29 Emilio De Cavalieri: Lamentations: Miserere mei Deus: part1

[PiroozAzDirooz]

These are beautiful and very soothing; thank you for posting them!

[lejeunotousier]

Catholic music, inspired by God, composed for Him...

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Well, I am not Catholic, but I do love this Music -- it is certainly inspired..

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

I'm glad to read that, it's so rare!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Which part did you like - that I am not a Catholic or that I love this music? :-):-)

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig Both! I liked your post because you said "i'm not catholic, but i love this music"...

I'm french so it's difficult for me to express my point of vue in english, but i'm pleased that people like you, who doesn't believe in God, can appreciate a such music!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Ah - I do believe in God - I am just not Catholic :-)

But thank you very much for your comments.

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Oh! So what ? I'd say... protestant ?^^

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

No - actually Jewish...

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

I see... I was in a big mistake!!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Not such a big mistake.

We are all people...

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

You're right!

Do you like opéras ? I'm fond of Titon et l'Aurore by Mondonville!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

I uploaded Rameau's Zoroastre to my channel. I never heard Titon et L'Aurore but I do like Mondonville's Grand Motets.

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Zoroastre's choruses are very pleasants! But I think I prefer Dardanus, from Rameau too, or Hippolyte et Aricie.

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

For some reason, I like only minor-scale music...

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

That's funny! I also major-scale music, but i think i prefer the minor-scale choruses and their sorrow... It take your soul in meditation. But i do an exception for Monteverdi's vespers, they are for me the "nec plus ultra"!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

I love the 1610 Vespers in Savall's version -- but note that the vespers are mostly in minor scale [with the exception of the opening Deus in Adjuvantum and the solo motets from the Canticles of Solomon in the middle]

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Hue ? Nisi Dominus ? Laudate pueri Dominum ? Lauda Jerusalem ? And a (little ok!^^) part of this wonderful Magnificat!

Monteverdi was a genius, he knew so well how to enrich gregorian chant, which stay in all plasms! I think Jordi Savall is the one who best understood Monteverdi's and Charpentier's musics. If I was worship, he would be my god! (i'm too exclusive)

P.S: Deus in adjutorium meum intende (i'll sing it on sunday, in his gregorian version))

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier All of the Psalms you have mentionned are mostly in the minor scale. It is true that they retain the psalmodic cantus-firmus but the harmonisation is

minor-scale/aeolian.

They all start out with a few major-scale chords, but very quickly change to minor-scale. They all end with a picardian-third. Apparently, the Church then considered the minor scale as demonic, so one had to start and end in the major-scale.

PS I too serve sometimes as a cantor in my Synagogue

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Music is a richess of our religions...

Are you sure for the Church's point of view about minor scale ?

Because all the music with sadness like Jeremy's lamentations are composed in this style... For me, perhaps the best musics were composed on these words... I specially think to Gilles's music, Hervé Niquet's version of course:)

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

That *used* to be the Church's point of view. It changed over time. Concerning Lamentations - are you familiar with Viadana?

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

I sing his exultate justi, but I don't know his Lamentationes...

I like (for Lamentations) Gilles, before Martini (whereas I love his "responses" (?) for three equal voices), Victoria, Charpentier and Couperin!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

I love Delalande's Lecons de Tenebræ performed by the Poeme Harmonique. I uploaded the Miserere to my channel

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Yes, I heard it yesterday, and loved it! Vincent Dumestre is a great conductor, and Claire Lefilliâtre has a voice.... near the perfection!

 But Miserere is a psalm from King David, not a Leçon de Ténèbres from prophet Jeremy ? Or am I mistaking again ?^^

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

It is indeed a Psalm - but it is part of the Tenebrae service

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Ok! I'm not fond of countertenors (even if I like Gérard Lesne in Pergolèse's Stabat Mater, stolen to Alessandro Scarlatti...!) in solo, I get bored quite fastly...

But I love Vivaldi's Nisi Dominus (Cum Dederit!) by Andreas Scholl (and not Jaroussky who's too "mechanical" to my mind), it is... Divine.

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Actually - I do not like haute-contres neither. But Lesne is an exception.

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

You mean who ? Andreas Scholl ?^^

Ok, Lesne isn't too boring!

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

What about Jean Gilles ? I want his Requiem mass for my funerals! And I'd love to sing his Lamentations (By the way, Fouchécourt is the best "french ténor" in the world!), his Motet to St Jean-Baptiste and his "Beatus quem Eligisti"...

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

As I have said - I do not like the major-scale. I do not know why....

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Ok, but you must like his lamentations (minor-scale for most of them)!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Never heard them - but I would try to find a recording and listen, following your recommendation...

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Like I'm hearing Zelenka!

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

For the lamentations by Jean Gilles, take care to have the correct version, the single! That of Hervé Niquet (le concert spirituel), with Jean-Paul Fouchécourt (haute contre)!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Are you familiar with Charpentier's Miserere des Jesuites ?

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

No I'm not! But I love Charpentier (my favourite composer after Monteverdi), his "Judicium Extremum", his magnificat(s), and we sing every year his Christmas Mass!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Besides - there is a very nice bass section in Zelenka's Lamentations

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Your are bass ?

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Baritone

[lejeunotousier]

@radaphhesig

Tenor!

[radaphhesig]

@lejeunotousier

Ah - and can one forget Zelenka's Lamentations performed by Gerard Lesne and the Seminario Musicale

[1PostPoMoMaN1]

I thought it's impossible for such music to exist.

[radaphhesig]

You mean that in a good way?

[1PostPoMoMaN1]

@radaphhesig

Well, yeah!