Crash Course: Chapter 12 - Debt by Chris Martenson

[djnetmen]

ANOTHER REASON TO VOTE RON PAUL 2012

[303anzac]

WHEN THE DEFAULT HAPPENS AS PLANED BY THE NWO=WW3=ONE WORLD GOVERMENT=SLAVERY! There is a place in Heaven for those who are already in the trenches fighting the NWO.

[pkripper32]

U.S. Debt as of 10-19-11......... 14,851,667,500,000.... so up 5 trillion in 3 years. Hope and change.. my butt!!!!!

[chelonia1663]

We have a mathematically proven terminal monetary system. The issue — and the only distinguishing process even — was and is "interest."

[gavinjengel]

If a person believes hyper-inflation is approaching, then he would probably want to buy commodities with debt. That is because the high inflation would inflate away the debt, and he could pay it back very easily in the future. So, I wonder, how many people who truly believe hyper-inflation is near are investing with lots of debt?

[mdg583]

I don't get what is said about future generations and debt. Debt can't just be present consumption of future rewards - how can I spend tomorrows wealth? How could I drive a car built in 2025 when it is only 2011? Whatever wealth I get today was produced today or yesterday.

[slavimarinovgmailcom]

IMHO: "Debt is a claim on *future* human labor" <= That's not correct. Should be "Debt is a *future claim* on human labor"

[tomeucap]

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[LightYagame1]

Guess what, the longer the elderly lives, the more we have to pay in the future, we actually think that the fact that Americans are living longer is good? Good to whom is my question :D

[mrhuge815]

Great Job with these videos.

This video series should be compulsory viewing for EVERY US Citizen, ESPECIALLY the youth. I guarantee there would be a change in the way they approach life.

[YaHuWaHservant]

Chris I have a question. Our debt is about at 16 trillion and it has been said that they are now having to raise the ceiling, I am not shocked it was obviously going to happen, but my question is that if we have already gotten up to 16 trillion in debt what do we have to worry about? What amount of debt screws us, what happens to us when we fall apart, and more importantly if our debt reached let's say 100 trillion would that really have any effect on us? Thanks for the vids!

[siprus]

i'd like to point out that even if depts grow 5% year and there is inflation of 5% per year there isn't actaully change in amout of debt. (i bet debts are increasing faster than what inflation is, but to give people more accurate understainding you should take this in account.)

[crb4059]

What is incredibly scary is even since this video was created, weve nearly DOULBED our national debt, were approaching 15 trillion since this was made just 3 years ago. Unbelievable.

[awsomeshot]

college is no longer self liquidating.

[superdiza]

This system is obviously contrived as a conspiracy of the super-rich to enact global control.(kiyosaki actually wrote a book about it) It has been so for hundreds of years. yet this is by far their most successful round.

[jackgoldman1]

The money bubble is caused by government and banks the fund governments. Protect yourself. Get out of debt. Own commodities you need. Get a real skill. Reduce your expenses. Invest in inflation hedges like gold, silver, and commodities that have real value. Most of our economy is based on sheer luxury. We need air, water, food, shelter, energy, clothing, and friends. We have a luxury based society based on debt, financed by more debt. Take away debt and prices collapse. Protect yourself.

[rolficus]

hi chris thanks for the information what do you think of silver and gold as they print more money

[flagship21]

what about the multiplier effect of non liquidating debts would this not create more jobs

[flagship21]

How come the average person lives in denial ????

[TheChineseEmpire]

@flagship21, the government maintains a status quo making everyone think all is ok.

[annoloki]

So forget the Mississippi bubble, the South Seas bubble, the dot-com bubble, and even the housing bubble... what we're in now, is a MONEY BUBBLE! With extra thanks to things like derivatives, where money can be made from money, money itself has become intrinsically separated from value, a bubble by definition, and not just in a single country, but this is happening all around the world. What happens when the money bubble bursts? It hurteth my mind just thinking about it!

[MrTheLOLOL]

theres a "money printer" that was made in china somewhere and the US CAN PRINT OFF AS MUCH MONEY AS IT WANTS (but they have to pay a bit to HP for using their printer paper) to PAY ALL DEBT. But if the debt is in foreign currency then too much inflation will devalue the currency and we will have to pay more $ for each euro of debt.

[MDEMONIC689]

Hmmmn yes, razor blades on standby.

[bloodstaindimond]

DUDE, I CANT PICTURE A STACK OF $16 TRILLION....

[LazyOtaku]

I think he drives home one point, a future in crisis! How much debt does it take to enslave a nation? Find out as our nation is consumed away!

[TheMetalPerson]

Chris says that all debt isn't bad because as an investment, it encourages growth, but a lot of this crash course is based on how growth is unsustainable.

[offthehook2]

After watching these awesome videos, one friend said..

"So (cough), that means I don't have to give the £40.00 I borrowed from you."

"Eh?"

"Well, money is made from thin air. So since there was no money in first place, then I don't have to pay you the money."

"Listen you.."

"Nah. You can't argue over something that never existed. It was just paper and.."

Little knowledge is dangerous. He should be a lawyer and whup the impersonating corporate magistrates.

[aristotledixit]

I'm afraid war is the only way once again to make "the future larger than the present", because it conveniently brings all accounts back to zero. Unfortunately, this time it might bring the world population counter to zero too.

[elboertjie]

A third option would be if the creditors were to disappear...

[LazyOtaku]

@elboertjie here here, death to all debt collectors.

[zonsb]

International banksters via their currency cartel and control of issuance of money and control of governments has used money as a means to transfer wealth from the value creators/producers to themselves and their chosen corporations.

It has all been based in fraud and thus all wealth and assets must be returned to the rightful owners--value creators/producers. All the assets listed in the CAFRs are due/owed to the beneficiaries--the American People.

[zonsb]

A birth certificate is a trust receipt. It's a receipt for a trust deposit. Your mother unknowingly created a grantor trust for you with you as thegrantor/beneficiary. The trust deposit has been fraudulently commingled with others and sold in various financial markets. The assets are to be disbursed to the beneficiary--you.

[zonsb]

Composite govt has more than enough annual ROI to fully fund all its operations without need for collecting a penny in taxes .Government can self finance its operations. More below. Keep in mind that this highlights the problem not the solution. For govt has far to many programs and operations which the vast majority hinder abundance, health and prosperity.

[zonsb]

All US governments, fed, state and local and govt municipalities keep a second set of books. Each govt municipality reports the funds each year in CAFRs (Comprehensive Annual Financial Report).All combined composite government has over 110 trillion dollars in assets listed in the CAFRs and owns 80% of the NYSE and NASDQ. The average annual ROI is 14%. Tha'st over 14 trillion dollars a year in revenue each year. And the mainstream media is stone-cold-silent about it.

[zonsb]

13000 years ago (10000BC) average longevity was 26 years. It took 11000 years to increase human longevity by one third.

200 years ago (1800AD) longevity was about 38 years.

Today, 210 years latter the average age at death is 67 years. That's nearly double the longevity. And that's despite many intentional hindrances to longevity research and development over the last seventy years.

The solution will significantly accelerate the boot-strapping of an ageless future.

[iouhc19]

I think the Zeitgeist Movement and the Venus Project offer a long term viable solution and Ellen Brown Author of "The Web of Debt" has an immediate solution to our financial situation.

Check them out and see if it makes sense to you.

[lwanatt]

so imagine that this system continues unchecked and we do manage to use technology to meet required future gdps, eventually we will hit a brick wall where there just arnt any resources left, some will spread out leave our solar system looking for new prospects, those who stay will be locked in warfare, and most of the world will die, i wonder if perpetual scarcity thereafter will unite the remaining humans into a cooperative framework instead of a competitive one

[RBG02005]

BUSH really was the DEVIL. Hicks are the primary reason that that idiot was put in office in the first place. They're more impressed by "folksy-ness" than someone who's qualified. What's worse is that he was elected TWICE! Everyone that voted for Bush should have to pay for the Iraq war and all the debt increases that he caused. It's a damn shame that I wasn't old enough to vote against that crook and now I have to pay for his (and his voters') stupidity. He should be jailed for treason!

[lwanatt]

come onnn if there really was a satin it would be someone who atleast appeared worth following. Someone too good to be true, bush is to bad to be true.

[kikrlbs]

Funny how our parents want a better future for us, yet they borrow from it to make their lives easier. Thanks mom and dad! You fucking dumbasses...........

[nickrhill]

@kikrlbs Your parents almost certainly don't understand what is happening, much less doing it maliciously.

Ultimately, it will probably not be you who pays, but will be savers, including those who bought pensions.

Since this video was made, the future has become quite clear. The banks and any other corp will be bailed out by the gov't using newly printed, debased currency.

On retirement, baby boomers will likely be much poorer than they imagined, and may not even be able to retire.

[kikrlbs]

@nickrhill Watch "The Money Masters" you can watch for free on here or google. I think my statement is justified.

[TheAttackRat]

@kikrlbs well.. unless ur dad is bush or obama, it's usually not their fault.

[NazTheGreat]

@kikrlbs LMFAO

[lovedalord88]

thank you so much for these videos...

[zoomboost]

This playlist is SO interesting!

[USAepicness]

FALSE. The bank can take your credit card away.

[GovWillKillU]

at some point, labor decoupled from money and became a figment of the imagination, because we can mortgage the future. if money were SOUND, then it would be tied to labor.

[GovWillKillU]

problem is, debt today is not tied to any type of production; its tied to monetary expansionism - thereore it is not really tied to human labor. its tied to promises to pay.

[danno321s]

Gov: To pay with what? More printed money? Then more Inflation. Then lower standard of living? Then what? Another World War?

[GovWillKillU]

black friday = non self liquidating debt.

[Piscivorus]

Interest is justified by the concepts of time valuation and opportunity cost. But when a person lends money to someone for a period of time, they are implicitly declaring that they do not need that money for that period of time. That effectively nullifies any claims of opportunity cost or time valuation and eliminates the justification for charging interest. Interest is only justified when a loan, or loan payment, is past due.

[GovWillKillU]

dont know about that one. lending money is a speculative endevour; it can go to any investment at the discretion of those that hold the money. instead of lending they can buy assets, so in fact the motivation for interest comes from the borrower, not the lender. the borrower must entice the money from those that hold it in some form, that enticement is interest.

[Piscivorus]

If the motivation for interest comes from the borrower, then borrowers should be competing over interest free loans with interest bids, like an auction. But I don't see that happening anywhere. The motivation for interest comes from the lender (banks), by saying one thing with their left face (I don't need this money for the period of the loan) and say the opposite with their right face (I need it back as soon as I give it to you so I will start charge you interest on day one).

[GovWillKillU]

imo lenders dont need to "justify" collecting interest on lending money; but usurous rates do need to be questioned. whether the lender "needs" the money or not is irrelevant. the borrower must compete with other asset options the money could go in to; gold, stocks, etc. of course there is usurous exploitation by the lender, and manipulation to get the rates higher than they should be. ultimately, the credit bubble is their fault, for lax lending practicies, and lending on promises, not equity.

[Piscivorus]

You can't get a loan from just anyone. The only businesses that lend money are specifically dedicated to it so borrowers don't compete over asset options. But you're right, nobody should have to justify their business decisions as long as they are honest. The only dishonest thing I see is fraction reserve lending. That's what needs to be outlawed. Money should only be lent at interest, never created at interest.

[GovWillKillU]

"Money should only be lent at interest, never created at interest. "

wholeheartedly agree.

[Arkady63]

Chiefly medicare and SS? What about military expenditure and the debt it's incurred?

[Joe77477]

He's talking about medicare and SS as liabilities, not debt. Military expenditure does have a lot to do with our debt levels. In chapter 9 he explains how inflationary spending and war have increased the national debt. Medicare and SS are things the gov't is liable to give to taxpayers, since we've paid into the system. It's not a debt like war spending, where the money is literally blown up. I guess you could say its a different kind of debt. You really should watch the whole series of video's

[LadyDrinkKing]

In addition to default and inflation, there is actually a third way of eliminating debt: Loss of confidence in the currency. This looks like inflation because prices go up, but instead of going up because money is created, in this case dollar prices go up because the outside world loses confidence in the dollar. In other words, "price inflation" occurs amid deflation, that is, a collapse in the money supply.

[greatwassim]

a very nice fireside talk, lucid and logical

well done Chris!

[VikingNinjitsu]

i like how he starts this one with a hushed tone

[hardhittn63]

Don't bank loans/contracts obtain real value once they are executed?

[LDRinbrampton]

Yes, loans in straight theory do work. As long as the money is printed interest free, and the loans themselves are interest free. But since money is printed with interest, and loans are made with interest, there is nowhere to get the money to pay of the interest, leading to perpetual increasing debt.

[LDRinbrampton]

actually charging interest on loans is ok too, so long as the printing of money is interest free, and so long as the money gained by the loaner in interest is also spent in the system (keeping all money in the system)

[PanzerDivisionBOM]

What's this thing you have against interest? Do you have the same dislike of any other expressions of time preference?

For instance, how do you feel about land? Is it immoral to sell land?

[LDRinbrampton]

the idea of "selling land" is a little bit of a tricky situation. same with the idea of owning land. But as far as what i have against interest, it seems to me that interest inevitably causes a crash. If i'm the only guy in the world with money, 10 dollars. and I loan that 10 dollars to someone at interest, they will owe me more money than is in existence. and that applies to any interest. Like credit card interest, you owe money that hasn't even been printed yet, essentially.

[PanzerDivisionBOM]

Nono, I meant to ask whether you believe time preference itself to be evil.

Is it wrong to prefer the attainment of a given end now, over the attainment of that same end at some point in the future?

[PanzerDivisionBOM]

But if debt can only be part of a legal contract, and given that a contract cannot be enforced against a person that has not signed it... Those families have nothing to do with the debt. They have no responsibility for its accumulation, and no moral obligation towards its repayment.

[miklozek123]

He is talking about national debt. The fed is what will come after you if you don't pay your taxes. So in essence the future population of the United States will be paying back the debt that is created today. Also being born in the United States is basically a contract that is put on you when you turn 18 as a US citizen.

[PanzerDivisionBOM]

Very well. Then I hereby contract you to pay me an amount of money, equal in value to the current sum-total of your assets. You have until this Friday. ; )

Of course, both you and I understand that this contract is not valid in any moral sense, such as what Mr. Martenson mentioned in his video. No, you are not morally obligated to seed your property to me, just because I say that you should.

And no matter how many guns they get pointed at them, neither are the American taxpayers.

Peace. : )

[sysopkc]

hahahaa inflation OF COURSE. Its a slam dunk

[jimmayl1]

???

profit!

[dcmantommy]

Overall great work again Chris, thank you! Watch it on definitions of 'productive debt'. If it is one of the droves of students who blow thousands of dollars on higher education for a career that outputs very little value, or rhetorical value such as sociology, where there is very little productive return for other humans - it is a net loss for everyone. A union factory worker would earn and produce more lifetime value than a student who blew $100k getting a masters in sociology.

[bergweg]

Is it not ironic that we (labouring folks) create all the funds with out signatures on the promises to pay which they (banksters) then "lend" us back and collect interest and most of time the collateral, they bring nothing to the table and leave with everything. Read the book by Mary-Elizabeth: Croft "How i clobbered every bureaucratic cash-confiscatory agency known to man"

[apogist]

question, is the us the only country which it's government can "print and pay" ?

[managarm1349]

no all central banks do that...if it was only the us that´d be great (for the rest of the world at least)

[golfprobro4eagles]

Reagan did not make it worse moron. If you take a closer look at the graff you will see that he made it posible for Clinton to pay down the dept. What made it worse is your left brain idiot.

[vtwookie]

There is something deeply humorous about someone who can't spell "graph" or "debt" calling someone else a moron or idiot...

[enicao]

So if I understand well, the stimulus package to get the US out of the crisis, will only make things far worse in the future by increasing the level of debt by a few trillions of $.

[captainandthelady]

@enicao True, but a chunck of the stimulus wasn't borrowed money but tax cuts which is still a negative cash flow for the government (us). Between "Dubbya's and "O's" tax cuts we experenced quite a negative cash flow. If we want to pay off our debt we need a positive cash flow without our elected officials spending it as it comes in. We need our infrastructure repaired and rebuilt. If we have to borrow money it should go to things we NEED, not thing we want.

[novice8814]

We borrow from Chinese. Chinese take our land in payment. Send their surplus workers to America. Send us to liquidation camps. Problem solved.

[nageroc]

It started with Reagan.

[andretheking86]

reagan made it worse ... but it started in 1913

[VinceP1974]

I have been telling people that in the future, things like abortion and birth control might be restricted on national security grounds.

[VinceP1974]

111th CONGRESS

H. J. RES. 45

Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of

America in Congress assembled, That subsection (b) of section 3101 of title

31, United States Code, is amended by striking out the dollar limitation contained in such subsection and inserting in lieu thereof

$13,029,000,000,000

[ClassicalRay]

WAKE UP AMERICA!!

[SATANSbankers]

Inflation, then we Pay off our Debt to the Chinese, with Inflated Dollars.

[nobusio]

Fantastic videos,but in the debt chapter you say that ,

there is two possible scenario of how the story ends:

-Either paying back debt thru inflation

or eliminate debt thru bankrupty and defaults (deflation)

what about a third possiblity which would be a combination of both .Therefore an equilibrium between inflation and deflation

still hurting the middle class . it's all wrongflation anyway

[Acrobat747]

Check out the y axis. The scale is increasing, making the debt look higher and creating an impression that things are worse than they really are.

Alot of what this mans says is correct, but he is also a bit of a con man also.

[ChrisMartensondotcom]

Which graph are you referring to? The scale does not change on the main debt graph (around 7:30) -- it increases by 20 unit intervals. The baseline is not zero for this graph, but that does not affect the graph's shape.

[Acrobat747]

I apologise, I am very much mistaken.

I got mixed up because the baseline did not start at zero, and fully agree that this does not affect the graphs shape.

However, I notice that the graph jumps from 140 to 180 then 180 to 200, doubling the increase. I presume this is a mistake?

[FranceParisian]

Please check this comment below by Chromatype. I find this very disturbing and I tried to reply but each time my reply becomes a separate comment. Address this!

"I think all of you need to realize something. Chris is selling month subscriptions for $30.00. If he scares 500,000 people into wanting to "support his cause"...he will generate 15 million dollars for himself.

That is way more that any one needs to take care of website server costs. This guy is out to make a LOT OF MONEY REAL FAST."

[TimTrimT]

Interesting, I didn't realize he was making money in some way off this.

Okay, I doubt I'd give anyone money for this. But I would offer great appreciation - this (free) video series is a pretty cool contribution to the public.

So while making money off of fear is annoying, it doesn't diminish the factual value of what he is illustrating. Shoot holes in the information he presents if you can, but I've been studying this stuff for years and he's doing a pretty fair representation of reality IMHO

[amarssadal]

@ChrisMartensondotcom i am not a math genius but the y scale on graph does not corrspond to the numbers. if it is increasing by 20 then the top should be 500 not 320.

[JubJubJr123]

@Acrobat747

Dude it was only the first 2 increments on the y axis, and if you look closely at the graph, there is a line imbetween it nyway that he forgot to number. the guy isnt dishonest, he just made a small mistake with his graphing. hes not a con man u N00B XD

[pjblabla]

The crash course is simply a brilliant and so far the best summary I have seen of our recent economic past, present and ... contemplation about future

enlightening!

[enderwiggin42]

This part is scary, running up debt is enslaving our children :O

[honestcurio]

Brilliant, profound, and scary. This guy is a genius and a great teacher.