"When the police come in, how are they going to determine who's the good guy" ummm, because they only come in after all the victims are dead and the killer committed suicide, because their primary objective is self preservation. If someone else shot the killer before he ran out of ammo and thus out of victims, fewer lives would have been lost. It would be easy to tell because that law abiding person would then inform the police that the threat was neutralized.
All the critics rail on about irresponsible students carrying guns. They ignore faculty and staff most of whom are extremely responsible but are forbidden to carry and protect themselves and others.
This is an amazing debate. In Australia we have big time gun control laws but we are in a position where there is so few guns (let alone an assault rifles) the likelihood that someone has a gun is very tiny. I would argue that any laws have to be made in a country as it exists, not some distant utopia that doesn't. Therefore if weapons are prevalent I think it is sensible to have the right to one yourself, for protection. There needs to be the right for self defence, to protect ones life.
I am for guns on campus, but I have to say that this is one of the more civilized discussions I've seen on tv. Kudos to Stossel and the kids for keeping things in good taste.
The biggest advantage I think CCW holders have is that they are generally more familiar with the immediate territory where a shooting may occur.
Police would never know as much about a university in a crisis situation as the staff and students that actually go there. The latter should definitely have the right to be armed.
''We're not changing who carries guns, but where they carry it'' Exactely! we need to legalize this. Besides if they want to shoot people, they'll do it anyway! Laws do nothing prohibition doesn't work, if they want to shoot people, they'll do it, law or not.
Mr. Goddard made intelligent, but irrelevant observations towards the end there. The man was not pushing for the expansion of firearm rights to the mentally ill. He was simply calling for the rights that a mentally sound, trained citizen can obtain outside of a campus to be allowed inside one, where it could save lives in an active shooter situation.
I do see a major safety issue with allowing guns in dorms. It’s a recipe for disaster when you have drunk teenagers commonly going in and out of other people’s room. The gun owner may be a responsible safe person, but most kids in that environment are not.
An outright ban on guns for all students even if they rent an apartment OFF CAMPUS is insane and wrong. Rapists often target college girls for this reason. A “Gun Free Zone” is very attractive.
I do see a major safety issue with allowing guns in dorms. It’s a recipe for disaster when you have drunk teenagers commonly going in and out of other people’s room. The gun owner may be a responsible safe person, but most kids in that environment are not.
So why is a student different from any other person? Id rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. YOU NEED THE RIGHT TO DEFEND YOURSELF.
i love the argument that the police will not know who is the bad guy. It easy the cops show up the law abiding person says here is my gun there is the shooter
@swatcapt11 ive trained with cops n i've been told that they hav ONE job during an active shooter situation. that is to hunt down and kill the shooter asap. they're not even sposed to help the victims as that would waste time n allow the shooter to kill more. CAREFULLY weigh ur options in such a situation and accept the fact the odds r against u. cops c u with a gun, theyll probly shoot u. cops r ppl too n hav made mistakes before. that said, if my loved ones r in danger i'll risk gettin shot
@mikee1911 Your are right for the most part about having to leave the victims it is sad but that is what has to be done to save lives. The thing that most people fail to relize is that if a person had a ccw and was able to of carried they should not go looking around the school for the shooter only if they encoutered the shoot. so there would almost no risk of being shoot by the police and there it is quiet easy to see someone shooting everyone and and just someone with a gun
if gun control worked then chicago and new york should be the safest cities in america!!! no once can dispute that the 11 minute response time at virginia tech must have seemed like an eternity to the students.. if u allow students to carry, you give them a fighting chance to survive... (warren vs. DC) stated that the police have no legal duty to protect you as a private citizen !!! before you post here, actually know the facts... people seem to post stuff out of emotion and not out of fact.
On my final comment, we have a strict "no drugs" law.... but plenty of people have them. Laws don't stop criminals from possessing drugs or alcohol, they only restrict those who choose to follow those laws.
His final word did not address the topic at hand. He attacked the law that allows citizens to purchase guns in the first place, NOT the law preventing licensed citizens from carrying on campus.
His stance on positively distinguishing the actual murderous psycho from a defending victim is a sound argument, though.
The guy disregarded the actual question and instead constructed a scenario where it would be pointless. The real answer should have been, "Yes, unless that person was shot first." Though, I understand his reasoning, that would have discredited his stance right off the bat.
This always makes me laugh.. I carry on my campus ireguardless, it doenst matter what the law books say. I would rather be tried by twelve, then carried by six.
ICOM, you argue that guns deter crime, and...maybe you're right, but I hesitate to concede the point. I would, however, like to point out two things. Number one, if effective gun control laws were enacted, Cho never would have been able to procure the weapons he used in his massacre. Two, do you really think that the thought of someone else with guns on the campus would have stopped Cho? He took his own life in the end, clearly the threat of death was not a deterrent in this situation.
@ilorokamou Remember, gun laws weren't the only ones Cho violated by bringing guns onto campus, much less murdering people. Drugs are completely forbidden in the US, and criminals still get them. In fact, only criminals have them.
Cho took his own life only when he realized armed police were finally closing in. The FBI and Secret Service agree, active shooters stop only once they encounter resistence.
If you were evaluating a target, would armed citizens on campus change your mind?
@ConcealedCampus very well put gun my not deter someone cho but they very well may help stop him sooner. If one or two people had a gun then maybe he would of not killed 32 people in just ten min.
@ilorokamou The only thing *half-way* resembling an "effective" gun control scheme is complete confiscation--A law mandating government stormtroopers to bust into your home (and EVERY other), ransack the place in an impotent effort to catch llegal items.
Even in a magical world where guns just disappeared--that situation would last for about two weeks, as new weapons are carved out of steel.
Personally, since nobody else can or will defend me as good as ME, I'll just resolve to defend myself.
what structure of law would have prevented cho from getting guns, while allowing law abidding citizens to still have them?
And the idea of other people having guns is not just a deterrent. Deterrent means you don't have to use them. When Cho opened fire, how many guns would have been firing back? more then none, thats how many
And people that carry guns tend to know how to use them
cho is the one that, in anger, might pick up a gun, and not know how to use it
@ilorokamou What makes you think that he wouldn't have been able to get that gun off the street??? at half the price. People like him cowards... Don't want someone who is gonna fight back. He went it there armed to the teeth because he new that there would be no one who could stop him. And once someone showed up who could he did it him self. At one point he actually ducked into a class room full of kids to reload. If one of those students would have been a ccw holder lives might have been save
@ilorokamou I conceal carry and Im a student (not at the same time unfortunately) but I can guarantee you that if I had been allowed to have a gun on campus and was present at this event I would have attempted to neutralize him and would have been successful if presented with a good shot. I do not care if he was not deterred by death, wounding or killing him would have stopped him no matter his resolve to continue on.
@ilorokamou One, if someone wants a gun for whatever reason, they will get it regardless of any statutes. Two, yes he took his own life in the end, but all the others that lost their lives didn't get the luxury of that option. The second he slayed a second or third person, without a doubt a concealed carry in the audience would have rid him of his aggression and save the 27 other victims.
Collin Goddard just doesn't get it. First of all he threw out the "we can what if this situation a thousand times" then based his arguments all on "what ifs". The stone cold facts are that law abiding citizens carrying guns deter and prevent crime. Collin doesn't have his facts straight. I am a police officer and I along with many officers I know all support citizens carrying firearms, even on campus.
"When the police come in, how are they going to determine who's the good guy" ummm, because they only come in after all the victims are dead and the killer committed suicide, because their primary objective is self preservation. If someone else shot the killer before he ran out of ammo and thus out of victims, fewer lives would have been lost. It would be easy to tell because that law abiding person would then inform the police that the threat was neutralized.
SaintEntreri 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
Should high school students be allowed to carry concealed fire arms?
kytim89 3 months ago
@kytim89 I doubt they are 21 to begin with.....
memmm2 2 months ago
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All the critics rail on about irresponsible students carrying guns. They ignore faculty and staff most of whom are extremely responsible but are forbidden to carry and protect themselves and others.
aerhearts 3 months ago in playlist More videos from ConcealedCampus
yeah, and how long did it take the cops to save the people at Vtech. Can't depend on the cops
dreicemoney 3 months ago
This is an amazing debate. In Australia we have big time gun control laws but we are in a position where there is so few guns (let alone an assault rifles) the likelihood that someone has a gun is very tiny. I would argue that any laws have to be made in a country as it exists, not some distant utopia that doesn't. Therefore if weapons are prevalent I think it is sensible to have the right to one yourself, for protection. There needs to be the right for self defence, to protect ones life.
aussieconservative 4 months ago
I live in Texas, the gun stereotype is true.
Mezey5 4 months ago
I am for guns on campus, but I have to say that this is one of the more civilized discussions I've seen on tv. Kudos to Stossel and the kids for keeping things in good taste.
theshooter2000 5 months ago
Are people worried that students will shoot each other in the chaos of trying to stop a school shooting?
Because I am pretty sure this is what happens anyway when they are left defenseless.
StateExempt 7 months ago
@StateExempt
The majority of private gun owners who carry concealed are better marksmen than police officers.
They practice and train more than police are required to.
The best example is the fact that in NC, LEO only have to shoot 70% to qualify. CCW holders have to shoot 80%.
Paladinbr 5 months ago
@Paladinbr - I would agree.
The biggest advantage I think CCW holders have is that they are generally more familiar with the immediate territory where a shooting may occur.
Police would never know as much about a university in a crisis situation as the staff and students that actually go there. The latter should definitely have the right to be armed.
StateExempt 4 months ago
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''We're not changing who carries guns, but where they carry it'' Exactely! we need to legalize this. Besides if they want to shoot people, they'll do it anyway! Laws do nothing prohibition doesn't work, if they want to shoot people, they'll do it, law or not.
ubertubered 8 months ago
Comment removed
ubertubered 8 months ago
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This show makes Bill O' Reilly look like Adolf Hitler.
humanvegetable 8 months ago
This show makes Bill O' Reilly look like Adolf Hilter.
humanvegetable 8 months ago
Mr. Goddard made intelligent, but irrelevant observations towards the end there. The man was not pushing for the expansion of firearm rights to the mentally ill. He was simply calling for the rights that a mentally sound, trained citizen can obtain outside of a campus to be allowed inside one, where it could save lives in an active shooter situation.
imachickenman 8 months ago
Gun Control = Crime
Criminals will always have guns, as they do not obey laws - that is why they are criminals!
stephenabm 9 months ago
I am 100% pro Second Amendment
I do see a major safety issue with allowing guns in dorms. It’s a recipe for disaster when you have drunk teenagers commonly going in and out of other people’s room. The gun owner may be a responsible safe person, but most kids in that environment are not.
An outright ban on guns for all students even if they rent an apartment OFF CAMPUS is insane and wrong. Rapists often target college girls for this reason. A “Gun Free Zone” is very attractive.
kazuosrevenge2 11 months ago
I am 100% pro Second Amendment
I do see a major safety issue with allowing guns in dorms. It’s a recipe for disaster when you have drunk teenagers commonly going in and out of other people’s room. The gun owner may be a responsible safe person, but most kids in that environment are not.
kazuosrevenge2 11 months ago
So why is a student different from any other person? Id rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. YOU NEED THE RIGHT TO DEFEND YOURSELF.
Dafarnakis 1 year ago
i love the argument that the police will not know who is the bad guy. It easy the cops show up the law abiding person says here is my gun there is the shooter
swatcapt11 1 year ago
Comment removed
mikee1911 1 year ago
@swatcapt11 ive trained with cops n i've been told that they hav ONE job during an active shooter situation. that is to hunt down and kill the shooter asap. they're not even sposed to help the victims as that would waste time n allow the shooter to kill more. CAREFULLY weigh ur options in such a situation and accept the fact the odds r against u. cops c u with a gun, theyll probly shoot u. cops r ppl too n hav made mistakes before. that said, if my loved ones r in danger i'll risk gettin shot
mikee1911 1 year ago
@mikee1911 Your are right for the most part about having to leave the victims it is sad but that is what has to be done to save lives. The thing that most people fail to relize is that if a person had a ccw and was able to of carried they should not go looking around the school for the shooter only if they encoutered the shoot. so there would almost no risk of being shoot by the police and there it is quiet easy to see someone shooting everyone and and just someone with a gun
swatcapt11 1 year ago
Which campuses are allowing students under 21 to carry concealed?
mlacey56 1 year ago
if gun control worked then chicago and new york should be the safest cities in america!!! no once can dispute that the 11 minute response time at virginia tech must have seemed like an eternity to the students.. if u allow students to carry, you give them a fighting chance to survive... (warren vs. DC) stated that the police have no legal duty to protect you as a private citizen !!! before you post here, actually know the facts... people seem to post stuff out of emotion and not out of fact.
hiredgun30 1 year ago
Police do not enter the building when the shooter is active all the school shooting police entered after the shooter killed them selves.
subysuby 1 year ago
On my final comment, we have a strict "no drugs" law.... but plenty of people have them. Laws don't stop criminals from possessing drugs or alcohol, they only restrict those who choose to follow those laws.
PocketDrummer 1 year ago
6:30
His final word did not address the topic at hand. He attacked the law that allows citizens to purchase guns in the first place, NOT the law preventing licensed citizens from carrying on campus.
His stance on positively distinguishing the actual murderous psycho from a defending victim is a sound argument, though.
PocketDrummer 1 year ago
3:55
The guy disregarded the actual question and instead constructed a scenario where it would be pointless. The real answer should have been, "Yes, unless that person was shot first." Though, I understand his reasoning, that would have discredited his stance right off the bat.
PocketDrummer 1 year ago
This always makes me laugh.. I carry on my campus ireguardless, it doenst matter what the law books say. I would rather be tried by twelve, then carried by six.
thehammerglock17 1 year ago
I believe united states citizen should be the first responder to prevent criminal activities.
kutila 1 year ago
ICOM, you argue that guns deter crime, and...maybe you're right, but I hesitate to concede the point. I would, however, like to point out two things. Number one, if effective gun control laws were enacted, Cho never would have been able to procure the weapons he used in his massacre. Two, do you really think that the thought of someone else with guns on the campus would have stopped Cho? He took his own life in the end, clearly the threat of death was not a deterrent in this situation.
ilorokamou 1 year ago
@ilorokamou Remember, gun laws weren't the only ones Cho violated by bringing guns onto campus, much less murdering people. Drugs are completely forbidden in the US, and criminals still get them. In fact, only criminals have them.
Cho took his own life only when he realized armed police were finally closing in. The FBI and Secret Service agree, active shooters stop only once they encounter resistence.
If you were evaluating a target, would armed citizens on campus change your mind?
ConcealedCampus 1 year ago 15
@ConcealedCampus very well put gun my not deter someone cho but they very well may help stop him sooner. If one or two people had a gun then maybe he would of not killed 32 people in just ten min.
swatcapt11 1 year ago
@ilorokamou The only thing *half-way* resembling an "effective" gun control scheme is complete confiscation--A law mandating government stormtroopers to bust into your home (and EVERY other), ransack the place in an impotent effort to catch llegal items.
Even in a magical world where guns just disappeared--that situation would last for about two weeks, as new weapons are carved out of steel.
Personally, since nobody else can or will defend me as good as ME, I'll just resolve to defend myself.
nominalvelocity 1 year ago
what structure of law would have prevented cho from getting guns, while allowing law abidding citizens to still have them?
And the idea of other people having guns is not just a deterrent. Deterrent means you don't have to use them. When Cho opened fire, how many guns would have been firing back? more then none, thats how many
And people that carry guns tend to know how to use them
cho is the one that, in anger, might pick up a gun, and not know how to use it
LordVigeous666999 1 year ago
@ilorokamou What makes you think that he wouldn't have been able to get that gun off the street??? at half the price. People like him cowards... Don't want someone who is gonna fight back. He went it there armed to the teeth because he new that there would be no one who could stop him. And once someone showed up who could he did it him self. At one point he actually ducked into a class room full of kids to reload. If one of those students would have been a ccw holder lives might have been save
JoeDaddy40 1 year ago
@ilorokamou I conceal carry and Im a student (not at the same time unfortunately) but I can guarantee you that if I had been allowed to have a gun on campus and was present at this event I would have attempted to neutralize him and would have been successful if presented with a good shot. I do not care if he was not deterred by death, wounding or killing him would have stopped him no matter his resolve to continue on.
white98cummins 10 months ago
@ilorokamou last I checked, the only people who abide to gun laws are lawful people. Unlawful people could care less about the law.
tk4227 5 months ago 2
@ilorokamou One, if someone wants a gun for whatever reason, they will get it regardless of any statutes. Two, yes he took his own life in the end, but all the others that lost their lives didn't get the luxury of that option. The second he slayed a second or third person, without a doubt a concealed carry in the audience would have rid him of his aggression and save the 27 other victims.
higheddy89 2 months ago
If some psycho is going to do something terrible with a gun, they aren't going to care what the "law" says.
norcofreerider604 1 year ago 4
fair arguements on both sides but I am bias
ghandiesel 1 year ago
Shouldn't it be false advertisement on the Brady Campaign to say that "Gun laws saves lives"!?
fitedeltachi 1 year ago 2
Collin Goddard just doesn't get it. First of all he threw out the "we can what if this situation a thousand times" then based his arguments all on "what ifs". The stone cold facts are that law abiding citizens carrying guns deter and prevent crime. Collin doesn't have his facts straight. I am a police officer and I along with many officers I know all support citizens carrying firearms, even on campus.
ICOM2957 1 year ago 17
Where's the rest???? Good stuff though, glad to see the message getting out there.
ResisterOfEvil 1 year ago 3
I refuse to give any school a dime that does not allow me to protect myself.
zack9912000 1 year ago 23