Larry Holmes | James 'Bonecrusher' Smith I 5/5

[crownedful]

Bonehugger Smith held Tyson their entire fight. How could they call him

Bonecrusher? Whenever this guy fought I would always hope he would get KO'd, but also knew it would be a boring, long fight. There is one thing to use tactful clinching the way Holyfield did against Tyson. But Holy did it and spun Tyson around and did in fact fight Tyson when the opportunity presented itself. But this guy Bonehugger must have the all-time record as a heavyweight for holds and clinches.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful But when holmes tried to copy bonecrusher and do what holy did ,holmes wasnt able to do squat with the prime 88 tyson.Tyson had too fast muscle fiber twitching in that short period and would have discombobulated holyfield as well.The holyfield head rush nullification style he employed on tyson wouldnt work with the early 88 version.Bonecrusher was on a roll when he faced tyson and was diminished down to a clutcher for 12 rounds terrified of being stopped.

[crownedful]

@fadethetrade --When Tyson was knocking everybody out early in his career--take a look at his opponents. They were all bums. A prime Larry Holmes would have boxed Tyson silly and stopped him. Please Tyson is so overrated, its not funny. He fought NOBODIES--Guys washed up or bums. Please stop the Tyson was great, He lost to Buster Douglas--a journeymen HW who had a decent jab and boxed Tyson stupid. Holmes in his prime had one of the best jabs--ever. When Tyson stepped up he lost.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful But holmes was so old and retired so much that he beat mercer 5 yrs later and almost drew with a determined prime holyfield.Interesting,you're comments are shit,they dont make any sense because you just dont get it..tucker ko'd a fit douglas who didnt run out of gas,he ran into ticker left,spinks was favored by 40% experts to beat tyson,were you one of them?? A totally diiferent tyson back then and its too scientific for you to understand if you dont have paper proof.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful I suppose marciano was overrated and sucked also ,right?What about louis?? He was known to be the champion who fought the"bum of the month club" Tyson never was given the opportunity to fight a holy or liews or ali because they were all too inexperienced,retired or just scared shitless as in lewis' reason to duck tyson in his terror era of SKILLFUL FIGHTING JERK!You're a schmuck.

[crownedful]

@fadethetrade The bottom line is that you have not addressed my main point which was who did Tyson beat on his ascent of his career. As far as Louis is concerned he held the title for 13 years and pretty much cleaned out the division--there was nobody else to fight. Marciano fought the best of his times. May not have been the best era of HW boxing --but he fought the best of his time. The same cannot be said of Tyson. Tyson would have lost to Ali, Foreman and Frazier and beat only Norton.

[JDAlvo93]

@crownedful What are you talking about? He DID beat the best in the division from 85-89. No great fighters, but neither did Larry Holmes (who is the best person he beat? Cooney? Please.) , Marciano, or Dempsey.

[JDAlvo93]

@JDAlvo93 Does that make them bad fighters? No, I think theyre all great. But so is Tyson. But of course you're just gonna moan and tell me "LLOOK AT HIS RECORD" when I have seen his record (and his fights) countless times,

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful from berbick to spinks,tyson would test ali and perhaps beat everyone else in history excpet young foreman.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful You cant judge his career as a whole,its based on 20/20 hindsight,the way he demonstrated his great elusive skill of slipping punches and countering with blistering combiantions,all other fighters in history would become discombobulated dealing with this style for 12 rounds.smith,tucker,holy,lewis­,bowe ,it didnt matter in that short period. Bowe already admitted he was terrified of tyson and he said he would cross the street when tyson was walking his way.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful You see,you show flaws in your knowledge.He didnt knock out everyone.he went the distance of 12 and won most all rounds vs everyone who went the distance in that period.That showed great stamina and great corner for his style.He was the closest thing to perfection as a fighter in 87-88.Because it couldnt last long enough,schmucks like yourslef bash him

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful You misjudged his ability because you have limited knowledge in boxing when it gets very scientific.At 21 ,tyson was twice the fighter he was vs ruddock in 91 asan example.He was a manufactured fighter like hagler and if the conditiong and ACTIVE SCHEDULE wasn;t maintained, a shorter heavyweight goes in at a disadvantage becasue his defenive first posture and stamina are abandoned and his punches are inaccurate.the timing was also gone as early as the bruno fight in 1989

[crownedful]

@fadethetrade Furthermore,Tyson didn't fight the best HWs of his generation. He ducked Holyfield until he needed the cash--he never fought Bowe--he never fought Ray Mercer--or even Bert Cooper. The only reason he fought Lewis was because he was broke. All these guys were around when Tyson was fighting set up opponents. How come he never stepped up to fight the best of his time? Tyson was demolished by Holyfield--beaten to a pulp by Lewis. Bowe would have destroyed Tyson if he had the balls.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful When an expert of boxing talks about tyson,he talks about the tyson period of 3 yrs 86-89.His style was already abandoned in 1989.Nothing counts with tysons ability after 1988.He was diminished to a head hunting scared little fighter because of lost of confidence from lack of conditioning.The tyson who ko;d holmes very quickly for a 21 defence champion,would test ali,lewis and possibly beat them.in 88,he would have run thru a smaller heavyweight holyfield.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful YOu dont have to say "furthermore" its validless.His skill and stamina were at a stellar level but that couldnt last and in that period only a foreman would have stopped it because it was too much of a perpetual motion for 12 rounds when he was conditioned.Dont forget,lewis ran from him in 86 ,joined the olympics and still avoided tyson in his best ability.It was in that short period,any expert would still muse the idea of him testing an ali,beating any year holmes.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful Do you put foreman high in ratings because he beat frazier?? he lost to morrison! It was tysons level of fighting that was as high or higher then Cassius Clay's in 1966.That level didnt last long enough to face the prime holy,lewis's.His level was at a 30 % in that tokyo fight with douglas.any IDIOT can see it as he walked in that ring and the videos of him being knocked down in sparring by ancient greg page.Any level headed person knows tyson was already slipping.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful Tyson was the best next to ali from the 87 and 88 year,especially right before he got maried and fired his entourage who kept him training the damato way.Once he abandoned that,frankie fear took over and tyson coulnt control the fear in him and he tried for head hunting ko's which backfired starting with douglas.Its an easy explanation how a fighter like tyson could be compared to ali and then 2 years later lose to douglas.It was clearly not the same tyson vs douglas.

[crownedful]

@fadethetrade he fought nobodies--go look at his record please.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful You choose to take tysons career in a whole of 14 years but when you're fighting men in the ring at 14 yrs old,by the time you reach 9 title defenses,it gets a little burnt out ,even for any athlete.but idiots like yourself expect tyson to be fighting at the same level for 14 years.

[fadethetrade]

@crownedful When tyson trained he also had 12 rounds of stamina in him to fight 12 round fights with better opposition.He was always ready for a test like holy,doug;las and ali and lewis as examples.He would have been ready for them in 1988.I believe he's underrated as a short 3 yr fighter.His rating as a "whole career",is about 12 of all time.Once you take the 88 version,it drops to # 2 or #3.Thats how profoundly different he approached fights starting with bruno 89.he was awfull!

[crownedful]

Bonehugger Smith. This dude made every fight boring because of his overuse if holds and clinches.

[tw69hands2]

@crownedful:

See Bonecrusher Smith vs Frank Bruno right here on YouTube.

[nevawrong]

@TheSaniflo

thats because Bonecrusher held Tyson all night : (

[Myndir]

@nevawrong Excuses, excuses...

[nevawrong]

@Myndir

but legit excuses tho : )

[capablemachine]

@Myndir Jim Jacobs was furious at Smith for refusing to fight and he was never allowed on a Tyson undercard from that point on. 

[Gyro911]

@nevawrong Actually Tyson held bone Crusher. In fact Tyson Held all his opponents since he didnt know how to infight and was always trying to land hooks from the outside

[nevawrong]

@Gyro911

lol lol lol, i'm not even gonna respond, because youre either blind or just stupid for that comment, lol lol lool lol

[Gyro911]

@nevawrong You should LOL at your own ignorant ass. I'm boxed amateur as heavyweight and know exactly what i was seeing. He dives his head in with the hooks and when nothing lands he get frustrated and holds.

[nevawrong]

@Gyro911

YEAH, what ever,

& if thats the case, there were many other fighters that use to clinche & hold also, even the tough great Holyfield did a lot of holding & smothering against Tyson. & not to take anything away from Holyfield, he won fair & sqaure, but if you look at the fights against Tyson, he would get quick shots off on Tyson, then he would get real close to smother Tyson, he even held Tyson's left arm on the inside,

Holyfeild never fought like that with anybody except Tyson

[tightmadnesss]

Holmes and another bogus fight to pad his legacy. Tyson stopped Bone Crusher Smith in his prime. Ali fought Evangelista when Ali was old. Holmes fought Evangelista when Evangelists was old. Remember, Evangelista started after Holmes.

[johntvette]

@tightmadnesss Was there a Tyson-Boncrusher II that I missed? When did Tyson stop him? You also realize that Tyson fought Smith AFTER Holmes did, right?

God I hate having to constantly correct the misgivings of blind Tyson fans.

[lee1990lee]

i wanna see there second fight

[tw69hands2]

@26marbay:

Basically they do. Holmes moved better and Louis punched harder and went to the body more often.

[tightmadnesss]

And what happened to this "hand picked scrub" Holmes fought? He was recycled as a contender and even would the title AFTER he lost this fight to Holmes. So if someone tells you Holmes fought bums, tell them so did Ali and Tyson.

[jimmynablee]

@tightmadnesss larry holmes fought wars against bums or average boxers, prime ali,tyson,foreman,frazier,list­on,.. dominated his rivals 200 times more than holmes did

[tightmadnesss]

@jimmynablee Really? So Tyson dominated Smith and Ali dominated Evangelista and Leon Spinks right?

[gregm20072007]

tysonnnnnnnn! love you

[PascalsWager5]

You would have to talk to somebody who fought both guys in their respective primes. Even then it's all down to the style of fight on the night.

Mercer may consider Holyfield to punch harder than Lewis seeing as though he was dropped and hurt by Holyfield, & not by Lewis.

However it's pretty clear who punched harder.

Shavers fought a way past prime Ali, & a prime Holmes.

Also Homes went after Shavers more than Ali did.

[tom11zz884]

Smith was like a big unskilled, awkard version of Kenny Norton.

[JWalsh2564]

Holmes totally outclassed Bonecrusher.

[jeryd2003]

the bonecrusher didn't know how to throw punches like 1-2's and hooks he wasn't much of a boxer, learn how to throw punches

[dwcsl]

That was a great fight!!!, I scored 12 rounds 118-110 4 Holmes i gave Bc Smith 5 and 8.

Smith did hit larry with a huge right probably the hardist shot Holmes has taken/excpt the few rights from Norton.

[azumah]

That left jab could turn any Grade A beef into hamburger. One of the top 3 of all time, IMO.

[onlyjoetee]

No azumah not one of the top 3,but the ,THE best jab in boxing EVER, NO DOUBT...Larry Holmes!!! even better than Ali's....

[azumah]

I totally agree. When I said top 3, I was referring to his overall placement as a heavyweight. I (as well as every fighter he ever fought) KNOW he has the best jab of all time. :)

[garethac81]

Holmes had a good jab, but it was not as fast, accurate or even as powerful as Ali's. Holmes needed to land a lot of jabs to do any damage - Ali's jab stung, Holmes' jab just irritated - and he needed to throw even more, because he tended to miss a lot with it. His two fights with Michael Spinks are a good example...Spinks showed him some angles, and it completely neutralised Holmes' jab. He just kept falling short with it, and he was never able to adjust.

NO ONE avoided Ali's jab.

[onlyjoetee]

NO SIR,Earnie Shavers fought both Holmes and Ali,so he should definitely know about their jabs.He said Ali's was just a flick,but Larry's was like other guy's right hand!!!!!and that is from someone who felt them both!!!CASE CLOSED!!!

[garethac81]

"Holmes' jab was like another guy's right hand"?

Even Holmes' RIGHT HAND wasn't as powerful as other fighter's right hands! Forget about his jab. Holmes was a weak puncher, and his record proves it.

Ali had a higher KO percentage than Holmes, AND he fought tougher opponents...still want to argue Holmes had a harder punch?

[onlyjoetee]

That is not MY opinion Sir,it was stated as A FACT by someone who was actually jabbed by both Ali and Holmes,you and i are merely speculating,Earnie Shavers WAS actually jabbed by them both!!!!I think his opinion MUST outrank yours dont you?????????

[onlyjoetee]

You have never been jabbed by Ali or Holmes,neither have i,Earnie Shavers HAS!!!!!!!!!!!!Cannot argue with him!!!!!!!!!!!!

[onlyjoetee]

Have you ever been hit by ALi??NO

Have you ever been hit by Holmes??NO

Earnie Shavers Has!!!!!!!

You wanna argue with HIM???????????

Thank you...

[garethac81]

Easy with the !!!!!!'s and ??????'s...

Look, Ali has a higher KO percentage. That's a fact. Shavers fought an old Ali and a prime Holmes, and all he has to offer is one fighter's opinion. That's simply not enough basis to definitively rank Holmes' jab as harder than Ali's, when Ali KO'd more of his opponents - in a tougher era - than Holmes.

[onlyjoetee]

A higher KO% has nothing to do with strength of jab which is what we are talking about,absolutely nothing!Ali was 35 when he fought Shavers in 77,Holmes was 30 when he fought Shavers in 79,im 38 now,if i was to hit you,you'd fucking know about it,believe me!In a court case they look for an eye witness,someone who actually saw,and they only need ONE.Shavers is a feel witness,he is THE definitive authority on the quality of those 2 jabs!!!!without question,because HE actually felt them!!!

[jimmynablee]

@onlyjoetee listen simpleton, ali was a joke after of the year 76,holmes was still good when he faced tyson and ray mercer.holmes had better past prime than ali, but

prime ali 64-67 would play with shavers,holmes,jimmy young, lyle...

[johntvette]

@jimmynablee Holmes was completely washed when he fought Tyson. He hadn't fought or trained in over 2 years. The Holmes that made a later comeback was worlds better than the Holmes that fought Tyson.

[fadethetrade]

@johntvette wouldnt make any difference,holmes said he had problems with awkward fighters,even in his prime.He said tyson was the sharpest puncher he ever faced,he said "shavers hit like a mack truck but tyson hit like a speeding ferrari."tyson was hard to hit".This was due to his great conditioning and defensive first posture the night he beat holmes,he would test any year ali.Any prime holmes would never beat tyson of early 88.damato always wanted that fight for tyson sometime.

[JDAlvo93]

@johntvette "I thought Larry fought a very smart fight for the first three rounds. I don't think Tyson knocked out a completely shot Larry Holmes. He got that tremendous punch and he nailed Holmes. I think he's run out of opponents. I think he's that good." - Gil Clancy

Clancy seems to disagree with you.

[onlyjoetee]

The principles of classic boxing are very simple,get him drunk,then mug him.The jabs job is simply to daze.Ali flicked his,but Larry's was stiffer,more commanding.Confirmed by Earnie Shavers.Holmes was robbed in the Spinks fights."They" didn't want him to break Marciano's record.Faced a lot of big clumsy awkward guys did Larry,but his pedigree was never in doubt,ever!!