it ticklesme that the "Amiga Vs Atari" battle still wages on.......I personally Would fall into the Amiga Fan base but I still liked the Atari machines. However if you put all the power of the ST into a box and then stick in a sound chip that sounds like its been ripped from a Spectrum then you are going to end up with poor sounds.
@buggstermoo The Yamaha sound chip used in the ST was used in the Spectrum!! I personnally fall into the Atari fan base myself. I liked the ST Demos; all those custom chips in the Amiga surely made it easier to get the Amiga to dance!! To see the ST doing something similar; can't help but take my hats off to the coders that made it happen.
Awesome demo. The 68000 was a formidable cpu, whether its in an Amiga, Atari, Mac, or one of the various Unix boxes that used it. And thats just the computers. The mighty Sega Genesis and some of the arcades also made great use of the 68000.
What Amiga fans will not tell you is that the ST was around 12% faster than the Amiga, so it was faster at pure math, and so faster at things like Z depth sorting, 3D etc. So the ST versions of 3D games always ran smoother.
But the Amiga with it's blitter and different graphics modes made it much better for 2D games and demos. Sadly the STE was not really supported enough to compete, so although the STE was more a match for the Amiga, it was too late already upon release.
There is a ST demo that tries to mimic Enigma by Phenomena and if you read the scroller you will find a message from the coder, explaining why the spinning cube runs at 25fps instead of 50fps as on the Amiga.
@soupisgoodfooood The ST had sucky sound (inferior to Commodore 64's SID), but graphically it was almost as good as Amiga. One drawback was the lack of multitasking and no 4100-color porn mode
The Cuddly Demos set the standard for ST demo coding proving that the ST could do what the Amiga could without those custom chips.
All ST demos are done with the MC68000 processor and it's though into programming that makes the ST fun to code on. It's not just a case of the Blitter can do the sprites, use hardware scrolling to move the screen, use the Paula for sound, set-up a copper list for colour changes etc, etc.
Well, the ST could emulate many Amiga effects with clever tricks, which is amazing. But it seems like some people believe that there really is not necassary to have custom hardware at all because of that. Well, the effects i have seen on my ST may match some old Amiga demos (like DOC). But when it comes to later Amiga demos, it puts the ST to shame.
@zeusgb Or else someone who is impartial. Atari computers were always just slightly less capable than Commodore computers. For example the Atari 800 (1979) had less capable sound than the SID (1982) and fewer hardware sprites
.
Likewise the Atari ST had inferior sound to Amiga's Paula, and lacked multitasking, and lacked the 4100 color mode for artists. ST was good machine but why buy that when you have a better computer to choose from?
it ticklesme that the "Amiga Vs Atari" battle still wages on.......I personally Would fall into the Amiga Fan base but I still liked the Atari machines. However if you put all the power of the ST into a box and then stick in a sound chip that sounds like its been ripped from a Spectrum then you are going to end up with poor sounds.
buggstermoo 3 months ago
@buggstermoo The Yamaha sound chip used in the ST was used in the Spectrum!! I personnally fall into the Atari fan base myself. I liked the ST Demos; all those custom chips in the Amiga surely made it easier to get the Amiga to dance!! To see the ST doing something similar; can't help but take my hats off to the coders that made it happen.
joner847 2 months ago
There is no debate.
Go find this demo played on Amiga.
DOC [DR Mabuse Orgasm Crackings] Demons are Forever.
End. of.
glenlewis3348 1 year ago
Awesome demo. The 68000 was a formidable cpu, whether its in an Amiga, Atari, Mac, or one of the various Unix boxes that used it. And thats just the computers. The mighty Sega Genesis and some of the arcades also made great use of the 68000.
Scioneer 1 year ago
What Amiga fans will not tell you is that the ST was around 12% faster than the Amiga, so it was faster at pure math, and so faster at things like Z depth sorting, 3D etc. So the ST versions of 3D games always ran smoother.
But the Amiga with it's blitter and different graphics modes made it much better for 2D games and demos. Sadly the STE was not really supported enough to compete, so although the STE was more a match for the Amiga, it was too late already upon release.
stunthumb 2 years ago
3D game using the blitter to fill polygons were quite a bit faster on the Amiga (most 3D games after 1990).... Hunter is a very good example.
Polygon filling on the ST takes a lot of the available CPU time into account.
The 12% faster CPU doesn't make Hunter nearly as smooth on th ST as the blitter enhanced Amiga version.
OCS Amigas runs at 7.16Mhz instead of 8Mhz to gain performance, because of the way the chipset works. (Synced to the pixel clock)
Ahle2 2 years ago
There is a ST demo that tries to mimic Enigma by Phenomena and if you read the scroller you will find a message from the coder, explaining why the spinning cube runs at 25fps instead of 50fps as on the Amiga.
I can't remember the name of the demo sadly :(
Ahle2 2 years ago
Best ST demo screen ever.
Ah, the golden days, where everyone was trying to milk identical hardware for maximum effect...
biermeester 3 years ago 2
I understand the ST might be fun to code on and such...
But I've been looking at ST demos up and down, and honestly, I've had yet to see one that couldn't be done better on a C64.
soupisgoodfooood 4 years ago
Keep looking.
zeusgb 4 years ago
my sweet, the C64 couldnt do most of the things you see in these demos but i am impressed with those C64 demos. they arouse me slightly
shanebongos 4 years ago 2
I thought the only way to get smooth scrolling on any Commodore was to put it on a conveyor belt at your local supermarket :-)
The oldies are the best, joke that is (not the Chuff64)
viking272 3 years ago
@soupisgoodfooood The ST had sucky sound (inferior to Commodore 64's SID), but graphically it was almost as good as Amiga. One drawback was the lack of multitasking and no 4100-color porn mode
.
Ooops I meant HAM mode
.
harleykman 1 year ago
The Cuddly Demos set the standard for ST demo coding proving that the ST could do what the Amiga could without those custom chips.
All ST demos are done with the MC68000 processor and it's though into programming that makes the ST fun to code on. It's not just a case of the Blitter can do the sprites, use hardware scrolling to move the screen, use the Paula for sound, set-up a copper list for colour changes etc, etc.
BodSTAX 4 years ago
Well, the ST could emulate many Amiga effects with clever tricks, which is amazing. But it seems like some people believe that there really is not necassary to have custom hardware at all because of that. Well, the effects i have seen on my ST may match some old Amiga demos (like DOC). But when it comes to later Amiga demos, it puts the ST to shame.
Anyhow, i really live my STe.
Ahle2 4 years ago 4
What about ZX81? The most ashamed one, if we're talking about demoscene.
trophy242 2 years ago
I totally agree !!!
anhdysp 4 years ago 2
F*** the amiga fanboys, the ST rocked big time! I loved the Cuddly Demos!
red456x 4 years ago
Please rate and comment.
zeusgb 4 years ago
Who gave it one? Must have been an Amiga fanboy!
zeusgb 4 years ago
@zeusgb Or else someone who is impartial. Atari computers were always just slightly less capable than Commodore computers. For example the Atari 800 (1979) had less capable sound than the SID (1982) and fewer hardware sprites
.
Likewise the Atari ST had inferior sound to Amiga's Paula, and lacked multitasking, and lacked the 4100 color mode for artists. ST was good machine but why buy that when you have a better computer to choose from?
.
harleykman 1 year ago
@harleykman
The simple answer to that is the Atari ST was a lot cheaper than the Amiga.
zeusgb 1 year ago