser blue collar, faux tough guy punk bands that should be out laying bricks. At least producing something besides this garbage that passes for "punk" music. As for your plight you don't like your life do something about it and quit bitching to people who dont give a f
TheManolakis 11 months ago
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TheManolakis 1 year ago
Only thing I don't like about this cover: Reducing the villains to the GOP. They may be the most powerful and most organized and most dedicated of workers' enemies in Washington, but Democrats shouldn't get a free pass. Enough Democrats stood against the EFCA to keep it from passing. Democrats helped bail out Wall Street.
They may be the lesser of two evils, but let's not forget they serve plenty of bosses, too. People power comes from the bottom up.
vapidkunst 1 year ago 4
If Capital has the right to unionize (in Corporations), than so does labor. In the end, as working class people, all we have is each other. Working people of all lands, unite! We have nothing to lose but the chains that bind us! End of story.
Isil1972 1 year ago 17
@Isil1972 OCCUPY!
hitchains 1 month ago
In the gilded age of transnational corporations, which lead the world every day to neo-feudalism and chase the lowest wages from one region of the globe to the next in a grim race to the bottom, there must rise the age of the _transnational union_. The right in the U.S. hyperbolize Obama into some sort of socialist, which is laughable on the face of it, but if they continue to get their way they ain't seen nothing yet--eventually labor will wake up and the Hamptons will become a prison camp.
edesaute 1 year ago
FUCK THIS YANK SHIT!!!!!
kentokie 1 year ago
@kentokie this "yank shit" of which you speak is acctually a cover billy bragg a very british person
LonelyPinballMachine 1 year ago
To the strikers at the Congress Hotel and Hilton Hotel in the heart of Chicago: Good Luck guys. This one is for you. To those fellows I met, chatted, and hung out with today - though I do not know your names, you taught me a real lesson today:
There truly is Power In A Union.
DvineINFEKT 1 year ago 2
Teamster For Life !
2050211 1 year ago
Violence will never solve nonviolent problems.
Fetchdafish 1 year ago
Union Pride Forever!
BubbaJazzy 1 year ago 2
GOD SAVE the Working class.
mdtiforp 1 year ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
@mdtiforp hahaha do you believe in that shit?
jamesroot123 1 year ago
@pukedragon It's easy to forget that Marx spent much more time analyzing capitalism than he did the plan for a socialist future. This means that the question of "what comes after capitalism?" is largely unanswered. You could have a system which combined worker ownership of business with free-market buying and selling of products, BTW.
The only real difference between Adam Smith and Karl Marx is that Smith was cautiously optimistic about people being able to keep plutocracy from going too far.
ComradeSephiroth 1 year ago 17
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@ComradeSephiroth in true capitalism there is nothing to stop those who are capable of it from starting their own business. There are some things i believe in that make excessive socialism and communism impossible. For one, you cannot consume more than you produce. For two, competition and freedom yeild prosperity for workers unheard of in ANY system that a government controls the economy. Just don't confuse the Working Class with the Moocher Class.
pukedragon 1 year ago
@pukedragon No I'm not a fan of any kind of planned economy, whether communist, fascist, mercantilist or a late-stage plutocracy. Actually there is a lot of effort on the political right to confuse worker-to-worker redistribution with worker-to-moocher redistribution. They're afraid that too many people might question the distribution of wages/salaries or, worst of all, realize that economic mooching (rent-seeking, windfalls, etc.) is actually very widespread at the top.
ComradeSephiroth 1 year ago
@pukedragon there's no such thing as a "moocher class," unless you're referring to people so wealthy they don't have to work.
hope this helps.
BenkaiDebussy 10 months ago
@pukedragon That's not necessarily so. Robert Kennedy once said that "You can't measure happiness with GNP." While it's true that the US has the highest total output of any nation in the world and has for some time, it does not have the happiest citizens, the broadest shared wealth, the highest output per capita or even the freest markets. The old soviet nations, for all their flaws, managed to provide universal access to housing, education and employment-- all with much less money than the USA.
IUEC38 6 months ago
@ComradeSephiroth This is simply wrong. Marx devoted quite a bit of time to criticizing models of socialism which retained markets - see The Poverty of Philosophy. Marx's theoretical system is also quite different from Smith's, insofar as Marx sees violence and domination at the heart of capitalism, and Smith didn't There are a host of other differences, but the main point is that Marx's critique of capitalism implies that markets are incompatible with a just society.
pmheideman 11 months ago
@ComradeSephiroth haha, that is actually already theorized. A socialist workplace (i.e. worker's self management) producing goods within a free market (i.e. lack of illegitimate authoritarian dictates about market interaction) is called mutualism.
"Mutualism is an anarchist school of thought that envisions a society where each person might possess a means of production, either individually or collectively, with trade representing equivalent amounts of labor in the free market."
rtnslnd 10 months ago
@ComradeSephiroth what you're describing is called mutualism
ccraigd89 10 months ago
@pukedragon If you're interested in ideas which combine worker ownership with markets look into Proudhoun and his philosophy of mutualism which actually preceded Marxist socialism.
richardrussell3 8 months ago
Many men and women spilled blood to gain decent pay, safer working conditions and generally begrudging respect from the ruling class...I am grateful to be in a union...THE UNION FOREVER!
Happy May Day
68evolver 1 year ago
@68evolver Happy Mayday from Clerkenwell Green!
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
out for may day! Union!
Luxontour 1 year ago
Bragg's arrangements + Boston street punk power. FU(kin nice!
mthai66 1 year ago
I have to say these chaps do the song jolly well, what!
willemslie 1 year ago
Dam just listen to the great music ^^....The colour of the stable changes, but the cows inside are the same .)
Tastelikechicken21 1 year ago
not if they're brown cows, then you get chocolate milk.
pukedragon 1 year ago
@pukedragon Just a trick to turn the cows against each other. Its so old like the mankind is. And it will always work. Just my two cents ^^
Tastelikechicken21 1 year ago
so chocolate milk is all a government conspiracy....i knew it!
pukedragon 1 year ago
@pukedragon lol :D yes of course chocolate milk is just another word for Evil ^^
Tastelikechicken21 1 year ago
he probably still ives with his mom and delivers pizza or some shit
badboy5715 1 year ago
Let's change the subject, at least momentarily. Who made this video, which I suspect has been thrilling and encouraging all of us? If pukedragon did, he did a great job. If not he's got good taste.
redchannels 1 year ago
The Janitors and unskilled labourers of America do a great job too; and yet Pukedragon attacks them. He believes that although they are hard working, tax paying members of society, they should should rely on charity for their healthcare. So why should anybody praise that sly, treacherous toad? If this deceitful little scab had an ounse of taste, then maybe he would not try to contradict the words of this song. Pukedragon is a traitor to his fellow countrymen, his family and his class.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago 43
should an assemblyline worker get the same pay as an archetect? should a janitor get the same pay as a doctor? if you think they should your an idiot too infected with communism to even exist. Why is getting charity from a private charity an insult, but forcing your company out or business by asking for pay thats twice what your work is even worth so great? How many unions forced their company to close so they could go stand in unemployment lines?
pukedragon 1 year ago
If you weren`t such an ignoramus, you might have been able to comprehend my previous posts. I have already stated that I do not advocate that all workers are paid the same regardless of career, but I do however support all workers whose conditions of employment are under attack. The thought of just one hard working, tax paying citizen (of the richest nation on earth) having to go cap in hand for healthcare makes me want to throw up. Hang your head in shame class traitor.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
You really cannot tell the difference between your arse and your elbow. In one breath you accuse trade unionists of being communists; the next they're great! Do you enjoy paid holidays and sick pay? Do you enjoy a company pension scheme? Are there laws in place that ensure that you work in a safe environment? None of these conditions miraculously fell out of the sky. They were fought for and won by trade unions to ensure that we all live in a more civilized society.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
A society is a union of persons in one interest. A mob of selfish individuals like you is a chaos.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
Pukedragon, you're a fucking moron. You'll be shot first in the case of revolution.
arbetarklass 1 year ago
i'm sure i will be, communism only murdered 200 million people last century. With commies like yourself and obama on the loose, maybe you'll double that number this century?
Organization, making deals with the bosses, and unifying against bullies and thugs. Those are wonderful things that the Unions did. But the jobs bank and pensions after only 30 years, you've shot yourselves in the foot.
pukedragon 1 year ago
the majority of unions sold out the worker long ago but the american worker has a right and must organize again . we live in a country where wages and benefits are declining while the cost of everything is astronomical we need sound money ,end the fed, and we also need REAL working class representaion
logan1776 1 year ago
@logan1776 i with you a hundred percent on that buddy or should i say comrade!!!!!!!!!!!! But what people in this country think is a working class representaion changes quicker the the seasons thats the reson Obama won we hate the way Bush was leading us and people jumpship and voted Democratic or independent. This is a long and anyonning problem of America as no one party is actually going to do anything because when they do people decide that what they are doing is wrong.
WorldDebater 1 year ago
@logan1776 to fix this problem we must have a independent run that has never run for anything before and get into congress and get more people like him and get a person to run for president in a few decades from that party we need a independent or third party to take over. Or just have a socialist or Anti-capitalist revolution as that might be the only way.. as we will be stuck with careerist politicians as we Americans suck at making up our minds or we are just afraid of change.
WorldDebater 1 year ago
The post before this one is a reply to skcodyerrus, one that makes no sense where it sits. So what else is new?
redchannels 1 year ago
Housekeeping: 3 posts down the page
from here is my response to skcdoyerrus.
4 posts down is my statement that I didn't
regret mentioning syndicalism, but I did
regret posting overmuch. Where these are
they don't make much sense, so, yep,
one more post in explanation. See ya.
redchannels 1 year ago
Second of two posts - sorry, y'all I mentioned syndicalism because I
was trying to find common ground with pukedragon. He baffled me by posting this song, with its phrase "Let's fight the right wing", and then talking libertarian, which I consider a right-wing philosophy. Such was also my reason in ideating about a wholesome, progressive, labor-friendly government "withering away" to leave a wholesome, humane anarchism.
I feel no need for such a step myself.
redchannels 1 year ago
i like alot of songs i don't necessarily agree with. In this particular case, i believe unions are absolutely necessary in cases of abuse, in cases of being used just one step above that of a slave. Today, you will almost never find such cases. Not so even just 30 or 40 years ago. But today, in many cases, unions have gone too far, actually destroying their own jobs by asking for way too much. Look up "Jobs Bank" on wikipedia or google and you should see what i'm talking about.
pukedragon 1 year ago
It is obvious that you, just like redchannels, is not a trade unionist. With the demise of trade unions in the 'land of the free', how many of your citizens are employed as casual labour? Do they enjoy sick pay, paid holidays and the same employment rights as those who are organised? How many working class Americans have to work until they drop? How many hard working, tax paying citizens, of the richest and most powerful nation on earth, rely on charity for their health care?
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
you want to replace private charity with government charity for the sake for 5% or less of americans? Business are competitions, and businesses can't compete paying janitors and unskilled laborers the same as doctors and lawyers. If your a skilled laboror, you could start your own business if the left and the socialists in government would just get out of your way.
pukedragon 1 year ago
Competition gluts our markets, it enables the the rich to take advantage of the necessities of the poor. Competition drives down the wages of the worker! Just over a century ago, Britain with her empire was the richest country in the world; and yet 55% of children in the East end of London were dead before their fifth birthday. Thanks to the trade union movement, a Labour government and those with a social conscience, we have enjoyed a National haealth service for the past 51 years.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
It's just a new brand of socialism that doesn't just steal from the productive in a society, but steals from future generations. It means that you've lowered the bar so much that no one can be prosperous, therefor, everyone is equal. It's the exact opposite of being free. Slaves who instead of farming a cash crop, are just used to harvest votes for a socialist side of the government. It's a pathetic existance.
pukedragon 1 year ago
Yeah right! Your rotton principled tumour will not allow you to comprehend any kind of socialistic act what so ever. Instead you jealously attack trade unionists by accusing them of of being communists. Are you really that ignorant?
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
A communist is someone who believes what you believe. That everyone should get the same benefit regaurdless of ability. That nothing should be bought, but rather divided out equally by a totalitarian government. That is communism. You are a communist.
pukedragon 1 year ago
You pay tribute to Labour day by uploading a song and video depicting the working class struggle; and yet you attack trade unions. In defense of the unions, I have mentioned some of the conditions that most workers now enjoy, most notably the NHS. In your ignorance, you have proceeded to rant about executions, famines and the population being turned into slaves. I am an active trade unionist who enjoys a good salary, holiday pay, sick pay and an excellent final salary pension scheme.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago 2
I do not advocate that all workers should get paid the same regardless of ability, but I do however support workers from other trades whose pay and conditions are under attack. This is a principle that your rotton tumour will not allow you to comprehend. It is nice to know that McCarthyism is alive and well!
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
No body today but people who are paid under the table are comparable to workers before the 1970's. If you don't like your job, if you don't like how your boss treats you, start your own company. Oh thats right, you leftists have made that impossible with your red-tape and bullshit. You made your bed, now lie in it.
pukedragon 1 year ago
So your advise to an employee who has been the victim of racial or sexual discrimination would be: "start your own business". What advise could you offer to a person who is being bullied in the work place or has been unfairly dismissed? Are there laws in place that protect you from unsafe working practices? Do you run your own company? If so, what conditions do your employees work under? Do you find that as you`re in competition with other firms, you need to cut expenditure?
skcodyerrus 1 year ago 18
i don't have any employees you filthy communist trash. Since you don't speak or read english anyways, go live in north korea with the other commies and tell me how much you love it then. What use is a union if the government controls your working conditions for you? None. A useless middleman between government and business. If a woman is being (honestly) sexually harassed or abused at work, she should kill whoevers doing it and/or leave. Being a commie, you rely on the government of course.
pukedragon 1 year ago
When you set off for work, do you wear a cheap suit and carry a breifcase with nothing in it but a jam sandwich? Do you kid yourself that you`re some sort of executive; but in reality you obediently take all the crap that is thrown at you? Do you jealously attack trade unionists because you`re unable to controvert the principles of dignified workers, without contradicting yourself? Please tell me how an awful individual like you, with a backbone that is made of jelly, is able to stand alone?
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
@pukedragon
Your name says it all really - case closed!
auguritutto 1 year ago
what did Communist Russa, Communist China, Communist Cambodia, and Communist North Korea do for workers that you so desperately need to happen everywhere else.
Unions are great. Communism, not so much. Unions are an agreement between workers and business owners. Communism is nothing more than fascism in a disguise. Real Unions died out long ago now.
pukedragon 1 year ago
@pukedragon there are anarquists Unions.
cagunlapoota 1 year ago
@pukedragon Those weren't really communist societies. What is Marxism? Marxism is in essence direct democracy. Marx & Engles advocated for a society where workers democratically controlled the state, the factories and the means of production. What you had under Stalin and in China was privately owned states that controlled the means of production. This is how Tony Cliff coined the concept of state capitalism which is what you essentially had under the societies you listed. Read more mate
queerveganliberal 1 year ago
@queerveganliberal There are no communist societies. The two terms are mutually exclusive. There's only idiots who want communism and so give absolute power to the first monster to come and promise it to them.
pukedragon 1 year ago
This National health service provides all the healthcare that a Janitor, Doctor, Lawyer or Unskilled Labourer would require for themselves and their families. No need for them to endure the degradation and indignity of credit scoring. It is abhorent that the richest country in the world cannot provide this basic human right to all of its citizens. You would rather snatch bread out of the mouth of your neighbour than provide for your fellow countrymen!
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
from each according to his abilities to each according to his needs? Sorry, the world tried that last century and it was a failure resulting in the deaths of hundreds of millions of people due to purposefully caused famines, execution of political enemies, etc. Your dream world cannot happen without a totalitarian government controlling all aspects of society and the economy. This always results in mass graves. Socialists eventually run out of other peoples property and wealth.
pukedragon 1 year ago
The National Health Service was founded here in Britain in 1948. There were no executions of political enemies, there were no mass graves and not one single person died of starvation. If you lived here in the UK, you would be able to have your rotton principled tumour removed for free. It would then be possible for a selfish individual like you to comprehend our wonderful institution we call the NHS.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
then why is the survival rate of cancer patients higher in the U.S than any socialist country, including U.K, Germany, France, and Canada?
pukedragon 1 year ago
1. The UK, Germany, France, and Canada are not socialist countries. These countries all have capitalist economies. However, they do have national healthcare. To insist that government-run healthcare makes a country socialist is like insisting that a government-run mail service or military makes a country socialist. Is the US socialist?
Ceraziefish 1 year ago
Also the survival rate has little to do with the issue at hand. Yes, the US's healthcare system may be able to provide better cancer care for the individual consumer. But there are many people in the US who cannot afford to pay for this treatment (or can pay for it only by impoverishing themselves), where as any cancer patient in the UK would get treatment for free. That's the issue.
Ceraziefish 1 year ago
Interestingly, you will find examples of abuse in many countries today that are not in the first world, thanks to the globalized nature of capitalism. Do you not think that sweatshop workers in Burma or China or Mexico should unionize themselves? Remember that in many cases these are workers employed by American companies to make American consumer goods, and they are exploited because their countries lack the progressive laws that our countries have thanks to the labor movement.
Ceraziefish 1 year ago
@Ceraziefish You speak the truth man i have heard that in Texas it is illegal to have Unions. As i live in Texas i can't wait to get out as i can't stand the way we are.
People complain about government but then they complain when people what to change it there is no hope unless we take it from under their feet. I am not saying Europe is better but they do a better job at pretending they care for there people.. Not the bail-out thought that is just one stupid plan!!!
WorldDebater 1 year ago
@Ceraziefish We who want something different wither it is socialism or communism or something different all together we must rise up and claim our right and kick out the old habbits and give rise to a new freedom and laws. Let people have a voice and not pretend like they do.
WorldDebater 1 year ago
I'm an artist, and there's no artists' union, at least not in my town. I'd suppose for you about my starting one, but it'd result in more of the overelaborate speech you're complaining about. My political fantasia was elaborately phrased because it was a fantasia. I understood that it would be the workers who made the union in my fictional world. I was just supposing, to no real point, about who would create the workplaces where these workers would have to organize themselves.
redchannels 1 year ago
You speak of syndicalism and yet you`re not a trade unionist. You are a socialist and yet you cannot organise as there is no artists` union your town. It is obvious to me that you are a principled and dignified worker; but you are also a fantasist.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
I didn't say I couldn't organize. I said I wouldn't run my mouth on the subject, essentially because I've been running my mouth on this string too much lately. I spoke of syndicalism even though I'm not in some as-yet-to-be-created artists' union because I was trying to dialogue with pukedragon, and trying to work out whether I'd want to live in a society where the lines of supply and substantial political power were in syndicalist hands.
Artists ARE fantasists. For the sake of new ideas.
redchannels 1 year ago
That was an apology for making two posts, not for mentioning syndicalism.
redchannels 1 year ago
redchannels 1 year ago
redchannels 1 year ago
I`ve got a rough idea what you`re on about, but would you please be so kind as to translate your argument into plain english. Are you a trade unionist? If so, you would know that the workers are the union.
skcodyerrus 1 year ago
redchannels 1 year ago
redchannels 1 year ago
I thought I'd try sort of a roundup of my
thoughts on these posts, going back two
months or so. -- I would say that in general libertarian politics are quite bad for working people. -- I think pukedragon may be trying to develop a concept of some form of syndicalism, in which worker's cooperatives enjoy a high degree of autonomy, freely trade with, help, or ignore one another; and in which this (see next post)
redchannels 1 year ago
Great song. I really like it. Street Dogs fucking own!
Back to the world is one of my favorites though and you alone.
MrRuigni 1 year ago
I thought Billy Bragg was the only guy that knew how to play this song.
EdUCate4All 2 years ago
5.000 *
grummeper 2 years ago
is this a billy brag cover?
punkhippe 2 years ago
yes
pukedragon 2 years ago
I love how they sing about what is really going on
TheZero4life 2 years ago 2
thats punk!
thineleachbath 2 years ago
when did we become more about the bullshitting,lie'ing polititions, and less about our working brother's and sister's(and our family's)???? they don't care about us!!!! they just use us for photo op's and stolen votes...
oilman115181 2 years ago
the unions have definately lost sight of workers. Supporting obama and the liberals? How many jobs will be lost by their pseudo-enviromentalist laws? limiting coal, gas, and oil drilling, for what? to limit the amount of Plant Food in the atmosphere? the earth isn't even being affected by CO2, it was all a fraud and a lie. Get back on track unions.
pukedragon 2 years ago
its seems like some unions are just as corrupt as the corporations but unions are still needed and really both parties are good to unions politics in this nation should more towards being libertarian
WVliberty 2 years ago
i think the vast majority of people are libertarian, they just don't know it. It'll be a long time before libertarians, or libertarian minded republicans gain any real power though. Unions are a good thing, but unions should negotiate with employers, not become a branch of the government.
pukedragon 2 years ago
@pukedragon alott of truth in that man u from Appalachia
WVliberty 2 years ago
some of my grandparents were, i'm from the pittsburgh area.
pukedragon 2 years ago
and libertairian ideas are very negative for workers. without goverment involvement buisness is free to exploit workers in america and all over the world. i feel like if your looking for workers rights you wanna look into liberal ideas, like socialism, or communism but removing goverment and asking nicely for big buiesness to play nice is not a workers paradise
punkhippe 2 years ago
without government involvement people are free.
Communism? you think the workers "employed" by the government at gunpoint in communist countries have it right? There is no difference between communism and fascism, they are one in the same.
pukedragon 2 years ago
yea but free people starve in the streets because no ones protecting them from the people with money ( i dont mean cops ether). yea belive having a job (forced or not) is better than starving on your own account. i think you may be wrapped up in this idea that libertarianism is a party that flips the man off but really, goverment or buisness can screw you over the difference is goverment is not souly working for profit
punkhippe 2 years ago
who in any 1st world country is starving in the streets? The only people i can think of are the mentally ill and neglected elderly and children. Freely run charities can find people to fill their beds and to pass out their free food too. Yes, the government isn't working for profit, they are working for Idealism and power. Thats why the government wastes so much of the money it takes in.
pukedragon 2 years ago
Very few people starve in the streets in first-world countries (probably more than you think, but still very few), but it doesn't change the fact that without people starving or barely eking out a living elsewhere, the current system could not sustain itself, hence opposition to the whole current system of things. Even if worker's rights are earned and means of education secured in countries that currently supply cheap labour [cont. in next comment]
Rykemasters 2 years ago
[...] as is slowly happening in China and India, the same volume of cheap labour must be kept up in order to maintain the prices, for us, in first-world nations, anything like what they are now. If many Chinese and Indian people hold educated, high-paying jobs, there will still be a need for manual labour, and the cycle of industrialisation and fight for labour rights will repeat itself until the system breaks, most likely, unless something is seriously changed.
Rykemasters 2 years ago
ohh i have a basic eduaction. its a lesser of two evils, the liberal party has shown to be the party for working class and the unions. yes eviormental issues will hurt laborers but the conservatives economic policys destroy jobs to due to lazie fair economics encourageses out sourcing. the deference is the liberal party wants to help unions. and all of the global warming is a lie conspiracys are dumb and baseless
punkhippe 2 years ago
Democrats are the party of slavery. Instead of farming cash crops we're now asked to farm votes. Being totally dependant on government for food, shelter, healthcare, and education makes a person a slave. Free people don't need to work in factories or for big corporations, they can innovate, produce, and live on their own means. Giving their time in exchange for their pay, not being forced to do something in exchange for it.
pukedragon 2 years ago
well sure at one point in history they were the party of oppression, but thats only till the 1940's when Charles wallace championed racism for the republican party. i like your speech but im not sure its practical in reality. do free people no longer need food or shelter. goverment or no goverment to make money you need to compeat and doing so against corporations is impossible with the differnce is total capitcal, goverment or no goverment
punkhippe 2 years ago
How much power and wealth do you think the government should hold? All of it? Sorry, i'll never trust any government THAT much. If you look at history, all monopolies are only made possible through government intervention. All cases of depression, famine, and war too.
pukedragon 2 years ago
but your wronge here. ok heres an example the depresion in america right now is caused by bank giving large loans to people they know wont be able to pay it back, the idea being this would generate insain amounts of intrest money, it did until the people physically could not affored the loans and had to leave there homes as a result of the poverty the banks created, this is the american banking and housing crisis
punkhippe 2 years ago
had the goverment stepped in and universalized the banks the goverment (whos main goal isnt profit unlike buisness) would not issue unpayable loans and cause the crisis. i could go on and on about how its not goverment, its goverment not sticking it to buisness enought that creates problems, and though libertarianism is a nice idea your not solving the problems you think you are
punkhippe 2 years ago
so you have no idea what Fannie Mae and Freddie Mack was? the government beurocracy that forced banks to give out the rediculous unpayable loans. Do you really think the banks want to give loans to people that can't pay the loans back? where is the profit in this? Why did the banks need corporate welfare if they were making so much money doing this?
pukedragon 2 years ago
to answer your second question, yes. its called sub prime morgage. people wanna live beyond their means and if they are willing to pay out the nose in the long run their able to thanks to sub prime morgages. initially banks were making rediculose amounts of money because of this the problem was no one was expecting the water to run out at the same time. this immediate drop in bank revenue caused them to collapse. this isnt a dark conspiracy theory. this has preatty much been proved.
punkhippe 2 years ago