Rachel Corrie is a hero. Stood for people far away and gave her life. Palestinians are people with hope and hearts. When their child died they feel pain.People like Rachel went 5000 miles to be a human shield. I'm a old Soldiers. Her story came to me from a Poet in the middle east. They called her the beautiful American who gave all. Thank you.
John Branchizio (36) Mark T. Parson (31) John Martin Linde Jr. (30) Marla Bennett (24) David Gritz (24) Benjamin Blutstein (25) Janis Ruth Coulter (36) Avraham Boaz (71) Shoshana Greenbaum (31) Kobi Mandell (14) and dozens more (don't forget Robert Kennedy)
Why should I as an American feel any sympathy or support for the Palestinians?
Great new vid on Youtube titled "The Last Days of the Big Lie" youtube.com/watch?v=-48HQpgQRz0
Dr. David Duke's latest vid- “The Real Rogue Nuclear State” great also: youtube.com/watch?v=KLSlmLx4Fls
FDR vs. Hitler. Both took power/office 1933 their countries unemployed 25-30%. 6-8 years later Germany rate 2% USA still 20%. Who was better leader? How? Hitler threw off International Bankers. They still hate & vilify him to this day like he had no qualities
@rachelgolem ! I think you are forgetting, Israelis tell their children in those meetings that they should grow up to become IDF dogs and run over people who are fighting for a just cause.
the debate is cool here folks BUT - bulldozing homes, seriously that is like out of some 19th century aristocratic attack on real humans. Such a thing should never be tolerated by a civilized people anywhere!
That was beautiful. It touched my heart and inspired me. Rachel gave your life to try to stop a bully committing wrong. We need more like you with your great courage and honesty. Your sacrifice was not wasted. RIP.
The moral of the story is to be the change you want to see in the world. Or perhaps it's that sometimes a lame attempt at being clever just shows one for the fool they are.
@rachelgolem - maybe using the same train of taught, jews should be very carefll about who they accept showers from! not very nice when it is coming the other way.....
This comment shows what a sick hateful person you are. The Jews sent to the camps had no choice but to be herded into the "showers" . Idiot Corrie willingly traveled to a far land and into the midst of a conflict zone, where she did everything she could to help terrorists smuggle weapons aimed at civilians. She then stupidly put herself in a dangerous position by playing hide-and-seek where the bulldozer driver could not see her and got herself killed. Stupid idiot girl.
For a thousand years Jews were forced to put up with racist pigs like Rachel Corrie. We put up with ethnic cleansing, mass murder occupation and humiliation. Jews fight back now! Better get used to it! Being bulldozed to death is a fitting end to this young Nazi who would deny Jews their basic human rights! I can only cry when thinking about all the Jewish children murdered by the people she wanted to help. What in the world did those children do to her
"the best you can do is call Rachel Corrie names??" Moreover, "Rachel" is a name that all Jews honor, Rachel was considered a matriarch of the Jewish people. Ironically, Arab advocates of ethnic cleansing seek to prevent Jews from visiting Rachel's Tomb on the outskirts of Jerusalem and Bethlehem, a site that has been the focus of Jewish pilgrimages for centuries. (One of my ancestors was a caretaker there 200 years ago.) I don't think the Corrie Idiot was fit to be called "Rachel".
"I don't think the Corrie Idiot was fit to be called "Rachel".
ShmorgelBorgel 12 hours ago"
Your an evil little yank with no morals..don't need to say much more here, anyone reading your comments will come to the same conclusion as i.(what does get me though is how you can be so callous with regard to the murder of a fellow american by a forgein army?)
"does get me though is how you can be so callous with regard to the murder of a fellow american by a forgein army?"
I sympathize with her parents, whose daughter committed suicide. Normally, I have sympathy for suicide victims, they go through terrible mental anguish, but when learns about the character of the Corrie Idiot,one sees that her voluntarily ending her own life was no loss to the world. She died to protect smuggling tunnels aimed at bringing in weapons to harm me and other Israelis
"the best you can do is call Rachel Corrie names???"
Like I said, I am being very charitable to the Corrie Idiot's memory. I could call the stupid little girl who committed suicide by playing hide-and-seek in front of a heavy machine whose operator couldn't see her many worse things.
That's the evidence of your sick thinking right there. Jews living in their own small country is "a problem". You advocate the ethnic cleansing of Jews from Israel and their dispersal around the world. That happened once, but it won't happen again.
@ShmorgelBorgel - Yep you’re the problem, and people like you, immigrants, colonists, ethnic cleansers, hypocrites, terrorists and criminals, yep people like you are the problem in Palestine. If immigrants like you stayed in their own country then those defenceless indigenous people could live without fear of their homes being demolished.yes you are the problem. By the way it is not your "small country" it is someone elses "small country" and so says the rest of the world......
"By the way it is not your "small country" it is someone elses "small country" and so says the rest of the world"
First off, I have faith in much of humanity, not all are disgusting hate-filled specimens like you who openly advocate ethnic cleansing and the scattering of Israel's Jewish inhabitants all over. Much of the world does recognize the inherent right of the Jewish people to independence in its homeland, something we had once and finally regained 62 years ago.
@ShmorgelBorgel - checked it again shorgell... Jerusalem is a occupied city under international law.....you lose so shhhhhhhh, and anyway your a yank so your capital is where............?
", and anyway your a yank so your capital is where............? "
I'm an Israeli who also happens to hold a US passport. My capital is Jerusalem, because it is where the Kneseet meets. I vote in Israeli elections, not US elections--I'm Israeli. Although the USA is a nice country that I have nothing against, it is not home for me. My US passport is simply a useful document that enables me to travel to America without waiting on line for a visa if I wish to visit my my daughter who lives there.
@ShmorgelBorgel - Your a yank, you have an american passport..its not hard to work out, most people would find this one easy.....as you yourself said regarding an american who had a Palestinian passport "He can't be both", you have made a fool of yourself with your own words........enough said.
""as you yourself said regarding an american who had a Palestinian passport "He can't be both", When did I ever make such a statement? Nobody can be both a Palestinian and American citizen because no such state called "Palestine" exists (or ever existed) for anybody to be a citizen of. However, if and when a Palestinian state ever emerges, then certainly a Palestinian-American should be able to claim dual citizenship, if the Palestinian state permits it. (The US permits dual citizenship.)
"Europe have passports from more than one country"
btu you not so long ago staed that an american who held a palestinian passport was not entitled to it? So why change your view when it comes to an american holding an israeli passport? You are such a hypocrite, you change yor view when it does not sit your own purpose...rather like your state..and if you are so commited to been an israeli why dont you apply for one?you would have no problem taking the racist oath.....
"btu you not so long ago staed that an american who held a palestinian passport was not entitled to it"
Nope, I never wrote any such thing. When and if a State of Palestine ever gets established for the first time in history, why should I care if a citizen of the not-yet-existing "State of Palestine" also carries a US passport?
"and if you are so commited to been an israeli why dont you apply for one?"
If you mean apply for an Israeli passport, I've had one since birth. Although all Jews are entitled to Israeli citizenship, I've never needed to apply, since I was Israeli from birth through my father, who obtained Israeli citizenship in the 1950s (his Mum was born here in 1907). I lived here from age of 4-12 and have Israeli ID from the 1970s, and I live here again now. What's the big deal?
"you would have no problem taking the racist oath....."
I would indeed have a problem taking a racist oath. A racist oath would require that I swear that I belong to a superior race, which is something I don't believe in. (Although I am sure I am quite clearly superior to you, but that's a different matter.) If I didn't already have Israeli citizenship from birth, however, I would have no problem swearing loyalty to Israel as a Jewish and democratic state if I wanted to become a citizen here.
"its not hard to work out, most people would find this one easy...."
Yes, most people ESPECIALLY people throughout Europe, INCLUDING Ireland and the UK, where you claim to to live, would find the concept of dual citizenship VERY EASY--because so many people in Europe have passports from more than one country. I know people who are citizens of both the UK and Ireland, the US and Ireland, the UK and Australia, etc...all these people have more than one passport---how can they be both?
@ShmorgelBorgel - can't beleive you accuse me of supporting ethnic cleansing! its like hitler accusing stalin of engaging in a little murder!!!! i am not even going to grant you the respect of discussing it with you..what a fool.
"can't beleive you accuse me of supporting ethnic cleansing! i"
Do you have Alzheimer' s Disease? Have you not the courage to stand by your very own words? You have repeatedly and frequently advocated that the Jews leave the land that you Europeans named "Palestine". Your own words damn you as someone who supports the ethnic cleansing of the Jewish inhabitants of Israel and have nothing bad to say about the Arabs who ethnically cleansed Jews from areas of this country in 1948.
@ShmorgelBorgel - Sorry you have not answered my question, where have I agreed with ethnic cleansing?Jews are, as we speak carrying out ethnic cleansing in the West Bank, and “gerrymandering” a “state”, illegal under international law by moving immigrants, such as yourself into areas formally populated by arabs……that’s ethnic cleansing….requesting them to go back to new york or wherever is just requesting a wrong too be righted…grow up and face up to what you have done.
"you have not answered my question, where have I agreed with ethnic cleansing?"
You not only "agree" with ethnic cleansing, you openly advocate it. This evening Jews commemorate the destruction of the Temple by the Romans and the Babylonians that occurred on the 9th of Av--an ethnic cleansing that was committed against the Jews of Jerusalem millennia ago. In 1948, Arabs ethnically cleansed Jerusalem of its Jewish population, we reversed that in 1967 but you advocate another ethnic cleansing.
no i advocate you abiding by the laws of an Institution, the UN, whos resolution granting you the right to steal arab land you so whole heartedly accepted and yet when you steal more land and are told by the same instittion to cease this illegal and immoral behaviour you ignore it,i am advocating you not pniching those palestinians for the crimes of those a "millenna ago",i am adocating a humane approach to the treatment human of beings
"have to work now (but i am glad that you have accepted the UN should not be
allowed to decide on moral issues"
As I said, the UN in 1947 was composed in large part by the victorious allies over Nazism. Back then it had more moral authority, which has deteriorated significantly since that time as it has welcomed in all kinds of sick regimes into its ranks.
"..so when are yo giving back the land you stole???)""
You can't "give back" what has always belonged to you.
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Back then they had more moral authority", you sad little yank.......not much to say to that it just shows you what a hypocrite you are.....time to give back what yo stole..as i said i agree with what you have said the UN have no moral right to steel someone elses land ....so give it back and go back home to the U S of A...its where you belong.....
".so give it back and go back home to the U S of A...its where you belong..... "
I can walk to the Mount of Olives Cemetery here in Jerusalem and find family tombstones from the past several hundred years (not all of them were used to pave streets by the Jordanians when they occupied our city). Like all Jews, my roots are here. Why do you think I have so much right to squat on land in America that was stolen from the indigenous Indians by European colonialists like you?
You’re an american colonist who has arrogantly decided that he has the right to live on someone else’s land, but can’t admit it because to do so would mean the end of the fairy story you keep telling yourself in order to placate the crimes you , go home and if all the other thousands of immigrants did the same then those people who have been ethnically cleansed of their land since the foundation of israel could come home and the problem would be solved.
"the foundation of israel could come home and the problem would be solved. "
That's just it. Jewhaters like you view the fact that Jews have freedom in their land as a "problem". Truthfully, you care nothing about the so-called "Palestinian people." I have more in common with Arabs culturally than you do and have more concern for them than you. I actually want the local Arabs who have adopted the name Palestinian to gain what they are entitled to, self-determination in a small state next to mine
"then those people who have been ethnically cleansed of their land"
You don't give a fig about ethnic cleansing. I've shown you many examples of Arab ethnic cleansing of Jews (including members of my own family) and you just ignore it. You make demands for further ethnic cleansing of Jews from their Israel, to "solve the problem" of the Jews living in their land. Disgusting specimens like you don't want the local Arabs to get a chance at independence in their own state through compromise.
@ShmorgelBorgel - but shorgel you have an american passport....you cant be both, i find it rather sick that you would use the ethnic cleansing of the indigenious people of america in order to plicate the jewish ethnic cleansing of Palestine. kep insisting As i keep saying why do you keep insisting on using other countries atrocities to somehow excse your own atrocities, from a moral point of view it is pointless argument, rather like the nazis using the trks as their reason to murder jews....
""but shorgel you have an american passport....you cant be both,"
Umm, sure you can have both citizenships. Look, I am looking right now at my US passport and I am looking at my Israeli passport. I have both. What's the big deal? You live in Europe, don't you? All over Europe, there are people who hold two or more citizenships. I know people who have both Irish and UK passports, and people who have US and Irish passports.
I actually knew someone from the US who was American -born, and had just one Irish-born grandfather who went to the Irish embassy and got himself an Irish passport, making him a US-Irish citizen.So people have dual citizenships all over the world, but Jewhaters think it is outrageous that some Israelis like me hold a US passport. In my case, like I said, my roots here go back much further than my US roots, my grandmother was born here and I have more family here than in the US.
"i find it rather sick that you would use the ethnic cleansing of the indigenious people of america in order to plicate the jewish ethnic cleansing of Palestine."
You STILL haven't learned the correct usage of the word "placate"? Really, don't they speak English in Ireland? You know, you are not paying me, but since it's in part of my generous Jewish nature, I will give you more tuition-free vocabulary lessons: "pla·cate
to appease or pacify, esp. by concessions or conciliatory gestures"
"i keep saying why do you keep insisting on using other countries atrocities to somehow excse your own atrocities,
I recognize that for a Jewhater like you the existence of Jews having freedom in their own land represents an "atrocity" but we don't see it that way. We are very happy here in our own country. You suggested to me that I return "home" to America, a country where my family only briefly lived and that was stolen from its natives, unlike Israel, which RETURNED to its people, the Jews.
"rather like the nazis using the trks as their reason to murder jews.... "
The Nazis didn't use the Turks as their reason to murder Jews. Unlike the Nazis who very nearly succeeded in exterminating the world Jewish population Zionism is responsible for the creation of the idea that there is something called a "Palestinian People". No such concept ever existed before Israel. They owe us, big time for their invention.
@ShmorgelBorgel - Well you have finally done it, now "democratic" israel is to introduce a LAW by which every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state, now you tell me israel is not a racist entity!!!! all your comments now seem mute dont they?any state that links its right of citizenship with a particular fate is racist by definition.Dont you feel shame at your countries racist policies? or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else?
"israel is to introduce a LAW by which every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state,"
The proposed law is aimed at immigrants who wish to obtain Israeli citizenship. It's not racist to ask of people who move to our country that they recognize the Jewish national culture here, just as it is not "racist" if a Polish person or Nigerian moves to Ireland and applies for Irish citizenship, to ask of them that they be loyal to Ireland as an Irish state.
""racist by definition....Dont you feel shame at your countries racist policies? or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else? "
I gave a very good textbook definition of what the words "racist" and "racism" mean, that biology confers on various population groups in the human species distinct genetic advantages and disadvantages which separate them into sub-groups called "races". What does asking immigrants to respect the national Jewish culture in Israel have to do with "race"?
@ShmorgelBorgel "What does asking immigrants to respect the national Jewish culture in Israel have to do with "race"? "
let me explain, becase you dont seem to get it, (or maybe you do but are ashamed to admit it, which i can totally understand, shame is a powerfull thing), yo are asking people to pledge allegiance to a fate before they can become citizens!!! so what yo are saying is if you are not jewish you are not good enough, thats racist, do you understand now?
"yo are asking people to pledge allegiance to a fate"
LOL, I'm reviewing some of your comments--you really ARE stupid. You think "faith" is spelled "fate" because you don't pronounce the "th" in your ridiculous accent! Now, typos are one thing, and you can't help your spoken Irish accent, but man, you're fuc*ing ignorant! I didn't even get it at first--because I thought you were using the word "fate" like the word, "destiny"! But you're trying to spell "faith"--Damn what an ignoramus you are!
" if a Polish person or Nigerian moves to Ireland and applies for Irish citizenship, to ask of them that they be loyal to Ireland as an Irish state"
No we dont, you are just making things up now, there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon so that he may become a citizen! israel is now a very dangerous state, its making a particular religon a compulsory requirement for becoming a citizen.....scary, very scary
"you are just making things up now, there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon "
Wow, you're so fucking stupid. Nobody is asking any potential immigrant to "swear loyalty" to the religion of Judaism, we don't want non-Jews to convert to our religion. But people who come here to live, whether Jews or non-Jews, and who wish to become citizens of our country should recognize the Jewish national culture of our country, and be loyal citizens.
"israel is now a very dangerous state, its making a particular religon a compulsory requirement for becoming a citizen"
No Mr Stupid-Israel is not like Saudi Arabia, which BY LAW does not allow any non-Muslims to have Saudi citizenship. Jews, unlike Christians and Muslims do not believe in imposing our religion on others. 20% of Israeli citizens are non-Jews and we have no wish to make them Jews.
"there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon so that he may become a citizen!"
Get this straight. Being loyal to Israel as a "Jewish state" is not the same as being loyal to the Jewish religion. It is the same as asking that an immigrant be loyal to Ireland as an IRISH state (not a Catholic state) or Greece as a Greek state (not a Greek Orthodox state). "Jewish" refers to the NATIONAL CULTURE of Israel, not only the religion.
"or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else? "
It's not ok for anyone to be racist, but every nation has racists among them. In fact, holding up examples of when individual Jews express racist sentiments and blaming the Jewish nation as a whole for that is itself racist. Many in Hungary and Slovakia are racist towards the Gypsy minority, yet I don't blame all Slovakians as racist. Nevertheless, you have not shown anything racist in the proposed law.
@ShmorgelBorgel The big difference between the countries you have mentioned and Israel is that Israeli racism is institionalised, like SA, the government,which is democratically elected has passed laws which are systematically biased against non-jews there pure audacity beggars belief,not only now do non-jews have their house and farms demolished to make way for immigrant jews (such as yourself) but now they cant become israeli citizens without being jewish!!! this is not "individual jews"
The big difference between Israel and those other countries that I mentioned is that the non-Jewish minority in Israel actually enjoys rights. Arabs sit on the Israeli Supreme Court, where they interpret laws that affect all Israelis, they serve as ministers in cabinet that decide government policy for all Israelis, they serve as generals in the army defending all Israelis.
Again, Jews such as myself are much more alien to the USA, where my family only lived briefly,than to Israel. In my case, my grandmother was born here, she came from a Jerusalem family that has been here longer than 90% of the Arabs who recently adopted the name "Palestinian". Like I said, I take a short walk to the Mt of Olives Cemetery and find tombstones of people related to me from the past 500 years. I can only find one ancestor's grave in the USA.
"but now they cant become israeli citizens without being jewish!"
Would you rather I call you an idiot or a liar? I'll be generous in my assessment of your character, as I always prefer to find good in people, and rather than call you a malicious pathological liar, merely state that you are definitely of defective intelligence. You would have to be a total cretin to come to the conclusion that requiring immigrants to swear loyalty to Israel as a Jewish state would force them to become Jews.
"hich every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state"
The proposed law applies to non-Israelis who apply for Israeli citizenship, whether they be Jewish immigrants from the UK, Egyptian Arabs who marry Israeli Arabs, Thai workers, or refugees from Arab genocide in Sudan who found protection here. If non-citizens wish to obtain an Israeli passport, they should recognize the national culture here, which is Jewish and democratic. Nobody forces them to come here.
@ShmorgelBorgel So let me get this right, you have constantly said that israel is not a racist state, is not an apartheid state, my God how you have gone on about it, and yet you agree with a LAW which is so racist that it turns Israel into exactly the same as SA apartheid regime, except the state of israel has supplemented religion for skin colour.Put this together with the ethnic cleansing, the house demolitions, the daily murders of Palestinians and you have nazis germany..well done..
" you have constantly said that israel is not a racist state, "
Again, you'll keep on saying the same idiotic thing, and I'll keep repeating the same truth. To be racist means one believes there are essential inherent biological differences between different human population groups that are called "races" and to advocate discrimination on that basis. Israeli society is multiracial in nature, therefore not "racist".
Exactly so. In Apartheid South Africa, the white MINORITY prevented the black MAJORITY from voting or holding any power. In Israel, the Arab MINORITY does indeed vote and members of hold positions of high political and economic power within Israeli society.
The only reason they are a minority is because the jews ethnicly cleansed them from their land (and continues to do so), and replaced them with more jews, the brits done exactly the same here in Ireland, its classic colonists activity...tell yo what let all the people who wer ethnicly cleansed by the jews return, then lets see who the majority are??? well how about it..nope did nto think so..
"tell yo what let all the people who wer ethnicly cleansed by the jews return, then lets see who the majority are???"
Like I said, a large proportion of the "Palestinian" Arabs are descended from immigrants to this country, they started a war that they lost, and in most wars, the side that loses leaves. (It happened just last year with ethnic Georgians in South Ossetia, all of the Georgians were kicked out after Georgia lost the war.)
How come you STILL have no comment about the ethnic cleansing of East Jerusalem's Jewish inhabitants (many of whom had roots there for centuries, like my father's uncles and cousins) by Jordanian Arab forces when they took over the eastern half of the city in 1948? Why do you think that was okay? I am very interested in hearing your justification for this. What about the million Jews who were kicked out of various Arab countries and had their assets stolen? Why no comment?
@ShmorgelBorgel - Challenge you to show me where I have ever stated that, but what is interesting and constant in your comments is the only defence you have against your current bout of ethnic cleansing is to use other despots and dictators actions to legitimize yours..if you consider your state to be as inhumane and barbaric as that well theres not much I can say.. the fact is the ongoing ethnic cleansing of the West Bank is happening as we speak..and you see nothing wrong with that.......
@ShmorgelBorgel - insult me as much as you want, does not bother me in the least but an oath which requires citizens to be, and i quote, "jewish and democratic" means exactly what it states, if it didn't require a perspective citizen to be "jewish" then it wouldn't have stated it so clearly. i am not confused in the least, unfortunately you appear to be in a state of denial about what is clearly been required of a new "citizen" of israel.
I'm not insulting you when I call you stupid, I'm DESCRIBING you. There's a difference.
"an oath which requires citizens to be, and i quote, "jewish and democratic"
Again, Mr Stupid, there is no such oath requiring that citizens of Israel must be Jewish. However, there is a proposed law that would require that new citizens of the country, Jewish and non-Jewish, agree to recognize that our country is Jewish and democratic.
"you agree with a LAW which is so racist " I don't agree with any racist law. A racist law would say that some people should have less rights than others based on their genes. I agree with a law that says immigrants to this country--people who CHOOSE to live here and freely decide that they wish to become citizens (remember--nobody forces them to move here and nobody forces them to apply for citizenship) should be loyal to the Jewish national character of our country.
@ShmorgelBorgel "A racist law would say that some people should have less rights than others based on their genes"
Well, tell you what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home inorder to make room for an immigrant jew and then tell me your state does not make decisions on the basis of genetic heritage.....your playing with words..israel is a racist stae..demolision of Palestinian homes is very tangible demonstration of racism..
"Well, tell you what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home inorder"
The Jewish state doesn't "demolish" so-called "Palestinian homes" in order to make way for "immigrant Jews". However, the municipality of Jerusalem and the Israeli government does have the right to enforce building codes and dismantle structures that are erected without the correct permits, whether they are built illegally by Arab or Jewish residents of our city.
I"f a Jewish homeowner in WEST Jerusalem (or Tel Aviv or any other Israeli city) illegally"
i hate it when you act in such a childish and immatre manner and treat me like an idiot.Firstly Jersalem is an occupied city and therefore jews have no legal right to issue or not issue permits.It is impossable for the native population to get permits from the isrealis, but rather simple for jewish immigrants to build jewish homes on occupied land, its apartheid in action, & you know it
"Firstly Jersalem is an occupied city and therefore jews have no legal right to issue or not issue permits"
Jerusalem is the capital of Israel. It has had a clear Jewish majority since at least the 1840s (the year of the first Ottoman census). For it to be "occupied", then there has to be a country that was the legal sovereign there before Israel. The British controlled it before Israel took West Jerusalem and the Jordanians took East Jerusalem. I'm surprised you are so pro-British.
"It is impossable for the native population to get permits from the isrealis,"
Most Israelis are indeed native in the country, and even those born outside almost all trace ancestry to here. Many of the Arabs are relative newcomers. Nevertheless, most Arab residents of the capital of Israel (JERUSALEM) do indeed succeed in obtaining building permits. Abu Tor, an Arab neighborhood in West Jerusalem, which has been part of Israel since 1948 is one of the most prosperous areas in Israel.
"what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home"
If a Jewish homeowner in WEST Jerusalem (or Tel Aviv or any other Israeli city) illegally and improperly builds a structure without the correct permits, he also runs the risk of having it destroyed by the government. That's because, like all normal countries, we have a society based on law and compliance with procedure--people have to file architectural plans with the building department, etc.
"your playing with words..israel is a racist stae. "
No, I'm using words correctly. Words have meaning. AGAIN, racism refers to a belief that various human population groups are superior or inferior on the basis of genetics.
"demolision of Palestinian homes is very tangible demonstration of racism"
Demolishing an ILLEGAL structure erected without the proper building permits is a tangible demonstration of enforcing the LAW. Houses built by Jews without the correct permits also get demolished.
@ShmorgelBorgel "tangible demonstration of enforcing the LAW"
You have no force of "LAW" in Jerusalem, under international law it is an occupied city (just explained that one above), oh heres another one, "Resolution 298: deplores Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem" and how about this one "Resolution 476: reiterates that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are null and void. " So putting it simply israel is a theif and theives do not get to make laws about that they have stolen.
I'm still waiting for your comment on the Arab ethnic cleansing of Jews. Not just the million Jews who were ethnically cleansed by Arabs from Iraq, Egypt, Yemen, Syria, Libya, Algeria--but the ethnic cleansing of Jews in 1948 by the Arabs who later adopted the name "Palestinian"--people like my own relatives who were ethnically cleansed BY ARABS from Jerusalem. You think ethnic cleansing is good when Arabs do it to Jews and you want more.
Israeli Jews are such amateurs at killing Arabs...nobody is better at killing Arabs than Arabs. In 62 years of conflict, a grand total of approximately 50,000 people, roughly 20,000 Jews and 30,000 Arabs, have been killed. This total includes combatants and civilians on both sides. Hafez Assad killed more people in one month. So "daily murders" my ass. However, between 2000-2005 over 1000 Israelis were murdered in suicide bomb attacks. We won't return to that!
"Israeli Jews are such amateurs at killing Arabs..."
There you go AGAIN, not dealing with the facts as i put them to you, using other countries atrocities in order to side step your own atrocities.......i mean your state is now hiring american mercenaries in order to carry to your illegal activities..only despot contries stoop to these tactics......what next concentration camps? oops sorry forgot about Gaza........
"The Israeli army is composed of Israeli citizens and legal residents."
Well I thought you were up to date on all the latest, obviously I have put to much faith in you, but don’t worry I shall educate you regarding this act which is usually associated with “Banana Republics”. Jay Schultz, the executive director of Aish Malach, has set up a new Israeli body to help foreigners enlist in the IDF” (The Independent) Saturday, 19 June 2010. So now israel is hiring merceniries..
"Aish Malach, has set up a new Israeli body to help foreigners enlist in the IDF” (The Independent) Saturday, 19 June 2010. So now israel is hiring merceniries.."
By definition, a Jew who returns to his homeland, Israel, is not foreign, he belongs here, and if he is not a foreigner, then he can't be a mercenary. Mercenaries by definition are foreigners who enlist for monetary or other gain--like the non-French who enlist in the French Foreign Legion-that's an example of a mercenary army.
Machal stands for "Mitnadvei Chutz Laaretz" which literally means "Volunteers from out of the land" in Hebrew. Note, "out of the land" doesn't mean "foreign", the word for "foreign" in Hebrew is "zar", meaning "strange." There is nothing strange about a Jew coming home from a land of exile and volunteering for his country, Israel. It's the most natural thing! We are not like France, with its mercenary army (French Foreign Legion), but our army welcomes back the sons and daughters of Israel.
"There is nothing strange about a Jew coming home from a land of exile"
Lets take it real slow so that you will understand, it does not matter one bit what the organisation that is recruiting mercenaries for the idf is called they are mercenaries, foreigners taking money to fight another countries battles.Your feeble attempt to class them as “exiles” is what you call “Grasping at straws”, they are americans taking money from the Iisraelis to murder Palistinians.
", foreigners taking money to fight another countries battles."
Again, let's explain slowly for you. Jews who come to Israel--whether they come from from America, France or Britain, and who do their national service by defending the Jewish homeland, in the IDF, by definition are neither foreign nor mercenary. If they serve in the IDF they are serving in their own own country's army. If I had served in the US army rather than the IDF,I would be far more mercenary.
"If they serve in the IDF they are serving in their own own country's army."
No they are not, its very simple if you are born in France you are French, whether that person is jewish, protestant, catholic or hindu, being jewish does not give you the rght to ethnicly cleanse a land and claim it because of some fairy tale concocted to sponge your guilt! it would be like me staking a claim to Italy because i was born a catholic! How juvenile and childish is that!
now, now, does that sound just little bit sterotypical to you? even a bit racist? It kind of shoots your previous statements regarding you not being racist out of the water. To tell you the truth i am rather hurt by your sterotypical view of the Irish, i am so hurt that i think i shall have to have a drink......get it?
"now, now, does that sound just little bit sterotypical to you? even a bit racist?"
Nothing at all racist about me suggesting that you are a drunk--it's well known that Irish love their Guiness--and in fact, it's rather charitable of me to say you're a drunk. If you're not a drunk, then I guess your incoherent thoughts and stupid comments are due to your natural low intelligence and can't be blamed on alcohol!
ohh we are after upsetting someone, anyone who has to resort to juvenile stereotypes has indeed been beaten in the argument, I accept your capitulation to my far more reasoned comments. (think i will have a pint to celebrate)
No, nothing wrong with admitting you're a heavy drinker and nothing racist in my observation that it's likely the case--either that or you're just naturally stupid. My point was that the IDF, in accepting Jews from abroad into its ranks, is not doing anything mercenary by welcoming the children of Exile lands home. If the IDF was a mercenary army, they would accept drunk Irish non-Jews like you into their ranks just to increase manpower, this is not the case.
Sorry bud, but to be exiled from a land there first has to be a land to be exiled from and as has been pointed out by many historians ISREAL NEVER EXISTED prior to the terrorism of 1948. and by the way "the children of exile lands" ,its a bit hollywood dont you think?
"the children of exile lands" ,its a bit hollywood dont you think?"
Jews have been using the term "Exile" ("Galut" or "Gola" in Hebrew) to refer to Jews living Eretz Yisrael for 2,000 years before Hollywood existed. It's a traditional Jewish term.
The IDF is a mercenary organisation, it was bourn out of terrorist groups such as the Igrun and the Lehi Zionists (remember them?) and takes any nationality, it is now actively recruiting yanks.......thats a mercenary and they are joining a terrorist organisation who are very good at murdering people.........as for your comment about the "drunk Irish" well it just shows your childish sterotypical racist character... i am so upset about that..
It's not my intent to upset you. I am only saying that you're stupid because it's obvious. I am only 163 cm-- I don't take offense if someone makes the observation that I'm short. What's true is true. I am short ! And you are stupid. I know I'm not the first person whose told you this, I'm quite sure it's something you've heard from your Mum, teachers, significant others, friends, etc. for most of your life.
Your not upseting me in the least, your misinformed regarding the facts, and thats ok, not everybody can be informed to the same degree...but i will stick with you until yo see the light......
Good, it's not my intent to upset you. When someone remarks upon the fact that I short because I am only 1.63 meters, he is only stating fact, and I am not upset. When I comment about your stupidity, I am only stating fact, and you should not be upset. You are stupid.
"being jewish does not give you the rght to ethnicly cleanse"
You're right it does not--that's why there are so many Arab citizens of Israel who enjoy democratic rights here. We did, however, PREVENT the total ethnic cleansing of Israel of its Jewish inhabitants. In 1948, Arabs promised to throw us into the sea and we stopped them from doing so. Every bit of land the Arabs won in 1948 was ethnically cleansed of Jews and moral defectives like you support that. We won't let it happen again.
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Arab citizens of Israel who enjoy democratic rights here"
Its called gerrymandering on the back of ethnic cleansing, tell you whta let all those indigenious arabs who were ethnicly cleansed from their land return, then let see democracy in action......you won't do that will you because your afraid of true democracy..remember when you cleanse a land through terrorism, then cleanse it, then colonise it with Foreigners it has nothing to do with"democratic rights".
"tell you whta let all those indigenious arabs who were ethnicly cleansed from their land return, then let see democracy in action...." Arab squatters were offered a state in over half the historic land of Israel and they have refused it several times. Arabs who fled in 1948-49 have no inherent right of return--they ethnically cleansed Jews from Old Jerusalem when they controlled it. We don't trust them not to implement their Arab-supremacist apartheid policies dominate.
"hen cleanse it, then colonise it with Foreigners it has nothing to do with"democratic rights"."
We never colonized it with "foreigners," but Israel enabled Jews to return to their land from foreign Exile. Many foreign Arabs had to flee during the fighting, however. I do respect the Arabs' living in the West Bank/Gaza to have self-determination in their own state, if that's what they wish. Unfortunately, they are encouraged by European racists like you to decline compromise.
thats funny i am just watching a bunch of yanks building and colonizing on occupied land as i text..and i know they are yanks because they are being interviewd by the reporter as i write, dont worry they are being well protected by the idf..in total disregard towards the rule of law...tell me how do you expect there to be any peace when you continue to steal land.....isreal has no morals what so ever, your a disgrace
"thats funny i am just watching a bunch of yanks"
What is funny is throughout history, Jews were not accepted fully as citizens of the countries in which they lived in Exile. Jews in Germany were not considered Germans, a Jew in France was never truly considered a Frenchman, even in the so-called land of liberty the USA--Jews fought hard to be recognized as Americans and often are told they aren't true Americans. Now, that they're home in Israel, you call them "Yanks".They're Jews and at home
Look at the Jews of Ireland--Jews are not thought of or accepted by the Irish as real Irishmen--even after their families have lived there for more than 100 years. I know Jews from Dublin here in Israel--when they talk about growing up there-- and they are fond of Ireland mostly-- they say "relations with the Irish were good". That's because they know they are not Irish--they are Jews from Ireland, but not Irish. Neither do the non-Jews of Ireland accept them as truly Irish .
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! "
In 1904, the good citizens of Limerick rioted against the Jews of that city in the Limerick pogrom, they most certainly did not accept the Jews of that town as fellow Irishmen. A Jew cannot be in his national home in Ireland, it is an exile land just like the USA, Russian, Iraq or Egypt. Some of these places have made their Jews feel welcome as guests at various times, but a Jew is only truly in his home here, in Israel.
"In 1904, the good citizens of Limerick rioted against the Jews of that city in the Limerick "
and that proves what? in April of 1948 terrorists of the chosen people did not just riot but massacred Arab villagers in Deir Yassin so does that show that arabs can never be accepted in isreal? and as we speak the ethnic cleansing of arabs from their homes continues...your such a hypocrite...as are your countries policies....
It demonstrates that Jews were not viewed as fellow countrymen who just happened to have a different religion, but as a SEPARATE NATION--and that they were living in Exile. This was the Jewish condition in Russia, Poland, Germany, Morocco, Iraq, etc...and yes, IRELAND--a "liberal" country. Jews are foreign outside of Israel.Jews historically were not viewed as fellow Europeans, but as alien outsiders.Now we're home in our own country you Europeans still give us this shit?
@ShmorgelBorgel -"but as a SEPARATE NATION" why are you using capitals? remember just because you use capitals it does not make it true, now who said that to me not so along ago? as i said before (and which you did not comment on) when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation..........what other country does this?
I am using big letters because your brain is so small and I am hoping that it will help push in information. Jews are a separate and distinct national group, although in modern times we have contributed much as loyal citizens to the various countries where we have lived as exiles, whether in Ireland, the UK or the US. Thankfully, many Jews are like me and have turned our backs on life in Exile. I prefer to live amongst my own nation than as a foreigner in the US.
"when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation........."
Again, Mr Dunce, it's not "Tying nationality with religion". I am not a religious person, I don't believe in God and I don't observe Jewish religious ritual (I keep some Jewish customs that are national customs, but they are devoid of religious meaning to me). Yet, I am a complete Jew. Why? Because it is my nationality, and I live in the Jewish homeland where my ancestors lived and I speak the Jewish language.
@ShmorgelBorgel - "guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population."
Well that really contrasts starkly with the proposed "loyalty oath" whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state"..not an Isreali state bt a Jewish one......so much for you freedom to worship! the truth is that Isral is an extremely racist state which discriminates againest non-jews..and its getting more and more so each day///
"Well that really contrasts starkly with the proposed "loyalty oath"
whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state".."
We've been over this before, but yet again, you need things repeated to you. The oath is for NEW CITIZENS--to affirm the Jewish national and democratic character of our state if they wish to apply and receive citizenship. It does not interfere with anybody's freedom to practice their religion or even to practice no religion if they so choose.
Explain how asking someone from abroad who freely chooses to move here and then requests citizenship in Israel to affirm the Jewish national character of Israel violates such person's freedom of worship. If a Catholic Filipino living in Israel asks for Israeli citizenship and qualifies and makes that oath, has he violated Catholicism? Does this prevent him from going to church now? He is still a Catholic and still has freedom to practice his religion, no?
"he proposed "loyalty oath" whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state""
The oath applies to Jews and non-Jews, and it only applies to new citizens--not people who are born here. Thus an Israeli Arab Muslim or an Israeli Jew who is born here does not have to take the oath and neither do their children,they are citizens by birth. But people who voluntarily move here and voluntarily request citizenship should recognize the Jewish NATIONAL character of our state.
"when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation..........what other country does this?"
Why do you like to ask the same questions and make me repeat myself so much? We had this discussion already--there are states that tie nationality with religion you've never heard of Saudi Arabia, which bans non-Muslims from being citizens--very much unlike Israel which guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population.
"unlike Israel which guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population"
Yeah that’s why Muslims can’t get building permits in their own land and yet foreigners who just happen to follow Judaism have no problem with such matters…sounds like a very secular society to me…
"Yeah that’s why Muslims can’t get building permits in their own land "
Muslims can and do get building permits in Israel all the time. Go to any Muslim-majority town, especially in Northern Israel and you see constant building, construction cranes all over the place.
I'll repost the exchange I had with you 8 months ago:
"pdalaigh:
"i cant think of another country who base their identy on religon, can you?"
me:"Right off the top of my head, there is Saudi Arabia (which doesn't even allow non-Muslims to become citizens), then there are at least 4 states that even define themselves as "Islamic Republics" in their official names--Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Mauritania..."
As for non-Islamic states, there is Bhutan, where Buddhism is official and where religious rights of non-Buddhists (eg, Hindus, Muslims & Christians is severely infringed--everyone likes to paint Buddhism as super-tolerant, but it's not necessarily so), Nepal where Hinduism is established as the state religion and Buddhists are persecuted, plus let's not forget all the Western European democracies like the UK where Church of England is the official faith of the country."
Probably the only group in Israel that has its religious rights infringed to any degree are non-Orthodox Jews who are forced to have an Orthodox marriage (or leave the country to have the ceremony performed abroad). On the other hand, religious Jews also have their rights infringed by the government when they are restricted from worshiping at Jewish sites that are sacred to them for fear of angering Arabs.
"April of 1948... massacred Arab villagers in Deir Yassin "
And in 1929, the Jews of Hebron and Tsefat were massacred. Shortly after the massacre of 60 Jews in Hebron, the British evacuated the survivors--"for their own safety" --Arab ethnic cleansing that was finalized by the British that you admire so much--a community that had existed for centuries was wiped out overnight--and Jews could not live in Hebron again until after 1967, where they survive only with the protection of the IDF.
War is nasty, and Deir Yassin was a nasty battle. It's clear that innocent civilian Arabs died, and that's a shame. But there were other horrors in 1948. There was the Hadassah convoy massacre committed by Arabs against Jews. 80 Jewish medical personnel, relief workers were burnt alive in buses. There was the Kfar Etzyon massacre, where 50 Jewish defenders of that besieged village who had ALREADY SURRENDERED were machine-gunned to death. But that's ok with you, they were only Jews.
@ShmorgelBorgel - but you dont have to go back to Deir Yassin....just have a look at what you have done in Gaza last year..........it is clearly a policy of the IDF to carry out massacres, it frighthens the populations and keeps them in check, a clear policy of the IDF because they know that they can get away with anything....they have the good old u s of a to protect their actions....if hamas kills one or two jews theres international ontrage but not when the IDF do it............
"but you dont have to go back to Deir Yassin....just have a look at what you have done in Gaza last year."
Yes, we fought against the terror government of Hamas and let them know that it's not ok to shoot rockets at Israel and that there will be a price to pay for it. You obviously think it's all right for Hamas to shoot rockets at Israelis, but we disagree. We put up with it for several years--no more!
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Yes, we fought against the terror government of Hamas " again you are not listening to me, you have you have given up any right to comment on “terrorism”, remember your country was founded by terrorists and some of the most prominent members of your Keneset carried out and continue to carry out terrorist actions that make Hamas look like boy scouts….again you have no right to comment on "terrorism" as it was "terrorism" which allowed jews to colonise Palestine..so shhhhhhh
" it frighthens the populations and keeps them in check,"
If you mean discouraging them from supporting violent actions, such as firing rockets at our towns and civilians on a daily basis then that's a very good thing. Towns such as Sderot suffered near-constant rocket attacks for years and years from Gaza--the people of Sderot are glad that's being kept in check! (For now, at least.) This was made possible by last year's Gaza operation. Firing rockets at Sderot isn't a human right.
"If you mean discouraging them from supporting violent actions"
No thats not what i mean, the jewish state, from its very conception, has used terrorist tactics, violence, and fear to subdue and frighten the indigenous population.This tactic is used by all colonising armies, the germans used it to subdue europe, the brits used it to subdue Ireland and the Jews have used it and continue to use it inorder to colonise and cleanse Palestine.......
I repeat, firing rockets is not a human right. The Hamas regime has no right to fire even one rocket ever into Israel and if they do so, they must know it will be met with a deadly response from Israel. This will discourage the population from supporting violent actions--what you call "subduing" them. So, absolutely "subduing" them is a good thing--a very good thing--just as it was a good thing that the people of Germany became subdued by years and years of bombing in WW2 by the UK and USA.
And let's not forget the nearly 1,200 Israelis murdered in terror attacks perpetrated by Arab terrorists between the year 2000 and 2010--but I guess it's okay for Daley the Irishman, they deserved it, because some innocent Arabs died in Deir Yassin, and so what--they were only Jews, right?
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! good God it must be great being you................."
The Jewish author David Marcus, who was born in Ireland, wrote a book called "A Land Not Theirs". It described a Corkonian Jewish family during the Irish War of Independence--the "land not theirs" was Ireland...for the Jews, the only land that is theirs is Israel. Jews from Ireland are not Irish, they don't think of themselves as such and Irish don't accept them as such either.
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Jews from Ireland are not Irish, they don't think of themselves as such and Irish don't accept them as such either."
Well i hate to tell you that unlike your apartheid regime we, the Irish, do not require one of our citizens to be of a particular religion! so the jews of Ireland are indeed Irish, to base their nationality on their religon is very racist and is only required by states who are unsure of their own legitimacy, sounds like any place we know?
"unlike your apartheid regime we, the Irish, do not require one of our citizens to be of a particular religion!"
Mr Dunce, Israel doesn't require its citizens to be of one particular religion. 20% of the citizens of Israel are Muslim, Christian, Druze, Bahai or other. Many of these people are very patriotic Israeli citizens. Anybody of whatever religion (or no religion at all) can be an Israeli citizen. Many Israelis are like me, Jewish by nationality but secular and agnostic.
"to base their nationality on their religon is very racist and is only required by states who are unsure of their own legitimacy, sounds like any place we know?"
PREAMBLE
"Constitution of Ireland BUNREACHT NA hÉIREANN
In the Name of the Most Holy Trinity, from Whom is all authority and to Whom, as our final end, all actions both of men and States must be referred,
We, the people of Éire,
Humbly acknowledging all our obligations to our Divine Lord, Jesus Christ,"
Ireland has a constitution that starts out with all this Jesus shit, give me a break. We don't have any constitution in Israel like that, but our declaration of independence declares a state that will provide "complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex; it will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture; it will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions"
"RELIGION Article 45 (2) says: "The State recognises the special position of the Holy Catholic Apostolic and Roman Church as the guardian of the Faith professed by the great majority of the citizens."
You don't even know your own country's basic definition of itself as a Catholic country that gives a special favored status to one particular variety of Christianity. At any rate, being Jewish is not a matter of religious belief but of nationality.
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! "
Oliver Flanagan, former Irish Minister of Defense, elected to the Dail 14 times between 1943 and 1982 said this about the tiny Jewish population of Ireland back in 1943
"There is one thing that Germany did, and that was to rout the Jews out of their country. Until we rout the Jews out of this country it does not matter a hair's breadth what orders you make. "
He got twice the number of votes after that speech, the Irish loved it!
" He got twice the number of votes after that speech, the Irish loved it!"
So whats your point? does that give you the right to ethnicly cleanse villages? ignore the Geneva convention? ignore 100's of UN resolutions? Commit crimes againest humanity, maintain an apartheid state? you are again using the classic jewish tactic of not dealing with the facts put before you, but trying to divert the reader away from your illegal and immoral colonisation of a land not yours.
My point is that most Irish, like most people in Europe, have never accepted the Jews as fellow members of their nation--and Flanagan is a good illustration. You European hypocrites are sickening--for generations your societies--whether they were French, Polish, German, or even Irish--rejected the Jews living in your midst as aliens--and now that Jews from have regained independence in our own true country--you tell us you accept us as Europeans. Sod off.
"No they are not, its very simple if you are born in France you are French, "
Many Jews deluded themselves that they were Europeans and hoped the Europeans accepted them as fellow citizens, but we know better now. Your analogy between Catholicism and Italianness highlights your ignorance. Being a Jew, unike being Catholic, is not a matter of religion, but of NATIONALITY. This has always been the case and we have the right to determine our own destiny in our own land like any other nationality.
@ShmorgelBorgel - So your saying that Judaism is a nationality! Well I had better inform every reference book on the planet as they obviously have it wrong ! So is been called an isreali a nationality? Or have you turned that into a religion? You are trying so hard you have actually tied yourself up in knots! So let me get this right you’re a yank, an isreali and the new nationality of Judaism! Congratulations!
No, "Judaism" is a religion--but the Jews are a nationality and we always have been. This should be pretty simple even for a dolt like you. One need not believe or follow the religion of Judaism in order to be a Jew. I am an agnostic and barely practice Judaism, but I am a Jew by nationality, of course. Being an Israeli is NOT a nationality--but it is a citizenship. One can be an Israeli citizen without being part of the Jewish nationality.
No, "Judaism" is a religion--but the Jews are a nationality"
thats like saying Catholicism is a religon but the catholics are a nationality! yeah when you look at it from this view point is does sound ridiculous, and there is a reason for that ,it is because it is ridiculous!
"thats like saying Catholicism is a religon but the catholics are a nationality! "
Except Catholics, unlike Jews, do not constitute a nationality and never have. Someone who is baptized Catholic and is born into a Catholic family and later rejects Catholic belief and doctrine is no longer a Catholic. Someone who is born into a Jewish family and who does not practice nor believe in Judaism (the religion) remains a Jew by nationality. This has always been the case.
"Someone who is born into a Jewish family and who does not practice nor believe in Judaism (the religion) remains a Jew by nationality."
My God i think that must be one of the most arrogent statements i have ever heard.......when you are equating religon with nationality (as you have done) it is possably the most dangerous combinations that can exist..and you of all people should know this...its very close to those "Ayran" ideas of a certain german........scary!
"its very close to those "Ayran" ideas of a certain german........scary!"
Hitler was Austrian, not German. However, the Nazi ideology said the Jews were a "race". "Race" is not the same as "nationality." Nevertheless, Hitler was not placated (you see, I am using the word "placated" correctly) if he learned that a Jew had abandoned Judaism, because he knew that being Jews belonged to a different nationality--and so they did, although he crudely called it "race".
"..when you are equating religon with nationality (as you have done) it is possably the most dangerous combinations that can exist."
Ridiculous, because I am not equating religion with nationality. My "religion" is "none, " (I am not a religious person). My "nationality" is Jewish. My ancestors were Jewish, my language is Hebrew and I live in Israel, the Jewish state. I am a Jew by nationality.
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Ridiculous, because I am not equating religion with nationality"
Yes you have, you do not even know what you have been saying, you have stated that any jew has the right to live in isreal......therefore you have tied up nationalty and religious beleif ...now you are trying to retract what you have been stating all along...you really want to get your story correct before yo start rambling on....
""you do not even know what you have been saying, you have stated that any jew has the right to live in isreal......therefore you have tied up nationalty and religious beleif"
Nope. Many Jews (such as yours truly) have no religious belief. I'm skeptical that God exists , I certainly don't believe in the divinity of the Torah, I don't keep Sabbath--I don't believe in Judaism or follow most of its rules, but I am a Jew. It's my nationality. Understand? (No, probably not, you're stupid.)
Rachel Corrie is a hero. Stood for people far away and gave her life. Palestinians are people with hope and hearts. When their child died they feel pain.People like Rachel went 5000 miles to be a human shield. I'm a old Soldiers. Her story came to me from a Poet in the middle east. They called her the beautiful American who gave all. Thank you.
coyotestory 5 months ago
Americans killed Israelis:
Rachel Corrie
Americans killed by Palestinians:
John Branchizio (36) Mark T. Parson (31) John Martin Linde Jr. (30) Marla Bennett (24) David Gritz (24) Benjamin Blutstein (25) Janis Ruth Coulter (36) Avraham Boaz (71) Shoshana Greenbaum (31) Kobi Mandell (14) and dozens more (don't forget Robert Kennedy)
Why should I as an American feel any sympathy or support for the Palestinians?
CrocodilusPontifex 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Great new vid on Youtube titled "The Last Days of the Big Lie" youtube.com/watch?v=-48HQpgQRz0
Dr. David Duke's latest vid- “The Real Rogue Nuclear State” great also: youtube.com/watch?v=KLSlmLx4Fls
FDR vs. Hitler. Both took power/office 1933 their countries unemployed 25-30%. 6-8 years later Germany rate 2% USA still 20%. Who was better leader? How? Hitler threw off International Bankers. They still hate & vilify him to this day like he had no qualities
2ndSamuel710 11 months ago
Israelis have secret meetings where we tell our children not jump in front of moving bulldozers.
rachelgolem 11 months ago
@rachelgolem ! I think you are forgetting, Israelis tell their children in those meetings that they should grow up to become IDF dogs and run over people who are fighting for a just cause.
TheMechengr 10 months ago
@rachelgolem.. At the same meeting where you are told it is okay to run over people with bulldozers?
Uncle99B 8 months ago
Intel to invest $2.7 billion on Israel plant
January 19, 2011
JERUSALEM (JTA) -- The U.S. chip-maker Intel Corp. will invest $2.7 billion to upgrade its plant in southern Israel.
Intel also will be hiring 1,000 new workers for the new production line. It will be the second plant in the world to manufacture the new chips.
The company already employs more than 7,000 people in Israel, according to reports.
rachelgolem 1 year ago
the debate is cool here folks BUT - bulldozing homes, seriously that is like out of some 19th century aristocratic attack on real humans. Such a thing should never be tolerated by a civilized people anywhere!
roijax801 1 year ago 4
HIPPIE DREAMER........GET A NORMAL JOB.
BENREDARES 1 year ago
I'd Rather Be Dancing-6/3/10 at Collateral Repair Project
youtube.com/watch?v=MaYbt5KUy-0
ToddBoyle 1 year ago
rachel corrie was totally awesome. a courageous hero... R.I.P. angel.
sherhak 1 year ago
is communism still fashionable in the usa?
koertje 1 year ago
Israel is evil... I boycott Israel...
237Michael 1 year ago
a great song
Sakamachi25 1 year ago
Thank you so much Jim. Let the world never forget Rachel Corrie!!!
larbeckful 1 year ago
That was beautiful. It touched my heart and inspired me. Rachel gave your life to try to stop a bully committing wrong. We need more like you with your great courage and honesty. Your sacrifice was not wasted. RIP.
coolhandjackman 1 year ago
The moral of the story is, never try to stop a bulldozer with your face.
rachelgolem 1 year ago
@rachelgolem
The moral of the story is to be the change you want to see in the world. Or perhaps it's that sometimes a lame attempt at being clever just shows one for the fool they are.
onitram1 1 year ago
@rachelgolem - maybe using the same train of taught, jews should be very carefll about who they accept showers from! not very nice when it is coming the other way.....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
@pdalaigh
This comment shows what a sick hateful person you are. The Jews sent to the camps had no choice but to be herded into the "showers" . Idiot Corrie willingly traveled to a far land and into the midst of a conflict zone, where she did everything she could to help terrorists smuggle weapons aimed at civilians. She then stupidly put herself in a dangerous position by playing hide-and-seek where the bulldozer driver could not see her and got herself killed. Stupid idiot girl.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
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For a thousand years Jews were forced to put up with racist pigs like Rachel Corrie. We put up with ethnic cleansing, mass murder occupation and humiliation. Jews fight back now! Better get used to it! Being bulldozed to death is a fitting end to this young Nazi who would deny Jews their basic human rights! I can only cry when thinking about all the Jewish children murdered by the people she wanted to help. What in the world did those children do to her
Jasob767 1 year ago 3
"the best you can do is call Rachel Corrie names??" Moreover, "Rachel" is a name that all Jews honor, Rachel was considered a matriarch of the Jewish people. Ironically, Arab advocates of ethnic cleansing seek to prevent Jews from visiting Rachel's Tomb on the outskirts of Jerusalem and Bethlehem, a site that has been the focus of Jewish pilgrimages for centuries. (One of my ancestors was a caretaker there 200 years ago.) I don't think the Corrie Idiot was fit to be called "Rachel".
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"I don't think the Corrie Idiot was fit to be called "Rachel".
ShmorgelBorgel 12 hours ago"
Your an evil little yank with no morals..don't need to say much more here, anyone reading your comments will come to the same conclusion as i.(what does get me though is how you can be so callous with regard to the murder of a fellow american by a forgein army?)
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"does get me though is how you can be so callous with regard to the murder of a fellow american by a forgein army?"
I sympathize with her parents, whose daughter committed suicide. Normally, I have sympathy for suicide victims, they go through terrible mental anguish, but when learns about the character of the Corrie Idiot,one sees that her voluntarily ending her own life was no loss to the world. She died to protect smuggling tunnels aimed at bringing in weapons to harm me and other Israelis
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"the best you can do is call Rachel Corrie names???"
Like I said, I am being very charitable to the Corrie Idiot's memory. I could call the stupid little girl who committed suicide by playing hide-and-seek in front of a heavy machine whose operator couldn't see her many worse things.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"your the PROBLEM! "
That's the evidence of your sick thinking right there. Jews living in their own small country is "a problem". You advocate the ethnic cleansing of Jews from Israel and their dispersal around the world. That happened once, but it won't happen again.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - Yep you’re the problem, and people like you, immigrants, colonists, ethnic cleansers, hypocrites, terrorists and criminals, yep people like you are the problem in Palestine. If immigrants like you stayed in their own country then those defenceless indigenous people could live without fear of their homes being demolished.yes you are the problem. By the way it is not your "small country" it is someone elses "small country" and so says the rest of the world......
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"By the way it is not your "small country" it is someone elses "small country" and so says the rest of the world"
First off, I have faith in much of humanity, not all are disgusting hate-filled specimens like you who openly advocate ethnic cleansing and the scattering of Israel's Jewish inhabitants all over. Much of the world does recognize the inherent right of the Jewish people to independence in its homeland, something we had once and finally regained 62 years ago.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - checked it again shorgell... Jerusalem is a occupied city under international law.....you lose so shhhhhhhh, and anyway your a yank so your capital is where............?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
", and anyway your a yank so your capital is where............? "
I'm an Israeli who also happens to hold a US passport. My capital is Jerusalem, because it is where the Kneseet meets. I vote in Israeli elections, not US elections--I'm Israeli. Although the USA is a nice country that I have nothing against, it is not home for me. My US passport is simply a useful document that enables me to travel to America without waiting on line for a visa if I wish to visit my my daughter who lives there.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - Your a yank, you have an american passport..its not hard to work out, most people would find this one easy.....as you yourself said regarding an american who had a Palestinian passport "He can't be both", you have made a fool of yourself with your own words........enough said.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
""as you yourself said regarding an american who had a Palestinian passport "He can't be both", When did I ever make such a statement? Nobody can be both a Palestinian and American citizen because no such state called "Palestine" exists (or ever existed) for anybody to be a citizen of. However, if and when a Palestinian state ever emerges, then certainly a Palestinian-American should be able to claim dual citizenship, if the Palestinian state permits it. (The US permits dual citizenship.)
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"Europe have passports from more than one country"
btu you not so long ago staed that an american who held a palestinian passport was not entitled to it? So why change your view when it comes to an american holding an israeli passport? You are such a hypocrite, you change yor view when it does not sit your own purpose...rather like your state..and if you are so commited to been an israeli why dont you apply for one?you would have no problem taking the racist oath.....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"btu you not so long ago staed that an american who held a palestinian passport was not entitled to it"
Nope, I never wrote any such thing. When and if a State of Palestine ever gets established for the first time in history, why should I care if a citizen of the not-yet-existing "State of Palestine" also carries a US passport?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"and if you are so commited to been an israeli why dont you apply for one?"
If you mean apply for an Israeli passport, I've had one since birth. Although all Jews are entitled to Israeli citizenship, I've never needed to apply, since I was Israeli from birth through my father, who obtained Israeli citizenship in the 1950s (his Mum was born here in 1907). I lived here from age of 4-12 and have Israeli ID from the 1970s, and I live here again now. What's the big deal?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
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ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"you would have no problem taking the racist oath....."
I would indeed have a problem taking a racist oath. A racist oath would require that I swear that I belong to a superior race, which is something I don't believe in. (Although I am sure I am quite clearly superior to you, but that's a different matter.) If I didn't already have Israeli citizenship from birth, however, I would have no problem swearing loyalty to Israel as a Jewish and democratic state if I wanted to become a citizen here.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"its not hard to work out, most people would find this one easy...."
Yes, most people ESPECIALLY people throughout Europe, INCLUDING Ireland and the UK, where you claim to to live, would find the concept of dual citizenship VERY EASY--because so many people in Europe have passports from more than one country. I know people who are citizens of both the UK and Ireland, the US and Ireland, the UK and Australia, etc...all these people have more than one passport---how can they be both?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - can't beleive you accuse me of supporting ethnic cleansing! its like hitler accusing stalin of engaging in a little murder!!!! i am not even going to grant you the respect of discussing it with you..what a fool.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"can't beleive you accuse me of supporting ethnic cleansing! i"
Do you have Alzheimer' s Disease? Have you not the courage to stand by your very own words? You have repeatedly and frequently advocated that the Jews leave the land that you Europeans named "Palestine". Your own words damn you as someone who supports the ethnic cleansing of the Jewish inhabitants of Israel and have nothing bad to say about the Arabs who ethnically cleansed Jews from areas of this country in 1948.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - Sorry you have not answered my question, where have I agreed with ethnic cleansing?Jews are, as we speak carrying out ethnic cleansing in the West Bank, and “gerrymandering” a “state”, illegal under international law by moving immigrants, such as yourself into areas formally populated by arabs……that’s ethnic cleansing….requesting them to go back to new york or wherever is just requesting a wrong too be righted…grow up and face up to what you have done.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"you have not answered my question, where have I agreed with ethnic cleansing?"
You not only "agree" with ethnic cleansing, you openly advocate it. This evening Jews commemorate the destruction of the Temple by the Romans and the Babylonians that occurred on the 9th of Av--an ethnic cleansing that was committed against the Jews of Jerusalem millennia ago. In 1948, Arabs ethnically cleansed Jerusalem of its Jewish population, we reversed that in 1967 but you advocate another ethnic cleansing.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"you advocate another ethnic cleansing."
no i advocate you abiding by the laws of an Institution, the UN, whos resolution granting you the right to steal arab land you so whole heartedly accepted and yet when you steal more land and are told by the same instittion to cease this illegal and immoral behaviour you ignore it,i am advocating you not pniching those palestinians for the crimes of those a "millenna ago",i am adocating a humane approach to the treatment human of beings
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"have to work now (but i am glad that you have accepted the UN should not be
allowed to decide on moral issues"
As I said, the UN in 1947 was composed in large part by the victorious allies over Nazism. Back then it had more moral authority, which has deteriorated significantly since that time as it has welcomed in all kinds of sick regimes into its ranks.
"..so when are yo giving back the land you stole???)""
You can't "give back" what has always belonged to you.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Back then they had more moral authority", you sad little yank.......not much to say to that it just shows you what a hypocrite you are.....time to give back what yo stole..as i said i agree with what you have said the UN have no moral right to steel someone elses land ....so give it back and go back home to the U S of A...its where you belong.....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
".so give it back and go back home to the U S of A...its where you belong..... "
I can walk to the Mount of Olives Cemetery here in Jerusalem and find family tombstones from the past several hundred years (not all of them were used to pave streets by the Jordanians when they occupied our city). Like all Jews, my roots are here. Why do you think I have so much right to squat on land in America that was stolen from the indigenous Indians by European colonialists like you?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel "i'm a happy israeli jew"
You’re an american colonist who has arrogantly decided that he has the right to live on someone else’s land, but can’t admit it because to do so would mean the end of the fairy story you keep telling yourself in order to placate the crimes you , go home and if all the other thousands of immigrants did the same then those people who have been ethnically cleansed of their land since the foundation of israel could come home and the problem would be solved.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"the foundation of israel could come home and the problem would be solved. "
That's just it. Jewhaters like you view the fact that Jews have freedom in their land as a "problem". Truthfully, you care nothing about the so-called "Palestinian people." I have more in common with Arabs culturally than you do and have more concern for them than you. I actually want the local Arabs who have adopted the name Palestinian to gain what they are entitled to, self-determination in a small state next to mine
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"then those people who have been ethnically cleansed of their land"
You don't give a fig about ethnic cleansing. I've shown you many examples of Arab ethnic cleansing of Jews (including members of my own family) and you just ignore it. You make demands for further ethnic cleansing of Jews from their Israel, to "solve the problem" of the Jews living in their land. Disgusting specimens like you don't want the local Arabs to get a chance at independence in their own state through compromise.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - but shorgel you have an american passport....you cant be both, i find it rather sick that you would use the ethnic cleansing of the indigenious people of america in order to plicate the jewish ethnic cleansing of Palestine. kep insisting As i keep saying why do you keep insisting on using other countries atrocities to somehow excse your own atrocities, from a moral point of view it is pointless argument, rather like the nazis using the trks as their reason to murder jews....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
""but shorgel you have an american passport....you cant be both,"
Umm, sure you can have both citizenships. Look, I am looking right now at my US passport and I am looking at my Israeli passport. I have both. What's the big deal? You live in Europe, don't you? All over Europe, there are people who hold two or more citizenships. I know people who have both Irish and UK passports, and people who have US and Irish passports.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
I actually knew someone from the US who was American -born, and had just one Irish-born grandfather who went to the Irish embassy and got himself an Irish passport, making him a US-Irish citizen.So people have dual citizenships all over the world, but Jewhaters think it is outrageous that some Israelis like me hold a US passport. In my case, like I said, my roots here go back much further than my US roots, my grandmother was born here and I have more family here than in the US.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"i find it rather sick that you would use the ethnic cleansing of the indigenious people of america in order to plicate the jewish ethnic cleansing of Palestine."
You STILL haven't learned the correct usage of the word "placate"? Really, don't they speak English in Ireland? You know, you are not paying me, but since it's in part of my generous Jewish nature, I will give you more tuition-free vocabulary lessons: "pla·cate
to appease or pacify, esp. by concessions or conciliatory gestures"
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"i keep saying why do you keep insisting on using other countries atrocities to somehow excse your own atrocities,
I recognize that for a Jewhater like you the existence of Jews having freedom in their own land represents an "atrocity" but we don't see it that way. We are very happy here in our own country. You suggested to me that I return "home" to America, a country where my family only briefly lived and that was stolen from its natives, unlike Israel, which RETURNED to its people, the Jews.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"rather like the nazis using the trks as their reason to murder jews.... "
The Nazis didn't use the Turks as their reason to murder Jews. Unlike the Nazis who very nearly succeeded in exterminating the world Jewish population Zionism is responsible for the creation of the idea that there is something called a "Palestinian People". No such concept ever existed before Israel. They owe us, big time for their invention.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - Well you have finally done it, now "democratic" israel is to introduce a LAW by which every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state, now you tell me israel is not a racist entity!!!! all your comments now seem mute dont they?any state that links its right of citizenship with a particular fate is racist by definition.Dont you feel shame at your countries racist policies? or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"israel is to introduce a LAW by which every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state,"
The proposed law is aimed at immigrants who wish to obtain Israeli citizenship. It's not racist to ask of people who move to our country that they recognize the Jewish national culture here, just as it is not "racist" if a Polish person or Nigerian moves to Ireland and applies for Irish citizenship, to ask of them that they be loyal to Ireland as an Irish state.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"any state that links its right of citizenship with a particular fate is racist by definition."
A "fate"? Like, a destiny? You're not even making any sense.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
""racist by definition....Dont you feel shame at your countries racist policies? or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else? "
I gave a very good textbook definition of what the words "racist" and "racism" mean, that biology confers on various population groups in the human species distinct genetic advantages and disadvantages which separate them into sub-groups called "races". What does asking immigrants to respect the national Jewish culture in Israel have to do with "race"?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel "What does asking immigrants to respect the national Jewish culture in Israel have to do with "race"? "
let me explain, becase you dont seem to get it, (or maybe you do but are ashamed to admit it, which i can totally understand, shame is a powerfull thing), yo are asking people to pledge allegiance to a fate before they can become citizens!!! so what yo are saying is if you are not jewish you are not good enough, thats racist, do you understand now?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"yo are asking people to pledge allegiance to a fate"
LOL, I'm reviewing some of your comments--you really ARE stupid. You think "faith" is spelled "fate" because you don't pronounce the "th" in your ridiculous accent! Now, typos are one thing, and you can't help your spoken Irish accent, but man, you're fuc*ing ignorant! I didn't even get it at first--because I thought you were using the word "fate" like the word, "destiny"! But you're trying to spell "faith"--Damn what an ignoramus you are!
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
" if a Polish person or Nigerian moves to Ireland and applies for Irish citizenship, to ask of them that they be loyal to Ireland as an Irish state"
No we dont, you are just making things up now, there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon so that he may become a citizen! israel is now a very dangerous state, its making a particular religon a compulsory requirement for becoming a citizen.....scary, very scary
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"you are just making things up now, there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon "
Wow, you're so fucking stupid. Nobody is asking any potential immigrant to "swear loyalty" to the religion of Judaism, we don't want non-Jews to convert to our religion. But people who come here to live, whether Jews or non-Jews, and who wish to become citizens of our country should recognize the Jewish national culture of our country, and be loyal citizens.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"israel is now a very dangerous state, its making a particular religon a compulsory requirement for becoming a citizen"
No Mr Stupid-Israel is not like Saudi Arabia, which BY LAW does not allow any non-Muslims to have Saudi citizenship. Jews, unlike Christians and Muslims do not believe in imposing our religion on others. 20% of Israeli citizens are non-Jews and we have no wish to make them Jews.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"there is no law in Ireland which asks a perspective citizen to swear an oath to a particular religon so that he may become a citizen!"
Get this straight. Being loyal to Israel as a "Jewish state" is not the same as being loyal to the Jewish religion. It is the same as asking that an immigrant be loyal to Ireland as an IRISH state (not a Catholic state) or Greece as a Greek state (not a Greek Orthodox state). "Jewish" refers to the NATIONAL CULTURE of Israel, not only the religion.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"or is it ok for jews to be racist but not anyone else? "
It's not ok for anyone to be racist, but every nation has racists among them. In fact, holding up examples of when individual Jews express racist sentiments and blaming the Jewish nation as a whole for that is itself racist. Many in Hungary and Slovakia are racist towards the Gypsy minority, yet I don't blame all Slovakians as racist. Nevertheless, you have not shown anything racist in the proposed law.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel The big difference between the countries you have mentioned and Israel is that Israeli racism is institionalised, like SA, the government,which is democratically elected has passed laws which are systematically biased against non-jews there pure audacity beggars belief,not only now do non-jews have their house and farms demolished to make way for immigrant jews (such as yourself) but now they cant become israeli citizens without being jewish!!! this is not "individual jews"
pdalaigh 1 year ago
The big difference between Israel and those other countries that I mentioned is that the non-Jewish minority in Israel actually enjoys rights. Arabs sit on the Israeli Supreme Court, where they interpret laws that affect all Israelis, they serve as ministers in cabinet that decide government policy for all Israelis, they serve as generals in the army defending all Israelis.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"immigrant jews (such as yourself) "
Again, Jews such as myself are much more alien to the USA, where my family only lived briefly,than to Israel. In my case, my grandmother was born here, she came from a Jerusalem family that has been here longer than 90% of the Arabs who recently adopted the name "Palestinian". Like I said, I take a short walk to the Mt of Olives Cemetery and find tombstones of people related to me from the past 500 years. I can only find one ancestor's grave in the USA.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"but now they cant become israeli citizens without being jewish!"
Would you rather I call you an idiot or a liar? I'll be generous in my assessment of your character, as I always prefer to find good in people, and rather than call you a malicious pathological liar, merely state that you are definitely of defective intelligence. You would have to be a total cretin to come to the conclusion that requiring immigrants to swear loyalty to Israel as a Jewish state would force them to become Jews.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"hich every israeli must take an Oath of loyality to a "JEWISH and democratic" state"
The proposed law applies to non-Israelis who apply for Israeli citizenship, whether they be Jewish immigrants from the UK, Egyptian Arabs who marry Israeli Arabs, Thai workers, or refugees from Arab genocide in Sudan who found protection here. If non-citizens wish to obtain an Israeli passport, they should recognize the national culture here, which is Jewish and democratic. Nobody forces them to come here.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel So let me get this right, you have constantly said that israel is not a racist state, is not an apartheid state, my God how you have gone on about it, and yet you agree with a LAW which is so racist that it turns Israel into exactly the same as SA apartheid regime, except the state of israel has supplemented religion for skin colour.Put this together with the ethnic cleansing, the house demolitions, the daily murders of Palestinians and you have nazis germany..well done..
pdalaigh 1 year ago
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" you have constantly said that israel is not a racist state, "
Again, you'll keep on saying the same idiotic thing, and I'll keep repeating the same truth. To be racist means one believes there are essential inherent biological differences between different human population groups that are called "races" and to advocate discrimination on that basis. Israeli society is multiracial in nature, therefore not "racist".
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"not an apartheid state,"
Exactly so. In Apartheid South Africa, the white MINORITY prevented the black MAJORITY from voting or holding any power. In Israel, the Arab MINORITY does indeed vote and members of hold positions of high political and economic power within Israeli society.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"the Arab MINORITY "
The only reason they are a minority is because the jews ethnicly cleansed them from their land (and continues to do so), and replaced them with more jews, the brits done exactly the same here in Ireland, its classic colonists activity...tell yo what let all the people who wer ethnicly cleansed by the jews return, then lets see who the majority are??? well how about it..nope did nto think so..
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"tell yo what let all the people who wer ethnicly cleansed by the jews return, then lets see who the majority are???"
Like I said, a large proportion of the "Palestinian" Arabs are descended from immigrants to this country, they started a war that they lost, and in most wars, the side that loses leaves. (It happened just last year with ethnic Georgians in South Ossetia, all of the Georgians were kicked out after Georgia lost the war.)
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
How come you STILL have no comment about the ethnic cleansing of East Jerusalem's Jewish inhabitants (many of whom had roots there for centuries, like my father's uncles and cousins) by Jordanian Arab forces when they took over the eastern half of the city in 1948? Why do you think that was okay? I am very interested in hearing your justification for this. What about the million Jews who were kicked out of various Arab countries and had their assets stolen? Why no comment?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - Challenge you to show me where I have ever stated that, but what is interesting and constant in your comments is the only defence you have against your current bout of ethnic cleansing is to use other despots and dictators actions to legitimize yours..if you consider your state to be as inhumane and barbaric as that well theres not much I can say.. the fact is the ongoing ethnic cleansing of the West Bank is happening as we speak..and you see nothing wrong with that.......
pdalaigh 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - insult me as much as you want, does not bother me in the least but an oath which requires citizens to be, and i quote, "jewish and democratic" means exactly what it states, if it didn't require a perspective citizen to be "jewish" then it wouldn't have stated it so clearly. i am not confused in the least, unfortunately you appear to be in a state of denial about what is clearly been required of a new "citizen" of israel.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"insult me as much as you want, "
I'm not insulting you when I call you stupid, I'm DESCRIBING you. There's a difference.
"an oath which requires citizens to be, and i quote, "jewish and democratic"
Again, Mr Stupid, there is no such oath requiring that citizens of Israel must be Jewish. However, there is a proposed law that would require that new citizens of the country, Jewish and non-Jewish, agree to recognize that our country is Jewish and democratic.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"you agree with a LAW which is so racist " I don't agree with any racist law. A racist law would say that some people should have less rights than others based on their genes. I agree with a law that says immigrants to this country--people who CHOOSE to live here and freely decide that they wish to become citizens (remember--nobody forces them to move here and nobody forces them to apply for citizenship) should be loyal to the Jewish national character of our country.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel "A racist law would say that some people should have less rights than others based on their genes"
Well, tell you what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home inorder to make room for an immigrant jew and then tell me your state does not make decisions on the basis of genetic heritage.....your playing with words..israel is a racist stae..demolision of Palestinian homes is very tangible demonstration of racism..
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"Well, tell you what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home inorder"
The Jewish state doesn't "demolish" so-called "Palestinian homes" in order to make way for "immigrant Jews". However, the municipality of Jerusalem and the Israeli government does have the right to enforce building codes and dismantle structures that are erected without the correct permits, whether they are built illegally by Arab or Jewish residents of our city.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
I"f a Jewish homeowner in WEST Jerusalem (or Tel Aviv or any other Israeli city) illegally"
i hate it when you act in such a childish and immatre manner and treat me like an idiot.Firstly Jersalem is an occupied city and therefore jews have no legal right to issue or not issue permits.It is impossable for the native population to get permits from the isrealis, but rather simple for jewish immigrants to build jewish homes on occupied land, its apartheid in action, & you know it
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"Firstly Jersalem is an occupied city and therefore jews have no legal right to issue or not issue permits"
Jerusalem is the capital of Israel. It has had a clear Jewish majority since at least the 1840s (the year of the first Ottoman census). For it to be "occupied", then there has to be a country that was the legal sovereign there before Israel. The British controlled it before Israel took West Jerusalem and the Jordanians took East Jerusalem. I'm surprised you are so pro-British.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
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"It is impossable for the native population to get permits from the isrealis,"
Most Israelis are indeed native in the country, and even those born outside almost all trace ancestry to here. Many of the Arabs are relative newcomers. Nevertheless, most Arab residents of the capital of Israel (JERUSALEM) do indeed succeed in obtaining building permits. Abu Tor, an Arab neighborhood in West Jerusalem, which has been part of Israel since 1948 is one of the most prosperous areas in Israel.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"what go to the West Bank or East Jerusalem and watch as the jewish staet demolish a Palestinian home"
If a Jewish homeowner in WEST Jerusalem (or Tel Aviv or any other Israeli city) illegally and improperly builds a structure without the correct permits, he also runs the risk of having it destroyed by the government. That's because, like all normal countries, we have a society based on law and compliance with procedure--people have to file architectural plans with the building department, etc.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"your playing with words..israel is a racist stae. "
No, I'm using words correctly. Words have meaning. AGAIN, racism refers to a belief that various human population groups are superior or inferior on the basis of genetics.
"demolision of Palestinian homes is very tangible demonstration of racism"
Demolishing an ILLEGAL structure erected without the proper building permits is a tangible demonstration of enforcing the LAW. Houses built by Jews without the correct permits also get demolished.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel "tangible demonstration of enforcing the LAW"
You have no force of "LAW" in Jerusalem, under international law it is an occupied city (just explained that one above), oh heres another one, "Resolution 298: deplores Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem" and how about this one "Resolution 476: reiterates that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are null and void. " So putting it simply israel is a theif and theives do not get to make laws about that they have stolen.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"his together with the ethnic cleansing, "
I'm still waiting for your comment on the Arab ethnic cleansing of Jews. Not just the million Jews who were ethnically cleansed by Arabs from Iraq, Egypt, Yemen, Syria, Libya, Algeria--but the ethnic cleansing of Jews in 1948 by the Arabs who later adopted the name "Palestinian"--people like my own relatives who were ethnically cleansed BY ARABS from Jerusalem. You think ethnic cleansing is good when Arabs do it to Jews and you want more.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"daily murders of Palestinians "
Israeli Jews are such amateurs at killing Arabs...nobody is better at killing Arabs than Arabs. In 62 years of conflict, a grand total of approximately 50,000 people, roughly 20,000 Jews and 30,000 Arabs, have been killed. This total includes combatants and civilians on both sides. Hafez Assad killed more people in one month. So "daily murders" my ass. However, between 2000-2005 over 1000 Israelis were murdered in suicide bomb attacks. We won't return to that!
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"Israeli Jews are such amateurs at killing Arabs..."
There you go AGAIN, not dealing with the facts as i put them to you, using other countries atrocities in order to side step your own atrocities.......i mean your state is now hiring american mercenaries in order to carry to your illegal activities..only despot contries stoop to these tactics......what next concentration camps? oops sorry forgot about Gaza........
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"i mean your state is now hiring american mercenaries"
Where do you get this lunatic version of reality from? The Israeli army is composed of Israeli citizens and legal residents.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"The Israeli army is composed of Israeli citizens and legal residents."
Well I thought you were up to date on all the latest, obviously I have put to much faith in you, but don’t worry I shall educate you regarding this act which is usually associated with “Banana Republics”. Jay Schultz, the executive director of Aish Malach, has set up a new Israeli body to help foreigners enlist in the IDF” (The Independent) Saturday, 19 June 2010. So now israel is hiring merceniries..
pdalaigh 1 year ago
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"Aish Malach, has set up a new Israeli body to help foreigners enlist in the IDF” (The Independent) Saturday, 19 June 2010. So now israel is hiring merceniries.."
By definition, a Jew who returns to his homeland, Israel, is not foreign, he belongs here, and if he is not a foreigner, then he can't be a mercenary. Mercenaries by definition are foreigners who enlist for monetary or other gain--like the non-French who enlist in the French Foreign Legion-that's an example of a mercenary army.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
Machal stands for "Mitnadvei Chutz Laaretz" which literally means "Volunteers from out of the land" in Hebrew. Note, "out of the land" doesn't mean "foreign", the word for "foreign" in Hebrew is "zar", meaning "strange." There is nothing strange about a Jew coming home from a land of exile and volunteering for his country, Israel. It's the most natural thing! We are not like France, with its mercenary army (French Foreign Legion), but our army welcomes back the sons and daughters of Israel.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"There is nothing strange about a Jew coming home from a land of exile"
Lets take it real slow so that you will understand, it does not matter one bit what the organisation that is recruiting mercenaries for the idf is called they are mercenaries, foreigners taking money to fight another countries battles.Your feeble attempt to class them as “exiles” is what you call “Grasping at straws”, they are americans taking money from the Iisraelis to murder Palistinians.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
@pdalaigh
", foreigners taking money to fight another countries battles."
Again, let's explain slowly for you. Jews who come to Israel--whether they come from from America, France or Britain, and who do their national service by defending the Jewish homeland, in the IDF, by definition are neither foreign nor mercenary. If they serve in the IDF they are serving in their own own country's army. If I had served in the US army rather than the IDF,I would be far more mercenary.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel -
"If they serve in the IDF they are serving in their own own country's army."
No they are not, its very simple if you are born in France you are French, whether that person is jewish, protestant, catholic or hindu, being jewish does not give you the rght to ethnicly cleanse a land and claim it because of some fairy tale concocted to sponge your guilt! it would be like me staking a claim to Italy because i was born a catholic! How juvenile and childish is that!
pdalaigh 1 year ago
@pdalaigh
"not accept a drunk Irish non-Jew like you"
now, now, does that sound just little bit sterotypical to you? even a bit racist? It kind of shoots your previous statements regarding you not being racist out of the water. To tell you the truth i am rather hurt by your sterotypical view of the Irish, i am so hurt that i think i shall have to have a drink......get it?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"now, now, does that sound just little bit sterotypical to you? even a bit racist?"
Nothing at all racist about me suggesting that you are a drunk--it's well known that Irish love their Guiness--and in fact, it's rather charitable of me to say you're a drunk. If you're not a drunk, then I guess your incoherent thoughts and stupid comments are due to your natural low intelligence and can't be blamed on alcohol!
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"Nothing at all racist"
ohh we are after upsetting someone, anyone who has to resort to juvenile stereotypes has indeed been beaten in the argument, I accept your capitulation to my far more reasoned comments. (think i will have a pint to celebrate)
pdalaigh 1 year ago
No, nothing wrong with admitting you're a heavy drinker and nothing racist in my observation that it's likely the case--either that or you're just naturally stupid. My point was that the IDF, in accepting Jews from abroad into its ranks, is not doing anything mercenary by welcoming the children of Exile lands home. If the IDF was a mercenary army, they would accept drunk Irish non-Jews like you into their ranks just to increase manpower, this is not the case.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
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@ShmorgelBorgel -
"the children of Exile lands "
Sorry bud, but to be exiled from a land there first has to be a land to be exiled from and as has been pointed out by many historians ISREAL NEVER EXISTED prior to the terrorism of 1948. and by the way "the children of exile lands" ,its a bit hollywood dont you think?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
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"the children of exile lands" ,its a bit hollywood dont you think?"
Jews have been using the term "Exile" ("Galut" or "Gola" in Hebrew) to refer to Jews living Eretz Yisrael for 2,000 years before Hollywood existed. It's a traditional Jewish term.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "If the IDF was a mercenary army"
The IDF is a mercenary organisation, it was bourn out of terrorist groups such as the Igrun and the Lehi Zionists (remember them?) and takes any nationality, it is now actively recruiting yanks.......thats a mercenary and they are joining a terrorist organisation who are very good at murdering people.........as for your comment about the "drunk Irish" well it just shows your childish sterotypical racist character... i am so upset about that..
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"ohh we are after upsetting someone"
It's not my intent to upset you. I am only saying that you're stupid because it's obvious. I am only 163 cm-- I don't take offense if someone makes the observation that I'm short. What's true is true. I am short ! And you are stupid. I know I'm not the first person whose told you this, I'm quite sure it's something you've heard from your Mum, teachers, significant others, friends, etc. for most of your life.
What's the problem?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"It's not my intent to upset you"
Your not upseting me in the least, your misinformed regarding the facts, and thats ok, not everybody can be informed to the same degree...but i will stick with you until yo see the light......
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"Your not upseting me in the leas"
Good, it's not my intent to upset you. When someone remarks upon the fact that I short because I am only 1.63 meters, he is only stating fact, and I am not upset. When I comment about your stupidity, I am only stating fact, and you should not be upset. You are stupid.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"being jewish does not give you the rght to ethnicly cleanse"
You're right it does not--that's why there are so many Arab citizens of Israel who enjoy democratic rights here. We did, however, PREVENT the total ethnic cleansing of Israel of its Jewish inhabitants. In 1948, Arabs promised to throw us into the sea and we stopped them from doing so. Every bit of land the Arabs won in 1948 was ethnically cleansed of Jews and moral defectives like you support that. We won't let it happen again.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Arab citizens of Israel who enjoy democratic rights here"
Its called gerrymandering on the back of ethnic cleansing, tell you whta let all those indigenious arabs who were ethnicly cleansed from their land return, then let see democracy in action......you won't do that will you because your afraid of true democracy..remember when you cleanse a land through terrorism, then cleanse it, then colonise it with Foreigners it has nothing to do with"democratic rights".
pdalaigh 1 year ago
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"tell you whta let all those indigenious arabs who were ethnicly cleansed from their land return, then let see democracy in action...." Arab squatters were offered a state in over half the historic land of Israel and they have refused it several times. Arabs who fled in 1948-49 have no inherent right of return--they ethnically cleansed Jews from Old Jerusalem when they controlled it. We don't trust them not to implement their Arab-supremacist apartheid policies dominate.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"hen cleanse it, then colonise it with Foreigners it has nothing to do with"democratic rights"."
We never colonized it with "foreigners," but Israel enabled Jews to return to their land from foreign Exile. Many foreign Arabs had to flee during the fighting, however. I do respect the Arabs' living in the West Bank/Gaza to have self-determination in their own state, if that's what they wish. Unfortunately, they are encouraged by European racists like you to decline compromise.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"We never colonized it with "foreigners"
thats funny i am just watching a bunch of yanks building and colonizing on occupied land as i text..and i know they are yanks because they are being interviewd by the reporter as i write, dont worry they are being well protected by the idf..in total disregard towards the rule of law...tell me how do you expect there to be any peace when you continue to steal land.....isreal has no morals what so ever, your a disgrace
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"thats funny i am just watching a bunch of yanks"
What is funny is throughout history, Jews were not accepted fully as citizens of the countries in which they lived in Exile. Jews in Germany were not considered Germans, a Jew in France was never truly considered a Frenchman, even in the so-called land of liberty the USA--Jews fought hard to be recognized as Americans and often are told they aren't true Americans. Now, that they're home in Israel, you call them "Yanks".They're Jews and at home
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
Look at the Jews of Ireland--Jews are not thought of or accepted by the Irish as real Irishmen--even after their families have lived there for more than 100 years. I know Jews from Dublin here in Israel--when they talk about growing up there-- and they are fond of Ireland mostly-- they say "relations with the Irish were good". That's because they know they are not Irish--they are Jews from Ireland, but not Irish. Neither do the non-Jews of Ireland accept them as truly Irish .
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"Jews are not thought of or accepted by the Irish as real Irishmen"
So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! good God it must be great being you.................
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! "
In 1904, the good citizens of Limerick rioted against the Jews of that city in the Limerick pogrom, they most certainly did not accept the Jews of that town as fellow Irishmen. A Jew cannot be in his national home in Ireland, it is an exile land just like the USA, Russian, Iraq or Egypt. Some of these places have made their Jews feel welcome as guests at various times, but a Jew is only truly in his home here, in Israel.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "
"In 1904, the good citizens of Limerick rioted against the Jews of that city in the Limerick "
and that proves what? in April of 1948 terrorists of the chosen people did not just riot but massacred Arab villagers in Deir Yassin so does that show that arabs can never be accepted in isreal? and as we speak the ethnic cleansing of arabs from their homes continues...your such a hypocrite...as are your countries policies....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"and that proves what?"
It demonstrates that Jews were not viewed as fellow countrymen who just happened to have a different religion, but as a SEPARATE NATION--and that they were living in Exile. This was the Jewish condition in Russia, Poland, Germany, Morocco, Iraq, etc...and yes, IRELAND--a "liberal" country. Jews are foreign outside of Israel.Jews historically were not viewed as fellow Europeans, but as alien outsiders.Now we're home in our own country you Europeans still give us this shit?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel -"but as a SEPARATE NATION" why are you using capitals? remember just because you use capitals it does not make it true, now who said that to me not so along ago? as i said before (and which you did not comment on) when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation..........what other country does this?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"why are you using capitals?"
I am using big letters because your brain is so small and I am hoping that it will help push in information. Jews are a separate and distinct national group, although in modern times we have contributed much as loyal citizens to the various countries where we have lived as exiles, whether in Ireland, the UK or the US. Thankfully, many Jews are like me and have turned our backs on life in Exile. I prefer to live amongst my own nation than as a foreigner in the US.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation........."
Again, Mr Dunce, it's not "Tying nationality with religion". I am not a religious person, I don't believe in God and I don't observe Jewish religious ritual (I keep some Jewish customs that are national customs, but they are devoid of religious meaning to me). Yet, I am a complete Jew. Why? Because it is my nationality, and I live in the Jewish homeland where my ancestors lived and I speak the Jewish language.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population."
Well that really contrasts starkly with the proposed "loyalty oath" whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state"..not an Isreali state bt a Jewish one......so much for you freedom to worship! the truth is that Isral is an extremely racist state which discriminates againest non-jews..and its getting more and more so each day///
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"Well that really contrasts starkly with the proposed "loyalty oath"
whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state".."
We've been over this before, but yet again, you need things repeated to you. The oath is for NEW CITIZENS--to affirm the Jewish national and democratic character of our state if they wish to apply and receive citizenship. It does not interfere with anybody's freedom to practice their religion or even to practice no religion if they so choose.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"so much for you freedom to worship!"
Explain how asking someone from abroad who freely chooses to move here and then requests citizenship in Israel to affirm the Jewish national character of Israel violates such person's freedom of worship. If a Catholic Filipino living in Israel asks for Israeli citizenship and qualifies and makes that oath, has he violated Catholicism? Does this prevent him from going to church now? He is still a Catholic and still has freedom to practice his religion, no?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"he proposed "loyalty oath" whihc will require "non-jews"! to swear an oath to a "Jewish state""
The oath applies to Jews and non-Jews, and it only applies to new citizens--not people who are born here. Thus an Israeli Arab Muslim or an Israeli Jew who is born here does not have to take the oath and neither do their children,they are citizens by birth. But people who voluntarily move here and voluntarily request citizenship should recognize the Jewish NATIONAL character of our state.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"when you tie nationality with religon you have a very dangerous situation..........what other country does this?"
Why do you like to ask the same questions and make me repeat myself so much? We had this discussion already--there are states that tie nationality with religion you've never heard of Saudi Arabia, which bans non-Muslims from being citizens--very much unlike Israel which guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
"unlike Israel which guarantees freedom of worship for citizens of all religions and where we have a large openly secular population"
Yeah that’s why Muslims can’t get building permits in their own land and yet foreigners who just happen to follow Judaism have no problem with such matters…sounds like a very secular society to me…
ShmorgelBorgel 1 week ago
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"Yeah that’s why Muslims can’t get building permits in their own land "
Muslims can and do get building permits in Israel all the time. Go to any Muslim-majority town, especially in Northern Israel and you see constant building, construction cranes all over the place.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
I'll repost the exchange I had with you 8 months ago:
"pdalaigh:
"i cant think of another country who base their identy on religon, can you?"
me:"Right off the top of my head, there is Saudi Arabia (which doesn't even allow non-Muslims to become citizens), then there are at least 4 states that even define themselves as "Islamic Republics" in their official names--Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Mauritania..."
Ring a bell?
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
As for non-Islamic states, there is Bhutan, where Buddhism is official and where religious rights of non-Buddhists (eg, Hindus, Muslims & Christians is severely infringed--everyone likes to paint Buddhism as super-tolerant, but it's not necessarily so), Nepal where Hinduism is established as the state religion and Buddhists are persecuted, plus let's not forget all the Western European democracies like the UK where Church of England is the official faith of the country."
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
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@ShmorgelBorgel
" there is Bhutan, where Buddhism is official and where religious rights of non-Buddhists - "..not unlike Isreal then is it ?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
""Bhutan..not unlike Isreal then is it ? "
Probably the only group in Israel that has its religious rights infringed to any degree are non-Orthodox Jews who are forced to have an Orthodox marriage (or leave the country to have the ceremony performed abroad). On the other hand, religious Jews also have their rights infringed by the government when they are restricted from worshiping at Jewish sites that are sacred to them for fear of angering Arabs.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"April of 1948... massacred Arab villagers in Deir Yassin "
And in 1929, the Jews of Hebron and Tsefat were massacred. Shortly after the massacre of 60 Jews in Hebron, the British evacuated the survivors--"for their own safety" --Arab ethnic cleansing that was finalized by the British that you admire so much--a community that had existed for centuries was wiped out overnight--and Jews could not live in Hebron again until after 1967, where they survive only with the protection of the IDF.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
War is nasty, and Deir Yassin was a nasty battle. It's clear that innocent civilian Arabs died, and that's a shame. But there were other horrors in 1948. There was the Hadassah convoy massacre committed by Arabs against Jews. 80 Jewish medical personnel, relief workers were burnt alive in buses. There was the Kfar Etzyon massacre, where 50 Jewish defenders of that besieged village who had ALREADY SURRENDERED were machine-gunned to death. But that's ok with you, they were only Jews.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - but you dont have to go back to Deir Yassin....just have a look at what you have done in Gaza last year..........it is clearly a policy of the IDF to carry out massacres, it frighthens the populations and keeps them in check, a clear policy of the IDF because they know that they can get away with anything....they have the good old u s of a to protect their actions....if hamas kills one or two jews theres international ontrage but not when the IDF do it............
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"but you dont have to go back to Deir Yassin....just have a look at what you have done in Gaza last year."
Yes, we fought against the terror government of Hamas and let them know that it's not ok to shoot rockets at Israel and that there will be a price to pay for it. You obviously think it's all right for Hamas to shoot rockets at Israelis, but we disagree. We put up with it for several years--no more!
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Yes, we fought against the terror government of Hamas " again you are not listening to me, you have you have given up any right to comment on “terrorism”, remember your country was founded by terrorists and some of the most prominent members of your Keneset carried out and continue to carry out terrorist actions that make Hamas look like boy scouts….again you have no right to comment on "terrorism" as it was "terrorism" which allowed jews to colonise Palestine..so shhhhhhh
pdalaigh 1 year ago
" it frighthens the populations and keeps them in check,"
If you mean discouraging them from supporting violent actions, such as firing rockets at our towns and civilians on a daily basis then that's a very good thing. Towns such as Sderot suffered near-constant rocket attacks for years and years from Gaza--the people of Sderot are glad that's being kept in check! (For now, at least.) This was made possible by last year's Gaza operation. Firing rockets at Sderot isn't a human right.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel -
"If you mean discouraging them from supporting violent actions"
No thats not what i mean, the jewish state, from its very conception, has used terrorist tactics, violence, and fear to subdue and frighten the indigenous population.This tactic is used by all colonising armies, the germans used it to subdue europe, the brits used it to subdue Ireland and the Jews have used it and continue to use it inorder to colonise and cleanse Palestine.......
pdalaigh 1 year ago
I repeat, firing rockets is not a human right. The Hamas regime has no right to fire even one rocket ever into Israel and if they do so, they must know it will be met with a deadly response from Israel. This will discourage the population from supporting violent actions--what you call "subduing" them. So, absolutely "subduing" them is a good thing--a very good thing--just as it was a good thing that the people of Germany became subdued by years and years of bombing in WW2 by the UK and USA.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
And let's not forget the nearly 1,200 Israelis murdered in terror attacks perpetrated by Arab terrorists between the year 2000 and 2010--but I guess it's okay for Daley the Irishman, they deserved it, because some innocent Arabs died in Deir Yassin, and so what--they were only Jews, right?
;-)
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! good God it must be great being you................."
The Jewish author David Marcus, who was born in Ireland, wrote a book called "A Land Not Theirs". It described a Corkonian Jewish family during the Irish War of Independence--the "land not theirs" was Ireland...for the Jews, the only land that is theirs is Israel. Jews from Ireland are not Irish, they don't think of themselves as such and Irish don't accept them as such either.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Jews from Ireland are not Irish, they don't think of themselves as such and Irish don't accept them as such either."
Well i hate to tell you that unlike your apartheid regime we, the Irish, do not require one of our citizens to be of a particular religion! so the jews of Ireland are indeed Irish, to base their nationality on their religon is very racist and is only required by states who are unsure of their own legitimacy, sounds like any place we know?
pdalaigh 1 year ago
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"unlike your apartheid regime we, the Irish, do not require one of our citizens to be of a particular religion!"
Mr Dunce, Israel doesn't require its citizens to be of one particular religion. 20% of the citizens of Israel are Muslim, Christian, Druze, Bahai or other. Many of these people are very patriotic Israeli citizens. Anybody of whatever religion (or no religion at all) can be an Israeli citizen. Many Israelis are like me, Jewish by nationality but secular and agnostic.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"to base their nationality on their religon is very racist and is only required by states who are unsure of their own legitimacy, sounds like any place we know?"
PREAMBLE
"Constitution of Ireland BUNREACHT NA hÉIREANN
In the Name of the Most Holy Trinity, from Whom is all authority and to Whom, as our final end, all actions both of men and States must be referred,
We, the people of Éire,
Humbly acknowledging all our obligations to our Divine Lord, Jesus Christ,"
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
Ireland has a constitution that starts out with all this Jesus shit, give me a break. We don't have any constitution in Israel like that, but our declaration of independence declares a state that will provide "complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex; it will guarantee freedom of religion, conscience, language, education and culture; it will safeguard the Holy Places of all religions"
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
More from the Irish Constitution
"RELIGION Article 45 (2) says: "The State recognises the special position of the Holy Catholic Apostolic and Roman Church as the guardian of the Faith professed by the great majority of the citizens."
You don't even know your own country's basic definition of itself as a Catholic country that gives a special favored status to one particular variety of Christianity. At any rate, being Jewish is not a matter of religious belief but of nationality.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"So now you are an expert on what the Irish think! "
Oliver Flanagan, former Irish Minister of Defense, elected to the Dail 14 times between 1943 and 1982 said this about the tiny Jewish population of Ireland back in 1943
"There is one thing that Germany did, and that was to rout the Jews out of their country. Until we rout the Jews out of this country it does not matter a hair's breadth what orders you make. "
He got twice the number of votes after that speech, the Irish loved it!
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel -
" He got twice the number of votes after that speech, the Irish loved it!"
So whats your point? does that give you the right to ethnicly cleanse villages? ignore the Geneva convention? ignore 100's of UN resolutions? Commit crimes againest humanity, maintain an apartheid state? you are again using the classic jewish tactic of not dealing with the facts put before you, but trying to divert the reader away from your illegal and immoral colonisation of a land not yours.
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"So whats your point?"
My point is that most Irish, like most people in Europe, have never accepted the Jews as fellow members of their nation--and Flanagan is a good illustration. You European hypocrites are sickening--for generations your societies--whether they were French, Polish, German, or even Irish--rejected the Jews living in your midst as aliens--and now that Jews from have regained independence in our own true country--you tell us you accept us as Europeans. Sod off.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"No they are not, its very simple if you are born in France you are French, "
Many Jews deluded themselves that they were Europeans and hoped the Europeans accepted them as fellow citizens, but we know better now. Your analogy between Catholicism and Italianness highlights your ignorance. Being a Jew, unike being Catholic, is not a matter of religion, but of NATIONALITY. This has always been the case and we have the right to determine our own destiny in our own land like any other nationality.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - So your saying that Judaism is a nationality! Well I had better inform every reference book on the planet as they obviously have it wrong ! So is been called an isreali a nationality? Or have you turned that into a religion? You are trying so hard you have actually tied yourself up in knots! So let me get this right you’re a yank, an isreali and the new nationality of Judaism! Congratulations!
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"So your saying that Judaism is a nationality!"
No, "Judaism" is a religion--but the Jews are a nationality and we always have been. This should be pretty simple even for a dolt like you. One need not believe or follow the religion of Judaism in order to be a Jew. I am an agnostic and barely practice Judaism, but I am a Jew by nationality, of course. Being an Israeli is NOT a nationality--but it is a citizenship. One can be an Israeli citizen without being part of the Jewish nationality.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel
No, "Judaism" is a religion--but the Jews are a nationality"
thats like saying Catholicism is a religon but the catholics are a nationality! yeah when you look at it from this view point is does sound ridiculous, and there is a reason for that ,it is because it is ridiculous!
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"thats like saying Catholicism is a religon but the catholics are a nationality! "
Except Catholics, unlike Jews, do not constitute a nationality and never have. Someone who is baptized Catholic and is born into a Catholic family and later rejects Catholic belief and doctrine is no longer a Catholic. Someone who is born into a Jewish family and who does not practice nor believe in Judaism (the religion) remains a Jew by nationality. This has always been the case.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel -
"Someone who is born into a Jewish family and who does not practice nor believe in Judaism (the religion) remains a Jew by nationality."
My God i think that must be one of the most arrogent statements i have ever heard.......when you are equating religon with nationality (as you have done) it is possably the most dangerous combinations that can exist..and you of all people should know this...its very close to those "Ayran" ideas of a certain german........scary!
pdalaigh 1 year ago
"its very close to those "Ayran" ideas of a certain german........scary!"
Hitler was Austrian, not German. However, the Nazi ideology said the Jews were a "race". "Race" is not the same as "nationality." Nevertheless, Hitler was not placated (you see, I am using the word "placated" correctly) if he learned that a Jew had abandoned Judaism, because he knew that being Jews belonged to a different nationality--and so they did, although he crudely called it "race".
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
"..when you are equating religon with nationality (as you have done) it is possably the most dangerous combinations that can exist."
Ridiculous, because I am not equating religion with nationality. My "religion" is "none, " (I am not a religious person). My "nationality" is Jewish. My ancestors were Jewish, my language is Hebrew and I live in Israel, the Jewish state. I am a Jew by nationality.
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago
@ShmorgelBorgel - "Ridiculous, because I am not equating religion with nationality"
Yes you have, you do not even know what you have been saying, you have stated that any jew has the right to live in isreal......therefore you have tied up nationalty and religious beleif ...now you are trying to retract what you have been stating all along...you really want to get your story correct before yo start rambling on....
pdalaigh 1 year ago
""you do not even know what you have been saying, you have stated that any jew has the right to live in isreal......therefore you have tied up nationalty and religious beleif"
Nope. Many Jews (such as yours truly) have no religious belief. I'm skeptical that God exists , I certainly don't believe in the divinity of the Torah, I don't keep Sabbath--I don't believe in Judaism or follow most of its rules, but I am a Jew. It's my nationality. Understand? (No, probably not, you're stupid.)
ShmorgelBorgel 1 year ago