Davey Graham - Medley: She Moved Thru' the Bizarre/Blue Raga

[buzanthefearless]

What is the official, actual, real name of the first part -- is it "She Moved Through the Fair" or "She Moves Through the Fair" or "She moved through the bazaar" or "She moves through the bazaar" ? Or something else?

[planet123]

As I have been "influenced" by Led Zep's music I will claim I wrote it all.

[mielazul]

Fans of this kind of Celtic-Arabic guitar sound might like "Rosetta West - Yallah."

[Dadoprice]

search nicolas and the iceni vassal song. they write great folk music which has echoes of davy, drake and denny.

[ColonelHoraldo]

So why did Page change the title of the piece?

[bluestate69]

she moved through the fair is a traditional vocal arrangement. people who attack jimmy page for "stealing" the song, should also listen to the traditional vocal melody and arrangement. the guitar melody is based on the vocal melody.

[MrGcole001]

I believe Page, being influenced by this folk music, putting it into his own style, which became hugely successful, helped gain notoriety for everyone. In essence, more people know, appreciate, buy and listen to this music because Page liked it too and presented it to a wider audience. Graham and Jansch may have sold more albums in the end. So it becomes a moral argument. Well, we can't change the past.

[Edbert2004]

It feels wrong to be posting on a year old thread but...

Jimmy hardly ever spoke on stage, so do not fault him for not giving credit during a concert. he was terribly shy since childhood and when reporters were able to get interviews he never failed to give credit to his musical heroes and inspiration.

[ALfaDuB101]

I think if songs are being used they should give credit to artist who made the songs but everybody is influenced by something not necessarily stealing no one is wholy original and davey graham is amazing and his main influence was Steve Benbow .

[euphorik6]

what kind of a douchebag DISLIKES this?

[ekpil]

"White Summer ". i used to do this back when it first out

[OneBigRetard]

Seven people went to the wrong fair.

[glen1ster]

Give proper credit on the label and pay the royalties. (Not just the songs, but also the authors, are better passed through the ages that way, too.) Otherwise, it's not just dishonest, it steals someone else's money. In some cases with Led Zep, that's a lot of money, and it took law suits to correct it. See "Led Zeppelin Lift Offs." For this one, based on "She moved thru' the Bizarre/Blue Raga" (and rhythm like "ya Mustapha"), it should be trad. arr. by Graham arr. by Page, not just Page.

[schummsy]

@Mr Sluggo666 So, what is your point? I get so sick of reading some frustrated fool's rant about NOTHING on these posts. Have you got nothing better to do than take pathetic anonymous potshots at people you know NOTHING about? No style, no respect. You clearly haven't even read what I posted properly. You think I actually look forward to getting up on a Sunday morning to some jive-ass disrespectful crap from a fool somewhere out there in the ether? Get a life.

[jsilence418]

@schummsy You are a fucking idiot and hate when people point it out case closed.

[schummsy]

@jsilence418 grow up.

[jsilence418]

@schummsy" Growing old is not an option growing up is " so uh, blow me !!

[Andyfly]

Yes but I probably wouldn't have looked up this or blackwaterside if it wasn't for White Summer. I'm sure this is the same for many people the world over. Clearly Jimmy Page has brought more widespread appreciation of both Bert Jansch and Davy Graham even if that credit wasn't there. I'm sure Bert doesn't loose sleep over it. Thats my view anyway.

[BeorhtFrognostic]

Cool music.

[MARCOPAVESE]

For the record, Jimmy page never credited this arrangement to Davy Graham. Although at some point in the seventies Davy was given £130 by Page.

Davy's arrangement IS copyrighted and will be enforced shortly.

[thepassion10]

She Moved Through the Fair was written by Pauric Colum in the late 1890's and is copyrighted as his Poem. I'm not sure who owns the Tune but it may be Pauric's Family Estate. He and aumber of Poets were part of the Cletic Twilight best known for W.B. Yeats Synge and Lady Gregory's Plays

[schummsy]

Nice one, zenfreestyler! I do dislike these curmudgeonly rows people get into on various chatrooms about who knows what... . It's about spreading the music, really, isn't it?

[Andyfly]

The way I see it is that passing music down to the next generations is what folk music is all about. Thats all Jimmy Page did. He adopted both of these fantastic tunes and played his own interpretation of them. Yes, maybe not crediting Bert Jansch wasn't his finest moment. However, choosing to perform Black Mountain Side and White Summer is an honorable tribute to the genius of both artists. Well done Mr Page.

[poetryandbeyond]

@Andyfly

Yes, the folk process has a long, honored history. However, three variants of Barbara Allen are still called Barbara Allen and carry no composer credits. Davy Graham conceived of and created a raga version of She Moved Through the Fair, not to perpetuate a given tradition, but to illustrate his personal theory.  Page adopted the piece note for note, called it White Summer and claimed composer credit. That's neither the folk process nor honorable.

[StragonRage]

suck my dick jimmy page

[Ksimp9]

@StragonRage next time you have a thought, just let it go.  Jimmy is probably the greatest guitar player still living, so just step down

[StragonRage]

@Ksimp9

hahahah u have to be kidding me

he is popular

but not really great ...

[OneBigRetard]

@Ksimp9

I am actually laughing at the stupidity of that. Not even Jimmy would agree!

[Ksimp9]

@OneBigRetard yes I realize now that was a pretty stupid thing to write. But he is a lot better than the guitar players in other famous bands.

[OneBigRetard]

@Ksimp9

That's true enough. Fair play for the retraction.

[DEI420]

you all that are sayin this and that folks calm down its music you know just sit back have a lager or a spirit and stop sayin oh jimmie took this oh he stole this from that person you know if you all think abou it everyone has taken something from music through out the lifetime of music peace

[gab99]

one other thing about Davey and this tune, it is indeed based on a folk song 'She Moved Through The Fair', which Davey even kept in the title and would never have avoided discussing its roots. The idea he stole it as mentioned earlier is laughable. As for Jimmy (and his God-style worshippers)? well, there you go.

[gab99]

I think what hacks people off about Page is that over time he is given credit for having written this stuff i.e. completely original. When its pointed out that, well, no it isnt, you get the usual F*** you! Page is God maaan! stuff. Just as Page for his own reasons rarely referenced where such music came from other than some general statement about liking this player or that, so people seem to find it impossible to think that he didnt come up with the original ideas.

[Smudgefizz]

1) The original traditional folk song all these later versions were based on was "(Down by) Blackwaterside." Jimmy Page acknowledged in an interview that Annie Briggs was singing it in clubs when he first heard it. Annie Briggs later went on to teach it to guitarist Bert Jansch (also a fan of Davey Graham) who recorded it in 1966. Page cites Jansch as a major influence.

[Smudgefizz]

2) But Al Stewart also says that he taught it to Page. Stewart also followed Jansch closely in the clubs, & learned "Blackwaterside" from listening to Jansch. Stewart was recording his debut album at the time (1966), & hired Page to play on the album. Stewart says during a break, he taught Page "Blackwaterside", which became the Yardbird's "White Summer", & developed into Led Zeppelin's "Black Mountainside".

[andyjjay]

HI

Have to jump in there- Davy Graham was the first guitarist to use DADGAD that is a fact

As for the song it is an old folk song

As for Page and black mountainside - he did copy from Bert Janchs piece black waterside - listen to them both and you will be in no doubt

its all great music and like most comments seem to be saying - everyone is influenced by someone else along the way. if you want to listen to some amazing guitar playing type in Julian bream or segovia

[yumpin]

If Page stole this then so did graham. Its based on an old folk song, and DADGAD is a very common tuning, also a sitar tuning (note the indian influences)  Graham didn't like page's version because he felt he didn't do justice to the original, which is because page usually combined it with Black mountain side. So get your facts straight. Many artists from this era 'borrowed' from folk music.

[awesomewelles90]

Being influenced by and imitating is fine and inevitable but Page ripped off many artists without giving ANY CREDIT! So they wouldn't get any royalties. That is just plain dishonest.

[yumpin]

your comment is irrelevant to the fact that if page ripped this song off, then so did graham, because neither of them wrote it. Yes, maybe he was/is dishonest, but that doesn't apply here.

[awesomewelles90]

@yumpin I wasn't talking in particular about this song.

However you're wrong that this could not be ripped off. If the interpretation of a song is so personalised then it can be ripped off.

[mussman717word]

In all honesty, Page threw completely original guitar parts into the old blues covers by Led Zeppelin. Not justifying "Black Mountain Side," which is complete plagiarism, but Led Zeppelin remade a lot of "decent" songs and made them great by changing a LOT of things. In most cases (this one excluded) the only part of a song left unchanged would be the words, and many of the words used in those songs were hardly poetic and often common phrases themselves.

Peace.

[awesomewelles90]

@mussman717word Even if that's true it was still dishonest to not give credit where it was due (to the original songwriters). Who should have got royalties etc.

[StragonRage]

fucking page

stole many great songs :/

[G58]

Haven't been able to read all the comments relating to the debate as to whether Page 'stole' or borrowed without attribution, but it seems to me that prog rock wasn't really about sharing with the roots tradition of folk, it was about being somewhat elitist. Crossover and collaboration came much later.

And anyway, this is a very old song.

So, as Woody Guthrie said, "He just stole from me, but I steal from everybody!"

But then I stole that quote from Pete Seeger!

[zed0469]

I doubt Page 'intended' to 'steal' the song from Davey Graham as there are subtle differences. As Johnny Cash once said: "Give me my briefcase, you know the one with all the songs I stole."

[G58]

Oh dear. I have no notion how or why this ludicrous argument got started in the first place. There was no intention because there was no theft.

Page couldn't have stolen the song because Davy Graham had no claim to it in the first place - it's an old song dating back to the 18th Century or maybe even earlier.

Please see my comprehensive reply to @gduke25 below. And it's Davy Graham, not Davey.

Was everyone here born five minutes ago?

[schummsy]

No, 47 years ago.

Does everyone here get smart with one another?

Musician - copied, created, don't know if I've always known which was which...

[gduke25]

@G58 i started this whole argument. i love Jimmy Page and i know that him as well as Plant had interest in folk music and Davy Graham obviously wrote this before Page. i think Page stole it because,,,,,,,i must leave more than one comment because it's so long.

[gduke25]

1. The guitar tuning is exactly the same and it's not a common tuning. instead of EADGBe it's tuned to like, DADGAD. yeah...

2. I've read a lot about Page, he as well as Plant, loved folk music and Davy Graham was an influence to him.

3. Page has written other songs that he didn't give full credit to the original writers such as dazed and confused, and Babe i'm gonna Leave You which he finally had to give credit to Joan Baez, after a legal argument.

[gduke25]

4. White Summer and this song are definitely the same song so where did page get his influence from. even if Graham wasn't the original artist like you claim Page is not the original is what i'm saying. and i believe strongly that he got his ideas for White Summer from this song by Davy Graham.

[gduke25]

@G58

you said "it seems to me that prog rock wasn't really about sharing with the roots tradition of folk, it was about being somewhat elitist."

1. Page loved Folk music

2. He was elite

3. His mission was to fuse blues and rock

4. He did it :p

[schummsy]

It's on "After Hours at Hull University, 4th February 1967" (RCCD 3021). I found it on a Mojo compilation, "The Roots of Led Zeppelin". Incidentally, if I hadn't heard Zep's "Black Mountainside" as a young teenager in the '70's, I may never have discovered this, Anne Briggs, Bert Jansch and a whole world of music. And if musicians hadn't 'stolen' songs down through the ages, those songs would have died. There. I feel better now.

[zenfreestyler]

This piece is from that Mojo compilation exactly, along with Bert Jansch's "Blackwater Side". That CD opened me up to blues music for the first time really. I literally downloaded the pic off google along with this piece from that CD and here you have it ;) Your comment makes this video worth it's while here on YouTube.

[KevyNova]

@schummsy

And if those songs were properly credited as they should have been, MILLIONS more people would know them today.

[zed0469]

True, good point

[NeverAloneForever]

@schummsy Ofcourse, if they had given credit then you would have heard of them even sooner.

[mdgab321]

@schummsy I ve never thought this way about 'stolen' songs. Indeed, searching for my very beloved "black mountainside" I came here. A whole new world revealed. Thank you for your comment, my friend..

[MrSluggo666]

@schummsy I think these songs would have lived whether you " rediscovered" them or not idiot !

[N8wood1]

anyone know where i could buy this? is it on i tunes? because if its not then thats bullshit. the only place i have heard this song is on here (youtube).

[8333P]

@N8wood1 This song is on the 36 track double CD compilation: Davy Graham - A Scholar and a Gentleman, released in 2009.

[EricDymond]

FFFFFFFF************* It's true. And I thought that that "Santa Clause is Fraud" feeling was gone when I was 8. Nope... lingered into early 20's.

FFFFfff....

[DADGADSB]

I tend to not think of it as "stealing" etc. Jimmy Page's mistake was not giving proper credit. He simply needed to announce before each performance that the song he was about to play was inspired by his personal heroes Davey Graham and Bert Jansch. I can't know if it was ego or shyness preventing him from saying this. Jimmy's talent and skill are beyond reproach however. At a very low level everyone who plays steals. I used an A Minor chord this morning. Who did I steal that from?

[zenfreestyler]

Shyness actually falls under ego as an emotion or feeling.

I'm unaware of Page specifically mentioning *not* "stealing" this from Davey Graham and Bert Jansch, but more so... I don't think it matters, especially if he said nothing at all, because at the time, I reckon ppl were already aware of all of the origons. Sure a large part of the reason why I uploaded this *medley* was so that people could become more conscious of the piece itself, and naturally, the fact that JP made his own rendition.

[Macleod1487]

@zenfreestyler I completely agree!! I am a drummer, and If i didn't rip off all of my musical favorites, I would have the sound i would today. With that plus putting my own feelings into the compositions, I believe that isi what music is all about!

[KevyNova]

@DADGADSB But Page DID register and copywrite the songs in his own name. That goes well beyond "not mentioning" where it came from live.

[schummsy]

Yeah, fair enough!

[MrSluggo666]

@DADGADSB Your insipid arguement isn't worth answering you are just stupid! a minor chord pfff idiot!

[HotspurJr]

@DADGADSB "He simply needed to announce before each performance that the song he was about to play was inspired by his personal heroes"

More like - all he needed to do was give them songwriting credit (and royalties) on the albums themselves, instead of crediting himself as the author of the songs. Look, I'm a huge Page and Zeppelin fan, but what made this really lame behavior was his claim - on the albums - that he wrote the songs. He didn't. 

[peregrinusnoctis]

@HotspurJr

Well-said.

Page's unwillingness to give proper credit where due makes him increasingly look like a brilliant but immoral technician, rather than an artist in his own right.

[theotherhepcat]

@HotspurJr

Not exactly, because both songs are old traditional folk songs; however, Page's renditions were - more or less - the same as Jansch and Graham... but the songs themselves are only identifiable by their melodies.

Therefore, Page could legally perform said songs and not give credit to Jansch or Graham as the tunes are still the traditional folk songs.

That said, what bothers me the most is that Page re-titled the songs for the Zeppelin albums - which is actually quite deplorable.

[mouse17101710]

@DADGADSB

I agree, not stealing but being influenced. My mate remembers his step dad recalling a story of him bumping into his old mate Davey Graham on Oxford Street back in the 60s and asking why his forefinger and middle finger were strapped together. DG had been to Morroco and was forcing himself to play a different (and rather demanding) right hand finger picking style. We all need influences to become what we are.

[peregrinusnoctis]

@DADGADSB

It can reasonably be stated that all modern (i.e., post-Enlightenment) artists understand the distinctions between origination and plagiarism, and that there exists a moral imperative to publicly acknowledge appropriation of another's work, and of traditional work. Page understood this, but for his own reasons (e.g., legal, financial, etc.), chose not to so do. Henceforth, his reputation will ever reap the consequences.

A chord is an element, like salt--rather than a dish or recipe.

[DADGADSB]

There is no way to deny that Page lifted about 80-90% of this for White Summer and 80-90% of Black Waterside for Black Mountainside.

I love Zep and Jimmy's work. Saw them at O2 in London but no one is perfect. Jimmy should have given proper credit. That's all. He didn't.

No one can take Kashmir away from Jimmy however. Kashmir is in the same tuning (DADGAD).

[seenherdressedinblue]

@DADGADSB Hopefully by now it's pretty understood that Zeppelin lifted most of their work from older blues or folk albums. I guess a lot of people still don't realize this. I saw this great show once called "Zeppelin was a Cover Band." It traced the roots of much of their music and lyrics, first making you think of them as thieves, and then making you respect them even more for it.

[N8wood1]

you all are missing the point. this song is a very old old song that people like davey graham take and make different variations of. its not davey grahams song. nor jimmys. its no one song. its been passed down from a long long time ago. its an old irish song. this is why graham wouldnt be able to sue jimmy for white summer. and i believe jimmy made his version of it more him and doing so i think he made (in my opinion) the best version of it. but i still love grahams version as well.

[EddieJVale]

so what?

[GazzaGlitta]

THIS IS PRO.

[metalburger2]

What Davey Graham intended with this song was to demonstrate his theory that there is a connection between middle eastern music and traditional Celtic music. Remember, he spent years studying Middle Eastern music and traveling the Orient, he also became well versed in many traditional middle eastern instruments such as the Arabian Lute. He borrowed the tuning of these instruments and applied it to guitar, developing DADGAD, which is a tuning now used primary by Celtic guitarists.

[seenherdressedinblue]

@metalburger2 Absolutely right. While a lot of Middle Eastern music uses shifting modes and microtones, the basis is still predominantly monophonic modal music. Celtic music, as well, still retained the traditional of monophonic modal music from the medieval times. And of course, in medieval times, the Moors were in Europe as were Celts...

[choadman1]

Page ripped this off indeed! But lots of artist rip each other off as well.Page also lifted Black Mountain Side from Bert Jansch "Black Waterside"..It's stealing if they don't give the original author the song writing credit.

[gduke25]

Jimmy Page did steal this....listen to White Summer by Led Zeppelin.....

[fertuan666]

just adapt it, shut up

[gduke25]

oh i love jimmy page and his music but..this was stolen.

[G58]

@gduke25, Let me introduce you to the concept of traditional songs & originators copyright.

This song was first collected in Donegal by poet Padraic Colum & musicologist Herbert Hughes, & published by Boosey & Hawkes in London in a work entitled Irish country songs in 1909. The tune is in mixolydian mode. The lyrics were also published in Colum's 1922 book Wild earth: & other poems (though the book doesn't mention their traditional origin).

[G58]

A longer variant of the song is called Our Wedding Day.

A related song, Out of the Window, was collected by Sam Henry, from Eddie Butcher of Magilligan, Northern Ireland, around 1930, and published in Henry's Songs of the People. Another song, I Once Had a True Love, also appears to be related, as it shares some lyrics with She Moved Through the Fair.

The traditional singer Paddy Tunney learned it in County Fermanagh and recorded it in 1965. All this happened before Jimmy joined The Yardbirds!

[jsilence418]

Amazon has quite a few of his albums .

[N8wood1]

where could i buy this song? anyone know??? i must have it.

[Oszych]

Very inspirating .

I know that even it was inspiration 4 Page's 'White Summer', Graham doesn't composet it, I think that he change traditional 'She Moved Throught teh Fair' in his interesting mind . . .

It's amazing for me how some songs can be sophisticated and has soul to be used and parafrazed so many times by so many different minds and conceptions and remain the same in core and still we can find beauty in them .

[theleequa]

why is everyone calling each other faggot?!?! i was enjoying the music and scrolled down to see what people were saying in the comments and it's a bunch of flaming that has nothing to do with the video. weird!

[stofbj]

clashboy1977 & DisposableHero187 get a room together yee would be a perfect match, because yee are both faggots, just listen to the music of Davey Graham and shut the fuck up. Do you both really think that we want to read or listen to your shit?

[DisposableHero187]

i mean cmon...everybody has borrowed other ppls songs one way or another,or atleast in traditional music. you cant call it plagiarism everywhere u see someone playing a song that isnt theirs... its been evident forever in ALL music that makes up the music we know today... All this came from bluegrass, folk, blues, etc. etc. and its this music that everyone used to "steal" that even started rock music in the first place. quit bein so fuckin anal about it.

[clashboy1977]

yeh nobody writes original fold songs? that is one of the most stupidest think's i've ever heard! so all of jake holmes, simon & garfunkel song etc etc arent original! hahaha

and oh yeh i'm so jealous of sum1 who has plagarised moe than anybody else coz i wish i was a crafty thief FAGGOTT!

[DisposableHero187]

Im talking about traditional folk songs and u fuckin know it! quit tryin to act like i dont know what im talking about! Anne Briggs didnt write she moved through the fair. its a TRADITIONAL Irish folk song. your getting folk songs and the folk genre confused, they are not the same. Your a Sabbath fan? if all those riffs are original i will eat my shoe. YOU can look that shit up. Listen to NIB and tell me that riff wasnt inspired by Sunshine of your Love by Cream. Its music bud, deal with it.

[clashboy1977]

wow 1 example. with 2 chords the same!

not all band copy other bands! if they did there'd be no pojt in even playing music or listening to it anymore!

[JohannVonGoethe1]

When Davy was introduced to Led Zeppelin, he told them "It's a pleasure to meet you Robert Page, and you Jimmy Plant." Such wit, and it shows the man had a lot more dignity to him than to allow himself to get so pent up about the issue.

Of course Led Zeppelin were terribly unfair in failing to give him any credit for covering his songs, or his arrangements of songs, but this sort of bickering was beneath him, and you should learn something from his ways.

[DisposableHero187]

i know that im saying your stupid because you dont understand how traditional music works. you wanna throw around useless words everywhere because you...fuckin suck at guitar lol

[DisposableHero187]

well if you wereny such a dumbass you might have looked on my page. it is Kashmir so an asshole like you cant appreciate that but its better than that bullshit you play. Buzzcocks? wtf?

[gab99]

It doesnt require our point of view - Graham went to is grave regarding Page as a thief having stolen his song. Page at no time made any effort to reference this tune even though Graham wrote it back in '63, well before Page had even "thought" of it, including the DADGAD tuning. The only thing Page brought to the masses regarding this song is ignorance and people thinking he wrote it! and of course that makes him a God of guitar blah blah blah

[DisposableHero187]

hey your exaggerating... Graham wasnt "outspoken" against page "stealing" his song. its obvious this guy is one of his major influences...whats wrong with that? and all this stuff about plagiarism...it has no base. o their albums they DID credit most who wrote the songs or they were marked as someone who wrote the song that just PERFORMED it.and people want to jump down their throats about that? its obvious thats who they BELIEVED to be the composer

[HullBloke1313]

If you don't knoe that it's true, maybe you shouldn't say it?

[subterranean47]

I've heard (don't know if its true) that Zeppelins a buncha tight asses when it comes to people playing their songs.

[anonymouslolxD]

This song is brilliant.

Sorry for not being controversial.

[subterranean47]

hahahahaha

I totally agree

Thank you

[OldBluesAndDubMusic]

Davy Graham is the nuts!

[Fusionartist202]

Yep,

That's about all you can say about that!

Trippy stuff for being back in the day!

[medic7698]

This, I think is a beautifully textured song and is up there with all the greats.  Sorry if that isn't contraversial.

[Ason19]

can you un disable this please?

[zenfreestyler]

Disable what man? :)

[Ason19]

"Embedding disabled by request"

please

[Ason19]

thanks now I can post this on my blog.

Have a great day.

[skyemozart]

I am sorry, Hendrix was not "Original". Everybody has lifted or "influenced" by someone. Beethoven lifted from Mozart who lifted from Haydn. I am a huge Page fan and his biggest fault is not openly acknowledging what he "lifted" but that's common in Blues/Folk/Rock. That way you don't have to pay Royalties!!!! To me Page leaves Hendrix in the dust in composition and technique but that's another argumen. Cheers.

[nigusberries]

greatest guitarist ever!!!

[volgodon]

No it isn't based on all those, it is Davey Graham's arrangement of the air to a traditional song and a little tune of his own.

[Claystone1]

although page borrowed quite a few ideas without crediting the arrangers/writers, he is still pure genuis and has a very distinctive quality to his playing which a lot of people lack

[xHendrixfan09]

Majority of pages licks were "borrowed" if that's what you want to call it. More like stealing and taking credit for others work if you ask me. A pure genuis doesn't have to steal music and not even give credit to the real creaters . Yea he was good but he was half a fake. You wanna see a pure genuis listen to daveys songs or hendrix. I'm not trying to bash page but its the truth.

[ludwigvan17]

That's bullshit that you're saying. I study music and every composer from Bach to Beethoven to Jimmy Page borrowed ideas. With music, it's impossible not to repeat an idea. It's what you do with the idea that makes you a genius and I speak for millions upon millions when I say that Jimmy Page was a musical genius.

[xHendrixfan09]

I've studied music also. Half of what page stole was almost completely note for note. You trying to argue this is like trying to say the sky isn't blue. Borrowing ideas or taking riffs and working them into your own is different then taking a whole section on a song almost completely note for note and saying it's your own music. He did it numerous times. I'm not going to argue this because you seem like some dude that's way to far on pages dick to ever accept facts. Hes good, but he stole music

[ludwigvan17]

I'm not here to argue either but he's an idol to me. I grew up listening to his albums and watching "Song Remains the Same". And you can't doubt that he is one of the GREATEST musicians of all time. I would have never known about Davey Graham if it weren't for Jim Page. Sure Graham came up with the idea but who was the one that brought it to us all? Jimmy.

[clashboy1977]

fuck how much msuic you've studied mate. the fact is zeppelen covered whole songs lyrics and everything and claimed they wrote them!

and its not impossible to not repeat an idea!

[ludwigvan17]

Idk. Peace.

[thecattleking]

"standing on the shoulders of giants" is the expression best suited. We are a blank slate, impressioned upon by our life, loves and experiences. subliminally.

Our hereditary inheritance may form our likes/dislikes (may). The origin of originality? when it all began. Hendrix, page, davy graham etc are pioneers, commercial or not, for a generation of people. Us.

[clashboy1977]

page was not a pioneer at all!

nothing he was doing was new at all!

[thecattleking]

like i said, standing on the shoulders of giants. Page opened a new audiences eyes. Commercially.

davy grahams scales used in his playing were "borrowed" from asian and arabian culture. So nothing new there either. Like i said, standing on the shoulders of giants. Your opinion may be very low of what Zeppelin did but it is undenible he had a lasting effct on music thru ripping off, what was at the time, primarily " black music" , By bringing it to the masses. So there

[medic7698]

Wise words my man

[clashboy1977]

as if i'm gonan listen to what a person calledwhose youtube name is disposable hero thinks.

i bet you think kirk hammett is a great guitarist! hahahahaha

[clashboy1977]

yeh sure watever!

[DisposableHero187]

ya thats why ur buzzcocks cover fuckin sucks and u get behind the beat on paranoid CONSTANTLY its bullshit lol.

[clashboy1977]

yeh yeh keep believing that. faggott!

[DisposableHero187]

haha its right there.u need to learn how to use your ears "clashboy" sounds like a bad gay porn star name lol

[clashboy1977]

man you must have no life to keep responding to me. LOSER!

[DisposableHero187]

ya? lol. go suck a dick

[clashboy1977]

intelligent!

[WatTyler13]

They never claimed to have written them. They were always credited. Anything else is a myth.

[clashboy1977]

if theyw ere always credited howecome zeppelin were sued 3 times?

[WatTyler13]

OK. I worded it badly.  I was responding to the idea that Led Zep ALWAYS stole tunes and NEVER gave credit. This is a myth.

[clashboy1977]

they didnt always steal tunes but they have stolen close to 20 songs and not credited the original artists!

[HullBloke1313]

Name those songs.

[clashboy1977]

go on my profile i made 3 videos about it

or just type in led zeppelin plagarism!

[HullBloke1313]

I'm not trying to be deliberately awkward here, but it would be much easier for you to list them, rather than me sit and watch 25 minutes worth of video.

[DisposableHero187]

your stupid clashboy. People have played other peoples songs their own way since folk songs have been around. This isnt new.... Zep brought this to the masses. Isnt that enough or are u that jealous you have to be a fucking woman about it? they must have done something right considering they are millionaires. get a life asshole!

[clashboy1977]

hey retard. yes people have covered folk songs since before zep but unlike page the CREDITED THE COMPOSERS.

get a life? you're the one who restared this arguement with me about 2 months later!

[DisposableHero187]

um....not really.thats why its called a fuckin folk song.why do u think no one knows who wrote most folk songs originally? lol. I think your just jealous is what it is

[e412n]

Nice I've been looking for this song on youtube for a while. RIP Dave.

[bassman3212]

whitesummer - jimmy page thats the one jimmy page took this song from him and and named it whitesummer he just made the song faster and davy graham is the master mind behind the mastermind jimmy page page also took stairway to heaven intro from this man as well

[megavega74]

bassman3212 , jimmy page took the intro of stairway to heaven from the band spirit. they toured together in late 60's.

[bassman3212]

megavega, i know he did but if you listen to " cry me a river" by davy graham the intro is stairway to heaven just picked alittle differnet..

[bush555]

Yeah stairway's intro is really common traditional folk guitar

[dragaoastro69]

Its normal in blues and folk to copy or emulate another artists songs and even lirics. Its common use. Jimi page did what dozens have done before. I mean, art is in fact just that: a continuing passage of ideas and values thrue history. Cheers!!! ;)

[bayernmunchen007]

.... art is not just that......

[hanghang71]

what led zep tune does this remind me of?

[bassman3212]

whitesummer jimmy page stoll whitesummer from this song lol

[2112eire]

Beautiful. RIP Davey.

[MiniHeus]

By many known as White summer/black mountain side. (-:

[zenfreestyler]

This is a medly, it is called "She moved Thru' the Bizzare/BlueRaga" based on "She Moved Thru' the Fair" by Anne Briggs along with Rory Gallagher's "Western Plain" and Jimmy Pages "White Summer/Black Mountain Side" and mostly this particular version merged with Bert Jansch's "Blackwater Side".

[iamfroman]

cool dude your the only one with this one :)