Creation In The 21st Century - Crunch The Numbers Part 1 (2 of 3)

[Ben1987X]

WOW! what a evidence! its amazing! to bad about those dinosaurs huh..and that salt water and sweet water dont mix and fish would die..in the story of noah..you know a man of 600 years gathering all animals from the whole country in a boat that is way to small...

[SquareRo0o0t]

Derka Derppppppppppppppppppppppppppp­!!!!

[gastarbeiter1]

So incest is favoured by the bible?All the grandchildren of noah had sex with each other?Nice explanation.And we know that there was no bottleneck event 4.4 thousand years ago.These wannabe numbers really piss me off.

[ASKBELLA1]

Microevolution.. can be shown and is logical for a creationist to believe.

Macroevolution.. is a joke.. and if anybody who believes in darwinism were to say that 'creationists/ believers in God had to wear faith on the chin", are complete hypocrits , because the kind of faith they " Non believers in God" have in their own right is something that is literally out of this world.

[FluffyBunniesOnFire]

It embarrasses me that there are people who actually believe in the reasoning of this liar. Exponential population growth is always temporary as it conflicts with the equilibrium of its environment.

[alfredo11]

Continuous exponential growth only holds if there are no disturbances in the system. For Prof Heffner to crunch the number, 2.45x10^990, he had to ASSUME, that there are NO DISEASES, NO FAMINE, NO DROUGHT, so on; He has to assume that humans then lived in a condition perfect for rapid growth.

Furthermore, there is always a finite amount of resources in the environment, thus the ecosystem has a fixed CARRYING CAPACITY of organisms, and their populations will not and cannot go beyond this limit.

[Imaginefree69]

The claim that "Never been anything in archeology that refutes scripture" is an amazingly bald-faced lie. In fact, virtually NONE of the basic myths in the Bible can be supported by archaeology. Not the Egyptian enslavement of Israelites, not the Plagues or Passover or Wanderings, not the numerous genocides commanded by YHVH, not even the so-called "slaughter of the innocents" which John invented to make it appear as if Hosea's prophecy had been fulfilled, not even the life or death of Jesus.

[bradandnicole]

@Imaginefree69 So you used to be a christian lol,maybe if you seeked the truth instead of being brainwashed by evos or atheists,you might still be a christian,but what your saying is probably a lie anyway.I could say a lot of things but i will just attack one of your lies,to say that jesus didnt exist at all is the most braindead dumbass things i have ever heard especially with the enormous amount of evidence that he did exist.Why dont you ask any credible historian for info and see the truth.

[bradandnicole]

Evilution gets owned again,why do people and why are they so gullible to believe in the greatest hoax ever invented,evilution theory is dead evos get over it.

[Imaginefree69]

@bradandnicole The basic problem is that the people who attack evolution have not actually studied it. If they did, they would see that there's nothing TO attack. It isn't a Satanic Conspiracy, it's simply the description of a process, providing a very useful taxonomy and a way to understand relationships. I see no way around this problem of ignorance. And it will become far worse if we allow these untutored people to drag our science education back into the bronze age.

[bradandnicole]

@Imaginefree69 Ahh us creationists are uneducated and have not studied anything properly lol but evilutionists they are the smartest people in the world and are wrong about nothing,what a joke you evos are i mean there are so many creation scientists that have been to the same universities etc etc and have got the same qualifications as there counterparts and put in the time and effort,yet a hell of a lot of creation scientists were formerly evilutionary scientists but they know nothing lol.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole-- i mean there are so many creation scientists that have been to the same universities etc etc and have got the same qualifications-- All 700 of them, as compared to 400.000 who are behind evolution. CONGRATULATIONS !!!

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon Hey you are a filthy liar as simple as that and you know it.

There are just as many creation scientists,intelligent design scientists as there are evilution scientists and you can take that to the bank.

While your at it as well if your going to comment me back,give me a credible reference to this stat youve provided i would like to see it.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole You are not a filthy liar, just a brainwashed uneducated individual. Y You can find any information you want these days, . I am not your teacher..

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon I know who the brainwashed one is it is you my brainded little halfwit evo friend.

I thought you couldnt provide the answer and what else would you expect from a typical atheist evo loser.

Isnt it funny how evilutionists always lose debates with creationists,maybe its because we have got all the truth on our side and evos have got all the lies on there pathetic side.

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon Just remember as well a majority isnt always right as a matter of fact a majority have been wrong plenty of times,just go and look at hitlers germany for example and by the way hitler and his cronies were pro evilutionists and darwinists and look at how right they were lol.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole Shows again your low education level or your extreme brainwashing. In 1933 hitler instructed all German libraries to burn Darwins books . He further boosted to have stamped out" godless atheism" in Germany. I lived through WW2. You are just BRAINWASHED to the hilt.

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon You just never stop lying do you.

Show me some references to these things your saying and put up or shut up.

Google hitler and evolution or hitler and darwinism or maybe even google hitler and eugenics.

You are a fool!.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole Yes, you are a damned fool, and uneducated to booth

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon Maybe youve just got some sort of mental illness especially when you are writing all this rubbish on youtube and by the way us commenting to each other is just about over and i will be blocking you soon because we are going around in a vicous circle.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole It`s an honor to be blocked by a simpleton of your kind.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole Because what you call the "greatest hoax' is the greatest discovery of the last 2 centuries . It is the concurrence of the conclusions of all the appropriate sciences that make evolution FACT. Stop your stupid rear-guard skirmishes and christian demagoguery against science. Stick to your bible, there you don`t need any evidence.

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon greatest discovery lol if it is such a great discovery then why do the vast majority of people on earth reject it.I will tell you why because we still havent got a missing link of which evilutionists freely admit themselvesand evilution has got heaps of frauds and lies.I will stick to the bible because it has been proven by science not unlike evilution of which still hasnt been proven and it never will be proven.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole The bible has been proven by science exactly like " Snowhite and the 7 Dwarfs" has been proven by science. Scieence disporves the bible more and more. Except for the existence of certain towns and customs, the bible has no evidence.

[bradandnicole]

@lizazoon Yeah whatever you say evo,there is so much evidence for the bible it is not even funny,just go and look up your history and you would see this fact for yourself and i suppose are you one of those crackpots that say jesus didnt even exist,apart from the miracles etc.If jesus didnt exist then why is there so much historical evidence that he did josephus etc etc.

Ask any historian and i wonder if you are a holacaust skeptic as well,maybe you are with such a little brain that youve got.

[lizazoon]

@bradandnicole Your ranting and raving and insulting ,demeaning rhetoric says it all about your education and morals. You seem to know zilch about your masters teaching.

[mrx0066600]

The life spans and also taking into content wars, events like viruses spreading, There are a ton of variables that affect the human race's population growth.

You people are insanely inept when it comes to thinking in terms of actual science.

You have no facts and assume like no one's business.

You fail, and you fail at life.

Fade into the darkness of human embarrassment that you represent for our history.

[georgeeboy2222]

simplicity,sound knowlage,mathmatics is a fact of life,we could not live without the order of it.evolution is a delusion of the mind,and no new theory,its a new fad,witch was said in the bible would happen,godless society,

[CaptainToolong]

"after the flood they came off the boat...thay probably had a few daughters.." these guys are so clever

[arealisticone]

Hes an idiot

[andmarikis]

What I really love is that they never extrapolate their theory into the future by saying in a hundren thousand years our population will be gigantic! What would happen then? maybe a reduction in the birthrate, or increase in the deathrate? RIIIIIIIGHT...?

[Ozzyman200]

Hilarious. Anyone can see the obvious mathematical flaw in this. They assumed esponential growth. D'Oh!

If there were any evidence for creationism- man created by magic from dirt, why has no one presented it by now?

[PinkProgram]

I've been asking for that for months now. It would revolutionize medical science ^_^ You could fix amputees with clay arms and legs.

On a note the math in this video is horrible.

[Daytimeofnight]

It's not a homo sapien tooth, it's a homo erectus tooth. These guys clearly have no idea what they are talking about.

[sev773]

I like how he calls the drowning of a BILLION people by their god an "interruption". Doesn't seem to bother them.

[qwuad61]

There is no hope with evolution,only unending dispair.

[ProphetTenebrae]

That's why science invented internet pornography, beer and pizza.

[andmarikis]

Well NOW you tell us. Shit.

[fireflygirl246]

look up farming, modern medicine and sanitarian and it effects on population growth.

[insanekoolness]

right. and you look up when those came into place.

[fireflygirl246]

well farmings been around a long time well over 4000 years i believe, so that allowed us to move up form hunter gathers to form actual settlements and start forming a culture. Although framing has improved over this time, just like medicine and sanitation. If we take way all the technology we have today, hell if you just took away electricity we would be back at biblical time population levels in only a few years.

[GinEric84]

I love how creationists scoff and some are even enraged at the the idea of being "monkeys" but they will go out of their way to believe that they are MASSIVELY INBRED! Even come up with silly formulas to "prove" they are inbred.

[insanekoolness]

The gene pool back then would have been much richer in quality. If you understood genetics at all you would know that.

[ProphetTenebrae]

This is probably when some joke about the prevalence of Christian fundamentalism in the deep South should be made.

[andmarikis]

"Should" or "inevitably will"?

[ogrimdoombringer]

Creotrards.

[andmarikis]

LabelWin!

[blaqb0x]

What system of equations does he use to compute these numbers. y = Ae^bt ? No compensation for death rate, technological innovations, limited space and resources....

Makes me question if he is a real mathematician.

[insanekoolness]

right because back then we had no space but we had drugs and cars to kill us.

[flyingfisbeefilms]

HUGE FACE PALM!

[stork5100]

Appeal to Fear of Large Numbers.

This particular logical fallacy only seems to affect creationists.

[insanekoolness]

And computers.

[andmarikis]

LOL!

[Gorteenminogue]

"Using the Bible's numbers and common sense..." Let's play 'Spot the Oxymoron'.

[polop1234]

xD lol

[Maliciuos]

Yes, their math would be right if humans were immortal for those 500 000 years. How can you forget to include DEATH in your equations? Can I call you crocoduck now?

[Nocturnalux]

Heh, I've seen some other creationists claim that the closer to creation one goes the longer the life expectancy was. Really. Something about Noah's ancestors living thousands of years. But they did die...eventually, except for one that was "raptured" ahead of time.

Next, stay tuned for the pink invisible unicorn!

[Maliciuos]

People would never cry during the funerals too. Religion = hypocrisy and/or money fraud scheme. It should be illegal.

[MikeJunker]

I think that my favorite part of this video is the graph the "expert" put up to show how the human population has grown to it's current size according to the exponential growth formula.

It's my favorite, because it's not a graph of exponential growth. Somebody just drew in a graph of the way populations actually grow. Very fast at first, then holding constant at the carrying capacity, then increasing quickly again when some limiting factor is removed.

[fancofu]

1) The model assumes a constant population growth. This is a false assumption because it doesn't take into account famine, war, plague, etc. It also doesn't take into account the period of time before agricultural advancements when population growth would have been extremely low.

2) The model doesn't even match up with the Bible. If the flood happened in 2350bc. and the Exodus was on 1446bc. there wouldn't have been 600,000 people alive for Moses to lead. There would have only been ~700.

[fancofu]

If it doesn't match up with the Bible then which is wrong: The Bible or the model?

[andmarikis]

Both!

[Medhiv83]

"If you are at all interested I am happy to get into it with you. It takes FAITH to believe evolution since no one was there when the big-bang happened"

please tell me you're goofin' around ... as evolution and the big bang have nothing to do with each other, plus: evolution has been wittnessed an proven right beyond any degree, at least to a point, that no intelligent person can deny it

[Medhiv83]

i love it, how he takes into account that not every of the 2,8 children survives (natural selection anyone) + how many died not reraching adulthood and that homo sapiens has been at the top of the food chain only for about the past 10.000 or even less years ... well, but who can be bothered with fake-scientists :-P

[flyinkiwi01]

Wow that looks really scientific! You might be in a minority of creationists as any date over 10,000 years ago they view with caution. What about inbreeding? It didn't work for the Egyptian royalty.If we came from such a small population we would have only made it few generations before humans were infertile or congenital abnormalities extinguished us. Look at some of the underlying assumptions of your calculation. Somehow evolution is still an accepted fact despite your amazing proof against it

[TheProf1988]

''Somehow evolution is still an accepted fact despite your amazing proof against it ''

yeah. because they have to admit that all racial subtypes and haplogroups must have evolved since adam. adam couldnt have had ALL haplogroups.

also, adam must have had every human specific desease UNLESS all of those diseases eveloved AFTER he was created.

thats the logic of creationists

[flyinkiwi01]

Just an aside Prof.

Do current Anthropologists or Evolutionary Biologists / Population Scientists still use the term race in any of its forms? If so can you tell me how many races there are, how valid the construct is, and the characteristics of each?

This is my hobby horse a bit. We still for some reason use the language of disproven theories (not evolution so don't get excited - science is self-correcting unlike religion).

[TheProf1988]

as a collective or individually?

the concept of 'race' is still valid although now we refer to the very real genetic phenomenon of haplotype disparity due to geographic seperation rather than to outdated, outmoded and invalid concepts of racial hierarchy and subspeces.

race is still very real, but now it is more objective instead of subjective. i hope you are not implying that evolution can be used to justify racism? (when in fact one can debunk racism with evolutionary theory)

[flyinkiwi01]

No Prof I am not suggesting that evolution and racism have any valid link. Depending on the parameters of the research method when determining how many races there are we get different numbers. That is a rather basic thing to disagree about. I find the term and its associations rather useless.

[andmarikis]

I'd argue that there is no such thing as biological race. There is such thing as traits. Period. Race has no specific genetic definition or genetic marker. A scientist can't look at a genome and determine a race. Some traits come in sets as determined by biological history which, due to region and culture sometimes pool into regular populations. Therefore it's a cultural concept, not a genetic one. cheers

[TheProf1988]

Race can be defined, just like any other term. It does have meaning.

Read my comment again, I never stated that a single genetic marker coded for race, rather I stated that we can identify geographic subgroups of human beings that have genetically drifted in the thousands of years of seperation between them. This accounts for the phenomenon of race.

[TheProf1988]

''My eye-witness was God who wrote Exodus 20. Adam is also a good witness as well. ''

eye witnesses are worth nothing.

gentics and radiometric dating falsify the absurd claims of the bible.

try reading the Book in the form of allegory and metaphors that allude to religious truth. to consider the bible to be a literal reading is blasphemy in the highest degree

[flyinkiwi01]

I would go one further and question the existence of religion as a source of 'truth'. It is more like using homeopathy versus surgery when the goal is to transplant a heart.

Fascinating arguments here. Only a few hundred years ago reaching an age where you could procreate was an huge achievement... how can we then assume that every human born reached breeding age, was fertile, survived childbirth, their children survived, and no-one ever dies? How does this fit with what we know???

[TheProf1988]

''How does this fit with what we know??? ''

it doesnt. this argument is so debase and counter intuitive.

its difficult to know whether these men really believe this stuff and are merely trying to con others or whether they have convinced themselves.

surely anyone with even a rudimentary understanding of population dynamics can point this out to them

i learned thsi stuff in primary school geography!

[TheProf1988]

''That's the point...the evolution model just flat out don't work no matter how you slant it. Try it with 25,000 years ago and 2 original people. ''

this population exponent is fundamentally flawed that even a child can point it out.

it is carrying capacity that determines the size of the population.

humans have undergone two growth spurts. a small one 8000 years ago with the discovery of agriculture and one 200 years ago with the advent of modern science

[flyinkiwi01]

What I was saying was that we can objectively trace all human genes back in time (far beyond any timeframe accepted by creationsists) to smaller populations living in Africa... not a single individual without a population. Not some first human but simply our common ancestor.

I accept evidence from methodicical scientific enquiry... you accept prophecies and revelation as evidence. That is why we differ. You do not have an eye witness... other people will read this and wonder about you lol.

[RoundyBowt]

So many people are watching this, and all they can say is "this is sad" or "fail". Look at the facts you fools, before yuo comment. Can't you at least see an ounce of truth in this video?

[RJL738]

That first number would be more than a trecentillion, the second number would be ten douquadragintillion.

[flyinkiwi01]

Grrr, just because we can trace our lineage back to a single female through genetics in no way at all implies that she was a stand-alone first human. Tracing back looks at the rate and incidence of change in the Mitochondria. This first 'eve' was undoubtedly a member in a larger population of physically similar human individuals. This stuff is just pissing me off now.

[flyinkiwi01]

Why has there got to be population growth consistently at the same rate for 500,000 years? Most scientists posit that the human population was largely consistent at under 5 million up until 10,000 BC. Remember this was in a harsh environment without modern medicine, immunisation, secure food supply, inadequate clothing, hygiene, housing, small populations of nomadic peoples and VERY short life expectancy. You were an elite if you had even one child survive to fertility. Model = so so wrong.

[ronaldec7]

Man this is really sad.

[fissure226]

the numbers stated where all accepted by secular sources: current human population, the population equation, evolutionist human origin year range.

so the silly christians used numbers that they didn't make up. they just did the math.

The ignornance blatent disregard in today's world culture is beyond ludicrous, it's violently sickening. If you people read and analyzed half the arrogant vomit you spew out whenever your beliefs are chalenges you would all procede to suicidaly drown in it.

[victorcelmare]

silly christians, numbers are for scientists !

[UGLandrum]

Numbers for scientist? There are countless creationist scientist.

[zawam]

what an utter load of bollocks

[kalsolarUK]

you said it!

[ReadBetweenTehLines]

WOW. Just... wow. "There's no reason to believe it didn't take an up turn many times before that." Maybe if you have no knowledge of history, or no knowledge of the importance of industrialization, or no knowledge of the importance of modern medicine, or no knowledge of the importance of modern farming methods. Yeah, no reason at all. I've seen enough clearly deliberate distortions in this video to know these 2 are nothing more than frauds, who are either lying to themselves, or everyone else.

[mrAndersen72]

Creationists and numbers....tsk tsk, morons.

[aarlin81]

Perfect example given very early is the number of electrons [estimated] within the Universe. "Not and Dr." Baugh fails to mention that this is the KNOWN UNIVERSE.

[gnubieorg]

Regardless of your opinion of the content in the video, considering the "number of electrons" was used simply as an illustration to describe the magnitude of the number, I don't see what your point is.. Whether "known" was specified or not, it is irrelevant to the actual content of the discussion.

[aarlin81]

Nice Strawman

First, the argument assumes what it is supposed to prove. Second, all such arguments yield absurd values for population sizes at historical times. Third, the argument ignores what is known about population dynamics from other species. Fourth, final population size is an unreliable indicator of initial population time.

Fun FACT: Creationists still cannot explain lack of genetic diversity: Adam and Eve/Noah and his small family. They simply dismiss mutant babies.

[gnubieorg]

That wasn't a strawman, that was pointing out the fact that you were being obtuse.

As for your other points, those are valid points, and I don't argue them. I'm not a creationist. But, please, stop using "points" like whether the man said "known number of electrons", or "number of electrons" to try to prove your point, because it makes you sound silly.

[mookiewak]

Actually it is. I think the original comment was in regards to Creationists and numbers. This is a poke at how they never stand up. Rather than offer up supportive or contradicting comments to that point you chose to attack something more simple.

Also it is relevant to the comment made by

mrAndersen72 because it's misleading.

[aarlin81]

Hey let's look at some more numbers. Let's stick to the ones discussed in the video regarding the population formula.

The formula used is hopelessly flawed and contrived, since it assumes a perfectly uniform world population growth rate to two decimal places for the last 4300 years (the alleged time since the Flood). What makes the formula even more indefensible is that it contradicts a literal reading of the Old Testament since it forces the Exodus to have occurred no earlier than 346 A.D.

[UGLandrum]

Becuase we are using math and numbers to help PROVE creation is truth, btw one of those "morons" is my father, John Heffner, and the other one is mine and his friend. Do your research before you call us morons please.

[UGLandrum]

Oh and anther thing, My father John Heffner, is a math genius and a walking computer, he could have been a astro physicist if he wanted to. I am affended at your comment, but I do not hate you for it, I would hope you would reconsider your beleifs.

[nuthouse94]

@UGLandrum noone cares what ur father does for a living