Soldier Meets Citizen: a public debate

[thegreeensky]

well discussed.. nice video...

[felpaluche]

It's a clash of principles as military men really hold a different principle as citizens.

[kaferere]

The General lies for a living. "It all began when Saddam invaded his neighbour Kuwait.." No no, General, it all began when the U.S. paid a young thug called Saddam to assassinate the then leader of Iraq. It went wrong and the young Saddam shot himself accidentally in the thigh. He escaped capture by swimming across the river. Later the US installed him as their puppet dictator. The Kuwaiti's were slant-drilling and stealing his oil. They refused him OPEC membership while his country starved.

[PostBun1964]

every where the british army  navy and airforce went you caused nothing but trouble.

They are regarded as scum and rightly so in many countries. To this very day no proper investigations of Murder where ever you went. Africa Asia America Arab Countries even Ireland the country closest to you. Queen and country don't make me laugh. So brave kicking down doors hoping to get your dirty little hands on others oil and call it democracy. while health services ignored you waste money on this. MURDER

[theblackmafia71]

It always makes me laugh when I listen to these so called (experts) usally from the liberal elite, love to point the finger with there indepth knowledge of combat and combat operations , when they have never served in a front line unit and never fired a weapon in there life!

fuckin no mark clowns!

[Doversreturn]

The great wars where not a matter of money you,cheecky twat.

[Doversreturn]

I mean is he pissed or what.

[Doversreturn]

I mean is he pissed or what.

[Doversreturn]

fair conditions of employment.what a load of bollocks.

[Kampfer1445]

Actually that is not the case. A citizen soldier is a soldier who is also a citizen, i.e. a soldier who holds voting rights, the soldier of a democracy or a republic.

[Kampfer1445]

You were a lieutenant with a staff billet? What were you, the coffee boy?

[Kampfer1445]

Franks took the British capture of Basra as the model for the American assault of Baghdad. In professional military circles the British military is recognized as far more professional than the U.S. military. In 1991 the Israelis remained determined to attack Iraq even after Schwarzkopf told them that he had special forces behind Iraqi lines. It was only when he told them that he had SAS behind Iraqi lines that the Israelis quickly agreed to remain passive. The British Army has never lost a war.

[blueray1969]

@Kampfer1445 really? The American Revolution was a war wasn't it? Britain did lose the colonies so surely, we lost that one? Thankfully of course, but nevertheless, it was lost

[Kampfer1445]

The British ceased to patrol after withdrawing to the airport at the request of an incompetent government upheld by incompetent american military authority. The decisive blow in the war for the allies was the Sunni uprising in Anbar, not heavy-handed and ineffective U.S. operations. The British have also been doing most of the fighting in Afghanistan since 2006. In the Falklands the U.S. military believed that a British victory was impossible. A small British task force easily retook them.

[Kampfer1445]

Meaningless waffle. The British Army at the moment lacks in terms of numbers and equipment due to a ridiculously incompetent Labour Government and Ministry of Defence. In experience, training and professionalism it is far and away superior to the U.S. military, certainly the U.S. Army. I served in the U.S. military and I must say that many officers were poor. British officers are militarily superior. Unsurprisingly the British Army also has far more experience of successful operations.

[Kampfer1445]

It was the hapless U.S. government that invaded without any sort of plan to stabilize the country after the initial blitzkrieg. You just created a vacuum. So it was your bloody mess! You totally over look the dead hand of an incompetent Ministry of Defense over British operations. The British withdrew to the Airport at the request of the incompetent al-Maliki government. The fact is that the British have infinitely more experience in successful counter-insurgency than the inexperienced yanks.

[crewmason7]

again I think you are missing the point completely. its has nothing to do with employment. they are simply stating that soldiers also are citizens. meaning they are residents of the country. comparatively mailman meets citizen. soldiers represent the community. and im sorry to say that people like you also happen to be a part of my society. you are as bad as a terrorist advocating hate. hate is the route of all warfare. attitudes such as yours make the job more difficult for the rest of us.

[Redcarpet01]

@crewmason7 Well they're not citizens. They're subjects of the Queen, Britain isn't a republic.

[crewmason7]

@Redcarpet01 First, I am not sure why this was a response directed toward me, however, since you are wrong I will reply. Brits are citizens of the UK. A citizen is defined as a native or naturalized member of a state or nation who owes allegiance to its government and is entitled to its protection. China is a communist country and it still has citizens, the idea that the word citizen encompasses only residents of republics or even democracy is false.

[Redcarpet01]

@crewmason7 No we are not citizens of the UK. We are subjects of the monarch of the day. Look up the word yourself.

[crewmason7]

@Redcarpet01 im not sure what your point is exactly whether u want to use the term citizen or subject really in this case these coudl be interchangable by the standard applied here. you are a citizen of the UK. When u travel overseas and they see ur passport and ask u which country u are a citizen from that woudl be the UK. this discussion adds nothing to the wider debate argued by this conference, so i will no longer waste my time arguing over defienitions of a word. the above is a definition 

[crewmason7]

@Redcarpet01 the above comment does list a definition of citizen which i did look up in two separate sources and there is no mention of anything else in relation to edmocracy or republics and im sure the UK is a democracy. the queen is a figure head of continuity only. call urself what u will u are a citizen and subject they are not mutaully exclusive terms and most brits woudlnt call themselves subjects.

[crewmason7]

Professor Fabre is possibly one of the most highly informed individuals in the field of war and morality issues. I think you would be pleasantly surprised if you had a conversation with her, though im not sure your level of intellilect woudl hold an water

[crewmason7]

Did you ever work with the British? Why are the British provinces turned over to Iraqi forces yet the american sectors are rife with violence. where exactly did you serve? in what capacity was your assignment? its attitudes such as your that create more anti american sentiment and draw us into conflicts such as these in the first place. how exactly do u see british society as lacking?

[jaalmorrell]

these people live in a world of their own; put them in the front line, when the enemy's bullets and rpg's are flying at them then they can philosophise and debate whether a lawyer can advise whether to shoot or not. actually put the lawyer in the front line and let him/her debate the finer points of law with the enemy.

[crewmason7]

There are no front lines in assyemtric warfare. everything is gray, which is why most importantly we have people such as these to debate such questions of morality and legality. you are correct there is no time in combat to make such longwinded debates, however, if these debates are not conducted then the soldiers on the battlefield will not have the proper training and ROE to deal with the situation they find themselves in. training and preparation is what counts on the battlefield

[anything4ai]

Thank you for the upload.