Matt Chat 91: The Fall of Interplay with Brian Fargo

[GogorisChannel]

Great video!

[lendial]

ive played iwd2 at least 4 times over - i havent even touched dragon age 2 or oblivion even though ive ha them installed for like a year

[Jeet27]

I agree with Brian, but I would extend golden age period a little more, from '98 to '99 to '00 and '01, those 4 years were wonderful for RPG's. BG1, BG2, and IWD1 my favorites.

[BFLovesMoney]

I wish people would stop praising him and tag him as a 'game designer'. Designer he is not, he is just a business man that knows how to talk. The only game that he can make with his 'sidekick' are mobile games. Even that, they just bought ideas off people, never came up with anything original. (ie Linerider, Fantastic contraption)

[BFLovesMoney]

What everyone fails to realize is Fargo is unfit to run a game company. He's always been a rich kid with too much money to play game designer.

Interplay failed because of his greed, he let Titus buy him out. Of course he wasn't going to stand aside and watch Interplay fail, he didn't want to say it was him that caused it.

It is not his decisions that made his game successful, he was never involved in the game making. He just sat back and collected the money.

[BFLovesMoney]

Oh and all the companies that are successful now, they don't want to do business with him because they've all been burned by him. Do you think Bioware, Obsidian, Blizzard would be successful if they had continue their relationship with Fargo? I think not. Everyone that's work for him and done business with him knows how uninvolved and unimaginative his is.

Bards Tale for PS2 was decent, why no sequel? Hunted 2, yea right! Publishers knows his BS after working with him.

[MrMatt29999]

nice mission edition of final frontier

[droneforever]

Brian Fargo is my all-time favorite game designer, hands down. Wasteland was a masterpiece, and while I own a PS3 and game on it regularly, I do miss the Magic Candle and Wizardry days. That said, LA Noire gives me hope that at least maybe the Adventure Game genre will come back.

[CaponeAl36]

@droneforever -- Wasteland was great, and Brian Fargo can't be blamed for Fountain of Dreams.

[vavamanley]

WOW!!! Hah, Brian was my step dad for years til like last year. And i TOTALLY like remember how he talks and stuff haha. ughh i cant frickin gett overr thiss!!! hahah lol...oh old s dad.

[mormengil]

the background bookcase with all those titles made me almost shed tears over what we have lost and probably never find again..

[CaponeAl36]

@mormengil -- Glad I wasn't the only one.

[Plissken07]

Matt, thanks so much for setting up and sharing these interviews!

I liked Icewind Dale. My favorite moments were slaying Yuan-ti's and facing Yuxonomei and then the boss battle against Belhifet.

However, my favorite Infinity Engine game is Baldur's Gate 1. My hands shook and my heart pounded as my party faced Sarevok in the final battle. Monster Summoning FTW!

[matternicuss]

omg I remember wild 9! played it as a kid, remember loving it.

[PsYychH0]

Lol, wasn't the consoles that killed Interplay, it was desperately trying to get into consoles with shitty products and horrible management. Should they have had stuck with what they knew, they must have had a a chance at least.

Imagine BG 3, Planescape Torment 2, van Buren... all released in time.

Look at what Beth did with FO while Interplay thought it was a bust. Beth didn't make a better FO, they made an awful FO, but at the same time a good game and sold it like it was the ultimate game.

[bobfrapples21]

Sorry about Van Buren Fargo.... for what its worth, we all miss Interplay.... even Black Isle for that matter....

[viperswhip]

I really liked Icewindale as well, but I still fall back to the BG Trilogy (really, it's better if you run the the mod that merges them), and Torment. Neverwinter Nights really picked up with Hordes of the Underdark and NWN2 with Mask. Great storytelling pushed the games to greatness in my opinion. Icewindale was a bit more hack and slash and I think games like those mentioned above or Temple of Elemental Evil leave it in the dust.

[Spit2099]

Where's the intro music from, because i'm fairly sure it's from a game.

[Bajamamut]

Yay! Dungeons & Desktops FTW! ^_^ It's been a while since I watched one of your videos, unfortunately, but I'm resuming where I left :P

I agree with Brian Fargo. There's like a mothership product for all nowadays gaming industries, and after they make money with that they study the risks of an original game and decide to go on with it or not.

On the other side, there's a great renaissance of 'Indie' games, plus 'Virtual Console' platforms that give support to them - unimaginable back then.

[Muffincakeswithsugar]

Interplay of the 90's = Best publisher ever...

if only we could have something like that publisher again...

[PaladinV0ci]

INTERPLAYS BIG THING SHOUDA BEEN FALLOUT!!!!

[PaladinV0ci]

Brian i think you should talk to Elder Maxon and get the Brotherhood to assassinate Bethesda. IN COURT!!!! get a scribe as yourr lawyer

[Retrosofer]

Great 3 part interview dude, wouldn't mind playing some of those old skool rpg games.

[MrDebauch]

great interview, I am a fan of the first bard's tale and it still is probably my favourite rpg to date simply because of the party based system and the 2nd edition dnd structure. Though I think maybe the bard's tale name should not have been used on the ps2/xbox version... unless it would have actually been a bard's tale game. and battle chess was classic. probably the best chess video game ever made.

[BackForwardPunch]

Thanks to Brian, great interview, love these segments!

[freakyfatdog]

The big mistake was that they didnt enter the console market with the stick with what you know mindset. They had BG running on the PS 1. Even if they had a sided deal with Bioware they should have ported it to the PS 2/Xbox just to develop a following. I'm with him on IWD.

[AxeBlack84]

......... I'm still shocked this channel isn't up where it needs to be. Thanks for the awesome interviews man. How many people are giving you none biased none BS interviews, discussions, and reviews?

Great vid!

[mapiarz]

Great interview but it lacks dramatic and sad music when you show pictures of PS2 and XBOX!

[360deeman]

Hey Matt! Thanks for getting Brian on your show, I asked if you had any plans for a interview with him a couple shows ago and you said you couldn't get ahold of him. Also you are featured on NoMutantAllowed

[cowrevenge]

I'm gonna assume The Sims was an intended "mistake", but I fail to see the joke. Something to do with rich people and pools?

[blacklily8]

@cowrevenge No, it was just that I misheard him. I thought he said The Sims instead of Descent. Trust me, not the only screw up you'll see from me.

[Flinklehurst]

It's funny how he talks around the assertion in the first question and then addresses it halfway through the interview by saying he feels player attention spans are shorter. Whether he would agree that this trend is due to an audience drawn in to the hobby by more accessible platforms, however, remains a mystery.

[marcusmalone]

...And let's not forget that many of the early classics (pacman, space invaders et al) have far more in common with games like CoD than with the complex crpgs.

[marcusmalone]

Fargo makes a great point about franchises like Call of Duty. I play a lot of CoD AND my favourite game of all time (hands down) is Baldur's Gate 2. The latter is an immersive experience and the former, a sort of violent online snooker game. It's almost not worth comparing the two genres in terms of market share. The market for compelling rpgs isn't shrinking, it's just that the market for games like CoD is growing (cont'd in next comment!)...

[MrAcrin1]

I really enjoyed these interviews with Brian Fargo. I think they're some of the best you've done. I'd forgotten just how many great games came from Interplay over the years.

Regarding your pro tip - I'm reading through Dungeons & Desktops at the moment. Just reached the Golden Age - Part 1. I can recommend it to viewers here who are interested in CRPGs. I'll post a review on Amazon when I've finished the book.

[Mordaedil]

Great interview(s) with Brian Fargo. I see what his point is, it was a long time since I last saw a co-op game, and recently Magicka was released which really does co-op really well. I look forward to Hunted now.

[revpeyton79]

nice pro-tip. ;)

[madameneruda]

good stuff

[Snestastic]

Brilliant interview Matt, i really like the side by side of you and your interviee :)

[1988wasteland]

really good interview,didnt think it would take 5 yrs back then to make a game like wasteland but back in that time it was more about the story than the graphics.These days the game takes 5 yrs but is only 1/10 of the time to finish it.

[Sinekyre14]

This guy is brilliant, and this interview is so good!

Guys, let's spread these vids around!

[TiagoMorbusSa]

Good interview! Also, here's a tip for anyone who wants to start a career as a game designer/producer: design/produce your own indie game. No one, absolutely no one is going to take you in directly as a designer/producer with no experience.

[blacklily8]

@TiagoMorbusSa That sounds like great advice. It's much easier to talk and think about a game than to execute one--even a simple one!

[blacklily8]

@blesshiscottonsocks Haven't heard of it, but would like to hear more of the story.

[TehBarnz]

I miss Shiny Entertainment, David Perry's work. I always thought Wild 9 was a nice, but frustrating game. Hey Matt, can you interview Frédérick Raynal? He's the creator of the original Alone in the Dark, and Little Big Adventure series. Tom Hall, David Perry, Levelord (Richard Gray) would be nice as well.

[blacklily8]

@TehBarnz I've tried to contact him several times but have never succeeded.

[Massupossu]

I really love these! Please Matt, keep `em coming and all the best to you.

[vidyagaemer350]

So I liked the talk about the 90s PC gaming, and the interview with Brian was interesting, but then I saw that you also enjoy fine craft brew, and that is when I decided to watch more of your shows. Perhaps you should mix beer tasting with game testing some how.

[blacklily8]

@vidyagaemer350 Not a bad idea! You know you're drunk when you try to drink ale in WOW and the screen suddenly turns clear.

[redmar79]

I love Wing Commander. I have them all except for Armada. I can't wait for your bit on Wing Commander.

[Joeyboots80]

Another great interview with another pc gaming luminary. I bow before your contacting skills Mr. Barton! Seriously Matt, I don't know of any other independent journalist on youtube getting heavy hitters on their shows at the amount and frequency that you do. Keep up the good work, I look forward to the next one.

[blacklily8]

@Joeyboots80 Thanks. It's a big challenge, but always worth it when you get to sit down with a hero like Fargo.

[Joeyboots80]

@blacklily8 Of that, I have no doubt my good sir. Trust me when I say that I am living vicariously through you lol.

[retromanpresents]

Wonder who the next legend will be on the show? Also, can you review the iron maiden game Ed Hunter?

[Joeyboots80]

@retromanpresents I second this notion. Give this guy thumbs up!

[blacklily8]

@retromanpresents Ed Hunter? That sounds interesting. I did play the one that came on the disc I have on the shelf there--pretty good shmup.

[RaulBillieJean]

thanks for the interview

[KreatorRage]

Yay, I love waking up and seeing your videos in my sub box, what a good way to start the day =)

[TheLoadingScreenz]

Awesome interview!

[joeivo911]

you are my favorite show on youtube!

[Roderik46]

i'm dissapointed there was no question about the followup or remake or wathever of Wasteland that brian fargo is supposed to be making. he has the rights to the title and announced he wants to make it

[blacklily8]

@Roderik46 Unfortunately Brian got called away before I had run through all my questions.

[halcyonsskyler]

Might want to adjust your mic. Your breathing is pretty distracting when Brian is talking.

[blacklily8]

@halcyonsskyler Yes, nobody is more irritated about it than I am. As indicated in the show notes, the mic I was using has a mute button that went out on me. I couldn't tell if it was on or off. I'll definitely fix that in any future interviews.

[HardWarUK]

(Continued from below)

And Skyrim is rumoured to be $40 million. Mass Effect 1 was $25 million, Mass Effect 3 is going to be $40 million too. These companies have nowhere to go. Conversely, European developers are bringing games like The Witcher to market for under $14 million, allowing them to make a good profit with just a PC title. Witcher 2 will be about $20 million, with a new engine that will supply 3 titles. Will gamers let Bethesda release a $15 million cRPG? Or Bioware? I think not.

[blacklily8]

@HardWarUK I think most gamers will buy a great game regardless of the budget. The bigger budgets come with bigger marketing and hype, but then a game like Minecraft comes out of nowhere.

[HardWarUK]

@blacklily8 It's not about whether gamers will buy a game regardless of budget, it how many of them will have to buy it to make a profit for the publisher. You obviously have to sell more to break even if your costs are going up, and this is why more AAA have a little RPG, shooter, adventure, platforming, etc, so everybody into every genre gets it. But they don't. I prefer RPG's so I won't buy Dragon Age 2 and didn't buy Alpha Protocol. Something has to give for the big guys as sales decline.

[regemo]

@HardWarUK Star Wars The Old Republic rumored to be over $200 million. Makes Mass Effect 3's budget look like a pinto bean.

[HardWarUK]

@regemo Well there you go. $200 million means it needs 1 million subscribers at $10 a month from day one for almost 5 years, of 10 million subscribers for 3 years to break even! (I have included ongoing costs to fix bugs, upgrade, customer service, etc.) It'll be interesting to see if they can do that. 10 great KOTOR single player games on all formats over a 6-8 year period might have made more money! :)

[Borin81]

i would play a game that had Daggerfall graphics if Bethesda added good plots, no lore rape and gameplay to it.

heck just churn out Might and Magics using the same engine as MM4-5 and i'll buy them all twice, even the GOTY version.

[Sorrow612]

@HardWarUK

The Witcher was made for under $14 million because Polish wages are 3 times lower than US wages, so they can afford the same amount of developer's work with that budget as Americans with a $42 million budget.

[HardWarUK]

@Sorrow612 Trust me, if you are a shit hot programmer, anywhere in the world, you don't earn 3 times less! CD Projekt Red staff are more willing to have shares and have small wages and then have profit sharing. European developers operate like companies did in the 90's - and that's no bad thing! It doesn't change that between Bioshock 1 & 3, Mass Effect 1 & 3 and Morrowind & Skyrim, development costs have tripled. This cannot go on. Skyrim will have to sell 4 million units just to break even!

[Sorrow612]

@HardWarUK

After what I've read about the gaming industry, I'd be surprised if game programmers would earn as much as programmers of other software.

Also, programmers aren't the only people who work on games.

[HardWarUK]

@Sorrow612 That's true. But it's not the wages that makes a Witcher 2 a $15 million project and a Skyrim a $35 million project! Skyrim has to have $35 million spent on it because they have painted themselves into a corner! Would you accept Skyrim looking like The Witcher, how good it was as an RPG? I think not!

[HardWarUK]

From this interview, I have got the message that Brian Fargo, along with most industry leaders don't really know what's going on anymore. Their finger is not on the pulse. What he said about Forge, for example, made little sense. And when he implied indie companies are spending $5 million on a game, I was a little shocked. I believe the big publishers are on a treadmill and they don't know how to get off. Morrowind cost $10 million, Oblivion $30 million.

(Continued)

[agentm83]

Great video! Thank you! I know you've talked about point-and-click adventure games before. I was wondering if you could get a hold of the guys behind LucasArts at their peak (through the 90s), and maybe do an interview with one of them? I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one interested in such an interview.

[favianutube]

great interview

[herbg3]

Brian Fargo, bringin' the slime.

[Disthron]

CRPG's? Dose he mean Console RPGs?

Anyway, grate interview.

[TheSonsofAtreus]

@Disthron computer rpgs



[agentm83]

@Disthron Computer RPGs probably.

[HardWarUK]

@agentm83 cRPG stands for Computer Roleplaying Games. It was to separate them from RPG's which were what board game style roleplaying was called. Given the dominance of the console market I wouldn't be surprised if cRPG became thought of as Console RPG's though. To the victor, the spoils. We already have cRPG's like The Witcher 2, Two Worlds II and Risen 2 called "Action-RPG's". Whenever I see that I always ask the poster to name one plain ol' RPG - they never do! It's just a sign of the times.

[blacklily8]

@HardWarUK Man, I need to do a show just about the difference between real-time, RTwP, and turn-based, showing people why the last option is the best. :)

[deshadow52]

Great conclusion to the interview Matt. Now thanks to Fargo saying how amazing it is, I have to check Icewind Dale I & 2 now, maybe after Baldur's Gate I & II.

Can't wait to see what you will have next week, as always keep up the good work.

[Jockie25]

It sounded like he said Descent, not The Sims.

[blacklily8]

@Jockie25 OMG, you're right. LOL! Good call.

[FixiousMaximus]

@Jockie25 He definitely said Descent.

[Fn0rdPerfect]

I'm pretty sure he meant Descent, as it fits more into the context of games being made in the mid-90s. The Sims was 2001

[phreakindee]

@Jockie25 Yes, he was definitely talking about Descent, not The Sims... The Sims was a pretty huge project around the turn of the century. Descent was made in the mid-nineties by a couple dudes for not a ton of cash... ah well, solid video of course, but pretty funny mixup!

[Itto100]

 R.I.P, Interplay. You were one of the greatest video game publishers and developers of all time.

[Holammer]

While Brian is a certified cool dude; I'm sadly quite sceptical about Hunted. It looks too much like Gears of War meets Conan with ridiculous costume/weapon designs.

I want turn-based, roll a party of 4-6 adventures and explore stuff, y'hear that indy developers? you're my only hope!

[blacklily8]

@Holammer There are indie devs putting them out, but I've yet to see one that really had that commercial slickness. Probably some of the best I've seen were built with the NWN dungeon creator--definitely some talented people in that community. Of course, you're stuck with one character and a party of NPCs with that.

Now that I'm thinking about it, did anyone ever do an Icewind Dale 2 level editor? I'm pretty sure there was one for the gold box games, but not sure how slick it was.

[matternicuss]

@blacklily8 I was kinda surprised with the amount of praise he gave Icewind Dale. Sure, I've always thought it was an excellent game (probably the best dungeon crawler ive ever played, with peerless atmosphere and music), its just the usual suspects are games like BG/BG2, planescape Torment, Fallout 1/2 etc, due to character interaction and plot. Interesting choice in any case.

by the way, have you played any of the european RPG's? like the Witcher and Gothic series? If not, I recommend them

[gotrek44]

Time frame of the pinnacle of PC gameing. Or CRPG gameing. I actually have been thinking that for almost a month now. And suprised to hear about it now. My opinion would have to be late 90s through 04. In terms of graphics, creative strategies, and story staples. Examples being the epic journey of Diablo.96. The story telling of Half-Life 98-99. The fantasy emersion and brain power of Baulders Gate and Ice Wind Dale 1,2. Then Ragdoll Physics added around that time frame. So maybe 95-05.

[FalseNomen]

Really great interview. One of my favorites so far I think.

[cuttock]

Great video series. I love Interplay, Star Trek 23th is one of the all time RPG greats.

First PC game I ever played.

Oh, and, uh, Matt, will you review any Twilight games soon?? ;)

[MeAreTrees]

quite informative, great interview !

[topdog72]

World of Goo, lol...I loved how you said that, Matt.

Keep up the great work.

[DarkAvatar1313]

I see you have Wing Commander and Privateer shown on your shelf, are you going to do a video on either?

[blacklily8]

@DarkAvatar1313 Definitely in the pipeline. I missed them when I was a kid, so have to catch up.

[Joeyboots80]

@DarkAvatar1313 Hell Yeah! Privateer was metal.

[StephmoS]

Thanks Matt and Brian. Was an excellent interview.

[Rad1ka1]

Great interview

[Rad1ka1]

Wooh, im viewer number 0!

[JimmyBackbeat]

@Rad1ka1 Something to tell your grandchildren. Congratulations!

I really like this channel. I just found it after the first Brian Fargo part.

[blacklily8]

@Rad1ka1 Is it possible to be viewer 0?