hello, everybody, I just want everyone here to know that KKILO34 is a coward son oof a bitch piece of shit who filters his comments to present the illusion that people agree with him and that nobody hates his guts.
KKilo, you are a utterly useless piece of shit with a disgusting voice that makes me want to rip your throat out.
"RBGSolider" give it up already man, you folks look like clowns but even clowns deserve more respect. Most of your doctrine are based on lies. And your "boy" Seti is a liar full tilt. You and your "boy" are proof that there is something seriously wrong in the "Blackkk Community". You see, your comments reflect the stupidity and you cannot even refute one counter claim. All you do is cry racism. Like likkke a bitch.
@RBGSolider This comment doesn't address the central question in the video. If slavery created such profits, why are former slave states poorer than union states? Why are West African countries where slaves were sold by other Africans not richer than other African countries? Notice how this black supremacist just labels the questions "racist" and doesn't even answer them. This is how black racism works. Just cry racism whenever someone calls you on your bullshit.
Wouldn't the Great Depression put a real stop to the inheritance of any descendants of slavers? Though I am not from your country, only the rich owned slaves, and slavery only made the rich richer. I kind of wonder why my countrymen are so well off without the use of slavery in the past. Of course, Africa should be swimming in wealth due to the massive resources and slave labour STILL present there.
@WorldSacred Very true. Slavery does not result in widespread prosperity for anyone. It benefits only a small portion of society. And even those who benefit don't reap that much of a reward.
Bad history makes for bad individual attitudes. We are shaped by our culture and history. You for example are thinking like a typical American, only concerned with individual performance and incapable of accounting for social and historical dynamics, largely confined in present day US.
@DonVoghano Oh feel free to define who you are based on unpleasant events that were experienced by long-dead people whose only relationship to you is a similar shade of skin color. No one is trying to stop you. But that will undermine your success. And if you don't value success they way us "typical Americans" do, that's fine too. But when you have higher rates of poverty due to these attitudes, don't blame discrimination. You make your choice, and the outcomes are yours to live with.
@kkilo34 What makes us human is precisely the fact that the collective actions and thoughts of our ancestors affect and influence our way of thinking, our speech, our technology and lifestyle today. Every individual is responsible for his actions, but he's not responsible for the environment he grows up in or the socio-economic handicaps he happens to inherit from a bad history. It takes very strong spirits to escape the confinement of a ghettoized mentality.
@DonVoghano Again, you don't need to defend your belief that the past defines who you are. That will limit your possibilities in life, but you are free to limit your possibilities all you want. When they produce unpleasant circumstances or maintain those circumstances, you ARE responsible. If you deny that responsibility, that is also okay and typical of black culture. But it does cause your high poverty rates, and whites need not feel responsible or obligated to help you in any way.
@kkilo34 Haha so it's a "belief" now that history affects the present, and one that you obviously do not share clearly being a 100% self-made man who owes absolutely nothing to his society, history and heritage. Individuals are 100% responsible for anything that happens to them, they exist in vacuums and deserve absolutely no compassion or help of any way. In fact fuck em. Fuck em all up the ass. Why anyone ever felt a sense responsibility or obligation towards others' misfortunes is beyond me.
@DonVoghano The past of my ancestors, which contains much hardship, does not affect my present. That's what's called a "winning attitude," and yes, black culture does not foster such attitudes. It encourages self-defeating ideas like the notion that events you only read about in books can somehow determine who you are today. And again, it's fine you want to believe that. But such self-defeating thinking does cause a sense of futility and leads to high rates of failure in the black community.
@DonVoghano "deserve absolutely no compassion or help of any way." I never said this. But many (not all) black people have this ridiculous sense of racial entitlement that says that people are obligated to help them and responsible for fixing their problems. There's a big difference between acting out of voluntary compassion and out of a sense of responsibility. We aren't responsible for why black people are poor. It's fine if people want to help, but they shouldn't feel obligated. We aren't.
@kkilo34 Quite apart from any discussion of race, it's a basic moral obligation for fortunate people to help the less fortunate. Now how deeply this is felt to be a responsibility depends on the moral character of the individual and the ideological environment he grows up into. The "winner-loser" dichotomy is a prime example of an ideological framework which tries to obscure basic moral principles by separating the world in losers who deserve to die and winners who take all.
@DonVoghano " it's a basic moral obligation for fortunate people to help the less fortunate." And I disagree. What happens when someone causes their own misfortune? How do you help people who create misery for themselves? I never argued against charity, and we're not talking about the "unfortunate." Fortune happens. But the poverty in the black community is self-created. So, by treating them as charity cases, you actually hurt them. Welfare create dependency and helplessness.
@kkilo34 That welfare comment is the usual, tired, US propaganda hogwash - and demonstrably wrong. Providing quality education, health and security, as well as encouraging employment and retraining for the jobless and the least in a society benefits the poor AND rich who can safely walk out of their gated communities and enjoy their cities without being shot by gangs. It's blatantly obvious when comparing rates of crime and quality of life in European welfare social democracies vs the US.
@kkilo34 On the question of what white people in the US owe black people, you do not share in the crimes of your ancestors, you are not responsible for them if indeed they took part in the slave system. But their consequences persist. Now whether you want to assume that burden of guilt and help or not is your moral choice to make. But whatever you do, don't ever forget that black Americans are struggling to climb out of a cultural abyss and for this they deserve encouragement, not reproach.
@DonVoghano "that black Americans are struggling to climb out of a cultural abyss and for this they deserve encouragement" What reproach? I said you're free to embrace self-defeating ideas all you want. Feel free. I neither condemn nor praise you for it. But, on the other hand, when you blame people with my skin color for your problems, you are racially scapegoating. And then you DO deserve reproach. If you don't want reproach, stop blaming other races for your problems.
@kkilo34 It does not take encyclopedic knowledge to admit to the crimes of the Europeans, for which every descendant of Europe enjoys the fruits today. The comparative advantage in violence gained in their internal struggles in the 1500-1600s allowed them to freely ravage the world in search for profits. Without the colonies, with armies of slaves picking cotton for their textile industries, Britain would not have had the means to enact the industrial revolution. These are historical facts.
@DonVoghano " for which every descendant of Europe enjoys the fruits today." This is a statement of racial prejudice. It says "white people didn't really earn their wealth." In that way, the prosperity of whites can be condemned as ill gotten goods. But this is a lie. There's NOT A SHRED of economic evidence that today's wealth can be explained by way of slavery. If that's the case, why are southern states where slavery was practiced, on average, poorer than union states?
@kkilo34 Slavery is only a part of the equation. The very land that provided the goods was often occupied, with all kinds of the worst atrocities happening. We are talking concentration camps, intimidation and collective punishment, betrayal and humiliation... Enslavement is only a fraction of the crimes. Goods like cotton, sugar, timber, metals: everything that powered the industrial revolution came from the colonies. Even today oil, the main energy source, is held by occupation and corruption.
@DonVoghano Again, why is it, then, that the states that practiced slavery are some of the poorest in this country? And now you bring up oil, which shows you've not a leg to stand on. Fact is, you hate white people and don't believe they should be allowed to keep what they earn. Why can't you just say this?
@kkilo34 Really, I'm sorry, but your analysis is once again very partial and limited. I'll be glad to talk more extensively with you via PM so we can escape this 500 word constraint. Long story short, the North wanted protectionism to grow its industry on the Brit model, the South wanted free trade to sell its agro-products to Brit industry. This is the main cause of the civil war, and the South expected to be saved by the Brits throughout. Needless to say the Brits never came.
@DonVoghano I never said anything about the Civil War. And that has nothing to do with my argument. You are claiming whites' higher rates of wealth is a result of slavery. But states that practiced slavery before it was CONSTITUTIONAL OUTLAWED are TODAY poorer than states that didn't. So, if slavery could provide wealth 150 years after it was abolished, obviously this would not be the case. Your response has nothing to do with that question and does not answer it at all. Why so evasive?
@DonVoghano Further, I will not engage you in private. Your arguments are weak and silly. So, I want your defeat in this debate to be very public so everyone can see that the claim that whites are today benefiting from racism hundreds of years ago has no rational basis whatsoever. If you wish to say more than can fit in the comments box, then please make a response video. I will approve it so long as you approve my responses to it. What do you say? Let's make this even more public.
@kkilo34 It's not about public or private, it's about being able to explain myself in a more coherent way. I don't even own a camera, nor would I invest so much time on an Internet diatribe. If you are interested in having an honest debate, we can. But to me it just seems that at some point you just reset the discussion cause it's making you think too hard and switch back to "OMG BLACK PPL WANNA BE POOR LOL THEY GOT LOSER MENTALITY LOL IM A WINNER SO ILL GO PLACES."
@DonVoghano You don't need a camera. All you need is a mic and some freeware. If you're not into making videos, why are you here on a video forum? I'm not interested in a private debate. I'm not going to change your mind anymore than you will change mind. I can however change the minds of those who view the debate and demonstrate that your ideas are entirely flawed and baseless, as I've done so far. If no one can see you lose this debate, what's the point?
@kkilo34 All you have demonstrated is that you have a vague idea of a slave system appearing magically in the US some 400 years ago which was eventually outlawed making everything A-OK like in Smurfland. Only by this childish assumption does your "omg blacks are lazy hobos whites work so hard lol" 3rd grade argument survive. But since you refuse to look deeper cuz you "choose not to be bogged down by knowledge and culture" you can boast about having defeated a grade school strawman. Clap clap.
@DonVoghano I have never argued any such thing, and your claim is a strawman. I realize, though, that having lost this debate, you now have to resort to such fallacies. Fact: you never answered my question. If you can't answer that simple question, why should anyone believe you have a leg to stand on?
@DonVoghano And furthermore, let the record show that you didn't answer a single one of my questions. If your position is so strong, why do you keep avoiding my questions and trying to switch topics? It's quite clear you know you're losing this debate in the most obvious way and want to go private to save yourself the humiliation. Well, sorry. You believe that whites' wealth is a result of slavery and you've not a shred of evidence to back up that claim. You lose.
@kkilo34 I have answered every point. 1- Everyone is affected by history, not just because they read shit in books (which you obviously don't bother doing) but because PAST EVENTS AFFECTS PRESENT SOCIAL ARRANGEMENTS. 2- The success of Europeans, when properly understood, comes from a. COMPARATIVE ADVANTAGE IN VIOLENCE obtained mostly around the 16-18th century, which allowed for MASS COLONIZATION and CHEAP RESOURCES, which in turn allowed for INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT, ultimate deciding factor.
@DonVoghano Again, you did not answer my question. All you did was reassert your position. But that doesn't answer my questions about slave states being so poor if indeed whites' wealth can be traced back to slavery. You have a nice little argument here, but the economic data does not support it. Sorry. I realize, though, you have to believe that whites don't legitimately earn their wealth. And you'll never look down inside and ask yourself why you have to believe this.
@kkilo34 It's certain that a part of the wealth earned in industrial nations (by anyone) is illegitimate, because of the institutional structures that supported and still support major injustice and atrocities around the globe. But that's not my main point. My main point is that in the race to success in the US, blacks, as an enduring consequence of historical arrangements, on average start with less skills and in worse socio-economic environments. So they objectively have a tougher race to run.
@DonVoghano "on average start with less skills and in worse socio-economic environments." Yeah, they should fix that. I grew up poor and today earn a comfortable, middle-class salary. Yes, blacks start out on average poorer, but they cause their own poverty through their self-defeating attitudes and behaviors. Since they CHOOSE to embrace this self-defeat, then whites should not feel obligated to fix it or guilty for their own success. We chose success.We earned it. And blacks could have it too.
@kkilo34 This is not about personal cases, it's a statistic reality that the social ladder in the US does not work as well as it used to, meanwhile the rich have never been richer and clogged every nerve node of the society. Now the sad truth is that today even as you have conquered poverty, many white middle class families fall into it because of economic choices made above. There is little to choose at 20% real unemployment, as winning an attitude you may have, some will make it - most won't.
@DonVoghano "meanwhile the rich have never been richer" The poor have never been wealthier either than at any time in history. In just the past 15 years, according to the UN, the number of people on planet Earth who live on less than a dollar a day has been cut in half. Standards of living have rapidly rose in India and China, the planet's most populous country. Upward mobility is a reality for the vast majority of people on the planet.
@DonVoghano But blacks choose not to. And their free to make the choice to undermine their own success. I'm not trying to stop or change them. But I will *aggressively* defend my race against racial scapegoating. And when blacks claim they can't get ahead because they always start out poor, they are again trying to shoulder whites with the responsibility to fix their problems. Sorry, that shit ain't going to fly no more.
@kkilo34 They are not "shouldering whites," they are pointing out major flaws in the US system. The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West (which was not true 40 years ago). A society that increasingly becomes a welfare state for the rich and a debt-trap for the poor. The solutions that would truly benefit blacks are the same that would benefit most whites: less propaganda, less finance, bring industry back - all things that a well working State can encourage.
@DonVoghano "The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West " Wrong. The standards of living in this country are higher than most of the rest of the planet. Yes, there is a gap between rich and poor. In other countries, there is no gap, because poverty is spread evenly. You would prefer an equal distribution of poverty over an unequal distribution of wealth? Less finance? WTF are you talking about? Do you even understand how business works? If not, well, that explains a lot.
@DonVoghano "The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West " Wrong. The standards of living in this country are higher than most of the rest of the planet. Yes, there is a gap between rich and poor. In other countries, there is no gap, because poverty is spread evenly. You would prefer an equal distribution of poverty over an unequal distribution of wealth? Less finance? WTF are you talking about? Do you even understand how business works? If not, well, that explains a lot.
@kkilo34 That's why I said "West" as in advanced industrial societies usually understood to be in Western Europe, US, Canada and aligned countries with similar properties like Japan. What would I prefer? How about the way it was when it worked? Up until 40 years ago the US had a pretty even society. The rich paid their fair share of taxes and everyone prospered, just like they still prosper in Nordic countries today, where they still do pay fair taxes.
@DonVoghano "Up until 40 years ago the US had a pretty even society." This claim is flat false. Do you have a source to back this up? Do you know that, in fact, the wealthy pay a higher percentage of their taxes than they did 40 years ago? This is fact, and I can back up my claims with sources. Would you like to see them? They are mainstream sources, so you can verify this information yourself. Would you like to see the facts, or do you prefer to go on basing opinions on ignorance? Your choice.
@kkilo34 Like I previously stated, and repeated to no avail since you both ignore arguments and avoid reading freely available history, SLAVERY is a PART of a SYSTEMATIC POLICY OF OPPRESSION OF FOREIGN LANDS AT GUNPOINT of the mercantile era in Europe. So NO, it wasn't just slavery that made whites rich, just like it wasn't just concentration camps that made the Nazis powerful, get it? Not a single cause, but many different causes working together within an organized SYSTEM.
@DonVoghano Again, you reasserted your position. Wonderful. I ask again, if slavery caused such profits in white populations even today, why are slave states the poorest? They were poor before the Civil War as well. Likewise West African countries that sold the slaves to Europeans show no exceptional wealth. So, clearly your theory has some major holes in it.
@kkilo34 Because slavery was never meant to make the PLACES that practiced rich, just the few LANDOWNERS. The majority of the wealth went to industry in Britain and later in the North which processed the cheap raw material into high added value industrial goods with huge profit margins. A country doesn't establish colonies to make them rich, it establishes them to exploit them with the aid of a corrupt local oligarchy, which is why the US seceded in the first place. Not so hard to understand.
@kkilo34 I don't hate anybody's melanocyte activity and I don't think you do either. Just like I don't hate, say, the French who invaded and pillaged my country. But I do understand that the consequences of that historical act persist today. The economic and cultural relationship to France as well as the balance of wealth has since remained rather tipped in their favor, and there is little I, as an individual, can do to change these institutional facts.
@DonVoghano "But I do understand that the consequences of that historical act persist today." Yet, you can't provide a single argument to bolster that claim other than to keep repeating it. WHY ARE COUNTRIES IN AFRICA AND STATES IN THE US WHERE SLAVERY WAS PRACTICED NOT RICHER THAN THEIR NEIGHBORS IF INDEED THERE IS PROFIT STILL LINGERING FROM THOSE EVENTS? Why won't you answer this question? Why do you keep avoiding it? You're showing a lot of intellectual dishonesty here.
@DonVoghano If you'd like to learn more about this, see my video "Black Supremacist Economics." You will see that this idea that whites are richer than blacks because of "crimes" is the same idea that the Nazis promoted against the Jews. The Nazis said that the Jews earned their wealth through manipulation and exploitation. You believe the same about white people. Also, did you know 90% of all slaves in America were sold to Europeans by other Africans. If slavery is so profitable...
@DonVoghano ...then why aren't these West African nations also showing significant rates of wealth over other nations in Africa? If indeed slavery could cause wealth in a people centuries after the practice was abolished, then clearly, there would be more wealth in southern states and West African nations. But they are actually poorer than the neighbors. So your idea is based on a hatred of white people. You simply don't believe we deserve what we have. And we do.
@DonVoghano It is true that whites have committed some terrible crimes. We also invented the refrigerator, cured small pox, and destroyed the Nazis, which means for every life lost to these historical crimes you so focus on, ten lives were saved by the innovations of whites. I don't believe there's anything about whiteness that made us so successful, but why don't you credit us with those accomplishments? Instead, the only history your interested in is the one with whites as evil killers.
@kkilo34 No, you are not getting the point. Colonies provided with cheap raw materials and trade goods that gave early European trade and industry an insane boost. These goods were extracted and produced at gunpoint by enslaved populations within brutal military occupations. These occupations often forced different peoples away from their native land, with huge loss of culture and languages and the relentless instilling of a mentality of inferiority through widespread, institutionalized racism.
@DonVoghano There are MANY poor immigrants who come to this country with nothing, including many from Africa. In a single generation, they enjoy an upward mobility into the middle class, despite facing the same discrimination that American-born blacks allegedly face and a lot of challenges they don't, including language barriers. So, wealth can be created in a single generation, as is proven by millions of immigrants. Blacks fail at high rates because many choose to fail. Simple as that.
@kkilo34 Are you denying that institutionalized racism in the US was systematically punishing blacks as recently as the 1960s? And that despite institutional changes many of the attitudes and ghettos formed in those years are still alive and well? Many black individuals today succeed. That's not the point. The point is that for many blacks to succeed it takes challenging the cutthroat mentality of ghettos and rising above a deeply felt sense of inferiority projected by history and society.
@DonVoghano "Many black individuals today succeed. That's not the point. " NO, that IS THE POINT. It's just a fact that's inconvenient to your ideological position, so you want to dismiss it. If black people feel inferior, then they need to build their self esteem as individuals. If you can't understand that individuals are responsible for their own self esteem, then you don't have the most basic tools to be a success in life. Sorry, but you don't.
@DonVoghano And your attitude is not surprising since you insist an individual's self-esteem is at the mercy of events that individual only reads about in books. That would be like me claiming my self-esteem is harmed by stories of childhood abuse experienced by a long-dead person, but since I read about his abuse in a book and CHOOSE to identify with that person as if their trauma were my own, then I'm not responsible for that choice.
@DonVoghano Again, it's fine if black people want to CHOOSE to be traumatized by hardships they themselves have never, ever faced. It's fine if you want to cling to the past and insist it defines who you are today. But these are self-defeating ideas that will erode your will, your self esteem, and your ambition. In turn, you will engage in behaviors that undermine your success. And feel free. I just want whites to see that you do do it to yourselves, and discrimination is not the problem.
The problem with blacks in america is because it's not PC to criticize their culture or lifestyle. Lots of races and cultures had it far harder and more recently than blacks and yet they have moved on and do not have the same problems as them now. Why is it not okay to hold people of color to the same standards we would hold whites or any other race?
@foozybearz That's precisely what blacks want. They want to be held to lower standards. They want to morally condemn others, while being immune to such condemnation themselves. They want to label anyone racist while being immune to such labels themselves. They want to hold others accountable without being held to any accountability themselves. To put it another way, they want a racially based privilege.
So blacks are not successful because of the lack of hard work, healthy attitudes, and successful behaviors. Instead of the opportunities actually be given of them?
I WILL COME TO YOUR HOUSE. TAKE OVER. PUT CHAINS ON YOU AND YOUR FAMILY. WHIP YOU UNTIL YOU HAVE LOST COUNT. DEHUMANIZE YOU IN FRONT OF YOUR FAMILY TO THE POINT WHERE THEY LOSE HOPE IN YOUR MANHOOD. MAKE YOUR FAMILY WORK FOR ME WHILE I MAKE PROFITS. RAPE YOUR DAUGHTERS SO THAT SOME OF THE CHILDREN RESEMBLE ME.... REPEAT THIS FOR SOME CENTURIES. The workout the answere of this equation (i.e do this with honesty. I know your kind has not had much practice... but just trt your best )
@Mrcbclobster Did any of these things happen to you? Really? Did you call the cops? You do know that they would arrest the people that did this to you, right? If it didn't happen to you personally, then why do you feel the need to identify with injustices you've never faced? Why do you feel the need to claim the hardships of your ancestors as your own to create the illusion that you suffer these things to? Clearly, your status as a victim is important to you. Why?
.... and if they happen to get a credit card they run themselves into life long debt (just like the rest of us). If they get disposable income they don't put the kids through college, hell they drop out in highschool to sell drugs or work as laborers. That is poor black people. The rest of the black people did work hard, save, plan for the future, and most of them are seeing the same rewards from that as white people and other races. Black economics is entitlement and ## from white guilt.
@foozybearz "The rest of the black people did work hard, save, plan for the future, and most of them are seeing the same rewards from that as white people and other races." Thats assuming they had the education to do so first then had a system of support and then didnt get taken advantaged afterward. What about the state of black businesses?
@newfish09 What about the state of black businesses? Fact is black culture in America deeply embraces racial scapegoating and defeatism. This leads to high rates of poverty. Whites don't cause this. Blacks cause their own misery. And any black person that chooses to succeed, doesn't blame others for his or her problems, and does what one needs to do to succeed will have it no harder than any white person. Simple as that.
@kkilo34 "one needs to do to succeed will have it no harder than any white person." You still didnt mention the state of black businesses. That matters.
@newfish09 Whatever the state of black businesses, that is the fault of black people. If their businesses are doing well, that is their fault. If they are doing poorly, that is their fault too. So, yeah, it doesn't matter whether or not I mention one thing or another.The state of ALL BLACK PEOPLE'S LIVES are the responsibility of black people.It's astounding how many black people just can't comprehend the concept of personal responsibility, much less live by it.And you think whites do it to you?
@newfish09 Sorry, but by this comment, you prove my point. You can't even fathom the personal responsibility, so it's clear you were raised very poorly. You keep pointing to black businesses and can't understand how responsibility. In other words, your mama didn't give you the personal tools you need to succeed. You could CHOOSE to succeed anytime you want. But you'd have to take responsibility first, and you don't even know what that means. Sorry, but most whites are taught this from birth.
@kkilo34 you didnt answer my question. I didnt say anything about personal responsibility. Most black are taught this not to be in the system. You looked over my question. This has nothing to do with personal responsibility. Persons with personal responsibility would have looked for opportunities for success. Quite a few have, many are not as lucky. The state of black businesses would have answered your question and mine.
@newfish09 Actually, if your question had any merit, you would have explained how. So, why don't you do that. The state of black businesses is as shitty as anything else black people do. That is a result, as I explained, of the self-defeating attitudes and behaviors in black culture in America. It has nothing to do with racism. Blacks fail, because they choose to fail. Your response to this argument is to keep insisting I haven't answered some question. You're being very insincere here.
@kkilo34 "The state of black businesses is as shitty as anything else black people do. That is a result, as I explained, of the self-defeating attitudes and behaviors in black culture in America." Nice how did I know it would steep to that level. Many blacks are successful not all however that hasnt stopped you from throwing them under the bus. You havent answered it, because you havent alluded to it. You are using racist economics.
@newfish09 I noticed you were unable to explain what your question demonstrated or what merit it had to the conversation. And just what is "racist economics?" Explain to me what would make an "economics" racist? Do racist economics burn crosses? Do they enslave people? No. What you mean is that I express opinions you disagree with. So, when you say you're a victim of racism, you mean you're forced to tolerate people disagreeing with you. Oh, you poor helpless baby, you. How can you stand it?
@kkilo34 "Explain to me what would make an "economics" racist?" Apparently black supremacists, unless this video wouldnt be. "Do racist economics burn crosses? Do they enslave people?" Poor argument and a nice reframing of the argument. You are allowed to disagree however I am to correct you on both being wrong on what is so called "black supremacist economics" and my actual race.
@kkilo34 "So, when you say you're a victim of racism, you mean you're forced to tolerate people disagreeing with you." Another porr arguement and completely shies away from the issue at hand.
@newfish09 I love how you keep claiming my arguments are so poor, but you never seem to be able to exactly explain how they're flawed. You keep insisting there's some message, question, or issue that's not being addressed, yet you can never say precisely what they are. You make references to things you claim are so important, yet you can never explain why they're important. Clearly, you're just playing silly games to avoid admitting I'm making very good points. And I can prove it....
@newfish09 Describe in SPECIFIC detail PRECISELY what "issue at hand" is being shied away from. No more silly games. See, I think you're lying through your teeth and there's no "issue at hand" being shied away from at all. Instead, you make these vague references to some point that doesn't actually exist. That way, you can pretend you've made an argument when really all you've done is made vague references to some illusive argument you can never seem to articulate.
@newfish09 If I'm wrong and there really is some question, issue, or point being shied away from, avoided, or left unaddressed, you'll prove it by EXPLAINING IN SPECIFIC DETAIL PRECISELY what that is. If you cannot say specifically, then you know you're full of shit. You're just lying to these people, and the "state of black businesses" had no relevance, and there was no issue being shied away from. Prove me wrong if this is not the case. I eagerly await your DETAILED response.
@kkilo34 I don't think it's a racial problem that causes black failure, it's a cultural and economic one. I'm in agreement that many have self defeating attitudes as well as self destructive ones. They don't exactly choose to fail but they don't put in the hard work or exercise the discipline needed to succeed. As long as thugs, pimps, and low class people are the preferred role models I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. When you get more respect for your grades than for stealing...
@foozybearz When I say they choose to fail, I mean they could choose to engage in attitudes, behaviors, and choices that produce unfavorable outcomes, such as high rates of poverty. So, they don't say, "Hey, I think I'd like to be a failure." But they do choose to deny any personal responsibility for the results in their lives, which undermines their ability to examine mistakes and choose different courses that would produce more favorable outcomes.
1. Education is a right all citizens have. Anybody can go to highschool for free. Dropout and graduation rates have more to do with the quality of the school than the racial or financial makeup of it's students. There are many exemplory inner city schools. They have easier access to higher education than white people as well with the NAACP and Negro college fund.
2. System of support is a persons family and community. If your family is shit and your community is shit, thats not race
So my question to these people who say that black people are being held back by whites and that racism is responsible for the wealth divide between blacks and whites is this "How many years does it take a race to get back on it's feet?" Everybody else is doing pretty damned good in spite of recent tragedy and poverty. They worked hard, put their kids through school and reaped the rewards. But poor blacks waste money on shitty cars, stereos, and rims, don't take care of their homes or stuff....
Jews were at the center of a world war, were systematicly wiped out in death camps, had their homes, lives, and wealth taken from them. Not in some distant past but in our lifetime. 50 years later they have their own country to call home and it's doing so well that NOBODY FUCKS WITH ISRAEL.
Every wave of immigration from the Chinese to the Irish began in abject poverty. Cheap Irish labor actually pushed blacks out of dock work for a time. 50 years later we have doctors, lawyers, etc from them.
@foozybearz Didnt the area of Israel got taken? And was financially support from an external source? Jews and Israelities are not the same thing and even if they were being wiped out has nothing to do with wealth.
@newfish09 Africa has received $1 TRILLION since 1970. If all it takes is an "external source" of financing, then wouldn't Africa see much more prosperity, since it has received so much aid? Yet it's one of the few places on Earth that has seen an economic decline in the past 40 years. In fact, this "Jews got more support" than us argument holds no water. So, what's your next desperate excuse to explain why other people that have suffered atrocities thrive while blacks languish behind.
@newfish09 Yes, let's hear more of your desperate and weak attempts to explain away any personal responsibility on the part of blacks for their failures. And then maybe you can answer a simple question. How can a group of people be strong when apparently everyone on the planet is able to dominate, control, and determine every single outcome in their lives? Why do you believe black people are so pathetically weak that they are at the mercy of everyone else's whims? Can you explain that to me?
Black drug dealers do not wear suits. They dress like bums.
Black man in nice car in a suit = I think they have a good job.
Black man in used luxury car with huge rims, a 5,000 watt car stereo, and dressed like a piece of shit = I think they won the black lottery or sell drugs.
Great video you keep getting better and better. People need to hear what you have to say. American Society has become so PC most people are afraid to be intellectually honest with themselves when it comes to race issues. It is refreshing to hear rational people discuss these issues.
Well Johnson & Johnsons wealth can be traced back to slavery but i'm just splitting hairs and plus thats a sole company not just another random white owned business. Great Video!
That "peculiar institution" put an enduring negative stigma on blackness & a positive association to whiteness. INDIVIDUALS who control the institutions w/in this country tend to have these negative attitudes towards blacks that stem from these enduring stigmas. Their color doesn't matter.
Yup, that sounds like a benefit for whites bc of slavery to me. And it has nothing to do with money :)
Just another reason why your video does not discredit the "black racist" argument.
@GGLebo23 You say: "Their color doesn't matter." Then you say: "Yup, that sounds like a benefit for whites bc of slavery to me. " Well, which is it? Does color matter or not? You sit here and claim color doesn't matter and then accuse whites of benefiting from slavery, which I show in this video clearly doesn't happen. You want it both ways. You want to demonize people who don't have your skin color and then claim you don't care about skin color. How is that?
-Isolate those white populations and their wealth will increase
I don't have to explain more. Even a random racist could guess as much. You can argue about oppression, but the facts in your video DO NOT destroy what these "black racist" claim. That whites(esp. those in former slave holding states) have benefited from slavery...
@GGLebo23 Yet, you couldn't point out a single flaw in this video. And the one flaw you HYPOTHESIZED existed, I was more than willing to put to the test. When I offered to, you pussied out.
@GGLebo23 It was a hypothesis. Do you have any evidence that if we compare whites wealth in the north with those in the south that we'll find whites in the south are wealthier? If so, I'd love to see it. If not, then yes, it's a hypothesis you were too much of a pussy to have challenged.
@GGLebo23 Again, I offered you a challenge to demonstrate that whites in the south were, on average, poorer than whites in the north. You pussied out. I WILL STATE THE CHALLENGE AGAIN. I will make a video comparing whites median incomes in the south with those in the north. BUT! If whites in the south are poorer than whites in the north, YOU HAVE TO ADMIT YOU WERE WRONG. But the fact is, you won't agree to this because you know what the outcome will be. And that shows your agenda clearly.
@kkilo34 Challenge. Dude do I look like I have time to waste doing that? Whites from the South are richer than blacks from the South. That is ALL that matters. You forgot to mention that monetary wealth is not the only privilege that comes from slavery. How about the fact that the "peculiar institution" put a never ending negative stigma on blackness and an enduring positive stigma on whiteness in this country and others???
@GGLebo23 "Whites from the South are richer than blacks from the South." But if whites benefit from slavery, why are whites in the north -- where slavery was illegal -- richer than whites in the south? And who holds this negative stigma against black people? What group of people are you referring to that you claim holds this stigma? Please identify whom you're talking about? I'd really like to know how to identify them. What characteristics do they share? Please tell me.
@kkilo34 "And who holds this negative stigma against black people?"
Americans in general. Of course, their are exceptions, but they are few. These ppl don't value blks and basically associate almost ANYTHING that is bad with blacks. You obviously fit into this group of Americans
"But if whites benefit from slavery, why are whites in the north -- where slavery was illegal -- richer than whites in the south?"
-Sources? You keep making this claim w/ no proof...
@GGLebo23 "Americans in general." So, you would agree that people with black and white skin hold these stigmas, right? And if so, which group is more likely to hold these stigmas? White or black people? I offered to prove this claim to be true on the condition you admit you're wrong if I did. You pussied out. Again, when you're ready to man-up, I'll prove that statement to be true. Until you are willing to put your money where your mouth is, then don't question the claim.
@kkilo34 "So, you would agree that people with black and white skin hold these stigmas, right?"
Why does it matter? Why is the world so black and white to you? The point is the INDIVIDUALS who control the institutions w/in this country tend to have these negative attitudes towards blacks that stem from these enduring stigmas. Their color doesn't matter. Red, white, green, blue, it needs to stop.
@GGLebo23 Whoa, whoa, whoa. Aren't we the avoider of questions. Fact is, you don't want to admit that YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHITE PEOPLE. You are such a hypocrite. Do you think these little games are going to hide that fact? Are these individuals who cause these stigmas predominantly white or black? Why are you afraid to answer that question? Do you think dodging it is going to hide your hypocrisy?
@kk "Fact is, you don't want to admit that YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHITE PEOPLE. "
-Assumption. Fact is it doesn't matter. Red, blue, purple, green your the one making this into a racial thing. Justifying racism solely based off the fact you are white. Bc deep inside you think all racist are whites, so you defend an identity you hold dear to your heart. It is only you that is indeed a racist white. So, stop attempting to get whites who don't feel this way to support fighting AGAINST anti-racism.
@GGLebo23 Actually, I'm showing them that black people grossly exaggerate their situation, and they do so to shoulder whites with the responsibility for the failures black people create for themselves. So, whites need not feel any sympathy for black people, responsibility for any of their problems, or guilty for their own success. We are more successful because we CHOOSE to act and think successfully. Many black people do too, and they also succeed. Racism has nothing to do with it.
@GGLebo23 Oh, and uh, don't bullshit everyone here with this silly claim you have no time. Buddy, I'm the one doing all the data mining. All you have to do is admit you're wrong when I show, with cited data, that you are, in fact, flat fucking wrong. You're not willing to agree to this condition, which requires almost no time from you, and so I'm not willing to do the work to show how full of shit you are. The fact you don't accept my challenge should demonstrate that enough for everyone.
@kkilo34 Still wouldn't change the ENDURING negative stigma associated with Blacks in this country that is is the source of all discrimination towards them. It still wouldn't change the enduring positive stigma attached to whites that keep them clear of discrimination. That is the MAIN benefit from slavery that ALL whites have in this country no matter what their personal attitudes are regarding race.
@GGLebo23 "that is is the source of all discrimination towards them." And who is doing this discrimination? What characteristics do they hold? Please describe what aspects this group shares in common? I would like to know how one can identify who these people are. How would I know who they are?
@GGLebo23 "ALL whites have in this country" Wow, for someone that hates generalizing, you sure love to generalize about people whose skin is not the same as yours. Well, by your definition, you are a total bigot. Isn't it funny how black people who accuse me of generalizing are the first to make statements about how "all whites this..." and "all whites that..."? You sure are a hypocrite.
@kkilo34 That's not generalizing. That is simply fact. All whites have privilege in America based on their skin color. That isn't the same as saying they are all racist. Isn't it funny how you just love to twist words to make ppl look like hypocrites. Funny game indeed.
@GGLebo23 "That is simply fact. " I see. So when black people criticize whites or define what their lives or like it's a "fact." But when I criticize black people or suggest they aren't suffering the disadvantage they claim to be experiencing, I'm "generalizing." Again, it's a racially based double standard that says that blacks can criticize whites all they want, but whites can't criticize blacks. And that makes you a babbling hypocrite.
@GGLebo23 It's not obvious. It's blindly accepted. And I'm presenting a lot of challenges to this unquestioned assumption. It was dumb to question the Earth was flat. Thankfully, there's people like me to help the human race move beyond these silly assumptions. But we sure do piss off mindless sheep like you in the process. Sorry, but evolution cannot be stopped. Deal with it.
@passionitliberal I believe that everyone should be free to live their lives however they choose so long as they don't violate the rights of others. So, I'm neither liberal or conservative, since both support big government programs to force people to live according to their values.
@kkilo34 Basically it is not something white people DO, it is something that is given to them. That is the difference btwn saying ALL of them have privilege and all of them are racist. Duh...
@GGLebo23 It's given to us? Really? Tell me in SPECIFIC detail how I, as an INDIVIDUAL, am receiving these privileges. You have claimed up and down that generalizing is the act of making claims about a race without dealing with the individuals within that race. Okay, show that you're not just blowing smoke out your ass and demonstrate this to be true. You just made a claim about whites receiving privileges. I'm an individual. What privileges do I receive? I eagerly await your response.
@GGLebo23 Seems to me like you're desperately splitting hairs as a means to cover up your own blatant hypocrisy. And since you have to stoop to this tactic, then you must know that you're full of shit and are just trying to rationalize your hypocrisy. You just told me that whites receive privileges, which was a generalization about my race. If indeed you're against generalizing, then tell me what privileges I've received as an individual. You should know if you're not a hypocrite. Are you?
If somebody says their society is racist than that means that EVERY PERSON in that society is racist. Yup, that makes sense. That is exactly what they are trying to say(sarcasm).
Dude if YOU aren't prejudice/racist than why defend ppl who are?
@GGLebo23 If you aren't an anti-white bigot, why do you believe that when blacks criticize white people, they're not meaning all white people? Yet, when whites criticize black people, even if they mention exceptions and individual variation, you claim that no matter what, by way of the fact that a person with white skin is criticizing people with black skin, it's automatically racist and generalizing? Why the double standard? I'm still waiting or an explanation, and you won't give one.
Dude you have a racist mentality towards Black people and it is so clearly evident. You can tell by the way you talk about blacks and how you ASSUME MY beliefs. Sayings like this
You blacks...
Blacks think...
All blacks do is...
Instead of addressing my point you deflect by trying to turn my argument around on blk ppl or myself. You jump through a million hoops to claim I'm a hypocrite just so you can deflect from my original argument. BS dude. I'm not playing your little game.
@GGLebo23 Actually, it's not a game. You claimed that when blacks accuse whites of oppressing them, they don't mean all whites and no one should assume they do. Would you like me to copy and paste the quote again? Then, you keep assuming that I'm talking about all black people when I speak critically, even though I regularly mention exceptions to my criticisms. Why do you assume the best of intentions in people with black skin when they criticize but not those with white skin?
@kkilo34 Running away from my argument again. Deflection. Go ahead and quote me again(you made up that quote last time) bc I didn't say that shit. You just kept assuming and twisting what I said to the point where you could say I am doing the same shit as you. It was a clear attempt to discredit my argument
@GGLebo23 You said this: "I hear ppl say blacks are oppressed, not that every white person is oppressing them. BIG difference... " You can deny that but anyone can do a ctrl-F and see it right here in the comments. The fact you would deny writing this I think speaks volumes about your dishonesty. It's right there. How can you deny you wrote this?
@kkilo34 Yup! Those are racist statements and your a racist too. You can't talk shit about "black racist" bc you are one in the same. Which is exactly what I said in an earlier comment.
"Why are you acting like being a racist is such a bad thing? It's obvious your one of those white supremo types(don't even try to lie & justify). How can you be mad for someone doing the same shit you do?"
@GGLebo23 Oh, okay. So, in other words, you would agree that no black person should ever claim to be oppressed, because that's racist. Right? Yes or no?
cont. This may come as a surprise to you, but it is possible to claim that all black people are oppressed w/o saying all whites are doing the oppressing....
@GGLebo23 It may come as a surprise to you but it's possible to say that black people exaggerate their situation without suggesting that black people are a bunch of stupid, lazy, losers. But the fact is, you can not tolerate any criticism from whites toward blacks, but you'll make all kinds of exceptions for blacks criticizing whites. Your agenda is all too transparent.
@GGLebo23 Oooh, but what about all the exceptions I mention? You clearly love to ignore those, even though THEY ARE RIGHT THERE THROUGHOUT MY VIDEOS, COMMENTS, AND EVEN MY CHANNEL DESCRIPTION. But isn't it interesting how some minor little changes of words works for people with black skin but not for me? Wow, again, your racially based double standard is so clear. Blacks accuse whites of being evil, but aren't racist so long as they avoid using the word white. Handy little privilege there.
@kkilo34 Bullshit dude. If you cared about those "exceptions" you would make full-length videos focusing on them, but you don't. Why? Bc you view them as exceptions that you ONLY care about when you need them. You still think the majority of Blacks are bad ppl. The bad are not exceptions to you and they supersede the good.
@GGLebo23 "but you don't." Wrong. See my video "Black People Have No Power?" And "Counter Racism Hurts Black People" and "First Black President in 2012." Also see my channel description. Further, here's a quote from the video before this one, "Many black people do what it takes to succeed and do. Many whites choose not to and don't." I have other examples. Would you like me to list them? Again, your problem is that I am white and not glorifying people whose skin is darker than my own.That's all.
@GGLebo23 "Our prez is a Mulatto dude... " Interesting claim. Here's what you said just a moment ago: "Why is the world so black and white to you?" So, I guess in your oh-so-open-minded worldview, it's an important distinction that our president is not a real black person. If you're not into these labels, why does it matter to you so much if he's labeled black? Again, you are the master of hypocrisy.
@kkilo34 Not a real black person? Wtf are you talking about. He just isn't black. Their is no if, ands, or buts about it. That is a fact. Couldn't say that racism has continued bc Barack Obama is our white president 2012? I mean his mother is white and so are the ppl he raised him, so my argument would make sense right?
@GGLebo23 Wow, you sure do love these racial concepts of yours. Tell me, how is he different as an individual since he is not truly black? And earlier you were claiming that white people receive advantages for having skin color that is different from yours. Does Obama receive half of those since he's half white? Tell us all here what it means that he is not black? Tell me what people can know about him because of this quality of non-blackness that is so important to you.
Today some Blacks are talking about "Black Economics." It's a fucking joke at this point. It's also trend in myth making. Notice the Chinese or Mexican people never say things like, "Mexican Economics" or Chinese Economics." They just do it. But Blk Economics is taken seriously and one of its proponents is Claude Anderson. Black this, black fucking that. Black black black... Jesus fucking christ already... Talk about pigeon holing yourself into crack in a wall.
@controversyking ; Excellent point. Most Whites throughout American history has had that same experience you described, including my fathers family who are "White." And including my mothers side who are not "White." Those who became successful (on both sides), did so, because of hard work. Nothing is given to anyone for no reason, not even for race. It's just a stupid theory that doesn't add up in no way at all. Tim Wise is a con man.
Why are you acting like being a racist is such a bad thing? It's obvious your one of those white supremo types(don't even try to lie & justify). How can you be mad for someone doing the same shit you do?
@GGLebo23 Yes, because expressing opinions that offend a lot of black people is "racism?" And having your own thoughts separate from the black collective is "white supremacy?" See, that's what you don't understand. White people generally don't label everything they don't like as "racist" or every opinion they disagree with as "oppression." So, when I condemn racism, I mean ideologies that believe in the superiority of a race. Not just "stuff I don't like," which is what blacks call "racism."
@kkilo34 "Yes, because expressing opinions that offend a lot of black people is "racism?"
Dude, don't be a bitch. Just say who you are. I can't stand ppl who jump over a million hoops in an effort to justify their nonsense. You want to play the assumptions game huh? Okay, well ppl like YOU are the first to whine about political correctness even though you can't grow the balls to say who you are w/o all of the BS to cover up your true feelings.
@GGLebo23 Yes,because anyone that doesn't agree with blacks despises them, and if they claim to just have a different opinion, even showing logically how they arrive at their conclusions, they're just not being honest about what they feel. So, to show your true love for black people, you must always subjugate your own opinions to theirs. We'll always live in a racist society until all opinions conform to the black majority. Only then will we have true equality.
@kkilo No, dude. It's really not about your opinions on racism in American society. It's about the attitude you have towards black ppl. Just look at the way you talk about us.
"doesn't agree with blacks"
"You're just another black person"
"Blacks LOVE to be victims"
"They relish in the thought of their own oppression and take pride..."
"they use the most baseless BS to defend their status"
You can tell you don't even see blk ppl as fully human. Not complex enough to treat as individuals.
... THEY ALL look, act, and think the same way. Their variation is not vast enough to consider. Their lives have no independent value. They have no inner life...
Just imagine me speaking about whites the same way. Go ahead. Replace all of the "blacks" in your quotations with the word white. You'd throw a fit calling me a blk racist if I dared to do the same. Your MENTALITY is what is fucked up. That is what makes you a racist. I could give a damn about what you think on racism/oppression...
@GGLebo23 Oh, I know. It's downright evil that I would ever suggest that there are any shared traits amongst black people. Of course black people, being so sweet, innocent, and righteous, never ever talk about white people in any negative light. Nope. Black people are so morally superior that they know that suggesting whites are engaged in conspiracies that caused their problems would, of course, be generalizing. And they never would have such a mentality. They're just too superior. Right?
This has been flagged as spam show
hello, everybody, I just want everyone here to know that KKILO34 is a coward son oof a bitch piece of shit who filters his comments to present the illusion that people agree with him and that nobody hates his guts.
KKilo, you are a utterly useless piece of shit with a disgusting voice that makes me want to rip your throat out.
fuck you, and please die in a gutter.
MegaDumbwhiteguy 4 months ago
"RBGSolider" give it up already man, you folks look like clowns but even clowns deserve more respect. Most of your doctrine are based on lies. And your "boy" Seti is a liar full tilt. You and your "boy" are proof that there is something seriously wrong in the "Blackkk Community". You see, your comments reflect the stupidity and you cannot even refute one counter claim. All you do is cry racism. Like likkke a bitch.
blokcom 4 months ago in playlist More videos from kkilo34
@RBGSolider Oh, jesus christ. I'm going to let that one stand on its own merits. Everyone, see what I mean? Yeah. Exactly.
kkilo34 4 months ago
@RBGSolider This comment doesn't address the central question in the video. If slavery created such profits, why are former slave states poorer than union states? Why are West African countries where slaves were sold by other Africans not richer than other African countries? Notice how this black supremacist just labels the questions "racist" and doesn't even answer them. This is how black racism works. Just cry racism whenever someone calls you on your bullshit.
kkilo34 4 months ago
Wouldn't the Great Depression put a real stop to the inheritance of any descendants of slavers? Though I am not from your country, only the rich owned slaves, and slavery only made the rich richer. I kind of wonder why my countrymen are so well off without the use of slavery in the past. Of course, Africa should be swimming in wealth due to the massive resources and slave labour STILL present there.
WorldSacred 5 months ago
@WorldSacred Very true. Slavery does not result in widespread prosperity for anyone. It benefits only a small portion of society. And even those who benefit don't reap that much of a reward.
kkilo34 5 months ago
Bad history makes for bad individual attitudes. We are shaped by our culture and history. You for example are thinking like a typical American, only concerned with individual performance and incapable of accounting for social and historical dynamics, largely confined in present day US.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Oh feel free to define who you are based on unpleasant events that were experienced by long-dead people whose only relationship to you is a similar shade of skin color. No one is trying to stop you. But that will undermine your success. And if you don't value success they way us "typical Americans" do, that's fine too. But when you have higher rates of poverty due to these attitudes, don't blame discrimination. You make your choice, and the outcomes are yours to live with.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 What makes us human is precisely the fact that the collective actions and thoughts of our ancestors affect and influence our way of thinking, our speech, our technology and lifestyle today. Every individual is responsible for his actions, but he's not responsible for the environment he grows up in or the socio-economic handicaps he happens to inherit from a bad history. It takes very strong spirits to escape the confinement of a ghettoized mentality.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Again, you don't need to defend your belief that the past defines who you are. That will limit your possibilities in life, but you are free to limit your possibilities all you want. When they produce unpleasant circumstances or maintain those circumstances, you ARE responsible. If you deny that responsibility, that is also okay and typical of black culture. But it does cause your high poverty rates, and whites need not feel responsible or obligated to help you in any way.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Haha so it's a "belief" now that history affects the present, and one that you obviously do not share clearly being a 100% self-made man who owes absolutely nothing to his society, history and heritage. Individuals are 100% responsible for anything that happens to them, they exist in vacuums and deserve absolutely no compassion or help of any way. In fact fuck em. Fuck em all up the ass. Why anyone ever felt a sense responsibility or obligation towards others' misfortunes is beyond me.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano The past of my ancestors, which contains much hardship, does not affect my present. That's what's called a "winning attitude," and yes, black culture does not foster such attitudes. It encourages self-defeating ideas like the notion that events you only read about in books can somehow determine who you are today. And again, it's fine you want to believe that. But such self-defeating thinking does cause a sense of futility and leads to high rates of failure in the black community.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "deserve absolutely no compassion or help of any way." I never said this. But many (not all) black people have this ridiculous sense of racial entitlement that says that people are obligated to help them and responsible for fixing their problems. There's a big difference between acting out of voluntary compassion and out of a sense of responsibility. We aren't responsible for why black people are poor. It's fine if people want to help, but they shouldn't feel obligated. We aren't.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Quite apart from any discussion of race, it's a basic moral obligation for fortunate people to help the less fortunate. Now how deeply this is felt to be a responsibility depends on the moral character of the individual and the ideological environment he grows up into. The "winner-loser" dichotomy is a prime example of an ideological framework which tries to obscure basic moral principles by separating the world in losers who deserve to die and winners who take all.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano " it's a basic moral obligation for fortunate people to help the less fortunate." And I disagree. What happens when someone causes their own misfortune? How do you help people who create misery for themselves? I never argued against charity, and we're not talking about the "unfortunate." Fortune happens. But the poverty in the black community is self-created. So, by treating them as charity cases, you actually hurt them. Welfare create dependency and helplessness.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 That welfare comment is the usual, tired, US propaganda hogwash - and demonstrably wrong. Providing quality education, health and security, as well as encouraging employment and retraining for the jobless and the least in a society benefits the poor AND rich who can safely walk out of their gated communities and enjoy their cities without being shot by gangs. It's blatantly obvious when comparing rates of crime and quality of life in European welfare social democracies vs the US.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@kkilo34 On the question of what white people in the US owe black people, you do not share in the crimes of your ancestors, you are not responsible for them if indeed they took part in the slave system. But their consequences persist. Now whether you want to assume that burden of guilt and help or not is your moral choice to make. But whatever you do, don't ever forget that black Americans are struggling to climb out of a cultural abyss and for this they deserve encouragement, not reproach.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "that black Americans are struggling to climb out of a cultural abyss and for this they deserve encouragement" What reproach? I said you're free to embrace self-defeating ideas all you want. Feel free. I neither condemn nor praise you for it. But, on the other hand, when you blame people with my skin color for your problems, you are racially scapegoating. And then you DO deserve reproach. If you don't want reproach, stop blaming other races for your problems.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 It does not take encyclopedic knowledge to admit to the crimes of the Europeans, for which every descendant of Europe enjoys the fruits today. The comparative advantage in violence gained in their internal struggles in the 1500-1600s allowed them to freely ravage the world in search for profits. Without the colonies, with armies of slaves picking cotton for their textile industries, Britain would not have had the means to enact the industrial revolution. These are historical facts.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano " for which every descendant of Europe enjoys the fruits today." This is a statement of racial prejudice. It says "white people didn't really earn their wealth." In that way, the prosperity of whites can be condemned as ill gotten goods. But this is a lie. There's NOT A SHRED of economic evidence that today's wealth can be explained by way of slavery. If that's the case, why are southern states where slavery was practiced, on average, poorer than union states?
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Slavery is only a part of the equation. The very land that provided the goods was often occupied, with all kinds of the worst atrocities happening. We are talking concentration camps, intimidation and collective punishment, betrayal and humiliation... Enslavement is only a fraction of the crimes. Goods like cotton, sugar, timber, metals: everything that powered the industrial revolution came from the colonies. Even today oil, the main energy source, is held by occupation and corruption.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Again, why is it, then, that the states that practiced slavery are some of the poorest in this country? And now you bring up oil, which shows you've not a leg to stand on. Fact is, you hate white people and don't believe they should be allowed to keep what they earn. Why can't you just say this?
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Really, I'm sorry, but your analysis is once again very partial and limited. I'll be glad to talk more extensively with you via PM so we can escape this 500 word constraint. Long story short, the North wanted protectionism to grow its industry on the Brit model, the South wanted free trade to sell its agro-products to Brit industry. This is the main cause of the civil war, and the South expected to be saved by the Brits throughout. Needless to say the Brits never came.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano I never said anything about the Civil War. And that has nothing to do with my argument. You are claiming whites' higher rates of wealth is a result of slavery. But states that practiced slavery before it was CONSTITUTIONAL OUTLAWED are TODAY poorer than states that didn't. So, if slavery could provide wealth 150 years after it was abolished, obviously this would not be the case. Your response has nothing to do with that question and does not answer it at all. Why so evasive?
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Further, I will not engage you in private. Your arguments are weak and silly. So, I want your defeat in this debate to be very public so everyone can see that the claim that whites are today benefiting from racism hundreds of years ago has no rational basis whatsoever. If you wish to say more than can fit in the comments box, then please make a response video. I will approve it so long as you approve my responses to it. What do you say? Let's make this even more public.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 It's not about public or private, it's about being able to explain myself in a more coherent way. I don't even own a camera, nor would I invest so much time on an Internet diatribe. If you are interested in having an honest debate, we can. But to me it just seems that at some point you just reset the discussion cause it's making you think too hard and switch back to "OMG BLACK PPL WANNA BE POOR LOL THEY GOT LOSER MENTALITY LOL IM A WINNER SO ILL GO PLACES."
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano You don't need a camera. All you need is a mic and some freeware. If you're not into making videos, why are you here on a video forum? I'm not interested in a private debate. I'm not going to change your mind anymore than you will change mind. I can however change the minds of those who view the debate and demonstrate that your ideas are entirely flawed and baseless, as I've done so far. If no one can see you lose this debate, what's the point?
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 All you have demonstrated is that you have a vague idea of a slave system appearing magically in the US some 400 years ago which was eventually outlawed making everything A-OK like in Smurfland. Only by this childish assumption does your "omg blacks are lazy hobos whites work so hard lol" 3rd grade argument survive. But since you refuse to look deeper cuz you "choose not to be bogged down by knowledge and culture" you can boast about having defeated a grade school strawman. Clap clap.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano I have never argued any such thing, and your claim is a strawman. I realize, though, that having lost this debate, you now have to resort to such fallacies. Fact: you never answered my question. If you can't answer that simple question, why should anyone believe you have a leg to stand on?
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano And furthermore, let the record show that you didn't answer a single one of my questions. If your position is so strong, why do you keep avoiding my questions and trying to switch topics? It's quite clear you know you're losing this debate in the most obvious way and want to go private to save yourself the humiliation. Well, sorry. You believe that whites' wealth is a result of slavery and you've not a shred of evidence to back up that claim. You lose.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 I have answered every point. 1- Everyone is affected by history, not just because they read shit in books (which you obviously don't bother doing) but because PAST EVENTS AFFECTS PRESENT SOCIAL ARRANGEMENTS. 2- The success of Europeans, when properly understood, comes from a. COMPARATIVE ADVANTAGE IN VIOLENCE obtained mostly around the 16-18th century, which allowed for MASS COLONIZATION and CHEAP RESOURCES, which in turn allowed for INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT, ultimate deciding factor.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Again, you did not answer my question. All you did was reassert your position. But that doesn't answer my questions about slave states being so poor if indeed whites' wealth can be traced back to slavery. You have a nice little argument here, but the economic data does not support it. Sorry. I realize, though, you have to believe that whites don't legitimately earn their wealth. And you'll never look down inside and ask yourself why you have to believe this.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 It's certain that a part of the wealth earned in industrial nations (by anyone) is illegitimate, because of the institutional structures that supported and still support major injustice and atrocities around the globe. But that's not my main point. My main point is that in the race to success in the US, blacks, as an enduring consequence of historical arrangements, on average start with less skills and in worse socio-economic environments. So they objectively have a tougher race to run.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "on average start with less skills and in worse socio-economic environments." Yeah, they should fix that. I grew up poor and today earn a comfortable, middle-class salary. Yes, blacks start out on average poorer, but they cause their own poverty through their self-defeating attitudes and behaviors. Since they CHOOSE to embrace this self-defeat, then whites should not feel obligated to fix it or guilty for their own success. We chose success.We earned it. And blacks could have it too.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 This is not about personal cases, it's a statistic reality that the social ladder in the US does not work as well as it used to, meanwhile the rich have never been richer and clogged every nerve node of the society. Now the sad truth is that today even as you have conquered poverty, many white middle class families fall into it because of economic choices made above. There is little to choose at 20% real unemployment, as winning an attitude you may have, some will make it - most won't.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "meanwhile the rich have never been richer" The poor have never been wealthier either than at any time in history. In just the past 15 years, according to the UN, the number of people on planet Earth who live on less than a dollar a day has been cut in half. Standards of living have rapidly rose in India and China, the planet's most populous country. Upward mobility is a reality for the vast majority of people on the planet.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano But blacks choose not to. And their free to make the choice to undermine their own success. I'm not trying to stop or change them. But I will *aggressively* defend my race against racial scapegoating. And when blacks claim they can't get ahead because they always start out poor, they are again trying to shoulder whites with the responsibility to fix their problems. Sorry, that shit ain't going to fly no more.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 They are not "shouldering whites," they are pointing out major flaws in the US system. The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West (which was not true 40 years ago). A society that increasingly becomes a welfare state for the rich and a debt-trap for the poor. The solutions that would truly benefit blacks are the same that would benefit most whites: less propaganda, less finance, bring industry back - all things that a well working State can encourage.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West " Wrong. The standards of living in this country are higher than most of the rest of the planet. Yes, there is a gap between rich and poor. In other countries, there is no gap, because poverty is spread evenly. You would prefer an equal distribution of poverty over an unequal distribution of wealth? Less finance? WTF are you talking about? Do you even understand how business works? If not, well, that explains a lot.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "The US is one of the most unequal societies in the West " Wrong. The standards of living in this country are higher than most of the rest of the planet. Yes, there is a gap between rich and poor. In other countries, there is no gap, because poverty is spread evenly. You would prefer an equal distribution of poverty over an unequal distribution of wealth? Less finance? WTF are you talking about? Do you even understand how business works? If not, well, that explains a lot.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 That's why I said "West" as in advanced industrial societies usually understood to be in Western Europe, US, Canada and aligned countries with similar properties like Japan. What would I prefer? How about the way it was when it worked? Up until 40 years ago the US had a pretty even society. The rich paid their fair share of taxes and everyone prospered, just like they still prosper in Nordic countries today, where they still do pay fair taxes.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "Up until 40 years ago the US had a pretty even society." This claim is flat false. Do you have a source to back this up? Do you know that, in fact, the wealthy pay a higher percentage of their taxes than they did 40 years ago? This is fact, and I can back up my claims with sources. Would you like to see them? They are mainstream sources, so you can verify this information yourself. Would you like to see the facts, or do you prefer to go on basing opinions on ignorance? Your choice.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Like I previously stated, and repeated to no avail since you both ignore arguments and avoid reading freely available history, SLAVERY is a PART of a SYSTEMATIC POLICY OF OPPRESSION OF FOREIGN LANDS AT GUNPOINT of the mercantile era in Europe. So NO, it wasn't just slavery that made whites rich, just like it wasn't just concentration camps that made the Nazis powerful, get it? Not a single cause, but many different causes working together within an organized SYSTEM.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Again, you reasserted your position. Wonderful. I ask again, if slavery caused such profits in white populations even today, why are slave states the poorest? They were poor before the Civil War as well. Likewise West African countries that sold the slaves to Europeans show no exceptional wealth. So, clearly your theory has some major holes in it.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Because slavery was never meant to make the PLACES that practiced rich, just the few LANDOWNERS. The majority of the wealth went to industry in Britain and later in the North which processed the cheap raw material into high added value industrial goods with huge profit margins. A country doesn't establish colonies to make them rich, it establishes them to exploit them with the aid of a corrupt local oligarchy, which is why the US seceded in the first place. Not so hard to understand.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@kkilo34 I don't hate anybody's melanocyte activity and I don't think you do either. Just like I don't hate, say, the French who invaded and pillaged my country. But I do understand that the consequences of that historical act persist today. The economic and cultural relationship to France as well as the balance of wealth has since remained rather tipped in their favor, and there is little I, as an individual, can do to change these institutional facts.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "But I do understand that the consequences of that historical act persist today." Yet, you can't provide a single argument to bolster that claim other than to keep repeating it. WHY ARE COUNTRIES IN AFRICA AND STATES IN THE US WHERE SLAVERY WAS PRACTICED NOT RICHER THAN THEIR NEIGHBORS IF INDEED THERE IS PROFIT STILL LINGERING FROM THOSE EVENTS? Why won't you answer this question? Why do you keep avoiding it? You're showing a lot of intellectual dishonesty here.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano If you'd like to learn more about this, see my video "Black Supremacist Economics." You will see that this idea that whites are richer than blacks because of "crimes" is the same idea that the Nazis promoted against the Jews. The Nazis said that the Jews earned their wealth through manipulation and exploitation. You believe the same about white people. Also, did you know 90% of all slaves in America were sold to Europeans by other Africans. If slavery is so profitable...
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano ...then why aren't these West African nations also showing significant rates of wealth over other nations in Africa? If indeed slavery could cause wealth in a people centuries after the practice was abolished, then clearly, there would be more wealth in southern states and West African nations. But they are actually poorer than the neighbors. So your idea is based on a hatred of white people. You simply don't believe we deserve what we have. And we do.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano It is true that whites have committed some terrible crimes. We also invented the refrigerator, cured small pox, and destroyed the Nazis, which means for every life lost to these historical crimes you so focus on, ten lives were saved by the innovations of whites. I don't believe there's anything about whiteness that made us so successful, but why don't you credit us with those accomplishments? Instead, the only history your interested in is the one with whites as evil killers.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 No, you are not getting the point. Colonies provided with cheap raw materials and trade goods that gave early European trade and industry an insane boost. These goods were extracted and produced at gunpoint by enslaved populations within brutal military occupations. These occupations often forced different peoples away from their native land, with huge loss of culture and languages and the relentless instilling of a mentality of inferiority through widespread, institutionalized racism.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano There are MANY poor immigrants who come to this country with nothing, including many from Africa. In a single generation, they enjoy an upward mobility into the middle class, despite facing the same discrimination that American-born blacks allegedly face and a lot of challenges they don't, including language barriers. So, wealth can be created in a single generation, as is proven by millions of immigrants. Blacks fail at high rates because many choose to fail. Simple as that.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@kkilo34 Are you denying that institutionalized racism in the US was systematically punishing blacks as recently as the 1960s? And that despite institutional changes many of the attitudes and ghettos formed in those years are still alive and well? Many black individuals today succeed. That's not the point. The point is that for many blacks to succeed it takes challenging the cutthroat mentality of ghettos and rising above a deeply felt sense of inferiority projected by history and society.
DonVoghano 5 months ago
@DonVoghano "Many black individuals today succeed. That's not the point. " NO, that IS THE POINT. It's just a fact that's inconvenient to your ideological position, so you want to dismiss it. If black people feel inferior, then they need to build their self esteem as individuals. If you can't understand that individuals are responsible for their own self esteem, then you don't have the most basic tools to be a success in life. Sorry, but you don't.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano And your attitude is not surprising since you insist an individual's self-esteem is at the mercy of events that individual only reads about in books. That would be like me claiming my self-esteem is harmed by stories of childhood abuse experienced by a long-dead person, but since I read about his abuse in a book and CHOOSE to identify with that person as if their trauma were my own, then I'm not responsible for that choice.
kkilo34 5 months ago
@DonVoghano Again, it's fine if black people want to CHOOSE to be traumatized by hardships they themselves have never, ever faced. It's fine if you want to cling to the past and insist it defines who you are today. But these are self-defeating ideas that will erode your will, your self esteem, and your ambition. In turn, you will engage in behaviors that undermine your success. And feel free. I just want whites to see that you do do it to yourselves, and discrimination is not the problem.
kkilo34 5 months ago
The problem with blacks in america is because it's not PC to criticize their culture or lifestyle. Lots of races and cultures had it far harder and more recently than blacks and yet they have moved on and do not have the same problems as them now. Why is it not okay to hold people of color to the same standards we would hold whites or any other race?
foozybearz 7 months ago
@foozybearz That's precisely what blacks want. They want to be held to lower standards. They want to morally condemn others, while being immune to such condemnation themselves. They want to label anyone racist while being immune to such labels themselves. They want to hold others accountable without being held to any accountability themselves. To put it another way, they want a racially based privilege.
kkilo34 7 months ago
So blacks are not successful because of the lack of hard work, healthy attitudes, and successful behaviors. Instead of the opportunities actually be given of them?
newfish09 7 months ago
I WILL COME TO YOUR HOUSE. TAKE OVER. PUT CHAINS ON YOU AND YOUR FAMILY. WHIP YOU UNTIL YOU HAVE LOST COUNT. DEHUMANIZE YOU IN FRONT OF YOUR FAMILY TO THE POINT WHERE THEY LOSE HOPE IN YOUR MANHOOD. MAKE YOUR FAMILY WORK FOR ME WHILE I MAKE PROFITS. RAPE YOUR DAUGHTERS SO THAT SOME OF THE CHILDREN RESEMBLE ME.... REPEAT THIS FOR SOME CENTURIES. The workout the answere of this equation (i.e do this with honesty. I know your kind has not had much practice... but just trt your best )
Mrcbclobster 7 months ago
@Mrcbclobster Did any of these things happen to you? Really? Did you call the cops? You do know that they would arrest the people that did this to you, right? If it didn't happen to you personally, then why do you feel the need to identify with injustices you've never faced? Why do you feel the need to claim the hardships of your ancestors as your own to create the illusion that you suffer these things to? Clearly, your status as a victim is important to you. Why?
kkilo34 7 months ago
.... and if they happen to get a credit card they run themselves into life long debt (just like the rest of us). If they get disposable income they don't put the kids through college, hell they drop out in highschool to sell drugs or work as laborers. That is poor black people. The rest of the black people did work hard, save, plan for the future, and most of them are seeing the same rewards from that as white people and other races. Black economics is entitlement and ## from white guilt.
foozybearz 8 months ago
@foozybearz "The rest of the black people did work hard, save, plan for the future, and most of them are seeing the same rewards from that as white people and other races." Thats assuming they had the education to do so first then had a system of support and then didnt get taken advantaged afterward. What about the state of black businesses?
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 What about the state of black businesses? Fact is black culture in America deeply embraces racial scapegoating and defeatism. This leads to high rates of poverty. Whites don't cause this. Blacks cause their own misery. And any black person that chooses to succeed, doesn't blame others for his or her problems, and does what one needs to do to succeed will have it no harder than any white person. Simple as that.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@kkilo34 "one needs to do to succeed will have it no harder than any white person." You still didnt mention the state of black businesses. That matters.
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 Whatever the state of black businesses, that is the fault of black people. If their businesses are doing well, that is their fault. If they are doing poorly, that is their fault too. So, yeah, it doesn't matter whether or not I mention one thing or another.The state of ALL BLACK PEOPLE'S LIVES are the responsibility of black people.It's astounding how many black people just can't comprehend the concept of personal responsibility, much less live by it.And you think whites do it to you?
kkilo34 7 months ago
@newfish09 Sorry, but by this comment, you prove my point. You can't even fathom the personal responsibility, so it's clear you were raised very poorly. You keep pointing to black businesses and can't understand how responsibility. In other words, your mama didn't give you the personal tools you need to succeed. You could CHOOSE to succeed anytime you want. But you'd have to take responsibility first, and you don't even know what that means. Sorry, but most whites are taught this from birth.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@kkilo34 you didnt answer my question. I didnt say anything about personal responsibility. Most black are taught this not to be in the system. You looked over my question. This has nothing to do with personal responsibility. Persons with personal responsibility would have looked for opportunities for success. Quite a few have, many are not as lucky. The state of black businesses would have answered your question and mine.
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 Actually, if your question had any merit, you would have explained how. So, why don't you do that. The state of black businesses is as shitty as anything else black people do. That is a result, as I explained, of the self-defeating attitudes and behaviors in black culture in America. It has nothing to do with racism. Blacks fail, because they choose to fail. Your response to this argument is to keep insisting I haven't answered some question. You're being very insincere here.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@kkilo34 "The state of black businesses is as shitty as anything else black people do. That is a result, as I explained, of the self-defeating attitudes and behaviors in black culture in America." Nice how did I know it would steep to that level. Many blacks are successful not all however that hasnt stopped you from throwing them under the bus. You havent answered it, because you havent alluded to it. You are using racist economics.
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 I noticed you were unable to explain what your question demonstrated or what merit it had to the conversation. And just what is "racist economics?" Explain to me what would make an "economics" racist? Do racist economics burn crosses? Do they enslave people? No. What you mean is that I express opinions you disagree with. So, when you say you're a victim of racism, you mean you're forced to tolerate people disagreeing with you. Oh, you poor helpless baby, you. How can you stand it?
kkilo34 7 months ago
@kkilo34 You video is about black supremacist economics. Conceivably, wealth is an importance in economics- At least I thought I did.
newfish09 7 months ago
@kkilo34 "Explain to me what would make an "economics" racist?" Apparently black supremacists, unless this video wouldnt be. "Do racist economics burn crosses? Do they enslave people?" Poor argument and a nice reframing of the argument. You are allowed to disagree however I am to correct you on both being wrong on what is so called "black supremacist economics" and my actual race.
newfish09 7 months ago
@kkilo34 "So, when you say you're a victim of racism, you mean you're forced to tolerate people disagreeing with you." Another porr arguement and completely shies away from the issue at hand.
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 I love how you keep claiming my arguments are so poor, but you never seem to be able to exactly explain how they're flawed. You keep insisting there's some message, question, or issue that's not being addressed, yet you can never say precisely what they are. You make references to things you claim are so important, yet you can never explain why they're important. Clearly, you're just playing silly games to avoid admitting I'm making very good points. And I can prove it....
kkilo34 7 months ago
@newfish09 Describe in SPECIFIC detail PRECISELY what "issue at hand" is being shied away from. No more silly games. See, I think you're lying through your teeth and there's no "issue at hand" being shied away from at all. Instead, you make these vague references to some point that doesn't actually exist. That way, you can pretend you've made an argument when really all you've done is made vague references to some illusive argument you can never seem to articulate.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@newfish09 If I'm wrong and there really is some question, issue, or point being shied away from, avoided, or left unaddressed, you'll prove it by EXPLAINING IN SPECIFIC DETAIL PRECISELY what that is. If you cannot say specifically, then you know you're full of shit. You're just lying to these people, and the "state of black businesses" had no relevance, and there was no issue being shied away from. Prove me wrong if this is not the case. I eagerly await your DETAILED response.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@kkilo34 I don't think it's a racial problem that causes black failure, it's a cultural and economic one. I'm in agreement that many have self defeating attitudes as well as self destructive ones. They don't exactly choose to fail but they don't put in the hard work or exercise the discipline needed to succeed. As long as thugs, pimps, and low class people are the preferred role models I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. When you get more respect for your grades than for stealing...
foozybearz 7 months ago
@foozybearz When I say they choose to fail, I mean they could choose to engage in attitudes, behaviors, and choices that produce unfavorable outcomes, such as high rates of poverty. So, they don't say, "Hey, I think I'd like to be a failure." But they do choose to deny any personal responsibility for the results in their lives, which undermines their ability to examine mistakes and choose different courses that would produce more favorable outcomes.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@newfish09
1. Education is a right all citizens have. Anybody can go to highschool for free. Dropout and graduation rates have more to do with the quality of the school than the racial or financial makeup of it's students. There are many exemplory inner city schools. They have easier access to higher education than white people as well with the NAACP and Negro college fund.
2. System of support is a persons family and community. If your family is shit and your community is shit, thats not race
foozybearz 7 months ago
So my question to these people who say that black people are being held back by whites and that racism is responsible for the wealth divide between blacks and whites is this "How many years does it take a race to get back on it's feet?" Everybody else is doing pretty damned good in spite of recent tragedy and poverty. They worked hard, put their kids through school and reaped the rewards. But poor blacks waste money on shitty cars, stereos, and rims, don't take care of their homes or stuff....
foozybearz 8 months ago
Jews were at the center of a world war, were systematicly wiped out in death camps, had their homes, lives, and wealth taken from them. Not in some distant past but in our lifetime. 50 years later they have their own country to call home and it's doing so well that NOBODY FUCKS WITH ISRAEL.
Every wave of immigration from the Chinese to the Irish began in abject poverty. Cheap Irish labor actually pushed blacks out of dock work for a time. 50 years later we have doctors, lawyers, etc from them.
foozybearz 8 months ago
@foozybearz Didnt the area of Israel got taken? And was financially support from an external source? Jews and Israelities are not the same thing and even if they were being wiped out has nothing to do with wealth.
newfish09 7 months ago
@newfish09 Africa has received $1 TRILLION since 1970. If all it takes is an "external source" of financing, then wouldn't Africa see much more prosperity, since it has received so much aid? Yet it's one of the few places on Earth that has seen an economic decline in the past 40 years. In fact, this "Jews got more support" than us argument holds no water. So, what's your next desperate excuse to explain why other people that have suffered atrocities thrive while blacks languish behind.
kkilo34 7 months ago
@newfish09 Yes, let's hear more of your desperate and weak attempts to explain away any personal responsibility on the part of blacks for their failures. And then maybe you can answer a simple question. How can a group of people be strong when apparently everyone on the planet is able to dominate, control, and determine every single outcome in their lives? Why do you believe black people are so pathetically weak that they are at the mercy of everyone else's whims? Can you explain that to me?
kkilo34 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@kkilo34 I wrote that 3 days ago. Im done arguing you do NOT answer direct questions.
newfish09 7 months ago
Black drug dealers do not wear suits. They dress like bums.
Black man in nice car in a suit = I think they have a good job.
Black man in used luxury car with huge rims, a 5,000 watt car stereo, and dressed like a piece of shit = I think they won the black lottery or sell drugs.
foozybearz 8 months ago
@foozybearz "Black drug dealers do not wear suits." How about turn off the TV.
newfish09 7 months ago
This is Tim Wise Speaking
almightyblacknation 9 months ago
Still quibbling I see.
rdokoye 10 months ago
@rdokoye You mean demonstrating the truth of my claims and disputing the lies told by black supremacists? Yes. Yes, I am.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@rdokoye lol
TheBrownBruh 9 months ago
No it is just an aspect of oppression, but listen I'm not gonna argue with you on youtube.
passionitliberal 10 months ago
@passionitliberal Yes, most of my opponents can see that I can defend my position persuasively and are afraid to challenge it.
kkilo34 10 months ago
Great video you keep getting better and better. People need to hear what you have to say. American Society has become so PC most people are afraid to be intellectually honest with themselves when it comes to race issues. It is refreshing to hear rational people discuss these issues.
kizmania1 10 months ago
Well Johnson & Johnsons wealth can be traced back to slavery but i'm just splitting hairs and plus thats a sole company not just another random white owned business. Great Video!
benympls 10 months ago
That "peculiar institution" put an enduring negative stigma on blackness & a positive association to whiteness. INDIVIDUALS who control the institutions w/in this country tend to have these negative attitudes towards blacks that stem from these enduring stigmas. Their color doesn't matter.
Yup, that sounds like a benefit for whites bc of slavery to me. And it has nothing to do with money :)
Just another reason why your video does not discredit the "black racist" argument.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 You say: "Their color doesn't matter." Then you say: "Yup, that sounds like a benefit for whites bc of slavery to me. " Well, which is it? Does color matter or not? You sit here and claim color doesn't matter and then accuse whites of benefiting from slavery, which I show in this video clearly doesn't happen. You want it both ways. You want to demonize people who don't have your skin color and then claim you don't care about skin color. How is that?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Color doesn't matter when it comes to those who practice racist attitudes
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Yes, and you have some serious racist attitudes. I'm sorry you hate people who don't share your skin color.
kkilo34 10 months ago
And back to the point.
-Those states have the biggest black pops.
-Black people tend to be poorer than whites.
-Isolate those white populations and their wealth will increase
I don't have to explain more. Even a random racist could guess as much. You can argue about oppression, but the facts in your video DO NOT destroy what these "black racist" claim. That whites(esp. those in former slave holding states) have benefited from slavery...
GGLebo23 10 months ago
Garbage video. A retard could see the CLEAR flaws in your argument using basic logic alone. Try again
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Yet, you couldn't point out a single flaw in this video. And the one flaw you HYPOTHESIZED existed, I was more than willing to put to the test. When I offered to, you pussied out.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Hypothesized? Lolol
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 It was a hypothesis. Do you have any evidence that if we compare whites wealth in the north with those in the south that we'll find whites in the south are wealthier? If so, I'd love to see it. If not, then yes, it's a hypothesis you were too much of a pussy to have challenged.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Again, I offered you a challenge to demonstrate that whites in the south were, on average, poorer than whites in the north. You pussied out. I WILL STATE THE CHALLENGE AGAIN. I will make a video comparing whites median incomes in the south with those in the north. BUT! If whites in the south are poorer than whites in the north, YOU HAVE TO ADMIT YOU WERE WRONG. But the fact is, you won't agree to this because you know what the outcome will be. And that shows your agenda clearly.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Challenge. Dude do I look like I have time to waste doing that? Whites from the South are richer than blacks from the South. That is ALL that matters. You forgot to mention that monetary wealth is not the only privilege that comes from slavery. How about the fact that the "peculiar institution" put a never ending negative stigma on blackness and an enduring positive stigma on whiteness in this country and others???
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "Whites from the South are richer than blacks from the South." But if whites benefit from slavery, why are whites in the north -- where slavery was illegal -- richer than whites in the south? And who holds this negative stigma against black people? What group of people are you referring to that you claim holds this stigma? Please identify whom you're talking about? I'd really like to know how to identify them. What characteristics do they share? Please tell me.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 "And who holds this negative stigma against black people?"
Americans in general. Of course, their are exceptions, but they are few. These ppl don't value blks and basically associate almost ANYTHING that is bad with blacks. You obviously fit into this group of Americans
"But if whites benefit from slavery, why are whites in the north -- where slavery was illegal -- richer than whites in the south?"
-Sources? You keep making this claim w/ no proof...
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "Americans in general." So, you would agree that people with black and white skin hold these stigmas, right? And if so, which group is more likely to hold these stigmas? White or black people? I offered to prove this claim to be true on the condition you admit you're wrong if I did. You pussied out. Again, when you're ready to man-up, I'll prove that statement to be true. Until you are willing to put your money where your mouth is, then don't question the claim.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 "So, you would agree that people with black and white skin hold these stigmas, right?"
Why does it matter? Why is the world so black and white to you? The point is the INDIVIDUALS who control the institutions w/in this country tend to have these negative attitudes towards blacks that stem from these enduring stigmas. Their color doesn't matter. Red, white, green, blue, it needs to stop.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Whoa, whoa, whoa. Aren't we the avoider of questions. Fact is, you don't want to admit that YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHITE PEOPLE. You are such a hypocrite. Do you think these little games are going to hide that fact? Are these individuals who cause these stigmas predominantly white or black? Why are you afraid to answer that question? Do you think dodging it is going to hide your hypocrisy?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kk "Fact is, you don't want to admit that YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT WHITE PEOPLE. "
-Assumption. Fact is it doesn't matter. Red, blue, purple, green your the one making this into a racial thing. Justifying racism solely based off the fact you are white. Bc deep inside you think all racist are whites, so you defend an identity you hold dear to your heart. It is only you that is indeed a racist white. So, stop attempting to get whites who don't feel this way to support fighting AGAINST anti-racism.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Actually, I'm showing them that black people grossly exaggerate their situation, and they do so to shoulder whites with the responsibility for the failures black people create for themselves. So, whites need not feel any sympathy for black people, responsibility for any of their problems, or guilty for their own success. We are more successful because we CHOOSE to act and think successfully. Many black people do too, and they also succeed. Racism has nothing to do with it.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Oh, and uh, don't bullshit everyone here with this silly claim you have no time. Buddy, I'm the one doing all the data mining. All you have to do is admit you're wrong when I show, with cited data, that you are, in fact, flat fucking wrong. You're not willing to agree to this condition, which requires almost no time from you, and so I'm not willing to do the work to show how full of shit you are. The fact you don't accept my challenge should demonstrate that enough for everyone.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Still wouldn't change the ENDURING negative stigma associated with Blacks in this country that is is the source of all discrimination towards them. It still wouldn't change the enduring positive stigma attached to whites that keep them clear of discrimination. That is the MAIN benefit from slavery that ALL whites have in this country no matter what their personal attitudes are regarding race.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "that is is the source of all discrimination towards them." And who is doing this discrimination? What characteristics do they hold? Please describe what aspects this group shares in common? I would like to know how one can identify who these people are. How would I know who they are?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "ALL whites have in this country" Wow, for someone that hates generalizing, you sure love to generalize about people whose skin is not the same as yours. Well, by your definition, you are a total bigot. Isn't it funny how black people who accuse me of generalizing are the first to make statements about how "all whites this..." and "all whites that..."? You sure are a hypocrite.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 That's not generalizing. That is simply fact. All whites have privilege in America based on their skin color. That isn't the same as saying they are all racist. Isn't it funny how you just love to twist words to make ppl look like hypocrites. Funny game indeed.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "That is simply fact. " I see. So when black people criticize whites or define what their lives or like it's a "fact." But when I criticize black people or suggest they aren't suffering the disadvantage they claim to be experiencing, I'm "generalizing." Again, it's a racially based double standard that says that blacks can criticize whites all they want, but whites can't criticize blacks. And that makes you a babbling hypocrite.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 This is a dumb question. The racial bias against blacks in America is obvious
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 It's not obvious. It's blindly accepted. And I'm presenting a lot of challenges to this unquestioned assumption. It was dumb to question the Earth was flat. Thankfully, there's people like me to help the human race move beyond these silly assumptions. But we sure do piss off mindless sheep like you in the process. Sorry, but evolution cannot be stopped. Deal with it.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 I was curious where do you stand politically. More liberal or conservative?
passionitliberal 10 months ago
@passionitliberal I believe that everyone should be free to live their lives however they choose so long as they don't violate the rights of others. So, I'm neither liberal or conservative, since both support big government programs to force people to live according to their values.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Basically it is not something white people DO, it is something that is given to them. That is the difference btwn saying ALL of them have privilege and all of them are racist. Duh...
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 It's given to us? Really? Tell me in SPECIFIC detail how I, as an INDIVIDUAL, am receiving these privileges. You have claimed up and down that generalizing is the act of making claims about a race without dealing with the individuals within that race. Okay, show that you're not just blowing smoke out your ass and demonstrate this to be true. You just made a claim about whites receiving privileges. I'm an individual. What privileges do I receive? I eagerly await your response.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Seems to me like you're desperately splitting hairs as a means to cover up your own blatant hypocrisy. And since you have to stoop to this tactic, then you must know that you're full of shit and are just trying to rationalize your hypocrisy. You just told me that whites receive privileges, which was a generalization about my race. If indeed you're against generalizing, then tell me what privileges I've received as an individual. You should know if you're not a hypocrite. Are you?
kkilo34 10 months ago
These aren't racist statements?
"doesn't agree with blacks"
"You're just another black person"
"Blacks LOVE to be victims"
"They relish in the thought of their own oppression and take pride..."
"they use the most baseless BS to defend their status"
Blacks, blacks, blacks, they, they, they, they.. blah, blah, blah.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
If somebody says their society is racist than that means that EVERY PERSON in that society is racist. Yup, that makes sense. That is exactly what they are trying to say(sarcasm).
Dude if YOU aren't prejudice/racist than why defend ppl who are?
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 If you aren't an anti-white bigot, why do you believe that when blacks criticize white people, they're not meaning all white people? Yet, when whites criticize black people, even if they mention exceptions and individual variation, you claim that no matter what, by way of the fact that a person with white skin is criticizing people with black skin, it's automatically racist and generalizing? Why the double standard? I'm still waiting or an explanation, and you won't give one.
kkilo34 10 months ago
Dude you have a racist mentality towards Black people and it is so clearly evident. You can tell by the way you talk about blacks and how you ASSUME MY beliefs. Sayings like this
You blacks...
Blacks think...
All blacks do is...
Instead of addressing my point you deflect by trying to turn my argument around on blk ppl or myself. You jump through a million hoops to claim I'm a hypocrite just so you can deflect from my original argument. BS dude. I'm not playing your little game.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Actually, it's not a game. You claimed that when blacks accuse whites of oppressing them, they don't mean all whites and no one should assume they do. Would you like me to copy and paste the quote again? Then, you keep assuming that I'm talking about all black people when I speak critically, even though I regularly mention exceptions to my criticisms. Why do you assume the best of intentions in people with black skin when they criticize but not those with white skin?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Running away from my argument again. Deflection. Go ahead and quote me again(you made up that quote last time) bc I didn't say that shit. You just kept assuming and twisting what I said to the point where you could say I am doing the same shit as you. It was a clear attempt to discredit my argument
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 You said this: "I hear ppl say blacks are oppressed, not that every white person is oppressing them. BIG difference... " You can deny that but anyone can do a ctrl-F and see it right here in the comments. The fact you would deny writing this I think speaks volumes about your dishonesty. It's right there. How can you deny you wrote this?
kkilo34 10 months ago
These aren't racist statements?
"doesn't agree with blacks"
"You're just another black person"
"Blacks LOVE to be victims"
"They relish in the thought of their own oppression and take pride..."
"they use the most baseless BS to defend their status"
Blacks, blacks, blacks, they, they, they, they.. blah, blah, blah.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 If those are racist statements, then you'd have to agree that these are...
White people oppress black people....
White people protect white privilege....
White people are racists....
White people don't want blacks to be equal....
White people hate black people.....
Are these racist statements? Yes or no?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Yup! Those are racist statements and your a racist too. You can't talk shit about "black racist" bc you are one in the same. Which is exactly what I said in an earlier comment.
"Why are you acting like being a racist is such a bad thing? It's obvious your one of those white supremo types(don't even try to lie & justify). How can you be mad for someone doing the same shit you do?"
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Oh, okay. So, in other words, you would agree that no black person should ever claim to be oppressed, because that's racist. Right? Yes or no?
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Nope I wouldn't agree with that. You can say their is oppression w/o generalizing all whites. As long as they say:
"Institutions oppress black people"
"Racist white ppl protect white privilege"
"Many white ppl are racist"
"A lot of whites don't want blks to be equal"
... then they are good. Qualifiers can be a good friend ;)
Your mentality is obvious though. YOU are a racist, so my question remains. Why do you think what you and who you are is a bad thing?
GGLebo23 10 months ago
cont. This may come as a surprise to you, but it is possible to claim that all black people are oppressed w/o saying all whites are doing the oppressing....
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 It may come as a surprise to you but it's possible to say that black people exaggerate their situation without suggesting that black people are a bunch of stupid, lazy, losers. But the fact is, you can not tolerate any criticism from whites toward blacks, but you'll make all kinds of exceptions for blacks criticizing whites. Your agenda is all too transparent.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Oooh, but what about all the exceptions I mention? You clearly love to ignore those, even though THEY ARE RIGHT THERE THROUGHOUT MY VIDEOS, COMMENTS, AND EVEN MY CHANNEL DESCRIPTION. But isn't it interesting how some minor little changes of words works for people with black skin but not for me? Wow, again, your racially based double standard is so clear. Blacks accuse whites of being evil, but aren't racist so long as they avoid using the word white. Handy little privilege there.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Bullshit dude. If you cared about those "exceptions" you would make full-length videos focusing on them, but you don't. Why? Bc you view them as exceptions that you ONLY care about when you need them. You still think the majority of Blacks are bad ppl. The bad are not exceptions to you and they supersede the good.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "but you don't." Wrong. See my video "Black People Have No Power?" And "Counter Racism Hurts Black People" and "First Black President in 2012." Also see my channel description. Further, here's a quote from the video before this one, "Many black people do what it takes to succeed and do. Many whites choose not to and don't." I have other examples. Would you like me to list them? Again, your problem is that I am white and not glorifying people whose skin is darker than my own.That's all.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 First black prez 2010? Our prez is a Mulatto dude...
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 "Our prez is a Mulatto dude... " Interesting claim. Here's what you said just a moment ago: "Why is the world so black and white to you?" So, I guess in your oh-so-open-minded worldview, it's an important distinction that our president is not a real black person. If you're not into these labels, why does it matter to you so much if he's labeled black? Again, you are the master of hypocrisy.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 Not a real black person? Wtf are you talking about. He just isn't black. Their is no if, ands, or buts about it. That is a fact. Couldn't say that racism has continued bc Barack Obama is our white president 2012? I mean his mother is white and so are the ppl he raised him, so my argument would make sense right?
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Wow, you sure do love these racial concepts of yours. Tell me, how is he different as an individual since he is not truly black? And earlier you were claiming that white people receive advantages for having skin color that is different from yours. Does Obama receive half of those since he's half white? Tell us all here what it means that he is not black? Tell me what people can know about him because of this quality of non-blackness that is so important to you.
kkilo34 10 months ago
Today some Blacks are talking about "Black Economics." It's a fucking joke at this point. It's also trend in myth making. Notice the Chinese or Mexican people never say things like, "Mexican Economics" or Chinese Economics." They just do it. But Blk Economics is taken seriously and one of its proponents is Claude Anderson. Black this, black fucking that. Black black black... Jesus fucking christ already... Talk about pigeon holing yourself into crack in a wall.
blokcom 10 months ago
@controversyking ; Excellent point. Most Whites throughout American history has had that same experience you described, including my fathers family who are "White." And including my mothers side who are not "White." Those who became successful (on both sides), did so, because of hard work. Nothing is given to anyone for no reason, not even for race. It's just a stupid theory that doesn't add up in no way at all. Tim Wise is a con man.
blokcom 10 months ago
Why are you acting like being a racist is such a bad thing? It's obvious your one of those white supremo types(don't even try to lie & justify). How can you be mad for someone doing the same shit you do?
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Yes, because expressing opinions that offend a lot of black people is "racism?" And having your own thoughts separate from the black collective is "white supremacy?" See, that's what you don't understand. White people generally don't label everything they don't like as "racist" or every opinion they disagree with as "oppression." So, when I condemn racism, I mean ideologies that believe in the superiority of a race. Not just "stuff I don't like," which is what blacks call "racism."
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo34 "Yes, because expressing opinions that offend a lot of black people is "racism?"
Dude, don't be a bitch. Just say who you are. I can't stand ppl who jump over a million hoops in an effort to justify their nonsense. You want to play the assumptions game huh? Okay, well ppl like YOU are the first to whine about political correctness even though you can't grow the balls to say who you are w/o all of the BS to cover up your true feelings.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Yes,because anyone that doesn't agree with blacks despises them, and if they claim to just have a different opinion, even showing logically how they arrive at their conclusions, they're just not being honest about what they feel. So, to show your true love for black people, you must always subjugate your own opinions to theirs. We'll always live in a racist society until all opinions conform to the black majority. Only then will we have true equality.
kkilo34 10 months ago
@kkilo No, dude. It's really not about your opinions on racism in American society. It's about the attitude you have towards black ppl. Just look at the way you talk about us.
"doesn't agree with blacks"
"You're just another black person"
"Blacks LOVE to be victims"
"They relish in the thought of their own oppression and take pride..."
"they use the most baseless BS to defend their status"
You can tell you don't even see blk ppl as fully human. Not complex enough to treat as individuals.
GGLebo23 10 months ago
... THEY ALL look, act, and think the same way. Their variation is not vast enough to consider. Their lives have no independent value. They have no inner life...
Just imagine me speaking about whites the same way. Go ahead. Replace all of the "blacks" in your quotations with the word white. You'd throw a fit calling me a blk racist if I dared to do the same. Your MENTALITY is what is fucked up. That is what makes you a racist. I could give a damn about what you think on racism/oppression...
GGLebo23 10 months ago
@GGLebo23 Oh, I know. It's downright evil that I would ever suggest that there are any shared traits amongst black people. Of course black people, being so sweet, innocent, and righteous, never ever talk about white people in any negative light. Nope. Black people are so morally superior that they know that suggesting whites are engaged in conspiracies that caused their problems would, of course, be generalizing. And they never would have such a mentality. They're just too superior. Right?
kkilo34 10 months ago