i like the deck, you should try to sideboard terminates and maybe infest but i would use volcanic fallout just for the dmg and if thats not working im sorry lol
Change Demigod to Torrent of Soul and Incinerate to Hell's Thunder did you see your mana curve gets a little bit high besides, bitterblossom, Spectral token, Wall of Reverence even mulldrifter blocks it any lifegain wreck the Hell's Thunder strategy when Incinerate clears path for your creature one other thing kithkin deck turn 1 height, 2 cenn 3 spectral, turn 4 activate or cast mirrorweave means GG (20 damage if unblock) siege-gang deals 12 damage on turn 6 by itself
I think you´d be better off with Profane Command than Torrent of Souls, you can get him back and kill some blocker, but yea if you are playing Bitterblossom it maybe better. I´ve seen this deck has not been seeing a lot of play lately, mostly because stupid Wall of Reverence and other White cards. Any way just to contribute for an optimum list I think Goblin Oultander and Stillmoon Cavalier must be MD.
i agree. freaking wall. terminate is getting reprinted; that will help big time. i think the only draw back to stillmoon is mog. mog is in brew and there so much brew that stillmoon won't stick around too long. this deck def' still has the potential...just not sure it's going to have the goods to go all the way even w/ the addition of alara reborn.
Yeah that is ture, Stillmoon is weak against Red, you will just have to SB in him against that matchup, and get out some anti Boat Brew tech (Relic of Progenitus, Infest, you name it). While he is quite useless againt Boat Brew, he works wonders against a lot of decks (Dark Bant specially) cuz of his Pro Black n´ White and his morphlingish abilities.
Well, I play this deck all the time (the Demigod version) and I think that Demigod is overall better because you don't mind it getting countered as much. It gets recurred when you play another one which is an out that torrent doesn't have.
Yeah, I like this deck a lot because of the sideboard possibilities. I've been trying to run infest or volcanic fallout as a four of, and I'll work in a torrent in this weeks FNM. After boarding against aggro, making this deck less aggressive and more control might be the key. I mean it has bitterblossom and the best recurring five drop. Aggro decks lose steam at stage 3 of game play, and that's where the torrents are most likely to shine.
Demigod is somewhat a bad card now that Path To Exile beats it, but it's still one of the best five mana creatures in the format.
And Bitterblossom is the best two drop in the format. It gives you a 1/1 each turn. It's a pro-active card that gives you threats without using up mana. It's good, and isn't slow at all.
BB is an iffy call. it's not absolutely clear to me that it's THE play for this deck. it's good, don't get me wrong. i just wonder if there aren't better options.
demigod is not as good anymore. there's WAY too much black/red hate (path, purge...)
maindeck - 2 viv crags 7swamps 7mnts 4graven cairns, 4 sulf springs. 2Shmaws 2 figures, 4shamblings remains, 4hellsparks, 4demigods, 4flame javs, 4 incinerates, 4bitterblossoms, 4dark tempers, 4blightnings,||||| sideboard, - 1 shmaw, 4volc fallouts, 4 guttural response, 2 vexing shushers, and 4 fulminator mages. i like that set up because im managing about 9-1 with it, only thng i lose to is 5color control and thats why i sideboard all that stuff. what do you think of that?
sounds pretty sweet. i need to get my new list up. i'm wondering about the bitterblossoms and the dark tempers. is it necessary to have spot removal? i went a more goblin route...i'll have to get it up soon!
I've heard a lot of people say Hell's Thunder is a great card, but no one at my local card shop actually plays it. Then again, I'm fairly sure only two people even have a Red Deck together (small group of FNM players, usually around 12 people).
I've only played a friend's Demigod Red, and I personally don't like the card. Either my opponent is dead before I can play my second Demigod, or I am.
In theory, I like your build more, and I think the black splash for Blightning is the way to go.
WOW!,Sounds like alot of fun, I'm more of a tree hugger LOL, well was, but I do miss this, & it sounds like they brought alot more interesting things with the new sets, GL wit all you MTG
I just saw the deck, and after playing rdw for about a month I like it. My advice is to not change a thing in the deck. DO NOT ADD HELL'S THUNDER!!! That card is SOOO bad its not funny. Why is it bad? It doesn't have trample. On turn three you want to play gourger, save mana for flame javalin, play blightning, or make figure a 4/4, Ultimately thunder is 8 mana for 8 damage. Not good. Also torrent of souls is no where near as good in this deck as in tokens. Keep in demigod's and incinerates.
He may not have haste, but he's a 4/4 for 3 mana that dodges a lot of removal like terror, any 3 damage spell, and is a really aggressive creature. This deck is super aggressive and he fits in just fine. He swings more than hell's thunder and if people chump block him then okay then he's a removal spell on a stick. You can side him out, if they do nothing but chump block, for things like infest and thoughtsieze, and against aggro decks he's awesome. Take 4 damage or lose a creature?
Demigod is also key to this deck. He fits so much better in this deck than torrent. He has haste and evasion, and is easy to play. He's the reason the deck runs 24 lands, so you can hit 5 lands on turn 5 and play him. After playing with this deck I found I never had more than 3 creatures out turn 5. I know torrent can work well with the blossom, but Demigod works better with the whole deck.
I think it kind of pulls the deck in two different ways. But using the Bitter blossom, which I like btw, you are able to get a quicker critical mass of creatures on the board. Those tokens work perfectly with what Torrent wants to accomplish. But on the other hand Demigod is more aggressive and fits better in an aggressive deck. If you're going for quicker beats i would go demi, if you want a longer game go with Torrent.
Btw you can play thunder, torrent thunder, and unearth thunder. 12+ ;)
the deck needs a 2 drop, and while bitterblossom is the best one in standard, you still need 1 more. your options are either deathraiders or stigma lasher. Deathraiders will get more damage in against decks that don't run many creatures, but stigma lasher takes care of life gain which can be a nightmare for rdw. I think deathraiders maindeck and stigmalasher sb is a nice choice. Also for side board I would recommend everlasting torment in the sb.
The problem is everlasting torment is a MUST HAVE. It gets around pro red creatures, runed halo, and kitchen finks, all of which cause major problems for this deck. Burrenton Forge-tender is a HUGE problem for rdw. So if you don't take everlasting torment out then what? Stigma lasher, run him main? He is a bear. He does have wither, so he can get threw on damage, but i don't know if he is better in this deck than the deathraiders. I haven't played this version though so I'm not sure
i definitly agree that everlasting torment is a must-have. i've never been much of a stigma lasher fan. it's too slow. lol. i mean, seriously...why doens't it have haste? it's a rare for goodness sake. it's ability is screaming "give me haste!" lol
hat is true but it does have wither and an unusual ability, rareity is not bnecisarily defined by power, but more by its bombiness or crapiness in limited,
wizards makes stuff rare because they dont want it to show up often in limited,
however i agree it should have haste.
but it kills finks in combat and screws alot of decks after just one hit,
i wouldn't use more than 2 torment as it is a dead draw after you get 2.
yeah...stigma lasher is probably a MD card...but maybe only because finks is in 3 out of 5 highly played decks (two remaining: 1 is faeries, the other RDW).
oh yeah, i was totaly unaware that it did that, i was using pithing needle,although pithing also deals with planeswalkers it dooesn't deal with the tender, i totally didn't realise it delt with pro red, thx man.
I really wouldn't run torrent of souls. Maybe sb or something. I don't know, I'm going to start play testing this guy today and I'll see what happens. Two things I noticed is that this deck needs mogg fanatic, and puncture blast somehow. Also, it shouldn't run 4 ghitu encampmants. You don't want to be runing 8 citpt lands, and unless you have tarfire in hand Auntie's hovel is a citpt land (come into play taped). Maybe take out tarfire for mogg fanatic.
so far as lands, i think basics are fine. two x ghitu max. like you said, citpt is far, far, far from what this deck wants. part of me wants to say that any lands citpt are no-nos. it's _only_ two color deck. hitting the right lands shouldn't be that big of an issue.
mogg is good. not sure i'd take it over tarfire though.(debate??) i think puncture blast is a great suggestion. the wither is what makes that card so effing viable beause it's such a finks hater.
i like the deck, you should try to sideboard terminates and maybe infest but i would use volcanic fallout just for the dmg and if thats not working im sorry lol
chrisv2121212 2 years ago
vincent27038988 2 years ago
I think you´d be better off with Profane Command than Torrent of Souls, you can get him back and kill some blocker, but yea if you are playing Bitterblossom it maybe better. I´ve seen this deck has not been seeing a lot of play lately, mostly because stupid Wall of Reverence and other White cards. Any way just to contribute for an optimum list I think Goblin Oultander and Stillmoon Cavalier must be MD.
XXmetalforlife777XX 2 years ago
i agree. freaking wall. terminate is getting reprinted; that will help big time. i think the only draw back to stillmoon is mog. mog is in brew and there so much brew that stillmoon won't stick around too long. this deck def' still has the potential...just not sure it's going to have the goods to go all the way even w/ the addition of alara reborn.
power9pro 2 years ago
Yeah that is ture, Stillmoon is weak against Red, you will just have to SB in him against that matchup, and get out some anti Boat Brew tech (Relic of Progenitus, Infest, you name it). While he is quite useless againt Boat Brew, he works wonders against a lot of decks (Dark Bant specially) cuz of his Pro Black n´ White and his morphlingish abilities.
XXmetalforlife777XX 2 years ago
you have a new subscriber sir
polkadotedfish 3 years ago
just need to get my butt back to making vids. pretty darn time consuming.
power9pro 3 years ago
Well, I play this deck all the time (the Demigod version) and I think that Demigod is overall better because you don't mind it getting countered as much. It gets recurred when you play another one which is an out that torrent doesn't have.
lKILLGIANTS 3 years ago
that's absolutely true. i dropped the torrent. just didn't have the umph. strictly a SB card against agro decks mabye. ???
power9pro 3 years ago
Yeah, I like this deck a lot because of the sideboard possibilities. I've been trying to run infest or volcanic fallout as a four of, and I'll work in a torrent in this weeks FNM. After boarding against aggro, making this deck less aggressive and more control might be the key. I mean it has bitterblossom and the best recurring five drop. Aggro decks lose steam at stage 3 of game play, and that's where the torrents are most likely to shine.
lKILLGIANTS 3 years ago
im really stoked to see somebody playing magic that dosnt make us all look like nerds...gives me hope :P
polkadotedfish 3 years ago
lmao. i'll take that as a compliment. :)
power9pro 3 years ago
I've become convinced that Demigod is unnecessary in here.
Same for Bitterblossom. Too slow.
SaoPauloOrBust 3 years ago
Demigod is somewhat a bad card now that Path To Exile beats it, but it's still one of the best five mana creatures in the format.
And Bitterblossom is the best two drop in the format. It gives you a 1/1 each turn. It's a pro-active card that gives you threats without using up mana. It's good, and isn't slow at all.
lKILLGIANTS 3 years ago
BB is an iffy call. it's not absolutely clear to me that it's THE play for this deck. it's good, don't get me wrong. i just wonder if there aren't better options.
demigod is not as good anymore. there's WAY too much black/red hate (path, purge...)
power9pro 3 years ago
agreed. i'll get my list up soon. I SWEAR. lol.
power9pro 3 years ago
maindeck - 2 viv crags 7swamps 7mnts 4graven cairns, 4 sulf springs. 2Shmaws 2 figures, 4shamblings remains, 4hellsparks, 4demigods, 4flame javs, 4 incinerates, 4bitterblossoms, 4dark tempers, 4blightnings,||||| sideboard, - 1 shmaw, 4volc fallouts, 4 guttural response, 2 vexing shushers, and 4 fulminator mages. i like that set up because im managing about 9-1 with it, only thng i lose to is 5color control and thats why i sideboard all that stuff. what do you think of that?
nickiscool5656 3 years ago
sounds pretty sweet. i need to get my new list up. i'm wondering about the bitterblossoms and the dark tempers. is it necessary to have spot removal? i went a more goblin route...i'll have to get it up soon!
power9pro 3 years ago
have i played against you before? maybe met you somewhere?
carthwolf 3 years ago
I've heard a lot of people say Hell's Thunder is a great card, but no one at my local card shop actually plays it. Then again, I'm fairly sure only two people even have a Red Deck together (small group of FNM players, usually around 12 people).
I've only played a friend's Demigod Red, and I personally don't like the card. Either my opponent is dead before I can play my second Demigod, or I am.
In theory, I like your build more, and I think the black splash for Blightning is the way to go.
TripwireBeast 3 years ago
WOW!,Sounds like alot of fun, I'm more of a tree hugger LOL, well was, but I do miss this, & it sounds like they brought alot more interesting things with the new sets, GL wit all you MTG
vampb1tch 3 years ago
I just saw the deck, and after playing rdw for about a month I like it. My advice is to not change a thing in the deck. DO NOT ADD HELL'S THUNDER!!! That card is SOOO bad its not funny. Why is it bad? It doesn't have trample. On turn three you want to play gourger, save mana for flame javalin, play blightning, or make figure a 4/4, Ultimately thunder is 8 mana for 8 damage. Not good. Also torrent of souls is no where near as good in this deck as in tokens. Keep in demigod's and incinerates.
dragonian18 3 years ago
sorry for misspelling, really tired.
dragonian18 3 years ago
gouger doesn't have haste. it's also a ground creature so it can run into burton tender-feet all day...
power9pro 3 years ago
He may not have haste, but he's a 4/4 for 3 mana that dodges a lot of removal like terror, any 3 damage spell, and is a really aggressive creature. This deck is super aggressive and he fits in just fine. He swings more than hell's thunder and if people chump block him then okay then he's a removal spell on a stick. You can side him out, if they do nothing but chump block, for things like infest and thoughtsieze, and against aggro decks he's awesome. Take 4 damage or lose a creature?
dragonian18 3 years ago
also, i didn't mean to imply that gouger is gone. took out demigod for the torrent o souls.
power9pro 3 years ago
Demigod is also key to this deck. He fits so much better in this deck than torrent. He has haste and evasion, and is easy to play. He's the reason the deck runs 24 lands, so you can hit 5 lands on turn 5 and play him. After playing with this deck I found I never had more than 3 creatures out turn 5. I know torrent can work well with the blossom, but Demigod works better with the whole deck.
dragonian18 3 years ago
right on. thx for the feedback! :)
power9pro 3 years ago
my pleasure
dragonian18 3 years ago
I think it kind of pulls the deck in two different ways. But using the Bitter blossom, which I like btw, you are able to get a quicker critical mass of creatures on the board. Those tokens work perfectly with what Torrent wants to accomplish. But on the other hand Demigod is more aggressive and fits better in an aggressive deck. If you're going for quicker beats i would go demi, if you want a longer game go with Torrent.
Btw you can play thunder, torrent thunder, and unearth thunder. 12+ ;)
carthwolf 3 years ago
i think deathraiders should be replaced with incinerate.
that is a valuable card you are taking out for hell's thunder it needs to go back in.
see the thing is with raiders they cant attack till turn 3 and they'll probably only attack once.
bobudess 3 years ago
the deck needs a 2 drop, and while bitterblossom is the best one in standard, you still need 1 more. your options are either deathraiders or stigma lasher. Deathraiders will get more damage in against decks that don't run many creatures, but stigma lasher takes care of life gain which can be a nightmare for rdw. I think deathraiders maindeck and stigmalasher sb is a nice choice. Also for side board I would recommend everlasting torment in the sb.
dragonian18 3 years ago
noez stigma main
STIGMA MAIN
and also shusher board,
also having 7 or so slots devoted to preventing liffe gain is stupid just use 4 stigma m,ain.
bobudess 3 years ago
The problem is everlasting torment is a MUST HAVE. It gets around pro red creatures, runed halo, and kitchen finks, all of which cause major problems for this deck. Burrenton Forge-tender is a HUGE problem for rdw. So if you don't take everlasting torment out then what? Stigma lasher, run him main? He is a bear. He does have wither, so he can get threw on damage, but i don't know if he is better in this deck than the deathraiders. I haven't played this version though so I'm not sure
dragonian18 3 years ago
i definitly agree that everlasting torment is a must-have. i've never been much of a stigma lasher fan. it's too slow. lol. i mean, seriously...why doens't it have haste? it's a rare for goodness sake. it's ability is screaming "give me haste!" lol
power9pro 3 years ago
hat is true but it does have wither and an unusual ability, rareity is not bnecisarily defined by power, but more by its bombiness or crapiness in limited,
wizards makes stuff rare because they dont want it to show up often in limited,
however i agree it should have haste.
but it kills finks in combat and screws alot of decks after just one hit,
i wouldn't use more than 2 torment as it is a dead draw after you get 2.
bobudess 3 years ago
yeah...stigma lasher is probably a MD card...but maybe only because finks is in 3 out of 5 highly played decks (two remaining: 1 is faeries, the other RDW).
power9pro 3 years ago
oh yeah, i was totaly unaware that it did that, i was using pithing needle,although pithing also deals with planeswalkers it dooesn't deal with the tender, i totally didn't realise it delt with pro red, thx man.
bobudess 3 years ago
but it's okay if it only attacks once. i mean...that's why i put in torrent of souls. bring that B- back, naw meen? ;-)
power9pro 3 years ago
I really wouldn't run torrent of souls. Maybe sb or something. I don't know, I'm going to start play testing this guy today and I'll see what happens. Two things I noticed is that this deck needs mogg fanatic, and puncture blast somehow. Also, it shouldn't run 4 ghitu encampmants. You don't want to be runing 8 citpt lands, and unless you have tarfire in hand Auntie's hovel is a citpt land (come into play taped). Maybe take out tarfire for mogg fanatic.
dragonian18 3 years ago
so far as lands, i think basics are fine. two x ghitu max. like you said, citpt is far, far, far from what this deck wants. part of me wants to say that any lands citpt are no-nos. it's _only_ two color deck. hitting the right lands shouldn't be that big of an issue.
mogg is good. not sure i'd take it over tarfire though.(debate??) i think puncture blast is a great suggestion. the wither is what makes that card so effing viable beause it's such a finks hater.
power9pro 3 years ago
but you can target incinerate and it is slow,
it is screaming "give me haste"!!!
bobudess 3 years ago