IMO Monkeys who 'believe' in HeyZeus et al SHOULD be locked up in lunatic asylums. I don't care how/why they might happen to feel threatened by my opinion, I care only that I am offended (and physically threatened) moment-by-moment by their willful ignorance, deliberate delusion and abject fear of experiencing an actual life.
Because we don't fear their god and we're not scared of hell and we're not impressed with their bible quotes. This upsets their power structure and poses a great risk to it's existence. The higher ups see this danger. The sheep just hate us for our freedom.
Well in my opinion, belief comes from a kind of insecurity about life and other people to begin with. You fear the uncertainty of life, and the unpredictable nature of people, so you adopt a belief that puts it all into a more polarized perspective, you can blame it all on sin. So Christians being offended by atheists probably results from a fear of people who dont think like you, and are thus unpredictable.
In my experience, I've noted it is a strategy to silent you through psychological manipulation, because they can't do it physically (even if they wanted to). Most of the time they dont know how to respond to your critiques and are so arrogant and proud that can't admit to others when their reasoning is flawed.
@H2drO34 A male estrogen imbalance? WTF is that supposed to mean? So your view on the matter makes you more of a man? That's the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Typical of people like you though. I'm not wasting my time anymore.
Wow H2dr034 you just showed us that religion has no place at the grounds... You also just proved to us that religion is a major cancer to our society as we all fight towards a better future that one day will be rid of this immature bronze age way of thinking. Bravo for showing us your anger when all we were having was a pleasant back and forth... but as soon as someone disagrees with your religion your true colors and hate come through... Bravo for proving us right
Wow H2dr034 you just showed us that religion has no place at the grounds... You also just proved to us that religion is a major cancer to our society as we all fight towards a better future that one day will be rid of this immature bronze age way of thinking. Bravo for showing us your anger when all we were having was a pleasant back and forth... but as soon as someone disagrees with your religion your true colors and hate come through... Bravo for proving us right
@H2drO34 The 911 cross has been carried around as a religious shrine, and was displayed in front of a church for years. It is a blatant endorsement of the Christian religion and we all know damn well that if it were a star of David or some other religious symbol from a non-Christian religion, Christians would be screaming bloody murder about it and using the exact same argument that atheists are using which is that religious symbols are not to be displayed on government property, so save it.
@H2drO34 It's not just atheists that feel that way. What about the people who were Buddhist or Hindu or of other faiths? Why should Christianity always trump other faiths? Because you're Christian? The framers of the Constitution made sure there was a separation between church and state. Do you not think that going against the Constitution (which is the basis for our government) and using religious symbols for people killed in a terrorist act done in the name of religion is not hypocritical?
Personally, in future I'm going to show a good deal less respect to religious nutjobs. They can carry on going on about this that and the other, it doesn't affect me, but if anyone gets in my face they'll soon realise, that no, I don't believe, haven't done for over 40 years and I'm hardly going to change my mind now. Religions, all of them, get way too much respect and tolerance, especially when you consider that they don't even have any proof.
H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just Christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
I think deep down many christians doubt there is a god and are playing it safe. When you question the existence of their god they are forced in some way to face the possibility that all the BS they go thru is for nothing. People are afraid of death christians bury they head in a bible to escape their fear
Part 4: The next thing you learn is how personable God is. You begin to learn how to fellowship with him, the God of the universe…how exciting is that?! Oh yeah, God is real and above all, he’s eternal and wants us to share eternity with him. There are millions of people who have experiencing the Lord. So why go after something as ridiculous as evolution, who cares, God is so beyond the physical realm that nothing else matters! We’ve been destined to walk in the supernatural…come see!
Part 3: Part 3: The first thing you experience is the love of God, it’s goes beyond our love, his is unconditional where ours is not. His love washes over you in many different ways. He actually speaks to us, leading and guiding. God is not hiding as many suppose, quite the contrary, he’s involved in all aspects of our lives, but few recognize his voice. The more you learn of him and his word, the more you fall in love with him...
Part 2: God has already told us his ways are higher then ours and his thoughts are higher then ours. So why is it so difficult to believe that God is smarter then us? He has his own way of sorting out those he’s called to share eternity with him? God is infectiously wonderful, beyond all that you could imagine. So wonderful, you simply can’t contain it! But, it’s only the beginning; there is so much to learn about Him and how the kingdom of God works in our lives.
Part 1: Your question is interesting, but when a person actually surpassed the speculation of evolution by experiencing the reality of the Lord, you simply can’t keep it to yourself. Your eyes are suddenly opened to the spiritual realms of God. You somehow realize all that was said about God and His Son were true! Things begin to happen where before they where hidden from you. Also, you’re somehow catapulted in to a supernaturally brotherhood of fellow believers.
@motlencore89: "Im a christian with athiest friends"
No, you're an idiot with atheist friends.
If you believe in an invisible, immortal, telepathic being who created the entire universe in a few days, you're an idiot. Your friends most likely laugh at you behind your back.
@mikefromwa wow dude, your setting an example of how mature and well maintained atheist people are suppose to be.your a fucking immature dip shit know it all who thinks he understands life when he hasn't been alive long enough, or seen enough to even touch the fucking surface. Us Christians are suppose to be offended by atheist, you seem to be the one with the fucking issue. Go enlist in the Marine Corps when you turn 18, because your obviously not right now. that'll send any man praying.....
@motlencore89: You christians are all deluded idiots, and your obvious distress at being outed as fools is clearly evident in your ranting and cursing. Go pray to your magic man for some serenity and inner peace. You really ought to stop believing in stupid fairy tales- look how cranky it's making you. :) lol
"that'll send any man praying."
Anyone dumb enough to believe your nonsensical baloney, that is... :) lololol
@motlencore89: "Us Christians are suppose to be offended by atheist, you seem to be the one with the fucking issue."
You christians are offended by anyone who dares to disbelieve in your crazy-ass story. Atheists usually just laugh at people like you who live in a magical world where a telepathic sky-daddy reads your mind night and day. Don't blame me for your idiotic beliefs, or the fact that you can't tell fantasy from reality. :) lolol
PS: You cursed, so now you're goin' to hell! hahahah
I think maybe you are being attacked due to the athiest Rhetoric which pervails today. For example Dawkin's book "The God Delusion" is offensive. He says the God of the old testament is $%^%%^&^... etc. This is God, the Father. What if someone said that about your Father? Or someone you loved. If you want to get serious about philosophy read "Economic Science and the Poverty of Naturalism: C. S. Lewis’s “Argument from Reason”
@FromAcrossTheDesert What prevails is Christian nonsense attacking nonchristians.
Before you attempt to hold anyone responsible for offending your Father, you need to show your Father exists.
C S Lewis offers no proof & no good argument & does not argue from reason. He serves infantile pablum to the choir that is not the slightest bit convincing to nonbelievers yet for believers, seems to give them a leg to stand on. Same as the utterly ridiculous Evidence
@FromAcrossTheDesert (cont) Same as the utterly ridiculous Evidence That Demands A Verdict & Know Why You Believe neither of which offers any evidence.
I think maybe you are being attacked due to the athiest Rhetoric which pervails today. For example Dawkin's book "The God Delusion" is offensive. He says the God of the old testament is $%^%%^&^... etc. This is God, the Father. What if someone said that about your Father? Or someone you loved. I believe this battle is a dogmatic battle of a supposed conflict which is filled with ignorance. The rable vs. the plebs. Read C.S. Lewis' "The Poverty of Naturalism".
Christians, Atheists...same problems, DIFFERENT CHURCHES! Thats my point.
Sorry about the copy/paste error below! I was responding on the go from my iPhone, got a little tricky there. Ignore the second comment, then put the rest together. you'll figure it out. ; )
...they're defending who they are. The truth of the matter is, Christians have their faith in God, ie, the bible, and Atheist have their faith in Science. Both suffer from the same identity crisis: same problems...different churches.
I think both Christian “believers” and Science( theorist) “believers” are equally concerned with asserting their identities. I think that both types of believers are "personally" invested in their views; Ideas become who they are: their worth, their position in society. Self-value is often easily ...they're defending who they are. The truth of the matter is, Christians have their faith in God, ie, the bible, and Atheist have their faith in Science. Both suffer from the same identity crisis: s
I think both Christian “believers” and Science( theorist) “believers” are equally concerned with asserting their identities. I think that both types of believers are personally invested in their views; Ideas become who they are: their worth, their position in society. Self-value is often easily challenged by others, by strangers...people who don't even matter. Just evidence of how weak our sense of self really is.
The Atheists and Christians are not vigorously defending their point of view,
From experience I would say it is a knee jerk reaction on the part of the faithful who don't type with thought but from emotion. Too often we are told we are stupid, weak minded, "less evolved" (which is interesting that a particular member of this species which should evolve more or less as a whole could somehow be way behind yet literate) and my favourite that if all of us believers were killed the world would be a happy peaceful place. Link those comments to atheism often enough and "pavlov"!
@Strangerinasland I'm not sure if you're asking me which individual atheists on line have stated that or if you are asking if some have made the claim. I have seen the statement by at least 6 different people in the past month. If you want user names I would have to go looking for the them as I didn't jot it down.
@MsColdCanada I can understand not having those usernames handy, of course.
I've been exposed to thousands of atheists online, in person, thru books, etc & I've never known an atheist to say that. I have seen people misunderstand & claim an atheist said that when it was clear they didn't. I can't say no atheist would say that.
Theists have told me the same thing but with atheists being killed. Christians have told me the same thing but with nonchristians being killed.
@Strangerinasland When I see it again I will try to remember to come back here and reply. I have also seen people who claim various faiths say it and it saddens me when they do also. Advocating mass murder because of differing principles is horrific no matter who suggests it. I would like to think that they aren't serious but there are some very mentally ill people logged in from day to day.
"over 6 million people died at the hands of the inqusition alone... and the communists were very bad, but not as atheists... they had other motives like the religious leaders today... they all speak lies, are money grubbers and they are destroying a great country with their non-realistic crap... we need to do like the inquisition and kill all the preists and preachers.....
@Strangerinasland Here's another (will take two parts to paste) Islam is a dangerous death cult, a machine for terror and suicide bombers. A permanently offended global crybaby bully. Its time to cleanse earth from this filth. Deport all muslims and islamics back to the desert and send over a weapon that will quickly do the job that needs to be done.
@Strangerinasland continued... Muslims are cowards, in the act of bullying or the inaction required to prevent it. Ill take one strip of juicy crispy bacon over the lives of 2 billion islamics without a care in the world. Christians next.
I think they get offended bcuz when u say u don't believe in god your really saying much more than that. Your saying that u think they're wrong in their beliefs. Your saying that they believe in something that is non-existent which would make them gullible & foolish. Your saying all their prayer is for nothing. Your saying their grandma isn't really in heaven. Your saying they've been lied to all of their lives.
I am not offended at any non believer or those of different beliefs, or combinations of them. When people get offended, I think it's due to stereotypical thoughts about that person. Sad, and I wish it didn't happen. I mean if you are so easily offended at the fact your friend or family member doesn't believe in God, is it because you somehow are fearful just that person's presence will make you believe in god less? If so...you have some thinking to do.
I see little reason to feel personally offended if an individual merely states he/she does not believe in God. This is a decision and responsibility related to any given individual per se. Our disagreement would be with the characterization that an individual's belief in God is mythology. Perhaps the latter is where offense is often taken?
My own guess is that they're so used to having total dominion that the idea that anything might threaten their total hegemony over public life means that anyone who doesn't accept their superstitions means that they want the faith outlawed, banned, etc.
I'm a non-believer who is offened by believers simply because their beliefs don't make any sense. Imagine if somebody told you that you thought Attila the Hun was an immortal, omnipotent deity and that they honestly believed that. That is my reaction: I am scared by the lack of logic. However, it is not my opinion that anybody should be punished for religious belief, I simply think that people should have modern educations so that they don't believe in religious texts and such.
RabidApe, I'm a Christian, and I'll try to explain how I see things:
A Christian, if they follow instruction from the Biblical teachers, should understand that we're not supposed to trouble someone outside of the Church. The same people that do this also don't seem to as of yet understand faith. Faith is for what faith produces! It's like saying someone who doesn't go to school is against learning. They missed the point that they went to school learning, to learn something specific.
@krononomikon I like that you said "believers" with the quotes, because it shows that not the greater part of instruction is understood.
They should know that
1) preaching is considered foolishness to the world
2) the best way to attract someone to faith is to show them the fruit of it, and be ready to explain it
3) judgement starts in the Church
A good example is the recent May 21st ridiculousness! And I was afraid many people would blaspheme because of H.C.'s ridiculous, unbiblical prediction
@krononomikon For instance, not only is Revelation misunderstood, but parts of Jesus' words are completely thrown away. Not only does he set a time for the day of Yahweh, but he also sets the hour! Not only that, he, in opposition to Daniel and Revelation, says the reason it didn't come is 'cause it was delayed until October. He'd rather lie than call himself wrong! Jesus says of people who say "the time is near", don't follow them... and many, also unlearned, do just the same...
@krononomikon About it going against other books, it's outlined that the reason He returns, or that He takes up the people, is because they're all being KILLED and it's so that not everyone is destroyed, but "there will be no more delay".
As far as your atheist friend assuming what he did about you, that's the same with those so-called Christians: taking a name to justify their own ideas, rather than being honest to seek the truth. Now what I believe is different, but it's not my job to kill!
@krononomikon It's all summed up in the state of the human condition, wickedness, and "the lie". If they understood Revelation, the Kingdom of God, and the Holy Spirit, they would know that you don't see God because He is spiritual, and His Kingdom (rulership) can't be SEEN with eyes - it's an internal rule. What they should be doing is hoping for and trying to usher righteousness and truth, rather than bringing in groupies. Now, not to subtract from what I believe either, but I will also...
@krononomikon ...I will also say that (and I just realized these postings will have to be read backwards, sorry) they and all should thus understand that Him returning and ushering in His kingdom would be to destroy man's wickedness and bring about God's righteousness. Those who make excuses for sins and greediness and filthiness like "prosperity gospel" preachers, they're worse-off than someone who's never come to know God. But, to conclude, and to prove the point not only of the Bible but...
@krononomikon ...but also to prove what I'm saying, take a look at the propoganda against Christianity: people running around without any idea what's going on, people greedy and making excuses, believing lies, behaving ridiculously, and adding NOTHING to anyone... Jesus Himself said "many are called, but few are chosen". Therefore, it's not only no surprise that human beings are human beings, but that's what it was all about anyway. The ignorant will be beaten less, but the knowing more...
@krononomikon To sum up, I think the reason there is personal offense is because they are humans, and they don't understand why others do things, or even what they should be searching for (the Kingdom). They should be offended by sin and wickedness and corruptness, and should be willing to love perfectly like God, who gives rain and sun to every person, whether thankful or unthankful - to pray for people who use them! the Spirit shows inwardly that this was God's speech all along - also Jesus
I'm an atheist so this isn't necessarily the comment you are looking for, but in my experience it boils down to this: The extremely religious don't see a difference between religion and science. The bible tells them how the world works and science says something else. The people pushing for evolution in the classroom and not creationism are suppressing the religious one's view. Then, slippery slope it to all religion is outlawed.
I don't get offended. I believe and you don't, no problem, I believe that God will judge all and you don't. I believe in the Bible and that America was founded on Christian values and morals, and anyone that chooses to believe in God shouldn't be slammed or have their beliefs bashed. I believe that anyone should be able to choose their religion. One thing though, when you say "mythology" instead of " theology", it seems you are looking for an argument. Just saying.
It is not that we Christians take 'offense' at non-believers but that we are saddened by them. Men without God acting in their lives are foolish, harming themselves and others through sin and miss out on God's love, goodness and wisdom in our mortal lives and of course have no chance at eternal life.. All Christians have walked in the shoes of the sinful, lost man and we know something of what is possible through Jesus. Die in your sins and you will feel foolish when you meet the God you deny
@BondiHarry "Men without God acting in their lives are foolish, harming themselves and others through sin" - it is AMAZING that you make this allegation without a second thought, and we should not be offended, but anything and everything atheists say and do offends christians.Why should we have any respect, or even tolerance, for hateful people like you?
@BondiHarry So, because i don't believe in YOUR personal imaginary friend, i'm harming myself? And what eternal life are you talking about? Got any evidence to support that one, or even for your imaginary friend? You don't, and this is why faith is needed, because religions DO NOT have any evidence for their absurd extraordinary claims. Why should we respect something that deliberately belittles human intellect while stunning believers with psychological blackmail to keep them in line? Absurd.
@BondiHarry If your god wants to be loved and be believed in so damn much, why doesn't he simply show himself instead of setting really stupid tests and demand gullibility in order to magically pop "in your heart"? Isn't he supposed to be omniscient? Because if he's actually omniscient, and lets all the crap in the world happen, he's pretty fucked up. More like a kid burning little worms with a magnifying glass than a loving father. So much bullshit in religion....
Im an agnostic/evangelical christian, i don't get offended if yo do no't beleive but atheists tend to play the smart role and offend you saying you'r ridiculous etc...
@FlaiteOne I'm sorry for what you've been put through then. I'm personally a Unist, but hate when people try to force it down each others throat. Most of the time when you say evangelical, the atheists will assume your gonna try to convert them. At least they are fighting for equal rights.
@UseYerEFFINBrain When you say that you don't trust the Catholic Church to say things about morality, do you also distrust and refuse to accept the advice of smoking doctors who say you should stop smoking to improve your health? What about obese doctors, would you refuse to go on a diet if an obese doctor told you that you had diabetes and needed to lose weight? Thank you.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Just because people call themselves Christian it doesn't mean they are really being Christian their whole lives. Christianity is very difficult to follow. However I believe that in the same way everyone should go to university to improve their education and thinking skills, everyone should strive to be morally better. In traditional Christianity that is a main tenet. You seem to judge all and I guess you think you are morally good by your own standards.
Stop fighting and type in "Chuck Norris takes on a bear." It is much more exciting watching a man of steel take on a massive beast with his "bear" fists.
@SolidSnake3131 I prefer fighting with SONY Fanbois! I was told by one that a boutique Sony Vaio is tougher than a military grade Panasonic Toughbook. :-) You know even Chuck Norris couldn't rip a Panny up but a Vaio, well he eats them for breakfast :-).
They believe so much or at least tell themselves this that they cannot understand why someone does not.They only have to understand and compare why they do not believe in other gods.That is why we do not believe in theirs.
Ever notice..there are very few if none "old" or "aged" atheists? I find that curious...very curious. And atheism is NOT evil...and btw, what nutcasee useryerffinbrain says is untrue. The right has taken over, the country and our beliefs. Check Methodism, Lutheranism, and the milder protestant groups. You'll find much more tolerant people
I've seen too many people making the argument that atheism is evil because some dictator did evil things and was an atheist. That argument is like saying that all men are serial rapist killers because the "Green River Killer" was a man.
Anyone that claims Atheism is evil should take a course in logic because atheism has no doctrine. However some religions are atheistic such as Buddhism and Scientology.
So, the next time you want to say something like 'Atheists are the reason this world is a wreak'.....Look in a mirror and remember your hands aren't really sparkling clean either.
......Granted that Soviet Russia and N. Korea have a bit of state-worship in the mix doesn't change the fact that NONE of the countries or dictatorships haven't done anything that wasn't done by a theist (christian or otherwise) I won't defend what happened under their watch but you can't just say that ALL fault lies with atheism, or other religions. However if you're going to play that game, remember that believers started the crusades, the inquisition, among others.....
Hitler was a catholic, in fact the Nazi motto was 'Gott Mit Uns' (God With Us). Communism and atheism are NOT synonymous. Yes, Stalin was an atheist, that doesn't mean that every Soviet was as well, that's like saying before 1997 everyone in Hong Kong was English. As far as the East Asian Communist states you mentioned goes.....they are ALL Buddhist.....
@BusinessSuitBob Hitler may have been a Roman Catholic, but it meant nothing to him. He attempted to establish a neo pagan religion in Germany, hearkening back to some teutonic mythology; he commanded millions to be killed, and that is just the tip of the iceberg with that freak. Hardly the actions of someone even remotely devout. When did I saw ALL fault lies with atheists? I did not. I took exception to the notion that all fault lies with people of faith, whatever form that might be.
I am only offended when Christians personally attack who I am based off my beliefs or lack thereof. And even then... not really. Because it's hard to get offended by an ignorant, intolerant person who insists I'm just an evil bastard who will burn for all eternity.
@thedayitriedtodie We don't hate that which we don't believe! We hate idiots making empty claims, then telling us to just have faith, in your empty claims...
I think a lot of it stems from the fact that atheism is truly a new concept to many people. Not to say in anyway that atheism is a new concept but rather we are just now getting into times where people are more open about it. Then you have folks like Dawkins and Hitchens that, while have great points, are pretty abrasive to religion. So that's what believers see and when they hear the word "atheist" that's what they refer back to. I like their theories but they really give atheist a bad rap.
It's because they've been taken for a ride and are afraid, or don't have the balls to admit it. Just because flies congregate to a pile of bullshit doesn't make them right, but their delusions (a load of crap) certainly do enjoy company.
I think believers are offended by non-believers because religious beliefs are so flimsy, and atheists represent the possibility that they could be wrong. The only thing that keeps them going is the assurance that so many other people believe what they believe.
If everyone acted like they believed in the Easter Bunny and I believed it too but then everyone revealed that they were just playing a joke on me, I sure would look silly. Religious beliefs are no less silly, so they need the assurance.
I am an atheist. I am not offended by other people's beliefs in principle
I am "offended", if we want to call it that, by stupid beliefs that harm society
For example, I am OFFENDED by the belief that women are inferior to men (1 cor14:34). I am offended by the belief that we should murder our children if they misbehave (Exodus21:15) I am offended by slavery (Exodus21), etc
I don't care if people believe in invisible pixies, as long as those beliefs don't translate into MAJOR social problems
Hello, where have you been for the 20th century? NAZI Germany, Communist Russia, Communist China, Communist North Korea, Communist Vietnam, et cetera? ALL of these states were and are fundamentally and atheist, and likewise their leaders: Lenin, Hitler, Stalin, Mao...
hundreds of thousands died under these brutal regimes, in the name of "progress" and in the cult of the state.
Atheists advocate questioning authority and skeptically examining data. Do you think that THAT is what Nazi fanatical soldiers were doing too much of?
It's PRECISELY the opposite. The problem is obedience to appointed authority and blind faith in dogmatic ideology, whether religious or political
Unjustified faith in Hitler, unjustified faith in Jesus, unjustified obedience to Stalin, unjustified obedience to the Pope. Same thing. Anytime people stop thinking critically, millions die
@UseYerEFFINBrain as an orthodox, i find that opersonally inslting, because i dont believe in those things and i get the feeling youd be hard pressed to find someone who does.
alot of us have changed even in the last 30 years most of us, infact id say those anti woman etc are a major minority.
Oh, sorry. I didn't realize you were one of those Christians who think the Bible sucks
If you agree that those Bible passages that promote slavery, murder, rape, etc, are DESPICABLE, if you agree that the Bible is a HORRIBLE, VIOLENT, SINISTER, PERVERTED book, then we're on the same page.
You can be a Christian as much as you want, as long as you don't follow the Bible. As long as you don't burn gay people, stone women, own slaves, etc.
in truth, it was cuz of exodus i knew that acacia (the plant family that includes the australian wattles) was not just confined to australia, since they specificly mention acacia in the instructions to make the tabernacle etc.
(my version is called 'the good news bible')
now those parts i like about the bble, all the rich craftsmanship, and the epic conflicts.
Whatever. The Lord of the Rings is a million times better.
And either way, you can't pick and choose. Either it's the word of God (including the parts that are pro rape, pro murder, pro slavery, pro stabbing pregnant women in the belly) or it's just a book.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Your logic is slightly flawed when it comes to" in the name of atheism." If that is the reference, then I say when was the last time anyone did anything in the name of Thiesm. Regardless of if an action was right or wrong, everyone does it in the name of there moral compass. When you are part of a religion you cite that as a justification. Again regardless if it the action is correct or not. Now if you are an atheist then an equal statement would be--
"When you are part of a religion you cite that as a justification". That is true.
If there wasn't a religion telling you to burn gay people alive, you wouldn't do it.
That's why religion is evil.
There are SO MANY evil things religious people do all the time that non-religious people would never dream of doing
You are exactly right. Religion removes the necessity to think for yourself, and you just follow orders, burning people alive, just because your priest tells you to
@UseYerEFFINBrain "If there wasn't a religion telling you to burn gay people alive, you wouldn't do it." do you have scientific evidence to back that up? "Religion is evil" - is evil a valid concept in atheism?
Things religious do - like acts of charity? "Religion removes the ... think yourself" this begs the question. Do you have proof? Burning people alive - could you cite some proof of this? "Disgusting" - as as atheist you should not use emotion as a logical argument.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Do you have scientific evidence to show me that literal Bible reading is a significant motivator in a significant number of cases and that there were no other motivators. Dude, I've attended Church my whole life and never have I heard an anti-gay or anti-anyone else sermon, much less one advocating any violence. Evil is not a valid concept in atheism.
Evil IS a valid concept to atheists. Evil is that which harms society. This is my second time saying that.
Do I have scientific evidence to show that a literal reading of the Bible is a significant motivator in committing atrocities? YES. Here it is: Christians burn hundreds of thousands of people alive. Atheists don't.
Is this positive evidence that there were no other motivators? NO. But it's a VERY compelling case nonetheless.
Christian: STOP BUNING PEOPLE ALIVE! IT'S EVIL TO DO SO!
@UseYerEFFINBrain Evil is not a valid concept. Evil is a Judeo-Christian concept. In atheism there is no evil or good, everything is relative. You have no rationale to judge anyone and you're using what is called a weak form of argumentation called 'argument from outrage'. You do not have any scientific evidence. In science we do not consider evil. In psychology or psychiatry there is no category called evil.
@UseYerEFFINBrain "Is this positive evidence that there were no other motivators? NO. But it's a VERY compelling case nonetheless." this is unqualified nonsense. If we published such stuff in NEMJ we'd be laughed out by the community. Come up with something better or admit you're just as dogmatic as the people you hate.
@UseYerEFFINBrain You forget that this justification must pass a very critial analysis of your motivations. This must be done before you can use it for justification. More often then not, christianity stops you from acting evil. If you still want to do evil, that is when one must stop following there religion and follow the atheistic philosophy of choosing what is right for yourself. Once this is done, they can throw off the yolk of morals and commit evil without hinderence from religion.
@UseYerEFFINBrain "I did this because I believe it to be right to me." Any athiest who has ever killed anyone, had then did it in the name of themselves. This is an adequate parallel. Theism is the major catagory and chrisitan, muslim, jews, or what ever are the sub catagories. Atheism is the major catagory and each individial atheist is the subcatagory. I do agree that it was wrong for the protection of pediphiles.
Both atheists and theists kill for all sorts of reasons. On top of all the reasons an atheist has for killing, a theist has an extra reason - the invisible man in the sky
Either way, don't try to make this an hypothetical argument based on semantics. Look at the facts. How many people were burned at the stake in the name of common sense and critical thinking?
How many were burned at the stake in the name of Jesus or Mohammed or Abraham?
@UseYerEFFINBrain Your logic is flawed. People can be burned in the name of anything, they were killed in the French Revolution in the name of reason BTW. But many more people are killed in the name of freedom and safety. Should we do away with freedom and safety too? God is not defined as an invisible man in the sky. I post this: an atheist only does not kill because of the law. A theist will not kill because his religion is against murder and it's against the law. Did Jesus ask for killing?
"Did Jesus ask for killing?" Yes. Again, read the Bible.
Matthew 11:20 - Jesus condemns three cities to torment
Revelations 19:13-15 - Jesus wears a robe stained with blood, and uses a sword and an iron scepter to kill thousands
Revelations 19:20-21 Jesus throws people in the lake of fire, and kills more with a sword
You are ADORABLE, in the way you pretend to know about a book you've never even read, but if you try to talk with grownups, it's best to READ THE BOOK BEFORE EXPRESSING OPINIONS!
@UseYerEFFINBrain Those passages do not say that Jesus asked anyone to kill in His name.
So even if God kills some people, it does not follow that He wants me to kill people too. In fact Christians are told to LOVE THEIR ENEMIES. Which most don't do, but that's beside the point.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Christians kill in spite of their religion. Christianity does not advocate the killing of anyone except in self defence. Atheism says Christianity is bunk, but anything else is OK. Many atheists turned to Bolshevism in Russia and killed tens of millions in the name of a new society. They wanted to spread this to the whole world. Look at the facts yourself. A serious Christian will not kill anyone. A serious atheist is neutral towards killing.
@UseYerEFFINBrain You heard of Roman Catholicism? Read up about it. What does it say about these verses. Can you quote anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church which supports these points?
Secondly you do know that ancient Israel was a theocracy (no seperation of church/state) and thirdly can you cite some evidence showing those motivations to be the sole motivations for acts of violence directed against their supposed targets?
@UseYerEFFINBrain First of all, beleaving in Christ give you strength to do what is right and it gives you multiple extra reasons to not kill. And secondly you imply that being athiest is equal to having common sence and critical thinking. These are mutually exclusive. You can be an atheist or theist and have or have no commom sence or critical thinking. I believe your hate of theists is bluring your logic.
I agree, you can have irrational atheists, rational theists, etc. But OVERALL, the higher your IQ, the less religious you are, the higher your level of education, the less religious you are. That's just a fact
Yes, sometimes religion can give you the strength to do what is right, sometimes it can give you the "strength" to do something bad, like fly a plane into the twin towers
Regardless of whether religion helps or not, the fact remains that IT'S NOT TRUE that Jesus walked on water!
@UseYerEFFINBrain Many people who are smarter think they can solve problems on their own or reject Christianity as a priori because it seems crazy to them. There is a snobbish that sees some people (usually poor pseudo-intellectual academics) want to rise above their peers, they are as poor as their plumber religious neighbours so they elevate themselves by deluding themselves they don't need faith. Other people just don't see the logic in the traditions of the church.
@UseYerEFFINBrain IQ/atheism: I'll be honest here. I know many educated people and very few are wise across the whole spectrum. Some are hyperspecialised, and many make common assumptions and have worldviews which are heavily influenced by misinformation and often emotion. A guy who is a great physicist but pontificates on philosophy or politics often does it badly. Christianity is about humility, you can't study your way to God.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Dude, you don't know much. Instead of ranting and raving perhaps you could read up some real history or obtain a real education. Eh?
@nomyturn I agree and will add more.Christianity is actively pro-dignity of life, pro-marriage, pro-freedom, anti-murder, anti-rape etc. Atheism has no stance on those. It presupposes NO GOD and therefore WE MANKIND can do what we want for the sake of advancement (whose?) and have no conscience/soul to protect nor a God to answer to.Our morals are relative.Even our mind processes cannot be trusted(for they are random electro-chemistry) and we have to create arbitrary,fleeting purposes for life.
@UseYerEFFINBrain If you're an atheist why are you not a rocket scientist? Well that's your answer.
Why should divorce rates of people who think they are Christian be lower. BTW Christianity does not make life easier and yeah Catholics and Lutherans have same divorce rates as your atheist crowd.
When the Christian message comes in church (1 hr/week) but practical atheist message comes across in media (TV, movies, pop culture) where is the blame?
@UseYerEFFINBrain No. You presumed that just because people identify themselves as "Christian" they will miraculously have better lives. Just because you are an atheist does not mean you will be exceptionally smart or educated. Nothing personal. I am showing you the fallacy of your reasoning.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Freedom - I don't know why America has so many ppl in jail but perhaps it is an effective police force. In my country a woman is raped every 21 seconds and we have relatively few people in jail, most of those rapes go unpunished. Again, just below a religion preaches something it does not mean that automatically its adherents (we know nothing of how serious they are in their adherence) will be spared of being bad or good. People who murder disregard God (practical atheism).
@UseYerEFFINBrain BTW I was speaking about freedom from political oppression and not mere freedom from any form of incarceration. You should't have thrown that example. It's illogical. In your country you have a lot of relative freedom, civil rights, etc and you have a huge rich-poor gap. It can be a driver for crime. Your cops are definitely very effective though and your prisons are luxury hotels compared to E/European/Russian/Asian/African/South American prisons. Your prisoners are better off
@UseYerEFFINBrain Practical atheism = behaving in a way as though God does not exist. If you contend that people kill gays for God you should contend that they will not commit adultery or watch porn for God. Yet people do that all the time, including lying, stealing etc - because our morally relativistic secular/Godless society advocates it. These people derive their morals from non-religious sources i.e. they behave as atheists deriving their morals from non-Christian sources.
@UseYerEFFINBrain "pro-torture stance" - Christopher Hitchens is pro water boarding. Is he not a real atheist. PZ Myers does not see new born babies as human persons. He says they are meat. Surely the logical conclusion of atheism is that we're meat and have no inherent dignity? If we come from nothing and have no worth, why even bother? Only because the law punishes crime? Is lt fair to punish crime if humans are merely DNA replicators / mere accidents /meat?
Well. Fuck Christopher Hitchens. Of course he's a real atheist. But just because he is right in saying that there is no invisible man in the sky, doesn't make him right in EVERYTHING, and doesn't make him a representative of all atheists on ALL topics
Your argument: Hitchens is atheist + Hitchens is pro water boarding = Atheists are pro waterboarding
That's as stupid as saying: Hitler has mustache + Hitler is a genocidal maniac = People with mustache are genocidal maniacs
@UseYerEFFINBrain No. You said that Christians advocate torture, I said that so does the atheist called Hitchens. You have some unscientific view of life there. Your dogma tells you that atheists are immune to doing bad things, which is what your insinuating. Empirical data disagrees with you. In fact as an atheist you should not value human life if you're purely atheist because atheism per se does not recognise any value in humans. I could say you're being specist.
@UseYerEFFINBrain "When was the last time an atheist killed someone SPECIFICALLY IN THE NAME OF ATHEISM?" When was the last time a theist killed someone specifically in the name of THEISM?
@UseYerEFFINBrain pro-slavery = Christians helped abolish slavery in the British Empire and later in the USA. Anti-woman - all women in my Catholic family have university degrees, but sure how is being pro-family and anti-abortion anti-woman? What if the fetus is female? pro-rape? - Er Christians have been urging for higher penalties for rape in the US. anti-gay = not anti-gay but considering homosexual sex sinful, pro torture - Catholic Church is anti-torture as are most churches.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Institute for Psychological Therapies - Vol 4, 1992. Read up about the trade in child pr0n in Europe and how most opposition to it was from Christian political parties while secular and left wing parties opposed banning kiddie pr0n for many years. That surely is pro-rape and anti-woman. Christians have always been against sexual exploitation of women and children in porn. Feminists will agree that porn is bad for women. Do you still deny that Christians are anti-woman?
@UseYerEFFINBrain Google for the Institute for Psychological Therapies - Vol 4, 1992. It's a secular online journal. You know online journals, don't you? Those things we scientists read and publish in.
Well, by abolishing slavery and allowing women to get an education, Christians are DISOBEYING the word of God, because the Bible clearly says that we should have slaves, and that women are inferior beings to be treated as cattle, and that they're not even allowed to speak in church.
So the christians who are pro woman, anti slavery, anti-rape etc, are so DESPITE the teachings of the Bible, not because of them.
@UseYerEFFINBrain Well you may not know this but you're incorrect. In terms of my faith called Roman Catholicism, i.e. the people who assembled what you call the Bible (don't trust Protestants here hehe) we have a thing called a Magisterium which interprets that Bible. Nowhere in the Catholic teaching is education for women forbidden, nowhere is slavery supported and nowhere is rape supported. Secondly the Protestants have a good defense against the debunked argument you've used too.
Have you ever read the Bible? Nowhere is slavery supported? Really? You're going to say that? And you're not going to care that you are breaking the "Thou shalt not bear false witness" thing? Really?
Have you ever read the Bible? Seriously bro, have you?
@UseYerEFFINBrain Don't presuppose that Communism/Bolshevism is the only ideology which can emerged or from an atheist worldview. There have been atheists like Jim Jones (cult leader and mass killer) who started their own cults or atheists like Mussolini who cut deals with the Vatican. Sure, there are even wonderfully good and gracious atheists such as Marie Curie who lost faith when her mother died. There are also conservative and liberal atheists who are good. Theism also leads to the Amish.
@UseYerEFFINBrain wow i just read the posts between u and puragu..,and i have to say that I think that you want to beleive this evil thing about the Bible soooo much that you don't bother understanding what real Christians believe. You dogmaticaly stick to some old idea someone told you long ago and follow it blindly, instead of having a productive conversation. Go find a chrisitan you can talk to(not argue with) and do it knowing the other person is attempting to live a good life not evil.
Here is the fact: The BIBLE is pro murder, pro rape, pro genocide, pro slavery and pro misogyny
I agree that most Christians don't follow those teachings. They think they are a crock of shit
If by "real Christian" you mean a "person who disagrees with 90% of the teachings of the Bible", then I agree that I could have a productive conversation with him
I know most Christians are trying to live a good life. But if they followed the Bible, they wouldn't be able to.
@UseYerEFFINBrain You don't seem to know Christianity. I suggest you read up about it.
The laws of the OT included slavery because that was normal practice then. You did not have to keep slaves but the laws implied treating your slaves, your fellow free men and foreigners justly. If you're going to look at these laws through a modern POV, you are going to be mistaken.
i enjoyed this vid
xtremetom180 1 day ago
some really good stuff here
shellybirdy 1 week ago
great video thanks
msjessypp 1 week ago
you have some great stuff here
rodswebdesign 2 weeks ago
i enjoyed this vid
grisgrisy 2 weeks ago
really informative and interesting
chrispikeyp 2 weeks ago
brilliant video
xtremetom180 2 weeks ago
IMO Monkeys who 'believe' in HeyZeus et al SHOULD be locked up in lunatic asylums. I don't care how/why they might happen to feel threatened by my opinion, I care only that I am offended (and physically threatened) moment-by-moment by their willful ignorance, deliberate delusion and abject fear of experiencing an actual life.
lonewolfmtnz 1 month ago 2
Because we don't fear their god and we're not scared of hell and we're not impressed with their bible quotes. This upsets their power structure and poses a great risk to it's existence. The higher ups see this danger. The sheep just hate us for our freedom.
fdasherv 2 months ago 6
Well in my opinion, belief comes from a kind of insecurity about life and other people to begin with. You fear the uncertainty of life, and the unpredictable nature of people, so you adopt a belief that puts it all into a more polarized perspective, you can blame it all on sin. So Christians being offended by atheists probably results from a fear of people who dont think like you, and are thus unpredictable.
Staunts 2 months ago 5
In my experience, I've noted it is a strategy to silent you through psychological manipulation, because they can't do it physically (even if they wanted to). Most of the time they dont know how to respond to your critiques and are so arrogant and proud that can't admit to others when their reasoning is flawed.
cre599 3 months ago
@H2drO34 A male estrogen imbalance? WTF is that supposed to mean? So your view on the matter makes you more of a man? That's the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Typical of people like you though. I'm not wasting my time anymore.
JandBMan312 3 months ago
Wow H2dr034 you just showed us that religion has no place at the grounds... You also just proved to us that religion is a major cancer to our society as we all fight towards a better future that one day will be rid of this immature bronze age way of thinking. Bravo for showing us your anger when all we were having was a pleasant back and forth... but as soon as someone disagrees with your religion your true colors and hate come through... Bravo for proving us right
sandsoftime17 4 months ago
Wow H2dr034 you just showed us that religion has no place at the grounds... You also just proved to us that religion is a major cancer to our society as we all fight towards a better future that one day will be rid of this immature bronze age way of thinking. Bravo for showing us your anger when all we were having was a pleasant back and forth... but as soon as someone disagrees with your religion your true colors and hate come through... Bravo for proving us right
sandsoftime17 4 months ago
@H2drO34 The 911 cross has been carried around as a religious shrine, and was displayed in front of a church for years. It is a blatant endorsement of the Christian religion and we all know damn well that if it were a star of David or some other religious symbol from a non-Christian religion, Christians would be screaming bloody murder about it and using the exact same argument that atheists are using which is that religious symbols are not to be displayed on government property, so save it.
JandBMan312 4 months ago
@H2drO34 It's not just atheists that feel that way. What about the people who were Buddhist or Hindu or of other faiths? Why should Christianity always trump other faiths? Because you're Christian? The framers of the Constitution made sure there was a separation between church and state. Do you not think that going against the Constitution (which is the basis for our government) and using religious symbols for people killed in a terrorist act done in the name of religion is not hypocritical?
JandBMan312 4 months ago
They are "offended" because it means that YOU think that THEY are WRONG!
... and they CAN'T be WRONG, about ANYTHING!
LeoAutodidact 4 months ago
Personally, in future I'm going to show a good deal less respect to religious nutjobs. They can carry on going on about this that and the other, it doesn't affect me, but if anyone gets in my face they'll soon realise, that no, I don't believe, haven't done for over 40 years and I'm hardly going to change my mind now. Religions, all of them, get way too much respect and tolerance, especially when you consider that they don't even have any proof.
daverigby23 4 months ago
H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just Christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
sandsoftime17 4 months ago
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H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
sandsoftime17 4 months ago
H2dr034 It is an insult to all religions and atheists to put a cross in the 9/11 museum many different kinds of people died that day not just christians whom feel that they should be honored and what makes it a joke is if the world was rid of this religious nonsense, 9/11 would never have happened... I say put the sign up and show the sheep that god was not there that day or any other day... But that is just my opinion, there are many other valid reasons
sandsoftime17 4 months ago
Keep it up Body . But if by some chance you come across page 37 of Dr.Maurice
Rawling's book "To hell and back". or more convincingly renown communist
scientist (google those names) Dr. Azzacove non-believers, you'll draw con-
clusion that hell does exist and you be on your way to salvation.
sPitternaut 5 months ago
I think deep down many christians doubt there is a god and are playing it safe. When you question the existence of their god they are forced in some way to face the possibility that all the BS they go thru is for nothing. People are afraid of death christians bury they head in a bible to escape their fear
Xatasha6611 5 months ago
Thumbs up for the Dawn of the Dead poster :)
ViCe2999 5 months ago
Helge129: It's without doubt you have a learning disability!
I suggest you keep at it, sooner or later, you'll learn something you never knew. ;-)
Kindly said
1LonePuma 5 months ago
Part 4: The next thing you learn is how personable God is. You begin to learn how to fellowship with him, the God of the universe…how exciting is that?! Oh yeah, God is real and above all, he’s eternal and wants us to share eternity with him. There are millions of people who have experiencing the Lord. So why go after something as ridiculous as evolution, who cares, God is so beyond the physical realm that nothing else matters! We’ve been destined to walk in the supernatural…come see!
1LonePuma 5 months ago in playlist Hail Atheism
Part 3: Part 3: The first thing you experience is the love of God, it’s goes beyond our love, his is unconditional where ours is not. His love washes over you in many different ways. He actually speaks to us, leading and guiding. God is not hiding as many suppose, quite the contrary, he’s involved in all aspects of our lives, but few recognize his voice. The more you learn of him and his word, the more you fall in love with him...
1LonePuma 5 months ago in playlist Hail Atheism
Part 2: God has already told us his ways are higher then ours and his thoughts are higher then ours. So why is it so difficult to believe that God is smarter then us? He has his own way of sorting out those he’s called to share eternity with him? God is infectiously wonderful, beyond all that you could imagine. So wonderful, you simply can’t contain it! But, it’s only the beginning; there is so much to learn about Him and how the kingdom of God works in our lives.
1LonePuma 5 months ago in playlist Hail Atheism
Part 1: Your question is interesting, but when a person actually surpassed the speculation of evolution by experiencing the reality of the Lord, you simply can’t keep it to yourself. Your eyes are suddenly opened to the spiritual realms of God. You somehow realize all that was said about God and His Son were true! Things begin to happen where before they where hidden from you. Also, you’re somehow catapulted in to a supernaturally brotherhood of fellow believers.
1LonePuma 5 months ago in playlist Hail Atheism
@1LonePuma So in other words: You are saying Chrisitans, and religious in general, are delusional and schizophrenic.
Helge129 5 months ago
like 70% of the times i tell some1 im an atheist they say to me: "Your stupid" or "Stop talking nonsense" so i totally get this question
magocbi 5 months ago
Comment removed
motlencore89 6 months ago
@motlencore89: "Im a christian with athiest friends"
No, you're an idiot with atheist friends.
If you believe in an invisible, immortal, telepathic being who created the entire universe in a few days, you're an idiot. Your friends most likely laugh at you behind your back.
mikefromwa 5 months ago
@mikefromwa wow dude, your setting an example of how mature and well maintained atheist people are suppose to be.your a fucking immature dip shit know it all who thinks he understands life when he hasn't been alive long enough, or seen enough to even touch the fucking surface. Us Christians are suppose to be offended by atheist, you seem to be the one with the fucking issue. Go enlist in the Marine Corps when you turn 18, because your obviously not right now. that'll send any man praying.....
motlencore89 5 months ago
@motlencore89: You christians are all deluded idiots, and your obvious distress at being outed as fools is clearly evident in your ranting and cursing. Go pray to your magic man for some serenity and inner peace. You really ought to stop believing in stupid fairy tales- look how cranky it's making you. :) lol
"that'll send any man praying."
Anyone dumb enough to believe your nonsensical baloney, that is... :) lololol
mikefromwa 5 months ago
@motlencore89: "Us Christians are suppose to be offended by atheist, you seem to be the one with the fucking issue."
You christians are offended by anyone who dares to disbelieve in your crazy-ass story. Atheists usually just laugh at people like you who live in a magical world where a telepathic sky-daddy reads your mind night and day. Don't blame me for your idiotic beliefs, or the fact that you can't tell fantasy from reality. :) lolol
PS: You cursed, so now you're goin' to hell! hahahah
mikefromwa 5 months ago
I think maybe you are being attacked due to the athiest Rhetoric which pervails today. For example Dawkin's book "The God Delusion" is offensive. He says the God of the old testament is $%^%%^&^... etc. This is God, the Father. What if someone said that about your Father? Or someone you loved. If you want to get serious about philosophy read "Economic Science and the Poverty of Naturalism: C. S. Lewis’s “Argument from Reason”
FromAcrossTheDesert 7 months ago
@FromAcrossTheDesert What prevails is Christian nonsense attacking nonchristians.
Before you attempt to hold anyone responsible for offending your Father, you need to show your Father exists.
C S Lewis offers no proof & no good argument & does not argue from reason. He serves infantile pablum to the choir that is not the slightest bit convincing to nonbelievers yet for believers, seems to give them a leg to stand on. Same as the utterly ridiculous Evidence
(cont)
Strangerinasland 6 months ago
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@FromAcrossTheDesert (cont) Same as the utterly ridiculous Evidence That Demands A Verdict & Know Why You Believe neither of which offers any evidence.
Strangerinasland 6 months ago
I think maybe you are being attacked due to the athiest Rhetoric which pervails today. For example Dawkin's book "The God Delusion" is offensive. He says the God of the old testament is $%^%%^&^... etc. This is God, the Father. What if someone said that about your Father? Or someone you loved. I believe this battle is a dogmatic battle of a supposed conflict which is filled with ignorance. The rable vs. the plebs. Read C.S. Lewis' "The Poverty of Naturalism".
FromAcrossTheDesert 7 months ago
Christians, Atheists...same problems, DIFFERENT CHURCHES! Thats my point.
Sorry about the copy/paste error below! I was responding on the go from my iPhone, got a little tricky there. Ignore the second comment, then put the rest together. you'll figure it out. ; )
wineandchocolat 7 months ago
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@wineandchocolat There is no faith in atheism.
Strangerinasland 6 months ago
...they're defending who they are. The truth of the matter is, Christians have their faith in God, ie, the bible, and Atheist have their faith in Science. Both suffer from the same identity crisis: same problems...different churches.
wineandchocolat 7 months ago
I think both Christian “believers” and Science( theorist) “believers” are equally concerned with asserting their identities. I think that both types of believers are "personally" invested in their views; Ideas become who they are: their worth, their position in society. Self-value is often easily ...they're defending who they are. The truth of the matter is, Christians have their faith in God, ie, the bible, and Atheist have their faith in Science. Both suffer from the same identity crisis: s
wineandchocolat 7 months ago
I think both Christian “believers” and Science( theorist) “believers” are equally concerned with asserting their identities. I think that both types of believers are personally invested in their views; Ideas become who they are: their worth, their position in society. Self-value is often easily challenged by others, by strangers...people who don't even matter. Just evidence of how weak our sense of self really is.
The Atheists and Christians are not vigorously defending their point of view,
wineandchocolat 7 months ago
From experience I would say it is a knee jerk reaction on the part of the faithful who don't type with thought but from emotion. Too often we are told we are stupid, weak minded, "less evolved" (which is interesting that a particular member of this species which should evolve more or less as a whole could somehow be way behind yet literate) and my favourite that if all of us believers were killed the world would be a happy peaceful place. Link those comments to atheism often enough and "pavlov"!
MsColdCanada 7 months ago
@MsColdCanada What atheists claim that if all believers were killed the world would be a happy peaceful place?
Strangerinasland 6 months ago
@Strangerinasland I'm not sure if you're asking me which individual atheists on line have stated that or if you are asking if some have made the claim. I have seen the statement by at least 6 different people in the past month. If you want user names I would have to go looking for the them as I didn't jot it down.
MsColdCanada 6 months ago
@MsColdCanada I can understand not having those usernames handy, of course.
I've been exposed to thousands of atheists online, in person, thru books, etc & I've never known an atheist to say that. I have seen people misunderstand & claim an atheist said that when it was clear they didn't. I can't say no atheist would say that.
Theists have told me the same thing but with atheists being killed. Christians have told me the same thing but with nonchristians being killed.
Strangerinasland 6 months ago
@Strangerinasland When I see it again I will try to remember to come back here and reply. I have also seen people who claim various faiths say it and it saddens me when they do also. Advocating mass murder because of differing principles is horrific no matter who suggests it. I would like to think that they aren't serious but there are some very mentally ill people logged in from day to day.
MsColdCanada 6 months ago
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@Strangerinasland Got one:
"over 6 million people died at the hands of the inqusition alone... and the communists were very bad, but not as atheists... they had other motives like the religious leaders today... they all speak lies, are money grubbers and they are destroying a great country with their non-realistic crap... we need to do like the inquisition and kill all the preists and preachers.....
lentmain 6 months ago "
Seems pretty murderous to me.
MsColdCanada 6 months ago
@Strangerinasland Here's another (will take two parts to paste) Islam is a dangerous death cult, a machine for terror and suicide bombers. A permanently offended global crybaby bully. Its time to cleanse earth from this filth. Deport all muslims and islamics back to the desert and send over a weapon that will quickly do the job that needs to be done.
MsColdCanada 6 months ago
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@Strangerinasland continued... Muslims are cowards, in the act of bullying or the inaction required to prevent it. Ill take one strip of juicy crispy bacon over the lives of 2 billion islamics without a care in the world. Christians next.
699backstab 2 months ago"
Seems murderous to me.
MsColdCanada 6 months ago
I think they get offended bcuz when u say u don't believe in god your really saying much more than that. Your saying that u think they're wrong in their beliefs. Your saying that they believe in something that is non-existent which would make them gullible & foolish. Your saying all their prayer is for nothing. Your saying their grandma isn't really in heaven. Your saying they've been lied to all of their lives.
m0kn33marc 7 months ago
Because they want to everyone to believe in their beliefs. Their attitude is that their religion is the best of all religion.
tkathryyn 7 months ago
I AM SO OFFENDED THAT YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD! (just kidding obviously.) I don't get offended I just try to explain why I believe in what you dont.
ilikepie544 8 months ago
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@ilikepie544 Now I'm curious. Which god do you believe in & why?
Zentz29 7 months ago
I am not offended at any non believer or those of different beliefs, or combinations of them. When people get offended, I think it's due to stereotypical thoughts about that person. Sad, and I wish it didn't happen. I mean if you are so easily offended at the fact your friend or family member doesn't believe in God, is it because you somehow are fearful just that person's presence will make you believe in god less? If so...you have some thinking to do.
Tonailsprinkles 8 months ago
I see little reason to feel personally offended if an individual merely states he/she does not believe in God. This is a decision and responsibility related to any given individual per se. Our disagreement would be with the characterization that an individual's belief in God is mythology. Perhaps the latter is where offense is often taken?
Mechanized0 8 months ago
My own guess is that they're so used to having total dominion that the idea that anything might threaten their total hegemony over public life means that anyone who doesn't accept their superstitions means that they want the faith outlawed, banned, etc.
Darkstar1484 8 months ago in playlist Skepticism and Freethought 4
I'm a non-believer who is offened by believers simply because their beliefs don't make any sense. Imagine if somebody told you that you thought Attila the Hun was an immortal, omnipotent deity and that they honestly believed that. That is my reaction: I am scared by the lack of logic. However, it is not my opinion that anybody should be punished for religious belief, I simply think that people should have modern educations so that they don't believe in religious texts and such.
Andy32268 8 months ago
RabidApe, I'm a Christian, and I'll try to explain how I see things:
A Christian, if they follow instruction from the Biblical teachers, should understand that we're not supposed to trouble someone outside of the Church. The same people that do this also don't seem to as of yet understand faith. Faith is for what faith produces! It's like saying someone who doesn't go to school is against learning. They missed the point that they went to school learning, to learn something specific.
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon I like that you said "believers" with the quotes, because it shows that not the greater part of instruction is understood.
They should know that
1) preaching is considered foolishness to the world
2) the best way to attract someone to faith is to show them the fruit of it, and be ready to explain it
3) judgement starts in the Church
A good example is the recent May 21st ridiculousness! And I was afraid many people would blaspheme because of H.C.'s ridiculous, unbiblical prediction
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon For instance, not only is Revelation misunderstood, but parts of Jesus' words are completely thrown away. Not only does he set a time for the day of Yahweh, but he also sets the hour! Not only that, he, in opposition to Daniel and Revelation, says the reason it didn't come is 'cause it was delayed until October. He'd rather lie than call himself wrong! Jesus says of people who say "the time is near", don't follow them... and many, also unlearned, do just the same...
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon About it going against other books, it's outlined that the reason He returns, or that He takes up the people, is because they're all being KILLED and it's so that not everyone is destroyed, but "there will be no more delay".
As far as your atheist friend assuming what he did about you, that's the same with those so-called Christians: taking a name to justify their own ideas, rather than being honest to seek the truth. Now what I believe is different, but it's not my job to kill!
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon It's all summed up in the state of the human condition, wickedness, and "the lie". If they understood Revelation, the Kingdom of God, and the Holy Spirit, they would know that you don't see God because He is spiritual, and His Kingdom (rulership) can't be SEEN with eyes - it's an internal rule. What they should be doing is hoping for and trying to usher righteousness and truth, rather than bringing in groupies. Now, not to subtract from what I believe either, but I will also...
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon ...I will also say that (and I just realized these postings will have to be read backwards, sorry) they and all should thus understand that Him returning and ushering in His kingdom would be to destroy man's wickedness and bring about God's righteousness. Those who make excuses for sins and greediness and filthiness like "prosperity gospel" preachers, they're worse-off than someone who's never come to know God. But, to conclude, and to prove the point not only of the Bible but...
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon ...but also to prove what I'm saying, take a look at the propoganda against Christianity: people running around without any idea what's going on, people greedy and making excuses, believing lies, behaving ridiculously, and adding NOTHING to anyone... Jesus Himself said "many are called, but few are chosen". Therefore, it's not only no surprise that human beings are human beings, but that's what it was all about anyway. The ignorant will be beaten less, but the knowing more...
krononomikon 8 months ago
@krononomikon To sum up, I think the reason there is personal offense is because they are humans, and they don't understand why others do things, or even what they should be searching for (the Kingdom). They should be offended by sin and wickedness and corruptness, and should be willing to love perfectly like God, who gives rain and sun to every person, whether thankful or unthankful - to pray for people who use them! the Spirit shows inwardly that this was God's speech all along - also Jesus
krononomikon 8 months ago
I'm an atheist so this isn't necessarily the comment you are looking for, but in my experience it boils down to this: The extremely religious don't see a difference between religion and science. The bible tells them how the world works and science says something else. The people pushing for evolution in the classroom and not creationism are suppressing the religious one's view. Then, slippery slope it to all religion is outlawed.
maarakailet1 8 months ago
@maarakailet1 another uninformed so called "atheist"... religion can be studied in sunday school... it doesn't belong in a science classroom.
beenn15 8 months ago
I don't get offended. I believe and you don't, no problem, I believe that God will judge all and you don't. I believe in the Bible and that America was founded on Christian values and morals, and anyone that chooses to believe in God shouldn't be slammed or have their beliefs bashed. I believe that anyone should be able to choose their religion. One thing though, when you say "mythology" instead of " theology", it seems you are looking for an argument. Just saying.
Peace Out!
Matthewseven13 8 months ago
Let us make a pact to not watch videos where ratings and comments have been disabled. Please remove the response video which has these disabled.
greenjelly01 9 months ago
It is not that we Christians take 'offense' at non-believers but that we are saddened by them. Men without God acting in their lives are foolish, harming themselves and others through sin and miss out on God's love, goodness and wisdom in our mortal lives and of course have no chance at eternal life.. All Christians have walked in the shoes of the sinful, lost man and we know something of what is possible through Jesus. Die in your sins and you will feel foolish when you meet the God you deny
BondiHarry 10 months ago
@BondiHarry pascals wager? your arrogance is exceeded only by your ignorance.
uknowispeaksense 10 months ago
@BondiHarry "Men without God acting in their lives are foolish, harming themselves and others through sin" - it is AMAZING that you make this allegation without a second thought, and we should not be offended, but anything and everything atheists say and do offends christians.Why should we have any respect, or even tolerance, for hateful people like you?
greenjelly01 9 months ago
@BondiHarry So, because i don't believe in YOUR personal imaginary friend, i'm harming myself? And what eternal life are you talking about? Got any evidence to support that one, or even for your imaginary friend? You don't, and this is why faith is needed, because religions DO NOT have any evidence for their absurd extraordinary claims. Why should we respect something that deliberately belittles human intellect while stunning believers with psychological blackmail to keep them in line? Absurd.
hellhammerz666 8 months ago
@BondiHarry If your god wants to be loved and be believed in so damn much, why doesn't he simply show himself instead of setting really stupid tests and demand gullibility in order to magically pop "in your heart"? Isn't he supposed to be omniscient? Because if he's actually omniscient, and lets all the crap in the world happen, he's pretty fucked up. More like a kid burning little worms with a magnifying glass than a loving father. So much bullshit in religion....
hellhammerz666 8 months ago
Im an agnostic/evangelical christian, i don't get offended if yo do no't beleive but atheists tend to play the smart role and offend you saying you'r ridiculous etc...
FlaiteOne 11 months ago
@FlaiteOne I'm sorry for what you've been put through then. I'm personally a Unist, but hate when people try to force it down each others throat. Most of the time when you say evangelical, the atheists will assume your gonna try to convert them. At least they are fighting for equal rights.
GibsonPride 10 months ago
@FlaiteOne are they playing a role?
uknowispeaksense 10 months ago
@uknowispeaksense Absolutely.
FlaiteOne 10 months ago
@FlaiteOne you don't think that they are smart then?
uknowispeaksense 10 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain When you say that you don't trust the Catholic Church to say things about morality, do you also distrust and refuse to accept the advice of smoking doctors who say you should stop smoking to improve your health? What about obese doctors, would you refuse to go on a diet if an obese doctor told you that you had diabetes and needed to lose weight? Thank you.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Just because people call themselves Christian it doesn't mean they are really being Christian their whole lives. Christianity is very difficult to follow. However I believe that in the same way everyone should go to university to improve their education and thinking skills, everyone should strive to be morally better. In traditional Christianity that is a main tenet. You seem to judge all and I guess you think you are morally good by your own standards.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Stop fighting and type in "Chuck Norris takes on a bear." It is much more exciting watching a man of steel take on a massive beast with his "bear" fists.
SolidSnake3131 11 months ago
@SolidSnake3131 I prefer fighting with SONY Fanbois! I was told by one that a boutique Sony Vaio is tougher than a military grade Panasonic Toughbook. :-) You know even Chuck Norris couldn't rip a Panny up but a Vaio, well he eats them for breakfast :-).
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
one thing i will arge though, is that wwhile you yourself and others dont really mind people belieing in god/s
you even indirectly give the sort of vibe that those who do, are = being perpetually silly andare essentially wasting their time believing i a god.
even if thats not intended i will say onecan get that mpression, if nothing else because your often adressing the utter idiots.
elgostine 11 months ago
They believe so much or at least tell themselves this that they cannot understand why someone does not.They only have to understand and compare why they do not believe in other gods.That is why we do not believe in theirs.
knightone57 11 months ago
Ever notice..there are very few if none "old" or "aged" atheists? I find that curious...very curious. And atheism is NOT evil...and btw, what nutcasee useryerffinbrain says is untrue. The right has taken over, the country and our beliefs. Check Methodism, Lutheranism, and the milder protestant groups. You'll find much more tolerant people
davehutchinson67 1 year ago
I've seen too many people making the argument that atheism is evil because some dictator did evil things and was an atheist. That argument is like saying that all men are serial rapist killers because the "Green River Killer" was a man.
Anyone that claims Atheism is evil should take a course in logic because atheism has no doctrine. However some religions are atheistic such as Buddhism and Scientology.
kingkong8974 1 year ago
@Purplecatsoup30
So, the next time you want to say something like 'Atheists are the reason this world is a wreak'.....Look in a mirror and remember your hands aren't really sparkling clean either.
BusinessSuitBob 1 year ago
@Purplecatsoup30
......Granted that Soviet Russia and N. Korea have a bit of state-worship in the mix doesn't change the fact that NONE of the countries or dictatorships haven't done anything that wasn't done by a theist (christian or otherwise) I won't defend what happened under their watch but you can't just say that ALL fault lies with atheism, or other religions. However if you're going to play that game, remember that believers started the crusades, the inquisition, among others.....
BusinessSuitBob 1 year ago
@Purplecatsoup30
Umm, where were you during history class?
Hitler was a catholic, in fact the Nazi motto was 'Gott Mit Uns' (God With Us). Communism and atheism are NOT synonymous. Yes, Stalin was an atheist, that doesn't mean that every Soviet was as well, that's like saying before 1997 everyone in Hong Kong was English. As far as the East Asian Communist states you mentioned goes.....they are ALL Buddhist.....
BusinessSuitBob 1 year ago
@BusinessSuitBob Hitler may have been a Roman Catholic, but it meant nothing to him. He attempted to establish a neo pagan religion in Germany, hearkening back to some teutonic mythology; he commanded millions to be killed, and that is just the tip of the iceberg with that freak. Hardly the actions of someone even remotely devout. When did I saw ALL fault lies with atheists? I did not. I took exception to the notion that all fault lies with people of faith, whatever form that might be.
Purplecatsoup30 1 year ago
Being offended by non-believers was not an issue until about ten yrs ago; then the atheism hit the fan, so to speak.
KnowTheBible559 1 year ago
I am only offended when Christians personally attack who I am based off my beliefs or lack thereof. And even then... not really. Because it's hard to get offended by an ignorant, intolerant person who insists I'm just an evil bastard who will burn for all eternity.
OoOLawlietFerSurOoO 1 year ago
why do u atheists hate god??
thedayitriedtodie 1 year ago
@thedayitriedtodie
Because if he exists by the accounts in the Bible he sounds like a pretty awful guy =P
Not the sorta person I'd invite over
dummbatz48 1 year ago
@thedayitriedtodie We don't hate that which we don't believe! We hate idiots making empty claims, then telling us to just have faith, in your empty claims...
Vegasgodless 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Why do you christians hate Zeus?
UseYerEFFINBrain 1 year ago
I think a lot of it stems from the fact that atheism is truly a new concept to many people. Not to say in anyway that atheism is a new concept but rather we are just now getting into times where people are more open about it. Then you have folks like Dawkins and Hitchens that, while have great points, are pretty abrasive to religion. So that's what believers see and when they hear the word "atheist" that's what they refer back to. I like their theories but they really give atheist a bad rap.
chatykat 1 year ago
It's because they've been taken for a ride and are afraid, or don't have the balls to admit it. Just because flies congregate to a pile of bullshit doesn't make them right, but their delusions (a load of crap) certainly do enjoy company.
VanGoghsEar1890 1 year ago
I think believers are offended by non-believers because religious beliefs are so flimsy, and atheists represent the possibility that they could be wrong. The only thing that keeps them going is the assurance that so many other people believe what they believe.
If everyone acted like they believed in the Easter Bunny and I believed it too but then everyone revealed that they were just playing a joke on me, I sure would look silly. Religious beliefs are no less silly, so they need the assurance.
TharosTheDragon 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Because they are told by their pastors that everyone who is not for them is against them.
rrward 1 year ago
I am an atheist. I am not offended by other people's beliefs in principle
I am "offended", if we want to call it that, by stupid beliefs that harm society
For example, I am OFFENDED by the belief that women are inferior to men (1 cor14:34). I am offended by the belief that we should murder our children if they misbehave (Exodus21:15) I am offended by slavery (Exodus21), etc
I don't care if people believe in invisible pixies, as long as those beliefs don't translate into MAJOR social problems
UseYerEFFINBrain 1 year ago
Christian arn't offended by worldy people... it's the other way around..
bebopblues 1 year ago
@bebopblues I'm only offended by creationists that threaten me if i do not bow to their stupidity. e.g. burn in a hell
AForsakenHero 1 year ago
Atheists don't do much to offend people
It's Christians, with their pro-slavery, anti-woman, pro-rape, pro-murder, anti-education, anti-gay, pro-torture stance that piss people off
When was the last time somebody was burnt at the stake in the name of atheism?
When was the last time an atheist killed someone SPECIFICALLY IN THE NAME OF ATHEISM?
When was the last time an atheist community protected a pedophile just because he was an atheist? (like how catholics protected pedophile priests)
UseYerEFFINBrain 1 year ago 30
@UseYerEFFINBrain
I smell lots of win in the air.
Oldspiceguyshorse 1 year ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain u r a fucking tool..........
athetists don't do much to offend people?
Hello, where have you been for the 20th century? NAZI Germany, Communist Russia, Communist China, Communist North Korea, Communist Vietnam, et cetera? ALL of these states were and are fundamentally and atheist, and likewise their leaders: Lenin, Hitler, Stalin, Mao...
hundreds of thousands died under these brutal regimes, in the name of "progress" and in the cult of the state.
Purplecatsoup30 1 year ago
Atheists advocate questioning authority and skeptically examining data. Do you think that THAT is what Nazi fanatical soldiers were doing too much of?
It's PRECISELY the opposite. The problem is obedience to appointed authority and blind faith in dogmatic ideology, whether religious or political
Unjustified faith in Hitler, unjustified faith in Jesus, unjustified obedience to Stalin, unjustified obedience to the Pope. Same thing. Anytime people stop thinking critically, millions die
UseYerEFFINBrain 1 year ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain as an orthodox, i find that opersonally inslting, because i dont believe in those things and i get the feeling youd be hard pressed to find someone who does.
alot of us have changed even in the last 30 years most of us, infact id say those anti woman etc are a major minority.
so please. be accurate,
elgostine 11 months ago
Oh, sorry. I didn't realize you were one of those Christians who think the Bible sucks
If you agree that those Bible passages that promote slavery, murder, rape, etc, are DESPICABLE, if you agree that the Bible is a HORRIBLE, VIOLENT, SINISTER, PERVERTED book, then we're on the same page.
You can be a Christian as much as you want, as long as you don't follow the Bible. As long as you don't burn gay people, stone women, own slaves, etc.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain ill interject to say it IS useful in a way
in truth, it was cuz of exodus i knew that acacia (the plant family that includes the australian wattles) was not just confined to australia, since they specificly mention acacia in the instructions to make the tabernacle etc.
(my version is called 'the good news bible')
now those parts i like about the bble, all the rich craftsmanship, and the epic conflicts.
elgostine 11 months ago
Whatever. The Lord of the Rings is a million times better.
And either way, you can't pick and choose. Either it's the word of God (including the parts that are pro rape, pro murder, pro slavery, pro stabbing pregnant women in the belly) or it's just a book.
Decide, and stick with your decision.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain
i cant can i? watch me :P
though since you force the question on me the evidence suggests the bible isnt as divine as i would have thought in terms of its authorship.
though im willing to suspend belif in this area. not in science though .
elgostine 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Your logic is slightly flawed when it comes to" in the name of atheism." If that is the reference, then I say when was the last time anyone did anything in the name of Thiesm. Regardless of if an action was right or wrong, everyone does it in the name of there moral compass. When you are part of a religion you cite that as a justification. Again regardless if it the action is correct or not. Now if you are an atheist then an equal statement would be--
nomyturn 11 months ago
"When you are part of a religion you cite that as a justification". That is true.
If there wasn't a religion telling you to burn gay people alive, you wouldn't do it.
That's why religion is evil.
There are SO MANY evil things religious people do all the time that non-religious people would never dream of doing
You are exactly right. Religion removes the necessity to think for yourself, and you just follow orders, burning people alive, just because your priest tells you to
Disgusting
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain "If there wasn't a religion telling you to burn gay people alive, you wouldn't do it." do you have scientific evidence to back that up? "Religion is evil" - is evil a valid concept in atheism?
Things religious do - like acts of charity? "Religion removes the ... think yourself" this begs the question. Do you have proof? Burning people alive - could you cite some proof of this? "Disgusting" - as as atheist you should not use emotion as a logical argument.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
""If there wasn't a religion telling you to burn gay people alive, you wouldn't do it." do you have scientific evidence to back that up?"
Yes. No atheist has ever burned a gay person. EVER. In the history of the world.
There are some things that are so evil that you would NEVER do without religion.
On the other hand, things like charity are done JUST AS MUCH by atheists as by religious people.
And YES, evil is a valid concept to an atheist. Evil is that which harms society.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Do you have scientific evidence to show me that literal Bible reading is a significant motivator in a significant number of cases and that there were no other motivators. Dude, I've attended Church my whole life and never have I heard an anti-gay or anti-anyone else sermon, much less one advocating any violence. Evil is not a valid concept in atheism.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Evil IS a valid concept to atheists. Evil is that which harms society. This is my second time saying that.
Do I have scientific evidence to show that a literal reading of the Bible is a significant motivator in committing atrocities? YES. Here it is: Christians burn hundreds of thousands of people alive. Atheists don't.
Is this positive evidence that there were no other motivators? NO. But it's a VERY compelling case nonetheless.
Christian: STOP BUNING PEOPLE ALIVE! IT'S EVIL TO DO SO!
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Evil is not a valid concept. Evil is a Judeo-Christian concept. In atheism there is no evil or good, everything is relative. You have no rationale to judge anyone and you're using what is called a weak form of argumentation called 'argument from outrage'. You do not have any scientific evidence. In science we do not consider evil. In psychology or psychiatry there is no category called evil.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain "Is this positive evidence that there were no other motivators? NO. But it's a VERY compelling case nonetheless." this is unqualified nonsense. If we published such stuff in NEMJ we'd be laughed out by the community. Come up with something better or admit you're just as dogmatic as the people you hate.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain You forget that this justification must pass a very critial analysis of your motivations. This must be done before you can use it for justification. More often then not, christianity stops you from acting evil. If you still want to do evil, that is when one must stop following there religion and follow the atheistic philosophy of choosing what is right for yourself. Once this is done, they can throw off the yolk of morals and commit evil without hinderence from religion.
nomyturn 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain "I did this because I believe it to be right to me." Any athiest who has ever killed anyone, had then did it in the name of themselves. This is an adequate parallel. Theism is the major catagory and chrisitan, muslim, jews, or what ever are the sub catagories. Atheism is the major catagory and each individial atheist is the subcatagory. I do agree that it was wrong for the protection of pediphiles.
nomyturn 11 months ago
No, sorry. You're wrong.
Both atheists and theists kill for all sorts of reasons. On top of all the reasons an atheist has for killing, a theist has an extra reason - the invisible man in the sky
Either way, don't try to make this an hypothetical argument based on semantics. Look at the facts. How many people were burned at the stake in the name of common sense and critical thinking?
How many were burned at the stake in the name of Jesus or Mohammed or Abraham?
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Your logic is flawed. People can be burned in the name of anything, they were killed in the French Revolution in the name of reason BTW. But many more people are killed in the name of freedom and safety. Should we do away with freedom and safety too? God is not defined as an invisible man in the sky. I post this: an atheist only does not kill because of the law. A theist will not kill because his religion is against murder and it's against the law. Did Jesus ask for killing?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
"Did Jesus ask for killing?" Yes. Again, read the Bible.
Matthew 11:20 - Jesus condemns three cities to torment
Revelations 19:13-15 - Jesus wears a robe stained with blood, and uses a sword and an iron scepter to kill thousands
Revelations 19:20-21 Jesus throws people in the lake of fire, and kills more with a sword
You are ADORABLE, in the way you pretend to know about a book you've never even read, but if you try to talk with grownups, it's best to READ THE BOOK BEFORE EXPRESSING OPINIONS!
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Those passages do not say that Jesus asked anyone to kill in His name.
So even if God kills some people, it does not follow that He wants me to kill people too. In fact Christians are told to LOVE THEIR ENEMIES. Which most don't do, but that's beside the point.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Christians kill in spite of their religion. Christianity does not advocate the killing of anyone except in self defence. Atheism says Christianity is bunk, but anything else is OK. Many atheists turned to Bolshevism in Russia and killed tens of millions in the name of a new society. They wanted to spread this to the whole world. Look at the facts yourself. A serious Christian will not kill anyone. A serious atheist is neutral towards killing.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
"Christianity does not advocate the killing of anyone except in self defense"
AH AH AH!!!!
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed"
"If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death"
"All who curse their father or mother must be put to death"
Read the Bible my friend. Read first, then write. Otherwise you look really, really, really stupid.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain You heard of Roman Catholicism? Read up about it. What does it say about these verses. Can you quote anything in the Catechism of the Catholic Church which supports these points?
Secondly you do know that ancient Israel was a theocracy (no seperation of church/state) and thirdly can you cite some evidence showing those motivations to be the sole motivations for acts of violence directed against their supposed targets?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain First of all, beleaving in Christ give you strength to do what is right and it gives you multiple extra reasons to not kill. And secondly you imply that being athiest is equal to having common sence and critical thinking. These are mutually exclusive. You can be an atheist or theist and have or have no commom sence or critical thinking. I believe your hate of theists is bluring your logic.
nomyturn 11 months ago
I agree, you can have irrational atheists, rational theists, etc. But OVERALL, the higher your IQ, the less religious you are, the higher your level of education, the less religious you are. That's just a fact
Yes, sometimes religion can give you the strength to do what is right, sometimes it can give you the "strength" to do something bad, like fly a plane into the twin towers
Regardless of whether religion helps or not, the fact remains that IT'S NOT TRUE that Jesus walked on water!
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Many people who are smarter think they can solve problems on their own or reject Christianity as a priori because it seems crazy to them. There is a snobbish that sees some people (usually poor pseudo-intellectual academics) want to rise above their peers, they are as poor as their plumber religious neighbours so they elevate themselves by deluding themselves they don't need faith. Other people just don't see the logic in the traditions of the church.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain IQ/atheism: I'll be honest here. I know many educated people and very few are wise across the whole spectrum. Some are hyperspecialised, and many make common assumptions and have worldviews which are heavily influenced by misinformation and often emotion. A guy who is a great physicist but pontificates on philosophy or politics often does it badly. Christianity is about humility, you can't study your way to God.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Yes, Christianity is about humility, and accepting to obey whatever absurd thing the clergy tells you to do.
They DONT WANT YOU TO be educated, otherwise you'll see through their bullshit.
In the middle ages, the clergy would CHARGE YOU MONEY for a free pass to heaven even if you sinned.
If you had a mistress, you'd pay money to the clergy, and you "wouldn't go to hell".
It's a scam. And the fact that people with a high IQ don't fall for it should tip off even you, regardless of your low IQ
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Dude, you don't know much. Instead of ranting and raving perhaps you could read up some real history or obtain a real education. Eh?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@nomyturn I agree and will add more.Christianity is actively pro-dignity of life, pro-marriage, pro-freedom, anti-murder, anti-rape etc. Atheism has no stance on those. It presupposes NO GOD and therefore WE MANKIND can do what we want for the sake of advancement (whose?) and have no conscience/soul to protect nor a God to answer to.Our morals are relative.Even our mind processes cannot be trusted(for they are random electro-chemistry) and we have to create arbitrary,fleeting purposes for life.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
If Christianity is pro marriage why do christians get divorced more than atheists?
If it's anti rape why do Christians commit more rape than atheists (per capita - not just overall)?
If it's anti-murder, why do Christians commit more murder than atheists?
If it's pro-freedom why are there more people in jail in America than in all non christian countries combined?
Before you pontificate about your superior values you may want to look at FACTS
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain If you're an atheist why are you not a rocket scientist? Well that's your answer.
Why should divorce rates of people who think they are Christian be lower. BTW Christianity does not make life easier and yeah Catholics and Lutherans have same divorce rates as your atheist crowd.
When the Christian message comes in church (1 hr/week) but practical atheist message comes across in media (TV, movies, pop culture) where is the blame?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Most rocket scientists are atheists. It doesn't follow that most atheists are rocket scientists.
That's as absurd as saying there are a lot of pedophile priests, therefore you are a pedophile because you are a Catholic.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain No. You presumed that just because people identify themselves as "Christian" they will miraculously have better lives. Just because you are an atheist does not mean you will be exceptionally smart or educated. Nothing personal. I am showing you the fallacy of your reasoning.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Freedom - I don't know why America has so many ppl in jail but perhaps it is an effective police force. In my country a woman is raped every 21 seconds and we have relatively few people in jail, most of those rapes go unpunished. Again, just below a religion preaches something it does not mean that automatically its adherents (we know nothing of how serious they are in their adherence) will be spared of being bad or good. People who murder disregard God (practical atheism).
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain BTW I was speaking about freedom from political oppression and not mere freedom from any form of incarceration. You should't have thrown that example. It's illogical. In your country you have a lot of relative freedom, civil rights, etc and you have a huge rich-poor gap. It can be a driver for crime. Your cops are definitely very effective though and your prisons are luxury hotels compared to E/European/Russian/Asian/African/South American prisons. Your prisoners are better off
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
"People who murder disregard God (practical atheism)". AH AH AH! Are you serious?
Tell me the name of one book that is MORE pro-murder than the Bible. Tell me one Book that tells readers to commit murder MORE than the Bible.
Just give me the name of that book.
Committing murder is the ULTIMATE ACT OF OBEDIENCE to the Bible, because committing murder is the thing the Bible tell you to do most frequently.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE READ THE BIBLE!!!!
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Practical atheism = behaving in a way as though God does not exist. If you contend that people kill gays for God you should contend that they will not commit adultery or watch porn for God. Yet people do that all the time, including lying, stealing etc - because our morally relativistic secular/Godless society advocates it. These people derive their morals from non-religious sources i.e. they behave as atheists deriving their morals from non-Christian sources.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain "pro-torture stance" - Christopher Hitchens is pro water boarding. Is he not a real atheist. PZ Myers does not see new born babies as human persons. He says they are meat. Surely the logical conclusion of atheism is that we're meat and have no inherent dignity? If we come from nothing and have no worth, why even bother? Only because the law punishes crime? Is lt fair to punish crime if humans are merely DNA replicators / mere accidents /meat?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Well. Fuck Christopher Hitchens. Of course he's a real atheist. But just because he is right in saying that there is no invisible man in the sky, doesn't make him right in EVERYTHING, and doesn't make him a representative of all atheists on ALL topics
Your argument: Hitchens is atheist + Hitchens is pro water boarding = Atheists are pro waterboarding
That's as stupid as saying: Hitler has mustache + Hitler is a genocidal maniac = People with mustache are genocidal maniacs
Think it through
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain No. You said that Christians advocate torture, I said that so does the atheist called Hitchens. You have some unscientific view of life there. Your dogma tells you that atheists are immune to doing bad things, which is what your insinuating. Empirical data disagrees with you. In fact as an atheist you should not value human life if you're purely atheist because atheism per se does not recognise any value in humans. I could say you're being specist.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain "When was the last time an atheist killed someone SPECIFICALLY IN THE NAME OF ATHEISM?" When was the last time a theist killed someone specifically in the name of THEISM?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain pro-slavery = Christians helped abolish slavery in the British Empire and later in the USA. Anti-woman - all women in my Catholic family have university degrees, but sure how is being pro-family and anti-abortion anti-woman? What if the fetus is female? pro-rape? - Er Christians have been urging for higher penalties for rape in the US. anti-gay = not anti-gay but considering homosexual sex sinful, pro torture - Catholic Church is anti-torture as are most churches.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Institute for Psychological Therapies - Vol 4, 1992. Read up about the trade in child pr0n in Europe and how most opposition to it was from Christian political parties while secular and left wing parties opposed banning kiddie pr0n for many years. That surely is pro-rape and anti-woman. Christians have always been against sexual exploitation of women and children in porn. Feminists will agree that porn is bad for women. Do you still deny that Christians are anti-woman?
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Please give me the name of a secular left wing politician who was against banning child pornography.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
Please give me the name of a secular left wing politician who was against banning child pornography.
Please provide that name, or admit you lied.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Google for the Institute for Psychological Therapies - Vol 4, 1992. It's a secular online journal. You know online journals, don't you? Those things we scientists read and publish in.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Well, by abolishing slavery and allowing women to get an education, Christians are DISOBEYING the word of God, because the Bible clearly says that we should have slaves, and that women are inferior beings to be treated as cattle, and that they're not even allowed to speak in church.
So the christians who are pro woman, anti slavery, anti-rape etc, are so DESPITE the teachings of the Bible, not because of them.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Well you may not know this but you're incorrect. In terms of my faith called Roman Catholicism, i.e. the people who assembled what you call the Bible (don't trust Protestants here hehe) we have a thing called a Magisterium which interprets that Bible. Nowhere in the Catholic teaching is education for women forbidden, nowhere is slavery supported and nowhere is rape supported. Secondly the Protestants have a good defense against the debunked argument you've used too.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
Have you ever read the Bible? Nowhere is slavery supported? Really? You're going to say that? And you're not going to care that you are breaking the "Thou shalt not bear false witness" thing? Really?
Have you ever read the Bible? Seriously bro, have you?
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain Don't presuppose that Communism/Bolshevism is the only ideology which can emerged or from an atheist worldview. There have been atheists like Jim Jones (cult leader and mass killer) who started their own cults or atheists like Mussolini who cut deals with the Vatican. Sure, there are even wonderfully good and gracious atheists such as Marie Curie who lost faith when her mother died. There are also conservative and liberal atheists who are good. Theism also leads to the Amish.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain wow i just read the posts between u and puragu..,and i have to say that I think that you want to beleive this evil thing about the Bible soooo much that you don't bother understanding what real Christians believe. You dogmaticaly stick to some old idea someone told you long ago and follow it blindly, instead of having a productive conversation. Go find a chrisitan you can talk to(not argue with) and do it knowing the other person is attempting to live a good life not evil.
nomyturn 11 months ago
Here is the fact: The BIBLE is pro murder, pro rape, pro genocide, pro slavery and pro misogyny
I agree that most Christians don't follow those teachings. They think they are a crock of shit
If by "real Christian" you mean a "person who disagrees with 90% of the teachings of the Bible", then I agree that I could have a productive conversation with him
I know most Christians are trying to live a good life. But if they followed the Bible, they wouldn't be able to.
UseYerEFFINBrain 11 months ago
@UseYerEFFINBrain You don't seem to know Christianity. I suggest you read up about it.
The laws of the OT included slavery because that was normal practice then. You did not have to keep slaves but the laws implied treating your slaves, your fellow free men and foreigners justly. If you're going to look at these laws through a modern POV, you are going to be mistaken.
PuraguCryostato 11 months ago