Tony Blair vs. Michael Howard 1990

[MrAilingequation]

I wonder if blair and howard knew they would both face each other directly once again and fight a general election

[hearts76100]

Howard is a jew

[19STU84]

Two Tories chatting

[TheShepster80]

michael howard =mr burns (the simpsons)

[dezboss]

@TheShepster80 I have no ardent dislike for Michael Howard, but I must admit I do find him rather creepy.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation They need the support of their backbenchers, of course, but given certain circumstances and situtations they may be in a position where they agree. The Iraq war, for example. I strongly, strongly disagree with that war, but I can understand why, given the apparent 'evidence' at the time, parliament voted for it.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation Yes, but does that make the entire party bad? Not really. It makes the leader, an individual, bad.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation Do you blame a party soley on their leaders? I don't think that is fair.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation The liberal democrats, the ones who used to have the most integerity, are now the most hypocritical party of the three.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation I completely agree with the last note. Caroline Flint, Hzzel Blears, and definitely Harman should all leave the party. I can't stand them. Having said that, I don't agree that they are a bunch of hypocrites, any more than the Tories and Lib dems are. Blair took the party to the center ground, Brown didn't have enough time to shape the party in his own way, but I feel that Ed Miliband is genuinely more left wing. He was in no position to change policy in the Brown ministry, either

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation That's what I've been trying to say from day 1.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation Yes, and as I've already said, Mr. Tony Blair was the Labour leader during that time. Blair is of the center ground, not a socialist at all. Labour are a socialist party.

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation Well, Right wing and Left wing mean something to me. Labour are the party who created, spend the most money on and supported the NHS, Labour are the party who introduced minimum wage, Labour are the party who legalized abortion, homosexuality and rid us of the death penalty. To me, that makes them socialist.

Regards

[ToaJoe]

@ailingequation They are a socialist left wing party. Not under the new labour years, true, but by default they are. They represent the left wing of British politics, in case you haven't noticed.

[ToaJoe]

@19189073 You can say the same thing for the conservatives. New Labour had their misgivings, but there's no denying the facts, education and the NHS got much better, and under Brown's chancellorship Britain experience economic growth.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe Public services marginally, perhaps, got better. They certainly didn't get 60% better - public investment rose by 60%. Further, Gordon Brown inherited a solid working, and growing economy, but left office with a huge bust, unemployment rising and a huge budget deficit, plus a host of other economic problems. Some legacy.

[ToaJoe]

@1988orangeboy Wow, you dumbass prick. Brown inherited a solid working growing economy... who was the chancellor during the Blair years? Brown, dipshit. Under Brown's chancellorship, the economy grew at 2.7% every year, the highest speed in our country's history. Brown was clearly a good economist, but you Tories like to pretend he somehow triggered a global recession.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe Brown inherited a strong economy in 1997, which means he did not create it. He was just given it on a plate after the 1997 general election, which he later destroyed.

The economy did NOT grow 2.7% every year at all, absolute rubbish, it certainly grew but he inherited the economic growth, the economy started to grow rapidly from 1994, after all the Thatcherite reforms had matured. Brown did not change a single Thatcherite reform but reaped the rewards for it.

[ToaJoe]

@1988orangeboy The figures have been challenged, true. But Brown still grew the economy, that's a fact. Part of the reason new Labour didn't pick up flack for breaking promises after the '97 election was because they made everyone better off. Don't lecture me with the 'inherited a strong economy' bullshit. Thatcher did see a massive boom in the economy. But she also ruined so many people's lives. Brown DID grow the economy, and he improved education, health and living standards.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe The economy did grow during Brown’s resign as chancellor; I do not doubt that, however, it is very debatable to who is responsible for that. Brown did not change a single Thatcherite policy – that is a fact, so you could argue that this was the economic growth the Tories had been building throughout the 1980s. Let me remind you again, Brown inherited a growing economy. It did not suddenly grow on the day labour got elected, it started years before that.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe Labour made everyone better off? I do NOT think so! The rich certainly got richer, but the poorer, got poorer. The gap between the rich and poor expanded during the Labour years. It’s now tougher for someone from the bottom to work themselves up now than ever before and this is after 13 years of Labour government. Our children are the unhappiest in the developed world. Educational standards dropped in the international rankings for maths, English and science.

[ToaJoe]

@1988orangeboy You can list all of the bad things about the NHS and Education, but that's just a lame Tory argument. The pros heavily outweigh the cons. The gap between the rich and poor did NOT expand, that is a hilariously unreal argument. It's a well known fact that Thatcher, while she achieved universal economic success, seperated the rich & poor massively. And you're trying to tell me that Labour, a socialist left wing party, made that gap larger?

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe The gap between the rich and poor DID expand during the labour years, further still, health inequalities also widened between the rich and poor DURING the labour years. Sources: Rich-poor divide 'wider than 40 years ago': news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8481534.st­m and 'UK health gap between rich and poor widest ever' guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/23/­uk-health-gap-widest-ever. I find it absolutely hilarious that you think the labour government represented 'socialist left wing'!

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe We have one of the worst cancer treatment outcomes in Europe, despite the money spent in the NHS. Living standards got better got some but not for the people at the bottom – those that labour apparently claim they support. They were given a life on benefits, labour were not interested in hoping them to improve themselves.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe After the economy labour inherited and after all the money they spent, the gap between the rich and poor expanded, labour must be ashamed of themselves to claim they are the party for the poor. There had been no progress on social mobility at all.

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe Brown even claimed he had ended Boom and Bust- but left the country with the biggest Bust since the 1930s!

Brown even began to borrow cash from 2005 – you don’t borrow cash when you have a strong economy. Brown oversaw the City of London's deregulation, therefore had a responsibility for the economic crisis. Further, he even gave an award to the boss of the Royal Bank of Scotland for services to banking - in 2008 the bank went BUST! Brown certainly knowshis stuff eh?!

[1988orangeboy]

@ToaJoe If you really think Brown had absolutely nothing to do withthe UK's issues with its' budget deficit, its debts and the recession then you're seriously stupid. So stop swearing because you don’t know what you’re talking about.

[CookieCrumblz]

Tony Blair is liked Ed Miliband.

[yoctocb]

On a more serious note, this was quite an important point in Blair's political life. He showed down the unions by changing Labour's position to eventually support the end of the closed shop. One of the first baby-steps in the creation of New Labour.

[yoctocb]

What the heck was that "hurum" noise by the conservative frontbencher on the right at 0:14? Sounded like a cross between a sneeze and a derisory retort.

[Ohyewildthong]

What I love is when Blair was asked about this particular comment on Question Time (when he was PM) and why he had abandoned the idea of getting rid of this bill he just ranted that the guy was a tory plant.

[TheSunzuki1983]

His accent is different in these early videos.

[kevinoti]

theres that bigot word again, labour is so full of shitt

[MrDeverill]

Vote for REAL change, vote for Liberal Democrats!

[PsychoPunk1965]

@MrDeverill They ended up stabbing the left in the back with their opportunistic partnership with the Tories. What should the left do these day in the UK? They should take back what belongs to them which is the British Labour Party.

[whitelance06]

This was in the early stages of Blair's wrestling career. Shortly before he captured the Intercontinental Championship.

[Edam3000]

@whitelance06 Lol ! :D

[twgoldwood]

woah blair looks young

[NewLabour1]

If we are to build a future fair for all we must: - Secure the recovery, not put it at risk - Protect frontline services, not cut them - Stand up for the many, not the few

 - Invest in new industries and future jobs

VOTE LABOUR

[stoneytheraster]

@NewLabour1

Labour had 13 years to do all this, they FAILED. But you are right about standing up for the many, just a pity the "many" are the ones on benefits and contribute nothing to this country.

[fichbar]

People on welfare should be exempt from voting, it should be those of us who pay for all this welfare, dole, social benefits, and free money for all the work shy that should decide whether we have a Conservative or a Labour government.

[zoso7889]

Its not 1742. One man, one vote. Go back to your Daily Mail

[fichbar]

Labour has ruined the economy and let society crumble. This means no more free shit for all you chavs.

[Kevinasp]

People like you should be exempt from voting instead.......

[FlyingFox1971]

Michael Howard has more integrity in his big toe nail than that useless god loving prat opposite,, What can that man do! I now face the prospect of losing my job while Mr Blair and his wealthy wife sit in their palatial home thinking of ways to finance the Tony Blair faith foundation !!

[stranglingjohndenver]

so you think michael howard would have done anything to help people out of work? ! the tories don't give a fuck about the unemployed, they only care about the rich. at least labour have policies in place to help people get back into work.

[FlyingFox1971]

@stranglingjohndenver the best way to help the unemployed is to give them fuck all,,,they have a tendancy then to get off their arses and go and find a job !!

[stoneytheraster]

@stranglingjohndenver

And at the same time letting our industry disappear. Labours policies have always been to satisfy the unions and they are even failing at that. Why do people still insist Labour are for the working classes? They WILL tax the working class to death because under Labour means bigger government and bigger government = rising taxes.

[Speegs23]

There is no meaningful difference between any of the UK or US parties anymore, they are all statists that seek to horde power.

Blair charmed and betrayed you, Cameron will do the same.

Obama is a disaster for the Americans, his novelty status is not leadership and undoubtedly he'll be replaced by another partisan blowhard in 2012.

[britishfirstandlast]

You are right. The three main parties are a joke. I'm voting U.K.I.P. next time.

[lowestoftbus]

you are right

[AshtonArcher]

Ahhh, but you are a muppet who knows nothing about politics, especially UK politics. Go to bed sunshine...

[Speegs23]

Parliament may well be more worthless than the US congress and executive branch, so go ahead and place your faith in the mongrels, no matter what government or party is in power in every nation all you have are lesser evils and incompetents as all are power hungry and wicked and willfully incompetent.

[Cena60793]

A.K.A: Vote for Nazism

[ion871]

I think this counts as libel, which, of course, a media person ought to know.

[antonjon1]

Only if it is not true.

[RQualtrough]

Stay off the drugs son.

[jbs1861993]

What a traitor blair is!!

[OneBigRetard]

I love that pseudo oliver twist accent Blair has tinges of. He got rit of that again pretty quick.

'Aiddress'!

[mellowNdark]

@OneBigRetard Sounds south African

[GEORGIANGUSTIL]

since 1997 labour has ruined the uk labour is shabby!!!

[mellowNdark]

Ummm NO! Are you honestly telling me up until the recession this country was shit??? We HAD fuck loads of money and unions were kept in order! Sound familiar to John Majors government?

[pigeonfiles]

all heil not hale. hitler wasn't a weather front. just a national front, which is cockney for right ol c#nt!

[ngai1842]

just fuck Michael Coward!

[juices389]

i wonder if those two new they would be leader of their two parties and fight in a general election

[tbish09]

ooo it really kicked off there

[Alroight]

ummmmmmmm no they are not they are nazis

[vancitycanary]

Shut it you racist....

[spaceraider1999]

all hale hitler, all hale hitler.

[MissInformati0n]

i think people thought spaceraider was being serious... lol

[cleaverwielder]

Nazis say heil imbecile.

[THRUXTON1]

labour , fuck off

[mixmatosis]

Blair always was full of shit.

[nov3019892008]

blair was never full of shit. He WAS shit.

[Malthus0]

How vacuous that little speech was. He started the sound bites early I see.

[walkerth58]

that's always a good message "We can't face the challenges of the future, living with the predjudgices of the past!"

[msayersiii]

Wow Blair had some passion in those days. Shame he ended up being something of a sellout. But he won 3 elections so fair play to the man, more than anyone on here will ever do!

[bnprenaissance]

Five people a week are now being murdered on the streets of 'lawless Britain', making a mockery of Tony Blair's insincere bluster about being "tough on crime - tough on the causes of crime."

[NaMgKCa]

overall crime is down. overall crime doubled under the Tories.

[hitmanhatton11]

Crime is shambolic now...go outside.

[NaMgKCa]

fuck off =)

[hitmanhatton11]

Good response...sums up Gordon Brown as Prime Minister.

[NaMgKCa]

sums up the Tories economic policy

[LiverpoolLoyal1690]

Lies. Crime fell when Howard was Home Secretary.

Crime is falling now because of increased security etc.

[NaMgKCa]

crime doubled from the time that the Tories got into office to the time when they were leaving office you dumb fucking cock.

[buffboydan]

Crime has been rising since the 1950's through both labour and tory governments, and its obvious to see why.

[person9144]

Crime rises because of poverty. There's so much poverty because of Thatcher. Anyway, Howard is a really horrible person and was a crap home secretary. He lost loads of judicial review cases, because he didn't respect the human rights of many prisoners.

[buffboydan]

Crime rises when society breaks down and the courts stop punishing criminals, hence the reason we had low crime rates during the Great Depression of the 1930's when there was much worse poverty than today. The problem with the country is people like you who care more about scummy criminals than the victims.

[billyysands]

and they took your guns away didnt they mate? look i live in a country that has a totally insane policy towards guns

we sell them at walmart, but you went the other way,the other extreme,which is eqaully bad, you took guns away from the law abiding and forbade them self defense, and look at you now eh?

[buffboydan]

but we were never really a gun carrying country anyway,even before the anti gun laws came in. We used to have low crime rates for other reasons, however i think allowing people to own guns is a good idea as it is a safeguard against our increasingly tyrinical government.

[billyysands]

your laws are unbeleivably orwellian

[cdylan]

your right and this shit with jacqui smith and micheal savage supports that. She wanted to make a national database for all our information. However in the US, you have a great constitution, but your information is held by private hands.

[cdylan]

"crime rates" are socially constructed. Moron.

In victorian britain there was alot of crime, in the 1930s depression there was alot of crime, crime is more reported nowadays, at the hands of surveillance etc. But also crimes are being invented everyday. Crime has actually dropped in the UK since 1997 if you believe "official statistics".

[Mickmars90]

You silly person. There is no such thing as poverty in Britain. If you want poverty, go and travel to the socialist dictatorships in Africa and see children drinking water from dirty streams and rivers. In Britain, poor children receive free healthcare and education. They never starve. Foster care is provided for them. In the African contintent, children die because of their situation. We in Britain are extremely lucky. Michael Howard was a great Home Secretary, he cut crime by 50%.

[JMR83]

That mincing cocksucking POOFTER tony blair kept on about this "tough on crime" to sound godly. Would anyone believe a word of that faggot cocksucking poofter?

[stranglingjohndenver]

crime started increasing the moment society started to break down, the moment thatcher brought in policies that let unregulated capitalism sweep through our country. as a result people only started to care about themselves and money. before thatcher people actually used to look out for others

[tincoffin]

@stranglingjohndenver

Did you personally find that you were more selfish after Thatcher came to power than before ?

[joinchristianfaith2]

Yes you are correct HUGHSTIRLING also he was the poodle that George W Bush owned from 2001 to 2007

[PaulJCena]

lmao look at the commons..

Full house?? HAHAHA

[hitmanhatton11]

Well observed.

[worcesterwombat]

what a pathetic schoolboy Blair was, piss of back to your 6th form debating society mate, you have never lived in the real world

[RJWooller]

Blair won that round. KO

[charlieiscool1000]

theres the evil blair using his charm too gain power

[Larynxis]

Dang, Blair is barely even recognizable!

[mrshenley1980]

cameron is a fresh prospective over howard, i dont miss the 80s or 90s but the now is what matters

[rockandstroll]

All tories are gay bum sex revellers.

[worcesterwombat]

surely you mean LibDems?

[sirius711]

lmao!!

[radiofoos]

hahahaha..... love it!

[JMR83]

and that poofter tony blair is not?

[LollieSmith]

Would like to see more of this.

[Durbs75]

Did this bill go through and did Blair undo it in 97 if so. Yes and No i should think. Great barnets, also!

[Greg260146]

History will see Anthony Charles Lynton Blair as a dishonest and corrupt man who in 10 years in office was the most shamefull in British history. A liar whose dishonesty led to the loss of 100s of 1,000s of innocent lives.

An excrescence on the footprint of history.

[autoassult]

tony is better then brown anyday.. brown is runing the country with lies and everything i wish thay bring back tony i aint to sure if anything is true and honest anymore maybe it's all just lies and spin doctors

[peteratyorkshire]

Are you from backwards universe?

Tony did a runner just when the scandals couldn't be hidden any more.

[antonjon1]

Howard would have been a damn good Prime minister. He had already proved himself as home secretery when crime fell. He wouldn't have let decent people be terrorised by the yobs like Blair & Brown have.

[haldenver]

you are right BUT wake up.....now there is a new battle to beat these awful folks. Make the right choice : Vote Conservative , with heart !!

Rgds HD

[jamesmclaren1985]

your a cunt

[modernjackass]

Jesus James, learn to spell. Even though your sentiments are correct - you've made yourself look like an idiot 'cause you spell like a four year old. Come on mate...

[dickyfish]

I'm sorry, but having watched Michael Howard in that infamous interview with Paxman there is no way anyone could trust him to lead the country. The second a politician shows just how sneaky and vulgar they really are is the beginning of the end as they lose the trust of the people.

[antonjon1]

Most people (but not me) trusted Blair in the begining and look at how that turned out and Brown is breaking his promises already.

[makecakenotwar1]

lol howard, mr. poll tax... from what i remember he holds the record of the number of judicial reviews brought against him for acting without authority. some prime minister indeed. i would advise not to be drawn into daily mail thinking when it comes to crime. there aren't hoards of yobs everywhere and "terrorised" is not the best way to describe any gathering of young people. it's quite a shallow, hollow view which cant be properly substantiated.

[briggsyNF]

bollocks. crime has fallen in the uk under labour and the economy has gone up.

howard lost 1,000,00 people their jobs and introduced the poll tax.

[theboy121]

the economy has boomed by world causes and thatcherist ecomomic management.

and don't you think crime is a vauge word... labour have punished more crimes of the law abiding middle classes... look around you.

so surely when using the word crime you should use it in its true form.

[Greg260146]

briggsyNF - no doubt that explains why the prison population in 1997 was around 60,000 & after 10 years murderers etc. are being let out early because the prisons are over full with about 90,000 banged up. Is it your contention Labour has cut crime and thus increased the prison population by 50% by locking up the innocent! Howard as leader did NOT introduce Community Charge. Unemployment is massive NOW merely mopped up by 1,000s of parasitic and damaging QUANGOs and NON jobs paid from taxes!

[AlonsoLegend]

The British Crime Survey, which is independent of government, indicates crime rising and as for the economy going up...the gold reserves sold-see where that gets us in the current crisis, huge borrowing to fund spending at a time of prosperity-that needs to be examined closely, and 16% more young people unemployed. The Tories may have been bad but Labour are little better.

[nubbie1944]

Haha Tony Blair is awesome!

[Warmijwilf]

Don't Thumbs down that comment, Tony Blair is #1

[nickclapton]

does anyone else find politics so depressing. politicians nowadays remind me of school children. more interested in makeing everyone else look bad than making themselves better.

[RickyUK100]

More English people voted for Howard than Blair in 2005 election!

[sludge07]

Blair's a twat, Howard a cunt.

[SPAG22]

If only Howard had been PM.

[froste12]

Country would have been as it were in the good old days of Thatcher the milk snatcher? Bollocks to that. Thank God for Blair and Labour.

[SPAG22]

Exactly we would have been a proud nation just like in the Thatcher years. Incidentally withdrawing free school milk ended waste as the milk was not properly stored and most children did not drink it. Blair was the worst PM in the history of the world and the Labour party are about as reputable as the occupants of Belmarsh prison.

[steps1]

Labour? what..sending the country to war on a whim, tuition fees for students, id cards, privatising parts of the NHS..yeah these are are your typical Labour Policies??? face it..the Labour Party lost every single debate in the 80s and 90s..and so rebranded itself, stole Conservative policies and were fortunate to have a leader who was appealing to the electorate..Blair could so easily have been a Tory..but it's time for the Tories to be back in power now

[froste12]

well yeah there is flaws obviously with labour, but all these flaws are generally perceived as conservative (neo liberal) policies aimed at privitising and de-regulating government which aims to benefit large corporations instead of the common person. Labour has lost its way unfortunately and abandoned many of its socialist policies in order to gain seats

[jedieco23]

Then THAT would mean that it was (is) the British electorate who abandoned its socialist ideals and wishes, don't you think?

Politicians don't obtain their jobs from God's will, it's for the people's will!

[RJWooller]

if only blair had spoken like this when he was in power

[tgsh2007]

Howard became Employment Secretary in January 1990; following the re-shuffle caused by Norman Fowler needing to leave and 'spend more time with the family'.

[maviscrow]

No I didn't, it was March. I should know :). The vacancy wasn't that one, it was just a normal reshuffle. Ridley and Howe went later and caused more drastic reshuffles, but Maggie just needed to bring me in at that point and cleared out some more of the old guard to make room ;). MH

[Wolverhampton1]

I think to be fair Howard and Blair were well matched in the commons.

Howard was and is an incredibly skilled debater, there is no doubt about that.

Politics was possibly more interesting with these two around and is poorer since their frontline departure!

[endlessraining]

Who knew they'd clash years later in higher positions? :D

[maviscrow]

We'd already been at each others' throats since we were "children" on Westminster Council and we shared an office in the Commons after 1983 (you could say the relationship was somewhat like Piers Fletcher-Dervish (me) and B'Stard (him)...) so this was just ...official. He's always been a nasty vindictive prat and I'm even tempted to say that when I knew him in Westminster Council he was a Tory...BUT...

Michael Howard HIMSELF

[maviscrow]

I've looked it up and it's actually January 1991 not 1990.

As for Bliar's hair, well, he has cut it into an interesting topiary. Is he really imitating a rat or is it just me? Later on he got a mullet...

[Wolverhampton1]

Will now yiss!

Mullet I think! Very fashionable in 1991 and the soundbites started early!

[JeanDArblay]

Serious political point: Blair appears to have less hair here than in later years.

[maviscrow]

This isn't January he became Employment Secretary in March 1990.