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Diabetologia. 2007 Feb;50(2):307-16.

CONCLUSION: Vegans have a food intake and a biochemical profile that will be expected to be cardioprotective, with lower IMCL accumulation and beta-cell protective.Eur J Clin Nutr. 2005 Feb;59(2):291-8.

Fruit may be inversely associated w/diabetes-Prev Med Jan 2001

So, why push a diet of low carb when carbs are only 60% of the problem?

In the meantime, what about the heme iron and fat and excess protein and uric acid in meat that causes diabetes too?

Chrisisms 1 year ago

I'm not pushing any diet on anyone. Anyone who follows me online knows I am all about individuals making the best choice for the sake of their weight and health. However, that means while a vegan diet like you seem to favor may work for you, maybe a high-fat, animal-based low-carb diet will work for me. Diabetes is a condition that is only exacerbated by the excessive consumption of carbohydrate. Sure, there are other factors, but that's the primary one which is why I focus on it so strongly.

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

I'm not pushing any diet on anyone.'

I didn't say u were pushing it on any[one] in particular but you were pushing it despite disease risks associated.

'while a vegan diet like you seem to favor may work for you, maybe a high-fat, animal-based low-carb diet will work for me'

That assumption (you haven't tried both), takes for granted that humans are scavengers without dietary specialization, yet have vast differences in dietary needs that no species demonstrate within their own species.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

There are no proven "disease risks" associated with high-fat, moderate-protein, low-carb diets containing real whole foods. I'm not at all interested in doing a plan (low-fat, which I did in 1999 with great weight loss success, but felt horrible) that I cannot sustain. Low-carb living saved my life and my health is immaculate today because of it. Find the plan for you and do it is my bottom line philosophy.

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

'There are no proven "disease risks" Science looks for causal agents and evidence, not 100% cause/effect proof of 1 factor.

'associated with high-fat, moderate-protein, low-carb'

Do u have operationalizing #s? For instance, it's well-known humans naturally produce watered down breast milk of 1% protein and wild hominoidea consume less than 5% fat. (Wrangham et al., 1991). humans do not need more than 3-5% fat, enough to provide the one essential fatty acid and fat soluble vitamins (RDA, 1989).

Chrisisms 1 year ago

Diabetes is a condition that is only exacerbated by the excessive consumption of carbohydrate'

Not according to the scientific research. Heme iron is ONLY found in animal parts and causes type 2 diabetes.

"Greater dietary heme-iron intake and/or supplemental iron were associated w/ increased risk of Type 2 diabetes" -Diabetologia,47,(2) Feb, 2004

'there are other factors'

But a biochemically compatible diet doesn't include those factors and promotes not weakens insulin response.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

No sure what research you are examining, but there is ample evidence showing carbs are the root cause of the obesity/diabetes twin pandemics. Read GOOD CALORIES, BAD CALORIES by Gary Taubes for the historical research and THE NEW ATKINS FOR A NEW YOU for 50 of the latest studies on the healthfulness of carbohydrate restriction. It even includes vegetarian versions of low-carb living. My low-carb lifestyle has kept me from an early grave like my brother suffered at the age of 41.

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

'No sure what research you are examining'

You never heard of heme iron?? I referenced the study...

'there is ample evidence showing carbs are the root cause of the obesity/diabetes'

I agree processed/starchy/refined food lacking fiber is correlated with diabetes. But that's not the only causal agent. Decreased insulin response causes more free glucose in the bloodstream and more insulin to be produced to try to penetrate the cells. This happens with high fat diets too, saturated or not.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

I wish I had time to continue to share why I believe what I believe based on science, but read the books I talked about, check out the medical literature, and do further research. It looks like there are indeed questions that you've brought up that are worthy of examination, but hopefully I've given you some similar food for thought to challenge what you believe as well. Be well my friend and thanks for the conversation!

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

Fresh, raw fruit and even juices when sipped on gradually, digested best, are far less condusive and even negatively correlated with diabetes but why do people on low carb diets lump all plant foods together?

Sure low carb is negatively correlated w/diabetes when u eliminate the complex carbs of breads and pasta and refined grains. Assume that is the worst diet, related to diabetes. But then why settle for the second worst diet of meat, which impedes insulin response?

Fruit is most healthy.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

Fruit is an interesting subject because it seems to have this "health halo" attached to it as if it is some kind of superfood. But I'd NEVER eat a banana which has a whopping 29g carbohydrate in it. Or the much-heralded orange juice which has as much sugar in it as a can of Coca-Cola. One of the things that has been most remarkable about healthy low-carb living is coming off of that sugar rollercoaster ride and I don't have to worry about spiking my blood sugar or insulin levels ever again!

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

'I'd NEVER eat a banana which has a whopping 29g carbohydrate'

I don't eat bananas either, they are too starchy/complex carbs and mucus forming with mucopolysacharides. Bananas are not succulent fruit, digested best by humans. Closest relatives don't normally eat bananas either.

'orange juice'

Oranges are a mutated citrus.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

TOTALLY agree. :)

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

8:56 Diabetes is a risk factor of Atkins type diets.

Positive associations were also observed between type 2 diabetes and red meat. Arch Internal Med. 2004;164:2235.

Greater dietary heme-iron intake and/or supplemental iron were associated w/ increased risk of Type 2 diabetes. Diabetologia,47,(2) Feb, 2004

Intakes of total cholesterol, animal protein, and heme iron were also significantly associated with a higher risk of type 2 diabetes. Diabetes Care. 2004 Sep;27(9):2108-15.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

There is no evidence that an Atkins low-carb diet leads to diabetes--just the opposite:

Dietary carbohydrate restriction in type 2 diabetes mellitus and metabolic syndrome: time for a critical appraisal Nutrition & Metabolism 2008, 5:9 (8 April 2008)

The effect of a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet versus a low-glycemic index diet on glycemic control in type 2 diabetes mellitus Nutrition & Metabolism 2008, 5:36doi:10.1186/1743-7075-5-36

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

So u just pick and choose what research u want to believe?

Meanwhile, no studies indicate that a real fruit with the fiber diet promotes diabetes...

I posted studies above providing biological plausibility for the correlation between animal fat consumption and diabetes. Do u have no respones to it?

I'm not doubting a low carb diet may be less unhealthy as a standard american diet but there are specific reasons why meat contributes to diabetes. Will u just not address the issue?

Chrisisms 1 year ago

I have an open mind about the research & am willing to entertain any new ideas that run counter from what I have seen. Seems to me you're not willing to offer this same courtesy. Your thoughts on fruit are curiously interesting to me because I'd love to see a study examining the impact of fruit as nature intended (fiber and all) and the impact on blood sugar/insulin levels. On the subject of animal fat and diabetes, I don't buy into it at all. Explain to me how dietary fat leads to diabetes.

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

Of course if you compare diets w/complex carbs to atkins, atkins diets are not going to have as much of a risk factor for DB2 but if you take away the starchy foods AND animal fat, this decreases DB2 risk further.

Diabetic children had a high intake of energy from saturated fat and low intake of fibre, fruits and vegetables

Diabetologia. 2007 Feb;50(2):307-16.

if weight is the most valued factor, atkins doesn't compare to frugivore diets, one can eat as much fruit possible without worry.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

If you fear saturated fat after all the science that has come out about it in recent years, then that's your choice. But it's totally innocuous to your health. Read FAT AND CHOLESTEROL ARE GOOD FOR YOU by Dr. Uffe Ravnskov for more information.

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

It's not at all a question of 'fear' as much as it is a question of what the optimal diets for humans is. I admitted atkins diets help lose weight compared to standard American diets but not compared to fruit based diets. I was contrasting a biochemically compatible/life promoting diet with the atkins, which is associated with diabetes, cancer, Alzheimer's, etc.

I explained that compared to a standard American diet of starch/processed foods, atkins is not as strongly correlated with diabetes.

Chrisisms 1 year ago

I wish I had time to continue to share why I believe what I believe based on science, but read the books I talked about, check out the medical literature, and do further research. It looks like there are indeed questions that you've brought up that are worthy of examination, but hopefully I've given you some similar food for thought to challenge what you believe as well. Be well my friend and thanks for the conversation! Keep eating those fruit and stay healthy. :)

livinlowcarbman 1 year ago

Wow!U 2 look so much younger since u dropped weight!

mzrey 2 years ago

I'm working on it for early 2009. :)

livinlowcarbman 3 years ago

yep, DANDR wasn´t the invention of Low Carb, but certainly is a classic, Its fun to read , I think I read DADR ( borrowed from a friend ) in 3 days, I found it to be extremely interesting, Atkins did a good job on it. I think you could maybe add a good low carb recipe book. I´m on a Orkut community where recipes for Ice Creams , Breads, Cakes , and many many candies abount. they´re all great.

zegonzales 3 years ago

they look like great books to add to the library. Do you think that you could send me the names and the links to the sites in which I can purchase these little gems? Thanks

BlackPhase 4 years ago

Send me an e-mail at livinlowcarbman at charter dot net and I'd be happy to provide a link to all the books for you. THANKS so much! :)

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