i was not aware that leg loops were life safe hard points. secondly why not ascend using a grigri and an ascender, you wouldn't have such a terrifying transition and you can back up your grigri with a with a prussick if you need, (to hard point.)
@palindromepk86 You can certainly tie in short if you want a back up for the two ascenders. As for the gri gri method, sure, you can ascend that way or any of at least 20 other methods. The advantage of the gri gri systm is a trivial transition to rappel. The disadvantage is that to pull in slack, even redirected off the top ascender, you end up picking up the trailing rope. Gets tiring on a long ascent. Also a closer connection to the rope at your waist makes standing on a limb harder.
That is probably the scariest transition from Ascend to Rappel that I have ever seen. It is a very sketchy movement in a high stress situation without any solid back up. Good thing she was only 3 feet off the ground. You really should re-evaluate the process of that transition.
@NorthWashOutfitters The one additional thing we sometimes do is to add a figure eight on a bight below all the action. However, we always maintain two connections to the rope, and removing the lower ascender last means that if we lose control of the rappel, the ascender jams in the rappel device. You can find this same transition in rope rescue books. Try Fasulo. These days we use gri gri's for the change over which makes things considerably easier. Any specific recommendation?
@CornellTreeClimbing The part that had me concerned is when she stands up and disconnects from the rope the auto block slips and there is nothing stopping her from sliding except hitting that lower ascender. My technique is to raise the lower ascender up underneath the top ascender, we then attach the rappel device, stand up in the ascender, suck extra rope into our rappel device and lock it off so we are hanging in rappel device. Since we are locked off we can then disconnect both ascenders.
@NorthWashOutfitters If I follow you correctly we rejected that method specifically because students have difficulty controlling the rappel when they are removing the last ascender. The lower ascender hitting the belay device is a very reliable backup in this situation. If the last ascender removed is above the belay device and the student bobbles the rappel then off they go.
@Zember007 Interesting notion! Well, no. I can assure you that it is not in any way illegal for a recreational tree climber to rappel with an ATC. This is not to say that it is the only or best way, but it is certainly serviceable.
Interesting Video, but I still dont see the advantages to a technologically complicated system over what can be done with the minimal prussiks and hitches? can any one clarify this for me please?
@jorndis That's a good point, and I know a number of folks with that perspective. I think the short answer is that you can accomplish all these things with prussiks, munter, Blake's or whichever of the zillions of reversible hitches you prefer. We have a guy on the staff who can climb with prussiks as fast as I can with ascenders. On the other hand, there are a lot of folks around who can't manage those systems well, and prefer the accessibility of handled ascenders.
@pauljrsdad Autolockers are certainly nice. Our systems do away with carabiners in many places where arborists use them regularly, as in the connection to the ascenders. The two places where we still use them, in the ground anchor and in rappelling, don't necessarily need autolockers for safety. We double the anchor carabiners anyway as a matter of redundancy, and it is easy to monitor the status of a screw lock while rappelling.
@pauljrsdad I'm sorry but I just can't stand using auto lockers with the detent ball... the twisting gates with no detent are fine. Just hate trying to manipulate the detent while climbing
The guys voice is irrelevant, he knows his shite.
Unfortunately some Americans seem to be unable to open there throats properly when they speak. It's not just this guy. It's just the way they are. Infuriating i know.
@emlarge97 You can put your autoblock on the leg loop. Just make sure it is short enough not to run into your belay device. The key here is that the autoblock doesn't hold your weight. It merely acts in place of your hand on the brake strand of the rope. The tension on your leg loop will be about equivalent to hand pressure.
i was not aware that leg loops were life safe hard points. secondly why not ascend using a grigri and an ascender, you wouldn't have such a terrifying transition and you can back up your grigri with a with a prussick if you need, (to hard point.)
palindromepk86 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
@palindromepk86 You can certainly tie in short if you want a back up for the two ascenders. As for the gri gri method, sure, you can ascend that way or any of at least 20 other methods. The advantage of the gri gri systm is a trivial transition to rappel. The disadvantage is that to pull in slack, even redirected off the top ascender, you end up picking up the trailing rope. Gets tiring on a long ascent. Also a closer connection to the rope at your waist makes standing on a limb harder.
CornellTreeClimbing 1 month ago
That is probably the scariest transition from Ascend to Rappel that I have ever seen. It is a very sketchy movement in a high stress situation without any solid back up. Good thing she was only 3 feet off the ground. You really should re-evaluate the process of that transition.
NorthWashOutfitters 3 months ago
@NorthWashOutfitters The one additional thing we sometimes do is to add a figure eight on a bight below all the action. However, we always maintain two connections to the rope, and removing the lower ascender last means that if we lose control of the rappel, the ascender jams in the rappel device. You can find this same transition in rope rescue books. Try Fasulo. These days we use gri gri's for the change over which makes things considerably easier. Any specific recommendation?
CornellTreeClimbing 3 months ago
Comment removed
NorthWashOutfitters 3 months ago
@CornellTreeClimbing The part that had me concerned is when she stands up and disconnects from the rope the auto block slips and there is nothing stopping her from sliding except hitting that lower ascender. My technique is to raise the lower ascender up underneath the top ascender, we then attach the rappel device, stand up in the ascender, suck extra rope into our rappel device and lock it off so we are hanging in rappel device. Since we are locked off we can then disconnect both ascenders.
NorthWashOutfitters 3 months ago
@NorthWashOutfitters If I follow you correctly we rejected that method specifically because students have difficulty controlling the rappel when they are removing the last ascender. The lower ascender hitting the belay device is a very reliable backup in this situation. If the last ascender removed is above the belay device and the student bobbles the rappel then off they go.
CornellTreeClimbing 3 months ago
Isn't it illegal to rappel off of an ATC plate? Just wondering if you could clarify as I've heard several different people say that it is.
Zember007 4 months ago
@Zember007 Interesting notion! Well, no. I can assure you that it is not in any way illegal for a recreational tree climber to rappel with an ATC. This is not to say that it is the only or best way, but it is certainly serviceable.
CornellTreeClimbing 4 months ago
Interesting Video, but I still dont see the advantages to a technologically complicated system over what can be done with the minimal prussiks and hitches? can any one clarify this for me please?
jorndis 6 months ago
@jorndis That's a good point, and I know a number of folks with that perspective. I think the short answer is that you can accomplish all these things with prussiks, munter, Blake's or whichever of the zillions of reversible hitches you prefer. We have a guy on the staff who can climb with prussiks as fast as I can with ascenders. On the other hand, there are a lot of folks around who can't manage those systems well, and prefer the accessibility of handled ascenders.
CornellTreeClimbing 6 months ago
Great stuff but I would suggest using auto-lock biners only.
pauljrsdad 8 months ago
@pauljrsdad Autolockers are certainly nice. Our systems do away with carabiners in many places where arborists use them regularly, as in the connection to the ascenders. The two places where we still use them, in the ground anchor and in rappelling, don't necessarily need autolockers for safety. We double the anchor carabiners anyway as a matter of redundancy, and it is easy to monitor the status of a screw lock while rappelling.
CornellTreeClimbing 8 months ago
@pauljrsdad I'm sorry but I just can't stand using auto lockers with the detent ball... the twisting gates with no detent are fine. Just hate trying to manipulate the detent while climbing
vkelsov 8 months ago
The guys voice is irrelevant, he knows his shite.
Unfortunately some Americans seem to be unable to open there throats properly when they speak. It's not just this guy. It's just the way they are. Infuriating i know.
naughtyrobbie 8 months ago
Yes, probably better if the cute chick narrated. But thanks for the tutorial.
whaaaaateverful 9 months ago
@emlarge97 You can put your autoblock on the leg loop. Just make sure it is short enough not to run into your belay device. The key here is that the autoblock doesn't hold your weight. It merely acts in place of your hand on the brake strand of the rope. The tension on your leg loop will be about equivalent to hand pressure.
CornellTreeClimbing 1 year ago
menos susurro... hablar más firme, suena a ronroneo. Sin ofender !, Excelentes todos los videos !!. Saludos desde Argentina.
kidesqu 1 year ago
qué voz... por favor... un minuto más y tiro la pc. Buen video.
kidesqu 1 year ago
@kidesqu I'm sorry you don't like my voice but what am I supposed to do?
CornellTreeClimbing 1 year ago
Why get stuck on the "sound" of the voice? Its not like you cant mute the volume if you dont "like" it.
ErikKiliam 1 year ago 3
@ZK818 I don't like my voice much either, but it's the one God gave me. Not much I can do about it.
CornellTreeClimbing 1 year ago
Hate his voice but gud informative vid thanx
dchovs 2 years ago
goooood!!! no nesesary gloves?
SantiagoCardonaL 2 years ago
very good good tekneque
url96 2 years ago