Actually, it was a US Representative, Leo Ryan of California 11th district, not a US Senator, who was killed during his visit to Jonestown. Minor detail.
I read a book titled "Influence Science and Practice" by Robert Cialdini that discusses how Jones could possibly exert such phychological hold over his followers that would cause them to willingly drink poison and kill themselves.
@TabuuIntense There's also Puerto Rican-American José Luis de Jesús Miranda, who says he is Jesuschrist-Man. He preaches absolute liberty, you can do anything you please because Christ's (his) sacrifice was so great that every sin will be cleansed by him. You can delier yourself to fleshly affairs without fear of hell.
@eddygoombah His name is AJ Miller, and so far there isn't that much info about him other than some reports on A current Affair (which is a biased, useless, horrible news program) and christian websites complaining about how he is not the messiah.
What we do know however, is that he leads an apocalyptic cult called Divine Truth. Currently, he owns a secluded property and is living with about 40 followers there. I just hope nothing violent ever occurs there
I think the saddest thing about Jonestown is that the followers had such humanicstic intentions. They were sick of racial division. They shared with each other & everyone played a part in advancing their community. But what's sad is that they assumed they needed someone to follow in order to do this. They gave up their independent thought in exchange for a promise... a promise by a mere man. It's so sad. I heard the audio of the last days before they drank the kool aid. It's so sad.
Forgive me, if I'm wrong, but eventho his followers were people who followed a man without questioning, without reason and/of logic, I thought jim jones himself was an (open) atheist. He used the gullibility of the religious to get money to advance his own extreme communistic ideas
Not that this makes the part that religion plays in the death of these people any less. Just saying: monsters exist with and without religion
@Shangori wow, if that's true, he's an even bigger asshole than I thought he was. At first I thought it was a "No True Scotsman" argument. But Wikipedia says "By spring 1976, Jones openly admitted even to outsiders that he was an atheist." However, people close to him reported saying that he stopped believing in a loving God and that he was very much a christian. Regardless, the guy was evil.
In retrospect, the government bears just a little of the blame. If the impetus for the suicide was fear of the government, they really needed to be using military hostage retrieval tactics instead of going the hippie dippie route.
Jones was not anyone to be reasoned with or appeased. He needed to be sniped and his followers taken into military custody for debriefing and services.
Every time we eff around, these guys end up killing all their followers.
@zEropoint68 Jim Jone's followers were free to decide what they wanted to do with their lives. The government was helpless. If they sent troops into Guyana, there would have been cries that they were interfering with religious expression - in a foreign country, no less. Because of Jonestown, the government moved in on Waco. Damned if they don't and damned if they do.
US Congressman Leo Ryan was killed too as he tried to save citizens. IMHO - They did all they could.
You make great, intelligent videos- we miss them. I know you're a busy man but they are greatly appreciated. Please take time to contribute more to the atheist community here on You Tube. Thank you.
And still people think it's ok to blindly believe. They blame Jones rather than belief, people who don't apply critical thinking can easily be swayed by a charismatic leader professing "god's will". And still my friends and family wonder why a rail against religion and why I'm constantly trying to engage their minds through debate. They say I have no right to try and sway them away from their belief and faith. But I say, as a caring man, I have a duty to try and sway them from that faith.
@MrFamine69 I can relate to what you say, in fact I used to think exactly like you. But now as a former atheist (I'm a christian now), I don't think all forms of spiritual belief are blind, in fact at least in the Gospels there is a stress in criticizing "the doctrines of men" and discerning critically the truth of any leader judging "by their fruits." And nowhere is Jesus more virulent than when he criticizes the religious leaders of their time, but debate is a necessity, no doubt.
@BlackLaval All forms of spiritual faith are blind, that is the definition of faith. I doubt however that you used to think just like me else you wouldn't be a 'former' atheist you would be an atheist. Thanks for the reply though.
@BlackLaval I never understood how a REAL atheist could ever become a Christian, Muslim, Jew, or any of those religions that have extremely violent pasts, and many other tendencies of just horrific things, insane, outlandish, and downright fucking evil things in them... my favorite example is in Lev. 20:10, to paraphrase; If a man cheats on his wife they should BOTH be stoned to death. How could anyone who once supposedly saw the world rationally could follow such a dogma is beyond me, whatever.
@SturFriedBrains "Real" atheism? Nonsense, that sounds pretty religious to me: an atheist orthodoxy. In my case haven't embraced christian religion, but christian faith and, hopefully, way of life. Embraced Christ. Besides it seems you got the versicule wrong, it clearly says "both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death." And BTW it's not acceptable even in the non-"paraphrase" version, a famous passage in the Gospels (a late addition in fact) has Jesus preventing its application.
@BlackLaval in this "atheist orthodoxy" what are the rules? what are the obligations? what purpose does it serve? i am an atheist. do you know what that has told you about me? it has told you i don't believe in a god. that is all. it doesn't tell you my stance on anything else. it doesn't tell you if i am a democrat, libertarian, anarchist, or republican. it doesn't tell you if i am pro-choice (like dawkins) or pro-life (like hitchens). it doesn't tell you much at all.
@BlackLaval Sorry wrong word, the AVERAGE atheist would never go back to such a vile book as the bible, never... maybe JUST maybe in the middle of a major crisis, that's about it. and its is a generalization, but I just didn't get that. and getting to your "Jesus preventing its application" Jesus is his father right? 2 people or deities or what ever in 1 right? and Yahweh knows all right? so then why does he go back on his own word after he... makes him self from one earthly parent (genetics...)
@SturFriedBrains I don't think this is such a big question as the Bible is not infalible. Anyway, check out what happens in Exodus: the first Tables of the Law, written by Jehovah's fire were broken by Moses when he angered at the gold idol, then he himself made a new set. The first set is only the Ten Commandments, the second set is a bunch of cultural laws, so "technically" Jesus, when he opposed the stoning of the adulteress wasn't opposing his Father but the doctrine of one man called Moses.
What amazes me is that people's fear of enslavement can drive them to enslave themselves. They feared the CIA but didn't fear a man who told them to drink poison. The promise of heaven is a wet blanket over the fires of thought.
I was stationed at Dover AFB when the bodies were returned. Some of my friends helped to unload the bodies. I had stopped being a Fucktard before this event but I was very sympathetic for them and my other religious friends.
Great video, Eddy! I remember when I was a kid how this story had affected me, and made me cautious of anyone claiming divine knowledge! Thanks for re-actualizing it!
I wonder how fundie fucktards react when they are confronted with the reality that their faith is a tool of self-enslavement? Maybe, I'll just have to start asking! ;-)
People in these cults want to believe so much that even when they actually agree that without a shadow of doubt that they are wrong, they will continue to follow the cult. This is because they have invested so much emotion into it that the consequences of leaving it all behind and is devastating to them. It exists as their only support mechanism.
Yeah, I heard about this from seth's podcast. It's remarkable what power he had. He actually made almost a thousand people kill themselves on a really stupid lie... Wtf.
this is dogma's true face. the damage done by a lust for loosing yourself in emotion in place of rationality is only limited by how much you do it. and liking this video was very awkward.
@thinkingskeptic1 Now mental illness is a reality, people have malfunctioning regions of their brains, chemical imblances, enviromental and genetic pressures and influences that are out of their control. This is a fact. Like this Jim jones guy obviously shows signs of psychopathy, and the lack of empathy for others. But what I meant by insane is that normal people are so ignorant to basic reality, that they believe characters like this. This makes me worry about myspecies in general en masse.
@thinkingskeptic1 What I meant by insane, is ignorant to the point of acting like an insane person. One could argue, there is no "insanity", there is no "sanity". You can say the same thing about good and evil, they are just concepts. But with in society, we have come up with normalities, which are codes of conducts and bahviours that constitute sanity, social, anti social behaviour, good and bad, in regards to a functioning fair society. We are still a primitive species, and it shows.
@PinkProgram I feel you, but the silver lining is we have in us the ability to be so much more, we act like psychotic apes, when we could be the complete opposite.
@proofandevidence I'm lucky I don't have the same compulsion to act like a psychotic ape ;3 I'll just keep showing humans how to improve and upgrade themselves and maybe one day the monkeys will actually listen ;D
@PinkProgram lol, haha, it almost seems sometimes that there is a species with in our own species, like we are all human beings, but some are so fucking stupid, they are like monkeys, and some are so in the know, and open minded its like they are another fucking species entirely. Think about it, we still enjoy watching each other beat each other in the face causing permanent brain damage in a ring (boxing for example), like that is fucking primitive. What a god damned world...
@proofandevidence homo sapiens atavus breeds faster than homo sapiens sapiens too so you never have a shortage of monkeys... or darwin award winners ;3
@PinkProgram I copied the term h.s.adavus from your message and it appeared in my search bar for google and your vid came up on it haha, wow, I forgive you for copying my thoughts traveling back in time and making a video about them lol, mind fuck.
that cia hoax hobama is the new jim jones/hitler!!!
ask his blind black racist sheeple/nazis
shame!!!!!!!
aliciabanks 1 week ago in playlist Favorite videos
Resurrect him. Torture him. Kill him again. Repeat this for every single life he stole.
I know this may seem somehow ignorant but at the moment, I cannot see past my anger and hatred of this douchebag.
Viper4382 1 week ago
The power of Faith.
richo61 1 week ago
Actually, it was a US Representative, Leo Ryan of California 11th district, not a US Senator, who was killed during his visit to Jonestown. Minor detail.
ApolloWasReal 1 month ago
And still ppl ask me every day why I fight religion............
SoEFleX 1 month ago
I, too, just found you through the Living Dinosaur...
TheDevoutCaffeinist 1 month ago
just got introduced to you by the Living Dinosaur. I'm looking forward to watching your back catalog of stuff :)
MrShannonite 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
I read a book titled "Influence Science and Practice" by Robert Cialdini that discusses how Jones could possibly exert such phychological hold over his followers that would cause them to willingly drink poison and kill themselves.
SmartmanChris 2 months ago
@SmartmanChris Some may have done it "willingly" but there were men armed with automatic rifles making certain they were willing.
The message was clear - drink "willingly" or be shot.
richo61 1 week ago
Religion is a natural home for psychos. Simple.
thereforeithought 4 months ago
@TabuuIntense There's also Puerto Rican-American José Luis de Jesús Miranda, who says he is Jesuschrist-Man. He preaches absolute liberty, you can do anything you please because Christ's (his) sacrifice was so great that every sin will be cleansed by him. You can delier yourself to fleshly affairs without fear of hell.
BlackLaval 4 months ago
@TabuuIntense woah. Do you know his name?
eddygoombah 4 months ago
@eddygoombah The guy's name is, Alan John Miller. His wife also says she is, Mary Magdalene! Right pair of nutters.
unixhead101 4 months ago
@eddygoombah His name is AJ Miller, and so far there isn't that much info about him other than some reports on A current Affair (which is a biased, useless, horrible news program) and christian websites complaining about how he is not the messiah.
What we do know however, is that he leads an apocalyptic cult called Divine Truth. Currently, he owns a secluded property and is living with about 40 followers there. I just hope nothing violent ever occurs there
Plausiblesarge 4 months ago
@eddygoombah "Jesus Christ".
lordshipmayhem 4 months ago
I think the saddest thing about Jonestown is that the followers had such humanicstic intentions. They were sick of racial division. They shared with each other & everyone played a part in advancing their community. But what's sad is that they assumed they needed someone to follow in order to do this. They gave up their independent thought in exchange for a promise... a promise by a mere man. It's so sad. I heard the audio of the last days before they drank the kool aid. It's so sad.
88Keyz101 4 months ago
Forgive me, if I'm wrong, but eventho his followers were people who followed a man without questioning, without reason and/of logic, I thought jim jones himself was an (open) atheist. He used the gullibility of the religious to get money to advance his own extreme communistic ideas
Not that this makes the part that religion plays in the death of these people any less. Just saying: monsters exist with and without religion
Shangori 4 months ago
@Shangori wow, if that's true, he's an even bigger asshole than I thought he was. At first I thought it was a "No True Scotsman" argument. But Wikipedia says "By spring 1976, Jones openly admitted even to outsiders that he was an atheist." However, people close to him reported saying that he stopped believing in a loving God and that he was very much a christian. Regardless, the guy was evil.
eddygoombah 4 months ago
Thanks Eddy, Great video!
It's good to remind people where bat-crap crazy religious fervor gets them.
dan91709 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
did he died?
whitelighter27club 4 months ago 2
My parents went to high school with the guy who decided what drugs and poisons went into the Flavor-Aid.
Bacopa68 4 months ago
In retrospect, the government bears just a little of the blame. If the impetus for the suicide was fear of the government, they really needed to be using military hostage retrieval tactics instead of going the hippie dippie route.
Jones was not anyone to be reasoned with or appeased. He needed to be sniped and his followers taken into military custody for debriefing and services.
Every time we eff around, these guys end up killing all their followers.
zEropoint68 4 months ago
@zEropoint68 Jim Jone's followers were free to decide what they wanted to do with their lives. The government was helpless. If they sent troops into Guyana, there would have been cries that they were interfering with religious expression - in a foreign country, no less. Because of Jonestown, the government moved in on Waco. Damned if they don't and damned if they do.
US Congressman Leo Ryan was killed too as he tried to save citizens. IMHO - They did all they could.
dan91709 4 months ago
Survival of the fit?
d0ck47 4 months ago 2
"Those who will believe in absurdities, can be convinced to commit atrocities." ... -I dont remember ATM...
SturFriedBrains 4 months ago
@SturFriedBrains Voltaire. Figures.
Yes, I copied that into Google.
gimmethegepgun 4 months ago
What a waste of lives.
morgannicgregor 4 months ago
You make great, intelligent videos- we miss them. I know you're a busy man but they are greatly appreciated. Please take time to contribute more to the atheist community here on You Tube. Thank you.
flyingfisbeefilms 4 months ago
And still people think it's ok to blindly believe. They blame Jones rather than belief, people who don't apply critical thinking can easily be swayed by a charismatic leader professing "god's will". And still my friends and family wonder why a rail against religion and why I'm constantly trying to engage their minds through debate. They say I have no right to try and sway them away from their belief and faith. But I say, as a caring man, I have a duty to try and sway them from that faith.
MrFamine69 4 months ago
@MrFamine69 I can relate to what you say, in fact I used to think exactly like you. But now as a former atheist (I'm a christian now), I don't think all forms of spiritual belief are blind, in fact at least in the Gospels there is a stress in criticizing "the doctrines of men" and discerning critically the truth of any leader judging "by their fruits." And nowhere is Jesus more virulent than when he criticizes the religious leaders of their time, but debate is a necessity, no doubt.
BlackLaval 4 months ago
@BlackLaval All forms of spiritual faith are blind, that is the definition of faith. I doubt however that you used to think just like me else you wouldn't be a 'former' atheist you would be an atheist. Thanks for the reply though.
MrFamine69 4 months ago
@BlackLaval I never understood how a REAL atheist could ever become a Christian, Muslim, Jew, or any of those religions that have extremely violent pasts, and many other tendencies of just horrific things, insane, outlandish, and downright fucking evil things in them... my favorite example is in Lev. 20:10, to paraphrase; If a man cheats on his wife they should BOTH be stoned to death. How could anyone who once supposedly saw the world rationally could follow such a dogma is beyond me, whatever.
SturFriedBrains 4 months ago
@SturFriedBrains "Real" atheism? Nonsense, that sounds pretty religious to me: an atheist orthodoxy. In my case haven't embraced christian religion, but christian faith and, hopefully, way of life. Embraced Christ. Besides it seems you got the versicule wrong, it clearly says "both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death." And BTW it's not acceptable even in the non-"paraphrase" version, a famous passage in the Gospels (a late addition in fact) has Jesus preventing its application.
BlackLaval 4 months ago
@BlackLaval in this "atheist orthodoxy" what are the rules? what are the obligations? what purpose does it serve? i am an atheist. do you know what that has told you about me? it has told you i don't believe in a god. that is all. it doesn't tell you my stance on anything else. it doesn't tell you if i am a democrat, libertarian, anarchist, or republican. it doesn't tell you if i am pro-choice (like dawkins) or pro-life (like hitchens). it doesn't tell you much at all.
greycloud24 4 months ago
@BlackLaval Sorry wrong word, the AVERAGE atheist would never go back to such a vile book as the bible, never... maybe JUST maybe in the middle of a major crisis, that's about it. and its is a generalization, but I just didn't get that. and getting to your "Jesus preventing its application" Jesus is his father right? 2 people or deities or what ever in 1 right? and Yahweh knows all right? so then why does he go back on his own word after he... makes him self from one earthly parent (genetics...)
SturFriedBrains 4 months ago
@SturFriedBrains I don't think this is such a big question as the Bible is not infalible. Anyway, check out what happens in Exodus: the first Tables of the Law, written by Jehovah's fire were broken by Moses when he angered at the gold idol, then he himself made a new set. The first set is only the Ten Commandments, the second set is a bunch of cultural laws, so "technically" Jesus, when he opposed the stoning of the adulteress wasn't opposing his Father but the doctrine of one man called Moses.
BlackLaval 4 months ago
I thought you were talking about Jesus for a while...
jgoemat 4 months ago
Welcome to religion.
hemeoncn 4 months ago 2
What amazes me is that people's fear of enslavement can drive them to enslave themselves. They feared the CIA but didn't fear a man who told them to drink poison. The promise of heaven is a wet blanket over the fires of thought.
TheViciousSquare 4 months ago 6
But from this sad tragedy we gained a pearl of wisdom that is very useful even today in modern political understanding.
"You've been drinking the kool aid."
I don't think Edwin Perkins would approve but then again it is Nebraska's official soft drink
Curas1 4 months ago
@Curas1 actually it was flavor aid.
Mglosk 4 months ago
@Mglosk
Really.
Well is it just a urban myth that that saying came from the Jim Jones Suicides ?
Curas1 4 months ago
@Curas1 It might be, but the reality is, is that it's actually flavor aid.
Mglosk 4 months ago
I was stationed at Dover AFB when the bodies were returned. Some of my friends helped to unload the bodies. I had stopped being a Fucktard before this event but I was very sympathetic for them and my other religious friends.
8WholeThing 4 months ago
WOW! Powerful stuff. Great video
jippzmcghee 4 months ago
Great video, Eddy! I remember when I was a kid how this story had affected me, and made me cautious of anyone claiming divine knowledge! Thanks for re-actualizing it!
I wonder how fundie fucktards react when they are confronted with the reality that their faith is a tool of self-enslavement? Maybe, I'll just have to start asking! ;-)
Cheers, dude!
metalskinstudios 4 months ago
People in these cults want to believe so much that even when they actually agree that without a shadow of doubt that they are wrong, they will continue to follow the cult. This is because they have invested so much emotion into it that the consequences of leaving it all behind and is devastating to them. It exists as their only support mechanism.
SmartmanChris 4 months ago
Great video, I loved the soundrack.
Makes me glad I'm not superstitious.=D
L00NGB00W 4 months ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
This is why I am against religon.
halolIlmao0 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
intelligent design at it's finest folks
wideosvatcher 4 months ago
Yeah, I heard about this from seth's podcast. It's remarkable what power he had. He actually made almost a thousand people kill themselves on a really stupid lie... Wtf.
ObservableFiction 4 months ago
That. is. horrible.
oliethefolie 4 months ago
this is dogma's true face. the damage done by a lust for loosing yourself in emotion in place of rationality is only limited by how much you do it. and liking this video was very awkward.
theshiznojudge 4 months ago
@thinkingskeptic1 Now mental illness is a reality, people have malfunctioning regions of their brains, chemical imblances, enviromental and genetic pressures and influences that are out of their control. This is a fact. Like this Jim jones guy obviously shows signs of psychopathy, and the lack of empathy for others. But what I meant by insane is that normal people are so ignorant to basic reality, that they believe characters like this. This makes me worry about myspecies in general en masse.
proofandevidence 4 months ago
@thinkingskeptic1 What I meant by insane, is ignorant to the point of acting like an insane person. One could argue, there is no "insanity", there is no "sanity". You can say the same thing about good and evil, they are just concepts. But with in society, we have come up with normalities, which are codes of conducts and bahviours that constitute sanity, social, anti social behaviour, good and bad, in regards to a functioning fair society. We are still a primitive species, and it shows.
proofandevidence 4 months ago
Humanity never ceases to disappoint me...
PinkProgram 4 months ago
@PinkProgram I feel you, but the silver lining is we have in us the ability to be so much more, we act like psychotic apes, when we could be the complete opposite.
proofandevidence 4 months ago
@proofandevidence I'm lucky I don't have the same compulsion to act like a psychotic ape ;3 I'll just keep showing humans how to improve and upgrade themselves and maybe one day the monkeys will actually listen ;D
PinkProgram 4 months ago
@PinkProgram lol, haha, it almost seems sometimes that there is a species with in our own species, like we are all human beings, but some are so fucking stupid, they are like monkeys, and some are so in the know, and open minded its like they are another fucking species entirely. Think about it, we still enjoy watching each other beat each other in the face causing permanent brain damage in a ring (boxing for example), like that is fucking primitive. What a god damned world...
proofandevidence 4 months ago
@proofandevidence homo sapiens atavus breeds faster than homo sapiens sapiens too so you never have a shortage of monkeys... or darwin award winners ;3
PinkProgram 4 months ago
@PinkProgram I copied the term h.s.adavus from your message and it appeared in my search bar for google and your vid came up on it haha, wow, I forgive you for copying my thoughts traveling back in time and making a video about them lol, mind fuck.
proofandevidence 4 months ago
Well, that's not good to see right before going to bed.
DukeDonut 4 months ago
I am convinced, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that 95% of the human species, is insane.
proofandevidence 4 months ago