lol...im no carpenter, im trying to make a bench for my small shop, i work on motorcycles on and off....a motorcycle lift would cost like 500-600 bucks, i also detail and paint cars and i would need a bench that would hold atleast 600lbs and be light to move or hoist it up to the little attic in the garage...i figured these steel studs may be lighter then wood but since its thinner im not sure if it would hold the weight
way to slow bro if dat was at my job i would ov got fired for going so slow, we pump out like 2300 meters on average on a 8 hour day, i would ov took like a minute to do that, use a air rivet gun way faster.
Unless you live in a termite-infested high moisture locale, metal stud has more cons than pros. Fun video though. You can see how flimsy MS is when the wall's lifted. I can't determine if that's that's a rough door or window opening. In either case that's no header. If a door, normal door use will split the drywall. MS transfers the lateral rigidity onus onto drywall that isn't designed to handle. MS over block is fine. Anything else is might as well be tinfoil. Big time call backs.
@RenoDoctor Nice post. I was looking at this having never used it and wondering if it was really worth it given how quickly it can be done with timber and a chop saw.
@lexichronicle2 MS is ok if framing onto existing brick or block to insulate a basement with no intent of hanging anything weighty like cabinets. It's good for L.R. and foyer domed ceilings (just the drywall, not chandelier weight) and other geometric specs that are an ordeal for SPF. But for strength it's terrible. Any framing member you can bend in your hand is junk. MS costs more, ever the cheapest grade, and takes more time to prep and install than lumber.
1000 times better. So much quicker and the strength is not even comparable. No measuring is required. the machine measures the studs to fractions of a milimeter.
What he said is total bullshit. The tensile and compressive strength of wood is not even close to steel. Also, wood is brittle, when it fails it crumbles. Steel, on the other hand is ductile so deformity can be observed before failure occurs. Steel also doesn't burn like wood does. When screwed together with cross bracing like above, these frames are ridiculously strong, buildings in cyclones still stay up. I've built these with my own hands. There is no comparison.
Thanks for the quick reply. When you say the machine does it, do you mean these things are laid out by some CAD tool and then fed to an automatic saw? In the UK, they're sold just as plain lengths at the DIY places, that all need cutting and workings out by hand. Some of the profiles are really filmsy as well, that might be why renodoctor doesn't like them.
@lexichronicle2 Yep 1.15mm steel, the machine fabricates every single part of the stud members, all you have to do is put them together and screw them in. Literally wouldn't take 5 minutes for every stud to come out the machine for the frame above.
@lexichronicle2 In auss, they are engineered and designed and produced by factory machines. If you want a wall to withstand a mack truck direct hit, It will do it. Up to 2mm thick and placed in all the correct places for strength required. Most of the steel sheet is formed specifically for specific jobs and is all cold rolled to maintain structual design integrity. They are not just saws. These machines measure, cut, bend, fold, roll and punch then weld all in one.
@michaeljames92 Maybe Oz wood, but not SPF. Real lumber destroys even the thickest MS structural framing gauge in every strength category, except for one: the base steel MS is manufactured from is stronger than lumber. Try this, use MS laid flat for blocks next time you oil change the outbackwagon. Squash. That's the strength of MS. It's so shit that drywall (not intended for) gives it rigidity.
@RenoDoctor How about we compare apples with apples. This steel is 89mm C section 1.15mm thick. The wood you're using is actually thick, this steel is hollow, the whole idea is it is lightweight and when you make a frame with cross bracing it provides unbelievable strength. Dude, I'm an engineer, I might actually know which material is stronger. Why do you think they make bridges and skyscrapers out of steel? because its so much stronger you idiot.
@michaeljames92 MS is promoted as having the highest strength-to-weight ratio. Which is true. But what isn't disclosed is it means yield strength: resistance to pulling force. House framing is mainly subject to compression and shear. When pulled up means badass hurricane; when down, gravity due to sinkhole or washout. Attic joists brace against angular axial roof load: angled trusses technically pushing the wall top plate outward that in fact don't via sympathetic web loading.
As I have stated already, steel is still a number of times stronger in shear and compression than wood is. I cannot understand your argument either, you fail to make sense.
@RenoDoctor Part 2. Metal studs were designed to support interior drywall anchored to the inside of load bearing concrete block. Studs only bore gypsum. Wily contractors looking to outbid block design finagled an argument that cross-bracing could to do the same job as block.Uh-uh. It can withstand moderate seismic activity due to weight advantage but not airborne debris, the primary cause of hurricane-related structural damage.
@RenoDoctor Dont know about america, but in australia, we produced stud design to replace wood studs. Not concrete. It is cheaper, pest resistant, does not warp or shrink or distort and is far cleaner and easier to work with and much stronger screwed together in a cyclone than wood stud and nail housing design. :) Now, 25g studs are not just for drywall in auss as i suspect is same in USa. Studs are manufactured to temper, eg. 12g 14g 16g 18g and 20g for structual building designs.
@RenoDoctor building a steel frame house is far better to a wood house as steel is stronger than wood in all ways. yield strength, compression weight and shear. this is due to great leaps in building called engineering. Which is a bit beyond most builders. Its simple. You have a local wind rating of wd45, you design housing to withstand that. In steel, you just increase the guage of the studs and placement in design. Whallahh!..you have a stronger house with minimal extra bulk.
@sqnhunter Secondly, as all the great minds forget, from floor to roof, where is the weakest point for shear in a hurricane. most worry about the stud and forget the weakest point is where the stud is anchored to the floor or where the stud screws into the top channel where all the roofing or flooring is fastened. steel fastening bolts are a lot better than nails in timber any day. Thats where the tearing begins.
@sqnhunter there's no question steel has superior yield strength over lumber mass per mass. But when comparing Australia to elsewhere it must be mentioned that the termite problem is a primary determinant in the opting of metal stud over lumber for longevity. In the Canadian construction industry builders, by default, will cheap out and install the weakest, flimsiest metal stud they can. Compared to lumber, complete crap.
@RenoDoctor termites play a great roll, yes, but also it is the cyclones, the really big tornadoes that hit over and over in some areas. Steel plays the roll of strengthener, where as wood cant and concrete is too expensive. I guess the most important factor to concider though is how builders the world over will try to "cheap out" as you put it. Auss was the same. Now they have possibly the most rigid building codes in the world for quality and building. Its a pain but a good thing.
@lexichronicle2 The opposite for *structural* framing. Non-load and partition walls, that originally designed for, work fine. What's happening is manufacturers are expanding into the structural market. If a homeowner wants steel, go with I-beam. The metal screw fasteners have stronger MOE and MOR than the metal stud.
Good argument cocko. Last time i checked mine sites up north of australia(cyclones everywhere) use steel framing for the accommodation. Steel framing actually stays up in cyclones, not wood which is shithouse. Wood is terrible. It warps, it burns, it shears very easily, is brittle and fabricating the same frame out of wood above would take so much longer. I'd know I've actually built these before.
@michaeljames92 And use MS for things like termite defence and saving operating cost by having these modular constructed and then shipped to rather than built onsite, genius boy.
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balesteel100 3 months ago
lol...im no carpenter, im trying to make a bench for my small shop, i work on motorcycles on and off....a motorcycle lift would cost like 500-600 bucks, i also detail and paint cars and i would need a bench that would hold atleast 600lbs and be light to move or hoist it up to the little attic in the garage...i figured these steel studs may be lighter then wood but since its thinner im not sure if it would hold the weight
jettastreetracer 3 months ago
@jettastreetracer that will need calculations, hot rolled studs or thicker gauges can make it strong enough to support
tinacccc 2 months ago
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giang180573 3 months ago
i frame with steel every day and I have NEVER framed a steel wall while laying on the floor hahaha. DUMB ASSES !!!
Oh nice gloves too
benji9669 4 months ago
i frame with steel every day and I have NEVER framed a steel wall while laying on the floor hahaha. DUMB ASSES !!!
benji9669 4 months ago
way to slow bro if dat was at my job i would ov got fired for going so slow, we pump out like 2300 meters on average on a 8 hour day, i would ov took like a minute to do that, use a air rivet gun way faster.
jadevaradi 4 months ago
at naples fl you can found the best metal framer ,btw you guys took too long to build this ,even with all pre made
silentofhell47 10 months ago
How you can handle the lateral rigidity onus in this case??? More horizontal studs?
paleozoico82 1 year ago
Unless you live in a termite-infested high moisture locale, metal stud has more cons than pros. Fun video though. You can see how flimsy MS is when the wall's lifted. I can't determine if that's that's a rough door or window opening. In either case that's no header. If a door, normal door use will split the drywall. MS transfers the lateral rigidity onus onto drywall that isn't designed to handle. MS over block is fine. Anything else is might as well be tinfoil. Big time call backs.
RenoDoctor 1 year ago
@RenoDoctor Nice post. I was looking at this having never used it and wondering if it was really worth it given how quickly it can be done with timber and a chop saw.
lexichronicle2 10 months ago
@lexichronicle2 MS is ok if framing onto existing brick or block to insulate a basement with no intent of hanging anything weighty like cabinets. It's good for L.R. and foyer domed ceilings (just the drywall, not chandelier weight) and other geometric specs that are an ordeal for SPF. But for strength it's terrible. Any framing member you can bend in your hand is junk. MS costs more, ever the cheapest grade, and takes more time to prep and install than lumber.
RenoDoctor 10 months ago
@lexichronicle2
1000 times better. So much quicker and the strength is not even comparable. No measuring is required. the machine measures the studs to fractions of a milimeter.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
@michaeljames92 The other guy, down there (renodoctor), is saying precisely the opposite isn't he?
lexichronicle2 2 months ago
@lexichronicle2
What he said is total bullshit. The tensile and compressive strength of wood is not even close to steel. Also, wood is brittle, when it fails it crumbles. Steel, on the other hand is ductile so deformity can be observed before failure occurs. Steel also doesn't burn like wood does. When screwed together with cross bracing like above, these frames are ridiculously strong, buildings in cyclones still stay up. I've built these with my own hands. There is no comparison.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
Thanks for the quick reply. When you say the machine does it, do you mean these things are laid out by some CAD tool and then fed to an automatic saw? In the UK, they're sold just as plain lengths at the DIY places, that all need cutting and workings out by hand. Some of the profiles are really filmsy as well, that might be why renodoctor doesn't like them.
lexichronicle2 2 months ago
@lexichronicle2 Yep 1.15mm steel, the machine fabricates every single part of the stud members, all you have to do is put them together and screw them in. Literally wouldn't take 5 minutes for every stud to come out the machine for the frame above.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
@michaeljames92 That'd be loads better than the kits they sell here then! :D Cheers for the info and clear up.
lexichronicle2 2 months ago
@lexichronicle2 In auss, they are engineered and designed and produced by factory machines. If you want a wall to withstand a mack truck direct hit, It will do it. Up to 2mm thick and placed in all the correct places for strength required. Most of the steel sheet is formed specifically for specific jobs and is all cold rolled to maintain structual design integrity. They are not just saws. These machines measure, cut, bend, fold, roll and punch then weld all in one.
sqnhunter 2 weeks ago
@michaeljames92 Maybe Oz wood, but not SPF. Real lumber destroys even the thickest MS structural framing gauge in every strength category, except for one: the base steel MS is manufactured from is stronger than lumber. Try this, use MS laid flat for blocks next time you oil change the outbackwagon. Squash. That's the strength of MS. It's so shit that drywall (not intended for) gives it rigidity.
RenoDoctor 2 months ago
@RenoDoctor How about we compare apples with apples. This steel is 89mm C section 1.15mm thick. The wood you're using is actually thick, this steel is hollow, the whole idea is it is lightweight and when you make a frame with cross bracing it provides unbelievable strength. Dude, I'm an engineer, I might actually know which material is stronger. Why do you think they make bridges and skyscrapers out of steel? because its so much stronger you idiot.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
@michaeljames92 MS is promoted as having the highest strength-to-weight ratio. Which is true. But what isn't disclosed is it means yield strength: resistance to pulling force. House framing is mainly subject to compression and shear. When pulled up means badass hurricane; when down, gravity due to sinkhole or washout. Attic joists brace against angular axial roof load: angled trusses technically pushing the wall top plate outward that in fact don't via sympathetic web loading.
RenoDoctor 2 months ago
@RenoDoctor
As I have stated already, steel is still a number of times stronger in shear and compression than wood is. I cannot understand your argument either, you fail to make sense.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
@RenoDoctor Part 2. Metal studs were designed to support interior drywall anchored to the inside of load bearing concrete block. Studs only bore gypsum. Wily contractors looking to outbid block design finagled an argument that cross-bracing could to do the same job as block.Uh-uh. It can withstand moderate seismic activity due to weight advantage but not airborne debris, the primary cause of hurricane-related structural damage.
RenoDoctor 2 months ago
@RenoDoctor Dont know about america, but in australia, we produced stud design to replace wood studs. Not concrete. It is cheaper, pest resistant, does not warp or shrink or distort and is far cleaner and easier to work with and much stronger screwed together in a cyclone than wood stud and nail housing design. :) Now, 25g studs are not just for drywall in auss as i suspect is same in USa. Studs are manufactured to temper, eg. 12g 14g 16g 18g and 20g for structual building designs.
sqnhunter 2 weeks ago
@RenoDoctor building a steel frame house is far better to a wood house as steel is stronger than wood in all ways. yield strength, compression weight and shear. this is due to great leaps in building called engineering. Which is a bit beyond most builders. Its simple. You have a local wind rating of wd45, you design housing to withstand that. In steel, you just increase the guage of the studs and placement in design. Whallahh!..you have a stronger house with minimal extra bulk.
sqnhunter 2 weeks ago
@sqnhunter Secondly, as all the great minds forget, from floor to roof, where is the weakest point for shear in a hurricane. most worry about the stud and forget the weakest point is where the stud is anchored to the floor or where the stud screws into the top channel where all the roofing or flooring is fastened. steel fastening bolts are a lot better than nails in timber any day. Thats where the tearing begins.
sqnhunter 2 weeks ago
@sqnhunter there's no question steel has superior yield strength over lumber mass per mass. But when comparing Australia to elsewhere it must be mentioned that the termite problem is a primary determinant in the opting of metal stud over lumber for longevity. In the Canadian construction industry builders, by default, will cheap out and install the weakest, flimsiest metal stud they can. Compared to lumber, complete crap.
RenoDoctor 2 weeks ago
@RenoDoctor termites play a great roll, yes, but also it is the cyclones, the really big tornadoes that hit over and over in some areas. Steel plays the roll of strengthener, where as wood cant and concrete is too expensive. I guess the most important factor to concider though is how builders the world over will try to "cheap out" as you put it. Auss was the same. Now they have possibly the most rigid building codes in the world for quality and building. Its a pain but a good thing.
sqnhunter 2 weeks ago
@lexichronicle2 The opposite for *structural* framing. Non-load and partition walls, that originally designed for, work fine. What's happening is manufacturers are expanding into the structural market. If a homeowner wants steel, go with I-beam. The metal screw fasteners have stronger MOE and MOR than the metal stud.
RenoDoctor 2 months ago
@RenoDoctor
Good argument cocko. Last time i checked mine sites up north of australia(cyclones everywhere) use steel framing for the accommodation. Steel framing actually stays up in cyclones, not wood which is shithouse. Wood is terrible. It warps, it burns, it shears very easily, is brittle and fabricating the same frame out of wood above would take so much longer. I'd know I've actually built these before.
michaeljames92 2 months ago
@michaeljames92 And use MS for things like termite defence and saving operating cost by having these modular constructed and then shipped to rather than built onsite, genius boy.
RenoDoctor 2 months ago
nice but wrong way to do it,take to long.Chinese people try to do everything easy
rubenbasurtotorreon 1 year ago