Senator Orrin Hatch on Polygamy (Children Graves)

[hiimallen]

fincenMIB REAL crusade:

"I could have traded something better than carpet for the girl!"

[fincenMIB]

Allen, Allen, you have your head in the gutter, what would Uncle Warren say?

[thepayoff07]

So it has become obvious to me that you are "off" and twist things just like a politician; the devil invented this method you use when he told Jesus he would give him the world if he would follow him, but it wasn't his to give anyways and Jesus; probably laughing, turned him down.

No religious man of God has to lie to make a point nor twist the truth like you are doing repeatedly. Straighten up if you want to make a point you have to earn it squarely sir.

[fincenMIB]

No there is more, Christopher Rosch the Senators Communication Director who gave journalist Suzan Mazur quotes twise. The senators attorney letter and the list goes on. The truth is the truth no matter who presents it.

The truth is Texas did what Utah had no guts to do, but Hatch knew all to well abuses were going on.

Would you like me to define ORGANIZED CRIME for you? Above abuse the tax and medical fraud is tens of millions and sir, its our money that supports this, HATCH works for us!

[fincenMIB]

If you are mormon, bring the abuses to an end. For 8 years I have heard excuse after excuse. The church is concerned 100% with its image, 0% for the victims.

Actions speak louder than words!

I suspect 8 years from now apologist will still be making up excuses. Change the outcome, save the children, WHAT DON'T YOU GET???

I worked in Utah as a non profit rep of a child abuse prevention agency, my request were official, not private! The FLDS were defended by LDS like Senator Hatch!

[fincenMIB]

62 unmarked child graves photographed by a Los Angeles news crew on 1-23-04, likely to do with Fumarase Disease. There are real children burried beneath!

[mickeynkay]

Are these at the Texas compound or the Utah compound?

[fincenMIB]

Colorado City, likely related to Fumarase disease.

[mickeynkay]

No doubt. So there are 62 child graves in how many years?

[thepayoff07]

First I am not a "Mormon", I am a Latter Day Saint. Second "Mormons" have nothing to do with Jeffs group or simular; though "Mormons" may have relatives there. Third I can read what Sen. hatch's office wrote, and it says it is out of his constituentcy. Would you talk to Ford if Chevy has to be repaired? Your info states

"Name: Jay ...

Interests and Hobbies: Causing Trouble, ..."

That says it all for those who think.

Get it together, make the change yourself stop attacking the wrong people.

[fincenMIB]

"I shed a lot of tears putting myself in (the shoes of) the mother of children," said Holt, who has three kids.

[fincenMIB]

July 27th 2003 From the st. George Spectrum;

Asked about polygamy at a town hall meeting in St. George in April, Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, said he needed evidence of abuse for any polygamy charges. Hatch said he would not "sit here and judge anybody just because they live differently than me."

Hatch had played the organ in a church building in Colorado City, said Jeannine Holt, who attended Saturday's ceremony representing Hatch.

[fincenMIB]

Thompson was the Washington County Utah District Attorney from 1973-1978 and is quoted as knowing about the underage issue! From 1981 he represented Hildale Utah.

[fincenMIB]

Thompson, however, said he is still willing to assist Hildale with municipal works.

"Religion has nothing to do with how they operate," he said. "The people have always been polite, their kids well disciplined."

Other than the practice of marrying child brides, Thompson added, he doesn't oppose the polygamists' "personal beliefs."

_____________

[fincenMIB]

The Washington County Attorney, Ron Thompson acknowledges the child bride issue in the St. George Spectrum newspaper on May 4th of 2003;

Thompson and Urquhart are partners at the law firm Thompson Awerkamp Urquhart, which has represented the city of Hildale for more than 20 years. Urquhart said he had handled municipal works for Hildale, but has dropped it since January to concentrate on his duties at the Legislature. In March, he voted for the child bigamy bill.

[fincenMIB]

The intertwined relationships to the FLDS, included Rulon T. Jeffs citing encounters with Senator Orrin Hatch in the groups doctrine/history books.

Very, very powerful people in Utah preserved the FLDS lifestyle for friends and clients, for $ money $! When Hatch at a town hall meeting lashed out these are good people, evidence of crimes should be brought to him personally, it ignored his earlier letter, seen here, stating the practise was illegal. He was more involved, as we learned!

[fincenMIB]

So, if a victim wanted out, but we have read in Carolyn's book ESCAPE the leaders would hunt women down who left, where would a victim run to?  When I lived in Utah, some ran to ME! So that makes me MAD AS HELL!

I believe unflinching that Michael Leavitt, Orrin Hatch, Ron Thompson, LDS Church Elder Steven Snow, Judge David Nuffer, Judge Eric Ludlow, Jerry Howe Utah Senate Judiciary Committee Atorney and others are guilty of Criminal Conspiracy under the RICO Act of ORGANIZED CRIME! victims..

[fincenMIB]

What you see in Texas, they helped create by running interference for $ money $ and friendship! Blood money while child rape under the law occured! It couldn't have survived without the influential!

The wild card was Warren Jeffs! Under Leroy Johnson or Rulon Jeffs and Uncle Fred the group was a moderate and easier to overlook. Warren changed the rules, but all these attorneys were already joined at the hip!

Now we have victims and I think TEXAS should send UTAH the bill or cost!

[fincenMIB]

Now if you want me to go on, I can explain this further or start cut and pasting the actual documentation.

There are young children in the video, because some of the crimes were against children that young. The GENIE is out of the bottle and I want to see how the senator gets it back in, the spin if you will!

How is Texas 2008 different than Utah 1987 and the next go around in 2000/2001? Warren was calling the shots 8 years ago when Senator Hatch chose to ignore the same abuses.

[DadsBlueAngel]

I wanted to say a little about Carol Jessop and the heredity of the Fawns. I worked in a combination of crisis center, community counseling center, and drug treatment center

for about 2 years. I left the mission home in SLC. I somehow thought the Lord would protect them., then an incident occurred which put me in shock and

I left. I kept them. And went to the Y. An admired, married art teacher fostered them and I drove up to Alpine and slept on the lawn with them 3 or 4 days a week.

[fincenMIB]

If so, so be it! I worked with victims, lots of them, they deserved more in 2000 when the senator was contacted for help! He was the head of the senate judiciary committee and had the power to launch an investigation. He chose to ignore these victims.

The state prosecuited Jeffs for the monster he is, watch his confession videos or read unsealed documents to know this as fact! Then look at Texas and 467 children that could of been addressed 8 years ago! But then I wasn't the first to try!!!

[fincenMIB]

In 1987 Deputy State attorney Jameson with Arizona DPS was investigating Sam Barlow the Polygamous Police Chief of Colorado City trying to decertify him. 87 witnesses lined up to endorse the Police Chief filing affidavits for the court. They read like a who is who in Utah & Arizona from political positions to Law Enforcement, many endorsed the polygamous and abusive ENFORCER of the FLDS on LETTERHEAD! The Sheriff, District Attorney, County Supervisor, state Legislator, then so on! CRIMINALS???

[fincenMIB]

Utah should be stripped of its statehood for running a criminal enterprise that routinely and systematically ignored and permitted abuse to victims. If not HATCH then who??

If a victim of Hildale or Colorado City was to report a crime, it would require the District Attorney to prosecute, but in 1987, William Ekstrom Jr. had filed an Affidavit supporting the corrupt polygamous Police Chief and he was the Mohave County District Attorney. Victims in Colorado City didn't have a prayer!

[fincenMIB]

It didn't end there, victims on the Utah side in 1987 would of required help from Washington County UT DA Paul Graff now with the AG, but darn! He to filed an affidavit supporting the Polygamous FLDS Enforcer. Sam was the guy that escorted the LOST BOYS out of town and did all the dirty work for the FLDS priesthood! The Iron County Sheriff was on that list, Jim Gober of BATF, Phil Jordon of DEA, Bob Rehm of Arizona DPS, the same agency investigating. Page after page of elected officials & LE!

[fincenMIB]

But here is where it gets FUN! Elder Steven Snow of General Authority of the mainstream mormon church today was the FLDS attorney in the 1988 custody case of Johanson vs Fischer. He helped get 6 children awarded to a non blood realive step-dad. Vaughn didn't have the $400,000. blood money, but the FLDS did. 4 little girls from outside the FLDS became polygamous do to Mr. Snow! 3 years later, Snow & Nuffer became city attorney and special council for Colorado City 1991 to 2001. Are you surprised?

[fincenMIB]

Now the junior partner David Nuffer was made a judge by former governor Mike Leavitt in 2001, but Nuffer was the best, FLDS money could buy, he was the Utah Bar Association President in 2000/01 & Elder Snows partner.

Both were former Washington County Deputy District Attorneys, they knew the law all to well!

Nuffers former partner was Ron Thompson and Thompson has been city attorney and special council to hildale Utah since 1981, he defended his position in May of 2003 in the Spectrum News.

[fincenMIB]

Thompson was the Washington County District attorney elected from 1973 to 1978, I kind of think he knows the law! Thompson was 5th District Bar Association President in 2001, so as cases began going before the courts, he kew all the judges, hmmm...

Thompson use to get unannounced appointments with Bruce Babbit in Washington DC, this was the kind of influence bought and paid for by the FLDS!

Then as Southern Utah began to see development, retirees and $ money $, a new group was formed!

[fincenMIB]

It was called SUPAC, a economic alliance committee, which began as 3 members! Mike Leavitt, who was from Cedar City any way! Senator Orrin Hatch (you were wondering why the detour) and Ron Thompson. SUPAC had a economic influence on everything and the committee had only three on it.

[fincenMIB]

When in 2003 Mike Leavitt promoted the washington County DA Eric Ludlow for judgeship, like that of Dave Nuffer, Troy Bowles questioned the DA as to why in 13,000 cases he had never addressed one of a polygabuse victim complaint. He said no one had ever brought one to him. A LIE! I had twise! His office signed for both!

Jerry Howe from the Utah Senate Judiciary Committee assisted in an inverstigation of purgery on the part of the District attorney, but rubber stamped his nomination any way!

[fincenMIB]

I have about 100 emails that went to Jerry Howe if investigators or the press want to get copies!

Mike Leavitt was interesting as he rewarded attorneys with judgeships, attorneys who were either elected DA's or Deputy DA's, they ALL knew the laws and knew of the underage unions of the FLDS!

Mike's father Dixie had the Leavitt Insurance group in Cedar City and the FLDS were clients.

[fincenMIB]

Fred Jessop was a close and personal friend of the family. Fred and Dixie many a time had lunch together at the Sugarloaf cafe in Cedar after transacting business.

The keynote speaker in 1986/87 the first year of the public school in Colorado City, was none other than Dixie Leavitt. Rumor has it young Michael might of been babysat by Fern Jessop, Freds sister in law.

[DadsBlueAngel]

Back to clas and polygamy there were two kinds of polygamists in the early Church. There were rich men,

both before and after the Gold Rush whic after thE 2 year

Utah, Business picked up.

Brigham Young believed that in his time a man had no right to his money. By taking on more families and giviing bodies to as many Children of God as possible educating

all of them--girls, young women and younger men,

he could hold the Great Basin and Intermountain West

and create an Educated People.

[fincenMIB]

Abuses were reported to the Senator in Nov. of 2000, Suzan Mazur a journalist interviewed his staff twise also in 2000. In his letter he stated it was illegal and complex with out a solution for the child victims. In 2002 Utah celebrated the Olympics, but was to busy to sort out the Fundamentalist victims.

Then in 2003 at a Town Hall meeting the Senator order evidence of crimes turned over to him, he said it was illegal 3 years earlier! Then in June of 2003 we got a letter from his attorney!

[fincenMIB]

Would you like me to post the senators lawyer statement in this blog? I can...

What has occured in Texas, occured in Utah for decades first. Should Texas send Utah and Arizona the bill for cost? I wonder?

Then in 2003 Jannine Holt the Senators field deputy was quoted as remembering the Senator playing the organ at the FLDS meeting hall in polygamous Colorado City??? Christopher Rosch, the Senators Communications Director was the source used in the Mazur News Article.

You want proof?

[DadsBlueAngel]

My comment was not about proof, but ethics in journalism.. I was a year away from an MSW completing an inservice program in Provo when I married. I had 9000 plus hours of work experience some in California and some in Provo where 60 percent of The Community and 98 percent

of our clients were Mormon.

I am from a blue collar family and my brother married a woman whose family were a California White Supremisist , incestuous and pedophiliac Motorcycle gang. ''Bad.''

[DadsBlueAngel]

I don't think you understand the powerful influence that a

man like Jeoffs--or any powerful religious leader can have

both for good and evil. I don't know if you know the terror

that multi-generational Mormons [I mean both LDS, FLDS, and smaller groups which BYU anthropologists have been studying for years. The September Dawn/Mountain Meadows literary disaster was exhausting and unfortunate.

Many never came down from the small communities to where they stayed. The FLDS stayed dirt poor.

[DadsBlueAngel]

Below I was teling a story which I may have lost. It was about Children's writing Professor at the Y.

She was six when she saw the police cars at her best friends house. her friend ran home and into the bedroom. Her Father had just shot her mother and then put a shotgun in his head and blown it off. She said ''This is Utah. She was 70ish and taught a summer class..

I have rever been able to write this kind of story--if you write, This kind of theraputic writing needs to be done.

[fincenMIB]

The TRUTH if Utah did what Texas has done!

"And do what? Arrest thousands of polygamists in Utah? We wouldn't have 400 kids, we'd have thousands in our foster care and thousands of their parents in the prison system. It's not practical to do that," Shurtleff said. "We were right to focus on abused children."

[DadsBlueAngel]

As the above poster points out, the scope of this must be considered. In ''I have Six wives,'' which I checked out of the library in high school Samuel Taylor estimated that there were at that time about, 100,000 plural families from Mormon Stock.

You have to look at social class. There were two in the

Early Church. Joseph Smith was very close to the Indians

and the Church remained so. All indian groups practiced polygamy before the Cultural Genocide of the ''Christan\

Church.

[fincenMIB]

Kaziah May hancock was married at age 9, Colleen & Beth Kunz at ages 10 & 11. Ezmarelda B at age 12, who will regulate these secretive groups if not the government. We address human rights around the world, why not our backyard?

[DadsBlueAngel]

They look like flower girls to me. And then we move on to

the Republicans--the opportunitists are using this as a cheap shot. I'm a Democrat, and it makes me sick. The age of consent in much of the Southwest is 16-always has been.