youtube is full of christians swearing at atheists, muslims, jews you xtians are vermin you do all kinds of shit then you accuse others of doing the same
God of the bible responcible for the present killing of the innocent in Nigeria. ppl killing killing their freiends and family because they belong to a different religion. how sick!
@mrlogicalman1 Great, ok, I ain't gon' argue with you. Your still just a kid, I know, It's okay. My point is that, if you retards are right why put up insulting dumb videos and setup
a crazy stupid talk-show called the Atheist experience to criticize us. yeah, Do you see US putting up a retarded talk-show called the Christian experience and criticize you, Atheist Retard. I just think that why so insecure when you think your right, ^^ dumbshit.
The problems with you atheists is that you just get a statement from the bible that you think is wrong and use it against us without even bothering to check the reason why it is. It's like using the statement "Robin Hood stole from the rich" in the Robin Hood book against it's fans without even bothering to check the statement "and gave to the poor". Now, try posting a statement in the bible where God tells his people to do wrong without a good cause or without stopping that person.
P.S. Sweden is the most atheistic country in the world, and I don't see any homophobia or brutality over there you were talking about in your comment.
ope, The Holocaust "Jews killed Jesus" stuff, discrimination against African-Americans (In your Bible God specifically stated that blacks are to be slaves), discrimination against women (It's smothered all over your Bible, read it) are all good examples of how Xtianity has caused violence in the past and today.
I am not generalizing Xtianity as a whole. Most Xtians I know are good people, but I am saying that pure Xtianity can and has caused violence at certain times.
..Correlation does not imply causation. If 2 soon-to-be born babies were in an operation room, and 1 was born at the same time as the other died, does that mean that the first baby's birth was somehow connected to the other's death? Possibly, but you can't validate a claim that the birth of the first baby was connected to the death of the second without proof. There is no proof that atheism causes violence. And no proof Xtianity causes viol-- Oh wait, the Crusades, blessed by the P
If this is not sarcasm (If it is, it's way too deep and needs to be emphasized)
..If only smart people read the bible,
would you consider atheistic contributions to society (i.e. science, which is the result of humans doing something other than praying
to a nonexistent god or a god that does not do anything to perform miracles) stupid? And since science benefits humans, how can you tell me that the only loving people are Xtians that don't contribute much to science at all?
hey, Soviet Union persecuted Christians by tossing them in prisons and taking their children from them. China is still persecuting Christians and many other countries completely deny any kind of religion at all! Yet all of these countries, including ex-Soviet Union, were the most racist, the most homophobic and brutal!! What did they base their homophobia on? I have to say that if you're homophobic, racist and evil, you will find any source to give you that excuse to be as such!!
bible was written by child rapists and is followed by child rapist priests st paul used to rape his own mum yet xtians listen to him sick . bible god MURDERS 1st born CHILDREN OF EGYPT why they have no sin evil. this pagan bible is full of incest rape murder child rape on and on and xtians follow this perverted book sick fucks. bible says all sins paid for by some1 else so sin away just what the devil says so prooves written by devil luke matthew john paul all were devils whores simple
@sajakram1 Now these are the kind of dumbshit comments that force us christian's to defend our religion. Now, if you look at history, christianity was here before atheism, and you tell that God is just man-made? look whos talking, bub, wasn't atheism invented also BY people? People who were ignorant to the truth and those people who are just scared of admitting their wrong. if you WERE right, why try so hard to prove us wrong? answer me that.
@kingnothing1046 And if this imaginary retard in the sky called ZEUS is real, then how come I cursed him a few years ago and look now, still fully functional and alive! whoop dee doo! and your point isss....?
@Domino1000ify Of course Zeus isn't real. Neither is any other God. And by the way, Atheism as a concept dates back to ancient Greece, long before Christ is even alleged to have walked the Earth.
@kingnothing1046 I'm sorry, are you offended? I thought this is what YOUR doing. And I'M the dumb one. I know this is un-christian but idc, It's just an eye for an eye my friend. I'm not really someone who is into these morals that much. Yeah I swear a lot but who cares
@Domino1000ify Heh, of course I'm not offended. I actually enjoy debate with people who have different view points, as long as that debate doesn't regress into petty argument.
I believe the "Song of God" by Azrael Ondi-Ahman reflects the mind of our true God who is extremely humane and benevolent. The biblical god, Jehovah Yahweh, is a blood-thirsty monster deserving of NO honor or worship. Praise be to our Heavenly Mother and Father, the true "God". Please check out the You Tube video series "Eroel", by Azrael.
Greed and ignorance has been the major causes or war crimes, genocide, and abuses, not the bible. The bible has been the excuse to justify their abuses against ignorant and defenseless masses.
But you forgot to mention that because of the gospel of Jesus Christ, hospitals were born, charity, help to other countries, , and even abolition of slaveryand so many good causes.
Your statement is misleading. The first paragraph, I can agree with. The second... just no. Most hospitals and charities are completely secular. Is your point that, if there were no religious people, there would be a shortage of charities and/or hospitals? That is a silly notion. Help to other countries, especially US foreign aid, is 99% secular as well. Abolition of slavery, in America and abroad, had absolutely NOTHING to do with religion either.
If you read in the story of Christianity, you will see the story of the hotels for the sick. This was the beginning of hospitals. There were accepted the sick poor, and people with terminal diseases. Giving to the poor is a practice that was born with Jesus and continue by the early Christians and early churches. That's the beginning of charity.
US aids is also because many Americans had been believers and believed on helping others. The majority support external Aid.
@ggonjon This may be so but many Christians today seem upset when they are told that there are a huge number of charities out there that promote that they are not affiliated with religion. Why? Because the thought of providing a starving person food while they convert to Christianity or Islam is disgusting. They need food, medicine and education not manipulation.
@ggonjon Let me raise these points also. With exception of some, most religious people when faced with death flee to the hospital. Medicine today in any modern civilization is based on science. Given the religious person does this they must have a lot of faith in science. Why not go to church and pray? So my question is, if they believe in science to save their life why do they crap on it when it show clearly the bible is wrong about many things? e.g start with Genesis.........
This is one of the reasons they give young kids those little copies of the new testament in churches. They can't possibly let those kids read the horrors of the old testament, even though christians profess that both testaments are "perfect".
Amen to that. Time to be spiritual and put and end to religion. Religious people can never unite because they believe evil has to exsist. This is nonsense, we have proven in the past that humans can collaborate and do great things. Time to leave outdated superstitious myths alone and embrace science & technology that could enhance everyone's lives today.
@AstroAntaAposAnarch That is a very complex question that would take pages to even begin to answer. It is based on empathy, experience and education in my regard. I might attempt a video on the subject. Folks who treat others opposite of how they themselves would want to be treated with no care or remorse would be in the running but that only covers the interpersonal area. This is a great question and I appreciate you asking it. Will be thinking on it.
@AstroAntaAposAnarch Same reason 1.7 billion folks follow the pedophile Mohammad and his evil god allah. People would rather believe in magic than do the hard work of living in reality. Evil god's make even the most vile person justified in their reprehensible conduct.
@Netwriter So why don't you follow the crowd? It's been my observation that the majority of the world (or Western world at least) prefers to take concrete reality over magic, ridiculing those that do.
@AstroAntaAposAnarch I wish that was the case here in the US. 76% claim to believe in an invisible super being in the sky, many claim to even have a personal relationship with this being. I hope I am understanding your question properly.
@Netwriter Well just because they claim to believe doesn't mean they actually do. I think for most of them it is just posturing, but that's just me. Would you agree then that those 76% are evil as well?
@AstroAntaAposAnarch I believe you are correct, many are christian in name only. That the vast majority ignore the teachings of their bible and follow the evolved morality of our secular society keeping them civil. The fundamentalist of all three abrahamic religions are a danger and a detriment to their societies. I reserve the term evil for only the most vile of humans so I would not put that label on but a small percentage and a good portion of those are just misguided and uneducated. IMO
@Netwriter On what basis do you judge people as evil or good? What do you use as a reference or measuring standard? I'm not passing judgement on you, I'm just curious.
@AstroAntaAposAnarch Because the bible is one of the smartest self propagating brainwashing fear based law enforcement viruses ever made. People even infect their own children and so on. We have governments and police now. Killing women who are raped is longer needed in the 20th century. Another reason, most people need to settle their mind, believing what a book says is easier than finding out the truth. The more religious a person is the less intelligent they are. Look it up.
@markdlowe "The more religious a person is the less intelligent they are."- Yeahhhh, I'm assuming you are a believer in reason and science, well might I remind you that our wonderfully ordered, logical, and scientifically shaped world was built on the works of religious men, men who had faith in the Creator of the Bible. Are you calling them ignorant? Seems they would need to be significantly intelligent in order to discover things like gravity, mass conservation, etc.
@AstroAntaAposAnarch The scientifically shaped world was built on the works of religious men who upon learning more facts were persecuted by their brethren when they found many many things defined in the bible were simply false. Some of the most important scientists that ever walked this earth were victims of the church and their antics. Thankfully at least for the most part scientists today don't have to fear being killed by the church, just put up with creationism spin doctors. IQ - Read stats
@AstroAntaAposAnarch And about the stats on religious IQ vs non religious IQ, yes this is what stats say. Again, look it up. BTW, the creator of the bible was man.
i was under the impression that islam developed at the same time as christianity so that the torah development did not matter to the religion of islam. am i wrong? other than that i go agree with you. i was raised in a christian household that turned into a born again household. i equate it to child abuse.
1: Certainly, not only would the jews have done less evil, but christians and all their harm wouldn't have been around. For one, the Taiping rebellion would not have occured.
2: Yes, and a bloody dream as well.
3: The Qur'an is more evil and vile than the bible, by a long shot.
"1 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Yisrayl, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.
3 And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink.
@cats122894 The Sabbath is Saturday. Christians worship their god on Sunday because he is a Sun god. Only Jews and Seventh day Adventists still keep the real Sabbath.
I agree, that the 3 religions of China, being Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism are vastly better thought through than any of the monotheist religions... but at the end of the day they are still religions, and therefore not true.
@KylieTasticUK Thanks for the heads up. Missed that field at upload and my last upload was Yakking with Yahweh. I failed to change it. It would be nice if youtube offered a category Theist non-Theist or The God Question.
Excellent video! Those who have committed evil in the name of christianity over the times have easily been able to find justification in the bible. And that, in my opinion, is good enough reason to call the bible evil. And the same goes for islam and the koran as well.
I often wonder what the world would be like today if the Romans hadn't adopted christianity and spread it out to their empire. Could the industrial revolution have occurred a 1000 years earlier and the dark ages been avoided?
The question of whether or not the Bible and the Quran are evil, can simply be answered by reading them without rose tinted glasses on and looking at the actions of people under the influence of them. The only questions that remains for me are 1. Are all religions evil? 2. Is there any place for religion outside the third world?
the problem with that metaphor is that the torah isn't explosive. he was right in that if there was no torah they would have adopted another religion that would lead them to do equally unspeakable things. the danger isn't the book, but people's perception of it as divine truth. no book should be seen in this light not because the book is explosive but because people are.
@sariwat1 Confucianism, maybe. Since it's all about respect and pseudo ancestor worship (pseudo because it's not really worship. More like high respect). But for Buddhism, I disagree strongly with that point, except if you are talking about the Zen part of Buddhism. Because sadly, most other forms of Buddhism only seem to bring about immobilism and constant status quo in society. Which is bad.
You could say many fairy tales are evil too in their original forms (i.e. "cautionary tales") if you take them in the context that it was good that the bad things happen to the children in them. The newer happy endings weren't in many of the originals. Were Bible stories in ancient times told as sort of cautionary tales where God is the greatest obstacle one could hope to overcome? I think that's an interesting question to explore. And I try to stay away from the word "evil" too.
we can never know if the world would have been better off if the abrahamic faiths never existed, unless we can peek at some alternate universes, but a lot of historical atrocities attributed to them may very well not have happened. Other atrocities MIGHT have happened, but we don't have enough data to draw any meaningful conclusions.
I love getting Christians when they say I am the devil for being an Atheist. I simply ask them so why is the Devil bad? God in the Bible kills millions and millions of people what did Satan do? Not that I believe in the Devil, but its funny to hear their answers. "He just is bad, ok." or something else just as lame.
All religious people I have spoken with tell me that all the evil that is committed in the name of their holy book is due to other people "doing it wrong." If only everyone would see things their way all that wouldn't happen. So basically all religious people think everyone else is doing it wrong.
It's "evil" by our modern morality. The problem is, we can't replay history without the Bible. Sure, the Bible has fueled a lot of "evil", and in this age it hinders the advancement of society. But going back through history, the religions have joined people together as groups with common laws. We look at some of the stuff they did as barbaric, but a primitive population may have been even more barbaric and uncivilized without these common ideas bringing them together. We can only speculate.
yes the bible is evil.. because people believe it is the word of a pretty nasty character.
Some people can't understand that if one does not know something, then its not a realistic or healthy position to accept the first explanation heard. One without evidence is worse, one with evidence to the contrary worse still!
Teaching people things (any things) that have no valid evidence or method of testing should be illegal. If we don't do that soon or enact something similar then we're fucked!
Mark Twain said it was the only book he would ban as he had been forced to read it as a child and never got over the horrors he discovered within its pages. He was replying to a Christian lady who was concerned about the corrupting effects of modern literature but still...
I don't know what history would have been like without it, imo such speculation is futile, but I do know that religion is rapidly becoming a problem, it may well be a luxury we can no longer afford.
@colourmegone a luxury we can no longer afford? that would be excellent if religion were a luxury!
Religion is pretty much cheap as you like on the resources scale... since its basically acceptance of an idea with no research or knowledge...education on the other hand is what costs the money!
However I do believe that education and information will kill off religion pretty sharpish this century... by 2050 people will look at you like an idiot if you mention you believe in such superstitions
@MumblingMickey Have you taken a good look at the Vatican lately? Or a mosque? Or for that matter the pyramids? And consider the cost in human suffering and death, the loss of generations to barbarism and ignorance after the Christians systematically destroyed ancient science and philosophy during the Roman Empire. The current strictures on scientific research, the deaths stemming directly from the condemnation of the use of condoms, etc, ad nauseum.
@colourmegone Yeah they do scab quiet a lot... but look at the other side of the coin... being omnipotent god is essentially unemployed...which means he needs others to donate so that he can continue to do good deeds like erm.... I dunno...earthquakes and tsunamis and whatnot... have you any idea how much a working second hand volcano costs on the open market these days?...and the operating costs are horrendous!
What I meant was that an idea or belief costs nothing.
@MumblingMickey A belief can cost you quite a lot and usually the people who give the most are those who are the least well off. Go to a service and look in the collection plate, I believe you'll find some substantial sums. It costs a lot of money to build churches and pay ministers and all the other paraphenalia of running a religion. Of course the god bit is free.
BTW I got a great deal on used tsunamis on eBay, buy 2 & get a free hurricane. Delivery was expensive though!
@colourmegone I have this image in my head of some poor FedEx guy trying to push the contents of a hurricane into the back of a transport aircraft... with his friend mopping up after the tsunami!
YEah I'd suppose that it takes its toll on the poor... its interesting that the largest buildings in poor areas are always the churches!
Maybe it should be taxed highly... they can have the tax back when they deliver the evidence there is a God to start with. I think thats ultimately risk free!
@colourmegone And when I say taxed highly...I was thinking around the 98% mark! Enough to ensure they make more money for society in these recessionary times than they coin for themselves.
That local tax can be then pumped back into the schools and hospitals of the local parish! Just so they don't think its not going to a good cause! I'm sure even fundamental Christians will agree with that! And the most fervent religious areas will get the best education! Lets see them survive that!
It is a book that has obviously caused many atrocities. The world seems to have been better without it, and religion would be confined so something perhaps created by europeans in place of christianity and islam or another religion might have popped up. Then there is also the point of hinduism and pagan religions.
The Quran seems the same as the bible. Haven't finished reading it, but so far it is no better. Maybe more poetic.
Time to end this experiment of religion. It has, for the most part, been a dismal failure largely because it continues to incorporate bronze age mentality into a scientific age of reason. The bible is full of fairy tales, many of them simply taken from supposed events that happened much earlier. "The Flood" was recorded in the Epic of Gilgmash and its date can be verified. Too many "believers" do not want to have to think for themselves and use the "forgiveness clause" to do as they please.
@brightsorcerer a lot of the jewish laws mentioned in leviticus and exodus are also in the laws of the Hammurabi... the book which gave the hittites their civil laws.
some are almost word for word...and the hammurabi laws predate all books of the bible by a millenia at least.
Any time I mention those laws to fundamental Christians its an immediate show stopper. You can almost hear their mind implode! The law about two men fighting is an excellent example.
@MumblingMickey Great post. Between the various Babylonian influences, Greek legends, and of course the Hammurabi, virtually none of the bible is unique in terms of teachings; another thing that brings a cringe to the face of the fundi. Or, as "the wisest man who ever lived" said, "There is nothing new under the sun."
On a side-note: Solomon being "wise" was always a crack-up to me. 1,000 wives.. exactly how is THAT wisdom? : )
@rationalmuscle yeah 1000 wives. I suppose that after they outlived their usefulness they were more than likely dispensed with. but I doubt there were 1000 of them. There would be conclusive genetic evidence of that and theres not... it was probably more like 10.
Same thing with the exodus... the bibles numbers would dictate that about 35% of the egyptian population left egypt and lived off the desert for 40 years. A million people who left no evidence of their existence! They simply vanished!
Interesting that you can buy tissues in boxes of 1000. They treated their wives somewhat like tissues I guess. As to the exodus, there is no archaeological evidence for it as you say. Instead the archaeologists point out the startling similarities between Moses and Hamurrabi's stories, suggesting that the whole Egypt thing was a misrepresentation of the Babylonian captivity.
@MumblingMickey Not a shred of evidence for any of it. It's really humorous when you look at the size of the desert. You could traverse it in a fraction of that, literally. There would be encampment upon encampment... not to mention all those chariot wheels in the Red Sea.
Long answer: Read it sometime, answer will be clear. Unless, of course, you define "evil" differently. As in, anything that isn't the "word of god" is evil. If that's the case, you're a slave (and possibly a jerk). Friends and family comes before any authority figure. You should listen to the people (and yourself), what they want and feel before anything else. Whether god exists or not is irrelevant for this mindset.
It's very interesting to note that historically speaking - ie. before the NT - the OT laws were believed to only pertain to the Jews. Therefore, the injunctions against murder, lust, theft, etc. only came into effect if both party's were Jews . . . if a Jew murdered a gentile or stole from a gentile, etc. this was not consider a transgression. The same goes for the hadith and koran - non-muslims are not considered to adhere to nor be under the protection of allah's laws.
I don't like the term evil in reference to anything, really. Evil implies an inherent malevolent nature that is seemingly without purpose or redemption, i.e. just doing something TO be evil or bad. I just think that God is representative of the people around the time the concept was conceived. Old Testament God was much like the average folks of those time and the New Testament God is a slight variation based on the people of that particular time.
@SeriousPsyche Based on the definition of the word evil applies. I supply the definition about a 1/4 into the video.
1. Morally reprehensible.
2. Archaic , causing discomfort or repulsion
3. Causing harm, marked by misfortune.
The evolution of the OT god to the NT god reveals the evolution of mankind's morality. We have evolved another 1800 years but some still hang onto to bronze age morality thinking themselves superior. I hope this video helps point that out. Thanks for your comment.
@Netwriter Don't get me wrong, I totally agree with your point. My only contention is that, okay under your definition, yes it's evil. But that's also human nature without a system of checks and balances. We've built that through our progression since the days of civilization. Really, it's just moving towards inclusion and equality for everyone, and since back then pockets of elites had power, power corrupts and they did do morally reprehensible things. I just prefer the term 'wrong' over evil.
How do you tell the difference between the OT God and the NT God ? They both seem pretty malevolent to me. What sort of entity sends its offspring to be tortured by savages so that in the future the god can torture the savages and their descendants in a newly minted hell ? The God of the Christians is focused on threats and torture, how is this notably different from the OT god ?
Threats of hell is just a threat, hell does not exist, therefore anyone threatening with hell is not like someone ordering to STONE women to death in the life time.
The point is, the God of the old testament was ordering genocides, and all sorts of barbrism to be put into practice by men during their life time not in the after life.
The God of the new testament, is more gentle with the teachings for other fellow human beings( like love your enemies, etc)
Of course the old testament and new testament are both a bunch of bs, but if you look at both, you can clearly see this "God"( which is simply the reflection of the people who thought him up) becomes more gentle in the New testament with the Jesus caracther, while he was very angry and violent in the ot.
Actually the whole "love thine enemy" thing is most likely a mistranslation. The same word used for love in Hebrew & Aramaic is also used to mean "know" and "rape". So "love thine enemy" could equally mean "know thine enemy" and "rape thine enemy". After all, who in their right mind loves their enemies ? Certainly no Jew I ever met.
What I was pointing out is simple fact. The same word in Hebrew means those three things, love, knowledge and rape. This isn't junk, it's fact, and your rejection of facts says more about you than it does about facts.
I didn't invent the Hebrew and Aramaic languages, I just learned enough to discover the truth about this part of the scriptures. One word with three meanings; to know=to love=to rape. There are plenty of words in most languages with multiple meanings. Why is this so hard for you to accept ? It is completely true, after all. Consider Judges 19:22, when the pervert Benjaminites demand the Levite be brought out that they may "know" (i.e. rape) him.
On the other hand, consider that if you threaten someone who is ignorant, gullible, and fearful with "hell", a place of eternal and unimaginable torment, they will in turn torture and burn their fellow human beings alive to avoid the threat of imaginary torment. Look at the history of Christianity, simply put, it's a bloodbath, and that bloodbath is fueled by threats of hell, and often encouraged by the images of hell.
@formless777 I do not agree with Christianity at all, but anyone with a brain can clearly see that the God of the old testament is way more aggressive, angry, violent, and evil.
The New Testament introduces a new type of God, he is more gentle.
By the way, many Christians interpret the verse of the bible taht talks about hell as the grave. Not all of them think as a fiery pit.
Your analysis of the OT god vs Jesus is superficial at best. And yes, Christians imagine hell in all sorts of ways, but none of them good, and all contain the idea of an eternal torment... Eternal torment in hell is Jesus' teaching. You will find no teaching more pernicious in the OT than that.
@formless777 You make a very good and valid point. The outrageousness of the Jesus story required the hook of hell and heaven to sell it. The character of Jesus is much softer than the OT god if only by small increments, but that is how evolution works. That is how I see it, but I could be wrong.
I don't think Jesus is that much softer that the OT god. Remember, Jesus invented hell as a place of eternal unremitting punishment without relief for people who didn't accept his every contradictory teaching. Hell didn't exist before Jesus came on the scene... except in Buddhism.
@SeriousPsyche Try this exercise (I did when I was a youth pastor): Take, say, Numbers 31. Replace the word "LORD" with "Gog" and "Israel" and variations thereof with "Gogites." Claim it's from an old Babylonian deity tale (not far from the truth.) See the reaction. Then try "Satan" and "his worshipers"... that's even more fun. You'll be shocked at (a) how little believers know the Bible; and (b) how EVIL this being's actions become.
When you tell them the truth, watch the rationalization.
@rationalmuscle Very true, i heard they tried this on schoolchildren to see how they would react, .. they virtually all likened the "Gogites" to Nazi's. But in it's original form, they could justify Gods actions.
@rationalmuscle We would call this being evil, of course. But I try to look at it from the people of the time and of the being itself (if it indeed existed, which I believe it doesn't, btw). Imagine in that time thinking of immorality and power. Think of the boredom and lack of entertainment. Then think of what we are entertained by, except take out the fiction. If God does exist, he's no different from what a human would enjoy: violence.
@SeriousPsyche Um . . . do you know what evil means, sir? I hate when people create arguments by tacking on extra meaning to words so that they can somehow manipulate a discussion. By indicating that evil is somehow an extreme word, wholly inaccurate in describing a book, you are attempting to manipulate those who try to be moderate. Luckily, I'm not one of those people. A book must be judged by the ideas it contains. The Bible endorses ideas which bring suffering to innocent people. It is evil.
@jgodby1 Stand down, solider. I'm just trying to be as objective as I can, in dealing with scientific primitives (authors of the Bible). I'd say it's less evil, then, back in those days as opposed to now. Just as a racist bias was common in the days leading up to the civil rights era. Those people weren't particular bad, that was just the culture they were in. I think the real evil people are those who purport these same primitive ideas in our enlightened age.
@SeriousPsyche "I don't like the term evil in reference to anything, really"
I agree. Good and evil are relative terms and should have no real use in 'enlightened' discussions. Of course Netwriter is, I hope, not attempting to preach to the choir, and so those who he wishes to persuade will need use of such language.
@bignastydragon Ehhh, I think he's preaching a bit and it's not at all a stretch to call God evil by our standards today, so you can score some points on it. I just want to take a different look at this old as shit conversation, then just "They are evil and we don't need an evil god to have morality"
@Freedomismyreligion Right, it is evil by our standards. But I want to look at this from a perspective that is outside of individual times. They didn't have much back then but their own power and honor/pride, so anything that challenged those two principles was dealt with harshly. If those acts were committed today (and in some parts of the world it is), I agree completely, it's evil. But all this was in an unenlightened period and shouldn't be compared to us today.
As I understand it, "evil" is a religious idea. That being someone who is possessed by "demons". I'm not sure even people are evil even in the common definition. Certainly some people are very bad and crazy. And certainly the bible is a very bad and dangerous book. (as well as the koran) And any other "holy book" which deludes people and helps them to justify horrible behaviour.
@wolfinside O.E. yfel..."bad, vicious, ill, wicked," "In OE., as in all the other early Teut. langs., exc. Scandinavian, this word is the most comprehensive adjectival expression of disapproval, dislike or disparagement" [OED]. Evil was the word the Anglo-Saxons used where we would use bad, cruel, unskillful, defective (adj.), or harm, crime, misfortune, disease. The meaning "extreme moral wickedness" was in O.E., but did not become the main sense until 18c.
This is from the Online Etymological Dictionary and is a cut down version due to space limitations but you can easily look up the citation @ "etymonline[dot]com. As you can see evil in its original sense had nothing to do with religion, the relation to moral wickedness was made in the 18th cent. It simply ment bad or harmful and keeps this sense today as well as the anti-moral definition.
I have seen the bible used as motivator for "Good" and also as a motivator for "Evil." I believe If you can know the contents of the bible well enough I seriously think you can easily justify anything (good or bad) that you want to just as long as you pull relevant scriptures up in the right order and spin them to meet the ends you, or others, may seek. This aspect of the bible gives the "authority of God" to mere men who can choose to use it on others for various gains.
It was not the book that ordered these things, but people with power over other people. Most of the time this all revolved around money of course. This book however, contains laws wich govern the lives of many many people. These laws are ment to protect the people from one another. And to prevent the lower layers of society from killing those with wealth :) Also, the Bible can be interpreted in many ways, just like many other books. It depends on the reader which one he chooses to believe in.
EEEEEVVVVVVVVIIIIIIIIIILLLLLLLL HHA HAA HA
CV7E 1 week ago
youtube is full of christians swearing at atheists, muslims, jews you xtians are vermin you do all kinds of shit then you accuse others of doing the same
mrlogicalman1 2 weeks ago
God of the bible responcible for the present killing of the innocent in Nigeria. ppl killing killing their freiends and family because they belong to a different religion. how sick!
ifeness24 2 weeks ago
christians have been around 400yrs. not with permission from god . atheists have been around thousands of years. xtian retard.
mrlogicalman1 3 weeks ago
@mrlogicalman1 Great, ok, I ain't gon' argue with you. Your still just a kid, I know, It's okay. My point is that, if you retards are right why put up insulting dumb videos and setup
a crazy stupid talk-show called the Atheist experience to criticize us. yeah, Do you see US putting up a retarded talk-show called the Christian experience and criticize you, Atheist Retard. I just think that why so insecure when you think your right, ^^ dumbshit.
Domino1000ify 2 weeks ago
The problems with you atheists is that you just get a statement from the bible that you think is wrong and use it against us without even bothering to check the reason why it is. It's like using the statement "Robin Hood stole from the rich" in the Robin Hood book against it's fans without even bothering to check the statement "and gave to the poor". Now, try posting a statement in the bible where God tells his people to do wrong without a good cause or without stopping that person.
Domino1000ify 4 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify So your unchanging and omni-god operates with situational ethics and morality. Nice
Netwriter 3 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify Excellent example, especially considering they are both fiction.
kingnothing1046 3 weeks ago
God massacres babies and infants. Of course the Bible is evil. Don't believe me, google it.
metalsusa1 1 month ago
It's not a debate if one side if full of shit. *cough* religion *cough*
DylanTheVillyn 1 month ago
Bible.
Using your logic, you could assume that since Adolf Hitler is a German and he committed atrocities, all Germans commit atrocities.
newvultraz 2 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch
Correlation does not imply causation.
Isaac Newton did not dig his theory out of a
newvultraz 2 months ago
@RadarGuidedVermin
No, it's YOU who needs to get an education. Whether periods go inside or outside double quotations is entirely situational.
newvultraz 2 months ago
@ggjon
Hitler killed Jews by believing they had done wrong when they were all praising the suggestion to crucify Jesus.
He would not have killed them without a reason. Greed and ignorance do not play a part in the Holocaust. Hitler specifically
stated his Xtian views in Mein Kampf, and on every Nazi belt buckle reads the words "God With Us" in German.
newvultraz 2 months ago
P.S. Sweden is the most atheistic country in the world, and I don't see any homophobia or brutality over there you were talking about in your comment.
newvultraz 2 months ago
ope, The Holocaust "Jews killed Jesus" stuff, discrimination against African-Americans (In your Bible God specifically stated that blacks are to be slaves), discrimination against women (It's smothered all over your Bible, read it) are all good examples of how Xtianity has caused violence in the past and today.
I am not generalizing Xtianity as a whole. Most Xtians I know are good people, but I am saying that pure Xtianity can and has caused violence at certain times.
newvultraz 2 months ago
@NickKhivrin
..Correlation does not imply causation. If 2 soon-to-be born babies were in an operation room, and 1 was born at the same time as the other died, does that mean that the first baby's birth was somehow connected to the other's death? Possibly, but you can't validate a claim that the birth of the first baby was connected to the death of the second without proof. There is no proof that atheism causes violence. And no proof Xtianity causes viol-- Oh wait, the Crusades, blessed by the P
newvultraz 2 months ago
@luxunity
If this is not sarcasm (If it is, it's way too deep and needs to be emphasized)
..If only smart people read the bible,
would you consider atheistic contributions to society (i.e. science, which is the result of humans doing something other than praying
to a nonexistent god or a god that does not do anything to perform miracles) stupid? And since science benefits humans, how can you tell me that the only loving people are Xtians that don't contribute much to science at all?
newvultraz 2 months ago
I WILL WIPE MY ASS WITH BIBLE ..LOL
RaVaanMeraNaam 2 months ago
BIBLE IS TRASHHHHHHHHH
RaVaanMeraNaam 2 months ago
thanks Netwriter!! yes, the bible is an evil book for those that reason and lives with WISDOM !!!!! love and lights to ALL
luxunity 3 months ago
hey, Soviet Union persecuted Christians by tossing them in prisons and taking their children from them. China is still persecuting Christians and many other countries completely deny any kind of religion at all! Yet all of these countries, including ex-Soviet Union, were the most racist, the most homophobic and brutal!! What did they base their homophobia on? I have to say that if you're homophobic, racist and evil, you will find any source to give you that excuse to be as such!!
NickKhivren 3 months ago
bible was written by child rapists and is followed by child rapist priests st paul used to rape his own mum yet xtians listen to him sick . bible god MURDERS 1st born CHILDREN OF EGYPT why they have no sin evil. this pagan bible is full of incest rape murder child rape on and on and xtians follow this perverted book sick fucks. bible says all sins paid for by some1 else so sin away just what the devil says so prooves written by devil luke matthew john paul all were devils whores simple
sajakram1 3 months ago 3
@sajakram1 Now these are the kind of dumbshit comments that force us christian's to defend our religion. Now, if you look at history, christianity was here before atheism, and you tell that God is just man-made? look whos talking, bub, wasn't atheism invented also BY people? People who were ignorant to the truth and those people who are just scared of admitting their wrong. if you WERE right, why try so hard to prove us wrong? answer me that.
Domino1000ify 4 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify And Zeus was around before Christianity. What's your point?
kingnothing1046 3 weeks ago
@kingnothing1046 And if this imaginary retard in the sky called ZEUS is real, then how come I cursed him a few years ago and look now, still fully functional and alive! whoop dee doo! and your point isss....?
Domino1000ify 2 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify Of course Zeus isn't real. Neither is any other God. And by the way, Atheism as a concept dates back to ancient Greece, long before Christ is even alleged to have walked the Earth.
kingnothing1046 2 weeks ago
@kingnothing1046 So you DO accept that Christ did walk the earth. wow, you atheists aren't as wise as you seem to be.
Domino1000ify 2 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify Actually, notice I said "alleged".
kingnothing1046 2 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify So being right means not trying to prove the other person wrong? I'm confused, because isn't that what you're doing?
kingnothing1046 2 weeks ago
@kingnothing1046 I'm sorry, are you offended? I thought this is what YOUR doing. And I'M the dumb one. I know this is un-christian but idc, It's just an eye for an eye my friend. I'm not really someone who is into these morals that much. Yeah I swear a lot but who cares
Domino1000ify 2 weeks ago
@Domino1000ify Heh, of course I'm not offended. I actually enjoy debate with people who have different view points, as long as that debate doesn't regress into petty argument.
kingnothing1046 2 weeks ago
Religion is a disease of the mind.
dutchgoing 3 months ago 2
I believe the "Song of God" by Azrael Ondi-Ahman reflects the mind of our true God who is extremely humane and benevolent. The biblical god, Jehovah Yahweh, is a blood-thirsty monster deserving of NO honor or worship. Praise be to our Heavenly Mother and Father, the true "God". Please check out the You Tube video series "Eroel", by Azrael.
rnoodle3 4 months ago
Wonderful Video! And also TRUTHFUL! What said is ALL TRUTH!
flightkiller09 7 months ago
no IT ISN'T evil. The Old Testament is profitable for , teaching and reproof.
SpringChatty 7 months ago
Your video is misleading.
Greed and ignorance has been the major causes or war crimes, genocide, and abuses, not the bible. The bible has been the excuse to justify their abuses against ignorant and defenseless masses.
But you forgot to mention that because of the gospel of Jesus Christ, hospitals were born, charity, help to other countries, , and even abolition of slaveryand so many good causes.
ggonjon 7 months ago
@ggonjon
Your statement is misleading. The first paragraph, I can agree with. The second... just no. Most hospitals and charities are completely secular. Is your point that, if there were no religious people, there would be a shortage of charities and/or hospitals? That is a silly notion. Help to other countries, especially US foreign aid, is 99% secular as well. Abolition of slavery, in America and abroad, had absolutely NOTHING to do with religion either.
Try again.
steviej321 5 months ago
@steviej321
If you read in the story of Christianity, you will see the story of the hotels for the sick. This was the beginning of hospitals. There were accepted the sick poor, and people with terminal diseases. Giving to the poor is a practice that was born with Jesus and continue by the early Christians and early churches. That's the beginning of charity.
US aids is also because many Americans had been believers and believed on helping others. The majority support external Aid.
ggonjon 5 months ago
@ggonjon This may be so but many Christians today seem upset when they are told that there are a huge number of charities out there that promote that they are not affiliated with religion. Why? Because the thought of providing a starving person food while they convert to Christianity or Islam is disgusting. They need food, medicine and education not manipulation.
markdlowe 4 months ago
@ggonjon Let me raise these points also. With exception of some, most religious people when faced with death flee to the hospital. Medicine today in any modern civilization is based on science. Given the religious person does this they must have a lot of faith in science. Why not go to church and pray? So my question is, if they believe in science to save their life why do they crap on it when it show clearly the bible is wrong about many things? e.g start with Genesis.........
markdlowe 4 months ago
@ggonjon Are you seriously claiming there was no charity & no 1 gave to the poor before Jesus?
Strangerinasland 3 months ago
@ggonjon Don't forget all those nice Catholic missionaries who force their beliefs on poor unsuspecting indigenous peoples.
kingnothing1046 2 weeks ago
This is one of the reasons they give young kids those little copies of the new testament in churches. They can't possibly let those kids read the horrors of the old testament, even though christians profess that both testaments are "perfect".
jerico641 8 months ago
@jerico641 Periods go inside quotation marks, idiot. Get an education.
RadarGuidedVermin 8 months ago
Amen to that. Time to be spiritual and put and end to religion. Religious people can never unite because they believe evil has to exsist. This is nonsense, we have proven in the past that humans can collaborate and do great things. Time to leave outdated superstitious myths alone and embrace science & technology that could enhance everyone's lives today.
creamone 9 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch That is a very complex question that would take pages to even begin to answer. It is based on empathy, experience and education in my regard. I might attempt a video on the subject. Folks who treat others opposite of how they themselves would want to be treated with no care or remorse would be in the running but that only covers the interpersonal area. This is a great question and I appreciate you asking it. Will be thinking on it.
Netwriter 9 months ago
@Netwriter Glad to provide some inspiration. I'll be looking foward to that video.
AstroAntaAposAnarch 9 months ago
If the GOD of the Bible is so evil, then why would people follow Him at all?
AstroAntaAposAnarch 9 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch Same reason 1.7 billion folks follow the pedophile Mohammad and his evil god allah. People would rather believe in magic than do the hard work of living in reality. Evil god's make even the most vile person justified in their reprehensible conduct.
"A man is as evil as the god he worships"
- Gali Yonvadisi
Netwriter 9 months ago 8
@Netwriter So why don't you follow the crowd? It's been my observation that the majority of the world (or Western world at least) prefers to take concrete reality over magic, ridiculing those that do.
AstroAntaAposAnarch 9 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch I wish that was the case here in the US. 76% claim to believe in an invisible super being in the sky, many claim to even have a personal relationship with this being. I hope I am understanding your question properly.
Netwriter 9 months ago 2
@Netwriter Well just because they claim to believe doesn't mean they actually do. I think for most of them it is just posturing, but that's just me. Would you agree then that those 76% are evil as well?
AstroAntaAposAnarch 9 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch I believe you are correct, many are christian in name only. That the vast majority ignore the teachings of their bible and follow the evolved morality of our secular society keeping them civil. The fundamentalist of all three abrahamic religions are a danger and a detriment to their societies. I reserve the term evil for only the most vile of humans so I would not put that label on but a small percentage and a good portion of those are just misguided and uneducated. IMO
Netwriter 9 months ago 3
This has been flagged as spam show
@Netwriter On what basis do you judge people as evil or good? What do you use as a reference or measuring standard? I'm not passing judgement on you, I'm just curious.
AstroAntaAposAnarch 9 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch Because the bible is one of the smartest self propagating brainwashing fear based law enforcement viruses ever made. People even infect their own children and so on. We have governments and police now. Killing women who are raped is longer needed in the 20th century. Another reason, most people need to settle their mind, believing what a book says is easier than finding out the truth. The more religious a person is the less intelligent they are. Look it up.
markdlowe 4 months ago
@markdlowe "The more religious a person is the less intelligent they are."- Yeahhhh, I'm assuming you are a believer in reason and science, well might I remind you that our wonderfully ordered, logical, and scientifically shaped world was built on the works of religious men, men who had faith in the Creator of the Bible. Are you calling them ignorant? Seems they would need to be significantly intelligent in order to discover things like gravity, mass conservation, etc.
AstroAntaAposAnarch 4 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch The scientifically shaped world was built on the works of religious men who upon learning more facts were persecuted by their brethren when they found many many things defined in the bible were simply false. Some of the most important scientists that ever walked this earth were victims of the church and their antics. Thankfully at least for the most part scientists today don't have to fear being killed by the church, just put up with creationism spin doctors. IQ - Read stats
markdlowe 4 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch And about the stats on religious IQ vs non religious IQ, yes this is what stats say. Again, look it up. BTW, the creator of the bible was man.
markdlowe 4 months ago
@AstroAntaAposAnarch Because the bible is designed to create control by fear. lol. [insert southern bible belt accent] "And that's the bottom line!"
markdlowe 4 months ago
Some of the truest words ever written/spoken, come from Frank Herbert's "Dune".
"Fear is the mind killer"
ShaggyShagz13 10 months ago
nice channel
AtheistJews 11 months ago
i was under the impression that islam developed at the same time as christianity so that the torah development did not matter to the religion of islam. am i wrong? other than that i go agree with you. i was raised in a christian household that turned into a born again household. i equate it to child abuse.
HidingFromEveryone 1 year ago
This video brings to mind the words of Thomas Paine: Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man.
Turandot29 1 year ago 2
Good video, interesting.
Imo, just keep the book and state seperated.
RockTheOcean4me 1 year ago
Well, to put it this way: ´The Chainsaw Massacre´ is less violent than the Bible .
Hemulen40 1 year ago
1: Certainly, not only would the jews have done less evil, but christians and all their harm wouldn't have been around. For one, the Taiping rebellion would not have occured.
2: Yes, and a bloody dream as well.
3: The Qur'an is more evil and vile than the bible, by a long shot.
daemonowner 1 year ago
The bible: The bane of human existence.
MisterMatthewRoberts 1 year ago
yes yes yes yes
KYKIN44 1 year ago
Whether the bible is evil or not is meaningless to me! What concerns me is the amount of evil the god of the bible has his chosen people do!
mythicalhell 1 year ago
Favorited.. excellent video friend!
sheri226 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Joel 3
"1 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Yisrayl, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.
3 And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink.
derekdb2 1 year ago
you said "Saturday workers" rather than "Sunday workers" but it was a VERY good video. well thought out, and very good. =)
cats122894 1 year ago
@cats122894 The Sabbath is Saturday. Christians worship their god on Sunday because he is a Sun god. Only Jews and Seventh day Adventists still keep the real Sabbath.
Thanks for your kind words.
Netwriter 1 year ago 6
@Netwriter Liked ✔ subbed ✔ I have also had this sat./sun debate many times.
Good work!
pumpstations 1 year ago
@Netwriter Wow, i did not know that. *shamelessly insert the cliche* i guess you learn something new everyday =) thanks. keep up the good work!
cats122894 1 year ago
@Netwriter, the "real Sabbath" ?? Do you actually believe there *is* a real Sabbath?
Turandot29 1 year ago
I agree, that the 3 religions of China, being Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism are vastly better thought through than any of the monotheist religions... but at the end of the day they are still religions, and therefore not true.
formless777 1 year ago
very good video, Sir.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
Add to Favorites. Like. Share. Download. Live it, Love it. Great work, keep it up. auf wiedersehen.
TheEarthAbides 1 year ago
Category: Comedy?
KylieTasticUK 1 year ago
@KylieTasticUK Thanks for the heads up. Missed that field at upload and my last upload was Yakking with Yahweh. I failed to change it. It would be nice if youtube offered a category Theist non-Theist or The God Question.
Netwriter 1 year ago
Excellent video! Those who have committed evil in the name of christianity over the times have easily been able to find justification in the bible. And that, in my opinion, is good enough reason to call the bible evil. And the same goes for islam and the koran as well.
I often wonder what the world would be like today if the Romans hadn't adopted christianity and spread it out to their empire. Could the industrial revolution have occurred a 1000 years earlier and the dark ages been avoided?
detersgumig 1 year ago
excellent logic
humbleu 1 year ago
It is a manual for evil with detailed instructions.
groovyengineer 1 year ago 4
The question of whether or not the Bible and the Quran are evil, can simply be answered by reading them without rose tinted glasses on and looking at the actions of people under the influence of them. The only questions that remains for me are 1. Are all religions evil? 2. Is there any place for religion outside the third world?
NO1Mensan 1 year ago
This is why I call the bible "The Holy Toilet Paper" in my "Christian Inventions" series
manlioman 1 year ago
Any book that incites harm to others is Evil. The Bible is just one of those books.
pilgrimpater 1 year ago
the problem with that metaphor is that the torah isn't explosive. he was right in that if there was no torah they would have adopted another religion that would lead them to do equally unspeakable things. the danger isn't the book, but people's perception of it as divine truth. no book should be seen in this light not because the book is explosive but because people are.
anoldcrow 1 year ago
thanks for ur time and effort, and well said
drinkycrow67 1 year ago
most jews today are like that
adirm18 1 year ago
Loved your proposition at 7:55
No Torah = No Judaism, etc etc. It's something I hadn't considered before.
Looks like Darwin was right ... everything evolves!!
Great video, well presented.
bonnie43uk 1 year ago
Buddhism and Confucianism is the best philosophy mankind should embrace.
sariwat1 1 year ago
@sariwat1 Confucianism, maybe. Since it's all about respect and pseudo ancestor worship (pseudo because it's not really worship. More like high respect). But for Buddhism, I disagree strongly with that point, except if you are talking about the Zen part of Buddhism. Because sadly, most other forms of Buddhism only seem to bring about immobilism and constant status quo in society. Which is bad.
TheGoodColonel 1 year ago
@sariwat1 don't forget Taoism! :D
WalleWildberrie 1 year ago
number 2. I think that Christianity does not imply Islam. Its definitely still going to be around even without the arrival of Christianity.
aslowburnpdx1986 1 year ago
You could say many fairy tales are evil too in their original forms (i.e. "cautionary tales") if you take them in the context that it was good that the bad things happen to the children in them. The newer happy endings weren't in many of the originals. Were Bible stories in ancient times told as sort of cautionary tales where God is the greatest obstacle one could hope to overcome? I think that's an interesting question to explore. And I try to stay away from the word "evil" too.
seanotube85 1 year ago
we can never know if the world would have been better off if the abrahamic faiths never existed, unless we can peek at some alternate universes, but a lot of historical atrocities attributed to them may very well not have happened. Other atrocities MIGHT have happened, but we don't have enough data to draw any meaningful conclusions.
wakeangel2001 1 year ago
I love getting Christians when they say I am the devil for being an Atheist. I simply ask them so why is the Devil bad? God in the Bible kills millions and millions of people what did Satan do? Not that I believe in the Devil, but its funny to hear their answers. "He just is bad, ok." or something else just as lame.
bullwhipjesus 1 year ago 4
@bullwhipjesus lmao nice i will have to use that
DatSkinnyWhiteGirl 1 year ago
@bullwhipjesus
That's a good one...
xxSilverPhinxx 1 year ago
Netwriter, you forgot petty, the god of the bible is very petty.
TheRedneckAtheist 1 year ago 20
All religious people I have spoken with tell me that all the evil that is committed in the name of their holy book is due to other people "doing it wrong." If only everyone would see things their way all that wouldn't happen. So basically all religious people think everyone else is doing it wrong.
WarmWeatherGuy 1 year ago
Awesome as always @Netwriter
SgtDICTION 1 year ago
It's "evil" by our modern morality. The problem is, we can't replay history without the Bible. Sure, the Bible has fueled a lot of "evil", and in this age it hinders the advancement of society. But going back through history, the religions have joined people together as groups with common laws. We look at some of the stuff they did as barbaric, but a primitive population may have been even more barbaric and uncivilized without these common ideas bringing them together. We can only speculate.
GreatestJason 1 year ago
Yes it is.
Nagneto 1 year ago
yes the bible is evil.. because people believe it is the word of a pretty nasty character.
Some people can't understand that if one does not know something, then its not a realistic or healthy position to accept the first explanation heard. One without evidence is worse, one with evidence to the contrary worse still!
Teaching people things (any things) that have no valid evidence or method of testing should be illegal. If we don't do that soon or enact something similar then we're fucked!
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
Mark Twain said it was the only book he would ban as he had been forced to read it as a child and never got over the horrors he discovered within its pages. He was replying to a Christian lady who was concerned about the corrupting effects of modern literature but still...
I don't know what history would have been like without it, imo such speculation is futile, but I do know that religion is rapidly becoming a problem, it may well be a luxury we can no longer afford.
colourmegone 1 year ago
@colourmegone a luxury we can no longer afford? that would be excellent if religion were a luxury!
Religion is pretty much cheap as you like on the resources scale... since its basically acceptance of an idea with no research or knowledge...education on the other hand is what costs the money!
However I do believe that education and information will kill off religion pretty sharpish this century... by 2050 people will look at you like an idiot if you mention you believe in such superstitions
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
@MumblingMickey Have you taken a good look at the Vatican lately? Or a mosque? Or for that matter the pyramids? And consider the cost in human suffering and death, the loss of generations to barbarism and ignorance after the Christians systematically destroyed ancient science and philosophy during the Roman Empire. The current strictures on scientific research, the deaths stemming directly from the condemnation of the use of condoms, etc, ad nauseum.
Religion is many things but it ain't cheap!
colourmegone 1 year ago
@colourmegone Yeah they do scab quiet a lot... but look at the other side of the coin... being omnipotent god is essentially unemployed...which means he needs others to donate so that he can continue to do good deeds like erm.... I dunno...earthquakes and tsunamis and whatnot... have you any idea how much a working second hand volcano costs on the open market these days?...and the operating costs are horrendous!
What I meant was that an idea or belief costs nothing.
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
@MumblingMickey A belief can cost you quite a lot and usually the people who give the most are those who are the least well off. Go to a service and look in the collection plate, I believe you'll find some substantial sums. It costs a lot of money to build churches and pay ministers and all the other paraphenalia of running a religion. Of course the god bit is free.
BTW I got a great deal on used tsunamis on eBay, buy 2 & get a free hurricane. Delivery was expensive though!
colourmegone 1 year ago
@colourmegone I have this image in my head of some poor FedEx guy trying to push the contents of a hurricane into the back of a transport aircraft... with his friend mopping up after the tsunami!
YEah I'd suppose that it takes its toll on the poor... its interesting that the largest buildings in poor areas are always the churches!
Maybe it should be taxed highly... they can have the tax back when they deliver the evidence there is a God to start with. I think thats ultimately risk free!
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
@colourmegone And when I say taxed highly...I was thinking around the 98% mark! Enough to ensure they make more money for society in these recessionary times than they coin for themselves.
That local tax can be then pumped back into the schools and hospitals of the local parish! Just so they don't think its not going to a good cause! I'm sure even fundamental Christians will agree with that! And the most fervent religious areas will get the best education! Lets see them survive that!
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
It is a book that has obviously caused many atrocities. The world seems to have been better without it, and religion would be confined so something perhaps created by europeans in place of christianity and islam or another religion might have popped up. Then there is also the point of hinduism and pagan religions.
The Quran seems the same as the bible. Haven't finished reading it, but so far it is no better. Maybe more poetic.
Aresftfun 1 year ago 3
Time to end this experiment of religion. It has, for the most part, been a dismal failure largely because it continues to incorporate bronze age mentality into a scientific age of reason. The bible is full of fairy tales, many of them simply taken from supposed events that happened much earlier. "The Flood" was recorded in the Epic of Gilgmash and its date can be verified. Too many "believers" do not want to have to think for themselves and use the "forgiveness clause" to do as they please.
brightsorcerer 1 year ago
@brightsorcerer a lot of the jewish laws mentioned in leviticus and exodus are also in the laws of the Hammurabi... the book which gave the hittites their civil laws.
some are almost word for word...and the hammurabi laws predate all books of the bible by a millenia at least.
Any time I mention those laws to fundamental Christians its an immediate show stopper. You can almost hear their mind implode! The law about two men fighting is an excellent example.
Hammurrabi 206:211
Bible Ex 21:18
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
@MumblingMickey Great post. Between the various Babylonian influences, Greek legends, and of course the Hammurabi, virtually none of the bible is unique in terms of teachings; another thing that brings a cringe to the face of the fundi. Or, as "the wisest man who ever lived" said, "There is nothing new under the sun."
On a side-note: Solomon being "wise" was always a crack-up to me. 1,000 wives.. exactly how is THAT wisdom? : )
rationalmuscle 1 year ago
@rationalmuscle yeah 1000 wives. I suppose that after they outlived their usefulness they were more than likely dispensed with. but I doubt there were 1000 of them. There would be conclusive genetic evidence of that and theres not... it was probably more like 10.
Same thing with the exodus... the bibles numbers would dictate that about 35% of the egyptian population left egypt and lived off the desert for 40 years. A million people who left no evidence of their existence! They simply vanished!
MumblingMickey 1 year ago
@MumblingMickey
Interesting that you can buy tissues in boxes of 1000. They treated their wives somewhat like tissues I guess. As to the exodus, there is no archaeological evidence for it as you say. Instead the archaeologists point out the startling similarities between Moses and Hamurrabi's stories, suggesting that the whole Egypt thing was a misrepresentation of the Babylonian captivity.
formless777 1 year ago
@MumblingMickey Not a shred of evidence for any of it. It's really humorous when you look at the size of the desert. You could traverse it in a fraction of that, literally. There would be encampment upon encampment... not to mention all those chariot wheels in the Red Sea.
rationalmuscle 1 year ago
Short answer: Yes
Long answer: Read it sometime, answer will be clear. Unless, of course, you define "evil" differently. As in, anything that isn't the "word of god" is evil. If that's the case, you're a slave (and possibly a jerk). Friends and family comes before any authority figure. You should listen to the people (and yourself), what they want and feel before anything else. Whether god exists or not is irrelevant for this mindset.
piip4 1 year ago
It's very interesting to note that historically speaking - ie. before the NT - the OT laws were believed to only pertain to the Jews. Therefore, the injunctions against murder, lust, theft, etc. only came into effect if both party's were Jews . . . if a Jew murdered a gentile or stole from a gentile, etc. this was not consider a transgression. The same goes for the hadith and koran - non-muslims are not considered to adhere to nor be under the protection of allah's laws.
rictusgate 1 year ago
@rictusgate
"non-muslims are not considered to adhere to nor be under the protection of allah's laws."
Yeah... muslims should probably be made aware of that when non-muslims draw cartoons of allah or mohammad!
But thats part of the bullshit of religion... Islamic clerics have the opportunity to point it out. but they deliberately keep their mouth shut...
Same with Christians... its all push, push, push. However now that we have serious technology and science religions days are numbered.
MumblingMickey 1 year ago 2
I don't like the term evil in reference to anything, really. Evil implies an inherent malevolent nature that is seemingly without purpose or redemption, i.e. just doing something TO be evil or bad. I just think that God is representative of the people around the time the concept was conceived. Old Testament God was much like the average folks of those time and the New Testament God is a slight variation based on the people of that particular time.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche Based on the definition of the word evil applies. I supply the definition about a 1/4 into the video.
1. Morally reprehensible.
2. Archaic , causing discomfort or repulsion
3. Causing harm, marked by misfortune.
The evolution of the OT god to the NT god reveals the evolution of mankind's morality. We have evolved another 1800 years but some still hang onto to bronze age morality thinking themselves superior. I hope this video helps point that out. Thanks for your comment.
Netwriter 1 year ago 9
@Netwriter #1. yes
#2. yes
#3 yes
gphhawkins 1 year ago
@Netwriter Don't get me wrong, I totally agree with your point. My only contention is that, okay under your definition, yes it's evil. But that's also human nature without a system of checks and balances. We've built that through our progression since the days of civilization. Really, it's just moving towards inclusion and equality for everyone, and since back then pockets of elites had power, power corrupts and they did do morally reprehensible things. I just prefer the term 'wrong' over evil.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@Netwriter
How do you tell the difference between the OT God and the NT God ? They both seem pretty malevolent to me. What sort of entity sends its offspring to be tortured by savages so that in the future the god can torture the savages and their descendants in a newly minted hell ? The God of the Christians is focused on threats and torture, how is this notably different from the OT god ?
formless777 1 year ago
@formless777
well, listen.
Threats of hell is just a threat, hell does not exist, therefore anyone threatening with hell is not like someone ordering to STONE women to death in the life time.
The point is, the God of the old testament was ordering genocides, and all sorts of barbrism to be put into practice by men during their life time not in the after life.
The God of the new testament, is more gentle with the teachings for other fellow human beings( like love your enemies, etc)
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
to be put into practice during their life time.
Of course the old testament and new testament are both a bunch of bs, but if you look at both, you can clearly see this "God"( which is simply the reflection of the people who thought him up) becomes more gentle in the New testament with the Jesus caracther, while he was very angry and violent in the ot.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion
Actually the whole "love thine enemy" thing is most likely a mistranslation. The same word used for love in Hebrew & Aramaic is also used to mean "know" and "rape". So "love thine enemy" could equally mean "know thine enemy" and "rape thine enemy". After all, who in their right mind loves their enemies ? Certainly no Jew I ever met.
formless777 1 year ago
@formless777 that is total nonsense.
Jesus character, who I do not think even existed, said multiple times "love the enemy", your conjecture is complete nonsense. Rape? what junk!
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion
What I was pointing out is simple fact. The same word in Hebrew means those three things, love, knowledge and rape. This isn't junk, it's fact, and your rejection of facts says more about you than it does about facts.
formless777 1 year ago
@formless777 No, it is not a fact . It is your conjecture.
Love the enemy does not mean to rape them.
Jesus , and I have already stated that, I do not even believe he existed, did not say love the enemy as to imply rape them.
You are being totally ludicrous . Stop embarassing yourself.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion
I didn't invent the Hebrew and Aramaic languages, I just learned enough to discover the truth about this part of the scriptures. One word with three meanings; to know=to love=to rape. There are plenty of words in most languages with multiple meanings. Why is this so hard for you to accept ? It is completely true, after all. Consider Judges 19:22, when the pervert Benjaminites demand the Levite be brought out that they may "know" (i.e. rape) him.
formless777 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion
On the other hand, consider that if you threaten someone who is ignorant, gullible, and fearful with "hell", a place of eternal and unimaginable torment, they will in turn torture and burn their fellow human beings alive to avoid the threat of imaginary torment. Look at the history of Christianity, simply put, it's a bloodbath, and that bloodbath is fueled by threats of hell, and often encouraged by the images of hell.
formless777 1 year ago
@formless777 I do not agree with Christianity at all, but anyone with a brain can clearly see that the God of the old testament is way more aggressive, angry, violent, and evil.
The New Testament introduces a new type of God, he is more gentle.
By the way, many Christians interpret the verse of the bible taht talks about hell as the grave. Not all of them think as a fiery pit.
In any case, your arguments are rubbish.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion
Your analysis of the OT god vs Jesus is superficial at best. And yes, Christians imagine hell in all sorts of ways, but none of them good, and all contain the idea of an eternal torment... Eternal torment in hell is Jesus' teaching. You will find no teaching more pernicious in the OT than that.
formless777 1 year ago
@formless777 You make a very good and valid point. The outrageousness of the Jesus story required the hook of hell and heaven to sell it. The character of Jesus is much softer than the OT god if only by small increments, but that is how evolution works. That is how I see it, but I could be wrong.
Netwriter 1 year ago
@Netwriter
I don't think Jesus is that much softer that the OT god. Remember, Jesus invented hell as a place of eternal unremitting punishment without relief for people who didn't accept his every contradictory teaching. Hell didn't exist before Jesus came on the scene... except in Buddhism.
formless777 1 year ago
@Netwriter I agree.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche i just assume the israelits were semi nomadic warrior ppl who established a totalitarian society justified thru god
kaindrg 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche Try this exercise (I did when I was a youth pastor): Take, say, Numbers 31. Replace the word "LORD" with "Gog" and "Israel" and variations thereof with "Gogites." Claim it's from an old Babylonian deity tale (not far from the truth.) See the reaction. Then try "Satan" and "his worshipers"... that's even more fun. You'll be shocked at (a) how little believers know the Bible; and (b) how EVIL this being's actions become.
When you tell them the truth, watch the rationalization.
rationalmuscle 1 year ago 3
@rationalmuscle Very true, i heard they tried this on schoolchildren to see how they would react, .. they virtually all likened the "Gogites" to Nazi's. But in it's original form, they could justify Gods actions.
bonnie43uk 1 year ago
@rationalmuscle We would call this being evil, of course. But I try to look at it from the people of the time and of the being itself (if it indeed existed, which I believe it doesn't, btw). Imagine in that time thinking of immorality and power. Think of the boredom and lack of entertainment. Then think of what we are entertained by, except take out the fiction. If God does exist, he's no different from what a human would enjoy: violence.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche Um . . . do you know what evil means, sir? I hate when people create arguments by tacking on extra meaning to words so that they can somehow manipulate a discussion. By indicating that evil is somehow an extreme word, wholly inaccurate in describing a book, you are attempting to manipulate those who try to be moderate. Luckily, I'm not one of those people. A book must be judged by the ideas it contains. The Bible endorses ideas which bring suffering to innocent people. It is evil.
jgodby1 1 year ago
@jgodby1 Stand down, solider. I'm just trying to be as objective as I can, in dealing with scientific primitives (authors of the Bible). I'd say it's less evil, then, back in those days as opposed to now. Just as a racist bias was common in the days leading up to the civil rights era. Those people weren't particular bad, that was just the culture they were in. I think the real evil people are those who purport these same primitive ideas in our enlightened age.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche "I don't like the term evil in reference to anything, really"
I agree. Good and evil are relative terms and should have no real use in 'enlightened' discussions. Of course Netwriter is, I hope, not attempting to preach to the choir, and so those who he wishes to persuade will need use of such language.
bignastydragon 1 year ago
@bignastydragon Ehhh, I think he's preaching a bit and it's not at all a stretch to call God evil by our standards today, so you can score some points on it. I just want to take a different look at this old as shit conversation, then just "They are evil and we don't need an evil god to have morality"
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
@SeriousPsyche well, it was evil, there is nothing wrong in stating a fact.
The God of the old testament is evil. Would you not call a person who orders homicides, brutal stoning, slavery etc evil?
The fact of the matter is that evil exists and it can manifest itself in many forms.
The God of the Ot, which is just the rapresentation of the barbaric minds of the people who invented him, was evil.
As human progressed, and morality progressed, they made up a more gentle
God in the NT.
Freedomismyreligion 1 year ago
@Freedomismyreligion Right, it is evil by our standards. But I want to look at this from a perspective that is outside of individual times. They didn't have much back then but their own power and honor/pride, so anything that challenged those two principles was dealt with harshly. If those acts were committed today (and in some parts of the world it is), I agree completely, it's evil. But all this was in an unenlightened period and shouldn't be compared to us today.
SeriousPsyche 1 year ago
As I understand it, "evil" is a religious idea. That being someone who is possessed by "demons". I'm not sure even people are evil even in the common definition. Certainly some people are very bad and crazy. And certainly the bible is a very bad and dangerous book. (as well as the koran) And any other "holy book" which deludes people and helps them to justify horrible behaviour.
wolfinside 1 year ago 2
@wolfinside O.E. yfel..."bad, vicious, ill, wicked," "In OE., as in all the other early Teut. langs., exc. Scandinavian, this word is the most comprehensive adjectival expression of disapproval, dislike or disparagement" [OED]. Evil was the word the Anglo-Saxons used where we would use bad, cruel, unskillful, defective (adj.), or harm, crime, misfortune, disease. The meaning "extreme moral wickedness" was in O.E., but did not become the main sense until 18c.
colourmegone 1 year ago
This is from the Online Etymological Dictionary and is a cut down version due to space limitations but you can easily look up the citation @ "etymonline[dot]com. As you can see evil in its original sense had nothing to do with religion, the relation to moral wickedness was made in the 18th cent. It simply ment bad or harmful and keeps this sense today as well as the anti-moral definition.
colourmegone 1 year ago
I have seen the bible used as motivator for "Good" and also as a motivator for "Evil." I believe If you can know the contents of the bible well enough I seriously think you can easily justify anything (good or bad) that you want to just as long as you pull relevant scriptures up in the right order and spin them to meet the ends you, or others, may seek. This aspect of the bible gives the "authority of God" to mere men who can choose to use it on others for various gains.
funkyplayer4212 1 year ago
It was not the book that ordered these things, but people with power over other people. Most of the time this all revolved around money of course. This book however, contains laws wich govern the lives of many many people. These laws are ment to protect the people from one another. And to prevent the lower layers of society from killing those with wealth :) Also, the Bible can be interpreted in many ways, just like many other books. It depends on the reader which one he chooses to believe in.
Mercury1234 1 year ago
The bible and religion as a hole is the worst thing that has ever happened to the human race.
danbartels1 1 year ago 47
Indeed
Katalyzt 1 year ago