Frame a Hip Roof, Fast & Easy

[gzbg21]

How do you work out how deep to cut the birdsmouth on a hip? He said 2 1/2" but didn't explain why?

[babaloo42]

Cool!

[domino817]

GREAT IDEA IVE BEEN FRAMING FOR 36 YRS,SO FRAMING SQUARE IS THE ONLY WAY I KNOW TO FRAME HIPS,VALLEYS,COMMONS AND OFCOURSE STAIRS,BUT I THINK THE NEW GUYS MIGHT LIKE IT,I USE A DADO BLADE AND CUT ALL MY SEAT CUTS ONE SHOT,GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR PRODUCT

[1curt12]

you can also mark 3/4 ahead and behind the center mark of you hip so you dont have to make boh sides, saving tine

[ivoryalpha]

Walking off Common Length Difference only works in a perfect world .. it doesn't take into account the wood .. Some things that are old can be reintroduced and fine tuned with things that are new .. Large homes .. take the longest rafter heel sweep and the second to the shortest , Transfer the standing on both and divide by the CLD on The Tables ..ie 12/12 =22.62 .get the ratio and divide back into to fine tune for discrepencies .. and never again have a whacked out layoff on a hip

[ivoryalpha]

I'd rather use a Calculator from Walmart .Obviously ths "Square " is roughly 17" long and every inch must be represented approx 1 7/16" .. I suppose ..It is alright for a simple roof , but not a "Bastard" that requires different seat cuts and different overhangs .. As Framer of 32 years . I have always promoted The Math .. Make the math easy and they'll understand why they are cutting , what they are cutting and as every carpenter knows .. every house can have something unique to be considered

[rockbore]

Using the square to mark off long measure introduces compound error ( +or- 5% of smallest unit or 16th of an inch). I reckon your common rafters are going to be up to 1/2 an inch out. Is it time for the US to go metric?

[mikejmcc1970]

@rockbore

Some thing I do so I dont get the accumulated error is find my firsts layout point and then calculate the hypotenuse of the triangle, that is, the length along the hip it self as the rafter jacks land. Then all you have to do is add them up...no more accumulated error.

This is also a very effective way to do stairs. I was tired of laying out large stair of 20 steps or more with a square and having accumulated error by the time I reached the other end of my layout.

[fireball570]

No safety glasses or earmuffs...

[s37d]

@fireball570 shutup faggot

[rosevineman]

A framing square will you all the info you need to cut out all roof pieces.

It bothers me to see people trying to promote something that detracts from a tool that has been used successfully for over 100 years and if used properly is much more efficient and accurate than junk like this.

The only other square to use in place of or in combination with a framing square is a Swanson speed square.

[mikejmcc1970]

@rosevineman

Ya cause they had Swanson speed squares 100s of years ago.

You sound like the old man that tells the kids they should be out playing kick the can instead of riding those new fangled wheely boards by golly.

Hell man I built an entire spread sheet for my roofs so I can cut every piece on the ground all at once. It makes the job go about 4 times as fast.

[rosevineman]

The best way to lean how to frame a roof is to spend 30 minutes with an old carpenter (their "aged" wisdom and patience is what makes them the best teachers).

Here's the way it will probably go......They'll teach you what the numbers (dimensions and tables) on the square are for. Then teach you how to lay out the rafter line, building line, seat cut, fascia line, and soffit line. Then they'll teach you how to use a saw to properly cut it out.

[mikejmcc1970]

@rosevineman

...and then if you have half a brain you will improve on what they taught you, over the years...if people didn't we would still be banging rocks together in a cold, dark cave some where dying of tooth decay, and crapping worms and every other kind of parasite you can imagine.

My point is: There's ALWAYS a better way, and the day you think you have it all figured out is the day you should lay down your tools and die.

[rosevineman]

Everyone to his own method.............I prefer to stick with my framing square and a tape measure. If you give the contraption in this video to a framer who cuts in roofs for a living he would throw it in the trash. Its too big, has moving parts, and is more complicated than using a framing square or Swanson speed square.

If you learn how to use a framing square you will not only know how to cut in a roof frame properly but will understand the concepts of roof geometry.

[RenoDoctor]

To measure the cut angles of even a simple gable roof you have to know the trigonometric relationship behind every member. Expert framers break out the scientific calculator (this was done by pencil & paper years ago) and work out all the angles then transfer by framing square and/or adjustable. It isn't a trivial matter of setting a tab to 8in 12 and presto a hip roof. Video was fun to watch, but don't get lulled that framing comes down to measuring gauges. It doesn't.

[homeostasis4me]

Jesus on a donkey.....I can calculate the molarity of a solution if given the amount of solute in a given solution, the starting molarity of that solution, and he increase of that solute, by gram weight, per ounce of solution. Stoichiometry is fun! This shit is GREEK. You people are out there. I'll do your CBC for free if you frame my shop......hahaha.....

[PrimeFactorFilms]

I love your work it's extremely inspiring. Great job! Keep the videos coming.

[smithmx08]

Were the fuck is his PPE



[arbensullaj]

It's gr8



[norbertovaldez60]

god bless you maestro you may be in nasa more videos please gracias amigo give you adrees i will send you some tamales and mexicn food bless you

[restarto8]

I respect your innovation, but are you really suggesting that stairstepping rafter lengths is faster than simply calculating and measuring the length? I know for sure I can calc. and measure hips and layout far faster than I could with your method. Also how does your device account for hip drop? I think you have a great tool for your own personal use, but to say it saves scads of time for anyone is unrealistic.

[jrgniuwer]

where can i buy one of these squares please? thankyou!

[JustinBtchr]

Any chance you could send me one of these squares to try it out on my jobsites? I Do commercial carpentry and would like to give it a try. what stores sells these squares?

[scottishlad2k10]

hes just a sales man. fml

[adjustablehipsquare]

@scottishlad2k10 I am not just a salesman. I have been a contractor for over 27 years. I developed this square out of need on the jobsite. I brought it to market to share with others simpler methods of calculating components of a hip roof without having to understand more complicated math.

[scottishlad2k10]

@adjustablehipsquare your baisically  on and on and on about the lightweight....and what its made of etc..... its just a gimmie.plus most timberwork here anyway comes pre factory cut :) welcome to the brilliant kit houses and zip houses =] everythings done. can tell you for a fact that within the firm.... joiners cutting rafters/trusses....dosnt happen everythings factory cut by machine = less waste these machines use every piece your way is a waste of material.

[DJJUSSI]

@scottishlad2k10 And thats why Apprentice Carpenters these days are f**king useless because everything is per fabricated.If you asked them to assemble even a stud wall let alone a hip roof they wouldnt know where to start..So in conclusion as mush as truss plants etc save time and wastage the art of true Carpentary is being lost very quickly... :)

[overtenemy69]

@DJJUSSI Lol iam a 4th year carpenter and journeyman scaffolder

i rock at framing roofs iam oldschool!

[DJJUSSI]

@overtenemy69 Lol Nice mate keep it real...In NZ theres some shit Apprentices with no common sense...

[scottishlad2k10]

@DJJUSSI due to joiners having everything marked out for them in college no wonder they are all ruff as f*** even skills test day for them cutting rafters and setting them out its all drawn out for them thats why their all tools and useless half the older joiners are useless too cant even dryline a room without leaving coathanger screws everywhere fancy tools and the tools cant use them proper. pre-fab is far cheaper.......and quicker and more accurate. and everythings used no waste.

[DJJUSSI]

@scottishlad2k10 I know what your saying mate...I done my trade the old hard method and im telling you my skill set is better 10 fold than the average builder.If a carpenter cant use his materials to minimal wastage theirs somthing wrong with their calculations.A truss plant is supplied all the same length timber as a chippie can request from a merchant..A little bit of planning and thinking ahead will limit all wastage.

[scottishlad2k10]

@DJJUSSI im a painter & decorator / ames taper / cover / tiler and some of the jobs i do just want to make you cry at how bad the workmanship in the joinery is...... i see guys using plasterboard screws to hand £200 oak doors...... as for the plasterboarding dont get me started nevermind roofs! fools have automatic screwguns..... and the clowns cant even use the depthstop correctly. same with bradguns... they are crap! oldschool brads pull skirtings in. bradgun nails dont!!!

[DJJUSSI]

@scottishlad2k10 Yeah mate...No common sense in some of these muppets....I know how frustrating it must be for someone like you who comes in to do the finishing toucehs only to find some dip shit hasnt done the previous stage properly...My foreman was a hard arse and would go over every jib fix with his finger until he could trust that you were gonna do it properly.

[scottishlad2k10]

@DJJUSSI sure is eh turn up and the place is a bombsite..... joiners tools....... rubbish the lot and then mix up the filler or plaster to start skimming and finding screws hanging out and rough boarding its depressing. they should take the joiners away from plasterboard and let the "boarders" back in they are far neater and quicker. i wish the foremen in the companys here were like that they dont seem to care which is pretty bad.

[mikejmcc1970]

@DJJUSSI

What?!?! That's why they'er called APPRENTICES, they don't know dick. OF COURSE they don't know how to put a stud wall together...are you listening to your self? A Hip roof...you must be out of your mind to think that they should even have an inkling on how that would be done. I had a guy like you training me when I was a kid wanting to learn and getting shit on all the time. The only thing he taught me was how NOT to treat people just cause you know some thing they don't.

[muchadoaboutnoting]

@adjustablehipsquare He's obviously not just a salesman. He's using his experience and skills, and is showing something which uses trig and other mathematics to help make a valid and accurate shortcut. To me he seems to know what he's talking about, and that sort of person makes the best salesman.

[mojoeshaw]

@scottishlad2k10 And what's wrong with that? In order to make money on your idea, it's got to start somewhere and he seems to be a do it yourself type person. Kudos to him and his product. If I did more construction, I'd buy his device and consider it a part of my arsenal over the competition. Thanks for posting the video and good luck with your product.

[gizmobently]

It seems that the most important part of any hip valley framing is the deductions that need to be made based on the framer's preference (uploader's) of fastening his hips to the ridge, to each other, or between commons. Each one of these will dictate a different deduction and cut. No calculator does that for you, nor does the square used here. This is a simple calcution as the only method of procedure that will give the same result regardless of the pitch is to measure in the level plane.

[bluebird5100]

what about dropping the hip b/c he didn't bevel off th corners?

[gizmobently]

@bluebird5100

He hasn't cut any commons yet, so why would he need to drop the hips? I assume he would adjust his commons to his hip heel heigth for this purpose of keeping his hip centerline in plane to commons for sheathing.

[babysavaggge]

GREAT VIDEO GUYS LIKE U BLESS US WITH UR KNOWLEDGE 2 THUMBS UP

[Austinagent1]

It's hip to be square

[SuperFabiannnn]

This is an awsome video. I've looked around and for someone who knows enough but is not and expert.... This is great stuff. As i said, i am not an expert and i am tring to build a good size playhouse with a two sided 12'2 roof, and i am tring to understand somthing that i hope you can explain in an easy way that i can understand. Im sure the higher the roof pitch the longer the board, correct? Now if i set your square to the pitch i want, will it give me the correct lengh from the apex to the c

[balrajhansra]

you did not mention how support those rafter for vertical load.can you please explain

[traphic11y]

As you demonstrate at 7:24 your first common (jack) rafter is 8 3/4 away from the starting position. does that mean that the jack rafter (1) will be 8 3/4 long and jack  ( 2) will therefor be 8 3/4 x 2, etc. Please explain as I am unsure how the adjustable hip square method can help me find the proper length of my jack rafters.

[adjustablehipsquare]

@traphic11y The distance to the first common rafter from the hip establishes 2 things; 1) it allows us to position the layout of that rafter as well as other rafters on the hip to receive the jack rafters 2) with this # you can multiply by the ratio (in this case on a 6:12 the ratio is 1.118) to determine the length. Included with the adjustable hip square we send a list of ratios for any pitch from 1:12 through 16:12 to calculate the common or jack rafter length.

[restarto8]

@traphic11y just use the distance from the side of the hip to the far side of the longest jack along the plate as your span, then calculate the length as a common rafter. Using that as a reference, a standard framing square, rafter book, or calculator will give you the lengths of all the successive jacks. Also, for efficiency layout a cut roof as though it were trusses-form the outside to the center. This way all the jacks are the same length for corresponding positions.

[pdb199266]

why not just use your framing square and stair gauges? carpenters have been framing regular and irregular hip roofs with them for 150 years! nice gimmick tool to sell to homeowners wanting to build a shed and too cheep to pay someone to do it .

[adjustablehipsquare]

@pdb199266 Asa I have pointed out, you can use a framing square with stair gauges to accomplish the same result. The benefit of useing our tool is that the scale on the bottom numbered from 1 through 12 along with the locking adjustable arm makes it so much easier to use rather than converting the bottom of the framing square that reads just under 17", and running the risk of gauges set slightly off or getting bumped off during lay off.

[rickvtr]

so how do you set it out without that gadget square??

[the1fordirt]

If your hip jacks are cut right you don't need a lay out on your hips nail them where they fall waiste of time

[gizmobently]

@the1fordirt

this is true, as long as the difference from common rafter to longest hip jack is correct.

[builder37660]

well done!!!!

[shiftclick]

Wow,

As a do-it yourselfer I "kinda" get it, But , RESPECT to your

knowlege and impressive command of spatial theories!!!

A big thanks for this vid !

[cheweydan]

i think that the product needs a bit more explanation best suited for DIY and apprentices like me

[adjustablehipsquare]

@taitinme By bastard pitch I asume you mean a pitch not in an even increment such as 3.75 on 12 or 5.3333 on 12. As long as the hip or valley rafters are placed 45deg in relation to the walls, the square can be set to any pitch between 0 to 16.5 on 12. Even a pitch of 4.5 on 10 could be coverted to 5.4 on 12 and set on the square. This would always be true for any pitch as long as the hip or valley is in that traditional possision of 45deg to the wall plates.

[taitinme]

@adjustablehipsquare no I mean an unequal pitched roof like a 15/12 dormer on a 12/12 roof, or a hipped roof with two different pitches and same rise. Bisected footprint angle is not 45 degrees.

[chappellt]

@adjustablehipsquare No, I was thinking more like a 12/12 dormer on a 9/12 main pitch. What would you do in this situation??

[joseph3joey]

@chappellt

His square does not give you that information.

[aussieace450]

i know a faster way... its called trusses... pre fab in a factory....

[Propertyexit]

This looks way to complicated! I think a construction master may be the best way to go, for me at least. I

[ejbell61]

Have you guys ever heard of the construction master? Makes all this stuff even simpler.

[adjustablehipsquare]

In the time it takes to gather your data and compute a product, you can have an entire hip rafter completed with the Adjustable Hip Square. And, you cannot calculate or place the layout on the hip rafter with the construction master calculator. Try one of our squares, you too will become a believer.

[joseph3joey]

@adjustablehipsquare >>IAnd, you cannot "CALCULATE" or place the layout on the hip rafter with the construction master calculator.<<

Can you explain what you mean by not calculate a hip rafter with a CM calculator?

[adjustablehipsquare]

@joseph3joey As I demonstarte in the video, the square allows you to place or transfer the layout for the common rafters from the wall plates the the hip or valley rafters in one step with no additional calculations. With any calculator there are several steps in calculating where on the hip rafter to start your layout and what the correct spacing would be for the particular pitch being used.

[joseph3joey]

@adjustablehipsquare

Mark,

I know how your square is used and it's nice and works. It's the same as stepping off a common rafter with a framing square. It works but it's not faster then using a CM calculator. You get the hip length in seconds and you mark it. just like a common rafter. I've been a framer for 27 years and used to step off commons and then measure the hips. Calculating commons and hip lengths takes seconds with a CM.

[the1fordirt]

@joseph3joey If you hip jacks are cut right you don't need to layout the hips waiste of time

[joseph3joey]

@the1fordirt

I never said that I layout the hip for jacks. There's no need at all to do that. For a hip running at 45 degrees the framing square tells you the jack difference. For Bastard hips I use my Construction Master Calculator. Stepping off rafters with a square is slow and not as accurate as using a calculator.

[the1fordirt]

@joseph3joey

Sorry my comment was for adjustablehipsquare

[gizmobently]

@joseph3joey

As I said, no construction master will give you the actual cutting length of any jack or hip rafter. It will give you the theoretical length, and you will have to make adjustments to your theoretical length based on how thick your hip is and pitch. I like to double long hips, so my theortical length will be the same, but the actual length will be different from the one hip thickness also. Difference between common rafter and longest hip jack is common difference of all jacks.

[joseph3joey]

@gizmobently

I'm not talking about actual lengths. When I calculate lengths they are the exact length because I deduct ridge for the effective run therefore when the hip is calculated on the CM it's the correct length. No need for any adjustments later. His square is nothing more than using a framing square and stepping off the hip. There's no need to step off a hip or common. The CM is much faster and gives you the exact length for what you need.

[the1fordirt]

@joseph3joey 

[gizmobently]

Hello Mark,

I have to say, that is one of the slickest ways I have ever seen in laying out of roof! great job and great explanation in only a 10 minute video. you clearly know what you are doing, and by being able to lay this out without ever getting up on the roof is what very few can do today. I think I am going to buy one for sure. Keep up the videos and maybe zero in for us on the connections of hip to ridge, as I would love to see how these were made with your layout technique.

[dexsmasher]

the lay out might have only took 10 mins but the cuts are terrible they are not tight at all.?

[BlackSoulent]

i will like to see your jobs!!

[wesdawg84]

honestly i think that its a cool idea  I personally enjoy figuring the length strictly with math and not with jigs or squares however its a pretty cool tool could help cut time on typical 45 degree hips and valleys

[adjustablehipsquare]

The adjustable arm, once set to the correct pitch, holds the bottom of the square in plane with the wall plates, which allows you to simply read the scale. You are not measuring along the pitch of the rafter, rather maintaining correct proportion with the wall plates.

[adjustablehipsquare]

If you watch the entire video, you will see that the square is 16.97" although it is divided into 12 segments. This dimension represents the ratio between the wall plates and the 45deg angle of the hip or valley rafters or the secant scale to which I refer.

[JOEY1JACKAL]

Also, your next measurement marking the 16" center is wrong. It should be 22.627421" or 22-5/8" because the 16" run and 16" rise in plan view has a 22.627421" diagonal measurement.

The 12" overhang on the hip sticking past the plate will give you an 8.485281" or 8-1/2" overhang on the rest of the building with all the commons because the 12" overhang for the hip is running at 45°

[JOEY1JACKAL]

Mark,

The way youre laying out your hip is wrong. That 5-7-1/2 step off is for the common rafter, not the hip rafter.

Also the way you mark your 8-3/4" on the hip rafter where the jacks will hit is wrong. It should be 12.37437" or 12-3/8" because the hip is running at 45°. You have in plan view an 8-3/4" run and an 8-3/4" rise giving you a diagonal measurement of 12.37437".