Warhammer Fantasy 3rd Edition - Character Creation Part 2

[azirk83]

Thanks for the video, you've completely validated my opinion that I should stick to WFRP2.

I won't say more than that, because I'm not some asshole edition warrior. And I sincerely apologize for comments I made in the other video that were leading in that direction.

[Webhead123]

@azirk83 No worries, man. I appreciate you taking the time to comment.

Nothing wrong with sticking to WFRP2. It remains one of my favorite RPGs and I do still prefer it overall to WFRP3. To be honest, there are times during my current 3e campaign when I think to myself things would just be a whole lot simpler if I went back to 2e. But, I stick with it because 3e has a lot of good ideas going for it and because a couple of my players who think 2e is just a little too harsh for their tastes.

[Webhead123]

...In fact, I think you've inspired me to do a similar character-creation vid for WFRP2, which might serve the interest of comparing the two processes, though I imagine that 2e will be considerable quicker to document than 3e was (roll/pick race, roll Career, roll stats, note skills, talents and trappings, buy gear, done).

[DeepEndOfTheDicePool]

My friend, this looks like a game I'd like to play but hate to own. So if you wanna invite us over to play, I'm game! Also, having followed your channel for a while, I just wanna say: great vid. Your style and energy and everything are just getting better and better. Congrats on some great recent vids!

[Webhead123]

@DeepEndOfTheDicePool It is certainly a game that benefits from having a GM who has slightly OCD when it comes to being organized! :-)

Thank you for the compliments! I strive to make my channel bigger and better with every video and, to that end, you'll see some new things and changes to the overall energy of my channel. Stay tuned!

[23penguins32]

Great post. I wonder if the cards are a bit of a distraction. I say that with knowing people who have played Magic and then tried to play D&D that complain there are no cards... I can see the opposite case too and have heard the argument that WFRP have only included cards to bring into the fold the 'Magic crowd'. Apart from that, I don't know if I like ? Seems a bit too 'outside the game' for me. I know it's only a physicality of a mechanic but maybe too much on the physical ? I don't know...

[Webhead123]

@23penguins32 I suspect the reason FFG has incorporated the "card" design into 3E is that they are largely a board/card game company and those are philosophies that they know very intimately. I suspect it was a desire to incorporate their expertise in those fields to attempt to build an RPG that would stand out as daring and innovative rather than being afraid to step outside of "traditional" RPG design. There are a lot of places where it works. There are some stumbling blocks too, for sure...

[Webhead123]

...If you've ever played an RPG where some of the players used index cards for magic items/spells/combat maneuvers/etc, you've already seen and done what WHRP3 is doing here. 3E simply makes it implicit. There's no "gamey-ness" to the cards a la Magic: The Gathering. The cards are just rules references to keep you from having to write notes on your character sheet or look them up in a rule book or chart somewhere. Seeing the cards can give a deceptive impression of their role in the game.

[23penguins32]

@Webhead123 Very good point ! Yes, I use index cards and even small 'diary - journal' -types for spellbooks. Good point. And yes, the notes on the character sheet proper can become quite a mess over time or no time at all really ! I see the light, J !

[Parthamacothna]

Great video again!

I am a bit worried though that the action cards coming with the boxes will be something some players might fight over. Let's say your thief has a hunter in his group. Being usually a agility based ranged fighter he might want to choose Nimble as well, in case he gets into close combat. With only one Nimble Strike card in the box one of the chars would have to copy the card or write it down somewhere in order to get this?

[Webhead123]

@Parthamacothna It's a good topic for discussion and one I've commented on before in one of my previous vids. I'll copy the comments here for ease of reference:

There is only 1 copy of each non-basic Action Card and Talent in the game. If multiple PCs want the same card, they either need to share or write it down on a note/index card or make a photocopy. There are schools of thought on the implications of this and they don't have to be mutually exclusive...

[Webhead123]

1st) Encouraging "exclusivity" of the Actions/Talents can be a good thing because it encourages diversity. It helps keep PCs from stepping on each other's toes too much. Even if you have 2 warriors in your party, they will end up having to branch out their choices and make them each feel unique. This helps give the otherwise very "open" system of WFRP3 some support on "niche protection". Not based on "class" or "role" but based on "choice"...

[Webhead123]

...2nd) "Exclusivity" should be ignored and players should be able to take the Actions/Talents they want, even if other PCs take them as well. The game doesn't say that 2 PCs can't have the same card. You would not be contradicting the RAW if you chose to duplicate cards. Nothing wrong with that. It will allow PCs to instinctively adapt their style to mimic that of the rest of the party. There will be a little less diversity because PCs will share common abilities but it may avoid arguements...

[Webhead123]

...if you're concerned about players who perceive "cherry picking" as a potential issue.

An element of the game I haven't yet discussed is the "Party Sheet". Yes, there is an entity that represents the party as a group. This tool allows PCs to "share" some of their Talents, represented as the PCs watching their friends and picking up bits of knowledge and experience from them. This element helps reduce the "mine" syndrome a bit and demonstrates the benefits of being part of the group...

[Webhead123]

...On the "1 copy of each" issue though, I take the best of both worlds. I encourage the exclusivity, so that each PC clearly has their own "cool stuff" to bring to the table that no one else does. However, if more than one player really wants the same ability and there is a good case for why they should and what they plan to do with it, I'm not going to say no just because there's only 1 "Charge" Talent, for example.

[Onionkid99]

Cool stuff, Warhammer 3rd looks better and better. Simple enough, yet elegant. I'm always interested to see the mechanics of character creation in assorted RPGs. It gives you a special insight into weather or not you'll mesh with the system, or if it will grate upon you.

Warhammer 3rd looks like a fine RPG.

[Webhead123]

@Onionkid99 I agree with you that seeing character creation can act as a sort of window into a game system. Knowing how a character is built and what all of their traits mean helps the player create appropriate expectatioins and cue in on major themes. It's for those reasons that I'm planning to revisit several games I've reviewed in the past, incorporating demos of the character creation process for each.