@letusreason1234 cont..... Ezekiel 36...26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. This is WHY we obey.... Not why we are saved. But of course this is only for the anointed right?
Obviously the Mosaic law with it's temple works do not save... The Temple, it's alter, and all it's functions were destroyed long ago, when Israel voided the Old Covenant by have Jesus killed...
The Commands of God, however, are not voided. The Bible is clear that if you are not following these commands you are not on the road to salvation...
Faith without works is dead...
Can you break Gods laws willfully and be saved? Is that what you teach?
@letusreason1234 """"Obviously the Mosaic law with it's temple works do not save."""" So when Paul wrote Romans 4:5 he had he Mosaic law and the temple in mind when he was talking about works?
(Romans 4:13-14) For it was not through law that Abraham or his seed had the promise that he should be heir of a world, but it was through the righteousness by faith. For if those who adhere to law are heirs, faith has been made useless and the promise has been abolished.
Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
@letusreason1234 ""Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?"""""
So what saved him? And what saved David (who's cited as well as an example) who was under the Mosaic law? Its the same thing :') FAITH....
@21crosscheck21 make sure to include Romans 4:13-14 and my above response in that video...
And explain why Paul specifically says that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how then is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
(Romans 4:13-14) For it was not through law that Abraham or his seed had the promise that he should be heir of a world, but it was through the righteousness by faith. For if those who adhere to law are heirs, faith has been made useless and the promise has been abolished.
Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
@letusreason1234 """earlier parables that begin with "The Kingdom is like...." have NO connection in your opinion because they don't ''ALL'' start that way?""""
Jesus does not start the story of the separation of the sheep and the goats out with "the kingdom is like..." So I have no idea what that even has to do with what were talking about. If you want to be taken seriously stop with the straw men.
I think the FACT that Jesus began most of his parables with "The Kingdom of God is like...." would kind of connect them as opposed to his non-parables wouldn't you"?
@letusreason1234 ""I think the FACT that Jesus began most of his parables with "The Kingdom of God is like...."""" The story starts out "31 “When the Son of man arrives in his glory," (NWT) so I have no idea why you would bring that up or what relevance it has to the discussion.... But I do know why you won't answer the question I have asked over and over but I'll keep asking :') Was Jesus asking a question?
I suppose this parable about the Kingdom, and earlier parables that begin with "The Kingdom is like...." have NO connection in your opinion because they dont ''ALL'' start that way?
How is is not relevant?
The connection between ALL of Jesus Parables is the Kingdom... That was what Jesus taught about...
Jesus Answered a question, yes...
He was using a metaphor to teach... Not providing some mystical glyph for interpreting his parables...
@letusreason1234 """The Kingdom is like.."""" Did he start the story out like that?
"""Jesus Answered a question, yes..."""" Game, set and match my friend. The interesting thing is you are arguing that it can't mean "brother".... when both say brother but it can mean anointed class when NEITHER.... NEITHER (didn't want you to miss that) say anointed class. Very fuzzy logic :')
He was answering a question that included "who" his brother were....
I am sorry, but YOU are now putting words in JESUS mouth now...
Jesus said VERBATIM “Who is my MOTHER, and who are my BROTHERS?” (Which to an observant person) would point to his NOT EXPLICITLY giving a definition about his Brother...
You only ASSUME Jesus is giving a definition... He is not, clearly... Jesus makes even more VAGUE the connection by saying:
whoever does the will of my Father who is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother
@letusreason1234 """I am sorry, but YOU are now putting words in JESUS mouth now..."""
So when I say "brother" means "brother"..... and Jesus actually says "brother".... I have somehow out words in his mouth.
But when he never says 144,000 anointed class.... NEVER NOT ONCE...... that's not putting words in his mouth? Cmon bro.... You can't possibly believe that.
As far as an intellectual fight? No not at all. It's a spiritual issue. That we agree on. Spiritual blindness
@21crosscheck21 Jesus is not giving a definition of what the word "Brother" means, any more then he is defining the word Mother or Sister
You are putting words in Jesus mouth by implying that He is
You also imply that all a person needs to do is 'Believe' in Jesus and that is it... How much of an ear tickling are you attempting to give people here???
If your going to teach, then teach the Truth, not what you find to be 'Popular' with people
@letusreason1234 Unless you can come up with a new argument I won't answer any more "brother" questions. At this point you're just repeating yourself over and over.
As far as tickling peoples ears by saying that "believing or faith is required for salvation. The Bible states that 200 plus times explicitly. How many times does it say salvation is based on how we treat some shady guys from New York City ? I'll stick with the bible :')
@letusreason1234 ""To quote Paul: "Even the Demons Believe..." Your doing a disservice to people my lulling them into a false sense of security""" Tisk Tisk..... You quote that out of context my friend. In context he is talking about how they have knowledge that there is 1 God. Interesting that the Watchtower teaches you are saved by knowledge and how you treat some men in New York. I say Jesus is sufficient.... You can deny that all you like but it's what the bible really teaches :')
So you add to the Bible and take away when you need to.... If it proves you wrong you simple re-define what words mean and make it say what you want it to...
@letusreason1234 """So you add to the Bible and take away when you need to..""" interesting coming from a guy who adds 144,000 to the sheep and the goats story and reads a bible that almost always adds "exercising: before the word faith and "union with" between the words "in" and "Christ." You do realize that Belief, Faith and Trust are generally speaking synonyms do you not? Seems you don't abide by your own standard do you? There's a word for that :')
@letusreason1234 You have to be at least in the ballpark of being reasonable here my friend. You make allot of accusations without allot to back it up. I say "Brother" means "brother" and I am adding to the scriptures. You say "brother" means 144,00 and you are not? You ask about another topic and I respond... then you accuse me of changing the subject. C'mon, you can do better then that :')
@letusreason1234 The problem is that you refuse to view things in context. I remember discussing this issue on the phone with you. When I asked you about the overall theme of the book of James you were clueless. You just cherry pick a scripture here and there and mash them together.
The last thing you have been is consistent my friend. Brother doesn't mean brother (that's adding to the scriptures) but it does mean 144,000? That's consistent? Let me ask you.... are sisters brothers?
So when YOU say "Believe" in your vid it does NOT mean to merely mentally acknowledge then?
When it is said that "Even the Demons Believe" it THEN does?
I am starting to see why you may be confused on many issues... When a single word has a million different meanings, depending on the position your trying to take...
Why not just read the Bible, and let the Bible tell us what it means...
@letusreason1234 Certainly you are not so ignorant as to believe that words can only have one meaning and context is irrelevant are you? I did answer and the answer is context.
""""Why not just read the Bible, and let the Bible tell us what it means...""" Interesting comment coming from one who belongs to, supports, promotes and defends an organization that forbids that very thing. You know well what they have said about such independent study. Physician heal thyself... you should try it!
@21crosscheck21 (James 2:18-20) Nevertheless, a certain one will say: “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith apart from the works, and I shall show you my faith by my works.”
You believe there is one God, do you? You are doing quite well. And yet the demons believe and shudder.
But do you care to know, O empty man, that faith apart from works is inactive?
"Belief " is used for Demons and Christians, but is DEAD without works... What works?
@letusreason1234 Your half way there.... Harmonize that with Romans 4 and Ephesians 2 and you"ll have something solid. Remember scripture can't be broken.
@letusreason1234 So now neither context, harmonizing all the scriptures nor consistency matter to you. I knew you couldn't but I do hope you'll think about it.
"Cant simply stick with the Scriptures then can you?"
@letusreason1234 I have addressed the James passage in a number of videos and in my debate with Robert King. If your really interested go watch and you can ask me questions base on that. No need for me to type it all out again,
Although I can see why you'll avoid Romans 4 like the plague and why you want to isolate a single verse and ignore the context and the rest of scripture.... :')
@21crosscheck21 Your video implies that all one must do is "Believe" in Jesus... It fulfills prophecy... You are an ear tickler... Its fine by me, I don't mind...
Your vid says all one must do is believe and the Bible says otherwise, but you keep tickling those ears, isolating those verses, and changing the definition of simple english words to make the Bible say what you want it to...
As for me an my household, We will worship Jehovah and read the ENTIRE Bible
@letusreason1234 """As for me an my household, We will worship Jehovah and read the ENTIRE Bible""" Well then go read Romans 4 and harmonize it with James 2. If you think that I am somehow going to sit here and respond to your insults and misrepresentations of what I said your mistaken. That;'s why I blocked you the first time. You seem to be a dishonest man. I'm seeing that side again. However I'm open to a real debate if you like... Make a video and I'll respond
@21crosscheck21 """In context he is talking about how they have knowledge that there is 1 God""" SO here you say the word 'Believe' means that the Demons have Knowledge, huh?
Then in John 6:29 what does 'Believe' mean? are you saying it does NOT mean 'to have knowledge'?
If in John 6:29 "to Believe" in Jesus does NOT mean the same as it does in James 2, then what does it mean?
lol
your answer please...
Does it possibly mean that belife is not the only thing needed?
@letusreason1234 Simply put our belief... our faith is put to the test by our actions or deeds..... Dead faith... mere intellectual assent has no deeds... But living faith produces good works, but the good works don't save us.... the faith does. Romans 4:5 among many other passages makes this clear..... The context of the book of James is this: What faith looks like when it walks. His message.... show me your faith by what what you do. Good tree... good fruit
@letusreason1234 cont... James 2:14 ""14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?""" Can a faith that has no works save them? No because no works is evidence of a dead... intellectual faith..... You are arguing the Mormon doctrine of some list of works you can't even provide combined with faith.... If you need to add works to save you your claiming the sacrifice of Christ was insufficient.
@letusreason1234 """To prove your faith you must OBEY the commands of God..."""" Got a verse that actually says that? And it's interesting you'll whine till the cows come home that I wont answer James.... I do (whether you agree or not is irrelevant... at least I tried) and you wont even touch Romans 4 with a ten foot poll. My view harmonizes the scriptures.... Yours can't even begin to :') But I understand why you won't even try.... I's alright.... I get it. Cheers
(1 John 2:3-4) And by this we have the knowledge that we have come to know him, namely, if we continue observing his commandments. 4 He that says: “I have come to know him,” and yet is not observing his commandments,IS A LIAR, and the truth is not in this [person].
Soooooooooooo,
Your video is a lie... You are telling ones that all they must do is Believe...
@letusreason1234 And????? I believe that. But doesn't say works save you. It states the simple fact of the new covenant and the spirit led born again man.
@21crosscheck21 You realize I could show you verses that say this, all day...???
(1 John 2:5) But whoever does observe his word, truthfully in this [person] the love of God has been made perfect. By this we have the knowledge that we are in union with him.
@letusreason1234 """ You realize I could show you verses that say this, all day...???""" yes I do and not a single one in context nor a single one that state what you stated. How about you show me Romans 4:5?
Romans 4:5 is speaking of the 'Works of the Law'... as in the temple... that was destroyed in the first century... as in animal sacrifices and festivals, and Sabbaths and the like...
I find it odd that you are advocating that a person who does not follow Gods commands is "Saved" as long as he believes...
And using scriptures that speak of the Temple Works, and Mosaic Law being abolished to support it...
@21crosscheck21 (Galatians 2:16) knowing as we do that a man is declared righteous, not due to works of law, but only through faith toward Christ Jesus, even we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, that we may be declared righteous due to faith toward Christ, and not due to works of law, because due to works of law no flesh will be declared righteous.
@letusreason1234 """(1 John 2:5) But whoever does observe his word, truthfully in this [person] the love of God has been made perfect. By this we have the knowledge that we are in union with him."""
Cont..... Another verse that I say amen to... But what it doesn't say is works save you.....
@letusreason1234 Another thing that's interesting... You claim one group is "brothers" and the other is "sheep."...... How is it then that the the sheep are "OTHER" sheep. Doesn't that make the "brothers" - uhhhh..... "sheep?" And there is only ONE fold.... Yet you have two folds.... Hmmmmm What a confusing and contradicting doctrine.
@letusreason1234 """"The Verse is not Jesus giving a definition of anything, as you are claiming, but rather him making a point...""" Jesus asks a question---then answers it, It's that simple. """"Unless you are saying the Sheep are also Christs Mothers, Sisters, etc... your interpretation of this verse makes NO SENSE...""""" Mother-brother-sister are synonyms. It's a metaphor is it not? In what sense is he using these terms? Do we have 3 classes of people here?
So you are agreeing that What Jesus is saying, "...Mother, Brother, Sister..." is a METAPHOR!""""
That has been my assertion from the start. I have actually even stated that to you. Please don't act as though I haven't. It's undignified and quote frankly dishonest. However the Mathew account is not a parable but a prophecy using a metaphor. Not sure why you would be surprised by that. Cont...
Jesus NEVER said "This is the Definition of what a 'Brother of Christ' is in all of my parables" as YOU are implying that he did...
You say there is no connection between the FDS parable and the Sheep/Goat/Brother Parable...
Ok then... by you own standard of 'Connectivity' what are you presenting to show that the scripture that Jesus compares his Mom, Sis, and Bros to his Disciples as his family, that he is define the Brothers in the Sheep/Goat Parable...
... - and it hurts you personally when you see all the lies and approaches of people who love their own ego/lives more than God. it hurts to see all this. but everything is just as it is written in the Bible for sooo long.
if you ever experienced such an unlogical behaviour of people who surround you or people you come across later when serving God and you are really really trying out of love for this wonderful God who is love and who sacrified his beloved son for our un-deserved salvation - but the world starts to hate you for nothing - you love them more but they hate you - then you begin to really have your own evidence of Jesus´ true words and warnings and you love him and the Almighty God even more
@Catch22here Thank you my friend...... I agree it is all straw man. He is continually putting words in my mouth. Although to his credit he does have the guts to make videos etc.
Psalm 109:5 "They repay me evil for good, and hatred for my friendship." - John 15:18: ""If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first.". or: Revelation 12:17. have you heard of all the hate and brutality JW had to cope with and still are being hated? how - beginning with Abel everyone who is righteouss had to cope with this hate ever since, just like the bible states from the beginning? and what is most important: are you being hated for merely wanting to serve God & doing no harm
@HeavenClear>"all the hate and brutality JW had to cope with"
Study 1Pe3:12-17 "the face of the Lord is against them that do evil. ...For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing."
Why do JW LIE against the truth saying: in 1914 an Angelic ascended master sat down on Most High throne at right hand of God?
The truth is "the MAN Christ Jesus" 1Ti2:5-6, "the Son of MAN" sat down at right hand of God Lk22:69, the day He resurrected from the dead.
@letusreason1234>"Bible NOWHERE says that the original plan was to have humans DOMINATE the earth"
Gn1:26 [RADAH] 28 "Further,God blessed them and God said to them:“Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it,and have in subjection [RADAH] the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth. ...God saw everything he had made and,look! [it was] very good”
râdâh = subjugate have dominion [dominate] reign rule over
You laugh and mock Christians who tell you truth of what Bible REALLY teaches. Please stop mocking us and start hearing:
Prior to sin entering world, God's plan for man kind was to have dominion reign over earth. And God saw His plan and all creation was very good. Study Gen 1:26-31; 2:21-25
After sin entered the world, God chose One Holy and Just man, the Holy One of Israel, mankind's Redeemer Christ the Lord to have dominion in heaven and in earth Mt28:18;Ep1:21
@letusreason1234 >"I think you should read your Bible and see what MANS! Domination has brought about..."
I think you should read your Bible and see what "the man Christ Jesus" dominion shall bring about! And also understand how you and your religious rulers continually deny Him and His dominion. Christ Jesus shall rule with a "rod of iron" Psa 2, Rev12:5;19:15.
Look Rev Climax bk page 52. The painting shows other men with rods of iron, and they have Jesus holding a rod of wood!
and - what is the main motivation for this video? you are annoyed to not be a broher of Jesus. this somehow reminds me personally on a "spiritual" "person" that demanded far too much glory for himself
not badly done, sounds good - but ridiculous - he didn´t say to the crowd you are my brothers. he said it to his apostles and that is a little difference than what you are talking about..
@21crosscheck21 it is too simple, can´t believe you ask: Jesus said this to the ones he chose before to be taught by him, to follow him. so, despite the fact that others did believe in Jesus and gathered to see/hear him - he did not say of them (of the ones who believed him) that they are his brothers /sisters but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will
@HeavenClear "" that they are his brothers /sisters but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will""" So the apostles lived a perfect sinless life from the time Jesus said this? Have ya read the bible?
@21crosscheck21 pardon?? who said that anyone on earth is perfect or can be?? I mean, your arguments are astonishingly childish for someone who tries to say something intelligent. where can you prove - without only taking fragments maybe and pointing them out in the way they please you only and the ones who are listening to you. - have YOU read the bible?? I mean, have you really read the whole bible - to me it seems you don´t even know what Jesus said and how he reacted.
@HeavenClear (...) matthew 24:43-47 for example. and - in your own video you say it exactly the way JW understand it and what they teach people - just the way it is written in the bible, and you - yes YOU - are mentioning it but it doesn´t seem to "reach" you: you say at 3:17 - reading from the bible: "...pointing to his disciples...." matthew 12:49. and: what about what Jesus said about the ones who are going to follow him?? (...cont.)
@HeavenClear """pardon?? who said that anyone on earth is perfect or can be?? I mean, your arguments are astonishingly childish""""" Why so surprised? You said it. And I quote: """but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will"""" Again I ask.... You said they followed EXACTLY his way....... did you not?
@21crosscheck21 so, if he wanted to say that everyone who merely believed in him is brother/sister/mother etc for him - he could have shown with the finger on all the gathered people came to see / hear him and not only showing to the apostles.
Glory to God in the Highest, and on earth peace good will toward men. For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. AMEN
Lettuce obviously doesn't believe in (John 14:26) He is a follower of men and he has accepted this teacher as his God! His false teachers have a 100% accuracy of epic failure. They teach that the bible teaches apostasy. Now that's some fine teaching... Haha!
@barbsinclair I'd like to know what Letusreason has to say about the audio clip on the video "1975 -What the Watchtower doesn't want you to know." by JWMediaFilms? I'd like to see him dance around that one!
(Audio = PROOF) Maybe he hasn't realized yet why his Awake stops at 1970 on his Watchtower library Cd?
@1914watcher Let's see how nice the GB treats "Christ's Brothers"
August 15, 2011 Watchtower (The study edition) pg 22 Memorial partakers.
This is the number of baptized individuals who partake of the emblems at the Memorial worldwide. Does this total represent the number of anointed ones on earth? Not necessarily. A number of factors including past religious beliefs or even MENTAL or EMOTIONAL imbalance might cause some to ASSUME mistakenly that they have the heavenly calling."
JWs spiritual human rulers actually think, the millions of anointed disciples of Christ who were martyred for witnessing of the name Christ Jesus in just the first few centuries had "mental or emotional imbalance might cause some to assume mistakenly that they have the heavenly calling." (August 15,2011 WT pg22)
Fact is all Christians have the heavenly hope, for no one can have any hope of living forever on a paradise earth; for in Bible "PARADISE" is the third HEAVEN = 2Co12:1-4
@1914watcher, THE GREATEST MAN bk ch17>"By the accompanying declaration from heaven, 'This is my Son whom I have approved,' God announced that he had brought forth a spiritual son having the prospect of entering into the heavenly Kingdom.Later,at Pentecost 33C.E.,other baptized ones will receive holy spirit and will thus be born again as spiritual sons of God."
Hear serpent hissing through these apostates: they say KING of the Kingdom only had "THE PROSPECT OF ENTERING INTO THE HEAVENLY KINGDOM"
@1914watcher SO your telling me that Matthew 24, ht eParable of the faithful and discreet slave, does not have Jesus giving his Slave the order to feed his domestics???
@letusreason1234 >"SO your telling me that Matthew 24, ht eParable of the faithful and discreet slave,does not have Jesus giving his Slave the order to feed his domestics?"
Points on Mt24:
1) its all prophesy [no parable]
2) v1-2 happened 70ad
3) v3-12 ongoing since Jesus resurrected from dead
4) v13-14 instructs dwellers on earth during tribulation period
5) v15-28 focuses on 7years of tribulation, specifically those in land of Israel.
6) v29-51 all future "after the tribulation of those days"
Question for you archeng, did Matt 25:31-46 happen yet? (Note verses 31-32). Who do you think the brothers and the sheep are? Do you think these "sheep" and "brothers" are those who have been around since the 1st century and up to the day v31-32 happens?
All believers are "a ROYAL priesthood" and "fellowcitizens with the saints and of the household of God...Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;IN WHOM all the building fitly framed TOGETHER GROWS UNTO AN HOLY TEMPLE IN THE LORD..."
Go study completely those passages, and be blessed.
Jn11:25-26;12:26 "where I am, there shall also my servant be"
= Father will honour all believing Christians as His "chosen generation a royal priesthood an holy nation"; royal priesthood of believers 1Pe2. Rev20:4-6"Happy and holy is ANYONE HAVING PART IN THE FIRST RESURRECTION; OVER THESE THE SECOND DEATH HAS NO AUTHORITY [Jn11:25-26;12:26], but THEY WILL BE priests of God and of the Christ, and will rule as kings and priests WITH HIM [Rom ch8] for the thousand years"
JWs, this teaching of your seed class, denies the virgin birth of "the Holy One and the Just", the only "seed" of the woman (Gen 3:15), the male child, Christ the Lord (Lk 2:11; Rev 12:1-10), the "HOLY" child come in the flesh without human father; Isa 7:14; 9:6-7.
You desire 144,000 sinful humans be granted unto you. Read:
Ac3:14 "But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you"
All believers in Christ Jesus "the resurrection and the life...shall never die at all" Jn11:25-26 = Rev20:4-6
One body together "with all that in every place" 1Co1:2 = "any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour" Jn12:26
Father shall "honour" all believing Christians: His "chosen generation a royal priesthood an holy nation"; royal priesthood of believers = 1Pe2
Perfect, just perfect! John 6: 29 could not be more plainly said for all to see, but the WTS has even messed that up: John 6:29 "... "This is the work of God, that YOU exercise faith in him whom that One sent forth."
They replace "believe" with "exercise faith" thus downgrading the importance put on believing in Jesus.
What about James 2:14,17? By their rules it should be: 14"...faith but he has no FAITH? Can that faith save him? 17Even so faith, if it has no FAITH, is dead, being by itself.
@letusreason Did u miss this? What makes you think every homeless person is a criminal? Are there not homeless people all over the world due to famine..... national poverty.... economic collapse... little children through no fault of their own Why are you so fixated on this and hateful to those in need ?
In addition are not all sinners? Have not all sinned? Are the anointed perfected and living sinless on earth? Again I think your fixated on this as a way to avoid the real issue at hand....
@21crosscheck21 I didnt say that EVERY HOMELESS person is a criminal
They are not all Christians obviously though... The Muslims and Buddhists that are homeless are not Christian are not right?
What about the Junkies and the Drunkards, and Murderers?
My Point is that You, and others like you, point to this verse as some MORALITY tale as if we are commanded to go out and feed ALL the Hungry, Homeless, People in Prison
These ones in Matthew are clearly this way for PREACHING
@letusreason1234 "My Point is that You, and others like you, point to this verse as some MORALITY tale as if we are commanded to go out and feed ALL the Hungry, Homeless, People in Prison" Can you point me to where I actually said that? Not to where you read into a comment or an assumption based on a comment but where I actually argued that point?
Also are we not to help the Samaritan? They were quasi-pagans?
@letusreason1234 "I didn't say that EVERY HOMELESS person is a criminal. "They are not all Christians obviously though." Christ was born in manger..HOMELESS! His very first breath of air was that of urine and manure in a manger?! He was rejected by his own people, his mother was shunned.. SOUND FAMILIAR?
@letusreason1234 >"These ones in Matthew are clearly this way for PREACHING"
In Mt25:31-46, our Lord King Jesus Christ, DID NOT SAY preaching was done. He said:
The sheep saw the brothers were hungry and thirsty and gave them meat and drink. The sheep saw brothers were strangers and naked, took them in and clothed them. The sheep saw the brothers were sick and in prison so came to them, visited them.
Its impossible these brothers are JW anointed class: for they are to do, what these sheep do.
@letusreason1234 >"The Demons believe [Jms2:19].Are they saved??? Or is it what they are EXERCISING that condemns them?"
You preach: there's only One SEED, but in that One SEED, there's many 144,001 person's
THAT >"condemns" you!
For you deny "the doctrine of Christ" our Saviour Christ the Lord (Luke 2:11) come in the flesh (1Jhn4:1-6; 2Jhn1:7-11), the "VIRGIN BIRTH" of ONE [not many] Gen3:15 the "seed" of the woman. Rev 12:1-11 "male child... Christ": Isa 9:6-7.
I hope your starting to understand the serious error of this Watchtower teaching your preaching to the public! It is not the truth of the Holy Son of God, the only 'seed' of the woman who was sent by Holy Father, come in the flesh to save mankind from their sins.
God says, ‘He did no sin’ (1Pe2:22), ‘He knew no sin’ (2Co5:20), and we read, ‘in him was not sin.' (1Jn 3:5).
STOP lying against the truth by teaching there are 144,000 sinful humans as that HOLY "Seed". Repent!
Remove your entire foundation of religious faith in 144k holy temple class; for what you are EXERCISING in THEM, shall condemn you: for its not the truth of God, its a lie of the evil one.
No elite class of 144k Christians shall rule over Christian believers on earth; there was no 1914 enthronement of an angelic ascended master on the heavenly throne.
But yes, an angel of light did pick JW org as its channel = 2Co4:3-6;11:13-15.
Ya. I was having trouble finding LUR comments because they were spammed. I really want to read what he has to say. I'm thinking it would be awesome to hear discussions on this with the brethren; record it and upload to YouTube. This is a very important doctrine of God, so much so that it actually effects the salvation of those who place their trust in the teachings of JWs "faithful and discreet slave and its governing body." It moves trust in salvation from God's Words to men's.
Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:
"But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." Mat23:1,8
YOU ARE ALL BROTHERS
Therefore, brother John rightly warns of "the FALSE brothers" (Gal2:4) trying to mislead Christ's innumerable brothers: "...the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU, and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU" 1Jn2
@letusreason1234>"Christs Stewards,if we do not follow them, we do not follow him!"
"AS EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT, MINISTER the same one to another, AS GOOD STEWARDS of the manifold grace of God.If any man speak,[let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister,[let him do it] as of THE ABILITY WHICH GOD GIVES: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."1Pe4
@letusreason1234 >"we all have the duty of receiving our spiritual food from Jesus Faithfull slave"
That's your JW "sacred duty", not mine. I reject JWs human rulers as antichrists.
Our household have received Jesus Christ Himself: JWs "received him not" Jn1:11-13
My fellowship is with Father and Son and like precious believers we are taught directly by Holy Spirit of truth 1Jn ch1&2. Our household are sons of God Rom8, we shall never die Jn11:25-26;12:26, receiving 1st resurrection = Rev20:6
@letusreason1234>"Where does the bible say that ALL Christians are KINGS or RULERS?"
Rv20:6"Happy and holy is ANYONE having part in THE FIRST RESURRECTION: over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ,and will rule as kings with him for the thousand years"
= Jn11:25-26 "EVERYONE" believing in Christ Jesus "the RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE...shall never die at all" ="FIRST RESURRECTION"
"ONE BODY" of believers with "ONE HOPE of calling" Eph ch2&4
JWs never represent the man Christ Jesus. Every JW represents their human religious rulers and its organization. Not one of JWs, including all JW human rulers, not one represents Son of God Jesus Christ; for you all admit:
WT 2/15/1964 p109>"They [JWs] came to appreciate that they were a people, not for the name of Jesus"
Every JW is a person not for the Name of Son of God Jesus Christ. None of you people represent Him at all.
@letusreason1234>"Where does the bible say that ALL Christians are KINGS or RULERS?"
BIBLE teaches "RESURRECTION" only refers to PHYSICAL "flesh and bones" BODY. Bible NEVER teaches spirits & souls be resurrected from dead; spirits & souls are not subject to physical death being non-physical
YET JW human rulers teach a past resurrection of spirits: Rev Climax pg124-125,pr16-17 = Their as Hymenaeus & Philetus: read 2Ti2:16-18
1st resurrection Rv20:6, of believers Jn11:25-26, hasn't started yet
The Mt24:42-51 selection by our Lord and Master Christ Jesus HAS NOT HAPPENED YET; it happens at "the judgment seat of Christ":
Rm14:10-11"FOR WE ALL SHALL STAND BEFORE THE JUDGMENT SEAT OF CHRIST. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God."
Study 2Cor ch5 "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ" = 1Pe4:17
After reading what I posted you today please read again:
1Pe4 "AS EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT, MINISTER the same one to another, AS GOOD STEWARDS of the manifold grace of God.If any man speak,[let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister,[let him do it] as of THE ABILITY WHICH GOD GIVES: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."
"EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT" = 1Jhn 2:24-29; 3:1-10
@letusreason1234 >"if we do not follow them, we do not follow him!"
My Lord and Master said:
"The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord." Mat 10:24-25
You shall be as those whom you follow. Look in the mirror, your lords and masters can only give to you what they themselves have: sin and corruption leading to destruction.
Your following false shepherds that cannot give you the life.
@letusreason1234 """Corinthians 9:17) If I perform this willingly, I have a reward; but if I do it against my will, all the same I have a stewardship entrusted to me."""" Paul is talking about himself in this verse is he not? What does that verse have to do with the other sheep? Was Paul one of the other sheep? Was the way he treated himself a determining factor in His eternal life?
@21crosscheck21 All Christians have the Job of Teaching others about Christ and God... As we receive our Spiritual Food from the faithful slave, we share with others...
Are you trying to argue that Witnessing and Teaching about God is NOT the duty of ALL Christians? We believe it is... As the bible says it is...
Where does that Bible say that ALL Christians are to be RULERS???
Where does the Bible say that ALL Christians are to be KINGS???
@letusreason1234 ""Are you trying to argue that Witnessing and Teaching about God is NOT the duty of ALL Christians? We believe it is... As the bible says it is...""" I have no idea what you're talking about. Not only did I never say that I teach evangelism classes.
""Where does that Bible say that ALL Christians are to be RULERS???
Where does the Bible say that ALL Christians are to be KINGS???"""
Will not the meek inherit the earth... was not Adam/children to have dominion?
@letusreason1234 "Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
That is what men rule over..... God rules over men.... Men have rule over earthly things..... do they not?
Interesting how willing and eager you are to be ruled over by men and woman..... but not God :')
@letusreason1234 Cont..... Just so I can be as snarky as you let me add my apology.... I had assumed you had read the bible.... my bad.... LOL Take care my friend. We'll chat soon.
(Galatians 6:10) Really, then, as long as we have time favorable for it, let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to [us] in the faith.
Really? In the Parable Jesus EQUATES these 'Brothers' with HIMSELF, saying
"To the Extent that you did it to one of THESE, you did it to me" making it clear who they are.
'Christians' Witnessing for God and Christ (Revelation 20:4) not Criminals.
Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? Literal 'Homeless Drunks and Drug Addicts' and 'Criminals' who have been arrested for crimes committed?
You feel that is who Jesus Equated himself to? Or Christians?
@letusreason1234 "Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? " To the redeemed and those he will redeem. "Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? Literal 'Homeless Drunks and Drug Addicts' and 'Criminals' who have been arrested for crimes committed?""' What? They cannot be redeemed? They don't deserve a glass of water? Did not Jesus eat with tax collectors and feed the 5000? Were they all brothers?
So they are a group of Christians being persecuted as Christ was for preaching the truth, or they are as YOU say, 'Merely Homeless Criminals who the Sheep have to be good to'
You honestly advocate that we should support poverty and drug addictions?
Or does the Parable teach that we should support CHRISTIANS?
The Sheep Support those in (Revelation 20:4), not Homeless criminals, and they get life for it.
The goats do NOT support the ones in (Revelation 20:4)
@21crosscheck21 When you agreed with babrsinclair that the sheep and brothers were the same and were lost homeless and didn't come to know Jesus until they suffered some tragedy...
Doesn't sound like Christians to me...
So we gain life by supporting those who are NOT YET Christians, and their bad habits???
The we EQUATE them with CHRIST???
You lost me...
Jesus NEVER advocated being poor or a criminal. He said HIS FOLLOWERS would become that way because the world hated them
@letusreason1234 "So we gain life by supporting those who are NOT YET Christians, and their bad habits???""" No, we gain life by faith in Christ..... and we demonstrate that faith by showing mercy, even to those who don't deserve it. Certainly you know what the word Grace means don't you? And what makes you think reaching out to needy people HAS to mean helping them in their sin? Again.... that's what the pharisees taught... that why the priest wouldn't help the worldly Samaritan.
This entire teaching of your religious rulers on Mat 25:31-46 is laughable at best. Do you seriously believe that your 144k (who really is the governing body of JWs a group of men at WT headquarters in NY USA). Do you really believe the sheep have to FEED GIVE WATER CLOTH AND VISIT THEM To receive everlasting life from our Saviour Jesus Christ?
Stop being so gullible and read the passage! When is the last time you gave food, water and cloths to a JW governing body member? lol
@barbsinclair SO when yo are clearly WRONG about something you simply change the subject?
Is that How you operate? :)
Have you been executed by an Axe???
Please show me where in the Bible it says that these ones in Revelation 20:4 are EVERYONE that believes in Christ and not ONLY those whom i describes as Witnessing and dieing by execution...
Bible verse please?
Oh, and please don't change the subject... It ruins your credibility
@letusreason1234 >"SO when yo are clearly WRONG about something you simply change the subject?"
I never changed subject; I'm staying in Mat 24&25, and how your human rulers LIE by inserting themselves into God's prophetic Word 24:44-46; 25:31-46
What's clearly WRONG, is ALL your JW religious dogmas surrounding the years 1914-1919! There was no 1914 enthronement of an angel on the Most High heavenly throne; and the Son of Man, the man Christ Jesus 1Ti2:5-6, NEVER had invisible parousia in 1919!
@letusreason1234>"where in the Bible it says that these ones in Rev20:4 are EVERYONE that believes in Christ"
JW human rulers LIE in Rev Climax pg290-291, par16,17,18: saying "The First Resurrection" and 1Co15:53 ONLY applies to them; that they alone conquer “the second death"!
@letusreason1234 >"you agreed with babrsinclair that the sheep and brothers were..."
Brother Brian and I agree "the sheep" Mt25:31-46, and "the little flock" Lk12:32, both have EXACT SAME INHERITANCE GIVEN THEM. It is written:
Lk12:32 "Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom"
Mt25:33-34 "Then shall the King say unto them [sheep] on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world"
@21crosscheck21 Christs brothers are those who Christ EQUATES with HIMSELF...
What did Jesus Do???
(Revelation 20:4) And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God
"""The Law covenant and its many works do not save, but the OBEYING of the commands of God, which precede the Law covenant, do save...."""""
I agree with the first part but "obeying the laws that precede the law covenant?" What are you talking about?
In Romans 4 Paul uses 2 examples.... 1 not under the law and 1 that is. Abraham and David. What "laws" or "works" where they saved by?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 cont..... Ezekiel 36...26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws. This is WHY we obey.... Not why we are saved. But of course this is only for the anointed right?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
Obviously the Mosaic law with it's temple works do not save... The Temple, it's alter, and all it's functions were destroyed long ago, when Israel voided the Old Covenant by have Jesus killed...
The Commands of God, however, are not voided. The Bible is clear that if you are not following these commands you are not on the road to salvation...
Faith without works is dead...
Can you break Gods laws willfully and be saved? Is that what you teach?
(HEB 10:26)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """"Obviously the Mosaic law with it's temple works do not save."""" So when Paul wrote Romans 4:5 he had he Mosaic law and the temple in mind when he was talking about works?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Well, you tell me:
(Romans 4:13-14) For it was not through law that Abraham or his seed had the promise that he should be heir of a world, but it was through the righteousness by faith. For if those who adhere to law are heirs, faith has been made useless and the promise has been abolished.
Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 ""Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?"""""
So what saved him? And what saved David (who's cited as well as an example) who was under the Mosaic law? Its the same thing :') FAITH....
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
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letusreason1234 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@21crosscheck21 His faith, Which was OBSERVED through his actions or moving out of the city of UR and into Tents...
His Faith proved by Righteous Works!
In Romans 4:5, though, it is BEYOND clear, that the WORKS being spoken of are the LAW covenant, if you keep reading
The Law covenant and its many works do not save, but the OBEYING of the commands of God, which precede the Law covenant, do save
As they are proof of ones faith
Make your vid, and I will respond to it...
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Yes...
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Okay... thanks. I'll make a video response to that :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 make sure to include Romans 4:13-14 and my above response in that video...
And explain why Paul specifically says that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how then is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@21crosscheck21
(Romans 4:13-14) For it was not through law that Abraham or his seed had the promise that he should be heir of a world, but it was through the righteousness by faith. For if those who adhere to law are heirs, faith has been made useless and the promise has been abolished.
Paul shows that Abraham was counted Righteous BEFORE THE MOSAIC, and asks: how is it that THE LAW is what makes you righteous if someone was righteousness before it existed?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
Are SOME works required?
Is it your position that NO WORK on a persons part is necessary?
Please tell us all, what does this mean?
(James 2:14) Of what benefit is it, my brothers, if a certain one says he has faith but he does not have works? That faith cannot save him, can it?
(James 2:26) Indeed, as the body without spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.
Is faith ALONE in Jesus what saves? What does the above say?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
"...the same is my brother, and sister, and mother"...
How more ""UNSPECIFIC"" could our Lord have been?
You said, """"Game, set and match my friend""""
This is exactly WHY I do this...
People think this is some word/rule/intellectual GAME that they are playing against Gods People...
I am trying my hardest to reason with you... Really help you to understand the Bible...
You are playing a "Figurative-Chess-Game" of taking verses out of context and arguing...
This is not a game to me...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
earlier parables that begin with "The Kingdom is like...." have NO connection in your opinion because they don't ''ALL'' start that way?
How is is not relevant?
The connection between ALL of Jesus Parables is the Kingdom... That was what Jesus taught about...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """earlier parables that begin with "The Kingdom is like...." have NO connection in your opinion because they don't ''ALL'' start that way?""""
Jesus does not start the story of the separation of the sheep and the goats out with "the kingdom is like..." So I have no idea what that even has to do with what were talking about. If you want to be taken seriously stop with the straw men.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
I think the FACT that Jesus began most of his parables with "The Kingdom of God is like...." would kind of connect them as opposed to his non-parables wouldn't you"?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 ""I think the FACT that Jesus began most of his parables with "The Kingdom of God is like...."""" The story starts out "31 “When the Son of man arrives in his glory," (NWT) so I have no idea why you would bring that up or what relevance it has to the discussion.... But I do know why you won't answer the question I have asked over and over but I'll keep asking :') Was Jesus asking a question?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
lol
I suppose this parable about the Kingdom, and earlier parables that begin with "The Kingdom is like...." have NO connection in your opinion because they dont ''ALL'' start that way?
How is is not relevant?
The connection between ALL of Jesus Parables is the Kingdom... That was what Jesus taught about...
Jesus Answered a question, yes...
He was using a metaphor to teach... Not providing some mystical glyph for interpreting his parables...
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """The Kingdom is like.."""" Did he start the story out like that?
"""Jesus Answered a question, yes..."""" Game, set and match my friend. The interesting thing is you are arguing that it can't mean "brother".... when both say brother but it can mean anointed class when NEITHER.... NEITHER (didn't want you to miss that) say anointed class. Very fuzzy logic :')
He was answering a question that included "who" his brother were....
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
I am sorry, but YOU are now putting words in JESUS mouth now...
Jesus said VERBATIM “Who is my MOTHER, and who are my BROTHERS?” (Which to an observant person) would point to his NOT EXPLICITLY giving a definition about his Brother...
You only ASSUME Jesus is giving a definition... He is not, clearly... Jesus makes even more VAGUE the connection by saying:
whoever does the will of my Father who is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """I am sorry, but YOU are now putting words in JESUS mouth now..."""
So when I say "brother" means "brother"..... and Jesus actually says "brother".... I have somehow out words in his mouth.
But when he never says 144,000 anointed class.... NEVER NOT ONCE...... that's not putting words in his mouth? Cmon bro.... You can't possibly believe that.
As far as an intellectual fight? No not at all. It's a spiritual issue. That we agree on. Spiritual blindness
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
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letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Jesus is not giving a definition of what the word "Brother" means, any more then he is defining the word Mother or Sister
You are putting words in Jesus mouth by implying that He is
You also imply that all a person needs to do is 'Believe' in Jesus and that is it... How much of an ear tickling are you attempting to give people here???
If your going to teach, then teach the Truth, not what you find to be 'Popular' with people
OBEYING Gods Laws, Preaching the good news
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Unless you can come up with a new argument I won't answer any more "brother" questions. At this point you're just repeating yourself over and over.
As far as tickling peoples ears by saying that "believing or faith is required for salvation. The Bible states that 200 plus times explicitly. How many times does it say salvation is based on how we treat some shady guys from New York City ? I'll stick with the bible :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 The Bible says ''''MORE'''' is required then merely believing...
To quote Paul: "Even the Demons Believe..." Your doing a disservice to people my lulling them into a false sense of security
"To Believe" really???
That is ALL that the Bible teaches?
I think you know better, but would have a much smaller audience if you said so...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 ""To quote Paul: "Even the Demons Believe..." Your doing a disservice to people my lulling them into a false sense of security""" Tisk Tisk..... You quote that out of context my friend. In context he is talking about how they have knowledge that there is 1 God. Interesting that the Watchtower teaches you are saved by knowledge and how you treat some men in New York. I say Jesus is sufficient.... You can deny that all you like but it's what the bible really teaches :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Really?
Because the Scripture says "Believe"
So you add to the Bible and take away when you need to.... If it proves you wrong you simple re-define what words mean and make it say what you want it to...
I understand now... Thanks
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """So you add to the Bible and take away when you need to..""" interesting coming from a guy who adds 144,000 to the sheep and the goats story and reads a bible that almost always adds "exercising: before the word faith and "union with" between the words "in" and "Christ." You do realize that Belief, Faith and Trust are generally speaking synonyms do you not? Seems you don't abide by your own standard do you? There's a word for that :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
Nice!
try and change the subject... muddy the water a bit?
good tactic...
So, Paul does not say "Even the Demons Believe..."???
He says that they ''''mentally acknowledge''''???
I see... So you ARE telling people that all they must do is mentally acknowledge then?
Make up your mind... What does Believe mean?
Only what YOU say it does in EACH verse???
please be more consistent...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 You have to be at least in the ballpark of being reasonable here my friend. You make allot of accusations without allot to back it up. I say "Brother" means "brother" and I am adding to the scriptures. You say "brother" means 144,00 and you are not? You ask about another topic and I respond... then you accuse me of changing the subject. C'mon, you can do better then that :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
I don't recall you saying 'Brother' means 'Brother'...
You said Jesus was DEFINING what it means to be his brother, when he was clearly being UNSPECIFIC; using Sister, and Mother as well...
You change the meaning of "Believe" in one verse to support your view, then SWITCH for another when it directly contradicts your false teachings...
so please, be consistent... I am at least...
Does 'Believe' mean to mean 'Believe', or "Mentally Acknowledge?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 The problem is that you refuse to view things in context. I remember discussing this issue on the phone with you. When I asked you about the overall theme of the book of James you were clueless. You just cherry pick a scripture here and there and mash them together.
The last thing you have been is consistent my friend. Brother doesn't mean brother (that's adding to the scriptures) but it does mean 144,000? That's consistent? Let me ask you.... are sisters brothers?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
Seriously!?
You really are refusing to answer huh? lol
So when YOU say "Believe" in your vid it does NOT mean to merely mentally acknowledge then?
When it is said that "Even the Demons Believe" it THEN does?
I am starting to see why you may be confused on many issues... When a single word has a million different meanings, depending on the position your trying to take...
Why not just read the Bible, and let the Bible tell us what it means...
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Certainly you are not so ignorant as to believe that words can only have one meaning and context is irrelevant are you? I did answer and the answer is context.
""""Why not just read the Bible, and let the Bible tell us what it means...""" Interesting comment coming from one who belongs to, supports, promotes and defends an organization that forbids that very thing. You know well what they have said about such independent study. Physician heal thyself... you should try it!
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 (James 2:18-20) Nevertheless, a certain one will say: “You have faith, and I have works. Show me your faith apart from the works, and I shall show you my faith by my works.”
You believe there is one God, do you? You are doing quite well. And yet the demons believe and shudder.
But do you care to know, O empty man, that faith apart from works is inactive?
"Belief " is used for Demons and Christians, but is DEAD without works... What works?
Believing?
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Your half way there.... Harmonize that with Romans 4 and Ephesians 2 and you"ll have something solid. Remember scripture can't be broken.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
lol
WOW!
and you accuse me of jumping around???
What do you call this? REAL CONTINUITY?
The Scripture specifically says that "Believing" Will NOT be the only thing to save you...
Yet your vid says the opposite...
Why do you teach contrary to the Bible and then try and SKIP around to avoid the plain truth right in front of you?
And you say some Witnesses are Cafeteria like? Mr. Pick and Choose?
Cant simply stick with the Scriptures then can you?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 So now neither context, harmonizing all the scriptures nor consistency matter to you. I knew you couldn't but I do hope you'll think about it.
"Cant simply stick with the Scriptures then can you?"
Romans 4 is not scripture? Hmmmm....
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Why do you want to "Jump Around" (As you call it)???
It seems you are unable to address the scriptures in James... You teach people?
How do you do it when they ask YOU to focus on these verses?
SO far you have only tried to change the subject with me...
Stick to James, answer the question... What does it say? You tell us...
What does James say to the Christians about the Demons?
The floor is yours
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 I have addressed the James passage in a number of videos and in my debate with Robert King. If your really interested go watch and you can ask me questions base on that. No need for me to type it all out again,
Although I can see why you'll avoid Romans 4 like the plague and why you want to isolate a single verse and ignore the context and the rest of scripture.... :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Your video implies that all one must do is "Believe" in Jesus... It fulfills prophecy... You are an ear tickler... Its fine by me, I don't mind...
Your vid says all one must do is believe and the Bible says otherwise, but you keep tickling those ears, isolating those verses, and changing the definition of simple english words to make the Bible say what you want it to...
As for me an my household, We will worship Jehovah and read the ENTIRE Bible
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """As for me an my household, We will worship Jehovah and read the ENTIRE Bible""" Well then go read Romans 4 and harmonize it with James 2. If you think that I am somehow going to sit here and respond to your insults and misrepresentations of what I said your mistaken. That;'s why I blocked you the first time. You seem to be a dishonest man. I'm seeing that side again. However I'm open to a real debate if you like... Make a video and I'll respond
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 """In context he is talking about how they have knowledge that there is 1 God""" SO here you say the word 'Believe' means that the Demons have Knowledge, huh?
Then in John 6:29 what does 'Believe' mean? are you saying it does NOT mean 'to have knowledge'?
If in John 6:29 "to Believe" in Jesus does NOT mean the same as it does in James 2, then what does it mean?
lol
your answer please...
Does it possibly mean that belife is not the only thing needed?
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Simply put our belief... our faith is put to the test by our actions or deeds..... Dead faith... mere intellectual assent has no deeds... But living faith produces good works, but the good works don't save us.... the faith does. Romans 4:5 among many other passages makes this clear..... The context of the book of James is this: What faith looks like when it walks. His message.... show me your faith by what what you do. Good tree... good fruit
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 cont... James 2:14 ""14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?""" Can a faith that has no works save them? No because no works is evidence of a dead... intellectual faith..... You are arguing the Mormon doctrine of some list of works you can't even provide combined with faith.... If you need to add works to save you your claiming the sacrifice of Christ was insufficient.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 To prove your faith you must OBEY the commands of God...
Your video says all one must do is believe...
You argue against the Bible, not me
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """To prove your faith you must OBEY the commands of God..."""" Got a verse that actually says that? And it's interesting you'll whine till the cows come home that I wont answer James.... I do (whether you agree or not is irrelevant... at least I tried) and you wont even touch Romans 4 with a ten foot poll. My view harmonizes the scriptures.... Yours can't even begin to :') But I understand why you won't even try.... I's alright.... I get it. Cheers
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
Are you serious?
(1 John 2:3-4) And by this we have the knowledge that we have come to know him, namely, if we continue observing his commandments. 4 He that says: “I have come to know him,” and yet is not observing his commandments,IS A LIAR, and the truth is not in this [person].
Soooooooooooo,
Your video is a lie... You are telling ones that all they must do is Believe...
The Bible says the EXACT OPPOSITE...
Why do you oppose Gods word with your own?
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 (John 14:15) “If YOU love me, YOU will observe my commandments;
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 And????? I believe that. But doesn't say works save you. It states the simple fact of the new covenant and the spirit led born again man.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 You realize I could show you verses that say this, all day...???
(1 John 2:5) But whoever does observe his word, truthfully in this [person] the love of God has been made perfect. By this we have the knowledge that we are in union with him.
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """ You realize I could show you verses that say this, all day...???""" yes I do and not a single one in context nor a single one that state what you stated. How about you show me Romans 4:5?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 I thought you were a teacher...
Romans 4:5 is speaking of the 'Works of the Law'... as in the temple... that was destroyed in the first century... as in animal sacrifices and festivals, and Sabbaths and the like...
I find it odd that you are advocating that a person who does not follow Gods commands is "Saved" as long as he believes...
And using scriptures that speak of the Temple Works, and Mosaic Law being abolished to support it...
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 (Galatians 2:16) knowing as we do that a man is declared righteous, not due to works of law, but only through faith toward Christ Jesus, even we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, that we may be declared righteous due to faith toward Christ, and not due to works of law, because due to works of law no flesh will be declared righteous.
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """(1 John 2:5) But whoever does observe his word, truthfully in this [person] the love of God has been made perfect. By this we have the knowledge that we are in union with him."""
Cont..... Another verse that I say amen to... But what it doesn't say is works save you.....
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Another thing that's interesting... You claim one group is "brothers" and the other is "sheep."...... How is it then that the the sheep are "OTHER" sheep. Doesn't that make the "brothers" - uhhhh..... "sheep?" And there is only ONE fold.... Yet you have two folds.... Hmmmmm What a confusing and contradicting doctrine.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
So since we BOTH agree that Jesus was using family members as a metaphor to show how close his disciples were to him and
NOT GIVING A DEFINITION OF ANYTHING...
Now we can RE-FOCUS on the parable...
Sheep/Brothers/Goats... Not defined by the scripture you've presented int he vid (As you have stated)
1-Faithful slave that feeds
2-Domestics that are fed (Sheep)
3-Evil slave that neglects domestics
Again we have 3 Groups.... Who are the Domestics vs the Faithful slave? Another Group perhaps???
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 cont.... So Jesus was answering a question was he not?
""Sheep/Brothers/Goats... Not defined by the scripture you've presented int he vid (As you have stated)
1-Faithful slave that feeds"""""
The FDS is nowhere found in either text.... you assume it but there is no connection.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
The vid is nice, but obviously flawed...
The Scripture you present says, "... My Brother, Sister, Mother..." not merely Brother...
Nice try...
The Verse is not Jesus giving a definition of anything, as you are claiming, but rather him making a point...
Unless you are saying the Sheep are also Christs Mothers, Sisters, etc... your interpretation of this verse makes NO SENSE...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """"The Verse is not Jesus giving a definition of anything, as you are claiming, but rather him making a point...""" Jesus asks a question---then answers it, It's that simple. """"Unless you are saying the Sheep are also Christs Mothers, Sisters, etc... your interpretation of this verse makes NO SENSE...""""" Mother-brother-sister are synonyms. It's a metaphor is it not? In what sense is he using these terms? Do we have 3 classes of people here?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
WOW!
You finally get it then???
So you are agreeing that What Jesus is saying, "...Mother, Brother, Sister..." is a METAPHOR!
And NOT Jesus giving an exact definition of anything...
rather then misrepresent the scripture to mean that Jesus is defining something concretely...
I Appreciate your honesty...
(So Jesus is giving a metaphor and NOT a definition... Hmmmmm Isn't that what I said???)
:)
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """You finally get it then???
So you are agreeing that What Jesus is saying, "...Mother, Brother, Sister..." is a METAPHOR!""""
That has been my assertion from the start. I have actually even stated that to you. Please don't act as though I haven't. It's undignified and quote frankly dishonest. However the Mathew account is not a parable but a prophecy using a metaphor. Not sure why you would be surprised by that. Cont...
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Your ENTIRE position is that Jesus was giving some concrete DEFINITION of what a "Brother of Christ" is n all cases...
You have OBVIOUSLY misrepresented the scripture... Jesus is NOT giving a definition, but making a point through comparison...
The Brothers in the sheep parable are not in anyway made to fall under YOUR definition of what Jesus Brothers are...
Jesus Brothers are CLEARLY not the Sheep in the Parable....
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 """You have OBVIOUSLY misrepresented the scripture... Jesus is NOT giving a definition, but making a point through comparison...""""
Again I'll ask: Was Jesus answering his own question when he made the statement?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21
Jesus NEVER said "This is the Definition of what a 'Brother of Christ' is in all of my parables" as YOU are implying that he did...
You say there is no connection between the FDS parable and the Sheep/Goat/Brother Parable...
Ok then... by you own standard of 'Connectivity' what are you presenting to show that the scripture that Jesus compares his Mom, Sis, and Bros to his Disciples as his family, that he is define the Brothers in the Sheep/Goat Parable...
letusreason1234 1 month ago
... - and it hurts you personally when you see all the lies and approaches of people who love their own ego/lives more than God. it hurts to see all this. but everything is just as it is written in the Bible for sooo long.
HeavenClear 1 month ago
if you ever experienced such an unlogical behaviour of people who surround you or people you come across later when serving God and you are really really trying out of love for this wonderful God who is love and who sacrified his beloved son for our un-deserved salvation - but the world starts to hate you for nothing - you love them more but they hate you - then you begin to really have your own evidence of Jesus´ true words and warnings and you love him and the Almighty God even more
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@Catch22here Thank you my friend...... I agree it is all straw man. He is continually putting words in my mouth. Although to his credit he does have the guts to make videos etc.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
Psalm 109:5 "They repay me evil for good, and hatred for my friendship." - John 15:18: ""If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first.". or: Revelation 12:17. have you heard of all the hate and brutality JW had to cope with and still are being hated? how - beginning with Abel everyone who is righteouss had to cope with this hate ever since, just like the bible states from the beginning? and what is most important: are you being hated for merely wanting to serve God & doing no harm
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@HeavenClear>"all the hate and brutality JW had to cope with"
Study 1Pe3:12-17 "the face of the Lord is against them that do evil. ...For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing."
Why do JW LIE against the truth saying: in 1914 an Angelic ascended master sat down on Most High throne at right hand of God?
The truth is "the MAN Christ Jesus" 1Ti2:5-6, "the Son of MAN" sat down at right hand of God Lk22:69, the day He resurrected from the dead.
barbsinclair 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@21crosscheck21 NO!
In fact the Bible NOWHERE says that the original plan was to have humans DOMINATE the earth
lololol
that is what God said was wrong with the earth...
Man ( when dominating) has dominated man to his injury...
Your concept of """man Owning the Earth""" is Satan's Plan... Not Gods...
Gods Plan is for GOD to Rule Man, Not MAN to rule Man...
I think you should read your Bible and see what MANS! Domination has brought about...
WARS, CRIME, POLLUTION, ETC
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"Bible NOWHERE says that the original plan was to have humans DOMINATE the earth"
Gn1:26 [RADAH] 28 "Further,God blessed them and God said to them:“Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it,and have in subjection [RADAH] the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving upon the earth. ...God saw everything he had made and,look! [it was] very good”
râdâh = subjugate have dominion [dominate] reign rule over
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"lololol"
You laugh and mock Christians who tell you truth of what Bible REALLY teaches. Please stop mocking us and start hearing:
Prior to sin entering world, God's plan for man kind was to have dominion reign over earth. And God saw His plan and all creation was very good. Study Gen 1:26-31; 2:21-25
After sin entered the world, God chose One Holy and Just man, the Holy One of Israel, mankind's Redeemer Christ the Lord to have dominion in heaven and in earth Mt28:18;Ep1:21
barbsinclair 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@letusreason1234>"Gods Plan is for GOD to Rule Man, Not MAN to rule Man..."
Christ the Lord is God, He is a man, and He shall rule over men!
If you say you shall not have "this man reign over" you as God, then you are God's enemy.
Study Luke 19:11-27. God said:
v14 "But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.
...
v27 But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me."
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"I think you should read your Bible and see what MANS! Domination has brought about..."
I think you should read your Bible and see what "the man Christ Jesus" dominion shall bring about! And also understand how you and your religious rulers continually deny Him and His dominion. Christ Jesus shall rule with a "rod of iron" Psa 2, Rev12:5;19:15.
Look Rev Climax bk page 52. The painting shows other men with rods of iron, and they have Jesus holding a rod of wood!
Why is that??
barbsinclair 1 month ago
and - what is the main motivation for this video? you are annoyed to not be a broher of Jesus. this somehow reminds me personally on a "spiritual" "person" that demanded far too much glory for himself
HeavenClear 1 month ago
not badly done, sounds good - but ridiculous - he didn´t say to the crowd you are my brothers. he said it to his apostles and that is a little difference than what you are talking about..
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@HeavenClear """ he didn´t say to the crowd you are my brothers"""" And in the context of that verse where does he say they are not?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 it is too simple, can´t believe you ask: Jesus said this to the ones he chose before to be taught by him, to follow him. so, despite the fact that others did believe in Jesus and gathered to see/hear him - he did not say of them (of the ones who believed him) that they are his brothers /sisters but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@HeavenClear "" that they are his brothers /sisters but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will""" So the apostles lived a perfect sinless life from the time Jesus said this? Have ya read the bible?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 pardon?? who said that anyone on earth is perfect or can be?? I mean, your arguments are astonishingly childish for someone who tries to say something intelligent. where can you prove - without only taking fragments maybe and pointing them out in the way they please you only and the ones who are listening to you. - have YOU read the bible?? I mean, have you really read the whole bible - to me it seems you don´t even know what Jesus said and how he reacted.
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@HeavenClear (...) matthew 24:43-47 for example. and - in your own video you say it exactly the way JW understand it and what they teach people - just the way it is written in the bible, and you - yes YOU - are mentioning it but it doesn´t seem to "reach" you: you say at 3:17 - reading from the bible: "...pointing to his disciples...." matthew 12:49. and: what about what Jesus said about the ones who are going to follow him?? (...cont.)
HeavenClear 1 month ago
@HeavenClear """pardon?? who said that anyone on earth is perfect or can be?? I mean, your arguments are astonishingly childish""""" Why so surprised? You said it. And I quote: """but to the apostles who exactly followed his way, and were prepared to do God´s will"""" Again I ask.... You said they followed EXACTLY his way....... did you not?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 so, if he wanted to say that everyone who merely believed in him is brother/sister/mother etc for him - he could have shown with the finger on all the gathered people came to see / hear him and not only showing to the apostles.
HeavenClear 1 month ago
Glory to God in the Highest, and on earth peace good will toward men. For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. AMEN
barbsinclair 2 months ago
Lettuce obviously doesn't believe in (John 14:26) He is a follower of men and he has accepted this teacher as his God! His false teachers have a 100% accuracy of epic failure. They teach that the bible teaches apostasy. Now that's some fine teaching... Haha!
1914watcher 2 months ago
@1914watcher >"(John 14:26)"
Ahhh the wonderful Holy Spirit of truth, our teacher and comforter for all Christ's sheep, the brothers:
Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:
"But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." Mat23:1,8
And brother John also reminds us of these things, warning us there would be false brothers coming trying to deceive us = 1John ch2.
Peace of the Lord Jesus be with you and all in thy household
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@barbsinclair I'd like to know what Letusreason has to say about the audio clip on the video "1975 -What the Watchtower doesn't want you to know." by JWMediaFilms? I'd like to see him dance around that one!
(Audio = PROOF) Maybe he hasn't realized yet why his Awake stops at 1970 on his Watchtower library Cd?
1914watcher 2 months ago
@1914watcher Let's see how nice the GB treats "Christ's Brothers"
August 15, 2011 Watchtower (The study edition) pg 22 Memorial partakers.
This is the number of baptized individuals who partake of the emblems at the Memorial worldwide. Does this total represent the number of anointed ones on earth? Not necessarily. A number of factors including past religious beliefs or even MENTAL or EMOTIONAL imbalance might cause some to ASSUME mistakenly that they have the heavenly calling."
1914watcher 2 months ago
@1914watcher
JWs spiritual human rulers actually think, the millions of anointed disciples of Christ who were martyred for witnessing of the name Christ Jesus in just the first few centuries had "mental or emotional imbalance might cause some to assume mistakenly that they have the heavenly calling." (August 15,2011 WT pg22)
Fact is all Christians have the heavenly hope, for no one can have any hope of living forever on a paradise earth; for in Bible "PARADISE" is the third HEAVEN = 2Co12:1-4
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@1914watcher, THE GREATEST MAN bk ch17>"By the accompanying declaration from heaven, 'This is my Son whom I have approved,' God announced that he had brought forth a spiritual son having the prospect of entering into the heavenly Kingdom.Later,at Pentecost 33C.E.,other baptized ones will receive holy spirit and will thus be born again as spiritual sons of God."
Hear serpent hissing through these apostates: they say KING of the Kingdom only had "THE PROSPECT OF ENTERING INTO THE HEAVENLY KINGDOM"
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@1914watcher SO your telling me that Matthew 24, ht eParable of the faithful and discreet slave, does not have Jesus giving his Slave the order to feed his domestics???
WHat Bible are you reading ???
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"SO your telling me that Matthew 24, ht eParable of the faithful and discreet slave,does not have Jesus giving his Slave the order to feed his domestics?"
Points on Mt24:
1) its all prophesy [no parable]
2) v1-2 happened 70ad
3) v3-12 ongoing since Jesus resurrected from dead
4) v13-14 instructs dwellers on earth during tribulation period
5) v15-28 focuses on 7years of tribulation, specifically those in land of Israel.
6) v29-51 all future "after the tribulation of those days"
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@archeng123
Question for you archeng, did Matt 25:31-46 happen yet? (Note verses 31-32). Who do you think the brothers and the sheep are? Do you think these "sheep" and "brothers" are those who have been around since the 1st century and up to the day v31-32 happens?
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@archeng123
Jesus said to THE MULTITUDE & TO HIS DISCIPLES:
"But be not ye called Rabbi [teacher]: for ONE is your Master even Christ; AND ALL YE ARE BRETHREN" Mt23:1,8
STUDY:
1Pet ch 2, and Eph 2:19-22
All believers are "a ROYAL priesthood" and "fellowcitizens with the saints and of the household of God...Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;IN WHOM all the building fitly framed TOGETHER GROWS UNTO AN HOLY TEMPLE IN THE LORD..."
Go study completely those passages, and be blessed.
barbsinclair 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@archeng123>"who are"
Jn11:25-26;12:26 "where I am, there shall also my servant be"
= Father will honour all believing Christians as His "chosen generation a royal priesthood an holy nation"; royal priesthood of believers 1Pe2. Rev20:4-6"Happy and holy is ANYONE HAVING PART IN THE FIRST RESURRECTION; OVER THESE THE SECOND DEATH HAS NO AUTHORITY [Jn11:25-26;12:26], but THEY WILL BE priests of God and of the Christ, and will rule as kings and priests WITH HIM [Rom ch8] for the thousand years"
barbsinclair 2 months ago
This composite seed class of JWs of 144,001...
JWs, this teaching of your seed class, denies the virgin birth of "the Holy One and the Just", the only "seed" of the woman (Gen 3:15), the male child, Christ the Lord (Lk 2:11; Rev 12:1-10), the "HOLY" child come in the flesh without human father; Isa 7:14; 9:6-7.
You desire 144,000 sinful humans be granted unto you. Read:
Ac3:14 "But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you"
desiring 144k is far worse
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@archeng123>"who are the kings and priests?"
All believers in Christ Jesus "the resurrection and the life...shall never die at all" Jn11:25-26 = Rev20:4-6
One body together "with all that in every place" 1Co1:2 = "any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour" Jn12:26
Father shall "honour" all believing Christians: His "chosen generation a royal priesthood an holy nation"; royal priesthood of believers = 1Pe2
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@archeng123
YouTube user = JaySHess
barbsinclair 2 months ago
Perfect, just perfect! John 6: 29 could not be more plainly said for all to see, but the WTS has even messed that up: John 6:29 "... "This is the work of God, that YOU exercise faith in him whom that One sent forth."
They replace "believe" with "exercise faith" thus downgrading the importance put on believing in Jesus.
What about James 2:14,17? By their rules it should be: 14"...faith but he has no FAITH? Can that faith save him? 17Even so faith, if it has no FAITH, is dead, being by itself.
abbyguy 2 months ago
@abbyguy Exactly! (Ephesians 2:8,9)
(Hosea 6:6) (Matt 9:13).Ughh
1914watcher 2 months ago
@abbyguy I am sure that God merely wants you to believe and then you are saved right?
(James 2:19) You believe there is one God, do you? You are doing quite well. And yet the demons believe and shudder.
The Demons believe... Are they saved??? Or is it what they are EXERCISING that condemns them?
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason Did u miss this? What makes you think every homeless person is a criminal? Are there not homeless people all over the world due to famine..... national poverty.... economic collapse... little children through no fault of their own Why are you so fixated on this and hateful to those in need ?
In addition are not all sinners? Have not all sinned? Are the anointed perfected and living sinless on earth? Again I think your fixated on this as a way to avoid the real issue at hand....
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21 I didnt say that EVERY HOMELESS person is a criminal
They are not all Christians obviously though... The Muslims and Buddhists that are homeless are not Christian are not right?
What about the Junkies and the Drunkards, and Murderers?
My Point is that You, and others like you, point to this verse as some MORALITY tale as if we are commanded to go out and feed ALL the Hungry, Homeless, People in Prison
These ones in Matthew are clearly this way for PREACHING
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 "My Point is that You, and others like you, point to this verse as some MORALITY tale as if we are commanded to go out and feed ALL the Hungry, Homeless, People in Prison" Can you point me to where I actually said that? Not to where you read into a comment or an assumption based on a comment but where I actually argued that point?
Also are we not to help the Samaritan? They were quasi-pagans?
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21 Would you like to continue this conversation VIA phone for a bit?
let me know, I am free for a while and would welcome the conversation...
Thanks
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 PM your number and I'll give you a call.
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 "I didn't say that EVERY HOMELESS person is a criminal. "They are not all Christians obviously though." Christ was born in manger..HOMELESS! His very first breath of air was that of urine and manure in a manger?! He was rejected by his own people, his mother was shunned.. SOUND FAMILIAR?
1914watcher 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 >"These ones in Matthew are clearly this way for PREACHING"
In Mt25:31-46, our Lord King Jesus Christ, DID NOT SAY preaching was done. He said:
The sheep saw the brothers were hungry and thirsty and gave them meat and drink. The sheep saw brothers were strangers and naked, took them in and clothed them. The sheep saw the brothers were sick and in prison so came to them, visited them.
Its impossible these brothers are JW anointed class: for they are to do, what these sheep do.
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 >"The Demons believe [Jms2:19].Are they saved??? Or is it what they are EXERCISING that condemns them?"
You preach: there's only One SEED, but in that One SEED, there's many 144,001 person's
THAT >"condemns" you!
For you deny "the doctrine of Christ" our Saviour Christ the Lord (Luke 2:11) come in the flesh (1Jhn4:1-6; 2Jhn1:7-11), the "VIRGIN BIRTH" of ONE [not many] Gen3:15 the "seed" of the woman. Rev 12:1-11 "male child... Christ": Isa 9:6-7.
= you have not God - 2Jn1:9
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234
I hope your starting to understand the serious error of this Watchtower teaching your preaching to the public! It is not the truth of the Holy Son of God, the only 'seed' of the woman who was sent by Holy Father, come in the flesh to save mankind from their sins.
God says, ‘He did no sin’ (1Pe2:22), ‘He knew no sin’ (2Co5:20), and we read, ‘in him was not sin.' (1Jn 3:5).
STOP lying against the truth by teaching there are 144,000 sinful humans as that HOLY "Seed". Repent!
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 >"what they are EXERCISING that condemns them"
Remove your entire foundation of religious faith in 144k holy temple class; for what you are EXERCISING in THEM, shall condemn you: for its not the truth of God, its a lie of the evil one.
No elite class of 144k Christians shall rule over Christian believers on earth; there was no 1914 enthronement of an angelic ascended master on the heavenly throne.
But yes, an angel of light did pick JW org as its channel = 2Co4:3-6;11:13-15.
barbsinclair 2 months ago
Please don't spam letusreasons1234's comments.
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21
Ya. I was having trouble finding LUR comments because they were spammed. I really want to read what he has to say. I'm thinking it would be awesome to hear discussions on this with the brethren; record it and upload to YouTube. This is a very important doctrine of God, so much so that it actually effects the salvation of those who place their trust in the teachings of JWs "faithful and discreet slave and its governing body." It moves trust in salvation from God's Words to men's.
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@barbsinclair The Bible clearly says how you treat Christs brothers is how you treat them....
Corinthians 9:17) If I perform this willingly, I have a reward; but if I do it against my will, all the same I have a stewardship entrusted to me.
As Christs Stewards, if we do not follow them, we do not follow him!
The Bible says this clearly... How can you miss it?
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234>"Christs brothers"
I'm a brother and disciple of Christ Jesus, a Christian Ac26:11. Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:
"But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." Mat23:1,8
Therefore, brother John rightly warns of "the FALSE brothers" (Gal2:4) trying to mislead Christ's innumerable brothers:
"the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU, and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU"
Study 1Jn2
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234
The Word of God says this clearly...
Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:
"But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." Mat23:1,8
YOU ARE ALL BROTHERS
Therefore, brother John rightly warns of "the FALSE brothers" (Gal2:4) trying to mislead Christ's innumerable brothers: "...the anointing that YOU received from him remains in YOU, and YOU do not need anyone to be teaching YOU" 1Jn2
How can you JW, miss THAT?
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234>"Christs Stewards,if we do not follow them, we do not follow him!"
"AS EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT, MINISTER the same one to another, AS GOOD STEWARDS of the manifold grace of God.If any man speak,[let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister,[let him do it] as of THE ABILITY WHICH GOD GIVES: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."1Pe4
All believers are Steward followers Jesus Christ!
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@barbsinclair I agree, we all have the duty of receiving our spiritual food from Jesus Faithfull slave and sharing it with others...
But...
How does that in ANY WAY show Biblical that we are to be RULERS with CHRIST as Kings???
It only shows that we represent him, as belongings to the Slave...
Where does the bible say that ALL Christians are KINGS or RULERS???
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"we all have the duty of receiving our spiritual food from Jesus Faithfull slave"
That's your JW "sacred duty", not mine. I reject JWs human rulers as antichrists.
Our household have received Jesus Christ Himself: JWs "received him not" Jn1:11-13
My fellowship is with Father and Son and like precious believers we are taught directly by Holy Spirit of truth 1Jn ch1&2. Our household are sons of God Rom8, we shall never die Jn11:25-26;12:26, receiving 1st resurrection = Rev20:6
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"Where does the bible say that ALL Christians are KINGS or RULERS?"
Rv20:6"Happy and holy is ANYONE having part in THE FIRST RESURRECTION: over these the second death has no authority, but they will be priests of God and of the Christ,and will rule as kings with him for the thousand years"
= Jn11:25-26 "EVERYONE" believing in Christ Jesus "the RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE...shall never die at all" ="FIRST RESURRECTION"
"ONE BODY" of believers with "ONE HOPE of calling" Eph ch2&4
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"we represent him, as belongings to the Slave"
No.
JWs never represent the man Christ Jesus. Every JW represents their human religious rulers and its organization. Not one of JWs, including all JW human rulers, not one represents Son of God Jesus Christ; for you all admit:
WT 2/15/1964 p109>"They [JWs] came to appreciate that they were a people, not for the name of Jesus"
Every JW is a person not for the Name of Son of God Jesus Christ. None of you people represent Him at all.
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"Where does the bible say that ALL Christians are KINGS or RULERS?"
BIBLE teaches "RESURRECTION" only refers to PHYSICAL "flesh and bones" BODY. Bible NEVER teaches spirits & souls be resurrected from dead; spirits & souls are not subject to physical death being non-physical
YET JW human rulers teach a past resurrection of spirits: Rev Climax pg124-125,pr16-17 = Their as Hymenaeus & Philetus: read 2Ti2:16-18
1st resurrection Rv20:6, of believers Jn11:25-26, hasn't started yet
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"belongings to the Slave"
IMPORTANT:
The Mt24:42-51 selection by our Lord and Master Christ Jesus HAS NOT HAPPENED YET; it happens at "the judgment seat of Christ":
Rm14:10-11"FOR WE ALL SHALL STAND BEFORE THE JUDGMENT SEAT OF CHRIST. For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God."
Study 2Cor ch5 "For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ" = 1Pe4:17
JW dogmas surrounding dates 1914-1919 are LIES
barbsinclair 1 month ago
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@letusreason1234
After reading what I posted you today please read again:
1Pe4 "AS EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT, MINISTER the same one to another, AS GOOD STEWARDS of the manifold grace of God.If any man speak,[let him speak] as the oracles of God; if any man minister,[let him do it] as of THE ABILITY WHICH GOD GIVES: that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."
"EVERY MAN HAS RECEIVED THE GIFT" = 1Jhn 2:24-29; 3:1-10
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"if we do not follow them, we do not follow him!"
My Lord and Master said:
"The disciple is not above his master, nor the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord." Mat 10:24-25
You shall be as those whom you follow. Look in the mirror, your lords and masters can only give to you what they themselves have: sin and corruption leading to destruction.
Your following false shepherds that cannot give you the life.
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 """Corinthians 9:17) If I perform this willingly, I have a reward; but if I do it against my will, all the same I have a stewardship entrusted to me."""" Paul is talking about himself in this verse is he not? What does that verse have to do with the other sheep? Was Paul one of the other sheep? Was the way he treated himself a determining factor in His eternal life?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
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letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 All Christians have the Job of Teaching others about Christ and God... As we receive our Spiritual Food from the faithful slave, we share with others...
Are you trying to argue that Witnessing and Teaching about God is NOT the duty of ALL Christians? We believe it is... As the bible says it is...
Where does that Bible say that ALL Christians are to be RULERS???
Where does the Bible say that ALL Christians are to be KINGS???
Where doe it say that???
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 ""Are you trying to argue that Witnessing and Teaching about God is NOT the duty of ALL Christians? We believe it is... As the bible says it is...""" I have no idea what you're talking about. Not only did I never say that I teach evangelism classes.
""Where does that Bible say that ALL Christians are to be RULERS???
Where does the Bible say that ALL Christians are to be KINGS???"""
Will not the meek inherit the earth... was not Adam/children to have dominion?
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 NO!
In fact the Bible NOWHERE says that the original plan was to have humans DOMINATE the earth
lololol
that is what God said was wrong with the earth...
Man ( when dominating) has dominated man to his injury...
Your concept of """man Owning the Earth""" is Satan's Plan... Not Gods...
Gods Plan is for GOD to Rule Man, Not MAN to rule Man...
I think you should read your Bible and see what MANS! Domination has brought about...
WARS, CRIME, POLLUTION, ETC
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Show me .... PLEASE..... Where MANKIND was to make their OWN rulings... to have their OWN dominion as you say...
lololol
this concept is laughable...
please provide the verses that support it....
........lol.........
letusreason1234 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 "Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness, so that they may rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky, over the livestock and all the wild animals,[a] and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
That is what men rule over..... God rules over men.... Men have rule over earthly things..... do they not?
Interesting how willing and eager you are to be ruled over by men and woman..... but not God :')
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 Cont..... Just so I can be as snarky as you let me add my apology.... I had assumed you had read the bible.... my bad.... LOL Take care my friend. We'll chat soon.
21crosscheck21 1 month ago
(Galatians 6:10) Really, then, as long as we have time favorable for it, let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to [us] in the faith.
letusreason1234 2 months ago
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letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 ""and you outright contest the Bible?"""" I'm not contesting the bible i'm contesting your interpretation of the bible.
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21
Really? In the Parable Jesus EQUATES these 'Brothers' with HIMSELF, saying
"To the Extent that you did it to one of THESE, you did it to me" making it clear who they are.
'Christians' Witnessing for God and Christ (Revelation 20:4) not Criminals.
Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? Literal 'Homeless Drunks and Drug Addicts' and 'Criminals' who have been arrested for crimes committed?
You feel that is who Jesus Equated himself to? Or Christians?
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 "Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? " To the redeemed and those he will redeem. "Just who, or What are YOU EQUATING CHRIST WITH? Literal 'Homeless Drunks and Drug Addicts' and 'Criminals' who have been arrested for crimes committed?""' What? They cannot be redeemed? They don't deserve a glass of water? Did not Jesus eat with tax collectors and feed the 5000? Were they all brothers?
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21
So they are a group of Christians being persecuted as Christ was for preaching the truth, or they are as YOU say, 'Merely Homeless Criminals who the Sheep have to be good to'
You honestly advocate that we should support poverty and drug addictions?
Or does the Parable teach that we should support CHRISTIANS?
The Sheep Support those in (Revelation 20:4), not Homeless criminals, and they get life for it.
The goats do NOT support the ones in (Revelation 20:4)
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 cont...... """You honestly advocate that we should support poverty and drug addictions?""" Ahhh when did I say that?
Did you know the pharisees had the exact same attitude?
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21 When you agreed with babrsinclair that the sheep and brothers were the same and were lost homeless and didn't come to know Jesus until they suffered some tragedy...
Doesn't sound like Christians to me...
So we gain life by supporting those who are NOT YET Christians, and their bad habits???
The we EQUATE them with CHRIST???
You lost me...
Jesus NEVER advocated being poor or a criminal. He said HIS FOLLOWERS would become that way because the world hated them
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 "So we gain life by supporting those who are NOT YET Christians, and their bad habits???""" No, we gain life by faith in Christ..... and we demonstrate that faith by showing mercy, even to those who don't deserve it. Certainly you know what the word Grace means don't you? And what makes you think reaching out to needy people HAS to mean helping them in their sin? Again.... that's what the pharisees taught... that why the priest wouldn't help the worldly Samaritan.
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
@letusreason1234
This entire teaching of your religious rulers on Mat 25:31-46 is laughable at best. Do you seriously believe that your 144k (who really is the governing body of JWs a group of men at WT headquarters in NY USA). Do you really believe the sheep have to FEED GIVE WATER CLOTH AND VISIT THEM To receive everlasting life from our Saviour Jesus Christ?
Stop being so gullible and read the passage! When is the last time you gave food, water and cloths to a JW governing body member? lol
barbsinclair 2 months ago
@barbsinclair SO when yo are clearly WRONG about something you simply change the subject?
Is that How you operate? :)
Have you been executed by an Axe???
Please show me where in the Bible it says that these ones in Revelation 20:4 are EVERYONE that believes in Christ and not ONLY those whom i describes as Witnessing and dieing by execution...
Bible verse please?
Oh, and please don't change the subject... It ruins your credibility
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 >"SO when yo are clearly WRONG about something you simply change the subject?"
I never changed subject; I'm staying in Mat 24&25, and how your human rulers LIE by inserting themselves into God's prophetic Word 24:44-46; 25:31-46
What's clearly WRONG, is ALL your JW religious dogmas surrounding the years 1914-1919! There was no 1914 enthronement of an angel on the Most High heavenly throne; and the Son of Man, the man Christ Jesus 1Ti2:5-6, NEVER had invisible parousia in 1919!
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234>"where in the Bible it says that these ones in Rev20:4 are EVERYONE that believes in Christ"
JW human rulers LIE in Rev Climax pg290-291, par16,17,18: saying "The First Resurrection" and 1Co15:53 ONLY applies to them; that they alone conquer “the second death"!
What apostate liars!
Rv20:4-*6 *"ANYONE"
*IS*
Jn11:25-26 *"EVERYONE"!
ALL, EVERY believer who received Jesus Christ Jn1:11-12, also receives First Resurrection conquering because of "OUR FAITH" in Christ = Rm8;1Jn5:4
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@letusreason1234 >"you agreed with babrsinclair that the sheep and brothers were..."
Brother Brian and I agree "the sheep" Mt25:31-46, and "the little flock" Lk12:32, both have EXACT SAME INHERITANCE GIVEN THEM. It is written:
Lk12:32 "Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom"
Mt25:33-34 "Then shall the King say unto them [sheep] on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world"
barbsinclair 1 month ago
@21crosscheck21 Christs brothers are those who Christ EQUATES with HIMSELF...
What did Jesus Do???
(Revelation 20:4) And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 cont... why are you quoting Rev 20:4.... The verse says NOTHING about brothers..... You are making a giant leap with no evidence.
21crosscheck21 2 months ago
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letusreason1234 2 months ago
@21crosscheck21 Really???
So it is YOUR position that the ones being spoken of on Revelation 20:4 are NOT Christs Brothers?
Interesting...
So those who were executed for Speaking about Jesus and God are NOT Christs brothers to YOU??? Is that what you Teach?
Very Very interesting...
letusreason1234 2 months ago
@letusreason1234 >"Christs brothers are those who Christ EQUATES with HIMSELF"
All Christ's "disciples" called "Christians" are His brothers, Ac11:26 "it was first in Antioch that the disciples were by divine p