Man. I didn't know how clearly Stella speaks about his work. Easily the most well spoken painter I can think of. This was very, very interesting. And his opinion of the secondary abstract expressionists. Very astute.
before i thought just like those art critics b/c i couldnt really analyze his paintings.. or understand for that matter. this interview helped a lot and doing further research about him and the way he approached his art is very brilliant in my opinion.
Bring back Frank Stella from cryogenics and have him play the part of Woody Allen playing him, in a sort of post conceptual time warp of neo expressionistic abstract pictorial subversion of control for it's own sake.
Maybe Damien Hirst could put the whole thing in some kind of body preserving jelly such as aspic and Jasper Johns could paint the can of Stella meat as some sort of bronze 'found object'.
@misternylon well he had fucking great glasses. Those frames are so much better looking than what people have today. They're even better than woody allen's. There's such a subtlety about them. The high moderns really had a lot, certainly not everything, and so many people hated them (because they were stupid people.) who had stupid superficial ideas. But dont you think everyone wore glasses then because they "thought you looked smart?" or was optometry just so established that glasses were life.
@ippolytos1 I ended up downloading the whole film on Vuze, it's such a joy to sit and watch actual great artists from that period really talk with passion about their work.
I think Frank Stella comes across as genuinely authoritive in this doco, he is engaged and confident in his delivery, and yes he has great glasses.
@misternylon easily my favorite of the clique of that era...im not a non-representational artist bu there is a quality about our work that i find strangely similar, and strangely similarly interesting. here i see the part of sneaker decal, here a polyesther bedsheet from the 70s... BUT i like his hard lines and I like his use of a white field, and he bests rothko (who used blurry lines). I like his monologue a lot, it has a lot of universal appeal even out of context.
If i can meet people like this in new york, my life will be complete. I should study more painting, I'm too much of a CAD-monkey architecture student. :)
On the wall and in his utterance, Stella has the figures/vocabulary to make extraordinary, everyday sense. His paintings and sculptures have always owned these amazing and unique properties; they're lucid and inevitable, available, delightful and still subversive, industriall-ish hard edged but obviously hand crafted. Read his Norton Lectures from Harvard.
Its obvious that Stella made Graphics on a large scale. His arguements that this was Paintings (in reaction against) Expressionist or Action Painting and that those works had 'weak' edges is flimsy. I can see how, at the time, he would have appeared appealing, especially if not only, to the leading NYC Art Galley and why his work could be 'sold' at good profit. The contribution he believes, he made to Painting as an Art Form, is vastly exagerated.
Its obvious that Stella made Graphics on a large scale. His arguements that this was Paintings (in reaction against) Expressionist or Action Painting and that those works had 'weak' edges is flimsy. I can see how, at the time, he would have appeared appealing, especially if not only, to the leading NYC Art Galley and why his work could be 'sold' at good profit. However, the contribution he believes, he made to Painting as an Art Form, is vastly exagerated.
I'll agree that a lot of "Modern Art" is "emperor's new clothes bullshit" but personally I think that Frank Stella doesn't fall into that category. You might not like it, but remember, a lot of art is about "I could do that!... Yea, but you didn't."
I concede defeat. I am very mathematical in my thinking and I tend to believe there is always one definitive answer. This idea tends to spill over into subjects where it is not true from time to time. And while it sounds incredibly childish, I failed to accept that just because I do not see value in something does not mean that it does not exists; to someone else at least...
This is not art. It lacks any aesthetic value, it lacks any intellectual value, and it lacks any emotional value. If one believes that this abomination is fine art, then they have proven themselves to be lacking in any taste whatsoever. It makes me laugh when people take this child like work seriously. As if Frank Stella has any talent.
@Johannes999999999 I really would, but I don't have the time or energy. Try the book Minimalism: art and polemics in the sixties by James Meyer, or for beginners Art Since the 1940s. Next to Pop Art I believe Minimalism (which came from Pop) is the United States most important movement. It has affected nearly every area of art from fashion, design, music and architecture. Probably every piece of your furniture, your house, and even your car has been influenced by Minimalism.
@Johannes999999999 And why would it not be considered art? Explain to me why you think it's not art, because it's nonrepresentational, because the object has been dematerialized, because its cold, because its not traditional or technically complex (although some minimalist are)? Give me a good reason why its not. I'll tell you why you think its not, because you don't like it. In your subjective opinion, without really knowing anything about the movement or its conceptual underpinnings, you..
@seth2342 For something to be art, it must have some aesthetic value, some intellectual value, and not required but always preferred, some emotional value. If you do not set up those requirements, then everything is art and everyone an artist. This is something that simple common sense can deem ridiculous. People, due to their naïveté, often believe in the idea that one cannot define art. But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires.
@Johannes999999999 To you maybe. Like I said it's totally subjective. Your definition of art is limited and shallow. Art is anything done with creative intent. Your just giving your subjective "standard" of what you think art is. To me the lack of emotionality found in Minimalism makes me incredibly emotional-confused, scared, alienated, etc. And as for your comment about whether this has aesthetic value, ever seen the minimalist work of Dan Flavin, Olafur Eliasson, James Turrell.
@Johannes999999999 Their work is incredibly beautiful (probably more so than Stella in your traditional mindset). I really wouldn't throw the word niave around me. I've got a masters in fine art so don't think I'm a philistine by any means. "But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires."---only to you, but I know so many (much more qualified to make that arguement) who would starkly disagree with you. Do some reading on the subject. It might...
@seth2342 I will admit, I am not a scholar of the visual arts, but when you compare this work to those done by artists of the Renaissance, Baroque, or even the Impressionist era, there is no comparison. There is no mastery in Frank Stella’s work, as it is just simple geometric designs. And for Dan Flavin and James Turrell, their work also lacksany complexity. The work of Olafur Eliasson is somewhat interesting, simply because of its textures...
@seth2342 Furthermore, minimalism as a genre appeals to the most basic aesthetic values, color and texture. It is also not very creative becuase of that. And as for my “archaic” definition of art, I see nothing wrong with it. If you define it as something done with creative intent, then putting a crucifix in a jar of urine is art. This is a ridiculous proposal, as it took no skill, and no real craft to do it. And it takes very little skill to compose a work of minimalism.
@seth2342 One final idea, to fully express my idea of art, I will use an analogy comparing art to wine. For a good wine, the wine maker works diligently to ensure that the grapes grow well and that all other processes go as intended. It is a laborious process, requiring much skill and diligence, and in the end, the volume of wine produced is relatively small. The bad wine maker does not put in nearly as much effort and simply creates large volumes of mediocre wine...
@seth2342 The good wine maker is a painter of the "archaic" eras of the Renaissance and Baroque eras, as they amount of art they produced was small, but of high quality. Modernists, like Frank Stella, are the bad wine makers, who can produce large volumes of mediocre art, as they do not put in the time to come up with creatively detailed works. Finally, in terms of the consumer, you, myself, and all others; the consumer lacking in taste cannot discern between a good wine, and a bad wine...
@seth2342 In less literary terms, the critic with less taste cannot discern between a quality piece of art, and the poorly produced nonsense that is modernism. You could probably infer that you are the critic with less taste, as you deem the low quality work of Frank Stella, and other minimalists, to be art. Just as Da vinci’s is art. I myself have higher standards for what I consider to be worthy of the title of art, and who is worthy of the title of artist...
@seth2342 And in order to be considered a member of the "educated" art community, one must abandon discriminating taste and adopt the modernist view of art. But, I say that "educated" critics, such as yourself, are the less tasteful, just as the wine taster who lacks taste cannot discern between a good wine and a bad one. While you may be educated, your taste is not at all intellectual, as you cannot see how childish and inferior the work of modernists really is...
@seth2342 It is a case of the Emperor has no Clothes. As you, and many other art scholars, desiring to be accepted amongst the educated artistic community, abandon discriminating, "archaic" tastes that would make it seem as though you fail to recognize the non-existent value of modernism. It in fact has little value, as the artist no longer cares for the quality of his or her work, which is why they can produce such large volumes. Your subconscious will prevent you from recognizing this...
@seth2342 Finally, you make me seem as though I am the ignorant critic, who cannot see the value of modernism. I can relate to being elitist in terms of artistic opinion, but I am more educated in music. The difference is that I am justified in believing my opinion is superior, as a support the best type of music as established by simple logic. But your opinion is not justified, as you support inferior and low quality work. I cannot wait to see your disillusioned comments.
@Johannes999999999 Oh my god, this is worse than I thought. I really don't want to waste time on this because judging from your writing you have no idea what your talking about. It almost makes me sick to read what you wrote. I will return when I have the time...holidays and all. I will return.
@Johannes999999999 Alright, I'm back with some comments on some of the inherent flaws in your logic. Now before this analysis starts I just want to relay that talking about Minimalism, in this blog, will probably not change your mind. It takes extensive research and actual encounters with Minimalist art to make a real impact on your opinion. You see, I was a lot like you about 10 years ago, in that I was absolutely convinced that all art, or even music, before the 1900s was divinely...
@Johannes999999999 My outlook changed during my second year at art school when I encountered an overly zealous painting professor who hindered himself and his art with his tyrannical standpoints on modernism. After witnessing his own self constructed limitations...I never looked back. I started experimenting in new media, branched out and read the new philosophies and dabbled in abstraction, and its liberating. And that's how you have to approach modern and contemporary art, as a attempt...
@Johannes999999999...to break from the ridged traditions of the past and try something different, something that expresses our modern world more accurately.
@Johannes999999999 In saying that now I want to dissect some of your comments and see in I can't add some insight and fresh perspective. In the first sentence you said that "when you compare this work to those done by artists of the Renaissance, Baroque, or even the Impressionist era, there is no comparison." Ok, right there you contradicted yourself. If you consider that the Impressionist era...
@Johannes999999999...is more worthy to be called art then the modern era then you must also consider that they are very similar in philosophy. The Impressionists sought to "simplify" their craft by expressing complex representation with a single stroke of the paintbrush. Other artist,s like realist James Abbott McNeill Whistler, painter of the famous "Whistler's Mother," were also moving...
@Johannes999999999...toward a more two dimensional style. Even the title sounds more like the title of an abstract painting more so than a portrait; Arrangement in Grey and Black. So the general progression of art since the 19th century has been to flatten the picture plane, to bring all objects to the foreground, and to simplify the mark making process. Plus if you damn the Impressionists, you really have to damn the art from the Far East altogether because that's what they have...
@Johannes999999999...what they have sought to do for thousands of years, it just became tradition and part of their culture. Post Modernism, is the next step, further deconstructing and analyzing concepts and styles from Modernism. Minimalism was important because it was a reaction to Abstract Expressionists and a bridge to a new way of thinking.
@Johannes999999999 Also, if you deem that only art from before the 20th century is acceptable then I suggest you look at the work of Salvador Dali, Lucian Frued, Odd Nerdrum, and John Currin, all 20th and 21st century artists who are influenced by the Mannerist's, the Baroque era, and the Renaissance. The only difference is they paint with a modern or postmodern mindset, that is without the church, god, and only for themselves. They rival any premodernist painter in skill, but I...
@Johannes999999999...think your caught up in the pretensions of established history. You read an art history book in some community college Art History 101 course and only know the basics. You need the full picture-past, present and future to fully understand the history of art.
@Johannes999999999 "There is no mastery in Frank Stella’s work, as it is just simple geometric designs." Well, that's a matter of opinion. You could look at it as mastery of the mind. I heard a quote from a conceptual artist in retaliation to a comment made by an angry, amature art patron. The man said "Anybody can think up something like that," and the artist responded "Well you didn't...did you?" If you consider that art has been dematerializing the art object then you have to take it on...
@Johannes999999999...those grounds. Is it no less powerful because its more of a concept than a aesthetic display of skill. No, it is simply a new medium, a new vehicle to convey an expression of self and society. Jackson Pollock said that the old traditional way of painting could no longer express modern life. There was a time and a place for grand, religiously themed narratives and perfectly...
@Johannes999999999...rendered Greek gods cut from stone, but not any longer. Technology and science has evolved society and so too has art evolved as a mirror to it.
@Johannes999999999 "Dan Flavin and James Turrell, their work also lacksany complexity."
On the contrary. Your giving me your limited subjective opinion again, without really understanding what your talking about. I believe they are very complex in their simplicity. Have you ever experienced a James Turrell piece? They are...
@Johannes999999999...perceptually profound, disorienting, and spiritually invigorating, something you really have to experience in person and not just on a Google image search, like you did after I mentioned his name. They are both inherently more powerful than any two dimensional painting because they are real three dimensional space, which is something the Minimalists were trying to employ. What's scarier, a painting of a car about to hit you or the real thing?
@Johannes999999999 "The work of Olafur Eliasson is somewhat interesting, simply because of its textures..."
That doesn't really make since because his work is perceptual, based in science and has nothing to do with aesthetics, although he uses a minimal approach that is typically beautiful. Try The Weather Project at the Tate. It's one of the most...
@Johannes999999999 "Furthermore, minimalism as a genre appeals to the most basic aesthetic values, color and texture. It is also not very creative because of that."
Wrong again! Do you know how deep into Abstract Expressionism America was before Pop Art and Minimalism. "Any intelligent fool can make something bigger and better, but it takes a bit of genius to move in the opposite direction"-Albert Einstein. That's...
@Johannes999999999...exactly what it did, move in the opposite direction. And as for your juvenile take on why Minimalism is worthless-there are so many Minimal and Post Minimal artist who do amazing things with the deconstruction of aesthetics-you just need to search around. I particularly don't favor the work of Frank Stella but I understand why it was important, it was the prototype of the movement. Just as I don't favor the Giotto over Michelangelo.
@Johannes999999999 "And as for my "archaic" definition of art, I see nothing wrong with it. If you define it as something done with creative intent, then putting a crucifix in a jar of urine is art."
Have you seen the Piss Christ? It's beautiful, the way the light reflects off of the water, the dramatized angle of the shot etc. Now your getting into content and not aesthetics which means your justifying "what is art" on a whole other scale. Of course it's art, but is...
@Johannes999999999...it good art? That's up to the viewer. It's controversial, that is true, but so was the Mona Lisa, so was Luncheon on the Grass, so was every picture ever painted by JMW Turner. Art has always been controversial and to demean it to a level that is anything but because of that is a childish, idealistic tactic. In a hundred years it will seem as mainstream as some etching by Goya and there will be a new piece for you fundamentalists to bark nonsense at.
@Johannes999999999 "This is a ridiculous proposal, as it took no skill, and no real craft to do it. And it takes very little skill to compose a work of minimalism."
That's not true either (man you are killing me). Maybe in execution, although I've seen some Minimalist works that have been very labor inducive, but in the planning, the concept, and pulling all of the elements together to make a well done coherent piece...now that's another story.
@Johannes999999999 "Finally, regardless of how you define art, it usually is not good art unless it is difficult to create."
This is the clincher. The part of your pathetic little essay that makes me not want to debate with you, so after this I'll stop. Although I was planning on going through your entire post, it just takes too much out of me because of your ignorance. Why don't you tell that to Picasso, who created...
@Johannes999999999...some of the greatest portraits in history (mainly those of Dora Maar) in a day or less so. Tell that to Vincent van Gogh who did the same. In fact, and this goes back to my earlier argument about the history of art progressing toward deconstruction because of oriental influence, so tell the entire nation of China, and to a great extent the Africa. Tell...
@Johannes999999999...them that their entire art history, all of their culture isn't worth that of Western tradition because it "is not good art unless it is difficult to create." Bullshit, you have no idea what your talking about. Goodbye.
@seth2342 This final series of comments is to set a few things straight. I crave complexity and form in any type of art, and I also have a simple respect for any work that displays true craftmenship. It is for these reasons that I will probably never be able to enjoy 20th century art (except for surrealism which I do like). Also, about the final aspect of my argument which you refuted, you obviously did not see the word "usually." Regardless, any Van Gogh is sloppy, and is not very percise...
@seth2342 so I am not surprised he could make a portrait in a day. And the Picasso, I thought you were talking about one of his early, and very respectable, works. Not so, so I am not surprised either. I also do firmly believe that Western culture is much more sophisticated in art, music, and theatre. The Far East is somewhat respectable in my opinion, but beyond that, it is childish. That is what it finally boils down to for me. The pre-20th century works required ample skill and creativity...
@seth2342 but after that, what could be considered fine art often required little to no skill, and although it might be creative, it is unfiltered, raw creativity which is not intellectual, but instinctual. What is more impressive for me is taking creativity, then using judgment and knowledge to create a beautiful piece of art, music, etc. While the idea of unfiltered human creativity may be quite interesting, in practicality, it is to chaotic, the most extreme example would be Pollock...
@seth2342 Minimalism, to me at least, is the opposite. Creativity is restricted to such a degree that there is no detail or intricacy, and true genius is in the details. Finally, you argument is more bulk than substance, and while I did read it closely, little truly did defeat my argument, and you will probably just accuse me of not opening my mind to another perspective. I could easily go through your argument and critique it, but you will not see my logic, so it is pointless...
@Johannes999999999 Alright so I've read your comments and I have to tell you that I am truely sorry. I had no idea you were so limited intellectually. You believe that only an academic representation of reality is the only viable way to make art because "it takes a long time to do and is technically tedious." I believe the opposite. Any painting student can learn to paint a bowl...
@Johannes999999999...of fruit accurately, but that's just what students do. They paint what they see. True artists paint what they know. In other words amatuers paint things, masters paint ideas about things. With you it's like looking into a mirror. All you see is the surface, yourself, your skin and hair-but not what's underneath. It's a very superficial way of veiwing the world and art. I mean, of...
@Johannes999999999...course you like the artwork of the surrealist like Dali and Magritte, they look like painted photographs. With your shallow perspective on art, you can relate to that. Which is what most niave, uneducated viewers think when they look at a Dali. "It looks real so it must be good."
@Johannes999999999 By the way, I've checked around on some of the other sites you've "commented" on and I wasn't surprised. You said that my previous statments lacked substance (even though everything I said was rooted in historical fact), you on the other hand gave me subjective nonsense that was inarticulaely expressed. Of course I didn't "defeat your argument." There was...
@Johannes999999999...no argument on your side just like on all your other posts. You click into a youtube video and make some banal judgment on whether some artist is a "genuis" or "talentless", with no logic or insight as to why, someone disagrees with you, and you call them "tasteless." Yeah your life must be vastly fulfilling. Really, you build these barriers inbetween you and knowledge and then you can't grow intellectually. It's such a sad way to exist.
@Johannes999999999 If you want to have a real debate then break down my previous comments and critique them. Tell me how I'm wrong. Give me true logic instead of subjective drivel. Until then I'm not even going to dissect your last post (it would take me all night). I'll just put your little "best of" comments up so you can reflect on them and hopefully mature. Hope everything works out with your brilliant "opinions."
@Johannes999999999 3. People, due to their naïveté, often believe in the idea that one cannot define art. But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires.-Johannes999999999
@Johannes999999999 4. "Above all things in art, I value technical brilliance, and if that technical brilliance is also incredibly creative, then for me, it is perfection."-Johannes999999999
@Johannes999999999 5."Creativity is restricted to such a degree that there is no detail or intricacy, and true genius is in the details."-Johannes999999999
@Johannes999999999 6. "While the idea of unfiltered human creativity may be quite interesting, in practicality, it is to chaotic, the most extreme example would be Pollock..."-Johannes999999999
@Johannes999999999 10. "The pre-20th century works required ample skill and creativity but after that, what could be considered fine art often required little to no skill, and although it might be creative, it is unfiltered, raw creativity which is not intellectual, but instinctual." -Johannes999999999
@seth2342 One reply, then I am done. When I want complex ideas, I much prefer literature, becuase I believe it is a better medium for them. Also, one of my favorite paintings is Persistance of Memory, not just becuase it looks life-like, but becuase I see the melted clocks in relation to relativity, in that time is flexable "substance." When I go to college, I plan to take some art history courses, I mabey there I can expand my horizon. Finally, although I am quite subjective, you are as well.
@Johannes999999999 Well if you have some final thoughts then I do too. It doesn't matter what medium you employ, complex ideas exist everywhere. With art it's more visual but that makes it no less complex. Next you said that you liked The Persistence of Memory because it relates to some scientific idea, right? Well, in a previous post you stated that modern art was raw creativity and lacked any intellectual context. That statement...
@Johannes999999999 is wrong on so many levels, but I'll give you just one reason why; 99% of all art produced after the 1900s was based around some kind of scientific idea or some radical new philosophy. Cubism, Surrealism, Syncronism, Minimalism, Pointalism, etc etc etc. And it all began with Impressionism, with artists trying to exploit light and experiment with effects, to approach art from a more scientific standpoint.
@seth2342 All of your isms you claim to be approaching art from a more scientific standpoint are actually approaching it from a more experiential standpoint. Vast difference.
@Johannes999999999 Also, I think it's great that your going to college to gain a deeper knowledge of art. I want you to know that I have no hatred toward you and your opinion. It's not your opinion that I hate, it's the flawed egotistical way you present it. You come off like you have the only knowledge that...
@Johannes999999999...contains ABSOLUTE TRUTH, and what modernism has taught us is that there is no ABSOLUTE TRUTH. Especially when you meet someone like me who knows alot about the subject and can challenge you on every level. That's not a brag or a boast, its just the truth, and you might just meet one of "those kinds" of people in college. So know your enemy, and read up before you speak up.
@seth2342 Furthermore, visual art is the form which I know the least about, and it happens that it is very different from music (in terms of interpretation), in that humans can obviously interpret things which they see more easily and in more depth than things they hear, in my opinion. And due to the technical nature of composition, I have been able to win many an argument asserting my beliefs in terms of music...
@seth2342 But, I have little knowledge of visual art, so my arguments are based off of my musical ones, where my basis is technical achievement (counterpoint, development, etc.), which is the most challenging aspect of musical composition, once again, in my opinion. My opinions of visual art still stand, but I failed to accept individual perception of art, and I apologize for wasting your time.
@seth2342 Above all things in art, I value technical brilliance, and if that technical brilliance is also incredibly creative, then for me, it is perfection.
um...his painting resembles to some extent an icey cold polyesther bedsheet print from that era. However i think the look was revolutionary in that era. i can see people listening to his endless talk and just being fuzzily aware of what its about at their endless parties. i see it couched in the warm fuzzy intoxicating feeling of the era, and see none of its coldness/ mighty big canvases huh? although this is not what he is talking about,....
Help! I am asking for help of anyone that may help me identify an unknown Walt Kuhn painting.I will give you a substantial reward, if you can maybe identify who the woman in my painting is. Click on my site and watch the video. I think I may have ended up with one of his works that was maybe thought destroyed by Kuhn, Or otherwise. ANY clues you may provide me that are helpfull will be rewarded. Thank you for looking.
hey ia m an art teacher...high school and i am trying to get this type of footage at school but they block youtube so you know where i can get this....???
@c0kar7 that would be GREAT you dont understand how much that helps I teach at 3 alternative high schools in Montreal so I need to go outside of the box all the time...if you could amazing...!!!!
@c0kar7 that would be GREAT you dont understand how much that helps I teach at 3 alternative high schools in Montreal so I need to go outside of the box all the time...if you could amazing...!!!!
@seriousblack514 I can download this and increase the volume in the video. all for a small fee of course. for time rendered and its a pretty big file size also, probably over 200 mb.
Don I have a wonderful small collage by Frank, after I fianally sell the few small Basquiat drawings over the next few months you can have it,if you want it...also I have a nice Warhol, Dollar Sign, the 19" x 15" approx. version..its really nice..email me if you wish to view all before I move forward!
@artrca1000 I assert that not all work need to be driven by reaction. It implies that there can't be good work that is not made in reaction to something else.
Oh my god, this is not painting!!! What happen is that Americans are the leaders in the art market and they tell us who is a real artist, when everybody knows that all these stupid artists have no talent at all compared with European artists!
@MyRicardo1981 You know nothing about art history and have a very narrow perception of what is aesthetically pleasing. Minimalism is the bridge of reductivism that led to postmodernism, It's in total opposition to Abstract Expressionism and, to me, expresses the anxiety, the dissociation, the alienation of modern humans more so than Jackson Pollock and his circle ever did. It's almost anthropomorphic and primal, something you know about deep in your psyche.
@seth2342 Pollock is a lot like frank stella. The "hype" is different. i thinkk that minimalism and abstract expressionism probably express alienation. they're both couched int he historical avnte-garde.....as for myricardo-=obvious "troll" (chuckle)
@MyRicardo1981 "What happen is that Americans are the leaders in the art market."
That statement doen't really make sense. Popularity is like a pendulum, it comes and goes and then comes back. America's popularity in art is still at the top. Sure it wavered a bit in the 90s but that's because we are recovering from the YBA boom. Even today, when China's imports artists are popular...it;s only a novelty.
@MyRicardo1981 "when everybody knows that all these stupid artists have no talent at all compared with European artists!"
That's nonsense. Have you ever seen the academic work of these so called "talentless Minimal artists...they are technically and aesthetically amazing. They just reject pictorial illusion. And as for that statement about Europeans, have you ever heard of Damien Hirst, Sarah Lucas? They all are Europeans and they've all been influenced by Minimalism.
Painters Painting is a good documentary for me because it shows de Kooning...i wish they would have made a full-length doc of him...i saw one that had about 15 min or so...
oh, and geez, stella talks WAY too much...talking like this causes banality, you have to paint with your balls, not just your brain...thanks for putting this up, tfa
I respect what he has produced , but I find it too mechanical and intellectual. It is more maths and art. I realise he is big in research , but it's just unspontaneaous. It more pleasing then say Sean Scully who really is garbage. That's art today , what next a stuffed shark or a medicine cabinet? Art is probably the most corrupt and sick industry today just behind the stock markets and banks.
if one day ill make money, ill buy stella
fuckingharpsichord 2 months ago in playlist Favorite videos
Man. I didn't know how clearly Stella speaks about his work. Easily the most well spoken painter I can think of. This was very, very interesting. And his opinion of the secondary abstract expressionists. Very astute.
shoesshoes 2 months ago
KEEP THE VIEWER FROM READING THE PAIN-TING!
DavidEdwardSchnell 2 months ago
before i thought just like those art critics b/c i couldnt really analyze his paintings.. or understand for that matter. this interview helped a lot and doing further research about him and the way he approached his art is very brilliant in my opinion.
gdragon9410 3 months ago
Looking for representation :)
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ArtistZamira 3 months ago
i recently began studying Minimalist style art and this is good-Frank Stella's style is amazing!
gungeman81 5 months ago
Bring back Frank Stella from cryogenics and have him play the part of Woody Allen playing him, in a sort of post conceptual time warp of neo expressionistic abstract pictorial subversion of control for it's own sake.
Maybe Damien Hirst could put the whole thing in some kind of body preserving jelly such as aspic and Jasper Johns could paint the can of Stella meat as some sort of bronze 'found object'.
misternylon 5 months ago
@misternylon well he had fucking great glasses. Those frames are so much better looking than what people have today. They're even better than woody allen's. There's such a subtlety about them. The high moderns really had a lot, certainly not everything, and so many people hated them (because they were stupid people.) who had stupid superficial ideas. But dont you think everyone wore glasses then because they "thought you looked smart?" or was optometry just so established that glasses were life.
ippolytos1 3 months ago
@ippolytos1 I ended up downloading the whole film on Vuze, it's such a joy to sit and watch actual great artists from that period really talk with passion about their work.
I think Frank Stella comes across as genuinely authoritive in this doco, he is engaged and confident in his delivery, and yes he has great glasses.
misternylon 3 months ago
@misternylon easily my favorite of the clique of that era...im not a non-representational artist bu there is a quality about our work that i find strangely similar, and strangely similarly interesting. here i see the part of sneaker decal, here a polyesther bedsheet from the 70s... BUT i like his hard lines and I like his use of a white field, and he bests rothko (who used blurry lines). I like his monologue a lot, it has a lot of universal appeal even out of context.
ippolytos1 3 months ago
@misternylon you don't need to use cryogenics, he's still alive.
minarima 3 weeks ago
@minarima wow..no shit Sherlock, and secondly, full marks for missing the entire thread of the humour. Perhaps a touch dry and obscure for you.
misternylon 3 weeks ago
If i can meet people like this in new york, my life will be complete. I should study more painting, I'm too much of a CAD-monkey architecture student. :)
stevenas135 7 months ago 2
2:23
TonytheGiant15 8 months ago
whatever happened to this quality in Art? Answer Post Modernism Geoff Pattison
xchq8 10 months ago
This is very good.
panamanubian 10 months ago
On the wall and in his utterance, Stella has the figures/vocabulary to make extraordinary, everyday sense. His paintings and sculptures have always owned these amazing and unique properties; they're lucid and inevitable, available, delightful and still subversive, industriall-ish hard edged but obviously hand crafted. Read his Norton Lectures from Harvard.
jblacktree 10 months ago
Its obvious that Stella made Graphics on a large scale. His arguements that this was Paintings (in reaction against) Expressionist or Action Painting and that those works had 'weak' edges is flimsy. I can see how, at the time, he would have appeared appealing, especially if not only, to the leading NYC Art Galley and why his work could be 'sold' at good profit. The contribution he believes, he made to Painting as an Art Form, is vastly exagerated.
ekerodstudiofour 1 year ago
Its obvious that Stella made Graphics on a large scale. His arguements that this was Paintings (in reaction against) Expressionist or Action Painting and that those works had 'weak' edges is flimsy. I can see how, at the time, he would have appeared appealing, especially if not only, to the leading NYC Art Galley and why his work could be 'sold' at good profit. However, the contribution he believes, he made to Painting as an Art Form, is vastly exagerated.
ekerodstudiofour 1 year ago
i LOVE Frank Stella!!!
spousewound 1 year ago
that is cold and PSEUDO INTELLECTUAL!!
autumncathedral 1 year ago
Utter garbage. No talent, the emperor's new clothes bullshit.
autumncathedral 1 year ago
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@autumncathedral
I'll agree that a lot of "Modern Art" is "emperor's new clothes bullshit" but personally I think that Frank Stella doesn't fall into that category. You might not like it, but remember, a lot of art is about "I could do that!... Yea, but you didn't."
BluishGreenPro 1 year ago
It's all good. Next time I come over to a classical music youtube vid, you can give me hell. Later.
seth2342 1 year ago
I concede defeat. I am very mathematical in my thinking and I tend to believe there is always one definitive answer. This idea tends to spill over into subjects where it is not true from time to time. And while it sounds incredibly childish, I failed to accept that just because I do not see value in something does not mean that it does not exists; to someone else at least...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
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seth2342 1 year ago
Nice.
EGI313 1 year ago
The Emperor has no clothes allusion may have gone a bit far, but besides that, did I say anything incorrect?
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Yeah nearly the whole thing. I'm coming back soon to debate you on what I think your flaws are.
seth2342 1 year ago
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seth2342 1 year ago
Due to illness, the part of Woody Allen playing the part of Frank Stella will be played by Sean Penn.
FirstYouGetTheSugar 1 year ago
This is not art. It lacks any aesthetic value, it lacks any intellectual value, and it lacks any emotional value. If one believes that this abomination is fine art, then they have proven themselves to be lacking in any taste whatsoever. It makes me laugh when people take this child like work seriously. As if Frank Stella has any talent.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Wow, you have no idea what your talking about.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 Explain, please.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 I really would, but I don't have the time or energy. Try the book Minimalism: art and polemics in the sixties by James Meyer, or for beginners Art Since the 1940s. Next to Pop Art I believe Minimalism (which came from Pop) is the United States most important movement. It has affected nearly every area of art from fashion, design, music and architecture. Probably every piece of your furniture, your house, and even your car has been influenced by Minimalism.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 The problem is that minimalism as an entire movement lacks artistic value, and whether it has had influence does not justify it as "art."
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 And why would it not be considered art? Explain to me why you think it's not art, because it's nonrepresentational, because the object has been dematerialized, because its cold, because its not traditional or technically complex (although some minimalist are)? Give me a good reason why its not. I'll tell you why you think its not, because you don't like it. In your subjective opinion, without really knowing anything about the movement or its conceptual underpinnings, you..
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 ...have deemed it "not art." Well, I'm waiting...
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 For something to be art, it must have some aesthetic value, some intellectual value, and not required but always preferred, some emotional value. If you do not set up those requirements, then everything is art and everyone an artist. This is something that simple common sense can deem ridiculous. People, due to their naïveté, often believe in the idea that one cannot define art. But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 Furthermore, Frank Stella's work does not posses any of these values.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 To you maybe. Like I said it's totally subjective. Your definition of art is limited and shallow. Art is anything done with creative intent. Your just giving your subjective "standard" of what you think art is. To me the lack of emotionality found in Minimalism makes me incredibly emotional-confused, scared, alienated, etc. And as for your comment about whether this has aesthetic value, ever seen the minimalist work of Dan Flavin, Olafur Eliasson, James Turrell.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Their work is incredibly beautiful (probably more so than Stella in your traditional mindset). I really wouldn't throw the word niave around me. I've got a masters in fine art so don't think I'm a philistine by any means. "But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires."---only to you, but I know so many (much more qualified to make that arguement) who would starkly disagree with you. Do some reading on the subject. It might...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 ...expand your horizon. Come back when you can give me a non subjective, archaic definition of what art is.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 If you do not like my definition, please provide me with yours.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 I will admit, I am not a scholar of the visual arts, but when you compare this work to those done by artists of the Renaissance, Baroque, or even the Impressionist era, there is no comparison. There is no mastery in Frank Stella’s work, as it is just simple geometric designs. And for Dan Flavin and James Turrell, their work also lacksany complexity. The work of Olafur Eliasson is somewhat interesting, simply because of its textures...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 Furthermore, minimalism as a genre appeals to the most basic aesthetic values, color and texture. It is also not very creative becuase of that. And as for my “archaic” definition of art, I see nothing wrong with it. If you define it as something done with creative intent, then putting a crucifix in a jar of urine is art. This is a ridiculous proposal, as it took no skill, and no real craft to do it. And it takes very little skill to compose a work of minimalism.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 Finally, regardless of how you define art, it usually is not good art unless it is difficult to create.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 One final idea, to fully express my idea of art, I will use an analogy comparing art to wine. For a good wine, the wine maker works diligently to ensure that the grapes grow well and that all other processes go as intended. It is a laborious process, requiring much skill and diligence, and in the end, the volume of wine produced is relatively small. The bad wine maker does not put in nearly as much effort and simply creates large volumes of mediocre wine...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 The good wine maker is a painter of the "archaic" eras of the Renaissance and Baroque eras, as they amount of art they produced was small, but of high quality. Modernists, like Frank Stella, are the bad wine makers, who can produce large volumes of mediocre art, as they do not put in the time to come up with creatively detailed works. Finally, in terms of the consumer, you, myself, and all others; the consumer lacking in taste cannot discern between a good wine, and a bad wine...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 In less literary terms, the critic with less taste cannot discern between a quality piece of art, and the poorly produced nonsense that is modernism. You could probably infer that you are the critic with less taste, as you deem the low quality work of Frank Stella, and other minimalists, to be art. Just as Da vinci’s is art. I myself have higher standards for what I consider to be worthy of the title of art, and who is worthy of the title of artist...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 And in order to be considered a member of the "educated" art community, one must abandon discriminating taste and adopt the modernist view of art. But, I say that "educated" critics, such as yourself, are the less tasteful, just as the wine taster who lacks taste cannot discern between a good wine and a bad one. While you may be educated, your taste is not at all intellectual, as you cannot see how childish and inferior the work of modernists really is...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 It is a case of the Emperor has no Clothes. As you, and many other art scholars, desiring to be accepted amongst the educated artistic community, abandon discriminating, "archaic" tastes that would make it seem as though you fail to recognize the non-existent value of modernism. It in fact has little value, as the artist no longer cares for the quality of his or her work, which is why they can produce such large volumes. Your subconscious will prevent you from recognizing this...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 Finally, you make me seem as though I am the ignorant critic, who cannot see the value of modernism. I can relate to being elitist in terms of artistic opinion, but I am more educated in music. The difference is that I am justified in believing my opinion is superior, as a support the best type of music as established by simple logic. But your opinion is not justified, as you support inferior and low quality work. I cannot wait to see your disillusioned comments.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Oh my god, this is worse than I thought. I really don't want to waste time on this because judging from your writing you have no idea what your talking about. It almost makes me sick to read what you wrote. I will return when I have the time...holidays and all. I will return.
seth2342 1 year ago
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seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Alright, I'm back with some comments on some of the inherent flaws in your logic. Now before this analysis starts I just want to relay that talking about Minimalism, in this blog, will probably not change your mind. It takes extensive research and actual encounters with Minimalist art to make a real impact on your opinion. You see, I was a lot like you about 10 years ago, in that I was absolutely convinced that all art, or even music, before the 1900s was divinely...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...inspired and all that came after was bunk.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 My outlook changed during my second year at art school when I encountered an overly zealous painting professor who hindered himself and his art with his tyrannical standpoints on modernism. After witnessing his own self constructed limitations...I never looked back. I started experimenting in new media, branched out and read the new philosophies and dabbled in abstraction, and its liberating. And that's how you have to approach modern and contemporary art, as a attempt...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...to break from the ridged traditions of the past and try something different, something that expresses our modern world more accurately.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 In saying that now I want to dissect some of your comments and see in I can't add some insight and fresh perspective. In the first sentence you said that "when you compare this work to those done by artists of the Renaissance, Baroque, or even the Impressionist era, there is no comparison." Ok, right there you contradicted yourself. If you consider that the Impressionist era...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...is more worthy to be called art then the modern era then you must also consider that they are very similar in philosophy. The Impressionists sought to "simplify" their craft by expressing complex representation with a single stroke of the paintbrush. Other artist,s like realist James Abbott McNeill Whistler, painter of the famous "Whistler's Mother," were also moving...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...toward a more two dimensional style. Even the title sounds more like the title of an abstract painting more so than a portrait; Arrangement in Grey and Black. So the general progression of art since the 19th century has been to flatten the picture plane, to bring all objects to the foreground, and to simplify the mark making process. Plus if you damn the Impressionists, you really have to damn the art from the Far East altogether because that's what they have...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...what they have sought to do for thousands of years, it just became tradition and part of their culture. Post Modernism, is the next step, further deconstructing and analyzing concepts and styles from Modernism. Minimalism was important because it was a reaction to Abstract Expressionists and a bridge to a new way of thinking.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Also, if you deem that only art from before the 20th century is acceptable then I suggest you look at the work of Salvador Dali, Lucian Frued, Odd Nerdrum, and John Currin, all 20th and 21st century artists who are influenced by the Mannerist's, the Baroque era, and the Renaissance. The only difference is they paint with a modern or postmodern mindset, that is without the church, god, and only for themselves. They rival any premodernist painter in skill, but I...
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999...think your caught up in the pretensions of established history. You read an art history book in some community college Art History 101 course and only know the basics. You need the full picture-past, present and future to fully understand the history of art.
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999 "There is no mastery in Frank Stella’s work, as it is just simple geometric designs." Well, that's a matter of opinion. You could look at it as mastery of the mind. I heard a quote from a conceptual artist in retaliation to a comment made by an angry, amature art patron. The man said "Anybody can think up something like that," and the artist responded "Well you didn't...did you?" If you consider that art has been dematerializing the art object then you have to take it on...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...those grounds. Is it no less powerful because its more of a concept than a aesthetic display of skill. No, it is simply a new medium, a new vehicle to convey an expression of self and society. Jackson Pollock said that the old traditional way of painting could no longer express modern life. There was a time and a place for grand, religiously themed narratives and perfectly...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...rendered Greek gods cut from stone, but not any longer. Technology and science has evolved society and so too has art evolved as a mirror to it.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 "Dan Flavin and James Turrell, their work also lacksany complexity."
On the contrary. Your giving me your limited subjective opinion again, without really understanding what your talking about. I believe they are very complex in their simplicity. Have you ever experienced a James Turrell piece? They are...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...perceptually profound, disorienting, and spiritually invigorating, something you really have to experience in person and not just on a Google image search, like you did after I mentioned his name. They are both inherently more powerful than any two dimensional painting because they are real three dimensional space, which is something the Minimalists were trying to employ. What's scarier, a painting of a car about to hit you or the real thing?
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999 "The work of Olafur Eliasson is somewhat interesting, simply because of its textures..."
That doesn't really make since because his work is perceptual, based in science and has nothing to do with aesthetics, although he uses a minimal approach that is typically beautiful. Try The Weather Project at the Tate. It's one of the most...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...profound experiences I have ever witnessed from a work of art, far more than the Mona Lisa or any painting by Rubens.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 "Furthermore, minimalism as a genre appeals to the most basic aesthetic values, color and texture. It is also not very creative because of that."
Wrong again! Do you know how deep into Abstract Expressionism America was before Pop Art and Minimalism. "Any intelligent fool can make something bigger and better, but it takes a bit of genius to move in the opposite direction"-Albert Einstein. That's...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...exactly what it did, move in the opposite direction. And as for your juvenile take on why Minimalism is worthless-there are so many Minimal and Post Minimal artist who do amazing things with the deconstruction of aesthetics-you just need to search around. I particularly don't favor the work of Frank Stella but I understand why it was important, it was the prototype of the movement. Just as I don't favor the Giotto over Michelangelo.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 "And as for my "archaic" definition of art, I see nothing wrong with it. If you define it as something done with creative intent, then putting a crucifix in a jar of urine is art."
Have you seen the Piss Christ? It's beautiful, the way the light reflects off of the water, the dramatized angle of the shot etc. Now your getting into content and not aesthetics which means your justifying "what is art" on a whole other scale. Of course it's art, but is...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...it good art? That's up to the viewer. It's controversial, that is true, but so was the Mona Lisa, so was Luncheon on the Grass, so was every picture ever painted by JMW Turner. Art has always been controversial and to demean it to a level that is anything but because of that is a childish, idealistic tactic. In a hundred years it will seem as mainstream as some etching by Goya and there will be a new piece for you fundamentalists to bark nonsense at.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 "This is a ridiculous proposal, as it took no skill, and no real craft to do it. And it takes very little skill to compose a work of minimalism."
That's not true either (man you are killing me). Maybe in execution, although I've seen some Minimalist works that have been very labor inducive, but in the planning, the concept, and pulling all of the elements together to make a well done coherent piece...now that's another story.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 "Finally, regardless of how you define art, it usually is not good art unless it is difficult to create."
This is the clincher. The part of your pathetic little essay that makes me not want to debate with you, so after this I'll stop. Although I was planning on going through your entire post, it just takes too much out of me because of your ignorance. Why don't you tell that to Picasso, who created...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...some of the greatest portraits in history (mainly those of Dora Maar) in a day or less so. Tell that to Vincent van Gogh who did the same. In fact, and this goes back to my earlier argument about the history of art progressing toward deconstruction because of oriental influence, so tell the entire nation of China, and to a great extent the Africa. Tell...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...them that their entire art history, all of their culture isn't worth that of Western tradition because it "is not good art unless it is difficult to create." Bullshit, you have no idea what your talking about. Goodbye.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 This final series of comments is to set a few things straight. I crave complexity and form in any type of art, and I also have a simple respect for any work that displays true craftmenship. It is for these reasons that I will probably never be able to enjoy 20th century art (except for surrealism which I do like). Also, about the final aspect of my argument which you refuted, you obviously did not see the word "usually." Regardless, any Van Gogh is sloppy, and is not very percise...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 so I am not surprised he could make a portrait in a day. And the Picasso, I thought you were talking about one of his early, and very respectable, works. Not so, so I am not surprised either. I also do firmly believe that Western culture is much more sophisticated in art, music, and theatre. The Far East is somewhat respectable in my opinion, but beyond that, it is childish. That is what it finally boils down to for me. The pre-20th century works required ample skill and creativity...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 but after that, what could be considered fine art often required little to no skill, and although it might be creative, it is unfiltered, raw creativity which is not intellectual, but instinctual. What is more impressive for me is taking creativity, then using judgment and knowledge to create a beautiful piece of art, music, etc. While the idea of unfiltered human creativity may be quite interesting, in practicality, it is to chaotic, the most extreme example would be Pollock...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 Minimalism, to me at least, is the opposite. Creativity is restricted to such a degree that there is no detail or intricacy, and true genius is in the details. Finally, you argument is more bulk than substance, and while I did read it closely, little truly did defeat my argument, and you will probably just accuse me of not opening my mind to another perspective. I could easily go through your argument and critique it, but you will not see my logic, so it is pointless...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Alright so I've read your comments and I have to tell you that I am truely sorry. I had no idea you were so limited intellectually. You believe that only an academic representation of reality is the only viable way to make art because "it takes a long time to do and is technically tedious." I believe the opposite. Any painting student can learn to paint a bowl...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...of fruit accurately, but that's just what students do. They paint what they see. True artists paint what they know. In other words amatuers paint things, masters paint ideas about things. With you it's like looking into a mirror. All you see is the surface, yourself, your skin and hair-but not what's underneath. It's a very superficial way of veiwing the world and art. I mean, of...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...course you like the artwork of the surrealist like Dali and Magritte, they look like painted photographs. With your shallow perspective on art, you can relate to that. Which is what most niave, uneducated viewers think when they look at a Dali. "It looks real so it must be good."
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 By the way, I've checked around on some of the other sites you've "commented" on and I wasn't surprised. You said that my previous statments lacked substance (even though everything I said was rooted in historical fact), you on the other hand gave me subjective nonsense that was inarticulaely expressed. Of course I didn't "defeat your argument." There was...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...no argument on your side just like on all your other posts. You click into a youtube video and make some banal judgment on whether some artist is a "genuis" or "talentless", with no logic or insight as to why, someone disagrees with you, and you call them "tasteless." Yeah your life must be vastly fulfilling. Really, you build these barriers inbetween you and knowledge and then you can't grow intellectually. It's such a sad way to exist.
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 If you want to have a real debate then break down my previous comments and critique them. Tell me how I'm wrong. Give me true logic instead of subjective drivel. Until then I'm not even going to dissect your last post (it would take me all night). I'll just put your little "best of" comments up so you can reflect on them and hopefully mature. Hope everything works out with your brilliant "opinions."
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 1. "Finally, regardless of how you define art, it usually is not good art unless it is difficult to create."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 2. "The work of Olafur Eliasson is somewhat interesting, simply because of its textures..."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999 3. People, due to their naïveté, often believe in the idea that one cannot define art. But art is something that appeals to aesthetic, intellectual, and emotional desires.-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999 4. "Above all things in art, I value technical brilliance, and if that technical brilliance is also incredibly creative, then for me, it is perfection."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 5."Creativity is restricted to such a degree that there is no detail or intricacy, and true genius is in the details."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 6. "While the idea of unfiltered human creativity may be quite interesting, in practicality, it is to chaotic, the most extreme example would be Pollock..."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 7. "Regardless, any Van Gogh is sloppy, and is not very percise..."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 8. "The Far East is somewhat respectable in my opinion, but beyond that, it is childish."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 9. "And the Picasso, I thought you were talking about one of his early, and very respectable, works."-Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
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@Johannes999999999 10. "The pre-20th century works required ample skill and creativity but after that, what could be considered fine art often required little to no skill, and although it might be creative, it is unfiltered, raw creativity which is not intellectual, but instinctual." -Johannes999999999
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 And so many more to come...
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 One reply, then I am done. When I want complex ideas, I much prefer literature, becuase I believe it is a better medium for them. Also, one of my favorite paintings is Persistance of Memory, not just becuase it looks life-like, but becuase I see the melted clocks in relation to relativity, in that time is flexable "substance." When I go to college, I plan to take some art history courses, I mabey there I can expand my horizon. Finally, although I am quite subjective, you are as well.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Well if you have some final thoughts then I do too. It doesn't matter what medium you employ, complex ideas exist everywhere. With art it's more visual but that makes it no less complex. Next you said that you liked The Persistence of Memory because it relates to some scientific idea, right? Well, in a previous post you stated that modern art was raw creativity and lacked any intellectual context. That statement...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 is wrong on so many levels, but I'll give you just one reason why; 99% of all art produced after the 1900s was based around some kind of scientific idea or some radical new philosophy. Cubism, Surrealism, Syncronism, Minimalism, Pointalism, etc etc etc. And it all began with Impressionism, with artists trying to exploit light and experiment with effects, to approach art from a more scientific standpoint.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 All of your isms you claim to be approaching art from a more scientific standpoint are actually approaching it from a more experiential standpoint. Vast difference.
alightedlamp 11 months ago
@Johannes999999999 Also, I think it's great that your going to college to gain a deeper knowledge of art. I want you to know that I have no hatred toward you and your opinion. It's not your opinion that I hate, it's the flawed egotistical way you present it. You come off like you have the only knowledge that...
seth2342 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999...contains ABSOLUTE TRUTH, and what modernism has taught us is that there is no ABSOLUTE TRUTH. Especially when you meet someone like me who knows alot about the subject and can challenge you on every level. That's not a brag or a boast, its just the truth, and you might just meet one of "those kinds" of people in college. So know your enemy, and read up before you speak up.
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 Furthermore, visual art is the form which I know the least about, and it happens that it is very different from music (in terms of interpretation), in that humans can obviously interpret things which they see more easily and in more depth than things they hear, in my opinion. And due to the technical nature of composition, I have been able to win many an argument asserting my beliefs in terms of music...
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 But, I have little knowledge of visual art, so my arguments are based off of my musical ones, where my basis is technical achievement (counterpoint, development, etc.), which is the most challenging aspect of musical composition, once again, in my opinion. My opinions of visual art still stand, but I failed to accept individual perception of art, and I apologize for wasting your time.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@seth2342 We will obviously never convince each other of anything, so farewell, and enjoy your "art."
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
@Johannes999999999 Wow, you really exposed yourself. I'll be back to answer on this later. Wow, that's all I can say....wow...
seth2342 1 year ago
@seth2342 Above all things in art, I value technical brilliance, and if that technical brilliance is also incredibly creative, then for me, it is perfection.
Johannes999999999 1 year ago
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seth2342 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
um...his painting resembles to some extent an icey cold polyesther bedsheet print from that era. However i think the look was revolutionary in that era. i can see people listening to his endless talk and just being fuzzily aware of what its about at their endless parties. i see it couched in the warm fuzzy intoxicating feeling of the era, and see none of its coldness/ mighty big canvases huh? although this is not what he is talking about,....
ippolytos1 1 year ago
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ippolytos1 1 year ago
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ippolytos1 1 year ago
painters let their paintings do the talking. what's all this bla bla bla about?
frtac 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Help! I am asking for help of anyone that may help me identify an unknown Walt Kuhn painting.I will give you a substantial reward, if you can maybe identify who the woman in my painting is. Click on my site and watch the video. I think I may have ended up with one of his works that was maybe thought destroyed by Kuhn, Or otherwise. ANY clues you may provide me that are helpfull will be rewarded. Thank you for looking.
WaltKuhnPainting 1 year ago
May 12, 1972. It was Friday. I went to school (4th grade), then on to Weekday Church School at my church. That was pretty much my day back then.
mkl62 1 year ago
hey ia m an art teacher...high school and i am trying to get this type of footage at school but they block youtube so you know where i can get this....???
seriousblack514 1 year ago
@seriousblack514 i can download this to u.
c0kar7 1 year ago
@c0kar7 that would be GREAT you dont understand how much that helps I teach at 3 alternative high schools in Montreal so I need to go outside of the box all the time...if you could amazing...!!!!
seriousblack514 1 year ago
@c0kar7 that would be GREAT you dont understand how much that helps I teach at 3 alternative high schools in Montreal so I need to go outside of the box all the time...if you could amazing...!!!!
seriousblack514 1 year ago
@seriousblack514 I can download this and increase the volume in the video. all for a small fee of course. for time rendered and its a pretty big file size also, probably over 200 mb.
c0kar7 1 year ago
Don I have a wonderful small collage by Frank, after I fianally sell the few small Basquiat drawings over the next few months you can have it,if you want it...also I have a nice Warhol, Dollar Sign, the 19" x 15" approx. version..its really nice..email me if you wish to view all before I move forward!
G
repelghosts 1 year ago
Excelente!!
tainosoy1492 1 year ago
Oy! The gesture!
frankly1970 1 year ago
at 7:34 I gave up. no pause in his talking
gusaiani 1 year ago
Why make work that is in reaction to what precedes it. Why not just make what you want? Do you really have to posture?
sneha1965 1 year ago
@sneha1965 All of modern art has been a reaction against what came before. It's what drives progress.
artrca1000 1 year ago
@artrca1000 I assert that not all work need to be driven by reaction. It implies that there can't be good work that is not made in reaction to something else.
sneha1965 1 year ago
"aaahhhh........"
spd13062 1 year ago
i like the colors.
pizzalover6969 1 year ago
Oh my god, this is not painting!!! What happen is that Americans are the leaders in the art market and they tell us who is a real artist, when everybody knows that all these stupid artists have no talent at all compared with European artists!
MyRicardo1981 1 year ago
@MyRicardo1981 You know nothing about art history and have a very narrow perception of what is aesthetically pleasing. Minimalism is the bridge of reductivism that led to postmodernism, It's in total opposition to Abstract Expressionism and, to me, expresses the anxiety, the dissociation, the alienation of modern humans more so than Jackson Pollock and his circle ever did. It's almost anthropomorphic and primal, something you know about deep in your psyche.
seth2342 1 year ago
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ippolytos1 1 year ago
@seth2342 Pollock is a lot like frank stella. The "hype" is different. i thinkk that minimalism and abstract expressionism probably express alienation. they're both couched int he historical avnte-garde.....as for myricardo-=obvious "troll" (chuckle)
ippolytos1 1 year ago
@MyRicardo1981 "What happen is that Americans are the leaders in the art market."
That statement doen't really make sense. Popularity is like a pendulum, it comes and goes and then comes back. America's popularity in art is still at the top. Sure it wavered a bit in the 90s but that's because we are recovering from the YBA boom. Even today, when China's imports artists are popular...it;s only a novelty.
seth2342 1 year ago
@MyRicardo1981 "when everybody knows that all these stupid artists have no talent at all compared with European artists!"
That's nonsense. Have you ever seen the academic work of these so called "talentless Minimal artists...they are technically and aesthetically amazing. They just reject pictorial illusion. And as for that statement about Europeans, have you ever heard of Damien Hirst, Sarah Lucas? They all are Europeans and they've all been influenced by Minimalism.
seth2342 1 year ago
Stella is so eloquent
paperfeathers 1 year ago 2
Painters Painting is a good documentary for me because it shows de Kooning...i wish they would have made a full-length doc of him...i saw one that had about 15 min or so...
oh, and geez, stella talks WAY too much...talking like this causes banality, you have to paint with your balls, not just your brain...thanks for putting this up, tfa
thefreedomartist 1 year ago
its called 'Painters Painting'
erinh019 2 years ago
someone please tell me where this footage is from, i've seen this whole doc before but i've since forgotten the title, help me
dylnx00r 2 years ago
Frank Stella 7 Artistes Americains
7 Artistes Europeens Galeria Doree 1978 see wideo
OPENINGRECEPTION 2 years ago
sick, i love woody Allen
HESHERSWORLD 2 years ago
Due to illness, The Part Of Frank Stella will be played tonight by a young Woody Allen.
blahnupunk1 2 years ago 24
@blahnupunk1 f""ing funny!!!!!!!
Karluspade 2 years ago
@blahnupunk1 woody allen played by 90's sean penn
axeandsmash 1 year ago
@blahnupunk1 "due to anxiety..."
artrca1000 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
There's no such thing as "maths" . The word is "math" or "mathmatics". I really wish you Brits would learn to speak proper English.
blahnupunk1 2 years ago
shut the fuck up you fucking hill billy scum
quenchedinlife 2 years ago 2
minimal art yOo
reppohc88 2 years ago
I respect what he has produced , but I find it too mechanical and intellectual. It is more maths and art. I realise he is big in research , but it's just unspontaneaous. It more pleasing then say Sean Scully who really is garbage. That's art today , what next a stuffed shark or a medicine cabinet? Art is probably the most corrupt and sick industry today just behind the stock markets and banks.
MrChubbington 2 years ago
Lass es, du ermüdest mich.....
LillifeePrinzessin 2 years ago
informative but COULD HE BE DRYER? and for eleven minutes? ugh.
bearcitybearbearcity 2 years ago
Can I please have the bibliography of this vedio?
Director, Publisher
Published date...ect
Air0ne 2 years ago
painters painting
rzbloh 2 years ago
I like how the stuff interlaps.. especially the one at 8:00
Aspartamebraintumor 2 years ago
frank stella talks like someone named frank stella should
chandru1103 2 years ago 2
I love this guy's work.
davidn46 2 years ago
I have a Stella, and it's amazing how detailed it is.
IloveRolf3 2 years ago
whaaaaaaa! give it!
jordanamer1 2 years ago
thank you. favorited.
mondodracula 3 years ago
non lo conoscevo....
bel video, veramente un ottimo lavoro!
millais89 3 years ago
great Video !!! Please post more stuff like this
Tim1302 3 years ago 2