DeGette on Healthcare Part 1

[DAHAZE10]

Did you know Degette voted to keep ACORN funding even though they have been proven to be corrupt? They are now being investigated in 20 states including Colorado. Did she vote for them because they helped her campaign? Where is the representation here?

[armyveteran101st]

I'm inclined to believe that ACORN was the victim of a hatchet job. That film crew that ambushed them was made up of conservative activists, and we all know that nowadays conservative activists have very little regard for facts and for the truth. If it had been anyone else bringing this to light, I'd be more inclined to believe the evidence, but I just don't. However, it was a good idea for Congress to stop funding and to start the investigation. That will ensure ACORN behaves honestly.

[DAHAZE10]

Actually all activists on both sides of the spectrum are sometimes lacking a respect for the truth. If you agree that it was a good thing for congress to stop funding then you are opposed to Degettes view. I cant help but wonder why she voted that way.

[DAHAZE10]

I am definitely in favor of healthcare reform. I dont want this particular bill and neither does the majority. If it is going to pass we need a national referendum. When people voted in Nov. Did they know their taxes would go up? Did they know the war would continue to drain the government or did they know their reps would totally ignore their wishes? They Dems ran on change. But nothing changed. If thats the case I'd rather have them back out of state issues.

[armyveteran101st]

I live in California, and the referendum practice has brought this state to the deplorable condition it is in right now. Referendums don't work in our Country. As far as taxation goes, it is about time people start getting rid of the notion that they can get something for nothing. Yes, we pay a lot of taxes, but that is the price of living in a civilized, equitable, compassionate society. Republicans would have you believe that money falls from the sky, and that no one has to pay for anything.

[DAHAZE10]

If they dont work than how do you know the will of the people? I never wanted something for nothing. I object to others who do and the government takes from me to give it to them. THE GOV IS NOW GIVING AWAY 10% of our swine flu vaccines in the name of compassion. What about the people i this country who want and need them? You have to draw a line somewhere.

[DAHAZE10]

Indeed you are correct. Bu I do see 2 problems. First who determines what is for the general welfare? What she thinks is good you or I may not. Second, You mention above that "all duties, imposts, and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States." The taxes and penalties in these bills arefar from uniform and as such may be unconstitutional. Maybe its not the end of discussion. The polls show over half of the people dont want thse plans. Where is the representation by government then?

[armyveteran101st]

The people determine what is for the general welfare, through majority votes cast during elections, such as the one we had last November. That was the ultimate poll, as far as I am concerned. Yes, the details have to be worked through and adjusted, but the people expressed their wishes quite clearly last November. If we had listened to polls back in the 1940's and 1960's, we wouldn't have Social Security or medicare, and our Country would have been the worst for it.

[DAHAZE10]

The people did vote for change. Many want health reform but we didnt have access to this bill. Once folks saw the bill they they didnt want it and that is why the current polls are more relevant. Re. SS+ M., how do we know we would be worse off without it? M. has definitely proven to be cost effective though. With SS If I hadnt been taxed I'd have over 500K. That would cover alot of health care. Combined with the fact that benefits will have to be cut 25% by the time I retire to cont. it.

[armyveteran101st]

That's what all the naysayers keep saying, but the bill was posted everywhere online for all to see. And the same naysayers picked through it to find something to twist and distort about it. These naysayers happen to be very effective in the use of misinformation and deceit, and they have been able to take advantage of the public's ignorance, manipulating them into believing something that isn't true. You can't seriously be asking why we would have been worse off without SS and Medicare!!

[DAHAZE10]

Actually it wasn't posted. The people voted for change in NOvember. The bill wasn't even written until April. Have you read it. I have twice. While there is crtainly spin out there there are some definite probs with it. For example funding, abortions, fines for non-coverage, shortage of care providers, Disclosure of personal info etc.

[armyveteran101st]

I have read it, and did so online. The concerns regarding what you call "definite probs" have been addressed and explained ad-nauseum. The opposition just has been way too busy being obstinate and obstructionist, and hasn't had neither the time nor the willingness to listen. All these items you mention are being used to distort information and deceive people.

[DAHAZE10]

Actually many of them have not been replied to sufficiently. Just because they gave their reason to fine americans for not having insurance doesn't make it right to tax them for their choice. Re provider shortage: subsidies for education might help us in 20 years but might not. Especially if 45% of doctors take early retirement when the bill passes. Also they have never actually come up with a way to make it budget nuetral.