Fun Fact - The news paper that has Toby on it- - - there is a clipping of it hanging in Toby's office that his father looks at in season 4/5 I believe. :)
The arrogance of power fully demonstrated in this scene. Two ordinary Americans, trying to do their job, get assaulted with the full weight of the Federal Government's Executive. What is good about that, ho is this inspiring? This is the strong bearing down on the weak, and enjoying it. Even back in the days of Hamurabbi, people knew that was wrong. (read the epilogue).
a) The cops didn't just do their job. They made a mistake, a mistake which unfortunately usually doesn't have bad consequences. But this time they ran out of luck and it HAD bad consequences.
b) The "strong" weren't abusing their power. They used it to do the right thing. The only difference compared to a regular cop-lawyer interaction is that Sam and Toby don't have to threaten the cops with using the courts (= the power of the state), since they already have that kind of power.
@Aristodama HAHAHAHAHA idiot. They're just concerned with getting Mendoza out, since they know for a fact he wasn't drunk. Also, they're a tad pissed at the cops because it's fairly obvious Mendoza was targeted as a hispanic, even though they don't have proof.
@Aristodama :If the Police had been just "trying to do their job", Justice Mendoza would never have been arrested in the first place - You might spare a thought for ordinary people (in real life) who aren't lucky enough to have the Cavalry arrive and save them from bigotry and arrogance. Anyone can end up on the receiving end - One day, it might even be YOU...
PLEASE DONT READ THIS!!!!U WILL GET KISSED ON THE NEAREST POSSIBLE FRIDAY BY THE LOVE OF UR LIFE. 2MORROW WILL BE THE BEST DAY OF UR LIFE.HOWEVER IF U DONT POST THIS COMMENT TO ATLEAST 3 VIDEOS U WILL DIE IN 2 DAYS.NOW UV STARTED READIN THIS SO DONT STOP NOW!THIS IS SOOO SCARY.SEND THIS TO ATLEAST 5 VIDEOS IN 143 MINUTES WHEN UR DONE PRESS F6 AND UR CRUSSHES NAMEWILL APPEAR ON THE SCREEN IN BIG LETTERS THIS IS SOO SCARY CUZ IT ACTUALLY WORKS!!!!!
@nicklebackfan Don't waste your time, nick....Srd is not worth it. Just let him continue in his Fox News induced semi vegetative state completely devoid of logic, reasoning or empathy. And get a good laugh whenever he goes on one of his right wing tirades. He's just parroting Beck, Hannity, Limbaugh, etc. He really doesn't know any better.
@Srd1126 Have you ever been stopped by law enforcement simply because of the color of your skin? I have. The tone used on these racist police officers was totally warranted. They stopped a Supreme Court Nominee because he LOOKED like trouble and then tried their darndest to violate his constitutional rights. Happens all the time. But in your narrow Fox News driven Universe, it doesn't. I am not even sure why I am trying to educate you....On second thought, just keep watching Fox.
@golfnut1220 I've been stopped by cops for behavior they wanted to check out. When that happens you answer "yes, officer, no, officer." You don't come off with an attitude that because you are black, brown, polka-dot, etc that you couldn't have been doing anything wrong. Just like that smartmouth professor in MA who said "your mother" when asked to show ID after someone saw him breaking into his home. Had he politelyu showed ID it would have been over. You are very racist towards whites.
@Srd1126 Thanks. I really needed that laugh. Fox-ites crack me up. I see that you have learned the rules very well: 1) Blame the victim. It must be their fault somehow. No law enforcement officer ever responds out of their own bigotry and 2) Accuse everyone else of bigotry. If you can accuse everyone else of bigotry (even if there is absolutely no documentation or proof of said bigotry) the accuser gets to feel better about their OWN bigotry. Ahhhh, Hannity and Beck have trained you well.
@golfnut1220 1. If a cop pulls someone over and the person smart-mouths first thing then it is indeed their fault; 2. The left are the ones who cry "racism" when someone even mentions the term "blacdk hole" or "niggardly." I'm watching Hannity right now as a matter of fact--I like intelligent TV.
@Srd1126 Those cops deserved the smack-down they got in this episode. They should be fortunate that their precinct wasn't sued for millions of dollars or that they didn't lose their jobs. Cops that behave this way don't deserve their badges or uniforms.
@nicklebackfan Cops that behave like what? Doing their job? While I realize we even have a real POTUS that thinks all cops are racist, the truth is the oppisite. Too many minorities think everything is racism and don't realize the cops had a valid reason to stop them. Then they get smart-mouth and force the cops to escalate it. Just look at that professor in MA last year for an example.
you're lagging 7 months behind. I assume I was referring either to the black professor who was arrested for being in his own house or the latino supreme court judge.
I think they could have stretched this out for a two part episode by extending Toby and Sam's trip to Conneticut(sp?). Toby had some classic lines during that trip.
"We've been navigating off the north star which turned out to be the Delta shuttle from La Guardia. It's a wonder we're not in Nantucket."
@beeb1421 The West Wing is so awesome and so much better than anything else on television that it's hard to pick one episode over another. But "Two Cathedrals" was one of the better episodes, as was "Celestial Navigation".
racial profiling is wrong a lot of the time. there are certain times when it is ok. but pulling someone over because of their race is not ok....at all....maybe you need to have your head examined.
In Australia almost every time you get pulled over by the police - whether its a routine stop, road worthy check, speeding, running a red light or simply a random stop - you get tested for alcohol. Nobody claims, thinks by saying no its a massive stand 'against the system'. Its simply good road safety. I think Americans need to get a life sometimes.
I would assume that given he was a nominee as a supreme court judge who plainly knew his rights, that he was making a point by not taking the test. if for no reason to highlight the waste of time racial profiling is.
Technically Australian citizens have far less rights than American citizens. Our major current defense is that we're pursuant to the UN Declaration of Human Rights which is pretty weak compared to their Bill of Rights.
All in all, I don't know what I'm talking about and you probably know even less than me so we should both shut up.
No, no, no. Our rights are clearly spelled out in the constitution. We have three of them. The first is the right to religion. The second is the right to free trade between states. The third I'll let you look up...
But never let it be said we have no rights, because those rights are written in the constitution, the original constitution that proclaimed the federated commonwealth of Australia in 1901.
I know, right to trial by Jury. (and also right to vote and just compensation from the Commonwealth for properties taken).
That's far from comprehensive compared to the UN declaration of Human Rights and very far from what most people would have in mind when they think intrinsic and inalienable human rights.
I know, I love how the Constitutional Convention was more concerned with colony/state rights in comparison with the new Commonwealth than they were with the citizens...
But a lot of things were just assumed to be honest. Like the fifth amendment was already an assumed centuries old common law right when our constitution was written. So it's not like we ACTUALLY have less rights than Americans.
You kept stats on how often he got pulled over? Did he get tickets? I know folks of all races who get stopped a lot. Why? Because they can't drive well and they commit violations.
While I disagree with david13721, and disagree with racial profiling, I am pretty sure this scene qualifies as Obstruction of justice. He was charged with a crime, wrongly it's true, for it to be a just outcome he should be found innocent by the court. As it is they used political power to force an elected sheriff to drop charges. Two wrongs don't really make a right. Now the sheriff can't be prosecuted for perjuring himself
Well being white and from a white neighborhood in suburban CA I can tell you that the 1 black family in our neighborhood made more money them my two programmer parents and so when their son Will drove home in his sweet 16 Lexus he got pulled over at least once a month. The crime? Driving while black...it IS getting old, maybe it is time for the police to stop doing it.
I wish they would have shown the line where Sam explains to the Sgt that Mendoza couldn't have possibly been pulled over for driving drunk because if he would have "consumed enough alcohol to blow .10 he would be dead right now." (Based on Mendoza's health condition.)
Well since HeeHaw and Dukes of Hazzard are off the air, I guess you don't have much left to watch, do you hillbilly? You ignorant rednecks crack me up.
Oh yeah, DWH, I was a criminal defense lawyer in Connecticut for many years. There's a identical offense, also well known in certain areas, DWB-Driving while Black.
It's been a long time but i think it was because he was a couple miles over the speed limit and they pulled him over. That's usually not enough to arrest someone but the arresting officer was racist and the judge was hispanic. Or something like that.
He was driving perfectly and just got pulled over for no reason. He refused the breathalyzer because he knew he wasn't drinking or doing anything wrong. He has a liver problem so that if he even drank enough to be over the legal limit he'd be dead. So he obviously was just pulled over for being Hispanic.
HEY! FUCK! We found it!
3113cj 2 weeks ago
Fun Fact - The news paper that has Toby on it- - - there is a clipping of it hanging in Toby's office that his father looks at in season 4/5 I believe. :)
bsgtrekfan88 1 month ago
Yeah Rob, leave this show for Dr. Vegas.Smart move.
thewaitingape 1 month ago
Toby: Shut up.
frankrizzo51 2 months ago
fucking awesome writing, scene, acting
jillhbaudhaan 2 months ago
@jillhbaudhaan Seriously! Has anyone seen a show since with this quality writing? I haven't!
pippinfett 2 months ago
I sometimes wish I could speak to people that way and know that they will listen
not out of fear but because they have no choice.
bornbillsmith 3 months ago
This is my favorite episode!
grobangirl1990 4 months ago
When that cop looked up after seeing Toby's picture, Toby should have said "yeah..That's me asshole.
TheFrogger15 5 months ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
WATCH,'`THE;.;FULL';'TV.;.SHOW'.'ONLINE,`;
WWW.STREAMTVR9X.TK
GO.'.TO,;,THE''.URL.,;
SabelineBarzilla 8 months ago
@0:52 translation: I'm not fucking around Fife, get off your ass and get your boss.
drbayoms 8 months ago 5
I LOVE, LOVE Celestial Navigation. One of my favorites.
MoRo07 9 months ago
I love this episode!
exp9r 10 months ago
I have every episode, who wants me to upload some and see how long it lasts.
dukestt 10 months ago
2 dislikes? Why would you dislike this? Favorite episode, celestial navigation.
ionabuss 1 year ago
@ionabuss The two cops
crazedmongoose2003 7 months ago
"Two lawyers walk into a police station..."
cshubs 1 year ago 23
I think Sam snuck in an F-Bomb there.
arbitterm 1 year ago 2
That is just awesome. Before I die, I want to be able to say, you better get that ...it will be the Governor of Connecticut.
elementalpuck 1 year ago 2
The arrogance of power fully demonstrated in this scene. Two ordinary Americans, trying to do their job, get assaulted with the full weight of the Federal Government's Executive. What is good about that, ho is this inspiring? This is the strong bearing down on the weak, and enjoying it. Even back in the days of Hamurabbi, people knew that was wrong. (read the epilogue).
Aristodama 1 year ago
@Aristodama
a) The cops didn't just do their job. They made a mistake, a mistake which unfortunately usually doesn't have bad consequences. But this time they ran out of luck and it HAD bad consequences.
b) The "strong" weren't abusing their power. They used it to do the right thing. The only difference compared to a regular cop-lawyer interaction is that Sam and Toby don't have to threaten the cops with using the courts (= the power of the state), since they already have that kind of power.
Praiosrondra 1 year ago
@Aristodama : It must be awful to live in Connecticut if a peace officer's job is to detain people for Driving While Hispanic.
Even if it is, they ought to have the full weight of the federal government fall on them.
jalindquist 1 year ago
@Aristodama HAHAHAHAHA idiot. They're just concerned with getting Mendoza out, since they know for a fact he wasn't drunk. Also, they're a tad pissed at the cops because it's fairly obvious Mendoza was targeted as a hispanic, even though they don't have proof.
grumpytosnowwhite 1 year ago
@Aristodama :If the Police had been just "trying to do their job", Justice Mendoza would never have been arrested in the first place - You might spare a thought for ordinary people (in real life) who aren't lucky enough to have the Cavalry arrive and save them from bigotry and arrogance. Anyone can end up on the receiving end - One day, it might even be YOU...
captnswing 1 year ago 6
This has been flagged as spam show
PLEASE DONT READ THIS!!!!U WILL GET KISSED ON THE NEAREST POSSIBLE FRIDAY BY THE LOVE OF UR LIFE. 2MORROW WILL BE THE BEST DAY OF UR LIFE.HOWEVER IF U DONT POST THIS COMMENT TO ATLEAST 3 VIDEOS U WILL DIE IN 2 DAYS.NOW UV STARTED READIN THIS SO DONT STOP NOW!THIS IS SOOO SCARY.SEND THIS TO ATLEAST 5 VIDEOS IN 143 MINUTES WHEN UR DONE PRESS F6 AND UR CRUSSHES NAMEWILL APPEAR ON THE SCREEN IN BIG LETTERS THIS IS SOO SCARY CUZ IT ACTUALLY WORKS!!!!!
Triggerz12234 1 year ago
The look on the faces of those police officers was priceless! They were seeing their careers flash before their eyes.
nicklebackfan 1 year ago
@nicklebackfan Don't waste your time, nick....Srd is not worth it. Just let him continue in his Fox News induced semi vegetative state completely devoid of logic, reasoning or empathy. And get a good laugh whenever he goes on one of his right wing tirades. He's just parroting Beck, Hannity, Limbaugh, etc. He really doesn't know any better.
golfnut1220 1 year ago 3
haha
lordhargreaves 1 year ago
god i love sam and how articulate he is, every sentence owns the person he's talking to
giftedgiggsy 1 year ago
Typical arrogant liberal the way he talked down to those cops.
Srd1126 1 year ago
@Srd1126 Have you ever been stopped by law enforcement simply because of the color of your skin? I have. The tone used on these racist police officers was totally warranted. They stopped a Supreme Court Nominee because he LOOKED like trouble and then tried their darndest to violate his constitutional rights. Happens all the time. But in your narrow Fox News driven Universe, it doesn't. I am not even sure why I am trying to educate you....On second thought, just keep watching Fox.
golfnut1220 1 year ago
@golfnut1220 I've been stopped by cops for behavior they wanted to check out. When that happens you answer "yes, officer, no, officer." You don't come off with an attitude that because you are black, brown, polka-dot, etc that you couldn't have been doing anything wrong. Just like that smartmouth professor in MA who said "your mother" when asked to show ID after someone saw him breaking into his home. Had he politelyu showed ID it would have been over. You are very racist towards whites.
Srd1126 1 year ago
@Srd1126 Thanks. I really needed that laugh. Fox-ites crack me up. I see that you have learned the rules very well: 1) Blame the victim. It must be their fault somehow. No law enforcement officer ever responds out of their own bigotry and 2) Accuse everyone else of bigotry. If you can accuse everyone else of bigotry (even if there is absolutely no documentation or proof of said bigotry) the accuser gets to feel better about their OWN bigotry. Ahhhh, Hannity and Beck have trained you well.
golfnut1220 1 year ago
@golfnut1220 1. If a cop pulls someone over and the person smart-mouths first thing then it is indeed their fault; 2. The left are the ones who cry "racism" when someone even mentions the term "blacdk hole" or "niggardly." I'm watching Hannity right now as a matter of fact--I like intelligent TV.
Srd1126 1 year ago
@Srd1126 Those cops deserved the smack-down they got in this episode. They should be fortunate that their precinct wasn't sued for millions of dollars or that they didn't lose their jobs. Cops that behave this way don't deserve their badges or uniforms.
nicklebackfan 1 year ago
@nicklebackfan Cops that behave like what? Doing their job? While I realize we even have a real POTUS that thinks all cops are racist, the truth is the oppisite. Too many minorities think everything is racism and don't realize the cops had a valid reason to stop them. Then they get smart-mouth and force the cops to escalate it. Just look at that professor in MA last year for an example.
Srd1126 1 year ago
Little too smarmy
cjrubbish 1 year ago
Toby's face at 1:06 is simply priceless
Blackhawk145 2 years ago 5
I seriously miss this show.
DeltaComp 2 years ago 62
@DeltaComp
Watch, The Wire, The Sopranos or Breaking Bad and you'll be just fine.
Reqrezentin 1 year ago
@Reqrezentin Yeah, The Sopranos was a brilliant show, but The West Wing, at it's best, was THE best :)
captnswing 1 year ago
@DeltaComp good thing the dvd's been invented
I have it on practically everyday
Kasino80 2 weeks ago
maaaannn imagine how shit scared the cops felt hahahaha
crazedmongoose2003 2 years ago 2
And TODAY it becomes relevant again as the West Wing writing is played out on the media.
ReX342 2 years ago
REX342
> TODAY it becomes relevant again as
> the West Wing writing is played out on the media.
Huh?
gagothesith 1 year ago
you're lagging 7 months behind. I assume I was referring either to the black professor who was arrested for being in his own house or the latino supreme court judge.
ReX342 1 year ago
1 The real-life Sotomayor was never treated like a criminal for being Latino.
2 The character Mendoza was not mistaken for someone who was breaking into a car/a house which turned out to be owned by him.
gagothesith 1 year ago
as far as you know :p
No, seriously, I have no idea what I was referring to over half a year ago.
ReX342 1 year ago
NP
Have a good weekend.
gagothesith 1 year ago
I think they could have stretched this out for a two part episode by extending Toby and Sam's trip to Conneticut(sp?). Toby had some classic lines during that trip.
"We've been navigating off the north star which turned out to be the Delta shuttle from La Guardia. It's a wonder we're not in Nantucket."
airdriver 2 years ago 7
Great, great episode. Toby pwns. Sam = awesome.
grumpytosnowwhite 2 years ago 2
this is one of my favorite episodes of all time.
celestial navigation, sam is the best.
HotPiratesWench 2 years ago 3
Celestial Navigation = best. episode. ever
jimbobjimminy 2 years ago 5
i thought "two cathedrals" was the best.
beeb1421 2 years ago
@beeb1421 The West Wing is so awesome and so much better than anything else on television that it's hard to pick one episode over another. But "Two Cathedrals" was one of the better episodes, as was "Celestial Navigation".
nicklebackfan 1 year ago
Toby looks like such a badass in this scene!
LuxLisbon79 3 years ago 7
are you idiots really argueing the legal points of a traffic stop...on a television program.
anybody that thinks racial profiling does not exhist....needs to go on a ride-along with the local PD.
anybody that thinks its wrong....also needs to go on a ride along with the local PD.
there is a real world out there, shut off the computers and check it out.
bigrob981 3 years ago
racial profiling is wrong a lot of the time. there are certain times when it is ok. but pulling someone over because of their race is not ok....at all....maybe you need to have your head examined.
bronxbomber428 2 years ago 3
What is it exactly that Sam says when Toby spots the police station? I always thought it sounded like "Hey! F*@K!"
Technosquid 3 years ago 2
Me too.
What does he actually say??
SoapStar4Life 3 years ago
Look.
theforeman118 3 years ago 4
I think it's "Hey! Look!" ;)
alfirin737 2 years ago 3
In Australia almost every time you get pulled over by the police - whether its a routine stop, road worthy check, speeding, running a red light or simply a random stop - you get tested for alcohol. Nobody claims, thinks by saying no its a massive stand 'against the system'. Its simply good road safety. I think Americans need to get a life sometimes.
Billy24Luke8 3 years ago
we have lives. if you want to be a sheep, move to new zealand.
pbl1 3 years ago
I would assume that given he was a nominee as a supreme court judge who plainly knew his rights, that he was making a point by not taking the test. if for no reason to highlight the waste of time racial profiling is.
MJStone1974 2 years ago 3
Technically Australian citizens have far less rights than American citizens. Our major current defense is that we're pursuant to the UN Declaration of Human Rights which is pretty weak compared to their Bill of Rights.
All in all, I don't know what I'm talking about and you probably know even less than me so we should both shut up.
crazedmongoose2003 2 years ago
No, no, no. Our rights are clearly spelled out in the constitution. We have three of them. The first is the right to religion. The second is the right to free trade between states. The third I'll let you look up...
But never let it be said we have no rights, because those rights are written in the constitution, the original constitution that proclaimed the federated commonwealth of Australia in 1901.
Not in some afterthought "Bill of"...
Prod1Kh 2 years ago
I know, right to trial by Jury. (and also right to vote and just compensation from the Commonwealth for properties taken).
That's far from comprehensive compared to the UN declaration of Human Rights and very far from what most people would have in mind when they think intrinsic and inalienable human rights.
crazedmongoose2003 2 years ago
I know, I love how the Constitutional Convention was more concerned with colony/state rights in comparison with the new Commonwealth than they were with the citizens...
Prod1Kh 2 years ago
But a lot of things were just assumed to be honest. Like the fifth amendment was already an assumed centuries old common law right when our constitution was written. So it's not like we ACTUALLY have less rights than Americans.
crazedmongoose2003 2 years ago
This is one of my favorite scenes from the whole series.
twoac 3 years ago 2
You kept stats on how often he got pulled over? Did he get tickets? I know folks of all races who get stopped a lot. Why? Because they can't drive well and they commit violations.
david13721 3 years ago
While I disagree with david13721, and disagree with racial profiling, I am pretty sure this scene qualifies as Obstruction of justice. He was charged with a crime, wrongly it's true, for it to be a just outcome he should be found innocent by the court. As it is they used political power to force an elected sheriff to drop charges. Two wrongs don't really make a right. Now the sheriff can't be prosecuted for perjuring himself
NoirMusic 3 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Ah yes ... the white police are the enemy and all minorites stopped by them must be innocent. Getting old.
david13721 3 years ago
Well being white and from a white neighborhood in suburban CA I can tell you that the 1 black family in our neighborhood made more money them my two programmer parents and so when their son Will drove home in his sweet 16 Lexus he got pulled over at least once a month. The crime? Driving while black...it IS getting old, maybe it is time for the police to stop doing it.
NoirMusic 3 years ago 6
"You should get that, that's going to be the Governor of Connecticut."
haha! That great.
sunnchilde 3 years ago 75
I wish they would have shown the line where Sam explains to the Sgt that Mendoza couldn't have possibly been pulled over for driving drunk because if he would have "consumed enough alcohol to blow .10 he would be dead right now." (Based on Mendoza's health condition.)
theshark1 3 years ago 6
is that sgt mcnamara?
SuperFantastich1884 3 years ago
i love it when the phone rings.
"that's gonna be the gov. of connecticut"
aknowneemus 3 years ago 4
what season was this, i've watched all seven seasons but cant remember which one this is from.
JT4000 3 years ago
1st season.
I can't say for sure but it's like episode 16 or something.
Kelseyshuan 3 years ago
@Kelseyshuan celestial navigation
DontPanicYet99 1 year ago
@Kelseyshuan 15
72Isaacblue 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
.I remember this.
chrissline77 7 months ago
it's from the episode celstial navigation from season 1
cortalis 3 years ago 4
@JT4000
Season 1 - Episode 9 - THE SHORT LIST.
PeterFormaini 1 year ago
@JT4000
CORRECTION!!! SEASON 1 - EPISODE 16 - CELESTIAL NAVIGATION! (I was a bit too hasty before!) :D
PeterFormaini 1 year ago
@JT4000 name of the episode is Celestial Navigation
star3132 1 year ago
@JT4000 Season 1, Episode 15: Celestial Navigation
ahopper1985 1 year ago
@JT4000 "Celestial Navigation", season 1 episode 15. :)
karlhansbraut 1 year ago
@JT4000 its called celestial navigation
lemonNlime1000 1 year ago
Comment removed
chrissline77 7 months ago
@JT4000 It's Season One, Celestial Navigation
shapiror 6 months ago
@JT4000 it's from Celestial Navigation. S1E15.
preischl8 6 months ago
@JT4000 Its in Celestial Navigation. Good Episode!
LettersForFriends 6 months ago
best tv show...ever..well Dead Like me..comes close to...
Lookstwice 3 years ago
Sam was the best character!!
largetalons22 3 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
who tha hell watches the westwing cocksucker lol..
americaneagle1967 3 years ago
Well since HeeHaw and Dukes of Hazzard are off the air, I guess you don't have much left to watch, do you hillbilly? You ignorant rednecks crack me up.
psatm 3 years ago 6
Oh yeah, DWH, I was a criminal defense lawyer in Connecticut for many years. There's a identical offense, also well known in certain areas, DWB-Driving while Black.
jokr8790 4 years ago
He was pulled over for "driving while being hispanic"
mgkish742 4 years ago 5
Why was the judge arrested? I missed this episode
toyt100ota 4 years ago
It's been a long time but i think it was because he was a couple miles over the speed limit and they pulled him over. That's usually not enough to arrest someone but the arresting officer was racist and the judge was hispanic. Or something like that.
vintagefish921 4 years ago
He was driving perfectly and just got pulled over for no reason. He refused the breathalyzer because he knew he wasn't drinking or doing anything wrong. He has a liver problem so that if he even drank enough to be over the legal limit he'd be dead. So he obviously was just pulled over for being Hispanic.
skudplayr 3 years ago 10
"Shut up" Hahaha
yesmissjones 4 years ago 4