Damn, I had just quit aviation school because I knew pilots are jobless, and i thought starting my prereq's for optometry but I have been seen allot of bad fuss about it and thought, Hmmm.. what about physician's assistant... I know they dont have the doctor in front of their name, but I want an educated person's opinion about it. Thank you in advance!
I've been looking into going into the OD profession. I am planning on applying this summer. I was going into optometry for all the same reason you listed above. I just graduated with my bachelors this dec. and I have been actively looking for a job that I cannot find because their aren't any out there. So, I was just going to go ahead and apply this year. I just have a few questions for you. What college did you go to? Where do you live now?
.. wow its funny because yesterday i had just gotten all excited about going into optometry school. this was so depressing, thanks for the info and warning us future people
@ crimng1 The debts for dentists & MDs are about 15% higher, but starting salaries and type of work available for them are far better. Per diem for DDSs is around 500-600 for new grads. New ODs get half that, if they're lucky enough to find work. What is most troubling for ODs is the overwhelming influence of commercial practice, a force that has been intentionally squashed by dentists and MDs. The three fields may seem similar on paper, but I speak from experience in saying that they're not.
I have family in several other health fields (medical, dental, etc) and optometry debt is generally on the lower end. Starting salaries can be lower for optometrists who can't find FT positions, but the same can be said for nurses, dentists, and doctors who are PT. Jobs are harder to find for everyone, post-grad degree or not. All fields are struggling, but you borrow money to pay for school to avoid minimum wage struggles. Everyone has it rough.
I am an electrical engineer, but I have many helpful friends in optometry. I USED to be a "critic" -- but no more. I truly did not realize that you run up $150,000 BEFORE you can collect any money from the public. I could not take that kind of "pressure". Thanks for the video, and good luck to you! Otis
@dmaino You appear to be clueless about optometry so I don't know why you bothered sharing your opinion. The vast majority of ODs share the opinion of the OP. I actually commend him for doing it. I've been an OD for a long time and I own a successful office. If I came out of school today, nothing I've done would be possible. Most new graduates coming out today will have careers in commercial optometry and never get to do what I have done. Those are the facts.
There is little honesty in this video. All professions, including medicine, law...well you name it....are having to work harder.. Get over it. If you are willing to work hard...you will succeed. If not...you sit at your computer, create a video like this and just moan and groan...."Oh woe is me .... oh woe is me!" There is no get quick rich scheme for any profession....it has been and always will be up to the individual to succeed. ""Success doesn't come to you? You go to it." Marva Collins
There is little honest" in this video. All professions, including medicine, law...well you name it....are having to work harder.. Get over it. If you are willing to work hard...you will succeed. If not...you sit at your computer, create a video like this and just moan and groan...."Oh woe is me .... oh woe is me!" There is no get quick rich scheme for any profession....it has been and always will be up to the individual to succeed. ""Success doesn't come to you? You go to it." Marva Collins
@ random99998 It's almost comical, though. I've gone on studentdoctornetwork to try and present a different perspective to people considering and OD. What I discovered is, pre-optometry students believe they know more than practicing ODs do about the field. It's amazing how blindly allegiant some people will be once they are convinced of something. The AOA says it's a great field so it must be true! I guess they'll figure it out like I did, after it's too late.
@ random99998 Totally agree on the insurance situation. Vision plans are matching the ridiculous prices given away at WalShart, Sams, etc. The retail side of optometry is contributing to its demise, which may be part of their plan. How nice would it be if Walmart, Sams, LC, etc could employ opticians to refract for glasses/CLs? Why have an OD when you don't need one? I truly believe the entire profession is fading away before our eyes. I don't know what ODs will be doing in another 15-20 yrs.
One of the most common arguments I hear (almost always from preoptometry and OD students) is that if the situation is so bad, why are newer grads not defaulting on their loans? The reason=>IBR. Everyone's on IBR these days, blissfully unaware that their loan balance steadily increases every month by 1000-2000K. People are adding 12-24K to their loans per year and don't even know it. IBR allows you to pay as little as 0.00 per month, feels great while you're in it, but it sure hurts afterwards.
@ random99998 Nice to see another "truth-seer" out there! It's amazing to me that anyone is still crazy enough to even apply to an OD program with everything that's going on in the field. The degree cots literally dozens of times what it cost 25 years ago, but the adjusted pay is actually lower. Sooner or later, it will get bad enough that people see the problem. I think one reason is that the "bubble" hasn't burst yet for education and the IBR loan repayment plans will only make things worse.
The insurance situation is awful. People pull out their Eyemed cards and think they are entitled to getting this amazing exam and any follow-up's they need for the rest of the year...but they don't realize the doc is only receiving 40 DOLLARS for their exam! (for routine glasses exam). We can't spend 30 minutes with a patient and only make 40 dollars, so that forces us to spend less time, see more people, and work harder for less. It's unbelievable how crappy the reimbursement is getting.
I was lucky enough to keep my student loans to a minimum and now I'm in a decent situation, but people don't realize, if you take a job paying 80K..this is not a lot of money nowadays. Loans to pay back, mortgage, bills, car repairs, gas, saving for retirement, family (I don't have any kids), and not to mention buying a few things you WANT (god forbid) or going out to dinner. I can't imagine if I had 200K in loans and 2 kids. I honestly wouldn't be able to afford it.
It wears on you.You imagine in school wearing your white coat,smiling, enjoying giving a great exam to appreciative patients&feeling fulfilled. And some of the time it IS like this,but so much of the time it is refracting non-stop idiotic people that cannot give a straight answer to something as simple as "which choice looks better,1 or 2?"Then you get the wackos that come back & say their Rx is wrong...when you got them seeing 20/20! Or you already explained the 1st time they have cataracts!
Man, I'm glad I found somebody online that kinda feels the same way I do about this career. It is NOT easy coming up with a way to make the income you want to make and, at the same time, work in a moderately paced, low stress situation. I'm in the corporate environment also, and thankfully I finally am my own boss in this office, but when I worked for others, it was either crappy pay, or waay overworked having to see patients every 10-15 min's with the way they overbooked the schedule.
@ttiiyy Oops, looks like I mis-numbered #6) as #5) - In essence, repeating #5) Damn, you're rubbing off on me. I found this little comment session relaxing and quite enjoyable. Please make another 9 or 10 posts at your earliest convenience, just screen for mindless repetition and irrationality. Oh, and watch the capitalizing, I'll give you some feedback on it after your next round of postings and we'll see how you do. You just don't want to come off like Frau Farbissina from Austin Powers.
@ ttiiyy Just a final thought for now. When you capitalize words in a post for emphasis, be consistent about it. Moreover, try to really think about which words you capitalize and what effect it will have on the readers "inside voice." When you randomly emphasize words, you end up coming off a little imbalanced. Also, in a related topic, "lasik" doesn't need to be capitalized. When I send a patient out for lasik, if I yelled it out, my patient would be a little thrown off. Just a suggestion.
@ttiiyy (Ranting resp. cont'd) #5) Really, some ophthalmologists hate ODs? Anyone else heard of this? This is new to me-seriously, all this time, who knew? And I was just going to ask one to join my "Optometry is Awesome" club. Damn. I've been in the industry for 10 years so - I'm aware. You seem to repeat things over and over like a manic patient. Has anyone ever told you about this problem? Maybe you're a manic depressive? Try meditation, you sound like you need to relax a bit.
@ttiiyy (Ranting response cont'd) #5) What industry is easy, you ask? Hmmm...I'd say internet porn. Oh, and coffee stands. I know some people who've made a killing with coffee stands. Don't know anyone in the porn industry, though. You seem like the type that might have gotten her face pushed up against the inside of a car windshield once or twice, maybe you know someone in the internet porn field? God, this is great, responding to your irrational rambling is more fun than I thought.
@ttiiyy "You seem like a girl that might have gotten her face pushed up against the inside of a car windshield once or twice...." Dow!!! Girl, you just got a first rate electronic beat down!
@ttiiyy(Ranting response cont’d) #4) Pharmacy, unlike the others you mentioned, does have a retail component so-No, I wouldn’t suggest getting a PharmD. Update: you actually asked me 4x about my expected pay-sorry. To answer, an OD needs to make about 120K to justify the expense. OMDs usually make at least 2-3x that so I'm not sure where you got the idea that I expect to me 240K+. Could you please clarify where you got that idea from? Thanks, I'd appreciate your cooperation in the matter.
@ ttiiyy I'll try to address some of your rants, but they're difficult to string together into coherent thoughts. #1)Are you aware that most ODs in the US today are in PP? Somehow, you've concluded that only OMDs can be in a PP. Thanks for allowing me to clarify your confusion. #2)Yes, I can perform surgery,all ODs can. #3) All of my "facts" do not apply to every industry. Nursing, surgery, and dentists do not have a retail component. Please learn a little more about the topic before posting.
@ttiiyy Everyone stand back, she's gonna blow! I don't know why I assumed you're a woman- you just seem to take on that neurotic, annoying, hysterical quality of a woman who just discovered a sale at Nordstrom or something. Do you have to be so repetitive? You asked me the same question 3x, twice in the same post. To answer-No, I don't expect to be paid the same as an OMD-please stop asking. I don't mind responding to your nonsense, but try to organize your jumbled thoughts before posting.
Have you tried hard enough to find a job or start your business? You sound like a crybaby. What industry in the world is easy?
If you don't change your attitude, you will never succeed.
You say that you wish you had done something different. What do you suggest then? Pharmacy? Guess what, there are some pharmacists who tell their friends to stay away from the industry. And here's the tricky part: no matter what option you choose, there'll be someone that tells you that industry is bad!
@megaton12; I know you directed your question to andrewcena, but I'll try to answer as well. When people talk about urban vs rural in optometry, they're grouping urban and suburban together. Another way to describe it would be to say heavily populated vs sparsely populated. Urban areas and the surrounding suburbs are very populated areas and as a result, ODs have moved into the area. In remote unpopulated areas, there might be only 1 or 2 ODs or maybe none. In short, suburbs are saturated too.
@StayAwayFromAnOD Do you have any idea how pathetic you sound? You are MERELY an OD, and you want to have private practice? Who the hell do you think you are?
Have you never heard of ophthalmologists? You know, the real smart ones that go to the medical school? They can do not only what you do but also the SURGERIES (such as LASIK).
You should feel grateful that you can even get a job in the US. You don't need to be a genius to get into an optometry school.
@ttiiyy What the hell are you talking about? The OP is right, you sound like a crazy person. Were you dumped by an optometrist at some point in your life? Slow your roll, lady. And yeah, what's with repeating the same questions over and over again?
@StayAwayFromAnOD Even though ophtalmologists will look down on people like you, they will be very HAPPY that you are discouraging people to enter the field of optometry. Ophthalmologists often HATE optometrists. They look at them as eye sores. After all, ophthalmologists can do everything that an OD can do PLUS other surgeries such as LASIK.
So don't expect people to feel sorry for you. In the eyes of some ophthalmologists, you are DELUSIONAL.
thanks for making this video. i generally agree with your observations and am glad that i'm not the only individual who feels this way. it's hard to find people who haven't been influenced by the "propaganda" and who continue to fail to see the truth. i think at least this video can give some perspective.
@andrewcena, thanks for your comments. I like your reference to "propaganda." I can't think of a better term that describes the attitude that optometry is a great profession to enter anymore. People think that if you criticize the profession from an investment standpoint, then you must be criticizing the integrity of ODs. I have tremendous respect for what we do and the services that we offer, which is why I can't stand seeing those services being given away and undervalued.
@StayAwayFromAnOD I really hate to say this to you, but you sound like one of those arrogant doctors who want to create some kinds of guilds to protect your interests.
But guess what? You're not the only smart person in the world. There are many smart people out there as well. That's good thing for the patients. They have GOOD choices instead of being stuck with some arrogant assholes.
You went to an optometry school, NOT a medical school. They are the ones that have the bitching right
@JustmeKasie, No hate at all. I'm just trying to stop others from being lured in like I was. If someone wants to get an OD so they can work in commercial or retail setting, go for it. Optometrists have a great skill set to offer, but most new grads will not be able to provide it to their patients since they will be doing refractive care only. I wish someone had told me. Anyone who goes in now should be comfortable working commercial and not be set on a PP career. It's not an unreasonable claim.
@StayAwayFromAnOD All the "facts" that you provide here are ironically applied to every industry in the US. I have heard people saying the same things about pharmacy, dentistry, and pretty much every other field in the US. Does that stop people from becoming nurses? Nope. Dentists? Nope. Pharmacists? Nope. Surgeons? Nope.
You went to an optometry school for God's sakes. NOT a medical school. Stop acting like a victim.
@Dmaino and Southernflounder - would either of you care to point out exactly what on the slideshow is inaccurate? From my viewing (I actually watched it twice), I could not find a single slide that presented misleading information. I love my job as an OD, but I don't think I would do it if I had to start over now. As someone with some grey hair on his head, I think the info is pretty accurate. What do you guys disagree with? Just curious.
@dmaino, cont'd:If you tell yourself optometry is great all day long, it doesn't make it true. Compare the return for an GP MD/DO who spends the same 5yrs in school as we do with a year of residency. They start at 150-175K and even they're complaining about not making enough to pay loans. I have tremendous respect for what we are trained to do, but it's sad that so many new ODs are forced into crap jobs because there's nothing else or because they can't afford to be in PP.
@dmaino, I've had 3 offers for associateships from the most successful practices in my city so no, I am not unable to make it in the real world. Each of them offered to pay 80K and that's pretty much the going rate. Can you pay 250K in student loans, mortgage, gas, kids, food, save for retirement, etc with that kind of money? I can't. I had to take a garbage job with commercial because it pays my bills. You're in a dream world if you think that optometry is a good investment for most people.
@StayAwayFromAnOD, the 80k offer isn't bad, i was looking at offers of 65-75 starting at "medical" practices, with a complex incentive structure, which was basically designed to never allow you to break out from your base. they did offer some benefits however. but of course you're going to be taking call and all the weekend shifts, seeing the post-ops etc
in my region, a truck driver can make well over that due to the particular industries in the area. with no tuition debt.
@andrewcena, You're right, 80K is on the upper end of the range offered to new grads and resident grads. I make about 90K and I have a lot of trouble making my loan payments. I can't imagine making less, but most ODs do, even those with a lot of loan debt. I'd really like to get the word out to prospective ODs that optometry is not what it used to be. It seems everyone wants to make themselves feel good about their situation so they're in denial about the realities. I wish I had known earlier.
If you spent half the time you wasted on this video and applied it to being a successful optometrist perhaps your bitterness, outlook and job opportunities would all improve. It is obvious you don't have what it takes to be a successful OD. Sad. The good news is that the vast majority of ODs do very well.
@dmaino that's actually untrue for many new graduates. unless you are willing to move to rural areas that may still experience market growth. in general, most urban centers feature a saturation of opticals and optometry services. because of the powerhold that established practices and corporations have on those areas, the pay that an optometrist may gross on each patient may end up being just $10 / exam, afterwhich they have to make loan payments, taxes, bills etc.
@dmaino you might also say that, well why don't you just move to the rural areas then to become a successful optometrist with your own thriving private practice. well in reality, with family commitments that is just not possible, depending on the sector your spouse is employed in or the services that your children/dependents may need access to...those rural communities do not provide a suitable living environment at all.
@andrewcena Well, America isnt just divided into urban and rural areas. How about suburbs? Whats the return like for an optometrist there in private practice?
Damn, I had just quit aviation school because I knew pilots are jobless, and i thought starting my prereq's for optometry but I have been seen allot of bad fuss about it and thought, Hmmm.. what about physician's assistant... I know they dont have the doctor in front of their name, but I want an educated person's opinion about it. Thank you in advance!
ShytFerBraynes 2 weeks ago
Dental School it is then.....
Toxicjazzlove 4 weeks ago
I've been looking into going into the OD profession. I am planning on applying this summer. I was going into optometry for all the same reason you listed above. I just graduated with my bachelors this dec. and I have been actively looking for a job that I cannot find because their aren't any out there. So, I was just going to go ahead and apply this year. I just have a few questions for you. What college did you go to? Where do you live now?
fordkd1 1 month ago
Comment removed
robeshko 1 month ago
How sad. How despairing. Real optometry isn't like that at all, but MEDICAL optometry is.
mdbowan 4 months ago in playlist More videos from StayAwayFromAnOD
.. wow its funny because yesterday i had just gotten all excited about going into optometry school. this was so depressing, thanks for the info and warning us future people
kibbt5224 4 months ago
@ crimng1 The debts for dentists & MDs are about 15% higher, but starting salaries and type of work available for them are far better. Per diem for DDSs is around 500-600 for new grads. New ODs get half that, if they're lucky enough to find work. What is most troubling for ODs is the overwhelming influence of commercial practice, a force that has been intentionally squashed by dentists and MDs. The three fields may seem similar on paper, but I speak from experience in saying that they're not.
DrBottomable 5 months ago
I have family in several other health fields (medical, dental, etc) and optometry debt is generally on the lower end. Starting salaries can be lower for optometrists who can't find FT positions, but the same can be said for nurses, dentists, and doctors who are PT. Jobs are harder to find for everyone, post-grad degree or not. All fields are struggling, but you borrow money to pay for school to avoid minimum wage struggles. Everyone has it rough.
crimng1 5 months ago
I am an electrical engineer, but I have many helpful friends in optometry. I USED to be a "critic" -- but no more. I truly did not realize that you run up $150,000 BEFORE you can collect any money from the public. I could not take that kind of "pressure". Thanks for the video, and good luck to you! Otis
otissumnerbrown 5 months ago
@dmaino You appear to be clueless about optometry so I don't know why you bothered sharing your opinion. The vast majority of ODs share the opinion of the OP. I actually commend him for doing it. I've been an OD for a long time and I own a successful office. If I came out of school today, nothing I've done would be possible. Most new graduates coming out today will have careers in commercial optometry and never get to do what I have done. Those are the facts.
sucksabba 6 months ago
There is little honesty in this video. All professions, including medicine, law...well you name it....are having to work harder.. Get over it. If you are willing to work hard...you will succeed. If not...you sit at your computer, create a video like this and just moan and groan...."Oh woe is me .... oh woe is me!" There is no get quick rich scheme for any profession....it has been and always will be up to the individual to succeed. ""Success doesn't come to you? You go to it." Marva Collins
dmaino 6 months ago
There is little honest" in this video. All professions, including medicine, law...well you name it....are having to work harder.. Get over it. If you are willing to work hard...you will succeed. If not...you sit at your computer, create a video like this and just moan and groan...."Oh woe is me .... oh woe is me!" There is no get quick rich scheme for any profession....it has been and always will be up to the individual to succeed. ""Success doesn't come to you? You go to it." Marva Collins
dmaino 6 months ago
As an engineer I have always been interested in the various problems that an optometrist has in his practice. Thanks for the honesty in this post.
otissumnerbrown 6 months ago
@ random99998 It's almost comical, though. I've gone on studentdoctornetwork to try and present a different perspective to people considering and OD. What I discovered is, pre-optometry students believe they know more than practicing ODs do about the field. It's amazing how blindly allegiant some people will be once they are convinced of something. The AOA says it's a great field so it must be true! I guess they'll figure it out like I did, after it's too late.
StayAwayFromAnOD 6 months ago
@ random99998 Totally agree on the insurance situation. Vision plans are matching the ridiculous prices given away at WalShart, Sams, etc. The retail side of optometry is contributing to its demise, which may be part of their plan. How nice would it be if Walmart, Sams, LC, etc could employ opticians to refract for glasses/CLs? Why have an OD when you don't need one? I truly believe the entire profession is fading away before our eyes. I don't know what ODs will be doing in another 15-20 yrs.
StayAwayFromAnOD 6 months ago
One of the most common arguments I hear (almost always from preoptometry and OD students) is that if the situation is so bad, why are newer grads not defaulting on their loans? The reason=>IBR. Everyone's on IBR these days, blissfully unaware that their loan balance steadily increases every month by 1000-2000K. People are adding 12-24K to their loans per year and don't even know it. IBR allows you to pay as little as 0.00 per month, feels great while you're in it, but it sure hurts afterwards.
StayAwayFromAnOD 6 months ago
@ random99998 Nice to see another "truth-seer" out there! It's amazing to me that anyone is still crazy enough to even apply to an OD program with everything that's going on in the field. The degree cots literally dozens of times what it cost 25 years ago, but the adjusted pay is actually lower. Sooner or later, it will get bad enough that people see the problem. I think one reason is that the "bubble" hasn't burst yet for education and the IBR loan repayment plans will only make things worse.
StayAwayFromAnOD 6 months ago
The insurance situation is awful. People pull out their Eyemed cards and think they are entitled to getting this amazing exam and any follow-up's they need for the rest of the year...but they don't realize the doc is only receiving 40 DOLLARS for their exam! (for routine glasses exam). We can't spend 30 minutes with a patient and only make 40 dollars, so that forces us to spend less time, see more people, and work harder for less. It's unbelievable how crappy the reimbursement is getting.
random99998 6 months ago
I was lucky enough to keep my student loans to a minimum and now I'm in a decent situation, but people don't realize, if you take a job paying 80K..this is not a lot of money nowadays. Loans to pay back, mortgage, bills, car repairs, gas, saving for retirement, family (I don't have any kids), and not to mention buying a few things you WANT (god forbid) or going out to dinner. I can't imagine if I had 200K in loans and 2 kids. I honestly wouldn't be able to afford it.
random99998 6 months ago
It wears on you.You imagine in school wearing your white coat,smiling, enjoying giving a great exam to appreciative patients&feeling fulfilled. And some of the time it IS like this,but so much of the time it is refracting non-stop idiotic people that cannot give a straight answer to something as simple as "which choice looks better,1 or 2?"Then you get the wackos that come back & say their Rx is wrong...when you got them seeing 20/20! Or you already explained the 1st time they have cataracts!
random99998 6 months ago
Man, I'm glad I found somebody online that kinda feels the same way I do about this career. It is NOT easy coming up with a way to make the income you want to make and, at the same time, work in a moderately paced, low stress situation. I'm in the corporate environment also, and thankfully I finally am my own boss in this office, but when I worked for others, it was either crappy pay, or waay overworked having to see patients every 10-15 min's with the way they overbooked the schedule.
random99998 6 months ago
@ttiiyy Oops, looks like I mis-numbered #6) as #5) - In essence, repeating #5) Damn, you're rubbing off on me. I found this little comment session relaxing and quite enjoyable. Please make another 9 or 10 posts at your earliest convenience, just screen for mindless repetition and irrationality. Oh, and watch the capitalizing, I'll give you some feedback on it after your next round of postings and we'll see how you do. You just don't want to come off like Frau Farbissina from Austin Powers.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 3
@ ttiiyy Just a final thought for now. When you capitalize words in a post for emphasis, be consistent about it. Moreover, try to really think about which words you capitalize and what effect it will have on the readers "inside voice." When you randomly emphasize words, you end up coming off a little imbalanced. Also, in a related topic, "lasik" doesn't need to be capitalized. When I send a patient out for lasik, if I yelled it out, my patient would be a little thrown off. Just a suggestion.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 2
@ttiiyy (Ranting resp. cont'd) #5) Really, some ophthalmologists hate ODs? Anyone else heard of this? This is new to me-seriously, all this time, who knew? And I was just going to ask one to join my "Optometry is Awesome" club. Damn. I've been in the industry for 10 years so - I'm aware. You seem to repeat things over and over like a manic patient. Has anyone ever told you about this problem? Maybe you're a manic depressive? Try meditation, you sound like you need to relax a bit.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 3
@ttiiyy (Ranting response cont'd) #5) What industry is easy, you ask? Hmmm...I'd say internet porn. Oh, and coffee stands. I know some people who've made a killing with coffee stands. Don't know anyone in the porn industry, though. You seem like the type that might have gotten her face pushed up against the inside of a car windshield once or twice, maybe you know someone in the internet porn field? God, this is great, responding to your irrational rambling is more fun than I thought.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 7
@ttiiyy "You seem like a girl that might have gotten her face pushed up against the inside of a car windshield once or twice...." Dow!!! Girl, you just got a first rate electronic beat down!
DrBottomable 8 months ago
@ttiiyy(Ranting response cont’d) #4) Pharmacy, unlike the others you mentioned, does have a retail component so-No, I wouldn’t suggest getting a PharmD. Update: you actually asked me 4x about my expected pay-sorry. To answer, an OD needs to make about 120K to justify the expense. OMDs usually make at least 2-3x that so I'm not sure where you got the idea that I expect to me 240K+. Could you please clarify where you got that idea from? Thanks, I'd appreciate your cooperation in the matter.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 3
@ ttiiyy I'll try to address some of your rants, but they're difficult to string together into coherent thoughts. #1)Are you aware that most ODs in the US today are in PP? Somehow, you've concluded that only OMDs can be in a PP. Thanks for allowing me to clarify your confusion. #2)Yes, I can perform surgery,all ODs can. #3) All of my "facts" do not apply to every industry. Nursing, surgery, and dentists do not have a retail component. Please learn a little more about the topic before posting.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 3
@ttiiyy Everyone stand back, she's gonna blow! I don't know why I assumed you're a woman- you just seem to take on that neurotic, annoying, hysterical quality of a woman who just discovered a sale at Nordstrom or something. Do you have to be so repetitive? You asked me the same question 3x, twice in the same post. To answer-No, I don't expect to be paid the same as an OMD-please stop asking. I don't mind responding to your nonsense, but try to organize your jumbled thoughts before posting.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago 3
Have you tried hard enough to find a job or start your business? You sound like a crybaby. What industry in the world is easy?
If you don't change your attitude, you will never succeed.
You say that you wish you had done something different. What do you suggest then? Pharmacy? Guess what, there are some pharmacists who tell their friends to stay away from the industry. And here's the tricky part: no matter what option you choose, there'll be someone that tells you that industry is bad!
ttiiyy 8 months ago
@megaton12; I know you directed your question to andrewcena, but I'll try to answer as well. When people talk about urban vs rural in optometry, they're grouping urban and suburban together. Another way to describe it would be to say heavily populated vs sparsely populated. Urban areas and the surrounding suburbs are very populated areas and as a result, ODs have moved into the area. In remote unpopulated areas, there might be only 1 or 2 ODs or maybe none. In short, suburbs are saturated too.
StayAwayFromAnOD 8 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD Do you have any idea how pathetic you sound? You are MERELY an OD, and you want to have private practice? Who the hell do you think you are?
Have you never heard of ophthalmologists? You know, the real smart ones that go to the medical school? They can do not only what you do but also the SURGERIES (such as LASIK).
You should feel grateful that you can even get a job in the US. You don't need to be a genius to get into an optometry school.
ttiiyy 8 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD EVERY ophthalmologist that watches this video will call you DELUSIONAL. They don't even have that much respect for optometry.
You are only an OD, and you are bitching about private practice? NO, seriously, how high do you expect your salary to be?
Do you honest expect to be paid as much as an ophthalmologist???????????
Do you think you deserve to be paid as much as an ophthalmologist?
ttiiyy 8 months ago
@ttiiyy What the hell are you talking about? The OP is right, you sound like a crazy person. Were you dumped by an optometrist at some point in your life? Slow your roll, lady. And yeah, what's with repeating the same questions over and over again?
AzaliaAl 8 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD Even though ophtalmologists will look down on people like you, they will be very HAPPY that you are discouraging people to enter the field of optometry. Ophthalmologists often HATE optometrists. They look at them as eye sores. After all, ophthalmologists can do everything that an OD can do PLUS other surgeries such as LASIK.
So don't expect people to feel sorry for you. In the eyes of some ophthalmologists, you are DELUSIONAL.
ttiiyy 8 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD Ophthalmologists are the REAL doctors. You should be grateful that you can even get a job in a retail store.
Private practice? My ass! You did NOT go to a medical school.
You honestly believe that you deserve to be paid as much as a REAL doctor such as an ophthalmologist?
Just be grateful if you can even get a job at a retail store.
This is one of the most PATHETIC videos that I have ever seen in a long time. But I'm sure many ophthalmologists find it FUNNY ;)
ttiiyy 8 months ago
thanks for making this video. i generally agree with your observations and am glad that i'm not the only individual who feels this way. it's hard to find people who haven't been influenced by the "propaganda" and who continue to fail to see the truth. i think at least this video can give some perspective.
andrewcena 9 months ago
@andrewcena, thanks for your comments. I like your reference to "propaganda." I can't think of a better term that describes the attitude that optometry is a great profession to enter anymore. People think that if you criticize the profession from an investment standpoint, then you must be criticizing the integrity of ODs. I have tremendous respect for what we do and the services that we offer, which is why I can't stand seeing those services being given away and undervalued.
StayAwayFromAnOD 9 months ago 2
@StayAwayFromAnOD I really hate to say this to you, but you sound like one of those arrogant doctors who want to create some kinds of guilds to protect your interests.
But guess what? You're not the only smart person in the world. There are many smart people out there as well. That's good thing for the patients. They have GOOD choices instead of being stuck with some arrogant assholes.
You went to an optometry school, NOT a medical school. They are the ones that have the bitching right
ttiiyy 8 months ago
one question: why would you go through all this trouble in going against optometry? why so much hate?
JustmeKasie 9 months ago
@JustmeKasie, No hate at all. I'm just trying to stop others from being lured in like I was. If someone wants to get an OD so they can work in commercial or retail setting, go for it. Optometrists have a great skill set to offer, but most new grads will not be able to provide it to their patients since they will be doing refractive care only. I wish someone had told me. Anyone who goes in now should be comfortable working commercial and not be set on a PP career. It's not an unreasonable claim.
StayAwayFromAnOD 9 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD All the "facts" that you provide here are ironically applied to every industry in the US. I have heard people saying the same things about pharmacy, dentistry, and pretty much every other field in the US. Does that stop people from becoming nurses? Nope. Dentists? Nope. Pharmacists? Nope. Surgeons? Nope.
You went to an optometry school for God's sakes. NOT a medical school. Stop acting like a victim.
ttiiyy 8 months ago
@Dmaino and Southernflounder - would either of you care to point out exactly what on the slideshow is inaccurate? From my viewing (I actually watched it twice), I could not find a single slide that presented misleading information. I love my job as an OD, but I don't think I would do it if I had to start over now. As someone with some grey hair on his head, I think the info is pretty accurate. What do you guys disagree with? Just curious.
stinklewink84 9 months ago
@stinklewink84 Thanks for this
Bryco264 3 months ago
@dmaino, cont'd:If you tell yourself optometry is great all day long, it doesn't make it true. Compare the return for an GP MD/DO who spends the same 5yrs in school as we do with a year of residency. They start at 150-175K and even they're complaining about not making enough to pay loans. I have tremendous respect for what we are trained to do, but it's sad that so many new ODs are forced into crap jobs because there's nothing else or because they can't afford to be in PP.
StayAwayFromAnOD 9 months ago
@dmaino, I've had 3 offers for associateships from the most successful practices in my city so no, I am not unable to make it in the real world. Each of them offered to pay 80K and that's pretty much the going rate. Can you pay 250K in student loans, mortgage, gas, kids, food, save for retirement, etc with that kind of money? I can't. I had to take a garbage job with commercial because it pays my bills. You're in a dream world if you think that optometry is a good investment for most people.
StayAwayFromAnOD 9 months ago
@StayAwayFromAnOD, the 80k offer isn't bad, i was looking at offers of 65-75 starting at "medical" practices, with a complex incentive structure, which was basically designed to never allow you to break out from your base. they did offer some benefits however. but of course you're going to be taking call and all the weekend shifts, seeing the post-ops etc
in my region, a truck driver can make well over that due to the particular industries in the area. with no tuition debt.
andrewcena 9 months ago
@andrewcena, You're right, 80K is on the upper end of the range offered to new grads and resident grads. I make about 90K and I have a lot of trouble making my loan payments. I can't imagine making less, but most ODs do, even those with a lot of loan debt. I'd really like to get the word out to prospective ODs that optometry is not what it used to be. It seems everyone wants to make themselves feel good about their situation so they're in denial about the realities. I wish I had known earlier.
StayAwayFromAnOD 9 months ago
If you spent half the time you wasted on this video and applied it to being a successful optometrist perhaps your bitterness, outlook and job opportunities would all improve. It is obvious you don't have what it takes to be a successful OD. Sad. The good news is that the vast majority of ODs do very well.
dmaino 9 months ago
@dmaino Totally agree here. Can't make it in the real world huh? The welfare line is over there--->
Southernflounder 9 months ago
@dmaino that's actually untrue for many new graduates. unless you are willing to move to rural areas that may still experience market growth. in general, most urban centers feature a saturation of opticals and optometry services. because of the powerhold that established practices and corporations have on those areas, the pay that an optometrist may gross on each patient may end up being just $10 / exam, afterwhich they have to make loan payments, taxes, bills etc.
andrewcena 8 months ago
@dmaino you might also say that, well why don't you just move to the rural areas then to become a successful optometrist with your own thriving private practice. well in reality, with family commitments that is just not possible, depending on the sector your spouse is employed in or the services that your children/dependents may need access to...those rural communities do not provide a suitable living environment at all.
andrewcena 8 months ago
@andrewcena Well, America isnt just divided into urban and rural areas. How about suburbs? Whats the return like for an optometrist there in private practice?
megaton12 8 months ago