Stupid vid! why there is no word trinity in the bible? think about it! if it were true then god would make no secret bout it! but jesus allways said the father is greater than me! read book genensis! what his spirit gods spirit is! just a tool like thing not a person!
@MrQuad4w41: The Bible does nowhere EXPLICITLY say "The earth is a globe!", yet I and you believe the earth is a globe! You don't need a special "word" written down in the Bible in order to prove the reality of it. The book of Ester does not even mention the word "God", yet after reading the book, you are sure that every page of this book describes the truthful working of the one true God. Have you noticed the context and the Greek text of Joh 14:28 "the Father is greater"?
@MrQuad4w41 Have you any idea of the usage of the Greek μείζων the New Testament? Have you noticed that this Greek word does not refer to nature or quality but rather privilege or office? Christ emptied Himself of some privileges (read Phil 2:7) in order to become a bond-servant (while He was God in the flesh at the same time), don't you notice that the Father's being "greater" applies only to the context, while Christ fullfilled the will of the Father in order to finally become a sin-offering?
Mat 10:33 - Since Christ and the Father are "one" (not one single person, but one single unity, that can not be separated; Joh 10:30) the denial of Christ is the denial of the Father also. Thus the reality of the trinity is no optional doctrine that one can deny while the other one can embrace. Notice that Joh 10:30 is in context another proof of the deity of Christ (Joh 10:1-33).
Therfore Christ commanded him to leave his riches in order to flee from his delusion. But as it is with all people, who love money and mammon, he refuses to OBEY the God of the law, CHRIST!. The Jews were so deeply involved in keeping traditions, that they DO NOT see that they disobey God all day long by keeping their traditions. And thatbis the whole point od this account.
The Jews separated the law of God from the God of the law and made the law superior than God. All this must be considered in the context of Mat 19:16. So since the rich young ruler wanted to know which good thing (i.e. which law) he should obey in order to be saved, Christ turned him to the keeping of the entirety of the law. If the rich man would have been honest, he would have recognized his bankruptcy. The man sadly thought to be accepted by God because of the richeshe had.
The Jews had a saying: "There is nothing good, but the law." In Mat 19:16 he asked "What good thing shall I do...". Thus he wanted to know WHICH LAW (i.e. the good) he should obey. Christ kind of corrected his high view of the law by reminding him, that God is more good than the law. The rich tested Christ by "declaring Him good" in order to see whether Christ would refuse this title given to Him. It is like "Rich man, do you understand your words? If you call Me good, I am God"
Joh 5:30 is a statement WITHIN a special context. Deny the context and you will not see the contextual meaning. Christ existed in the form of God, but voluntarily emptied Himself of His divine privileges in order to take the form of a bond-servant (Phil 2:5.7), and as bond-servant (yet still God) He expressed absolutely dependence upon His Father by saying "I can do nothing on My own initiative". Don't forget that Christ made Himself equal with God 12 verses before (Joh 5:18)!
"Any God that we can fully understand and explain, like a unitarian God, would be an entity no greater than we are"
I think this would be false. Firstly, different people can "comprehend" at different levels is very likely, but more importantly there is no logical reason for a unitarian existence being impossible, while a "polytarian" existence being possible. The 'solutions' come from a problem that does not seem fully explained.
wow that makes so much sense, my theory on how the trinity works is that the father, the holy spirit, and jesus are just forms but they are all one and the same and being infinity powerful he can be all of them at once, kinda like how clones work in superheros or naruto and scientifically speaking jesus was a clone of god that used mary as the perfect surrogate parent for his mortal form to be created and born from just like every mortal so he can see the hardships of being human and die for us
He was God at the moment then why did he limit his powers i cant be human and say i am a dog i cant be human and act like a dog either it still dosent make sence the statment is clear i canot and yet we know god can do anything .. who is he God or the son of God or just a prophet . and who is mary ? mother of God or just a human channel or way to earth for God why choose a human yet GOD COULD HAVE JUST COME TO EARTH WITHOUT A NEED OF HUMAN
@ALESHBAK You need to check out my video, "The Truth about Christianity" God had to become human for important reasons in dealing with us and agape love.
@ALESHBAK lol god sent himself to earth , since he is the purest person living. He used jesus to die for us in order to take away our sins, since we are all born as sinners due to adam, The only person who is pure enough to do this would be god himself ( jesus) , i dont know why all you question it? Jesus is GOD, you say our religion is illogical but many people would agree religion all in itself is illogical, the only thing you need in religion is FAITH.
@ALESHBAK in order to communicate with us God is able to take our form. if we can't understand it fully, that's understandable since we're not God. in order to get the answers to all your questions, why not ask Him? He is well able to get through if you really are wanting to hear, & will even give you Faith if you need some. if you are capable of realizing you have done some wrong things & should be sorry & need to be forgiven, you've put a foot on the right trail...
thats quite the cop out... to begin your explanation with, "God is not totally comprehensable". to begin one's belief with confusion is not the best way to begin.
I can do nothing on my own. I judge as God tells me. Therefore, my judgment is just, because I carry out the will of the one who sent me, not my own will.
@ALESHBAK Jesus became fully man and could do nothing on His own, until He was the risen Lord. He accepted all the limitations of humanity when He was on earth. So He was still God, yet fully man and limited by that. When He resurrected He was no longer stuck by the limitation of humanity. I hope this helps.
IT DOSENT MAKE SENSE ,,, I HAVE BEEN SEARCHING THE BIBLE TO FIND A CLEAR STATEMENT WHERE JESUS SAYS I AM GOD OR I AM THE TRINITY IN FACT JESUS HIM SELF WOULDNT RECOGANISE THE NAME JESUS CHRIST TODAY WHOEVER I KEEP WONDERIING HOW COULD JESUS DIE FOR MY SINS BEFORE I HAD COMMITED ANY AND WHY WOULD ADAMS SIN BE PAID BY ME AND YET JESUS DIES FOR ME COS ADAM DID THE SIN ?!!!
Proof from the bible that the trinity is man made: (1 Corinthians 14:33) For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace. Jesus prophecised that he would be worshiped in Mark 7:7, "They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men."
You say that the doctrine of the trinity begins with the belief that the true god is not fully comprehensible but the entire video is about comprehending god. You say that God must be comprised of 3 spacial dimensions to be omnipresent, but space and time has a beginning and it will have a ending. According to your logic God is dependent on space and time. I believe in one God, I believe there is non comparable unto him and he has no beginning or ending, can anyone fully comprehend that?
You say that the doctrine of the trinity begins with the belief that the true god is not fully comprehensible but the entire video is about comprehending god. You say that God must be comprised of 3 spacial dimensions to be omnipresent, but space and time has a beginning and it will have a ending. According to your logic God is dependent on space and time. I believe in one God, I believe there is non comparable unto him and he has no beginning or ending, can anyone fully comprehend that?
@nurghak I said God must be greater than 3 spatial dimensions. Space is defined as something 3D. Anything 4D or above is not defined by space, it's in the dictionary. You're also taking those verse out of context. In Mark 7:7, Jesus is quoting Isaiah & is speaking about a prophecy Isaiah made about the pharisees. In Cor 14:33, Paul is talking about tongues in the church. This isn't proof because the verses you are quoting are out of context. Read the full passage surrounding each verse.
The problem with this argument is that you claim we can not understand the other dimensions, yet you try to explain how god fits into them. Also, you used a verse in trying to prove the bible makes a reference to multidemension (Isaiah: 40:28), but it doesn't even somewhat seem to reference to it at all. It merely states his knowledge capabilities. Also, when you try to state how religions always make god understandable. It would be much more comprehensible to make the god seem uncomprehensible
@tttdub No, I do not explain how God fits in to them. I just say God is hyper dimensional. I do not try to explain this, nor do I claim I fully understand it. However, if God is God, He would have to be greater than us in all aspects, including His dimensions and form. I referenced Isaiah 40:28 for more with the 1st part of the verse, "The Lord is the everlasting God." infinite is everlasting. I hope this helps.
Intresting, still unexplained. The G-d of the "Bible" is not a plausable referrence. The "Bible" as it is to Christians is comprised of two Bibles, stemming from two Thiest systems. Jesus is birthed "systemically" from the Jewish Tanach (aka Old Testament), however, during the course of Church History there have been many ideas introduced, influenced & doctruinized. One of them being the "Trinity". There really is no Biblical proof that G-d was to be taught as a Triune Entity.
@MrJSTinnin These are two different subjects you bring up, and the purpose of the video isn't to address them. I plan to address down the road in other videos. I will do a video on the trinity in the old testament and one abolishing the myth that Nicaea created orthodox Christianity.
@HonestTechnoAthiest You're missing the point of the video. The video was not designed to prove God exists, it was designed to debunk the myth that the Trinity is unexplainable. This is not a video for atheists because you already deny God's existence so why would this video matter to you? This video is for people who do believe in God and argue about his nature and form. I use other arguments for God's existence.
@HonestTechnoAtheist If God wasn't omnipresent and if God was 3D I would agree. But if God exists, then we cannot assume He would be on the same level as us, how would He be God then? If God exists, His attributes would have to far exceed ours, hence hyper-dimensionism. I agree this is just a theory and is based primarily on the fact that God must exist, but that is a different topic. I consider this video more of a secondary clue to His existence, not a primary one.
Your cube idea FAILS because as the cube would turn the 2 dimensional being would see 2 Dimensional aspects of the Corners of the cube.
From the Point of View of the 2 Dimensional being that which is 3 dimensional does not exist!
Thank you for showing how YOUR GOD DOES NOT EXIST!
Besides something in a higher dimension wouldn't have the same ideas of what is right and wrong as its existence would be beyond such petty things as our social cultures!
@MrGoodNKinky you are applying an analogy in a way it isn't meant to be. "from the point of view of the 2 dimensional being that which is 3 dimensional does not exist!" false if you make that claim then you do not exist because we are 3D. "something in a higher dimension wouldn't have the same ideas of what is right and wrong as its existence would be beyond such petty thingsas our social cultures" baseless assertion. "must like we are beyond that of inchworms" yes God is beyond us so what?
@MrGoodNKinky If a cube turns in 2D space, a 2D being would see lines and points. It would not look anything like a cube. However, since we are talking about a cube in a 2D world, that doesn't mean 3D doesn't exist. Just because a 2D can't picture it, doesn't make something non-existent. The cube is just an analogy, and by definition, analogies are not perfect. Reading to much into an analogy doesn't attack the actual argument.
The Analogy FAILS because it doesn't take into consideration the turning aspect. Which would be PROOF to the 2d beings that there is something weird about this. As opposed to the they would just see the flat sides.
This also doesn't say anything about that 3d object having a Personal interest in 2d society. Doesn't even begin to cover why something from one dimension would care at all about the acts of those in the other dimension.
@MrGoodNKinky Again, attacking an analogy doesn't mean you are attacking the actual argument. I think the analogy clearly shows the 2D being sees something weird already happening, since the squares all are one object. If he were to see some lines in between the squares, he wold just think he say a square, then lines, then another square. This seems very nit picky.
As soon as you go into dimensional for your God you FAIL!
Reason being the Universe is the sum total of all that exists. Whatever would exist, If anything does exist outside of our universe would to us not exist.
So if your God is outside of our Universe then from the view point of our Universe Your God DOES NOT EXIST!
Further more there is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for the existence of a Jesus Christ!
This is not a small problem but a HUGE one. Given all of the MIRACLES he's claimed to have done
@MrGoodNKinky "The universe is the sum total of all that exists. Whatever would exist, if anything does not exist outisde of our universe would to us not exist" the universe has been shown to have begun, therefore it hasn't always existed which means that there must be a form of existence beyond the universe. "no historical evidence for the existence of a Jesus Christ" if that is your stance then you are denying historical evidence intentionally because that claim is just false.
No Historian from as earily as the 1,800 considered Jesus Christ to be a Historical figure.
The stories of a Jesus that are not in the bible have been proven to be Christian FRAUD!
Like Josephus in 18 VOLUMES this Jesus is mentioned in ONE TINY paragraph! And the word Christ is used which an Orthodox Jew Would NOT have used since Christ means Messiah!
So that was written by a Christian not Josephus who was a JEW!
The Universe beginning doesn't prove there is a God!
@MrGoodNKinky "the stories of a jesus that are not int he bible have been proven to be a christian FRAUD!" does that means the ones int he bible have been proven true? "the fact our universe couldve come from two universe bubbles" that is an assertion with 0 evidence of happening or possibley happening. if something would exist in another dimensiont aht thing wouldn't do XXX" again an assertion backed by nothing. you would have to show its impossible said being wouldnt do those things.
In fact the fact our Universe could've come about from two Universe Bubbles touching and making this one shows quite clearly that No God was Needed!
Let alone IF something would exist in another dimension that thing wouldn't sit up night fawning over CHRISTIAN'S! Nor is there ANY reason to think that it could only forgive when their is BLOOD! Hebrews 9:22
Explain the BLOODLUST aspect to this dimensional thing!
Dimensions like you are talking about apply ONLY to physical objects. God is by definition immaterial, so dimensions simply do not apply to him. It isn't about him being hyper dimensional, or beyond the dimensions, he is simply WITHOUT dimensions.
And you majorly contradict yourself, when you say that god is beyond human understanding, but then you make claim after claim about him, which would require human understanding.
So which is it? Beyond understanding, or within understanding?
@HonestTechnoAtheist Not necessarily, anything that exists entails substance. Substance entails form. Anything that has form requires the laws of mathematics and dimensions. If you life a vat of darkness and see a beam of light headed towards you, then you can at least measure the beam of light by 2D width and height, even though it isn't made of atoms. i hope this helps.
@InspiringPhilosophy I will need to know what you mean by "substance". But everything material that exists is made of physical substance. Not so sure about god though, I'll have to wait until you tell me what substance is.
Please note that the dimensions are height, length and width, however these terms are not applicable to a spaceless god. Therefore, god has no dimensions.
Btw, Light is made of photons, which are still material.
Everything that exists has to be something. Something cannot exist and be nothing. Substance, is something. To know what a spaceless God is, you 1st have to know what space is. Space is the 3D realm as defined in the Dictionary. So yes, God is spaceless because He is not 3D. But He exists, therefore He has form, and thus dimensions. Existence entails mathematics
Notice how I said light isn't made of atoms. I never said photons.
Right, now what is god? Just saying that he is something isn't good enough, you have to say WHAT that something is. Otherwise you may as well say god is noonanak. It's nothing but mere assersion and makes no sense.
"but he exists therefore he has form and thus dimensions"
Well again you need to say what those are, since height length and width are not among them. Same problem with time, he can be timeless yet everywhere.
@HonestTechnoAtheist You're missing the point of the video. The video was not designed to prove God exists, it was designed to debunk the myth that the Trinity is unexplainable. This is not a video for atheists because you already deny God's existence so why would this video matter to you? This video is for people who do believe in God and argue about his nature and form. I use other arguments for God's existence.
oK, iLike this, iSumWhat agree... But How & Why Does that have 2Mean he is aTrinity? It doesnt really, this is an arguement Sum would, maybe even me, use 2Disprove the Trinity. Im Jus Saying, doesnt prove 3, it only proves the 1 is completely Infinite & Omnipotent/Omnipresent/Omniscient/Omnilavent/Etc. In which iAs aOneness Adherent & also many "Non-Trinitarians" or "Unitarians" would agree..
@JIIBlessed No, it doesn't prove that God is definitely 3, but this video is intended to debunk the idea that the Trinity is not coherent and there is no explanation for it. Plus, there is also the quality of love. Click on the link at the end of the video, there is more information on the Trinity.
Man creates a radio (or any technology) and communicates through the radio using a radio signal that he also created.
Similarly…
All Mighty God created man(jesus, moses, etc), and communicated through them using the holy spirit.
God communicates through people using the spirit. Like people communicate through radios using radio waves.
Radio signals do not enter your home because you put a radio inside your home, they are always there. Similarly the spirit of God is everywhere all the time.
@red666111 Try it from this perspective: Einstein taught that time is the 4th dimension. Special relativity shows that time behaves surprisingly like the 3 spatial dimensions. Therefore it is possible that time is another spatial dimension for God which would allow him to move around the universe in an instance and be omnipresent. Plus, we do not know if hyper dimensions behave in 3D, like 3D behaves in 2D. It is just an an analogy and analogies are not perfect.
it would only be in a location described by the length and with of the cube (assuming the cube hits the 2d world strait on for simplicity). In the same way, a 4d object passing through our world would not occupy infinite space, it would only occupy an area defined by the 4d objects length, with, and height - which would change as it passes through the fabric of our three dimensional world. Describing god as being more than 3 dimensional does nothing to explain him being everywhere at once.
@red666111 Perhaps you are reading to much into an analogy that was intended to be simple, not deep in explanation. Besides I did not say God is 4D. Thanks anyway though.
@InspiringPhilosophy perhaps that's why it doesn't work. If you look to closely at it it falls apart. I will give you credit though, this is the best explanation I have ever heard of the Trinity. It is still flawed though. Half of the point was to show how god can be everywhere at once - I was only pointing out that you did not do that. Also, It doesn't matter how many dimensions God would be, the same rule applies.
@red666111 Not necessarily, because God doesn't pass through this world, He hold the universe in his hands (Isaiah 45:12, Isaiah 48:13, Hebrew 1:10). It would be like me holding a paper square in my hands. I could be everyone on the square at once. Sorry my analogy confused you, but it is just an analogy and no analogy can be perfect by definition. I hope this helps to clarify.
A cube can not exist fully in a two dimensional world. Think of it this way: A piece of paper is a two dimensional world - if a three dimensional object was to pass through this world, it would pass through in cross sections, that is, as the object passes through the plane of the paper all the two dimensional being sees is the edge of the object that is in line with the plane of the two dimensional world. The cube would NOT be EVERYWHERE in the two dimensional world, (see next comment)
This is somewhat flawed. First of all, your understanding of a two dimensional world is wrong. Look at it this way: we are three dimensional, but what we see is two dimensional: when we look at the cube strait on we see a square (you cant see a whole cube at once). In your two dimensional world if you showed them a square, they would see a line, yet comprehend the square - as we see a square and comprehend a cube. The problem with your idea comes after this. (see next comment)
"There is no way to explain the Trinity that is going to be true to the Faith."
And it's statements like that that cause the widespread ridicule of Christian theism today. Sounds like you're more committed to existentialism than Catholicism too since virtually all Catholic theologians have taken a shot at explaining the Trinity.
This video is amazing. Not only does it give a strong and reasonable explanation of the Trinity, it offers logical evidence that unitarian gods are invalid. A complete reversal to what most people think.
This video could sound like modalism if you focus too much on the cube analogy but if you realize that the author was trying to say that three persons being one God is something 3 dimensional beings like ourselves can't understand but one day will, then it makes sense with orthodox trinitarianism.
@KillerFaceification Honestly, I'm not trying to attack you or anything, but I have no idea how anyone could get a modalistic view from this video, especially the cube analogy. For the cube to even exist the six squares need to co-exist together at the same time. If InspiringPhilosophy said that a 'over time' a square changed to another square, and then to another, yet all 3 observed squares were 1 actually square, then someone could make that claim. See what I'm getting at?
@MAJ061785 I wasn't against this video. I was actually defending it against some of my friends on facebook that thought it was modalistic. I shouldn't have posted my comment here since the argument wasn't here. For the record I am in favor of this video and after reading your comment I now even see the cube analogy in a better light.
@KillerFaceification Someone else mentioned to me that someone was on Facebook telling everyone this video was modalistic, and was planning on making a response video. He/she was also trying to stop it. Thanks for defending this video and letting us know about the modalist rumor going around. I agree with MAJ061785 on that I can't understand how it could be considered modalistic.
This video is amazing. Not only does it give a strong and reasonable explanation of the Trinity, it offers logical evidence that unitarian gods are invalid. A complete reversal to what most people think.
Hello, I have a couple concerns and questions. From 5:47 to 6:14, you sound a bit modalistic, not Trinitarian; has anyone told you this before? I was waiting for you to say (or imply) that God is three persons who always co-existed in eternity with each other.
Secondly, the 2-d and 3-d cube illustration also seems modalistic. I assume that the cube's sides resembled an aspect/person of God-- is this the assumption you're hoping the audience to have for that illustration?
@SaintsEdified Well, no you are 1st to suggest I sound modalistic. I assure you I am not a modalist at all. I believe in the Trinity as understood by scripture to be 3 co-existing persons in the one true God.
Yes, that is assumption I was hoping for with the cube example. The 6 squares co-exist to make 1 cube just as the 3 person co-exist in one God.
How can we who live and understand 3 dimensions understand concepts of hyper dimensions...
Yet a 2d Cartoon character cannot under stand concepts of 3 dimensions... surely like us the 2d character in a possible world can understand 3d concepts.
This doesn't help your trinity argument, because by the logic of the 2d character we can not be able to understand concepts of hyper dimensions from our perspective.
@aaronstately We can't. I don't think I ever suggested we can. The only thing we know is hyper dimensions exist because we are aware of them mathematically. Besides, I never said we can fully grasp the Trinity or hyper Dimensions. I said this is an attribute of God and He uses familiar terms, like person, in an attempt to explain Himself, since He is greater dimensionally. I hope this help.
I think the best argument I've heard for the trinity is the H2O analogy. Water, ice, and steam are all different forms of one molecule. So in a sense, they're different, but all one at the same time.
Again about the cube analogy, we have to be careful, because the Trinity states that each of the three Persons IS God. Whereas, with a cube, while the 6 squares make up the one cube, the individual squares aren't THE cube. I know it wasn't your intention to use a cube as an analogy of the Trinity itself, but rather to illustrate our own difficulty in grasping the concept of hyperdimentions. I'm just pointing out how someone might misunderstand the argument.
5) And then yet at the same time, I also think of hell, and how people like to say that hell is "the absence of God's presence." I disagree, because I think the Scriptures are clear that the cause of torment in hell is God's own righteous wrath falling upon sin, which would mean He is very much present there, in some sense (See Rev. 14:10).
Anyway, I have no point, I am just offering some thoughts!
4) I think of the fact that God cannot tolerate sin in His holy presence. This is why nothing short of perfection will enter heaven. It seems to me that at the very least, a distinction must be made between what it means to be present with God in eternal life, and for God to be present in all places. Otherwise, His presence would necessitate the immediate destruction of all evil. Yet at the same time, He sees all, and is patient with sin for the time being.
@TheEgonTowst I think what you are suggesting is a logical absurdity. Psalm 139:7-10 says that no one can escape God's presences, not even in hell. I think when the Bible says God cannot look upon sin He we are touching something much deeper, as in He cannot be associated with it, therefore sinful beings cannot rest with and Him, like in eden. There is a great page on this on "tough questions answer.org"
3) Is God physically present in all places, even in the hyperdimentional sense, or is the concept of omnipresence just our attempt to explain the fact that nothing escapes His sight? Would it be legitimate to say that God, even as a physical being, is omnipresent in a spiritual but not necessarily physical sense? Or to state it another way, His *presence* is in all physical places, but is this necessarily the same as saying His physical being is in all places, even in the hyperdimentional sense?
@TheEgonTowst Thanks for the thought, but my understanding of God being omnipresent came front he the Bible, Jeremiah 23:24, "Do not I fill heaven and earth?" declares the LORD." I hope this helps to explain where I got my definition of omnipresence. Perhaps I should of included it in the video.
2) Your explanation may avoid this error, but I'm a little skeptical about the cube analogy because the figure living in 2D space is perceiving the cube one side at a time. Someone misunderstanding the argument could conclude a modalistic view of God. Im also a little skeptical about the idea of hyperdimentionalism in general. Not that I doubt the truthfulness of the concept, but I wonder if God being physically present in all places at all times is really the most accurate way to understand Him
1) This is an interesting explanation, but if I may offer a suggestion, I would include in the argument a warning against modalism, as this and other heretical views of the Trinity are common errors that analogies of the Trinity imply. E.g. the water analogy -- steam, liquid water, ice -- these are *states* of a single substance; they don't exist simultaneously. Likewise the egg analogy -- shell, white, yolk -- these are *parts* of the egg, but none *is* the egg.
Although this explanation may give scientific "backing" for the trinity, it does absolutely nothing to explain why it is a trinity rather than say a quaternity or quinternity.
@spammyadvertising Watch the 2nd part of the video starting at 5:26. I believe He is revealed as 3 persons for love and relational reasons. I can't prove why He is only 3 persons but I try to offer a logical claim as to why. I hope this helps.
how God can be hyperdimensional if he is spaceless? besides, does the bible really imply or suggest that a trinity exists? Did the original disciples believed in a trinity?
@trickjacko Yes the trinity is clearly presented in the letters of Paul and the gospels. Although the term was not used until later. Take a look at Matthew 28:18-20, 1 Peter 1:2, Matthew 3:16-17, John 1:32-34, Luke 3:21-22, John 14:26, John 15:26, Galatians 4:6, etc. Jesus said in John 10:30 says, "The Father and I are one." the Greek shows that the verse says they are one essences. Jesus called himself "I AM" claiming to be YHWH several times. Also...
@InspiringPhilosophy I wish I could go deeper in this discussion but is hard for me since English is not my natural language, sorry, well, I believe in God, but I don't think there are good reasons to believe in a Trinity. You quoted John 10:30, in response, I give you John 17:21, 22 where Jesus prays for his disciples to become one like Jesus and God are one, but certanly Jesus wasn't praying for de disciples to become one entity but to have the same purpuse and thinking. Thank you.
@trickjacko I don't think the Bible says God is spaceless. It says He fills everything. In other words He is everywhere at once. Esphesians 1:23, "which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all." In Jeremiah 23:24 God declares, "Do I not fill heaven and earth?" God is everywhere at once. Thanks for the question.
@InspiringPhilosophy You are right, the Bible doesn't say that God is spaceless but acording to the Cosmological Argument, in order to God created the universe one of the characteristics he must have is being spaceless.
@trickjacko Honestly, I don't know much about the cosmological argument because I'm not a fan of it. Do you have a link on it to send me? What I think it means is He is outside of our space, as in universe. From what I know of it, God cannot be part of our universe to create it, or part of the 3D world. He has to be beyond our universe to create it. Therefore He is spaceless, as in you can't find Him by searching the deeps of space or 3D spatial world. Message me a link if you can. Thanks
@InspiringPhilosophy How can you make that claim? How come god must be outside of our universe to create it? Doesn't make from a naturalistic view. One could easily imagine creating something (such as a fort) from within. Please explain this claim.
@InspiringPhilosophy This is the debate between Dr. Craig and Professor Wolpert, if I'm not mistaken, this is Dr. Craig's Opening Speech and Starts summarizing the Cosmological argument at 4:50. There is also a lot of material in his website reasonablefaith (.) org... well the CA is the main reason why I think your explanation of the Trinity fails, but maybe I am wrong, I hope you find this useful by the way, your other video is great, keep up the good work.
@trickjacko Yes I see, well spaceless is defined as, "having no limits or dimensions in space; limitless; unbounded." So it sounds to me like my definition of God as infinitely dimensional, is consistent with Craig's definition. I don't feel I claim the trinity to be material. He is clearly nothing physical or a part of of our physical world. But the Bible does say He fills everything and everywhere so I don't think Craig means spaceless as in having no space. I hope that helps.
@InspiringPhilosophy It seems to me that Dr. Craig by saying that God is spaceless is claiming that he doesn't need or occupies space in order to exist since he created space and time and is hard for me to conceive that something that has no dimensions in space is infinitely dimensional it is kind of contradictory. If I get it right, you are claiming that the Trinity occupies a place in the space (when it is dimensional) and at the same time is immaterial but, I mean, how is that possible?
@trickjacko I think we are looking at space defined differently. Space defined from my understanding is, "the unlimited or incalculably great 3D realm or expanse in which all material objects are located and all events occur." Webster gives a similar definition. I don't believe God occupies a 3D space because He expands beyond it. If space could contain Him, then He wouldn't be God. So God is spaceless as in our definition of space (3D).
@InspiringPhilosophy Well that's my definition of space too, and as you do, I believe that God transcends space and time, but that's the point I don't get, How can something beyond space can be in any way dimensional, because in order to something have dimensions it must be physical, therefore material and being contained in space, when you quote the Bible I don't think it implies that God fills all in a physical context.
@trickjacko I see, but on the flip side we don't really know what a spirit is. It may very well be something physical in a sense of hyper dimensions (not 3D). A comparison would be how air is physical but not a a solid sense. Plus, we don't know much about what the hyper dimensions are, we just know they exist. Some speculate the extra dimensions are not space at all, like 4D is time. God could be dimensional, but not in a 3D way. Make sense?
@trickjacko Plus in order for Cosmological Argument to be right and the universe to exist. We must draw an inference between the items in the set (things within the universe) and apply it to a set as a whole (the universe). For that to be valid we have to presuppose a realm beyond the universe, in which the universe can be taken from as an item. In other words, God pulls a 3D realm from a infinite Dimensional realm. If I had more space I would elaborate more.
@InspiringPhilosophy Thanks for this explanation now I understand better the concept of hyperdimensions and God being hyperdimensional, but still I don't believe in a Trinity and I don't think the Bible supports that Idea, anyway I think each of us have one belief and good reasons for it.
@trickjacko Yes, understandable. I'm glad I could be of help. If I may suggest something else, I did leave one factor of the Trinity out of this video that I plan on putting into a sequel for this video. Which is at the end of this video: "youtube. com /watch?v=vGVYXog8NUg" If you are still curious about the trinity I would suggest this argument as well. Thanks for the fun discussion.
@trickjacko : be careful of using or abiding in man-made philosophies, because that is what collapsed the Early Christian church and corrupted it. Even the early Apostles (NT) warned against man made doctrines, which speaks of man-made ideas to explain God. This includes trying to interpret the scriptures, which was called "private interpretations" as Apostle Peter described. This also applies to "InspiringPhilosphy", trying to use science to replace scripture and revelation.
@viewer087 You are once again assuming that the early Christians didn't believe in the Trinity, which isn't constant with the Textual Criticism of the Bible and you are assuming that Science is not of God. Should we look at science as a revelation from God?
@InspiringPhilosophy : Trinity Doctrine (Nicene Creed) does not belong to Early Christian Church. Apostles made sure Church members were corrected, & a lot of correction they had to do due to false doctrines filtering in - man made philosophies about God. RE: self-proclaimed Christians after the Nicene Creed, sure, many believed, but the Early Christian Church (NT) did not teach it. Anyway it was politically motivated by Constantine.
@viewer087@viewer087 You do realized Constantine converted to Arianism because of his sister after the council of Niceae? If He was politically motivated the create the trinity why would he abandon it. Look for my video this summer of Niceae. It will correct this idea that the council invented orthodox Christianity, which is not constituent with early church writings.
@InspiringPhilosophy : Arianism is not of Christ. It was also said that Constantine converted to Christianity and he had a vision from God to go into battle. Sorry, all these things about Constantine only describes a man who was not a true Christian and at least a bit high on himself. For any doctrine to announced as God's, it MUST be given by revelation. There was no revelation in the Nicene Council or any Council thereafter. Bishops do NOT receive revelation for God's Church, only Apostles.
@InspiringPhilosophy : where is the Niceae Video, cannot find it ... or did you mean it is coming in the summer of 2012? Just making sure I understood you correctly
@viewer087 Again you are going on the assumption that the concept of the trinity was invented at Niceae, which isn't consistent with the writings of early church fathers. You are also assuming that the Trinity was not revealed to man through God. I see the trinity is clearly revealed several times in scripture, such as when Jesus was baptized. I would recommend reading the direct writings of the early church before you assume. The trinity concept was with the early church.
@InspiringPhilosophy : first the Trinity doctrine was created at Nicene or Niceae. Second, there is no scripture to support it, even Catholic Scholars admit that. So if you think there is scripture supporting it, by all means provide those scriptures by passage name and I will look them up and respond. Then I will show which was revealed by God and what wasn't. Next, do not assume the writings of a "church" after the apostles left were writings of God, because they were not. I will read tomorrow
@InspiringPhilosophy Perhaps you will have a spirit of a Berean, and be wise like Solomon (Proverbs 18:17,) and see why you are reading the doctrine of the trinity into the text at Jesus' baptism, and how the opposite is true, that is, the baptism disproves the Trinity. redwordschurch dotcom / 2011 / 07/31 / the-trinity-matt-316/
@viewer087 Thanks for the advice, I don't believe in a Trinity though, but in the past, the Bible was kept from some people that weren't considered worthy of know about the scriptures and that's not what God really wanted, I don't think InspiringPhilosophy is trying to replace anything, rather he's trying to clarify some ideas and making easier to people to understand their doctrine and be able to defend it if necessary.
@trickjacko: Yes the Bible was kept locked by the priests, some reasons were special interests in preventing power lost, etc. This occurring by "Christians" who claim the Trinity was of God. This withholding the Bible was not God's way or teachings and this represents serious apostasy of the church. Have not cross-checked dates, but who knows, the control of scriptures may have occurred at same time of Nicene Creed. (Cont...RE: InspiringPhilosphy)
(Cont...RE: InspiringPhilosphy) - Any attempt to teach false doctrine by many means, is still false doctrine and should not be done. But InspiringPhilosphy has his freedom to believe what he wants. Yet be assured, no true faithful of God will endeavour to teach false doctrines to anyone, by any means.
Well done video.But there are quite a few Christians like myself who hold to an "open view" of God where because he has chosen to give beings free choice, that limits to some degree His knowledge of the future. He is omniscient in the sense of knowing all the past and present and because He can do anything He wants (Isaiah 46:10),He can predict and know much of the future too. But, some future are unknown due to giving free choice (btw, check out my main channel, truthislife7 here on youtube.)
Also, if you were agnostic, how did you conclude Jesus? How did you get from trying to claim agnosticism to trying to explain a ridiculous concept, unique to a single religion (that I'm aware of), by showing that the answer may be hidden from our perception. The explanation of a trinity is beyond perception because it's logically, rationally and arithmetically flawed, not because we couldn't understand it until we theorized about higher dimensions. Your sudden conversion is suspect.
@Falcondick69 - Which of us are you suggesting is committing a genetic fallacy? My question is valid on it's face, regardless as to whether he had decided that Islam was the one true religion, or Judaism, or Baha'i, or Jainism, or Sikhism, etc. He begs the question, which is typical for religious faith - they assume the conclusion. He displays the conclusion espoused by certain sections of a single faith. How did he get there when agnosticism means without knowledge?
@mojohound you didnt watch the video it seems. he explained that as an agnostic he couldnt wrap his head around the idea of a "trinity" and then he became a christian and in this way in the video said that is how he managed to understand it. and it isnt begging the question to explain a conclusion, also if you are agnostic to the idea of a Mosque existing on the peak of mnt.everest and then you find out there isnt one you are no longer agnostic about the question.
@Falcondick69 - Then you also beg the question. He got to Jesus because he found that there was a possible analogy to the trinity in this god being multidimensional, and therefore thought he might now understand how science shows god? He makes claims for his god that are not only not supported by evidence but are logically, physically and conceptually impossible, such as "infinitely dimensional". Infinity is a concept, not a condition.
You're right, it isn't begging a question to explain a conclusion, but he begs his question by assuming his conclusion. He used statements from the Bible as his source, not statements from the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, or Dianetics, etc. How did he decide that these particular statements were truthful, why did he dismiss all the other beliefs? How did he get to Jesus by philosophical masturbation, which this video is. Pure speculation presented as proof of a conclusion.
Seriously? I mean, seriously? Your explanation consists of trying to demonstrate how three different things can be one thing, we just don't perceive it as being unified. How exactly does this explain the trinity? If it's one thing, even if it appears to be three, it's still only one thing and thus, no trinity. If it actually is three things then it isn't one thing, and you're left right back at the beginning. You haven't explained anything, and your analogy is flawed.
@viewer087 Honestly, I see your logic as being flawed and based on some easily refutable assumptions. There are a number of things from God that are confusing, such as end times prophecies. However, youtube doesn't allow enough space for a reasonable response and I don't want to start fighting. So I respect your objections & hope you will check out some of my other videos. I plan on doing one on Niceae in time. If you want to talk more, message me so we can have more space.
ive always thaught of it like this the phrase 'jesus is god' is a phrase of predication , like a chair is red . im not saying its a colour but the phrase the 'trinity' is god is a phrase of identification. so jesus is god but the trinity is still 1 god. But its a great video
The Father, is now and forever more so, always appearing to us as Jesus Christ. The Father who cannot ever be seen in His Eternal Original Estate, is now a Visible Lord God Almighty, accessing to us a Way of Being Visible, by having take up Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Priest Yahweh of Elohim God, Yahweh is Jesus' own Name, Yeshua, which means Yahweh the Priest of the Lord Elohim , He is our God. Jesus is the only Name and appearing personal God, coming to us out of the Infinite
In Conclusion, where as God had in various ways appeared to Israel, in the Fire, the Burning Bush , the Thundering Shaking Mountain, and in the Persons God Elected as Messiah High Priest to Channel from Heaven to Earth, God's own SPEECH. God finally came into the flesh as Jesus Christ, the final Temple of Yahweh God, the Priestly Son of God, partaking the Nature of God in Himself Forever , such that as God's Person of Appearing , furthermore ever again, the Father appears as Jesus Christ
On Day of Atonement, High Priest was Ceremonially put to death by the symbolic act of slaying a Ram and showing the Blood before God's Throne. The Priest was Baptized in Water, Clothed in Funeral Garments, "Clothed in Righteousness". The Priest went into the Holy of Holies to lie upon the Mercy Seat as Dead. Then God came down & Raised up the Priest, When the Jews saw this they said "Hear O Israel, the Lord , our God, the Lord is One" This Unity of Three, made a man appear as God Speaking.
YHWH " YOD HEY VAD HEY" four Hebrew letters mean " Behold the Hand, Behold the Nail" This is the office of the High Priest, as was Moses the Levite Messiah in his day, face to face with God, meaning God was indwelling at times, inside Moses' literal flesh and blood body and taking over the body and God made Moses more like a Puppet, a Way of Speaking from Invisible Heaven, through a man's body, to the People who heard Moses speaking out of the Fire. as standing in God's Place. 3=1
YHWH or Yahweh God, is Personal and Appearing, not the Generic Invisible surrounding Glory of God EL or Elohim God. the Letters spelling YHWH have to do with the specific duties of the High Priest, who gives over his own flesh and blood body on the Day of Atonement, as if dead, symbolized by the blood of the Ram sacrificed in his place. That then God comes down in the Holocaust Fire, the Shekinah enters the Priest and God then is Possessing the body and speaking out through the mouth.
The special Name of the appearing God of Israel, "YAHWEH" or by the Divine Tetragrammaton or Four Hebrew Letters that signify His Name as the God who appears among us, YHWH, is different than the generic Name of God Elohim, which is "All" not the Personal God. The Personal God to Israel comes out of God's Mind as a High Priest, as was Moses, Indwelt by the Holy Spirit, acting and standing exactly in God's Place, not next to God or near to God, but coinciding with the God Yahweh.
The Literal Reason, we call a special man, "PRIEST" is that He is able to Transfigure the Being of God which is surrounding us forever, but unimaginable or invisible because we cannot understand that we are living inside something that is God. So the Priest is a Person of God, so chosen by God's Mind, that through the Priest, God is able to conduct His Business from Heaven, out of His Mind's Desire, into the Priest and out through his mouth to speak as God and his hands to act as God
There is an analogy of a great fireplace with a huge furnace fire going on. If one ember is taken away from the assembled material that is burning,the isolated ember begins to cool off and dies. When the Person you are, is not in the Fire of God, where everything is Glorified in a Great Fire of Energy, you are separated away from God, cool off, lose the heat of Life and die from Sin. So, in God you can live forever, being One with God, but by Sin, separated from the Glory , you will die.
Stupid vid! why there is no word trinity in the bible? think about it! if it were true then god would make no secret bout it! but jesus allways said the father is greater than me! read book genensis! what his spirit gods spirit is! just a tool like thing not a person!
MrQuad4w41 2 days ago
@MrQuad4w41: The Bible does nowhere EXPLICITLY say "The earth is a globe!", yet I and you believe the earth is a globe! You don't need a special "word" written down in the Bible in order to prove the reality of it. The book of Ester does not even mention the word "God", yet after reading the book, you are sure that every page of this book describes the truthful working of the one true God. Have you noticed the context and the Greek text of Joh 14:28 "the Father is greater"?
Reformiert1689 1 day ago
@MrQuad4w41 Have you any idea of the usage of the Greek μείζων the New Testament? Have you noticed that this Greek word does not refer to nature or quality but rather privilege or office? Christ emptied Himself of some privileges (read Phil 2:7) in order to become a bond-servant (while He was God in the flesh at the same time), don't you notice that the Father's being "greater" applies only to the context, while Christ fullfilled the will of the Father in order to finally become a sin-offering?
Reformiert1689 1 day ago
@ALESHBAK: Part5
Mat 10:33 - Since Christ and the Father are "one" (not one single person, but one single unity, that can not be separated; Joh 10:30) the denial of Christ is the denial of the Father also. Thus the reality of the trinity is no optional doctrine that one can deny while the other one can embrace. Notice that Joh 10:30 is in context another proof of the deity of Christ (Joh 10:1-33).
Reformiert1689 2 days ago
@ALESHBAK: Part4
Therfore Christ commanded him to leave his riches in order to flee from his delusion. But as it is with all people, who love money and mammon, he refuses to OBEY the God of the law, CHRIST!. The Jews were so deeply involved in keeping traditions, that they DO NOT see that they disobey God all day long by keeping their traditions. And thatbis the whole point od this account.
Reformiert1689 2 days ago
@ALESHBAK: Part3
The Jews separated the law of God from the God of the law and made the law superior than God. All this must be considered in the context of Mat 19:16. So since the rich young ruler wanted to know which good thing (i.e. which law) he should obey in order to be saved, Christ turned him to the keeping of the entirety of the law. If the rich man would have been honest, he would have recognized his bankruptcy. The man sadly thought to be accepted by God because of the richeshe had.
Reformiert1689 2 days ago
@ALESHBAK: Part2
The Jews had a saying: "There is nothing good, but the law." In Mat 19:16 he asked "What good thing shall I do...". Thus he wanted to know WHICH LAW (i.e. the good) he should obey. Christ kind of corrected his high view of the law by reminding him, that God is more good than the law. The rich tested Christ by "declaring Him good" in order to see whether Christ would refuse this title given to Him. It is like "Rich man, do you understand your words? If you call Me good, I am God"
Reformiert1689 2 days ago
@ALESHBAK: Part1
Joh 5:30 is a statement WITHIN a special context. Deny the context and you will not see the contextual meaning. Christ existed in the form of God, but voluntarily emptied Himself of His divine privileges in order to take the form of a bond-servant (Phil 2:5.7), and as bond-servant (yet still God) He expressed absolutely dependence upon His Father by saying "I can do nothing on My own initiative". Don't forget that Christ made Himself equal with God 12 verses before (Joh 5:18)!
Reformiert1689 2 days ago
لا اله الا الله
bullseye9572 4 days ago
"Any God that we can fully understand and explain, like a unitarian God, would be an entity no greater than we are"
I think this would be false. Firstly, different people can "comprehend" at different levels is very likely, but more importantly there is no logical reason for a unitarian existence being impossible, while a "polytarian" existence being possible. The 'solutions' come from a problem that does not seem fully explained.
thedebatecast 4 days ago
What have personalities to do with dimensions?
qoevont 1 week ago
and he had to br god to create us it seems like you cant help me cos a human god cant be better than me .
ALESHBAK 1 week ago
wow that makes so much sense, my theory on how the trinity works is that the father, the holy spirit, and jesus are just forms but they are all one and the same and being infinity powerful he can be all of them at once, kinda like how clones work in superheros or naruto and scientifically speaking jesus was a clone of god that used mary as the perfect surrogate parent for his mortal form to be created and born from just like every mortal so he can see the hardships of being human and die for us
wildlife011803 1 week ago
He was God at the moment then why did he limit his powers i cant be human and say i am a dog i cant be human and act like a dog either it still dosent make sence the statment is clear i canot and yet we know god can do anything .. who is he God or the son of God or just a prophet . and who is mary ? mother of God or just a human channel or way to earth for God why choose a human yet GOD COULD HAVE JUST COME TO EARTH WITHOUT A NEED OF HUMAN
ALESHBAK 2 weeks ago
@ALESHBAK You need to check out my video, "The Truth about Christianity" God had to become human for important reasons in dealing with us and agape love.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 weeks ago
@ALESHBAK lol god sent himself to earth , since he is the purest person living. He used jesus to die for us in order to take away our sins, since we are all born as sinners due to adam, The only person who is pure enough to do this would be god himself ( jesus) , i dont know why all you question it? Jesus is GOD, you say our religion is illogical but many people would agree religion all in itself is illogical, the only thing you need in religion is FAITH.
SIKSSS1 2 days ago
@ALESHBAK in order to communicate with us God is able to take our form. if we can't understand it fully, that's understandable since we're not God. in order to get the answers to all your questions, why not ask Him? He is well able to get through if you really are wanting to hear, & will even give you Faith if you need some. if you are capable of realizing you have done some wrong things & should be sorry & need to be forgiven, you've put a foot on the right trail...
jesushealsmohamdidnt 1 day ago
thats quite the cop out... to begin your explanation with, "God is not totally comprehensable". to begin one's belief with confusion is not the best way to begin.
abulmundhir 2 weeks ago
JHON 5:30
I can do nothing on my own. I judge as God tells me. Therefore, my judgment is just, because I carry out the will of the one who sent me, not my own will.
MARK 10:18
"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good--except God alone
Matthew 10:33
- 33 but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven.
PLEASE explain these to me i am only searching for the truth
ALESHBAK 2 weeks ago
@ALESHBAK Jesus became fully man and could do nothing on His own, until He was the risen Lord. He accepted all the limitations of humanity when He was on earth. So He was still God, yet fully man and limited by that. When He resurrected He was no longer stuck by the limitation of humanity. I hope this helps.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 weeks ago
IT DOSENT MAKE SENSE ,,, I HAVE BEEN SEARCHING THE BIBLE TO FIND A CLEAR STATEMENT WHERE JESUS SAYS I AM GOD OR I AM THE TRINITY IN FACT JESUS HIM SELF WOULDNT RECOGANISE THE NAME JESUS CHRIST TODAY WHOEVER I KEEP WONDERIING HOW COULD JESUS DIE FOR MY SINS BEFORE I HAD COMMITED ANY AND WHY WOULD ADAMS SIN BE PAID BY ME AND YET JESUS DIES FOR ME COS ADAM DID THE SIN ?!!!
ALESHBAK 3 weeks ago
@ALESHBAK
"IT DOSENT MAKE SENSE ,,, I HAVE BEEN SEARCHING THE BIBLE TO FIND A CLEAR STATEMENT WHERE JESUS SAYS I AM GOD"
where you searching in the old testament?
That might explain why,
try these:
John 10:30 (says him and the father are one)
John 8:58
Mark 14:62 (refer to Dan7: 13-14)
MegaExelo 2 weeks ago
Proof from the bible that the trinity is man made: (1 Corinthians 14:33) For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace. Jesus prophecised that he would be worshiped in Mark 7:7, "They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men."
nurghak 3 weeks ago
@nurghak
"Jesus prophecised that he would be worshiped in Mark 7:7"
your are incredibley deceitful, he actually said:
" Jesus replied, “You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you, FOR HE WROTE
‘These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
Their worship is a farce,
for they teach man-made ideas as commands from God.’
Jesus, was challenging the Jews traditions and customs!!!!!
MegaExelo 2 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
You say that the doctrine of the trinity begins with the belief that the true god is not fully comprehensible but the entire video is about comprehending god. You say that God must be comprised of 3 spacial dimensions to be omnipresent, but space and time has a beginning and it will have a ending. According to your logic God is dependent on space and time. I believe in one God, I believe there is non comparable unto him and he has no beginning or ending, can anyone fully comprehend that?
nurghak 3 weeks ago
You say that the doctrine of the trinity begins with the belief that the true god is not fully comprehensible but the entire video is about comprehending god. You say that God must be comprised of 3 spacial dimensions to be omnipresent, but space and time has a beginning and it will have a ending. According to your logic God is dependent on space and time. I believe in one God, I believe there is non comparable unto him and he has no beginning or ending, can anyone fully comprehend that?
nurghak 3 weeks ago
@nurghak I said God must be greater than 3 spatial dimensions. Space is defined as something 3D. Anything 4D or above is not defined by space, it's in the dictionary. You're also taking those verse out of context. In Mark 7:7, Jesus is quoting Isaiah & is speaking about a prophecy Isaiah made about the pharisees. In Cor 14:33, Paul is talking about tongues in the church. This isn't proof because the verses you are quoting are out of context. Read the full passage surrounding each verse.
InspiringPhilosophy 3 weeks ago
as to make the mystery much more ever present.
tttdub 1 month ago
The problem with this argument is that you claim we can not understand the other dimensions, yet you try to explain how god fits into them. Also, you used a verse in trying to prove the bible makes a reference to multidemension (Isaiah: 40:28), but it doesn't even somewhat seem to reference to it at all. It merely states his knowledge capabilities. Also, when you try to state how religions always make god understandable. It would be much more comprehensible to make the god seem uncomprehensible
tttdub 1 month ago
@tttdub No, I do not explain how God fits in to them. I just say God is hyper dimensional. I do not try to explain this, nor do I claim I fully understand it. However, if God is God, He would have to be greater than us in all aspects, including His dimensions and form. I referenced Isaiah 40:28 for more with the 1st part of the verse, "The Lord is the everlasting God." infinite is everlasting. I hope this helps.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
Intresting, still unexplained. The G-d of the "Bible" is not a plausable referrence. The "Bible" as it is to Christians is comprised of two Bibles, stemming from two Thiest systems. Jesus is birthed "systemically" from the Jewish Tanach (aka Old Testament), however, during the course of Church History there have been many ideas introduced, influenced & doctruinized. One of them being the "Trinity". There really is no Biblical proof that G-d was to be taught as a Triune Entity.
MrJSTinnin 1 month ago
@MrJSTinnin These are two different subjects you bring up, and the purpose of the video isn't to address them. I plan to address down the road in other videos. I will do a video on the trinity in the old testament and one abolishing the myth that Nicaea created orthodox Christianity.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago 2
This is very reminiscent of flatland, by some Abbot fellow that I ready this summer.
djb5255 1 month ago
@HonestTechnoAthiest You're missing the point of the video. The video was not designed to prove God exists, it was designed to debunk the myth that the Trinity is unexplainable. This is not a video for atheists because you already deny God's existence so why would this video matter to you? This video is for people who do believe in God and argue about his nature and form. I use other arguments for God's existence.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
@InspiringPhilosophy Right but I am always willing to grant theists that their god of choice exists, as well as what a god even is.
I simply find calling one god three seperate units, but still the same unit, to be absurd.
HonestTechnoAtheist 1 month ago
@HonestTechnoAtheist If God wasn't omnipresent and if God was 3D I would agree. But if God exists, then we cannot assume He would be on the same level as us, how would He be God then? If God exists, His attributes would have to far exceed ours, hence hyper-dimensionism. I agree this is just a theory and is based primarily on the fact that God must exist, but that is a different topic. I consider this video more of a secondary clue to His existence, not a primary one.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
I'LL SHOW ALL NON-BELIEVERS A G.O.D.
God
Of
DEATH
Witness the RETURN OF THE MAYAS
ILLUMINATI & FREE MASONS
Order of the SNAKE
p00piem4n 1 month ago
Your cube idea FAILS because as the cube would turn the 2 dimensional being would see 2 Dimensional aspects of the Corners of the cube.
From the Point of View of the 2 Dimensional being that which is 3 dimensional does not exist!
Thank you for showing how YOUR GOD DOES NOT EXIST!
Besides something in a higher dimension wouldn't have the same ideas of what is right and wrong as its existence would be beyond such petty things as our social cultures!
Must like we are beyond that of Inchworms!
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
@MrGoodNKinky you are applying an analogy in a way it isn't meant to be. "from the point of view of the 2 dimensional being that which is 3 dimensional does not exist!" false if you make that claim then you do not exist because we are 3D. "something in a higher dimension wouldn't have the same ideas of what is right and wrong as its existence would be beyond such petty thingsas our social cultures" baseless assertion. "must like we are beyond that of inchworms" yes God is beyond us so what?
Falcondick69 1 month ago
@MrGoodNKinky If a cube turns in 2D space, a 2D being would see lines and points. It would not look anything like a cube. However, since we are talking about a cube in a 2D world, that doesn't mean 3D doesn't exist. Just because a 2D can't picture it, doesn't make something non-existent. The cube is just an analogy, and by definition, analogies are not perfect. Reading to much into an analogy doesn't attack the actual argument.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
@InspiringPhilosophy
The Analogy FAILS because it doesn't take into consideration the turning aspect. Which would be PROOF to the 2d beings that there is something weird about this. As opposed to the they would just see the flat sides.
This also doesn't say anything about that 3d object having a Personal interest in 2d society. Doesn't even begin to cover why something from one dimension would care at all about the acts of those in the other dimension.
Let alone to demand BLOOD & DEATH!
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
@MrGoodNKinky Again, attacking an analogy doesn't mean you are attacking the actual argument. I think the analogy clearly shows the 2D being sees something weird already happening, since the squares all are one object. If he were to see some lines in between the squares, he wold just think he say a square, then lines, then another square. This seems very nit picky.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
@InspiringPhilosophy
It would still indicate that there is something unusual in that object.
However your claim that this God of yours exists in another dimension FAILS because that doesn't explain:
1. Why such would take a personal interest in YOU or YOUR ideas / beliefs!
2. Why would such have to forgive a being in a lower dimension at all?
3. Why would a being on a higher dimension be demanding BLOOD & DEATH to forgive?
In short you are seriously pissing on your own toes!
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
As soon as you go into dimensional for your God you FAIL!
Reason being the Universe is the sum total of all that exists. Whatever would exist, If anything does exist outside of our universe would to us not exist.
So if your God is outside of our Universe then from the view point of our Universe Your God DOES NOT EXIST!
Further more there is NO HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for the existence of a Jesus Christ!
This is not a small problem but a HUGE one. Given all of the MIRACLES he's claimed to have done
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
@MrGoodNKinky "The universe is the sum total of all that exists. Whatever would exist, if anything does not exist outisde of our universe would to us not exist" the universe has been shown to have begun, therefore it hasn't always existed which means that there must be a form of existence beyond the universe. "no historical evidence for the existence of a Jesus Christ" if that is your stance then you are denying historical evidence intentionally because that claim is just false.
Falcondick69 1 month ago
@Falcondick69
No Historian from as earily as the 1,800 considered Jesus Christ to be a Historical figure.
The stories of a Jesus that are not in the bible have been proven to be Christian FRAUD!
Like Josephus in 18 VOLUMES this Jesus is mentioned in ONE TINY paragraph! And the word Christ is used which an Orthodox Jew Would NOT have used since Christ means Messiah!
So that was written by a Christian not Josephus who was a JEW!
The Universe beginning doesn't prove there is a God!
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
@MrGoodNKinky "the stories of a jesus that are not int he bible have been proven to be a christian FRAUD!" does that means the ones int he bible have been proven true? "the fact our universe couldve come from two universe bubbles" that is an assertion with 0 evidence of happening or possibley happening. if something would exist in another dimensiont aht thing wouldn't do XXX" again an assertion backed by nothing. you would have to show its impossible said being wouldnt do those things.
Falcondick69 1 month ago
@Falcondick69
In fact the fact our Universe could've come about from two Universe Bubbles touching and making this one shows quite clearly that No God was Needed!
Let alone IF something would exist in another dimension that thing wouldn't sit up night fawning over CHRISTIAN'S! Nor is there ANY reason to think that it could only forgive when their is BLOOD! Hebrews 9:22
Explain the BLOODLUST aspect to this dimensional thing!
MrGoodNKinky 1 month ago
Dimensions like you are talking about apply ONLY to physical objects. God is by definition immaterial, so dimensions simply do not apply to him. It isn't about him being hyper dimensional, or beyond the dimensions, he is simply WITHOUT dimensions.
And you majorly contradict yourself, when you say that god is beyond human understanding, but then you make claim after claim about him, which would require human understanding.
So which is it? Beyond understanding, or within understanding?
HonestTechnoAtheist 1 month ago
@HonestTechnoAtheist Not necessarily, anything that exists entails substance. Substance entails form. Anything that has form requires the laws of mathematics and dimensions. If you life a vat of darkness and see a beam of light headed towards you, then you can at least measure the beam of light by 2D width and height, even though it isn't made of atoms. i hope this helps.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
@InspiringPhilosophy I will need to know what you mean by "substance". But everything material that exists is made of physical substance. Not so sure about god though, I'll have to wait until you tell me what substance is.
Please note that the dimensions are height, length and width, however these terms are not applicable to a spaceless god. Therefore, god has no dimensions.
Btw, Light is made of photons, which are still material.
And how about my video response request.
HonestTechnoAtheist 1 month ago
@HonestTechnoAtheist Oh trust me, I am very happy about that. LOL
Everything that exists has to be something. Something cannot exist and be nothing. Substance, is something. To know what a spaceless God is, you 1st have to know what space is. Space is the 3D realm as defined in the Dictionary. So yes, God is spaceless because He is not 3D. But He exists, therefore He has form, and thus dimensions. Existence entails mathematics
Notice how I said light isn't made of atoms. I never said photons.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
@InspiringPhilosophy "everything that exists has to be something"
Right, now what is god? Just saying that he is something isn't good enough, you have to say WHAT that something is. Otherwise you may as well say god is noonanak. It's nothing but mere assersion and makes no sense.
"but he exists therefore he has form and thus dimensions"
Well again you need to say what those are, since height length and width are not among them. Same problem with time, he can be timeless yet everywhere.
HonestTechnoAtheist 1 month ago
@HonestTechnoAtheist You're missing the point of the video. The video was not designed to prove God exists, it was designed to debunk the myth that the Trinity is unexplainable. This is not a video for atheists because you already deny God's existence so why would this video matter to you? This video is for people who do believe in God and argue about his nature and form. I use other arguments for God's existence.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago
WHY WOULD GOD BE BORN AND TAUGHT BY IMPERFECT WOMAN?
WHY WOULD GOD PRAY TO HIMSELF?
GOD DIES? I WOULD NOT PRAY A GOD THAT DIES.
WHO RESURRECTED GOD? DID HE REALLY DIE OR ITS JUST A LIE?
DID YOU SAY GOD IS OUR BROTHER, WE PRAY OUR BROTHER?
quietsparks1 1 month ago
oK, iLike this, iSumWhat agree... But How & Why Does that have 2Mean he is aTrinity? It doesnt really, this is an arguement Sum would, maybe even me, use 2Disprove the Trinity. Im Jus Saying, doesnt prove 3, it only proves the 1 is completely Infinite & Omnipotent/Omnipresent/Omniscient/Omnilavent/Etc. In which iAs aOneness Adherent & also many "Non-Trinitarians" or "Unitarians" would agree..
JIIBlessed 1 month ago
@JIIBlessed No, it doesn't prove that God is definitely 3, but this video is intended to debunk the idea that the Trinity is not coherent and there is no explanation for it. Plus, there is also the quality of love. Click on the link at the end of the video, there is more information on the Trinity.
InspiringPhilosophy 1 month ago 2
For a simple explanation of the Trinity see here i cant post links
Letusmakemaninourimage dot Blogspot Dot com
hardlyrocketscience 1 month ago
Man creates a radio (or any technology) and communicates through the radio using a radio signal that he also created.
Similarly…
All Mighty God created man(jesus, moses, etc), and communicated through them using the holy spirit.
God communicates through people using the spirit. Like people communicate through radios using radio waves.
Radio signals do not enter your home because you put a radio inside your home, they are always there. Similarly the spirit of God is everywhere all the time.
SuperLeafguy 1 month ago
Hahaha. What arrogance. !!
ndzoko 1 month ago
very interesting
blakodeel 2 months ago in playlist Favorite videos
@red666111 Try it from this perspective: Einstein taught that time is the 4th dimension. Special relativity shows that time behaves surprisingly like the 3 spatial dimensions. Therefore it is possible that time is another spatial dimension for God which would allow him to move around the universe in an instance and be omnipresent. Plus, we do not know if hyper dimensions behave in 3D, like 3D behaves in 2D. It is just an an analogy and analogies are not perfect.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
it would only be in a location described by the length and with of the cube (assuming the cube hits the 2d world strait on for simplicity). In the same way, a 4d object passing through our world would not occupy infinite space, it would only occupy an area defined by the 4d objects length, with, and height - which would change as it passes through the fabric of our three dimensional world. Describing god as being more than 3 dimensional does nothing to explain him being everywhere at once.
red666111 2 months ago
@red666111 Perhaps you are reading to much into an analogy that was intended to be simple, not deep in explanation. Besides I did not say God is 4D. Thanks anyway though.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy perhaps that's why it doesn't work. If you look to closely at it it falls apart. I will give you credit though, this is the best explanation I have ever heard of the Trinity. It is still flawed though. Half of the point was to show how god can be everywhere at once - I was only pointing out that you did not do that. Also, It doesn't matter how many dimensions God would be, the same rule applies.
red666111 2 months ago
@red666111 Not necessarily, because God doesn't pass through this world, He hold the universe in his hands (Isaiah 45:12, Isaiah 48:13, Hebrew 1:10). It would be like me holding a paper square in my hands. I could be everyone on the square at once. Sorry my analogy confused you, but it is just an analogy and no analogy can be perfect by definition. I hope this helps to clarify.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
A cube can not exist fully in a two dimensional world. Think of it this way: A piece of paper is a two dimensional world - if a three dimensional object was to pass through this world, it would pass through in cross sections, that is, as the object passes through the plane of the paper all the two dimensional being sees is the edge of the object that is in line with the plane of the two dimensional world. The cube would NOT be EVERYWHERE in the two dimensional world, (see next comment)
red666111 2 months ago
This is somewhat flawed. First of all, your understanding of a two dimensional world is wrong. Look at it this way: we are three dimensional, but what we see is two dimensional: when we look at the cube strait on we see a square (you cant see a whole cube at once). In your two dimensional world if you showed them a square, they would see a line, yet comprehend the square - as we see a square and comprehend a cube. The problem with your idea comes after this. (see next comment)
red666111 2 months ago
There is no way to explain the Trinity that is going to be true to the Faith.
ExistentialCatholic 2 months ago
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@ExistentialCatholic
"There is no way to explain the Trinity that is going to be true to the Faith."
And it's statements like that that cause the widespread ridicule of Christian theism today. Sounds like you're more committed to existentialism than Catholicism too since virtually all Catholic theologians have taken a shot at explaining the Trinity.
TheCartesianTheist 1 month ago
this vid made me lol
underdescribed 2 months ago
Actually man is also a 'trinity'. We are made up of a mind, a body,
and a spirit. The three make up the one being. And we are made
in God's image. ;)
1339girlisback 2 months ago
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This video is amazing. Not only does it give a strong and reasonable explanation of the Trinity, it offers logical evidence that unitarian gods are invalid. A complete reversal to what most people think.
FredSavageish 2 months ago
This video could sound like modalism if you focus too much on the cube analogy but if you realize that the author was trying to say that three persons being one God is something 3 dimensional beings like ourselves can't understand but one day will, then it makes sense with orthodox trinitarianism.
KillerFaceification 2 months ago
@KillerFaceification Honestly, I'm not trying to attack you or anything, but I have no idea how anyone could get a modalistic view from this video, especially the cube analogy. For the cube to even exist the six squares need to co-exist together at the same time. If InspiringPhilosophy said that a 'over time' a square changed to another square, and then to another, yet all 3 observed squares were 1 actually square, then someone could make that claim. See what I'm getting at?
MAJ061785 2 months ago 6
@MAJ061785 I wasn't against this video. I was actually defending it against some of my friends on facebook that thought it was modalistic. I shouldn't have posted my comment here since the argument wasn't here. For the record I am in favor of this video and after reading your comment I now even see the cube analogy in a better light.
KillerFaceification 2 months ago
@KillerFaceification Someone else mentioned to me that someone was on Facebook telling everyone this video was modalistic, and was planning on making a response video. He/she was also trying to stop it. Thanks for defending this video and letting us know about the modalist rumor going around. I agree with MAJ061785 on that I can't understand how it could be considered modalistic.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
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KillerFaceification 2 months ago
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This video is amazing. Not only does it give a strong and reasonable explanation of the Trinity, it offers logical evidence that unitarian gods are invalid. A complete reversal to what most people think.
FredSavageish 2 months ago 4
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Many, many logical problems with this video, starting with the strawman at 57 seconds...
SopaterTheBerean 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy
Hello, I have a couple concerns and questions. From 5:47 to 6:14, you sound a bit modalistic, not Trinitarian; has anyone told you this before? I was waiting for you to say (or imply) that God is three persons who always co-existed in eternity with each other.
Secondly, the 2-d and 3-d cube illustration also seems modalistic. I assume that the cube's sides resembled an aspect/person of God-- is this the assumption you're hoping the audience to have for that illustration?
SaintsEdified 2 months ago
@SaintsEdified Well, no you are 1st to suggest I sound modalistic. I assure you I am not a modalist at all. I believe in the Trinity as understood by scripture to be 3 co-existing persons in the one true God.
Yes, that is assumption I was hoping for with the cube example. The 6 squares co-exist to make 1 cube just as the 3 person co-exist in one God.
Sorry for the confusion.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago 14
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ForeverPraiseJesus 2 months ago
magnificent explanation.
whiteliketar 2 months ago 5
How can we who live and understand 3 dimensions understand concepts of hyper dimensions...
Yet a 2d Cartoon character cannot under stand concepts of 3 dimensions... surely like us the 2d character in a possible world can understand 3d concepts.
This doesn't help your trinity argument, because by the logic of the 2d character we can not be able to understand concepts of hyper dimensions from our perspective.
aaronstately 2 months ago
@aaronstately We can't. I don't think I ever suggested we can. The only thing we know is hyper dimensions exist because we are aware of them mathematically. Besides, I never said we can fully grasp the Trinity or hyper Dimensions. I said this is an attribute of God and He uses familiar terms, like person, in an attempt to explain Himself, since He is greater dimensionally. I hope this help.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago 13
I think the best argument I've heard for the trinity is the H2O analogy. Water, ice, and steam are all different forms of one molecule. So in a sense, they're different, but all one at the same time.
StygianDysnomia 2 months ago
MAKE MORE VIDEOS! I'm hooked.
pdilla 2 months ago
@pdilla I plan to, thanks
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
How are Muslims going to meet this argument...lol....great video & argument!
dannywizz 2 months ago
great video.
lilrat489 2 months ago
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This is actually heretical, it is teaching modalism. Strait from the pit of Hell, don't follow this un-Biblical heresy.
TruthDefenders 2 months ago
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TruthDefenders 2 months ago
Again about the cube analogy, we have to be careful, because the Trinity states that each of the three Persons IS God. Whereas, with a cube, while the 6 squares make up the one cube, the individual squares aren't THE cube. I know it wasn't your intention to use a cube as an analogy of the Trinity itself, but rather to illustrate our own difficulty in grasping the concept of hyperdimentions. I'm just pointing out how someone might misunderstand the argument.
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
@TheEgonTowst Sure, thanks for the input. It is helpful
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
5) And then yet at the same time, I also think of hell, and how people like to say that hell is "the absence of God's presence." I disagree, because I think the Scriptures are clear that the cause of torment in hell is God's own righteous wrath falling upon sin, which would mean He is very much present there, in some sense (See Rev. 14:10).
Anyway, I have no point, I am just offering some thoughts!
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
4) I think of the fact that God cannot tolerate sin in His holy presence. This is why nothing short of perfection will enter heaven. It seems to me that at the very least, a distinction must be made between what it means to be present with God in eternal life, and for God to be present in all places. Otherwise, His presence would necessitate the immediate destruction of all evil. Yet at the same time, He sees all, and is patient with sin for the time being.
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
@TheEgonTowst I think what you are suggesting is a logical absurdity. Psalm 139:7-10 says that no one can escape God's presences, not even in hell. I think when the Bible says God cannot look upon sin He we are touching something much deeper, as in He cannot be associated with it, therefore sinful beings cannot rest with and Him, like in eden. There is a great page on this on "tough questions answer.org"
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
3) Is God physically present in all places, even in the hyperdimentional sense, or is the concept of omnipresence just our attempt to explain the fact that nothing escapes His sight? Would it be legitimate to say that God, even as a physical being, is omnipresent in a spiritual but not necessarily physical sense? Or to state it another way, His *presence* is in all physical places, but is this necessarily the same as saying His physical being is in all places, even in the hyperdimentional sense?
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
@TheEgonTowst Thanks for the thought, but my understanding of God being omnipresent came front he the Bible, Jeremiah 23:24, "Do not I fill heaven and earth?" declares the LORD." I hope this helps to explain where I got my definition of omnipresence. Perhaps I should of included it in the video.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
2) Your explanation may avoid this error, but I'm a little skeptical about the cube analogy because the figure living in 2D space is perceiving the cube one side at a time. Someone misunderstanding the argument could conclude a modalistic view of God. Im also a little skeptical about the idea of hyperdimentionalism in general. Not that I doubt the truthfulness of the concept, but I wonder if God being physically present in all places at all times is really the most accurate way to understand Him
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
1) This is an interesting explanation, but if I may offer a suggestion, I would include in the argument a warning against modalism, as this and other heretical views of the Trinity are common errors that analogies of the Trinity imply. E.g. the water analogy -- steam, liquid water, ice -- these are *states* of a single substance; they don't exist simultaneously. Likewise the egg analogy -- shell, white, yolk -- these are *parts* of the egg, but none *is* the egg.
TheEgonTowst 2 months ago
@mojohound - Wow, I need to be my own grammar Nazi. Sorry about the "You're" rather than a "Your"...
mojohound 2 months ago
Although this explanation may give scientific "backing" for the trinity, it does absolutely nothing to explain why it is a trinity rather than say a quaternity or quinternity.
spammyadvertising 2 months ago in playlist More videos from InspiringPhilosophy
@spammyadvertising Watch the 2nd part of the video starting at 5:26. I believe He is revealed as 3 persons for love and relational reasons. I can't prove why He is only 3 persons but I try to offer a logical claim as to why. I hope this helps.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
how God can be hyperdimensional if he is spaceless? besides, does the bible really imply or suggest that a trinity exists? Did the original disciples believed in a trinity?
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko Yes the trinity is clearly presented in the letters of Paul and the gospels. Although the term was not used until later. Take a look at Matthew 28:18-20, 1 Peter 1:2, Matthew 3:16-17, John 1:32-34, Luke 3:21-22, John 14:26, John 15:26, Galatians 4:6, etc. Jesus said in John 10:30 says, "The Father and I are one." the Greek shows that the verse says they are one essences. Jesus called himself "I AM" claiming to be YHWH several times. Also...
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy I wish I could go deeper in this discussion but is hard for me since English is not my natural language, sorry, well, I believe in God, but I don't think there are good reasons to believe in a Trinity. You quoted John 10:30, in response, I give you John 17:21, 22 where Jesus prays for his disciples to become one like Jesus and God are one, but certanly Jesus wasn't praying for de disciples to become one entity but to have the same purpuse and thinking. Thank you.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko I don't think the Bible says God is spaceless. It says He fills everything. In other words He is everywhere at once. Esphesians 1:23, "which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all." In Jeremiah 23:24 God declares, "Do I not fill heaven and earth?" God is everywhere at once. Thanks for the question.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy You are right, the Bible doesn't say that God is spaceless but acording to the Cosmological Argument, in order to God created the universe one of the characteristics he must have is being spaceless.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko Honestly, I don't know much about the cosmological argument because I'm not a fan of it. Do you have a link on it to send me? What I think it means is He is outside of our space, as in universe. From what I know of it, God cannot be part of our universe to create it, or part of the 3D world. He has to be beyond our universe to create it. Therefore He is spaceless, as in you can't find Him by searching the deeps of space or 3D spatial world. Message me a link if you can. Thanks
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy How can you make that claim? How come god must be outside of our universe to create it? Doesn't make from a naturalistic view. One could easily imagine creating something (such as a fort) from within. Please explain this claim.
spammyadvertising 2 months ago in playlist More videos from InspiringPhilosophy
@spammyadvertising Thinking God is a part of our universe, is like Hamlet looking for shakespeare in the castle attic. I'm paraphrase CS Lewis.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy This is the debate between Dr. Craig and Professor Wolpert, if I'm not mistaken, this is Dr. Craig's Opening Speech and Starts summarizing the Cosmological argument at 4:50. There is also a lot of material in his website reasonablefaith (.) org... well the CA is the main reason why I think your explanation of the Trinity fails, but maybe I am wrong, I hope you find this useful by the way, your other video is great, keep up the good work.
/watch?v=-pFY7xHI0Ps
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko Yes I see, well spaceless is defined as, "having no limits or dimensions in space; limitless; unbounded." So it sounds to me like my definition of God as infinitely dimensional, is consistent with Craig's definition. I don't feel I claim the trinity to be material. He is clearly nothing physical or a part of of our physical world. But the Bible does say He fills everything and everywhere so I don't think Craig means spaceless as in having no space. I hope that helps.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy It seems to me that Dr. Craig by saying that God is spaceless is claiming that he doesn't need or occupies space in order to exist since he created space and time and is hard for me to conceive that something that has no dimensions in space is infinitely dimensional it is kind of contradictory. If I get it right, you are claiming that the Trinity occupies a place in the space (when it is dimensional) and at the same time is immaterial but, I mean, how is that possible?
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko I think we are looking at space defined differently. Space defined from my understanding is, "the unlimited or incalculably great 3D realm or expanse in which all material objects are located and all events occur." Webster gives a similar definition. I don't believe God occupies a 3D space because He expands beyond it. If space could contain Him, then He wouldn't be God. So God is spaceless as in our definition of space (3D).
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy Well that's my definition of space too, and as you do, I believe that God transcends space and time, but that's the point I don't get, How can something beyond space can be in any way dimensional, because in order to something have dimensions it must be physical, therefore material and being contained in space, when you quote the Bible I don't think it implies that God fills all in a physical context.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko I see, but on the flip side we don't really know what a spirit is. It may very well be something physical in a sense of hyper dimensions (not 3D). A comparison would be how air is physical but not a a solid sense. Plus, we don't know much about what the hyper dimensions are, we just know they exist. Some speculate the extra dimensions are not space at all, like 4D is time. God could be dimensional, but not in a 3D way. Make sense?
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy Fair enough, I understand your video in a better way now, Thanks for your time.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko Thank you for offering challenges, I love to challenge my mind with complex ideas. I find it extremely enjoyable.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@trickjacko Plus in order for Cosmological Argument to be right and the universe to exist. We must draw an inference between the items in the set (things within the universe) and apply it to a set as a whole (the universe). For that to be valid we have to presuppose a realm beyond the universe, in which the universe can be taken from as an item. In other words, God pulls a 3D realm from a infinite Dimensional realm. If I had more space I would elaborate more.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy Thanks for this explanation now I understand better the concept of hyperdimensions and God being hyperdimensional, but still I don't believe in a Trinity and I don't think the Bible supports that Idea, anyway I think each of us have one belief and good reasons for it.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko Yes, understandable. I'm glad I could be of help. If I may suggest something else, I did leave one factor of the Trinity out of this video that I plan on putting into a sequel for this video. Which is at the end of this video: "youtube. com /watch?v=vGVYXog8NUg" If you are still curious about the trinity I would suggest this argument as well. Thanks for the fun discussion.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@trickjacko The Bible clearly says God fills all, so He must be spaceless, as in unconfined by space.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@trickjacko : be careful of using or abiding in man-made philosophies, because that is what collapsed the Early Christian church and corrupted it. Even the early Apostles (NT) warned against man made doctrines, which speaks of man-made ideas to explain God. This includes trying to interpret the scriptures, which was called "private interpretations" as Apostle Peter described. This also applies to "InspiringPhilosphy", trying to use science to replace scripture and revelation.
viewer087 2 months ago
@viewer087 You are once again assuming that the early Christians didn't believe in the Trinity, which isn't constant with the Textual Criticism of the Bible and you are assuming that Science is not of God. Should we look at science as a revelation from God?
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy : Trinity Doctrine (Nicene Creed) does not belong to Early Christian Church. Apostles made sure Church members were corrected, & a lot of correction they had to do due to false doctrines filtering in - man made philosophies about God. RE: self-proclaimed Christians after the Nicene Creed, sure, many believed, but the Early Christian Church (NT) did not teach it. Anyway it was politically motivated by Constantine.
viewer087 2 months ago
@viewer087 @viewer087 You do realized Constantine converted to Arianism because of his sister after the council of Niceae? If He was politically motivated the create the trinity why would he abandon it. Look for my video this summer of Niceae. It will correct this idea that the council invented orthodox Christianity, which is not constituent with early church writings.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy : Arianism is not of Christ. It was also said that Constantine converted to Christianity and he had a vision from God to go into battle. Sorry, all these things about Constantine only describes a man who was not a true Christian and at least a bit high on himself. For any doctrine to announced as God's, it MUST be given by revelation. There was no revelation in the Nicene Council or any Council thereafter. Bishops do NOT receive revelation for God's Church, only Apostles.
viewer087 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy : where is the Niceae Video, cannot find it ... or did you mean it is coming in the summer of 2012? Just making sure I understood you correctly
viewer087 2 months ago
@viewer087 Again you are going on the assumption that the concept of the trinity was invented at Niceae, which isn't consistent with the writings of early church fathers. You are also assuming that the Trinity was not revealed to man through God. I see the trinity is clearly revealed several times in scripture, such as when Jesus was baptized. I would recommend reading the direct writings of the early church before you assume. The trinity concept was with the early church.
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
@InspiringPhilosophy : first the Trinity doctrine was created at Nicene or Niceae. Second, there is no scripture to support it, even Catholic Scholars admit that. So if you think there is scripture supporting it, by all means provide those scriptures by passage name and I will look them up and respond. Then I will show which was revealed by God and what wasn't. Next, do not assume the writings of a "church" after the apostles left were writings of God, because they were not. I will read tomorrow
viewer087 2 months ago
@viewer087 I'll message you, have a good night
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
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@InspiringPhilosophy Perhaps you will have a spirit of a Berean, and be wise like Solomon (Proverbs 18:17,) and see why you are reading the doctrine of the trinity into the text at Jesus' baptism, and how the opposite is true, that is, the baptism disproves the Trinity. redwordschurch dotcom / 2011 / 07/31 / the-trinity-matt-316/
SopaterTheBerean 2 months ago
@viewer087 Thanks for the advice, I don't believe in a Trinity though, but in the past, the Bible was kept from some people that weren't considered worthy of know about the scriptures and that's not what God really wanted, I don't think InspiringPhilosophy is trying to replace anything, rather he's trying to clarify some ideas and making easier to people to understand their doctrine and be able to defend it if necessary.
trickjacko 2 months ago
@trickjacko: Yes the Bible was kept locked by the priests, some reasons were special interests in preventing power lost, etc. This occurring by "Christians" who claim the Trinity was of God. This withholding the Bible was not God's way or teachings and this represents serious apostasy of the church. Have not cross-checked dates, but who knows, the control of scriptures may have occurred at same time of Nicene Creed. (Cont...RE: InspiringPhilosphy)
viewer087 2 months ago
(Cont...RE: InspiringPhilosphy) - Any attempt to teach false doctrine by many means, is still false doctrine and should not be done. But InspiringPhilosphy has his freedom to believe what he wants. Yet be assured, no true faithful of God will endeavour to teach false doctrines to anyone, by any means.
viewer087 2 months ago
Well done video.But there are quite a few Christians like myself who hold to an "open view" of God where because he has chosen to give beings free choice, that limits to some degree His knowledge of the future. He is omniscient in the sense of knowing all the past and present and because He can do anything He wants (Isaiah 46:10),He can predict and know much of the future too. But, some future are unknown due to giving free choice (btw, check out my main channel, truthislife7 here on youtube.)
dotoree 2 months ago
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dotoree 2 months ago
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dotoree 2 months ago
Also, if you were agnostic, how did you conclude Jesus? How did you get from trying to claim agnosticism to trying to explain a ridiculous concept, unique to a single religion (that I'm aware of), by showing that the answer may be hidden from our perception. The explanation of a trinity is beyond perception because it's logically, rationally and arithmetically flawed, not because we couldn't understand it until we theorized about higher dimensions. Your sudden conversion is suspect.
mojohound 2 months ago
@mojohound genetic falacy much?
Falcondick69 2 months ago
@Falcondick69 - Which of us are you suggesting is committing a genetic fallacy? My question is valid on it's face, regardless as to whether he had decided that Islam was the one true religion, or Judaism, or Baha'i, or Jainism, or Sikhism, etc. He begs the question, which is typical for religious faith - they assume the conclusion. He displays the conclusion espoused by certain sections of a single faith. How did he get there when agnosticism means without knowledge?
mojohound 2 months ago
@mojohound you didnt watch the video it seems. he explained that as an agnostic he couldnt wrap his head around the idea of a "trinity" and then he became a christian and in this way in the video said that is how he managed to understand it. and it isnt begging the question to explain a conclusion, also if you are agnostic to the idea of a Mosque existing on the peak of mnt.everest and then you find out there isnt one you are no longer agnostic about the question.
Falcondick69 2 months ago
@Falcondick69 - Then you also beg the question. He got to Jesus because he found that there was a possible analogy to the trinity in this god being multidimensional, and therefore thought he might now understand how science shows god? He makes claims for his god that are not only not supported by evidence but are logically, physically and conceptually impossible, such as "infinitely dimensional". Infinity is a concept, not a condition.
mojohound 2 months ago
You're right, it isn't begging a question to explain a conclusion, but he begs his question by assuming his conclusion. He used statements from the Bible as his source, not statements from the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, or Dianetics, etc. How did he decide that these particular statements were truthful, why did he dismiss all the other beliefs? How did he get to Jesus by philosophical masturbation, which this video is. Pure speculation presented as proof of a conclusion.
mojohound 2 months ago
Seriously? I mean, seriously? Your explanation consists of trying to demonstrate how three different things can be one thing, we just don't perceive it as being unified. How exactly does this explain the trinity? If it's one thing, even if it appears to be three, it's still only one thing and thus, no trinity. If it actually is three things then it isn't one thing, and you're left right back at the beginning. You haven't explained anything, and your analogy is flawed.
mojohound 2 months ago
@viewer087 Honestly, I see your logic as being flawed and based on some easily refutable assumptions. There are a number of things from God that are confusing, such as end times prophecies. However, youtube doesn't allow enough space for a reasonable response and I don't want to start fighting. So I respect your objections & hope you will check out some of my other videos. I plan on doing one on Niceae in time. If you want to talk more, message me so we can have more space.
Peace brother
InspiringPhilosophy 2 months ago
ive always thaught of it like this the phrase 'jesus is god' is a phrase of predication , like a chair is red . im not saying its a colour but the phrase the 'trinity' is god is a phrase of identification. so jesus is god but the trinity is still 1 god. But its a great video
lxAgnosticxl 2 months ago
The Father, is now and forever more so, always appearing to us as Jesus Christ. The Father who cannot ever be seen in His Eternal Original Estate, is now a Visible Lord God Almighty, accessing to us a Way of Being Visible, by having take up Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Priest Yahweh of Elohim God, Yahweh is Jesus' own Name, Yeshua, which means Yahweh the Priest of the Lord Elohim , He is our God. Jesus is the only Name and appearing personal God, coming to us out of the Infinite
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
In Conclusion, where as God had in various ways appeared to Israel, in the Fire, the Burning Bush , the Thundering Shaking Mountain, and in the Persons God Elected as Messiah High Priest to Channel from Heaven to Earth, God's own SPEECH. God finally came into the flesh as Jesus Christ, the final Temple of Yahweh God, the Priestly Son of God, partaking the Nature of God in Himself Forever , such that as God's Person of Appearing , furthermore ever again, the Father appears as Jesus Christ
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
On Day of Atonement, High Priest was Ceremonially put to death by the symbolic act of slaying a Ram and showing the Blood before God's Throne. The Priest was Baptized in Water, Clothed in Funeral Garments, "Clothed in Righteousness". The Priest went into the Holy of Holies to lie upon the Mercy Seat as Dead. Then God came down & Raised up the Priest, When the Jews saw this they said "Hear O Israel, the Lord , our God, the Lord is One" This Unity of Three, made a man appear as God Speaking.
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
YHWH " YOD HEY VAD HEY" four Hebrew letters mean " Behold the Hand, Behold the Nail" This is the office of the High Priest, as was Moses the Levite Messiah in his day, face to face with God, meaning God was indwelling at times, inside Moses' literal flesh and blood body and taking over the body and God made Moses more like a Puppet, a Way of Speaking from Invisible Heaven, through a man's body, to the People who heard Moses speaking out of the Fire. as standing in God's Place. 3=1
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
YHWH or Yahweh God, is Personal and Appearing, not the Generic Invisible surrounding Glory of God EL or Elohim God. the Letters spelling YHWH have to do with the specific duties of the High Priest, who gives over his own flesh and blood body on the Day of Atonement, as if dead, symbolized by the blood of the Ram sacrificed in his place. That then God comes down in the Holocaust Fire, the Shekinah enters the Priest and God then is Possessing the body and speaking out through the mouth.
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
The special Name of the appearing God of Israel, "YAHWEH" or by the Divine Tetragrammaton or Four Hebrew Letters that signify His Name as the God who appears among us, YHWH, is different than the generic Name of God Elohim, which is "All" not the Personal God. The Personal God to Israel comes out of God's Mind as a High Priest, as was Moses, Indwelt by the Holy Spirit, acting and standing exactly in God's Place, not next to God or near to God, but coinciding with the God Yahweh.
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
The Literal Reason, we call a special man, "PRIEST" is that He is able to Transfigure the Being of God which is surrounding us forever, but unimaginable or invisible because we cannot understand that we are living inside something that is God. So the Priest is a Person of God, so chosen by God's Mind, that through the Priest, God is able to conduct His Business from Heaven, out of His Mind's Desire, into the Priest and out through his mouth to speak as God and his hands to act as God
CarmineFragione 2 months ago
There is an analogy of a great fireplace with a huge furnace fire going on. If one ember is taken away from the assembled material that is burning,the isolated ember begins to cool off and dies. When the Person you are, is not in the Fire of God, where everything is Glorified in a Great Fire of Energy, you are separated away from God, cool off, lose the heat of Life and die from Sin. So, in God you can live forever, being One with God, but by Sin, separated from the Glory , you will die.
CarmineFragione 2 months ago