How To Fly The P-47 - High Altitude Flight and Aerobatics (1943)

[monsterzeroJr]

Achtung! Donnerbolz!

[KorvettenKapitan83]

This is a dream @uploader

[Bellerspitts]

There were some nice puffy clouds in 1943.

[GreenAce92]

The young one talks down to a woman hahahahaha

[mypspisdead]

apart ffrom this being another one of your great clips, it will greatly help me understand how to fly my jugg on flight sim xD

(Im not one of those people who thinks they know everything about planes just because they play flight sim- I am a qualified aircraft maintenance engineer, so i do know my stuff :P  )

[kkchongkk2]

KK

I went to fly in China : my channel : kkchongkk2

[kkchongkk2]

KK



[fryanventu]

If you like modern civil airplanes too, take a look at the ITVV series... tons of infos

[SabraStiehl]

I don't know the overhaul interval for the R 2800 engine in WW II, but when they were later put onto the Martin 404 and Convair 240 piston-engined airliners, it was every 2500 hours. I flew the Martin for three years for Piedmont out of Wilmington, N.C.Without constant maintenance, those engines were prone to blow jugs (lose a cylinder).

[wrh61]

It'd be interesting to know a TBO (time between overhaul) for these engines. Turbos generally are a 'necessary evil' for altitude operations, but with that comes a great deal of stress put on the engine itself, not to mention turbos and wastegates can become rather picky with all the heat generated...

[0MoTheG]

@wrh61 why "evil"? the turbo-charger is part of every diesel-engine and many-gasoline engines today, although they are not build for high altitude performance. In a car the load varies more and quicker than in an aircraft and maintenance-intervals and time of life are much longer.

I doubt these aircraft were ment to get many overhauls, many might have gotten shot down in the first encounter. They were build for performance and number not for a long service time.

[wrh61]

@0MoTheG Being an aircraft mechanic not to mention a pilot, and aircraft owner I stand behind 'necessary evil'. Adding complexity (more components, extra manual controls, not to mention heat) is a potentail reliability, pilot time management issue. This really didn't change much until jet fueled turbine engines and pure jet engines came along. As a percentage of all autos, the number of turbo models is fairly small and although they have come a long way engineering wise, simplicity rules.

[steffen19k]

@wrh61 Based on your argument of simplicity, then maybe we should leave flying to the birds, shouldn't we? It doesn't get much simpler than that.

All that said...Republic Aviation knew what they were doing when they designed the Jug. The fact that it became the most produced American Single Engine Single Seat aircraft in WW2 speaks volumes about the design. I'm sure that you've never ever flown, or worked on a P47, so don't knock it until you've tried it.

and that's my two cents on it.

[wrh61]

@steffen19k Well negativity rules the net so I'm not too suprised at your comment...

[colindhowell]

@0MoTheG I'm sure the engines got lots of overhauls. As SabraStiehl posted above, big piston engines like this had short overhaul periods of only around a couple thousand hours. Might be worse for the P-47, with the added stresses of "war emergency power" operation. I'd assume when an engine had to be taken out for overhaul, the aircraft would have another engine swapped in to keep it in service.

[scrfce123]

Wow... 18250 RPM for the turbo? Modern turbos have the potential to spin at almost 10 times that RPM.

Hearing about oil starvation, turbochargers and wastegates reminds me of cars more than planes... Amazing how far we've come.

[freedomintheskies]

@scrfce123 _

That is a turbo-supercharger, or commonly called a turbo- compounder on some engines. There are a number of different methods emloyed in warbird era engines to keep manifold pressure up, and the turbo compounder is in use on some Volvo turbo-deisel engines today. It uses exhaust gasses to spin a turbine that is connected through a viscus coupling to the crankshaft. On the post war piston engines (2850's) it was good for an additional 400 hp at takeoff power.

Cheerz

[scrfce123]

@freedomintheskies Thanks for the reply. I think that the 'turbo' thats referred to in this video is simply a conventional turbocharger. Judging by the schematic and the fact that it also has wastegates and an intercooler, it can be surmised that is capable of increasing manifold pressure; therefore it can be defined as a turbocharger. A turbo-compounder does not have the capacity to compress inlet air. It acts as a separate engine that transfers power to crank.

[colindhowell]

@freedomintheskies You're confused. "Turbocharger" is just a shortened term for "turbosupercharger". They're different names for the same thing: a compressor driven by an exhaust turbine. A turbo-compound engine is different: the exhaust turbine doesn't drive a compressor, it drives the engine crankshaft. Turbo-compounding has no effect on manifold pressure; it just extracts more energy from the exhaust that would otherwise be wasted.

[0MoTheG]

@scrfce123 What I find important: there is only one turbocharger and no compressor.

(negative g-forces are disallowed)

[scrfce123]

@0MoTheG If it has a turbocharger, then it has a compressor. Back in the early days, negative G forces were problematic because they interfered with the operation of carburettor floats; the float would rise above the fluid line and stop the flow of fuel to the carburettor - hence starving the engine.

The P-47 had a pressurised carb though, so negative G's were never a problem.

[0MoTheG]

@scrfce123 not in my book. To me a compressor is an air-pump that is driven by the shaft. (in the context of combustion engines) They could have used both f.e. to maintain pressure and reduce turbo-RPM by engaging the compressor at high altitudes.

the lubrication must have been the problem, not the mixing.

[scrfce123]

@0MoTheG A compressor increases the mass of a gas for any given volume (say square inch), so it is by no means an air pump.  A fan can be defined as a type of pump, because it can only increase velocity - not mass.

Also, the compressor in a turbocharger is driven by a shaft. Another type of compressor commonly employed in warbirds is the supercharger - these were engine driven.

[colindhowell]

@0MoTheG They did use both; the P-47's R-2800 engine included an internal geared supercharger, driven directly by the engine crankshaft, which further compressed the air already compressed by the turbosupercharger. However, a crankshaft-driven supercharger steals power from the engine, while a turbosupercharger does not, so the P-47's engine supercharger provided only modest boost to minimize the power loss; it relied on the turbo for high-altitude boost.

[colindhowell]

@scrfce123 Well, engineering technology has improved, but also the modern turbos you normally hear about are for car and motorcycle engines. They're small and can easily handle very high speeds. The P-47's engine is much bigger and its turbo is a monster in comparison; check around 9:30 in the "pilot familiarization" film in this series. In such a large turbo the rotational stresses are greater, so it can't turn anywhere near as fast.

[colindhowell]

@scrfce123 Actually, turbochargers are still often found in higher-end piston-engined aircraft used in general aviation.

[scrfce123]

@colindhowell Yeah, I've heard of turbocharged Lycoming and Continental engines. They seem to find use in high end, pressurised aircraft. The turbo must also divert some compressed air to cabin A/C on these models???

[FLOTRED]

Very interessant!

[vascoribeiro69]

In these days (1943) the P-47 had no dive recovery flaps, so it was easy to get under compressibility in a dive. The maximum mach number was 0,87 and critical mach number was 0,75. The 1945 -N could dive to 0.83 thanks to dive recovery flaps.

[TheGTAPlay]

i need a plane now....

[twoaxis]

the person who owns the original movie on celluloid or whatever has a real priceless treasure

[grasess]

thnx

[danagal79]

the "jug" was awesome!!!

[noonedude101]

I bet you a hundred thousand dollars they didn't take those precautions in combat.

[flaircraft]

@noonedude101 My grandfather flew the P-47 in the Pacific during WWII. One time he mentioned that the P-47 pilots were forbidden to do negative G's and especially outside loops. The very next thing he said was "Of course, we did that kind of stuff all the time."

[straighttailpilot]

@flaircraft yeah. I forget what kind of weakness the p47 had with negative manuevers. you werent supposed to fly inverted for more than 5 minutes either I believe.

[snakeyjakehall]

fascinating! was suprised to see the dive speed halved at high altitude. very informative.

[chrisrobsoar]

The maxium speed Vne (Velocity Never Exceed) remains the same True Air Speed (TAS) as altitude increases. The Indicated Air Speed (IAS) is less because the air becomes less dense with altitude. It reduces by about 16% per 10,000ft. BTW: The True Air Speed Stall speed increase with altitude at the same rate that the Air Speed indicator under reads, so the IAS stall speed remains the same. When the stall speed and Vne meet, this is the maximum altitude the aircraft can fly.

[asrlb45]

@chrisrobsoar Do you have a source? 16% per 10,000 ft? IAS will read slightly higher at high altitude because of the ram air effect of greater true airspeed.

[gcmbl]

@asrlb45: I am not sure where chrisrobsoar got 16% per thousand, as the generally accepted number is 2% per thousand, but IAS is definitely less at higher altitudes, not greater, unless you are speaking of some odd effect of extreme altitude. At normal altitudes, however, the 2% decrease rule is pretty accurate.

[MrElSatan]

@chrisrobsoar great !!thx!

[100MPG]

Good film! The P47 had tactical mach no. of 0.71 compared to FW190 and Me109 which were 0.75. Mustang was better (0.78) and after 1944 Lt J Doolittle ordered more P51s to fly top cover for B17s. The P47 went on to low level ground attack role

[lesterclaypool1]

@100MPG go to ,,, [ design and analysis of repbulic p 47 ] its a cite that show what the plane could actually do ,,, in a dive it would hit speeds over 700 miles an hour ,,, they found this after they use guages that were calibrated and not the miltitary trash they were issued

[cjracer1000]

FIRST!!!!!!