Death Penalty - English version

[jtking2504]

@undocumentedspot, restricting freedom as punishment is not against 'human rights, b/c prison is an option which balances the need for punishment with the protection of society. Vast majority of murderers don't get the death penalty so prison is considered sufficient for them, look at the Green River serial killer, he only got life in a Supermax. No one in US history has escaped from a Supermax, so there is no need to kill. Only Capital Crimes, so DP isn't about protection, it's about revenge.

[alexp9999]

the old rule of "an eye for an eye" leaves everyone blind...

/agree

[tednugent13]

LIBERAL PROPAGANDA

[CandelarioGaIvan]

Typical Euro video.

They don't muddle up the definition of the word murder.

Murder and killing are 2 differnt things.

A murder is the illegal killing of a person.

[ThaMan2131]

I bet you anti-execution fuckers are for abortion.

[gariadara]

ok...except the death penalty is not murder. it does not require evil or malicious intent from the part of the person conducting it like murder does.

[MurasakiShikibufan]

murder does not require evil or malicious intent

[Notcoldsoup]

let's not argue semantics. just go with what the term has always meant. There is a significant distinction between to kill, and to murder.

[choletalenda]

there's nothing more "evil" than death penalty. no human being has the rught to decide if another person should live or die. life is a human right. death penalty is the violation of this fundamental right.

[gariadara]

this is besides the point but: you're against abortion right? I'm just curious.

but to reply to your post: there are quite a few things that are more evil. such as what hitler or bundy did. Freedom is also a fundamental human right. I can say no human has the right to decide if another person should be denied his freedom. most of these cases, a guy kills one man in one moment of rage but is otherwise not too "evil", we lock him for life. we don't we just put him into exile?

[choletalenda]

of course i am FOR abortion.personally i wouldn't abort bcause i'm not in conditions that force me to do so,but every woman should have the right to decide.every person has the right to life,physical and mental integrity(besides,this is human right nr.3).in this case the life of the mother counts more than the right of an unborn fetus.

to ur comment:its obvious that was hitler did was MORE EVIL than death penalty,but it was just the climax of death penalty:he decided abt the lives of 20mill ppl

[gariadara]

I do not believe it is anyone's right to decide death for an unborn fetus. I'm not talking about a zygote of course but at the fetal stage when a rudimentary nervous system has developed but that's another argument. I also believe that every person has the right to life and physical and mental well-being. But to some capacity I also believe that all that has to be earned. Your Hitler response is illogical. His genocide's NOT in any way analogous to the capital punishment we are talking about.

[CandelarioGaIvan]

choletalenda

Ya there is something more evil than the death penalty.

People who spend their time defending people who love to shove their hairy dick into a small childs asshole and then strangle them.

Why do you defened them?

[choletalenda]

im NOT defending them u dickhead! i did never say im IN FAVOR of rapists/murderers, i said im AGAINST death penalty. thats different, start thinkin.

[CandelarioGaIvan]

choletalenda

Atually you are defeding them. You don't see it that way cuase you are tryng to seperate the punishment from the criminal.

[cl1mbat1ze]

"Correlation does not equal causation"? Wtf do you mean by that?? Earlier you stated the purpose of death penalty in legal terms, but we were discussing wether death penalty brings down crime and murder rate or not.

In addition, have you heard about ethics before? Is it ethical to let the state kill people? Those 1/4 thats innocent, is that an acceptable loss?

[cl1mbat1ze]

Psych101? at least i have an understanding of psychology, whereas you lack any understanding at all XD

I'm not saying i know exactly how they feel "dumbass", but perhaps seeing someone die is a little tougher on the mind than you think. Atleast i talk about mental health, while you seem to dismiss it altogether.

Once again with the seek help stuff? Why? Because my opinion differs from yours?

Or just because you ran out of valid arguments?

[cl1mbat1ze]

And europe is disgusting? please tell us what we do to be so disgusting so we can better ourselves, i beg of you! :O

And your reply basically had little or nothing to do with what we were actually discussing. Although, i admit, i had to read through it a couple of times to figure that out...

The crime and murder rates in europe are lower than in the US despite their death penalty.

Now tell me how you justify death penalty, not enough death sentences??

and please refrain from insults...

[cl1mbat1ze]

[part 1]

wow, that first post was totally unrelated.

Seek help?? XD

Read people's mind??? Obviously you don't have a clue about psychology...

And i don't think i know whats best for people, but it seems like you do (kill'em all!!)

And yes, i realize the point of the death penalty is to kill people after being sentenced by a court as you so kindly pointed out, but that has got nothing to do with whether death penalty brings down crime and murder rates or not... and i say it doesn't!

[cl1mbat1ze]

effie55555, the general point of federal punishment should not be revenge as you seem to think, but making the community a safer place.

Europe has a lower crime and murder rate than USA: disgusting?

"Justice" is not synonymous with "getting back" at criminals, just because the mob screams for blood doesn't mean its the smart or best thing to do.

i didn't mean right by law, but ethically right.

[cl1mbat1ze]

And just because the people carrying out the death penalty are volunteers does not mean they'll cope with seeing someone die any better than anyone else would.

They could develop mental problems just as easily as anyone opposed the death penalty.

[Budguy68]

God dame spineless liberals are at it again.

Anyone found guilty of putting a person in a cage, should be put in a cage!

[jsilver227]

consequences of murder: 1) a person dies, 2) it's irreversible, 3) the families of the deceased are innocent victims, 4) devalues life. consequences of the DP: 1) a person dies, 2) it's irreversible, 3) the families of the deceased are innocent victims, 4) devalues life. Justice? No! The DP is two steps back b/c it promotes murder under a different name. Our lives are short enough already. We don't need to make them any shorter by killing each other.

[fghtmeun]

If we do not win in Iraq, all we need to do is tell the tree huggers, to STFU and drill in the Gulf of Mexico. Of course I am all for alternate sources of energy. Once we no longer need oil we can fight Bin Laden for real no more hands tied behind our back PC bullshit

[apestaartje321]

If it wasnt for the oil you *probably* wouldnt be fighting that guy in the first place ;)

[mst3k4evur]

What about the thousands of murders and probably millions of rapes committed by murderers in prison for life. Putting them away for life kills more people, in prison and outside, than the one or two possibly innocent death penalty opponents claim it kills.

[myblackheart76]

WTF,ok have a machine do the killing..problem solved.

[DaddyBare2002]

"WTF,ok have a machine do the killing..problem solved." REALLY, blackheart76??? Alright, then, who turns your MACHINE on??? Another machine??? Who turns THAT machine on??? Sorry, ignoramus ~ problem reinstated!!!

[myblackheart76]

Honestly I would have no problem shooting these bastards in the head.....the machine was just an idea...the only problem I see is the fact they live on death row...once there sentenced to death they should take them straight to the chair or needle or better yet save us all money and just blow thier brains out.

[DaddyBare2002]

Sorry; but, my response to "myblackheart76"s latest reply to my previous post will be in SEVERAL posts due to something being wrong with this program. The TOTAL number of characters in my reply is 471; but, every time I click on "Post Comment", a window appears stating "Your comment must be less than 500 characters!" I had, always, thought 471 was appreciably less than 500. The program must be run by "myblackheart76" this evening.

[DaddyBare2002]

PART 1 OF HOPEFULLY 2 IN RESPONSE TO "MYBLACKHEART76":

Obviously, you're to be commended on being the ONLY person ON EARTH that CANNOT make a mistake in judgment of anyone's guilt. If *YOU* DECIDE a "bastard" to whom you refer is guilty, there's NO CHANCE they are NOT. WOW ~ such INSIGHT ~ such DEPTH of character!

[DaddyBare2002]

PART 2 OF HOPEFULLY 2 IN RESPONSE TO "MYBLACKHEART76":

The name myblackheart76 befits your character & decency if not maturity OR are YOU a BASTARD to MURDER INNOCENTS & think you need only a mere "OOPS! Sorry bout that" when you discover them to be INNOCENT? From your posts, you OBVIOUSLY are!

[myblackheart76]

comment to all and stop replying to my comments I'm done with these posts and I stand firm.. KILL THEM ALL!

[DaddyBare2002]

HAHA ~ I see that SOMETHING that was said musta "UPSET" you. Well, even though I do not "live to upset others" and am in NO way as HATEFILLED as YOU demonstrate yourself to be, I do find a bit of fulfillment in passing on a little bit of the TRUTH to even MURDERERS LIKE YOU. I'm sure your parentage is PROUD of you.

[DaddyBare2002]

"Stand firm" all you like ~ you'll NEVER change any portion of the TRUTH to accommodate YOUR IGNORANCE, myblackheart76!!! And, YES, I speak to YOU onacounta no others on here seem to be as MURDEROUS AS YOU demonstrate yourself to be!!! You have EVERY RIGHT to believe as you choose; but, throughout your miserable LIFE ~ you will never develop the RIGHT to speak {especially as YOU do} and expect to remain UNCHALLENGED in your declarations!!!

[DaddyBare2002]

And, THANK YOU ~ it's SO WONDERFUL that you are "done with these posts" onacounta, NOW, more MATURE and SENSIBLE minds can have the room on here to speak ~ even without being PLAGUED by YOUR FILTH of pseudo language skills as in your initial comment beginning "WTF ..." I, for ONE amm extremely PLEASED that you are "done with these posts".

[po1ar7]

very Clever

[tynoobi]

I never like hearing that an innocent person ends up in Death Row, but I think the death penalty is acceptable only with irrefutable evidence linking murders of the most brutal/unimaginable acts or with a straight confession both are rare, but I believe otherwise, there should be no execution

[mst3k4evur]

If the death penalty is murder then prisons make the government kidnappers, and an accessory to rape and murder committed behind bars.

[scorpioscouse]

So whats your point?? Why is it that people cannot understand that ANTI-DEATH PENALTY DOES NOT MEAN ANTI PUNISHMENT???

[mst3k4evur]

Read my last post, your brand of punishment is not effective, it just gives them the chance to kill again.

[cl1mbat1ze]

then why is the crime statistics for an average EU country much lower than in the USA?

Violence breeds violence... a fact of life

[mst3k4evur]

Because they are entirely different countries, hence different crime rates. If violence breeds violence, then how do you account for Japan's low crime rate AND use of the death penalty? Or non-dp countries like Russia, Mexico, South Africa and Colombia which have incredibly high crime?

[cl1mbat1ze]

part1:

EU is not a country.. its many countries and the highest murder rate in Europe can be found in finland with 2,86 murders per 100.000 people, in the US the murder rate is close to 6,5 :O And true, japan has a very low crime rate, but due to the way their society is built, i doubt very much if their low crime rate is due too dp (maybe because of their intense school systems?).

[mst3k4evur]

Also, if the death penalty promotes murder, then why does Michigan, a state without the death penalty have a 6.5 homicide rate while Utah, a state with the death penalty, has a homicide rate of 1.9? New Jersey, also non-dp, has a 4.5 while Delaware, which has one of the highest rates of execution vs population, has a 2.0.

[cl1mbat1ze]

part2:

Russia has suffered alot since the cold war and after the collapse of the soviet, they're society has lost much of its previous structure leaving Russia bankrupt and broken.

South africa? Alot of anger since the apartheid, and i wouldn't be surprised if it manifested itself in crime.

[mst3k4evur]

Aparteid? Most of the crimes are black on black and Aparteid ended 18 years ago.

You've also failed to point out how the death penalty increases violent crime when Colombia and Mexico have no death penalty and are the kidnapping and narcotics capitals of the world.

[cl1mbat1ze]

i cant answer everything obviously but i assure you that there are way more examples on countries without dp, which have alot lower crime rate. Would you like to explain why Norway, spain, france, britain, denmark, sweden, estland, switzerland, belgium, italy and austrich all have lower crime rates than USA? in addition the general crime rate in the EU is lower than USA.

[mst3k4evur]

That may be true, but if you know anything about the death penalty in the US, you know most states almost never use it. Most of teh states with the death penalty have carried out fewer than ten since it was reinstated in 1972. Less than 1% of murderers are sentenced to die and far fewer are ever executed. So if the deterrent studies are to be believed, it would take far more executions to see a lower crime rate.

[cl1mbat1ze]

So we should kill more people? Maybe use the death penalty as punishment for other crimes than murder?

The Problem is, once we lower the bar a little, It's gonna be easier to lower it even more in the future.

Furthermore, does the goverment have any more right to kill than others? What about the people forced to carry out the death penalty?

[mst3k4evur]

"So we should kill more people? Maybe use the death penalty as punishment for other crimes than murder?"

Already done. Louisiana, Montana, Florida, SOuth Carolina, Texas and Oklahoma have statutes for the execution of child molesters who do not kill.

"What about the people forced to carry out the death penalty?"

It's voluntary, no one is forced.

[MurasakiShikibufan]

Actually, Texas uses it quite liberally, smart one

[mst3k4evur]

Uses what liberally?

[MurasakiShikibufan]

Japan's low crime rate doesn't have anything to do w/ the dp cuz no one knows about what goes on in Japanese dp. For that reason, it's incredibly inhumane. Just ask Sakae Menda

[mst3k4evur]

You mean they're not interested in making killers celebrities? God forbid=P

[po1ar7]

I saw this one picked sign on the news- it said

Why do we kill to show that killing's wrong?

[mst3k4evur]

We don't. We kill them to protect society and yes even other prisoners.

[choletalenda]

its a fact that death penalty doesnt EVER avoid murderers from killing people. every country in europe has lower capital-crime rates than any state in the US with death penalty

[CandelarioGaIvan]

choletalenda

Does Jail sentances reduce crime??

The death penalty isn't to reduce murder it is to punish the guilty.

[choletalenda]

my answer was for mst3k4ever who said "We kill them to protect society and yes even other prisoners".

now my answer to you: in a civilized society there isn*t just only one purpose of punishment "an eye for an eye", but many. in a civilized country there cannot exist death penalty because 1 it is against the human right of life 2 as long as there are human beings on this planet they will make errors, and as long as there is death penalty, there will be innocent people being killed

[CandelarioGaIvan]

choletalenda

You are misquoteing the bible. An eye for an eye is suppose to be a limit on a punishment.

IE if a person knocks out a persons eye he should not be put to death for it.

NOW define civilized!!!

[undocumentedspot]

"but many. in a civilized country there cannot exist death penalty because 1 it is against the human right of life" hehehe. how about prison? isn't restricting someone freedom of move against human rights? but remember mass-murderers violated the "contract" that protects their rights. you have duties also not just rights.

[mst3k4evur]

"its a fact that death penalty doesnt EVER avoid murderers from killing people"

Yes it does prevent murder as executed killers cannot kill again-unlike the numerous murders committed by convicted murderers like Thomas Silverstein.

As for deterring OTHER murders, yes it DOES work. Look at Texas, it has a lower homicide rate than all the states to the east and west and Mexico to the South. The only neighbor with a lower homicide rate is Oklahoma, which executes more criminals per capita.

[katiekaite]

It has been proven the death penalty is NOT a deterrent as most crimes such as murder are committed in a fit of rage, or where a lot of passion is involved. If you were about to kill someone who hurt you, would you be thinking "Hmm if I do this, I'm going to be facing the death penalty...(or a lifetime in jail, depending where you're from." No you wouldn't be.

[mst3k4evur]

1 Take a look at the new york times article "Does Death Penalty Save Lives? A New Debate," it covers a dozen studies which showed a drop in murder rates after executions.

2 No, most capital crimes involve some premeditation. In order to commit robbery murder you think ahead and bring a weapon, to commit rape-murder you first have to commit sexual assault and to commit multiple murders you have to kill repeatedly.

3 Likely the deterrence comes from the greater publicity surrounding executions.

[jethromayham]

Yes, it does. You think letting him out and he wouldn't do it again. I bet you wouldn't want him living in your house. I bet you wouldn't want to pay his upkeep.

I bet you wouldn't want him to use you as a punching bag.

Executing is the only answer.

[Apachecatdog]

I saw on the news that a killer was eventually released, and then after being set free killed again.

Myth busted, he would have never killed again if sentanced to death.

[traceyrmj2]

@Apachecatdog he has the right to life in prison instead.

[fghtmeun]

As long as there are voters like me America will always have the death penalty. Europe may be weak, tree huggers and liberals may be weak but I will always do my part to ensure America has the death penalty on election day.

[scorpioscouse]

well done. I see that patriotism is far more important than evolution of the species. You keep trying to light that fire with sticks, I'll make sure that my government will one day solve your problems and dont forget that if you dont win this 'war' in "EEEraq" you are gonna have to borrow money to pay for all the oil that you need to drag your obese population around in hugely oversized, equally obese, mode of transport. Have a nice day McKiller!

[mst3k4evur]

Actually, most europeans favor the death penalty. Their leaders are more loyal to the unelected EU leaders than to the voters.

[fetisibitu]

actually....not

[mst3k4evur]

Really? 63% of Poles support it and so do 58% of Czechs.

[fetisibitu]

ohh right...sry...my bad =))))) and europe only has 2 countries...czech and poland right?=)))))))

[mst3k4evur]

I could only find polling info for a few countries smart ass. If you want to prove me wrong, then please provinde some proof.

[fetisibitu]

well smart ass...if europeans would agree with death penalty...we would have death penalty...but we dont;)

[mst3k4evur]

Actually, Poles, Czechs and Hungarians agree with the death penalty but their governments dropped it so they could stay in the EU, which is apparently more important than doing what their people want. Not only that but the percentage goes higher when you talk about specific cases like McVeigh and Ted Bundy.

[fetisibitu]

your problem is that u think u are god...u...americans...u think u have the right to decide in the name of others...and also u think u have the right to decide in the name of god...if it werent for you this world would be a lot peacefull...but u think u have the right to stick your noses everywhere...and europeans are not like that...thats why we are here long before you...and we will be here long after u ;)

[mst3k4evur]

No, Eurpeans are NOT like that. Europeans cower and wait for us 'nosy' Americans to come and save you. Without Americans the world would not be peaceful, it would be run by Nazi Germany.

[fetisibitu]

thats just your ignorant opinion

[mst3k4evur]

Tell me how I'm wrong.

[fetisibitu]

u dont have to come and 'save us' cause we dont get in trouble...we are not looking to start a war with other countries so we can get oil from there for example;)nazi germany is gone for a very long time...and u dont need to protect the world from europeans...u need to protect the world from yourselves

[mst3k4evur]

"cause we dont get in trouble...we are not looking to start a war with other countries so we can get oil"

Then why did you need us to defend you from Nazi Germany and Italy during 1933-1945? Why did you need us during 1945-1990 against the USSR? Also, since gas prices here have gone up Oil was not the motivator.

"dont need to protect the world from europeans...u need to protect the world from yourselves "

Really? You guys pillaged the 3rd world for 300 years. The US has never done that.

[fetisibitu]

yeah right :))) u only did good things to the humanity...hahaha...u are bad people...so u pay for it...and you will keep paying until you wake up and see what u r doing to the world...and i better stop answering to you...bye and happy new year

[mst3k4evur]

No, we did not only do good things. But we have done more good than you ever will. The fact that your country is not ruled from Berlin or Moscow is proof.

[Drakoman07]

wow, that was unpolished

[ebilly99]

So the question is does the death penalty work? I think it does, as long as the death is not plesurable. It needs to be cruel.

[Sikosm]

u sick sick thing. killing murderers solves nothing and is just as evil as the original act

[hazard808]

How about hitler? WFT why wouldn't you execute a man like hitler? Do you know the pain he caused? Let him live his life out in jail while people starve to death and did nothing wrong.

[gfreeman556]

Well, pedophiles and rapists should go to Europe to flourish. Oh wait, they already do. Europeans are so effing overrated sometimes.

[madmodpo]

Death penalty is wrong. State legitimized killing of individuals, even the most vicious killers, shows how little respect a society has for human life. It is often cruel. It is much more expensive than jailing people for life, considering high costs of appeals and procedures. It hurts families without giving anything back to those hurt by the death of a loved one. It is often the extension of racism. It does not convince people not to kill. Justice must protect society not promote barbarism.

[Tony63efc]

You've lost me, how many states in the US have the death penalty for rape? Care to share with us the statistics you have that show the USA has a particularly low incidence of sex crimes?

[JanineRobin]

You're such a fucking moron, gfreeman556.

[fetisibitu]

yeah right...thats why we have so many disasters happening every year cause here the bad is flourishing? hahaha u make me laugh...god is hitting u retards more and more every year...every day...he has enough of your stupididty...ignorance...and cruelty...there is no place on this planet where bad things happen more then are happening in your f***ing usa...'god bless the usa'...forget about that....god is taking his face from u...and u well deserve it

[rawcarrot]

more state-funded nonsense.

[banedon88]

Nonsense? Not really. It may not have been constructed well, but it has valid arguements.