Celestion Blue AlNiCo VS Chinese Vox Blue Speakers

[IamNemoN01]

I use AC30 with Blues; but unfortunately (because I can't afford both) I would have to try both with my own tone/effects line, which is very overdriven; yet with extreme tightness and fidelity. Just listening to them like this doesn't give me a good gauge for how they will react with my setup/tone/feel. I may in fact [prefer] the tighter cleaner sound and feel of the 1st one, and then push with harder OD. Just my observation on what I know works for me. Though not useful to me - a cool video.

[melindagreenjeans]

Ok now I've calmed down a tad, it strikes me that the first amp is an AC30 and the second amp is the Brian May AC30 with the treble booster engaged. So that's not a fair comparision. Another thing is the Celestion factory in China is just that, a "Celestion" factory. They don't make anything but Celestions and they make them just like at Ipswitch, only it's a massive factory with much better quality control. England defect level 5%, China 0.1%. No bullshit! SO it's a better product now days.

[petermichalowski]

@melindagreenjeans No, the same amp have been used but first played over UK Celestion Blue. The second played over the Chinese Blue. But if you have a newer AC30 like the AC30C2X or AC30HW2X you the Chinese ones BUT with the correct cone.

[melindagreenjeans]

OMFG that is just outrageous. You buy a Vox and shell out the extra cash for the Blues and they're bloody fake crap. Hmmm fuck me.

[acdc126]

your microphone seems closer with a different angle in the second half, it could change the recording too much to judge

[fretbored1]

Are both speakers broken in? If not, new speakers of any kind tend to have more of those "icepick" type highs until that dope around the edge, and those fibers loosen up.

[petermichalowski]

@fretbored1 Yes. The Chinese about 2 years. I had another pair in the other AC30BM to compare with too + an extra pair UK Celestion in my other TBX.

[merseybeat1963]

I am an Anglophile...but to me second, ones sond better?

[jasonsoloist]

I am disappointed to know that CELESTION has BAD QC

[pntblnguitarists]

uk blues sound amazing!!

[vibroluxor]

Dang dude, your vibrato makes me seasick

[punkmusicmetal]

Dude... There is a very obvious difference in tone between the Chinese and UK built blue speakers. That said, in the heat of a show, probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference, but its obvious here side by side.

[mskcouric]

@punkmusicmetal How about in the recording studio?

[rw5791]

all vox blues have fuzz on the low end but the chinese ones take it too far.The chords are so garbled as to be unusable in distortion mode.

[ehowie]

Hi, is there a huge difference in sound between the UK & Chinese ones when the amp is played clean?

Also what about pedals like fuzz?

[petermichalowski]

@ehowie Hi, Yes I think it is about the same as I also hear the the same using an attenuator at bedroomlevel.

[ehowie]

@petermichalowski I have the chance to get an AC30CC2X for pretty cheap and I don't think I will be using the amps own drive, it will mainly be for clean tones, so its probably not worth swapping them out for UK blues?

Thanks for the fast reply by the way.

[petermichalowski]

@ehowie Try to find a CC2 and fit the UK blue. Stay out of the Chinese blue if you don´t for some reason like them

[ehowie]

@petermichalowski

Ok, thanks man.

[Zach0525]

@ehowie I have an AC30 with the Chinese blues and I also have a Divided by 13 with Celestion Alnico blues made in the UK. I would definitely go with the UK blues. The Chinese blues have an added fizz to them that I find highly undesirable.

[TheHog107]

Thank you very much for bring this to light! Too many people assume they are getting what they paid for. Sad that they chose to cut corners on an area so critical to the tone of an amp. I my opinion speakers are soo overlooked to the overall tone, which is ridiculas as they have such and important role in the final shaping of your tone. I have to shack my head at a company doing this. It all comes down to money

[petermichalowski]

@TheHog107 Thanks. Yes this is something I never thought would happen. But as you say, MONEY and cutting corners. Apperently the new Chinese blue atleast have the correct cone I´ve been told.

[oxidindigo]

@petermichalowski wait, so all celestion blues are made in china now, not just the vox "celestion" blues? if so, thats fucking weak. i can definitely hear a difference between the two, the chinese is fizzier, harsher. maybe i can find the uk's on ebay..

[petermichalowski]

@oxidindigo No. All Vox (Celestion) Blues are made in China. The CC range have the wrong cone but as I´ve heard the new AC30C2X have the correct cone BUT the speaker is still made in Chines with imported cone. Try to find the proper UKs

[oxidindigo]

@petermichalowski no, i know vox blues are chinese. i meant does celestion make their blues in china now as well? or are they still uk made? cause ive seen some conflicting info on it. on a side note, i wonder if the new vox blues with correct cone are just as good as the uk ones. or at least close. theyre probably much cheaper so i would be eager to test them out side by side.

[petermichalowski]

@oxidindigo The Vox Alnice Blues are made in China now and with the correct cone. Still Celestion makes the Blues in UK and these are the ones you´ll get if you buy the from ex Lean-Business.co.uk Funny enough it is cheaper to buy the AC30C2 and upgrade with UK Blues and buythem from Lean:-))

[oxidindigo]

@petermichalowski oh good, im definitely getting a vox for my next amp so thats good to know, thanks for the tip =)

[guyshocks]

@petermichalowski Hey peter, just wanted to say thanks for all your investigating into the issue. I spent a good few hours last night reading through every page on multiple forums you have contributed to, and they were all so long haha, but it was worth it! Just want to see if it was possible for you to do a new test of the new speakers :)... 

[GoldtopSam]

Will have a look. Cheers



[petermichalowski]

@GoldtopSam Also have a look at the Voxforum as Rich, the moderator there performed a test and came to the same result. This YT clip was just done to show this to my mates in the Brian May world/forums. Then it just was a subject for a discussion on many forums. But you know we also crank the amps all way up and push the amp with a treblebooster. But still with an attenuator you get the same result.

[GoldtopSam]

Also would have been better to view the speaker demo side by side with the different speakers being A/B'd. The first is just a pic of the control panel being shown, the second view, a pic of the rear of amp with no power cord plugged in. I'm skeptical when demos are done this way. Can't be sure if any settings were changed or if any outboard devices such as pedal were used or mic change or placement, if one was used, or if that was the actual amp being used. Not a convincing demo.

[petermichalowski]

@GoldtopSam If you have a look and search there is atleast one more guy that have perfomed a similar test like I did with soundclips. On the Vintage forum a guy reconed his Chinese with the H1777 and ..bingo. Look for a guy called Jay Filippone. Oh and Vox now use the H1777 cone in the AC30CS2Xs

[JayFilippone]

@petermichalowski

what about this guy named Jay Filippone, Peter? :-)

[petermichalowski]

@JayFilippone Hahaha Have you tried the new AC15CX?

[GoldtopSam]

The Vox labeled Blue is a Celestion, made in China. Celestion has moved most all manufacturing to China. Look at a new Greenback, or a new Vintage 30, it will say made in China on the box and speaker. I have a Vox V212BNX vintage cab with the Vox labeled Blue. Sounds fab. The cone is a little stiffer, so it required a bit more break-in, but it's there now. I use with the Vox AC30CCH head, retubed with NOS Amperex 12AX7s, Mullard El84s and a NOS Sylvania GZ34 rectifier. They do get smoother.

[petermichalowski]

@GoldtopSam Well it is a bit more complicated. The Chinese uses as you correctly say and I said all the time a different cone. My AC30BMs had been played with for about 2-3 years before I started modding these amps and found out this difference in sound. I also have brand new UK Blue that sound great straight out of the box. I´ve had the AC30BMs for approx 2-3 years now and the TBX´s almost 10

[SotR59]

To me there is no comparrison. The first part practically sounds like Brian May. The second part pales. Good playing on both but the first tone wins by a landslide. I just picked up a vintage Fender Bassman head. I have no cabinet and while researching what I might want I read about the Blue's, but even at Musician's Friend they $300 a pop. Rock Star prices.

[virgult]

I think you're too hard on these speakers; I've tried a brand new Vox AC15h1tv squeezing every inch out of it, and I think it's a very nice amp along with a very nice speaker, even without any break-in. Chinese Blues are unmistakably worse than UK ones, but you're talking about a huge difference that isn't really there IMHO.

[terryorr]

The chinese blue does have a Greenback-like bite. It is an "in your face" sound like a ceramic magnet. The sound of the chinese blue is not bad but not the classic blue sound. I have A/B'd several U.K Celestion speakers in the past and also have old 50's alnicos which the original blue was patterned after. The original Blue stays smooth even at extreme volume, never sharp or fizzy. I wonder if the Chinese speaker gets smoother with age ie; maybe it is a stiffer cone material.

[petermichalowski]

I doubt they will go smooter by age as the cone material is different.

[wkcchampion]

oh dear!!! Is there so much difference?

I have a VOX AC30CC2X... i've been conned then :(

Do you think that by putting UK real Blue alnicos it will sound like a TBX; or it's different (worse) anyway?

[petermichalowski]

It will make a difference BUT actually the Chinese cabs are a bit different sounding too. But atleast you get rid of the nasty fizzyness

[wkcchampion]

hi Pete, long tim since we last talked! How r u?

Argh this is serious. So, ahs the AC30BM the same problem? Then, how can I know if I'm buying the right speaker?

[petermichalowski]

I´m fine thanks? And you? You have to look for the cone code. If it has a H1777 stamp on the backside you know it is the correct one. And yes the AC30BMs have the same problems.

[wkcchampion]

Yeah fine, I'm working on a project for Ferrari ;)

Ah so I'm not bad!!! I've always suspsected that there was something not good with these new Voxes!

Did u get "the sound" by putting UK Blues on the AC30BM, or did u stick back to TBX, and perhaps modifying them to Brian's specs (removing the unused channels etc)?

[petermichalowski]

I havethe UK blue in my Fryer modded AC30BM and it was diring this mod I actually noticed this big difference in sound. WOW Ferrari

[wkcchampion]

Yes I'm working on a self-setting seat for the California.

Darn it. I just discoevered that my chinese VOX is bullsh*t. Wow. Good job. :( Pretty sad.

I noticed that the sounded too close to the Whaferdales, now I understand why. Sad :(:(:(

[petermichalowski]

I think the CCs are still ok but I´m sure you will enjoy the amp more with the proper UK Blue. You could also re-cone the Chinese. I had a report from a guy in Canada and after doing this it was more or less identic to the real UK

[wkcchampion]

Well indeed, this a a fraud.

They advertise the amps as having Celestion Blue alnicos, while they don't.

There should be an official protest for this. You pay an amp and you don't get what you've thought. This is criminal!

[petermichalowski]

Couldn´t agree more and I´ve been in contact with them and they more or less just ignore me. But my clip here speaks fro itself;-)

[wkcchampion]

It's weird, I've always thought, even when I had a BM type guitar and proper Treble booster (now I have 2 Parker Flys - lovely ^^) that there was some fizzyness when distorted. I thought it was the guitar. It was not then...

I also hear it using it with the Flys. It doesn't sound as warm as it should. It sounds more like a Greenback!

[petermichalowski]

The Chinese lacks of this warm midrage

[GeekG]

the chinese sound fizzy and lack bottom, they don't sound organic, sounds like a pedal or something, can't describe it. doesn't sound like tube. although we are comparing speakers.

[BMGStammer]

@wkcchampion wow, i never knew that

[peterm3964]

WGS Black and Blue

[spentonmediocrity]

And oh yeah...I can vouch for the Eminence Red Fangs...not exactly like a Celestion Blue but in the same ball park for sure.

They're allot cheaper(saw them around going for $150 new)and a nice speaker...a tiny tiny bit more "boxy" sounding than the CB but it also is a bit smoother in the mids and highs than the CB.They also take more power(50 watts)than the CB(15 watts)

Allot of good alternatives out there so that's good.

[peterm3964]

WGS Black and Blue #Will check em out . And a couple a red fangs too . Man that would look goood in a perspex quadbox

Yeehaa get along li'l doggies..

[spentonmediocrity]

(:

:)

[Tomcaster1]

Peter thanks to your research regarding those amazing amps!

[peterm3964]

I thought the BLUE was made only in england . I 've never heard of a chinese celestion blue speaker .

[petermichalowski]

I think there were many he thougt just like that. It´s a shame

[spentonmediocrity]

I believe the speaker name was licensed out to Korg(who makes Vox)because these speakers are branded "Vox" on the magnet bell and come with Chinese made Vox amps.

[peterm3964]

Hmmmmmm I always thought the BLUE was the flagship speaker and would only ever be made in ENGLAND ..

[spentonmediocrity]

Yes,partly.

The "Celestion Blue" *is* made in the UK.Celestion is the key word.

It's the "Vox blue" that is made in China.Vox is owned by Korg,who manufacture the amp and "Vox Blue" speakers in China.People often confuse the two.

You can spot the Chinese made Blue speakers because printed on the magnet label is "Vox".

[peterm3964]

That makes sense . I am glad I didn't fork out bigg dollars for the chinese ones . I wont call them junk , but i would have felt deceived if i had bought VOX blues , thinking they were CELESTION BLUES .

Hearin them side by side is a REAL surprise . They are VERY DIFFERENT SPEAKERS . I'll just stay with my MADE IN EGLAND GREENBACKS till I find a spare $1000 for a pair of CELESTION BLUES . Yeah like I'm gonna burn $1000 on a pair of speakers HA FUCKIN HA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[spentonmediocrity]

Greenbacks are nice speakers but I think they sound best in a closed back...real velvity tone.

If you want the depth,the sponginess you gotta go alnico.

I've been speaking with WGS Black and Blue owners and they claim THAT speaker beats the Celestion Blue or the Red Fang or Weber Blue Dog...almost identical tone to the Celestion but a tad "smoother" in the mids and treble.

They're expensive($225 new) but cheaper than the Celestion.

[blinedriver]

so the chinese blues feedback more? thats weird.

[Misiekcameraman]

I believe that it's matter od different frequencies given by the speakers and getting back to the guitar.

[petermichalowski]

Send me the pic and it will be a lot easier. But in general you see the H1777 stamped on the backside as shown on my clip. If the amp as a Vox made after 2004 like the CC or Heritage your speakers are 99% Chinese

[3Deity]

My God, what a difference! Great to see that someone did a before and after video! Just thinking about making a pair of cabinets for my living room with Celestion Golds. I was worried about the top end they have - I should have never doubted them! :o)

[Slammintone]

This comparison doesn't tell me jack. For one, the amp should have been adjusted to provide a cleaner crunch for both speakers, another thing is the amps should have both been running for an hour or so to warm up good and as was posted elsewhere, who know's which speaker was more broken in? That makes a big difference. Playing some dreadful chainsaw buzz distortion through the best guitar speaker ever made proves nothing.

[petermichalowski]

This test was done with the same amp at the same time. Break in time for the Chinese was approx 2 years and the UK about 4-5 years. I also have replaced the Chinese in one of my AC30BMs and they sound much like the other UKs straight out of the box. This is no joke

[Slammintone]

Well, then going by what you say I have to say the first part of the clip sounds a little more refined and less out of control and a bit smoother. But beyond that I had a Chinese Vox Blue in an AC15CC1X and it sounded pretty damn good and a damn site better than the Wharfedales I've heard in the regular AC15CC1 amps I played through. Thanks for the heads up, it appears the Vox Blues don't like a hammering blast of overdrive.

[petermichalowski]

The speakers are identic except for the cone and I just can´t understand WHY there are two different sounding speakers with the same name. But anyway the UKs are warmer sounding also on cleaner sounds

[OC44K]

Yes, we know about valve amps and how to use them.

It's not a distortion pedal it's a treble booster......not the same.

The Chinese are dreadful in comparison to the REAL UK made blues.

[petermichalowski]

Thanks. No I´ve just heard about the Weber blue. I still think the UK Celestion blue are the ones to go for.

[electricflag]

Awesome comparison! I'm definitely thinking about swapping my Wharfedale with a Celestion Blue, but the price is an issue. I've heard great things about the Eminence Red Fang, have you had any experience with it?

[snouter]

So is the consensus that purchasing something like the AC15CC1 along with an Eminence Red Fang better than AC15CC1X (Celestion alnico blue)?

[petermichalowski]

Probably

[Slammintone]

I agree, probably. You may even save money buying the amp and upgrading to a Celestion Blue later on. But having had an AC15CC1X I can tell you it' sounds pretty damn good as is and doesn't get overdriven that hard anyhow.

[petermichalowski]

Here in the Brian May world/sounds we use a Treble Booster and these push the amps hard. Approx 36dB. I think this might accenturate the difference more obvius but also when I roll back the volume of the guitar I clearly hear a difference too. I don´tsy the Chinese are crap but..different

[Blackdogli]

wow !

[spicbuddha]

the celestion alnico blues that the cc2x uses are still made in england, the awful Whafedale speakers that come with the cc2 models are chinese, so the title of this vid is not totally correct...

but it's not the chinese peoples fault, its the company for exacting such low quality standards...

[petermichalowski]

All of the Celestionspeakers in any Voxamps are made in China

[dimemax]

How would you compare the chinese one with Weber's Blue dog?

[petermichalowski]

I have never tried the Weber but my guess is that they are way better;-)

[OC44K]

The Chinese made speakers sound dreadful. Thanks for this comparison. Vox should know better than to use different/cheaper (?) materials in one of the most important speakers in the world.

[petermichalowski]

Thnaks. It is actually even more obvius standing infront of these speakers.

[bluesbird75]

Don't know about dreadful. Are the two recordings identical? Have the speakers had the same break in time? The Chinese Voxes are some of the most reliable of all time LOL

[EnTallrikPropaganda]

Hur mycket skiljde sig antalet speltimmar åt mellan dem? Det har ju ofta stor betydelse! Annars måste jag säga att skillnaden är ännu större än jag upplevd, när det gäller det båda nya elementen. Spännande!

[petermichalowski]

Tja! En svensk. Kul. Kinahögtalarna har gått rätt så hårt i ca:2 år och de in min TBX ca: 4 år. Köpte också nya UK Celstion blue och de låter mums i jämförelse direkt ur kartong och har nu gått 20-30 timmar och jag hör egentligen så samma sak där

[weare7R]

I contacted Warehouse speakers and suggested better sound samples because I would much rather see people's money go Warehouse,Weber VST or Eminence over the bloated Celestion global corporation who pays peanuts to outsourced workers while charging uncompetitive prices.

Screw Celestion.

This was an *excellent* sound sample and the other manufacturers should aggressively push great samples of their own.

Thanks for the post.

[mrcreeves]

Luckily, Celestion made blues are still english made.

[123frizzlefry]

I hear alot of difference between the Chinese and the UK made (cranked) speakers. but what about clean, is there more difference in sound when they're cranked than when they're clean. i'm considering to buy one of the two alnico blue's, but I use it only for clean. what's you're opinion about the difference clean??

[petermichalowski]

It is a differens there too. Even if I use my attenuators I do hear a big difference between these two

[123frizzlefry]

is there difference in warmth?

[petermichalowski]

They lack of this typical midrange warmth. The sound in general gets brighter. It may appeay to some of cuorse but if you´ve played and are use the the UK blues these are not the speakers for you

[123frizzlefry]

thanks, last question:

I was just thinkin, baybe I'll put both uk and chinese in my ac30, because then I don't have to choose and I always have two different sounds to get. do you think it is good if I put both speakers in one ac30, or will it be messy or something?

[petermichalowski]

Sound is a matter of taste. It can always be nice with two sounds but I guess I would go for greebacks instead,??

[HeartfeltDawn]

The Chinese Blues can't touch the UK ones in my opinion. Yes I have had and still have both. Thanks for putting this up and for contributing to that Vox thread. It's good to know they truly do sound different and have differences in how they are constructed.

[petermichalowski]

Thanks for your comment. It seems most people don´t believe this and I guess you have to try the same amp over these two speakers. Chinese adds a fizzy sound that I just don´t like.

[GroovyGuitar02]

alnico sounds richer and more organic .

but the chinese ones are interesting ...

[petermichalowski]

I think in many ways it is up to how you maby run your amp. But the key here is the cone that is not the H1777 cone. I have another clip here were I use a Tele with t.booster and sound is amazing with the proper blues. That´s the way I want it to be and this is not possible with the chinese ones

[Wilkinson767]

u dont like the chinese one i suppose.

but i prefer it in sound. as i said more clear.

maybe trying to change the valve too u can have a more pointed sound on it

[petermichalowski]

If you compare these for yourself you will most likely not like them. But soundideals is personal of cuorse. These lacks of warmth. I have 4 ACs and different valves in all now I think with same results really

[Wilkinson767]

not understood really:

the chinese are lack of warmth? its true for me but i think its a question of valves and depends on what u wanna do with your ampli. btw i think the chinese ones are made in this way to be more balanced on contemporary sond (better than old UK ones). The result is not perfect for me but if u work on bias and some other control u can have gr8 results. i feel them (chinese i mean) superior than fender mexico stuff

[petermichalowski]

Yes and you get a fizzy sound from then. I run my amps all way up on normal channel and with trebleboosters so they are hard driven for sure. Butthis amp gives a pretty poor bottom end to the sound.

[Wilkinson767]

i tryed it with different guitars and effects:

telecaster thinline 72 on clear sound is gr8, on mixed channel too

Gibson Es 335, on clean channel is amazing cuz the ampli give a sound clear respect the guitar (u know his sound is pretty warm)

with a Godin Solidac on acoustic version gives a good really sond, with the electric pick ups not so well.

a large part of sound is gived by effects. for example using a zoom 9150 with valve pre amp the sound gived is very good. but i need send and ret

[Wilkinson767]

to be honest i feel better the chinese one

more clear and pointed on sound.

[petermichalowski]

If you have the proper UK blues I´m more than happy to swap