Healthcare Hypocrisy

[MathijsMoonen]

jperryam,

I don't think that at the beginning of his presidency, health care reform was dropped as a priority. I also don't believe that by becoming the president, the political disparity was immediately solved.

There's still a political war going on now, I find it ridiculous how much opposition there is and clearly most of the media has chosen the republican side. It looks impossible for Obama to achieve anything without someone trying to take him down.

[Isawanangel1X]

wow they just suck the marrow out of our bones, it's awful..so depressing:o(

[igspal]

TYPO!: I MEANT "Pps".

[igspal]

Pss. NOT that elections in this country aren't manipulated...to ENSURE that an Independent (nor ANY other candidate who thinks like one) is NEVER EVER taken seriously.

[igspal]

Ps.  I, TOO, am a registered "Independent".

[igspal]

T H A N K Y O U, "jperryam"!!! THIS VIDEO NEEDS TO BE SEEN BY ALL!!! (Btw, wasn't Dennis Kucinich the person who SOLELY drafted the Single Payer system?)

[gagefixer]

your correct that obama is a liar , what you DONT understand is that he will still try to do it BUT incrementally ..

dont worry the guy you voted for is a true socialist . he just isnt acting fast enough for you because the majority of us understand that govt run health care is bullshit , your facts are scewed about socialism goverment run single payer . it will give us crappy health care like all the other countries currently using it .

[jperryam]

Why should we listen to you? You back up what you say with nothing. Your YT channel is completely empty. Your propaganda parrot schtick could not be more transparent. I used to wonder why all you idiots even bothered, but then it came to me one day: It takes a lot less guts to sit back and take anonymous pot shots than it does to take a principled stand. I did not vote for Obama. And there are multiple polls that prove how wrong you are about being in the majority. Do the real homework, genius.

[taoofmichael]

"Socialized Medicine" a term invented by a PR firm in the 40s to kill Harry Truman's health care proposal.

Republicans fought SS, and Medicare. Why should we listen to them now?

[sugarpuddin88]

World Health Organization ranked the countries of the world in terms of oval health performance, and the U.S. (was) 37th In the fairness of health care, America is 54th. The irony is that the United States spends more per capita for health care than any other nation in the world, (The European Dream p 79 80 & NYT Nov 22, 2004). American education is the same

Soulless Insurance & Pharma Corps legally bribe politicians - See my video about avg payout between 1 to 4 million per Senator

[FantasticBob7000]

@gagefixer It would help if you get your facts right. Countries using single payer health care deliver better health care for less money.

You'd be more convincing if you'd argue for abolishing Medicare instead.

[ThePedub]

@gagefixer Should'nt you be watching Fox News right now?

[elderturtle]

Many people still overlook the fact that Obama is not interested in people or their health. (Like most dictators in history, Obama is interested in power.)

Nader also missed an important point: Obama's current plan would eliminate any upcoming Social Security deficit by facilitating the earlier demise of seniors, who will be ill-served by his plan.

[PersianPaladin]

Thats because the government IS owned by the big corporations.

The whole point is that WE the people can take back government and get it to serve our collective interests. Corporations must be banned from lobbying politicians, and it gets even worse with the fact that corporations have "rights" like human beings (see corporate law).

[sugarpuddin88]

Health Care in USA is ranked 54th (Pay more and get lots lots less)

USA is only developed country not to offer health care to citizens

US is 41st in world in infant mortality Cuba scores higher

Women are 70% more likely to die in childbirth in America than in Europe

Leading cause of death of pregnant women in USA is murder

US is dead last in the growth rate of total compensation to its workforce; they worker longer hours than any other nation & with least vacation time!

[PersianPaladin]

The government is what the people make it to be.

Remember that.

[immayhem]

...only if there is a Revolution, at this point. we're too little, too late to create the change we want without some bloodshed.

until people realize this fact - that the system itself is just too far gone, too corrupted to respond to our kindly requests, or even our outraged demands... people will just roll over and take whatever concession is being offered. Hegelian Dialectic.

SP will only come about if it can serve to complete their total dominance aspirations. Until we decide to revolt.

[immayhem]

Obama's Science advisor, John Holdren endorses (in 'Ecoscience') the creation of "a Planetary regime" in charge of regulating all human economic activity and interactions with the environment and the "power to enforce the agreed limits" on human population growth through whatever means might be necessary, including compelled abortion, involuntary individual sterilization, or even mass involuntary sterilization through the infiltration of sterilizing agents into public water...

[klard]

Obama definitely pulled a Jekyll/Hyde transformation. I like candidate Obama much better than President Obama. On every issue in the USA the Corporate parasites are sucking this country dry like it is a quickly rotting corpse.

[immayhem]

I know this sounds simplistic to all of you. But the answer is this: Create community ties, extended family with the 150 or so people who live closest to you. Pitch in (money, resources and time) to make yourselves entirely self-sustaining. Go off the grid. Chances are that within that circle are people whose talents and skills cover the spectrum of what you need. Stop paying taxes. Declare yourselves sovereign. This is the only way we are going to make it through what lies ahead. I'm serious.

[PersianPaladin]

immayhem....That is not a pragmatic solution for an urbanised and large industrial nation. What about people who are not living in such cohesive communities?

[immayhem]

May not be pragmatic in your opinion. It doesn't matter. You decide what works for you. if you want to be a slave, it's your business. China is the industrial nation now. We are a debtor/slave nation. If we want to be industrious (and we will HAVE TO to survive), we have to rethink sustainability and look to new ways of doing it. We will have to create cohesive communities in order to survive. Period.

[PersianPaladin]

You are being silly.

Single-payer is the most practical and pragmatic solution for social justice as well as for the economic security of the nation.

[immayhem]

...you have not sufficiently addressed any of the points i've made. you just resort to an ad hominem.

i honestly would like for you to explain to me how it will happen that a HUGE industry will just concede to becoming a non-profit provider of pharmaceuticals? especially when that industry is one of the most politically powerful on the planet (and intricately woven into our government)? just who is going to forcibly nationalize them? themselves? and if that DID happen, what would it look like?

[PersianPaladin]

The government has the power to create a public option that renders these big pharmaceuticals powerless to overcharge people, to profit by selling patients' drugs instead of proper treatment, and making money from NOT providing healthcare.

It could happen tommorow.

[immayhem]

I don't share your optimism that it could happen tomorrow. I don't think you realize how intrinsically interwoven the medical/pharmaceutical complex actually is with government at the highest levels. the pharma giants control medical education and research, down to the fiber. they write the curriculum, fund the research (and defund the research that turns up results)... nearly every last doctor trained in the US learns from textbooks written by big pharma. the problem is deeply systemic.

[PersianPaladin]

I agree with getting rid of debt-based money, fractional reserve banking, etc. It also means government no longer has to get into debt, and banks no longer make a profit off money itself. Dennis Kucinich supports that initiative, just as he supports single-payer.

[immayhem]

I like Kucinich. But he's not (and no other member of congress) is in control now. Look at what is happening with the Fed. 1207 and the senate equivalent (to audit the Fed) is being blocked- Obama seeks to give them MORE power. We're in the middle of a coups, and you all are distracted by health care?? It seems completely ridiculous to me. It's equivalent to begging for scraps from Satan's table.

[PersianPaladin]

immayhem...

A not-for-profit single-payer system is the only way to reliably ensure that you don't get continuing exploitation by insurance companies who have cornered the drug-delivery market.

Get Wall-Street OUT of healthcare, and that is done by removing profit.

[immayhem]

Again - you're a victim of in-the-box thinking. SP itself will ensure exploitation. The government provides funding and legal shielding (at our expense) to big pharma. The mandatory vaccines (coming down the pipe this fall) will be paid for with tax dollars and FORCED ON YOU. That will continue, getting more and more prevalent as the government becomes more embedded with private interests. Yes, of course get Wall street out of health care. Get them out of government entirely.

[PersianPaladin]

Single-payer is not-for-profit. Big pharma cannot make profits from that. Use your brain.

[immayhem]

you're a riot.

so you're saying (correct me if I'm wrong) the pharmaceutical industry is going to be forced to make drugs now and sell them to the government (as their only customer) for NO PROFIT? and since everyone will be covered by single-payer plan, they will be expected to just take that loss of billions of dollars per annum on the cuff.

Have some more fluoride water, sucker.

[immayhem]

Sadly I view the problem as unfixable, under the circumstances. It's too far-gone. All of it.

The monkeysphere is just too big.

(Google 'monkeysphere)

Until we return to living in smaller groups/communities, building local economies (including health care that is more insulated from the controls of big industry)... it's just going to get worse. Our 4lb. brains are not capable of placing any importance on the wellbeing of strangers.

[jperryam]

So the solution is to do nothing? Bravo. The point you're missing is that single payer *does* insulate healthcare from big industry, by putting the focus on people instead of profit. Maybe *your* 4lb brain is not capable of placing any importance on the wellbeing of strangers, but there are plenty of us out here who have no problem with the concept. The majority of Americans, in fact, support single payer, including the majority of doctors and nurses. Do they all have it wrong too?

[immayhem]

the solution is to first rid ourselves of a debt-based monetary system by whatever means necessary, then come up with better solutions like private consumer-based community medical coops, for instance. single payer health care is like taking an aspirin for brain cancer.

how does SP put the focus on 'people' instead of 'profit'? will the pharmaceutical industry magically change? Are the insurance giants just going to go away? 'darn, we've been replaced. guess we'll just try philanthropy now'..

[jperryam]

Either you haven't studied the single payer issue much or you're pretending you haven't. The insurance giants would go away (at least the health insurance giants) if we adopted single payer, because there would be no need for them. Which is why they're fighting the idea tooth and nail with all the propaganda and palm greasing in Washington. Now how about answering my question: Are all the nurses and doctors (the majority of them) who support single payer wrong too?

[immayhem]

logic: they are fighting it tooth and nail, they have lots of power... therefore, my guess is that whatever comes down the pipes is going to benefit them. we're not being protected from them by anyone as it is. they're not going to just go away. are doctors and nurses wrong? it would depend on how they feel about mandatory vaccines, NIH AIDS forced drug trials on orphans,etc. that would be two random qualifiers for my respect for their (OR YOUR) opinions on this (OR ANY) subject.

[immayhem]

our government has no problem with working in conjunction with private sector to benefit said private sector at taxpayer expense. Look at the excesses and corruption (and terrible abuses) by Halliburton, KBR, Sanofi Pasteur, Eli Lilly, Searle. It will be the same with single payer. The Insurance giants with the most insider influence will get the contract to deliver the product. Don't know what it will look like, but they'll call it 'single payer'...

[immayhem]

They are not going to just tuck tail and run away. We have a system based on plunder. A debt-based economy. The plunderers are firmly in control. They are deeply involved in preserving it. Why Obama's about face? He has no say in the matter. Until they can sort out a way to make just as much money, it's not going to happen.

[jperryam]

So again, you reocognize the problem(s), but your solution is to do nothing. "The plunderers are firmly in control," so why even bother? Just bend over and let them keep plundering. Now there's a briliant strategy. It doesn't matter what the odds are of bringing real change. If you don't even make the effort, you're part of the problem. I'm not going to keep arguing with you. You clearly don't get it.

[immayhem]

i'm sorry.. not trying to argue. It's a matter of methodology. If you want health care reform (we all want something vastly different than we have now) we have to systematically eliminate ALL the self-interested corporations from the policy-making process. It would require nothing short of revolution on all fronts. That's ultimately the only way to put things right.

I'm not one for bending over. Nor am I willing to give them any more power than they already have. I'm not part of the problem.

[PersianPaladin]

What I do worry though, is how a public funded system will allocate money towards prescriptions.

I will tell you now, that I HATE drugs companies in general and doctors are in the business of prescribing far too many drugs when they could be offering more natural solutions.

I think there is certainly potential for choice, in a not-for-profit system.

[PersianPaladin]

truindep...

Government CAN work for us. We just need to get the private bankers out of government influence. We do this by nationalising the money supply, removing fractional reserve and debt from money creation and preventing banks from creating new money. This also reduces debt in society, and can reduce tax burdens too. Government can then tax people and corporations who take money OUT of society and NOT tax people's income or productive work.

[PersianPaladin]

I DO believe we can have single-payer not-for-profit healthcare and privately delivered too, but I think the beuracracy should be minimal, and there shouldn't be targets set by the government that cause real problems.

They should fund and help pave the way for affordable healthcare, but not get involved in imposing central planning of the delivery of healthcare.

If the not-for-profit Kucinich-backed deal remedies this, then I support it!

[PersianPaladin]

The problem with socialised healthcare in Britain; for example - is that the government makes decisions on which private drug companies and corporations can be involved in subcontracts in various areas. This means that we have a tax-funded public-private partnership system, where there is profit made in certain areas. The UK government also imposes too much beuracracy and strangles hospitals with targets. This increases stress and reduces efficiency.

[zoxovox]

100% agreement. Looks like the public option is what we are going to get pushed down our throats regardless though. Obama is likely not getting my vote in 2012 unless the other candidate is someone intolerable like Sarah Palin which is anyone in the republican party.  Maybe Hillary will run again.

[nohealthcare62]

Thank You for UR Video ! I was Sprayed for 7 yrs in West Tennessee ...and I dididnt live there all by-my-self lots of other people were also sprayed and didnt know it like me ...now I cant find a Doctor or a Lawyer to help me and I dont QUALIFY @ the Dept of Human Services only for DEATH they Told me so ! HR676 we need a PAPER Petition to Hand to Obama or he wont get re-elected !

[Weeth]

single-payer system.. just like social security. brilliant

[jperryam]

So what's the answer then, Brett? What do we do about the 50 million uninsured? What do we do about the 20,000 people who die every year because they can't afford health insurance? What do we do about all those who faithfully pay their premiums, only to be screwed at the last minute before major surgey when the company denies coverage for some bogus reason? And what about all the health related bankruptcies? Complaining without offering legit alternatives only makes one part of the problem.

[Weeth]

well. as long as we can agree that a government-run health care system is not desirable (keep in mind that such a system would be virtually irreversible), then we can begin to move on to solutions that will actually work. but when the executive branch is rushing to jam this down our throats in such a short period of time, we should be cautious and stay focused on halting the imminent legislation. thats all that matters right now.

[jperryam]

Nice non-answer. You should run for office.

[Weeth]

you cant defend horrible, imminent legislation by saying "hey, you cant think of anything better!". that would be like debating whether or not to throw more water onto a sinking ship and then becoming indignant when you are criticized for the proposal. however, i do happen to have the solution and ill explain it to you if you want. ill be back later today

[jperryam]

Let's make something clear, Brett: I DO NOT support Obama's "public option" or any other plan they're currently talking about in Washington. I'm advocating Single Payer, the plan preferred by the majority of Americans (December 2007 AP/Yahoo poll), including the majority of doctors, nurses and health economists. Think they know what they're talking about? Obama's "public option" is phony lip service that will maintain the hopelessly broken for-profit system and still leave millions uninsured.

[finefilth]

google" the whale medical fascism"... you are being fist fucked and murdered by medical tyrants and wall street parasites

modern medicine is the biggest fraud in history ( next to central banking)

suppress causes and cures for ALL disease to protect egregious and extortionary profits

[55ella2007k]

Excellent !

[truindep]

i often agree with you....but can't get on board with this one. i don't support obama (fvck, i'm almost wishing that shrub were still puppet in chief at this point) but single payer is a fvckin sham. smash the state and free markets ftw! u have no argument that can beat an-cap on this matter - history is on my side.

[jperryam]

Sorry, truindep. an-cap? Not sure what you're saying there.

[truindep]

free market anarchy.

every problem r/t health care and insurance right now is directly r/t gov't interference.

single-payer proponents ignore that and like to pretend that medicare for all would be cost effective and that it wouldn't fall into the same traps that are already effecting us do to gov't regs.

besides that, advocating so-called single-payer is advocating theft and force - two things i find distasteful. only a morally bankrupt person can support it or any nat'l plan.

[jperryam]

"every problem r/t health care and insurance right now is directly r/t gov't interference." - So what should we do? Remove all oversight and rely on the "good faith" of an industry motivated solely by profit? - "Advocating so-called single-payer is advocating theft and force...only a morally bankrupt person can support it ." - As if it's the height of morality to do nothing about 50 million uninsured and 20,000 dying every year because they can't afford coverage? Please. You're making NO sense.

[truindep]

&more gooferment intervention will lower costs? of course not - they've been skyrocketing b/c of the intervention&will only go higher. ppl have forgotten what the purpose of ins was.

and yes - it's immoral to demand that the gov't take money from ppl (steal) to pay for others. they're not dying and going w/o ins because we don't have single payer - they're hurting because the gov't, through force and theft, has made health care so expensive - and yet, ppl are screaming for the gov't to do more.

[jperryam]

It's not immoral to ask people to pay a fair share so everyone benefits. It's part of the responsibility of citizenship. Some will cheat, but that will happen regardless of the system we have. This is where government is supposed to come in. The force and theft are originating in an insurance industry driven solely by profit. Washington is just enabling it. People are not screaming to be ripped off more. They're screaming for the government service that's going to corporations instead of them.

[truindep]

"fair share" seriously? what if i don't agree with your concept of what a "fair share" is? you are saying that it is ok to force me to pay it anyway and are happy to steal it from me. "responsibility of citizenship" please. my responsibility ends&begins at not trampling on the rights of others - not harming the individual&getting in the way of their rights - life, liberty, & the pursuit of happiness. stealing from me & forcing me to subsidize gov't programmes i find distasteul takes my rights.

[truindep]

the gov't caused the costs to skyrocket - the gov't subsidized and regualted every aspect of the industry - ppl are screaming to get ripped off when they demand single payer. most are simply to foolish to realize it, thinking instead that more gov't is the answer to their problems instead of understanding that gov't itself is the problem.

[jperryam]

Exactly! But anyone who just bitches about how government is the problem instead of actually getting off his or her ass to DO SOMETHING about it is only handing politicians the ignorant defacto approval they thrive on. You want to improve life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness? Give everybody a fair healthcare deal that leaves more cash in their pocket and allows businesses to actually invest in growth instead of feeding the corporate insurance beast. This is exactly what single payer does.

[truindep]

sorry - your comment makes no sense.

you start off agreeing with me and then in the next sentence, you argue for more gooferment as the solution to the problem.

[jperryam]

It makes perfect sense if you take the blinders off, look at the whole picture, and take the time to actually understand before shooting back with cute little words like "gooferment." Yes, government is the problem. But it's because they're working for the corporations instead of the people. Single payer takes profit (and kickbacks, of course) out of the equation. It's government FOR THE PEOPLE, which is why they resist it. But it's the peoples' responsibility to bring real change. Get it yet?

[truindep]

gov't is the problem.

turning it all over to the gov't is not the solution - corps will still be in control, still setting prices, still having a monopoly.

when gov't is the problem, more gov't is not the solution. this will make things worse. stop thinking that dc will make things better - history shows that more gov't is always worse and in this case, so do the on the ground facts.

this will give most coverage, but it will not reduce the cost one red cent - costs will go up!

[jperryam]

You're wrong, truindep. And an honest look at ALL the available info (as opposed to just that which you think supports your argument) proves it. I've agreed with you multiple times that government is the problem and explained how it's the peoples' responsibility to change the equation, to get them working for us instead of their coroporate pimps. But you're completely ignoring the issue in favor of the same old tired rhetoric. Thanks for proving my point about the blinders.

[Bigwheels161616]

I am just wondering why do u think medicare has been a failure? It has no waiting list and the services it provides are up to par with the private insurance.

The reason I think is cos it cost too much money, when the responsiblity of paying is put in the hands of insurance company or govt the people are going to misuse the service.

The singapore healthcare system uses that model a video description which can be seen below. watch it and tell me what u think

/watch?v=r7QMCEa7hVk

[truindep]

wrong again as this will not reduce costs regarding meds (rx or studies) tx, etc , nor will it take away from the monopolies created by gov't intervention in the first place. it will give more control to the gov't over your funds and lives. i'm not a republican, nor am i the sort that screams socialism over everything. i am vehemently anti-state tho, and the free market provides better solutions. the gov't will never work for the ppl - ever. it cannot be done - gov't is force.

[jperryam]

The free market may provide better solutions in other areas, but certainly NOT healthcare. 50 million people uninsured, 20,000 dying every year because they can't afford insurance and medical bills promting more than 60% of bankruptcies is NOT a better solution. You're ignoring the $400b in needless administrative waste that we would save every year under a single payer system, not to mention the huge economic benefit of businesses being able to invest in growth instead of paying for insurance.

[truindep]

really? eliminating that waste is nothing overall when compared to the huge waste that gov't intervention into the private medical has created which will still exist and multiply under single-payer. ppl used to be able to afford a doctors' visit for basic checkups and the like - it is the gov't that has made that impossible for so many now. all single payer will do is give more money to business on behalf of us all. it isn't the free market that prevents ppl from getting care.

[jperryam]

"gov't will never work for the ppl - ever. it cannot be done - gov't is force."

And how does government become force? It happens when people abidicate their power by refusing to honor their responsibility as citizens to hold government accountable. You're bitching about the problem that YOU'RE enabling with your defeatist attitude. But hey, you've got your creature comforts, convenient distractions and overpriced healthcare, so you're good, right? Congrats on being part of the problem.

[jperryam]

*abdicate*

[truindep]

gov't is force and nothing more.

gov't cannot secure rights as it has none but those that are taken, whether by force via mob rule or under threat of violence.

you are arguing in favour of more force; i argue against it. you enable the State and its evils; i refuse to comply and work to smash it.

the attitude that only the State can or should provide is defeatist and is the problem.

[jperryam]

"ppl used to be able to afford a doctors' visit for basic checkups...it is the gov't that has made that impossible for so many now." - WRONG. It's govt's service to corporations instead of the people. I do not argue for more force. I argue for the people we elect as public servants to actually honor that standard, by administering a system that WE provide for with our tax dollars. But you want to let them continue siphoning off those dollars to provide for their corporate paymasters instead.

[truindep]

"It's govt's service to corporations instead of the people."

that is gov't - you contradicted yourself.

you are arguing for me force because you are demanding that i allow the gov't to steal from me to fund something that i do not agree with.

you see, i don't agree with the current system either and do not think that i should have my wages stolen for medicare. i do not want the gov't to steal from me at all. you are fine with that theft if they use the money as you wish, never mind my own.

[jperryam]

So what's your solution? We have to pay for healthcare somehow. What's wrong with each person paying less and having everyone covered? I've explained multiple times how it will cost us less. I have links in the video info, which lead to more links...all the info is out there. But you refuse to even take an honest look. All you can offer is random bitching about "gov't intervention" and tell me I'm wrong. That's no solution, my friend. That just perpetutaes the problem. We need real answers.

[truindep]

"We have to pay for healthcare somehow. What's wrong with each person paying less and having everyone covered? I've explained multiple times how it will cost us less."

problems are "we," and "us." it is not your responsibility to pay for me, nor is it mine to pay for you, yet you want to force me to do so.

further, it does not address the root. you keep ignoring why care costs so much - you seem ok that due to gov't int, their buddies in the pharm indus, fda, etc will rake in our money.

[truindep]

it is you who is not being honest, searching instead for a quick fix. when the problem is force, theft, and gov't, the answer is not more and trying to make it work better for you somehow, the answer is less of all that is causing strife - real solutions to the problem cannot be found by making the problem even bigger.

gov't has no business here and needs to be removed entirely. since the gov't has been allowed to intervene, every problem plaguing american's r/t to their health has grown.

[jperryam]

Good job avoiding my question. Seems like you're the one looking for the quick fix, as long as you don't have to contribute. Some good citizenship that is. I guess I'll just let the record here speak for itself. I've explained the difference between government working for us and government working for the corporations. I've explained how it's our responsibility as citizens to stand up and make that happen. You just refuse to even attempt to understand the concept. Good luck with your problem.

[immayhem]

sorry... i am with truindep on this one. Bastiat provides the litmus test for the difference between correct and incorrect functions of government: If the government does that which a citizen can't do without committing a crime. Forcible removal of property (money) is a crime. It's theft. The ramifications = no one can respect Law as justice. I do not want to have my property taken by force and given to a body as corrupt, negligent and murderous as the western medical establishment.

[jperryam]

It's not theft if you're getting something in return. Which you certainly are in the case of single payer. In fact, we' re ALL getting a much more efficient, cost-effective healthcare system that includes everybody. No deductibles, no co-pays, no bills from the doc for stuff your plan doesn't cover, no exclusions for pre-existing conditions, no going broke because of medical bills, which are the direct result of 60% of U.S. bankruptcies. Disagree? Fine. Please tell us what the solution is.

[immayhem]

It is theft if you are not making a freewill choice to buy the product. I would have little problem with it personally if one can 'opt out' - and not pay anything at all into the system. Politically though I'd still fundamentally disagree with it. It compounds the real problem.

Any real solution would have to address the root of the problem, which is that the pharmaceutical and insurance industries have wrested control of medical education, of research - the practice of medicine itself.

[immayhem]

cont'd. even the government bodies which are supposed to protect us - all are systemically controlled by an industry that profits from sickness. Western medicine has become a leading cause of death in the US. A single-payer system will make it even worse. Watch.

[PersianPaladin]

immayhem...

Do you think it is theft for society to pay tax in order to pay ambulance workers' to pick up the sick?

Think before you speak.

[immayhem]

You're so inside the box.

Your thought process is flawed. A victim of the 'either this or that' disorder...

I used to be a volunteer EMT, donated 15-20 hrs per week to my community, plus paid for my own training with fundraisers. There were 30 of us who did this in my small community alone. Our community supported us. The love we received was payment enough. I wouldn't have done it for money.

[jperryam]

All the facts and evidence that prove you wrong about your claims that the waste would continue are out there for anyone who cares enough to do some honest homework. Clearly you don't, which clearly indicates your preference for the broken status quo and makes you part of the problem. There can be no doubt that you're the enabler here. The single payer movement advocates real change that benefits everybody. But you seek to supress it. Trying to protect your dwindling stock portfolio, perhaps?

[truindep]

sigh.

you are one hundred percent wrong, not just in your assessment of single-payer, but in your assessment of me.

one- single-payer does not address the real root, ie, why is medical care, prescriptions, diagnostics, etc so expensive? (answer- gov't intervention). sp will only pay for what already costs too much; it will not reduce them one writ.

two - i simply ask that no one use force against me. if you support it, pay in, reap what benefits you can, but allow the rest of us to opt out.

[Y3rMawm]

Nobody will go bankrupt. Except the US.

Where will the money come from?

[jperryam]

It will come from your paycheck, just like it does now, except it won't be going to insurance companies who are more concerned with their profit than your health. It will go to a general fund that pays the docs and hospitals directly. And as is pointed out in the video and the supporting links, it will be a lot cheaper and far more efficient. The lobbyists and corporate tools on Capitol Hill don't like it because it cuts off their gravy train, but it's the ONLY choice if we want REAL reform.

[Y3rMawm]

You miss the point. The question is, how will we afford it? What happens when what I contribute becomes insufficient?

I don't use Doctors, who are BigPharma shills lacking nutritional knowledge, now. Why on earth would I ever want to contribute to this?

You want abdicate more of my rights/money same people who run Amtrak, and the USPS? You dare to think this will be different? Good luck with that Mr.

I refuse.

[jperryam]

You'd want to contribute because your healthcare would cost you less. Not a dime out of pocket for deductibles, co-pays or bills from the doc for stuff your current plan doesn't cover. All contribute, all pay less. It makes sense and you know it. You just can't get past the politics. But hey, if you're happy with overpaying, not caring about anybody else's coverage as long as you've got yours, and bitching about how single payer won't work while offering no alternative, that's your choice.

[bigbono12]

Right on the mark! But again I say why are you staying in the USA ? - a failed new Third World nation of beastiality and cruelty.

[jperryam]

Thanks, but I stay because I refuse to run away and watch from afar while my country is brought to its knees by corruption and ignorance. I will stay and keep speaking out until we once again have government we can believe in, or until they put me six feet under. We have a saying here to honor the memory of dead soldiers - "Freedom is not free." But those words also apply to everyday citizens, who need to remember their responsibility to take an active role and speak out against injustice.

[bigbono12]

Courageous but foolish in my opinion. Would you stay in a house if you knew the roof was about to fall in and the land around burnt & made radioactive? True patriotism is made of love for ones country and for the dead soldiers' lives given to protect its liberty & WISDOM. LOVE & WISDOM. America cannot recover. It is going to be destroyed. Don't let your love of a former America blind you. Leave & help us build a new world on the principles of America's founding fathers for the ENTIRE WORLD.

[jperryam]

I guess you and I just see things a little differently. Call me crazy if you must, but I think America can recover. I assure you, my friend, I am not blind. But neither am I intimidated by bunch of frauds inside the Beltway masquerading as public servants. They are the ultimate cowards, as time will eventually prove.

[55ella2007k]

Thanks for continuing the good fight, while once again, many people are falling into complacency !

[PASMdude]

Because the funds have been looted so they could continue to spend money without raising taxes.

[jperryam]

As the movement has consistently made clear, you STILL have choice with single payer. In fact, even more so than now. If you have evidence to the contrary, you need to share it. Rationing and denying of care are hallmarks of the current for-profit system that single payer would eradicate. Bad for America? Please tell us what's bad about covering everybody, saving employers millions that they can throw to their bottom line, and saving taxpayers $400 billion every year in needless waste.

[uche007us]

Contd

more like the system they have in singapore.

watch?v=r7QMCEa7hVk&feature=ch­annel_page

[uche007us]

I have a feeling that a single payer system not really lower the cost spent on healthcare in this country, it may lower the individual cost by a bit, but the general cost will be so massive that it may cripple this country.

What id like to see is something like an individual health saving account with the govt matching a smal % of lowers income payers. This will do 2 things, lower the cost of healthcare and force individuals to take good care of themselves so as not to deplete their account

[jperryam]

uche, I would urge you to do more research to realize the savings. Single payer would reduce overhead from 30-some percent to the single digits. Doctors and hospitals would be dealing with ONE payer, as opposed to the 1300 they have to deal with now. They would actually be able to spend most of their time helping people instead of doing paperwork. What a concept! It would be a FAR more efficient system. As I said in the vid, people just need to do their own homework and learn for themselves.

[uche007us]

ok, I have done my homework and even you will agree with this flaw with single payer.

My problem is that it gives me no responsiblity for taking care of myself. Why stop smoking when the am going to be covered everytime all the time.

What i would really like is some form of co-pay or even rebate system to give people an incentive to take care of their health. This is the real reason why i over eat at the buffets, its very hard to turn down a free lunch.

[jperryam]

I do agree there should be some kind of measure of personal responsibility. I don't mean to suggest that single payer would be perfect coming out of the gate, but it would be FAR better than what we have now. The first thing we need to do is get our reps to start representing us instead of the insurance lobby.

[uche007us]

Ok then i think single payer can work with the enough checks and balance put in place because if its anything like medicare this country is finished.

[jperryam]

You're not paying attention, shooter. This is not a pro-Obama video. Please watch the video and read my previous response to you again, and check out the link that explains the difference between his "public option" and a REAL single payer plan. You're just muddying the waters, which doesn't help at all.

[jperryam]

Sorry, shooter. Not a lie. Check out the December 2007 AP/Yahoo poll. Adopting a real single payer system would not "screw over 250 million people". It would make sure everybody is covered, with free choice of docs and hospitals. Please check out the Nick Skala link in the video info for the difference between Obama's "public option" and a REAL single payer system. Apparently you failed to grasp that this is not a pro-Obama video.

[FriedDaisy]

How is it that people can't see the difference between an insurance company & a hospital?

Doctors, hospitals, & other health care facilities will not sign themselves over to the government if we expand medicaid to cover those who can't afford health care insurance. We'll still have choice.

What does it say about us as a nation, one of the richest, when we allow 1/6 of the population to be marginalized by denying them a living wage & some kind of basic health care coverage? It's embarrassing.

[KamikazeKoscki]

This country needs an Ass Kicking, I can not believe that I have been in litigation now for 7 years of hell, all because my former employer who hired Auther Anderson to due the books cooked the books, and I have to pay all the legal fees and support myself without any money. fuck this country and it's policies, I am ready for the Militia, overthrowing the corrupt evil elites and restoring the Constitution, whats left with it.

[MacroTraficante]

how bout busting an Iran and hitting the streets...o yeah you need a permit to hit the streets in the land of the free......

[klard]

shooterca51: People need to wuit being selfish and do what is right. I have insurance coverage and I support the single payer system. My second job is also in a medical bill collection office, so i would loose that job. If I were selfish I would oppose single payer. But I do what is right, not just what benefits me.

[medicatedsaint]

Give me proof that the majority doesn't.

[Y3rMawm]

Show me proof that they do.

I sure as hell don't.

[jperryam]

December 2007 AP/Yahoo poll: 54% consider themselves supporters of single payer, 65% say the U.S. should adopt a universal system where everybody is covered.

[medicatedsaint]

Hard to see things you don't want to. Have you asked around? Looked around? Talked to people besides possibly saying they don't(your friends at work and play don't count). I see both sides those that say no for what ever reason they see about it and those that say yes for what ever reasons they observe.

[Y3rMawm]

Perhaps you might heed your own words :)

Again...dispassionately:

A) Math says we cannot afford less than what we spend as a nation now.

B) Monopoly is not a natural state of any market, and only breeds inefficiency. Single payer is monopoly.

C) A majority in favor of anything only means something in a Democracy, which we are NOT.

D) I do indeed cross paths with many walks of life in my line of work. My queries show the opposite of the AP/Yahoo propaganda.

[polidic]

I don't know what world you live in but it has nothing to do with facts. I find a lot of humor in this country not being a democracy. That's classic I like that one. Not formed as one no but it is now and it is Tyranny by majority - I don't like it anymore then you do but it's reality.

You are looking at a corporate monopoly now and the math says we can't afford not to.

[medicatedsaint]

"Perhaps you might heed your own words :)"

That was said with passion. Obviously, I hit a bone. :D

A) More nothing of nothing.

B) More pandering and money to inefficiency in the private market.

C) Yes, since we're like Rome lets vote you in as Caesar. We all know how well one entity rules over the many worked in history, don't me, lol. Interesting how I this subject never came up when Bush was in office.

D) Stop lying.

[medicatedsaint]

Edit: "many worked in history, don't me"

is actually "...don't we, lol."

[polidic]

Poll: 73% of Voters Think Health Care Reform Must Include Choice of a Public Health Insurance Plan, huffington post.

Minnesota Medicine Magazine, Poll of Minnesota Physicians, "Of 390 physicians, 64% favored a single-payer system.

Fact is the White House is blowing off the polls because the are in favor of single payer.

TON of polls show Americans favor single payer.

[Y3rMawm]

Only a Democracy if WE allow it. Why should we allow it? They ALWAYS END....very BADLY.

You are spreading disinformation. A correct statement would be that 73% of HuffPo's (socially liberal..libs wont admit it though) readership are pro-SP. This in no way constitutes a majority of the US. Only a majority of HuffPo sheeple.

Enjoy your gubmint opiates

[polidic]

You are a little late pal - the Government that controls you calls it Democracy too. You're not going to see anyone stand up and change it or it would have happened quite some time ago.

You have a lot of nice little labels to place on things I guess that makes life convenient for you so you can take out what stats you like but the people in this country are very pro single payer. What really shows eternal ignorance is condemnation before investigation.

[jperryam]

Y3rMawm: As I pointed out to you just a few posts before this one: December 2007 AP/Yahoo poll: 54% support single payer, and 65% say the U.S. should adopt a universal system that covers everybody...

[seamoremonster]

Well said John. The US is well behind civilized and develped countries in health care, education and a number of other social services. Yes, John, it's time to get off our ass and write our representatives.

[Azzaiel]

i don't get it either ... Barry-O really wants this also.

i mean his mother died .. this is a holy war for him, i don't get it.

[uche007us]

I still dont undertsand what it means by sngle payer. Who is the single payer and why does it matter if its universal insurance?

[jperryam]

The single payer is the government. It's basically an expansion of Medicare (which currently covers seniors) to cover everybody (universal). The money comes out of your paycheck, just like social security. BUT: No more premiums, deductibles, co-pays or bills, and employers would no longer have to provide health insurance. Imagine what that savings will do for business and economic growth! What we have now is a broken system with 1300 payers (insurance companies) motivated solely by profit.

[navtel]

face it Jperryam, people don't want to know, they prefer to see things in a better light.. soon however that light may go out.

[bigbono12]

Every psychologist will attest: the first reaction to any bad situation is DENIAL. America is in this Denial Phase. It is the most primtive of all reactions. Since it negates the problem and its gravity it prevents one's working for a correct solution. Obama is being used to give false hope, false because the correct but painful solutions to America's problems are unwanted by those who control the economy. Obama wants a compromise with this evil. Any compromise with this evil is still EVIL.

[johnnydigital77]

You hit this one on the nail, I don't think anyone could have said this better,.