Does Religion Overlap With Science? | Muharram 2011

[masticina]

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And the part about faith, mmm science and faith don' t mix. The scientific method REQUIRES that you are WILLING TO CHANGE YOUR POSITION if the EVIDENCE SHOWS YOU ARE WRONG!

A religious position on the other hand FORCES you to keep on lying because.. it is written. See the issue! Science and faith do not mix..

[masticina]

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So claiming that just because one thing in the qu' ran, a bible, any socalled holy writings proof that the whole has any scientific backing is insane. Nor can you even claim that a small part has scientific backing..

What is written in these books is not done through the scientific method. Hence it has no scientific value! At most it is a eye witness account and those are low on the standing of evidence. Humans are bad witnesses!

[masticina]

i find this holy books have scientific information always very troubled. Why? It takes away from the meaning of religion and faith. Not only that it also opens up the door to ridicule!

Because yes people will say that the shotgun method. I have a shotgun shell with 50 small balls. if i shoot it on a rabbit sure a few will hit but most will not.

This doesn' t makes me a good shot.. this just means that the bullit hits..SOMETIMES.



[saramelad]

@masticina

hmmm do u think person without control can be gd human ??

[masticina]

@saramelad

Good and Bad are in the person.. what rules govern them is secundairy. What causes a human to act a certain way? Mostly the environment, remember that in pretty much all wars both or all sides said "We are the only good and godly divine chosen one.. ATTACK" ..and yet there always only w'e're losers. Oh sure you might have won terrain or killed of a powerful political person. Yet you still lost.. people died..

[masticina]

@saramelad

We all have controls, we all have limits, even in very open societies there are enough people who simply cannot get themself to do certain things. And I don't talk about socalled "bad" acts.. no just certain acts they never would. Maybe they never would kill an animal.

Good and bad is within us, religion and politics..have trained us to become cows..to stampede over the others herd green grass.

Be good because you ARE good..not because someone forces you to!

[saramelad]

@masticina yea we have controls caz the human soul has 3 types self is inclined towards evil accusing soul self-reassuring the first one makes some people that humans act selfishly@don't care about the other person therefore, problems in the world caz the officials made​a world preoccupied with issues of religion and silly things such as sex illegally 2 become pregnant women and then put the child and throw it in the house of orphans or kill him in a doctor's office without n

[masticina]

@saramelad

Interesting belief...

That is all, I am almost sure that if I ask another Muslim about the "types of selves" I get another answer. Which makes that the answer either is defined later or that different groups took the same basis and worked out different ideas. Who is wrong and who is right?

In the end what keeps Islam together is belief. like any other religion. I respect you but I am not a believer!

[masticina]

@saramelad

>> Societies have come and gone and what have we learned in that time well.. some very basic survival rules that makes sure a group has a higher chance to survive. Those rules do not have religion as basis.. at times even religion is counter those rules.

Yes there is allot rotten in this world.. we made it that way. For the same this means we can make it a better world. Religion at times I fear has been in the way of this. Let me explain!

[masticina]

@saramelad

>> Religion sets in stone where nature and the way time flows is dynamic. We go from times of peace to times of war, times where even though the golden rule says "thou shalt not kill" [a rule much older then any current religion] we are forced at times to kill.

Like a tree sometimes you cant go a certain way so you grow another way. Bad things happen in society but also good, that is what it is to be HUMAN

Religion can do good and evil like anything else. Peace :)

[saramelad]

@masticina

i agree with u ...so i can say religion what u must 2 do not what u do

so we responsible 4 our actions

and we can distinguish between right and wrong .. and the truth and falsehood ..

u believe there is God ?

[masticina]

@saramelad

I am spiritual yes.. but I find the books written by humans to limiting, to bound to the time they are written. For the divine is in everything.. and like nature is always adapting. A child that smiles one of the highest rewards of the gifts of life. A community in peace working together.

Yes.. not yet not here.. we are after all human. And being human makes that we can do many odd things. This is not perfect nor can we make it perfect. We at least can try!

[masticina]

@saramelad

In what I picked up from the many insight, mere as a subjective part of it all. The written in stone.. is bound to crumble. The mighty tree breaks through the walls of stone we build.

I see spirituality like a diamond, there is only one tip but many facets. And we all have different facets in us!

[wais910]

MashaAllah brothers, please PLEASE upload the evolution video from this brother!

[Gnomefro]

The reason is that when you do make claims about scientific revelations in ancient holy books you make yourself wide open to being ridiculed due to the contrived interpretations needed. You look silly because no muslim ever thought about reading it that way until after infidel science discovered the phenomenon, and undermine the idea that you can extract knowledge from the Qur'an, because earlier muslims, clearly failed at that and you are in a much worse position due to time passing.

[Gnomefro]

That's just one out of a vast body of claims, both about the nature of reality and how Allah interacts with it, that are testable and whose failure to be vindicated point to Mohammed being just another ignorant cult leader. Muslims who want to stay muslims probably make a good choice sticking their fingers in their ears and going "Allahu Akbar! Allahu Akbar!" whenever they encounter modern understanding of reality. That's superior from going the Christian creationist route as many muslims do.

[Gnomefro]

It takes all manner of revisionist interpretation to avoid this. While that's ok in Christianity, it is anathema in Islam, because we already know what Mohammed believed the Qur'an said, and revisionist interpretations essentially call him out as a liar, undermining the entire religion.

Also, the idea that science and religion are separate fields without overlap is just silly. You realize that the Qur'an makes concrete claims about praying causing rain right? That is a scientific claim.

[Gnomefro]

This is problematic, because there is a slew of embarrassing claims about reality from that man. Everywhere from the Qur'an itself, to the hadith. Exactly what you'd expect if Islam was false. It's entirely true that there could not be contradictions between Islam and reality if Islam was true. However, that's a pretty big "if", and that's the reason why muslims, like all creationists, tend to shy away from science and instead repeat to themselves that their iron age books are True.

[Gnomefro]

The actual state of affairs is that Islam demands submission. That point is far more important than anything else, such as truth. In fact, the Qur'an simply mocks everyone who doesn't see the "obvious" fact that there is a creator, and that this creator is Allah. In essence this means that muslims blindly trust Mohammed for any and all claims about their invisible friend.

[Gnomefro]

While it's easy to agree with statements such as truth being important, it's patently absurd to insinuate that there is evidence for any important claim in Islam, or that Islam is the source of the scientific method. The mere fact that is observed in this video, that young muslims don't care about truth and, more than any other superstitious group, believe they possess Truth for no reason.

[yaQaemAleMohamed]

mashAllah . Very intresting