Progressive Values? Terry McAuliffe - On Values

[LeeCountyArkansas]

Top Clinton Advisor-Super Delegate Terry MacAiffle turned a $100 dollar investment into $2.5 million on the sale of his commerical real estate in FL.

Clinton friend, Bob Johnson, turned his $15,000 dollar investment into $3 billion selling BET (Black Exploitation TV) to Viacom. He shills for Hill now.

Hillary turned $1,000 dollars into $100,000 dollars trading futures with Don Tyson's the Chicken king.

That Clinton clan sure know how to get things done... (for themselves)!

[Hudd1950]

Progressive values: take from you to give to others.

[Big0range]

HERE'S a progressive idea - eliminate social programs and allow people to re-learn to depend on their friends, neighbors, and themselves instead of the government. It's crazy and "out there", but it's what builds society.

[EdwinRutsch]

the government is you and your neighbors. you've just bought into the failed conservative values of authoritarianism, indifference and selfishness. If you care about your friends and your neighbors, you should have no trouble caring about your wider community.

[Big0range]

Hey, thanks for the response! Indifference doesn't occur because of conservative values, it occurs when people no longer have to earn the things they want. When the government gives people something they haven't earned, it has no value to the recipient. Why should someone care about something when they have no investment in it? Government-imposed wealth redistribution has never, ever worked (unless you're one of the elite, ruling party).

[EdwinRutsch]

Scapegoating is another well known Failed Conservative Value. It fits with the Failed Conservative Value of hierarchy... wanting to look down on people, using put downs, etc needing someone to blame. Indifference is the outgrowth of conservative selfish individualism. Don't you feel that caring and empathy would be a better foundation for a society than selfish indifference and scapegoating?

[Big0range]

Scapegoating is a tactic employed masterfully by progressives: "Businesses and rich people are evil and oppress the common man" is a primary liberal mantra. The implication progressives make is "you are unable to succeed without my help", which should insult most people. Caring and empathy IS a primary foundation in our nation, but it needs to (and does) occur on a personal, not governmental, level; and real caring occurs when people are allowed to make AND learn from their mistakes.

[EdwinRutsch]

Katrina was a classic example of not caring. It wasn't the government that failed, but conservative indifferent government and the failed values behind it. If you care about people, your friends, family, neighbors, local community, country, world, it's an extension of your caring. It's manifest through your personal relationships, family institution, community institutions, including the government. It could even be manifest through businesses and corporations.

[EdwinRutsch]

Using your position, you should not care about your friends or family either. It's an "insult" to care about them. If conservatives care and don't extend the caring out through all the institutions, they then create a mess like Katrina. An absolute failure of Conservative Values. Everyone's in it for themselves.

BTW, "evil" is a conservative word, progressives' I believe, just want responsible business and are not against business or wealth. Look at Bill Gates and Warren Buffet.

[Big0range]

No, Katrina was a classic example of why people should purchase insurance for their homes and property. The govt has no business bailing out people who made poor purchasing and financial decisions. One can choose to purchase cable tv, cell phones, brand name sneakers, and eat out three times a week instead of purchasing property or health insurance - but they do not need to be absolved from the repercussions of their poor decision making. They can't learn if they're bailed out with tax dollars.

[Big0range]

"Evil" is a conservative word because conservatives still recognize that there is a right and wrong - in decisions, behavior, attitudes, and all aspects of life. There is personal responsibility that goes along with recognizing right and wrong in one's life. If one doesn't complete school, taking advantage of a provided free education, if a parent doesn't make the effort to ensure kids complete their homework, it's not the function of society to step in an support those people for life.

[EdwinRutsch]

So punish drowning people, as a lesson to them. I hope conservatives are not in power during the next earth quake in California. Let them all lay under the rubble, they should have bough insurance. I wonder what conservative governmetn will say to you where ever you live when a catastrophe happens.

[Big0range]

This statement about punishing drowning people provides insight into a liberal cornerstone: to punish requires action, and the implication is that it's anyone else's fault but the people who didn't buy insurance and evacuate. Who, exactly, is punishing these people, and how, exactly, are they being punished? Keep in mind that inaction (which isn't applicable in this case) is not the same at taking the action of punishing.

[EdwinRutsch]

it sounds like you're just finding rationalizations for why you don't care and finding rationalizations to support indifference. Who do you actually care about in your life????

[EdwinRutsch]

I've been thinking that maybe conservatives don't want to care because people will take advantage of it. They want to protect themselves from being taken advantage of. But that happens in all situations. I.e.. Corporations steal, break the law.. It doesn't mean you write off all corporations. There are people that take advantage of any system. Doesn't mean you punish everyone in the system for that.

[Big0range]

No able-bodied American needs public assistance for a lifetime. You equate not giving them someone else's earnings with punishment? The real punishment is condemning them to an unproductive, unfulfilling life in which they never experience the satisfaction of accomplishment, achievement, and success. Instead of allowing them to learn a better life is available to them, you teach them that they can't do anything without govt help. THAT'S the punishment, and it's not a conservative value.

[EdwinRutsch]

Big0range - good to see you have returned.. I've been too busy to respond. But I want to take this thread and discussion and repost it to another site that allows for longer discussions and rich text, (ie. links, bolding, images, no limit on text length, etc) I'll do that as soon as I can.. I know a site for this, if that works for you? I enjoy our conversations. best edwin

[Big0range]

I posted earlier, but don't see it here; it may have been deleted (?). Yes, I'll be glad to follow the conversation to a more facilitating site.

[Big0range]

I'll take this opportunity to point out that because I don't care about things you care about or demonstrate my care the same way as you does NOT mean I don't care. I give to the causes, organizations, and people I choose in the amounts I feel are warranted. Nothing personal, Edwin, but I don't need you (or other libs) to tell me who is worthy of charity; nor will I be so pretentious as to tell you who deserves your resources. Charitable giving is a personal, not governmental, matter.

[Hudd1950]

Do not the city and state have responsibilties? Last I heard, biollions of our taxes--that would be federal--have gone into the area and to the people.

[runkaballe]

Worked in Scandinavia fairly well, The average BNP per capita is higher in Scandinavia the in the US.

[EdwinRutsch]

Please, rate this video and post a few comments about it here. Write your synopsis of what you feel was said and give your response. You can also help create the "What are Progressive Values" documentary by going to ProgressiveSpirit(dot)com and joining the Progressive Values study group and listserver.