3rd mov. BWV 1052 Bach d minor concerto - Ivan Kerekovsky

[idaspe]

Great performance, great tempo, very nice!!!

[mstuartg]

A great interpretation - wow the speed - love it.

[glantz91]

well,I really prefer the piano, and

the new possibilities it gives however, the Harpsichord

is the only way for the performer to see a little the true face of a baroque work! (:

Please, hear my cadenza before the end,

at the hall there almost no one noticed!!, but Bach

himself wrote fermatta over the rest (this means cadenza)

(:

[EmceeLorder]

Aha. Never noticed it until you said it.

[glantz91]

( :

[wcbroccoli]

I've heard this work many times, in both historically informed and historically clueless performances. Not once did I hear a cadenza.

I don't believe the fermata here (on a diminished form of the dominant) is an invitation play a cadenza. That chord is a pregnant pause that begs for the resolution of cadence that follows. You don't make a woman in labor wait for a cadenza!

Cadenzas are a creatures of the a later era. The fermata usually occurs on the 2nd inversion of the tonic.

[glantz91]

I'm really happy to read your comment, since I didn't

discuss the cadenza for now here!

Well, I know that hardly one plays own cadenzas even

in the Mozart concertos nowadays, and that is sad, since

no one imagined a concerto without a cadenza before 19th century... you know it.

About my cadenza here - well, the pregnant women is waiting firstly because of Bach himself, since in the score next to the highly dissonant diminished fermata chord is the transition section to the final motto in adagio

[glantz91]

(adagio - two bars condensed into one) , and not the baby (oops tonic:)

which itself is a cadence to the motto (T6, K54-D7), so in other words,

there are two dominant sections next to each other. and my cadenza is simply a transition between them, an embellishment of the fermatta (the

main cadenza is Bach's - b.b.250-265, you know).

But even though, now (2009:) I would extemporize a completely

different cadenza (if at all), that cadenza is for that performance. And a cadenza is essential, it

[glantz91]

will take me too much space to explain obvious things that you obviously know, but shortly for the others who read:

A cadenza has nothing to do with a personality (ego) invading the art. For centuries it was regarded as a high form of appreciation to the composer-performer.

(There was no difference!),

and it had to be integral to the performance.

A cadenza is the music that one creates through the inspiration of a single performance, thus what directly unites the audience with the composer/art,

[wcbroccoli]

The cadenza did not mutate into the circus sideshow that we are accustomed to today until the growth of public concerts in the late 18th c.

The origin of the instrumental cadenza was the vocal cadenza, which was a vocal flourish improvised by the performer to elaborate a cadence in an aria.

Bach's keyboard works include many written out cadenzas. They are always mere cadential flourishes. To see what I mean, just look as the cadenza in movement 1 of this concerto.

[wcbroccoli]

BTW. The long harpsichord solo in Brandenburg Concerto 5 is often called a cadenza. It isn't. It's a thematically derived capriccio of a kind found in Vivaldi's Violin Concerto RV 208, which contains fully written-out solos (capriccios).

[wcbroccoli]

The problem is that your cadenza took such a long, scenic detour, harmonically and thematically, that the drama set up by that dim. V7 chord was lost.

[wcbroccoli]

For cadenzas, a Bach contemporary, Johann Quantz. recommends the imitation or use of themes from the piece, and opposes roaming into remote keys and adhering to regular meter.

Another contemporary, Johann Mattheson, stated that if you have a good ideas, you don't really need much of a cadenza, and was critical of cadenzas that introduce ideas not in the piece.

[wcbroccoli]

The 1st movement has a dim. V7 chord under a fermata. You will agree that the 3+ measures that follow ARE the cadenza.

Likewise, in the 3rd movement, the Adagio section that follows the dim.V7 (or V9) chord under the fermata IS the cadenza.

Why would he write out the cadenza in the 1st movement but leave it to the whim of the performer in the 3rd movement?

Baroque instrumental cadenzas were not circus sideshows. They were merely cadential flourishes, like vocal cadenzas in opera.

[puck981]

I prefer it with piano any day.

[ilovebach123]

Yes i would prefer harpsichord to. But this is amazing as well.

[juan486]

I usually prefer this piece performed with harpsichord, but this interpretation with piano is excellent. Awesome.