Jin Air OSL Stork vs Hydra 2011-07-29 @ Pathfinder

[fjuurtiiz]

10:23 LOOOOOL

[mytitswillwork]

guys nono, . Zerg just play normal .

Stork FFE into gate - starport - rever (AKA. harrass build)

if zerg sees protoss FFE they gonna get fast 3rd its pretty typical.

the build stork is using is pretty good in big maps but not this map,

he should use more aggressive build not stargate rever,

because it delays your gates and units

zerg saw that then he knew if he attack he win no doubt.

there was nothing imba in this game, it was just build order lost

[ppshchik]

Pathfinder is such a horrible map why are they still using it?

[TheSZZy]

time for new generation of players, stork was good but now he is average no compare to younger players

[wasdwasdedsf]

lol

[VinsonWood]

pvz is hard in general, but this map makes it look nearly impossible :s

[scbwaddict]

1 justin reaver fan

[songkai0514]

does anyone know how to get replay of this game? or Pro replays in general?

[jeepld]

Please fix the scarabs AI!!

[SeenaSeenaSeena]

what a sick game....i thought it was over but at 23:29 HE MADE A SICK COMEBACK but ended up losing

[Arrrghgagooga]

Stork's defense was almost perfect but it was theorycrafting > mechanics this time.

[a8le8x]

Either you believe PvZ is balanced or you don't, but this match was no different than countless other games.

In general I think corsair/reaver is a poor build against the modern 5 hatch build. The zerg has such crazy flexibility, while the toss will need to do the same thing every time.

This game in particular, stork didn't put on any early pressure. The first big hydra drop was the deciding point, and if the game looked "imba" after that, it's because stork was way behind.

[llmbs]

Im a Toss player. I love how stork lost. I am sick and tired of this fe build. When I do it i always get hydra raped. Toss needs to do some old school pressure. Make zerg waste money on sunkens. 3 base vs 2 base toss is hard for toss to win unless zerg f's up

[RocketMess]

ZvP was considered imba because the power of protoss achrons, reavers and storms against zerg, but this new strategies like 3 hatch hydra pushes and fast ultra-defiler are a kind of sick. Protoss is always against a constant stream of units, and they can't move nor expand. It is unfair that zerg makes a mistake (like lose 12 hydras or 20 drones in storms) and still continue but protoss with a couple of mistakes is death meat.

The only way to protoss win is a no mistake match or tiny maps IMO.

[Eternalgosu]

@RocketMess yea exactly which is so frustrating when u play toss. hate the fact that a simple flaw can cost you the game most of the time. its probably not imba but maybe we need like a new toss revolutionist for a different BO or anything to counter this fast hydra push cuz this is sad :/

[fc9731]

What a terrible map...

[itsagooday]

i feel so bad about this game. it's nothing but imbalance. it's so true protoss naturally lose if without arduous check.

[doanvu11]

this is not about imba, it is about strategy. if you could not break in the main door, find another way as Hydra did, if hydra cannot bear with reavers, mutas did and another way around for every units in this game. it is just how you manage your game

[itsagooday]

@doanvu11 then any idea how much better stork can manage the game?

[Eternalgosu]

its a bad day to be a protoss LOL.. i dont know what else stork could have done more or better to block this 3cm drop. This is similar to the Bisu vs YellOw at Heartbreak Ridge but was it the lack of scouting? lack of cannons at base? the build? or the map? so imba to always fight an uphill battle against zergs

[VeeckyDa12one]

oh oh oh needless to say if u are a pvz fan

you will not be pleased by this outcome for the sake of the upcoming rounds :)

And by the way

Movies gateway first if i remember correctly was a horrible game but he left an open spot in his wall-in zergling ran through and it just snowballed from there after he lost several probes and it took him ages to get rid of the initial zerglings... so the outcome was clear and he just fought against the odds. But still go Movie and come back to OSL :)

[TRYCLOPS1]

Hydra is such an S-class zerg and Stork needs to change races or retire because it's just frustrating to see him loose like every good Protoss left. It's time for me to move on from being an all time fan of him... Stork... die.

[IVomitOnYourGod]

@TRYCLOPS1 rotfl

[TheMongolHordes]

fuck zergfinder needs to go, what a shitty map. Fuck stupid zerg hydralisk abuse.

[zephyrsimon]

Protoss is underpowered. Need proof? Bonjwa: 4 terran, 1 zerg, 0 protoss.

Scarab ai sucks, and it is one of two units from the protoss arsenal that needs resources to make. FE is now almost hard countered by hydra busts. OSL: only 2 protoss and Bisu got knocked out by Hyvaa in his 71% best match up. This game is not balanced, and the maps have little to do with it. Every non mirror match up, Protoss almost always have to fight it uphill.

[caeksauce8]

@zephyrsimon

bisu doesn't die from hydra bust. he may be an exception these days, but there are ways protoss can surprise and pressure the zerg even with the FE build.

[Strand0410]

@zephyrsimon The game is over 10 years old, people obviously have no problem with the balance at this point. The reason there are more Terran Bonjwas is because each one influences the next. There wouldn't be any Flashes or Oovs if there wasn't a Boxer. Only SC2 players bitch about balance.

[calidude146]

@zephyrsimon Seems you started watching pro-StarCraft only recently. You should know that there have been times where protoss players dominated the scene and the race was considered overpowered. While Bisu and Stork are arguably the best protoss players right now, they're not playing in peak condition. Your "proof" doesn't prove anything: StarCraft AI is lousy in general, and hydra busts are successful only when the protoss doesn't scout effectively. Protoss have rush builds they can do, too.

[zephyrsimon]

@calidude146 when?? When Bisu was killing off Savior for two MSLs? Its not considered as dominating when there is no Bonjwas. The highest win percentage for a protoss player right now is only 65.91% and that's Bisu. And where is Bisu? He got knocked off by some nobody in preliminaries of this OSL in his 71% matchup.

Where is this lousy ai in zerg or terran that has to pay for its ammo and misses its shots nearly half the time? Which unit does that? This game is not balanced.

[fishyfishbait]

@zephyrsimon you've obviously haven't seen dumbass ultralisks stand around, or run back and forth behind a zergling.

[odiumisfun]

@zephyrsimon If the matchup was imbalanced bisu wouldn't have his 71% winrate. With that winrate he should have a ~80% chance of winning a bo3 against a zerg and yet he failed and it was his own damn fault. Stork might have had the map against him and while his strategy was sound what made the muta switch possible was him losing sairs to hydras, something totally preventable. Stop whining.

[zephyrsimon]

@odiumisfun Until there is a protoss bonjwa stfu.

[wasdwasdedsf]

lol what

[randykarmakum]

@odiumisfun bisu only have 71% because of proleague where his zerg opponent didnt know who he will be playing, so he practiced against 3 races. If its individual leagues then he still lose because the zerg player can prepare solely a ZvP matchup against bisu. Its all about adequate preparation added to this imba matchup.

[wasdwasdedsf]

lol

[wasdwasdedsf]

uhh

[calidude146]

@zephyrsimon There are many matches and rivalries where Protoss came out on top. Bisu vs Savior is one of them as is Reach vs Boxer, Garimto vs Boxer, and so on. The reason there hasn't been a Protoss Bonjwa is not because the race itself is underpowered but because there haven't been any players to play the race with qualities like the other Bonjwas. That is, players like Bisu & Stork CAN play like champions, but they lack the fortitude/discipline to consistently play at that level unlike Flash

[RocketMess]

@calidude146 We talk about imba in PvZ, most of the games with hydra pushes are won by Zs. Nowdays look at medium and large maps 3hatch strat from Z, how many openings does toss have? (wall-off reaver HT, sairs harass, so predictible)

Bisu has fortitude/discipline Nal_ra too, they had OSLs y MSLs they were potential Bonjwas, they had new strats but were countered easily between competitions, why because protoss is not too flexible and that makes it predictible in high pro level.

[calidude146]

@RocketMess "Most games with hydra pushes are won by Z's." True. That's because it's a BO counter to a fast expand build. If Protoss didn't fast expand so much and play so predictably, you wouldn't see Zergs winning like this. Now that the element of surprise/novelty of the Bisu Build is gone, it's a risky build because you relinquish map control to the Zerg and leave yourself vulnerable to early attacks like hydra breaks. It was a powerful build, but now Zergs are using it to their advantage.

[wasdwasdedsf]

LOL WHAT

[calidude146]

@wasdwasdedsf What?

[randykarmakum]

@RocketMess true bisu and stork could have many more titles. Even toss's strongest MU PvT didnt look as imba as ZvP. Time to time terran come out with a good strat against P, the key to them is going up to 3/3 upgrades without economic damage so there is always chance to win, very unlike ZvP where protoss strat always countered..

[wasdwasdedsf]

lol

[wasdwasdedsf]

bisu is not in good condition?

[llmbs]

This game is heavily balanced. Every race has its burdens. Now the scarab ai IS MAJOR IMBA. It needs to be as precise as seige tank fire. Instead it wonders around and does no damage hella stupid. Like i said fe sucks. Try a fake fe let zerg take a third now and do a major zealot rush that'll put zerg on their toes

[Modesty00]

Hydra showed to stork and to everyone the true POWER of ZERG. Hydra bust front or maybe lurk contain.. no is Slow drop lings and lurk... NO is FAST mass drop HYDRA.. wait no is MUTA !!!

[ratatouillez]

Lol! WOW! I gotta say Hydra is my favorite zerg player behind Jaedong, brilliant harass using SLOW overlord for drops!? exploiting the lack of corsairs on the field.

But Man, if only hydra's ZvT was better then he'd be closer to jaedong's level. Still great play.

[JznZeroO]

ohh wtf! overlord micro xP 20:55 =D

[JznZeroO]

BUAHHHHHHHHHHHH! xO 10:23 LOL ^.^

[thebigcougar]

The micro by the mutas taking out photon cannons and reavers was osome. I have never seen a game like this one.

[fratleyiskewl]

OVERLORD MICRO

[hizokaR]

nice game :D gogo hydra.... u are the best nevake !!! thx so much

[jjay75]

Love the SC2 retards thinking Protoss is underpowered...at least in the way they think they are.

[OpenTheTrollGate]

now protoss need to put their ht in shuttles instead of letting them get sniped by mutas

[dimitur4o]

stork put such a good fight man,but freakin hydra hrrr

[OpenTheTrollGate]

shuttles should be a bit faster than scourge

[IVomitOnYourGod]

@OpenTheTrollGate Yeah and with speed upgrade for shuttles, scourges would be completely useless, brilliant idea...

[OpenTheTrollGate]

@IVomitOnYourGod corsairs

[IVomitOnYourGod]

@OpenTheTrollGate When you have +10 corsairs any scourge harass is almost impossible.

[ldavidtw2000]

10:22 *game starts* *rooting screams* *one guy got kicked in the balls*

[Eternalgosu]

not trying to complain but anyone else think this was imba? -.-;;

[Raz0rIG]

@Eternalgosu just watching Protoss lose every PvZ is pathetic and the race needs to be buffed a bit, zerg can do a lot of shit and still make a comeback if it fails cuz it has much more potential to do dmg, while protoss drops/harassments can simply be blocked by ALL standard zerg defense plays, as long as they don't make a stupid mistake, zerg wins.

[kidshavewings]

@Eternalgosu

sick of hydralisks busts

[Raz0rIG]

@kidshavewings yeah me too, but the trend has been that way because its cost efficient for zerg. Zerg will abuse w/e they can win with. Mass hydras vs reavers/hts is still more cost effective for zerg as long as they don't make a stupid micro mistake, did you see how stork struggled to do dmg with his reaver, reaver range against hydras is almost irrelevant because of how fast the hydras can close in on them and snipe them while the reaver takes forever to shoot one scarab that usually duds.

[randykarmakum]

@Eternalgosu imba as hell but it takes time to solve for protoss players, hydra didnt even cut drones or something. His econ is good shape always so he can afford to trade non stop since stork is pulling probes on every attack. I remember before this protoss shoot well with corsairs and zealot break zerg's 3rd and 4th.

[lakermangmx]

wow, that was intense

[monkeymoo87]

wtfffff

[deadspirit90]

lol at the scream at 10:22

[StridingStrider]

10:20 game starts

[zerazobz]

Go Ahead Hydra!