Beijing 2008 - MFI - L8 - Ota JPN v Joppich GER - 2 of 2

[luvinwafflez]

Ota's 11th touch was amazing, that is how foil fencers dream their attack on prep is like

[CyrusofChaos]

@luvinwafflez youre referring to the touch at 4:02 right? i didnt think it was amazing, for some reason even though joppich had the attack he decided to parry which means that he saw the counterattack coming and for some reason didnt finish. had he chosen to finish like he should have ota would have looked silly for counterattacking there instead

[luvinwafflez]

@CyrusofChaos yes, but joppich was coming forward with preparation, perhaps even a bit too close to ota, and ota sees this and attacks into his preparation. Since joppich did not finish his attack, but was caught on prep, he went for the parry, which was a mistake. It was Joppich's mistake, but it was not independent of Ota's actions, it would have been hard for Joppich to finish with a well-aimed attack in that situation.

[olympiafencing]

@CyrusofChaos I agree with you...it was a gutsy move, but also lucky.

[Fastest0Jason]

I thought it was good refereeing. He deserved the red card at end, and joppich defiantly did the beat attack, not ota's parry repost. :D But only my opinion.

[117nomansland]

at 02:08 it sounds like he said douch bag

[jiri1991]

@ CyrusofChaos

do you fence yourself? and if so, what weapon?

cheers

[WrightWindWrath]

LOL. 10:00 Ota looks like he's in pain. And his coach on top of him just makes it look wrong. :D

One thing I've always admired about Ota is his lightning pare ripostes. He's real fast.

[roy89321]

OTA act the Japanese Suicide Attack!

[Blad0506]

Referee is ridiculous

[schokoprinz]

ive always wondered what the hell the director says after "touche", it sounds really weird, i know its not the word "one", so anyone know what he is saying after each touch?

[CyrusofChaos]

not sure how to spell it in french but it translates to point. attack touche, "point"

[webbster5296]

Point in French is "Point"

It's just pronounced differently

[D04S02B04]

There were a few odd calls by the referee in favour of Joppich. Quite a few times in slow motion, you can actually see both fencers actively 'taking the blade', hence both actually have priority yet the point is given to Joppich.

[Voiv]

Taking the Blade does not give you priority, the there only two things which give you priority. Beginning arm extension first and establishing Point in Line correctly.

Taking the blade is a preparation

[D04S02B04]

So you're saying that a parry/taking the blade does not give priority?

[Voiv]

I am.

Its a common misconception that a parry gives the defender right of way, in fact if you read the rule, what it says is that the parry "gives the right to riposte". What this means is that the parry momentarily takes priority away from the attacker, at this point no-one has priority and it is upto the defender to then make his riposte. It is the riposte which gives the priority. Many coaches use the idea of the parry giving priority to simplify it, but it is wrong.

[Voiv]

As well as this, taking the blade is a completely different action to a parry. Taking the Blade is a type of preparation, I'm sure you've heard the call from Referees "On your preparation, attack touche" or something of the sort. This would apply in the case of a beat if you were to beat or take the blade then stop, and the other fencer attacks immediately. The call would be the on your prep call.

[schokoprinz]

you seem to know the rule book rather well. If i had some questions pertaining to fencing actions would you be willing to answer them?

[Voiv]

I'll do my best, fire away!

[schokoprinz]

So im advancing and the other guy attacks, i catch the perry and go for a riposte over my head (cause we are too close) as i go to riposte he tries to counter into me, as my arm is coming up it hits his and i get called for cor-de-dor, is that the correct call? - i have a video if my explanation is poor.

[Voiv]

I'd like to see the video if possible please :)

Its always a little difficult to say without knowing everything that happened in the phrase

[D04S02B04]

Anyway, to follow up on this intepretation.

There are numerous instances in fencing when both attacker and defender pre-empt each other and parry simultaneously along with the riposte and you'll usually see both of them cheer because to each of them that is a legitimate touch.

Who's point will it be then? Are you going to determine it by who is moving forward? Or are you going to determine it by who struck first? This is a very grey area in fencing.

[Voiv]

Bloody good question.

I don't have a hard and fast rule for dealing with them as each instance is invariably different.

What I tend to do is look for where on the blades contact was made. The rules state that a Parry must be Forte of blade of Foible, if one is clearly on the Forte of another it makes the job easier. However in all honestly when a situation like that pops up I tend to go on how the action felt.

[viikidaviking]

i have had mor yellow cars than i can remember even though it wasn't my fault! I hate fencing with c**p ref's

[40300j]

Yes peter is the best.

[BohemianGod]

damn, that red card is a whole heap of dick.

[D04S02B04]

He was impolite for arguing with the referee. He deserved the card. Check the rulebook.

With all the "wide-armed" attacks that he is making, it isn't going to win him the match. Most of Ota's parry ripostes were scored because of the telegraphic attacks, giving him ample time to react.

Just observe the slow motion carefully.

[dragopie]

I thought he got a red card for lowering his head

[TheLegenddudet]

He might of lost this one but Peter Joppich is still amazing