Did Jesus really exist? .... probably not. What I do find quiet funny is that followers of the 'Birther Movement' in the USA are close to 100% Christian. Any atheist Birthers out there to prove me wrong? I won't hold my breath. So they insist on more proof than a validated birth certificate, but on the other hand believe that 2000 years ago some guy was crucified and rose from the dead. and was a god. All from 2nd and 3rd hand writtings decades after the fact. starting to see the irony?
Human will allways need to invent new teories and facts about nature and spiritual word but for God all times of history and evolutions are at one moment...
Many prophecies are "fulfilled" by the simple expedient of inventing and writing a fulfillment that never happened in fact. An example is Matthew 2:13-15, which has Jesus as a child being hauled off to Egypt to escape the "slaughter of the innocents". Neither the move to Egypt nor the slaughter ever took place. Matthew wrote this lie to be able to say "And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: "Out of Egypt I called my son." " No other gospel or history records this.
@ stantheman42069: You keep harping that others are avoiding your claim of "more then 100 other deities" which fit Jesus' story. I challenge you to enlighten us of the names or any other details of these 100... nay, let's say 10 to make it easy for you. Mind you, you can spare us the spiel about Mithras being a perfect example of a "Sun God" who had a miraculous "virgin birth", since a cursory investigation reveals that his mythology claims he was born spontaneously from a "rock", not a woman.
when are any of you people even going to touch the other deities like Jesus years before him. Josephus himself is under contest there is a good amount of scholar who think his work was rewritten in more of a pro Christian mindset. the reason i dont think Jesus existed is based on the lack of historical evidence the similarities between him and the myths of god before. He is just the same sun god stories repacked to sedate the masses.
sorry man but you re guided by false knowledge the sun god has nothing to do with jesus and the things in zetgeist about jesus are completely false and you just have to study egypt gods to know that this shit was almost completely made up
Is the only source you people have Josephus i mean a his writing werent even discovered till the 14 century( maybe sooner I cant recall) these sources are under hot debate in fact most historian believe it was rewritten when it was discover in a more Christian mind set. Much like these historians in this video that have vested interest in saying these non historical facts. Why you ask because they are Christians them selfs and they dont want to go against there own faith.
In addition to Josephus we have Tacitus (Annales 15.44,), Seutonius (12 caesars-"Iudaeos, impulsore Chresto, assidue tumultuantes Roma expulit"), and Pliny in his letters to Trajan, among other less credulous sources. I have vested interest in saying non historical facts? Excuse me but I am not a christian, I am a student of history, and frankly I find your flagrant disregard for the objective application of historical standards to be as dogmatic as that of any christian I've ever come across.
god dam it you Christian are the most blinded arrogant group of people to ever walk this earth when you die and go to your god he will cast you to your hell for being so damn closed minded. Can one of you explain how Jesus story mimic perfectly more then 100 god more then 1000 year before his non excitant birth. You people can ignore all the fact you want it doesnt make Jesus magically exist sorry to tell you.
Ok, Joseph-stantheman-Smith Google doesn't help your roman-crucifixion-list either... so where did you hear about it? when was it found? where is it today? and why does it seem that no scholar has ever sited it.
Well, I can't wait to read it once you've translated the Book of Steantheman from this golden list... do you have to give the list back to the angel?
did you actually click on any of the websites or are you just saying you googled this subject. There are actual book on the subject Jesus never existed written by Ken Humphrey it detail all the thing I am talking about. By the way I do find it funny that you arent even touching the fact that Jesus "real" story isnt even original. What is your answer to these fact how will you twist the fact that more then 200 deities have similarities with Jesus story 1000 year before him.
You must be an eye witness to be creatable source and even then eye witness within a few year will have major discrepancies in there stories. So to say that a references made 50- 80 years after death or a book written 80-120 years after death could be considered accurate is logically bankrupt. Now if your showed me a scholar that live in that time and could show why so many other god fit the same story many years before Jesus then I would be glad to retract my previous statement.
@stantheman42069 V V V Notice, he didn't answer any of my questions with references to where he got the dates from or what his sources are, he just makes this stuff up. P.S. Did you even read what I wrote or do you just like to watch yourself type?
@Brian685 I answered all of your question it you who have yet to answer mine I have given you name example and even shot down your supposed historian Josephus whose only reference to Jesus was 60-80 years after death and where more or less references to Christianity not Jesus himself. Jesus is as real as unicorns or the idea that the world is flat. I have yet to hear you explanation for the hundreds of god whom stories mimic Jesus fable let hear it I am waiting.
Josephus 'Testimonium Flavium' 18.3.3. =>direct reference to jesus himself. With regard to the 60 year gap, the only evidence we have concerning alexander the great comes 200 years after his death in the form of latin translations of greek sources which are lost entirely. Would you deny that alexander the great existed?
Alexander the great did exist for there are building in his honor and when are one of you people going to address the issue of the 100 or so other deities that perfectly mimics Jesus story. There is not one scrap of credible evidence what one man say years after his death doesnt count if that your case then I will like to add that we could easily say the Egyptian god horus exist because his story is identical to that of Jesus the only difference is the names.
There are buildings built in honour of Jesus. Is this evidence that he existed? No, unless you concede that the same standards of evidence exist for both alexander and jesus as historical figures. The stories of other deities mimicking jesus' story are irrelevant. These myths surrounding the man occurred posthumously, and are irrelevant for ascertaining whether or not a person existed or not. I am not talking about whether the man had super powers or not. I am arguing that he existed.
@Brian685 hey where did you go no rebuttle come on i finaly felt like we where geting somewhere. I hate that ever time i start to get into a construtive debate the other person wimps out check and mate
and I look up Josephus he was born 5 years after death. Not to mention the fact that he never spoke of the gospels till the end of his life which was when they were written more then 55-80 years after the fact. There also a large discrepancy amongst scholars on weather or not these supposed Jesus references where actually written buy Josephus so nice try my friend but you must do you homework a bit better.
@stantheman42069 What proof do you have of their being a large discrepancy amongst scholars regarding the Test. Flav. in Josephus works? Actually, thats not even close! MOST JOSEPHUS SCHOLARS accept the Test. Flav. as genuine, they just dont accept the parts which were interpolated which is two phrases!!!
@stantheman42069 And BTW when I say scholars Im not talking about Jesus myth Holocaust denying quacks Im talking about actual Josephus scholars. Statistically, thats 3-1. Maybe you missed kindergarten that day, but last time I checked 3-1 was the MAJORITY!!!
@stantheman42069 You mentioned Tacitus. Before I forget ... Tacitus mentions Jesus Ref. Annals 15.44. Lest I forget about Josephus, he also mentions John the Baptist and James, the BROTHER of Jesus elsewhere, both of which are not doubted. Ref. Ant 18.5.2 116-119 and Ant. 20.9.1 200-203, circa 62 C.E.
@stantheman42069 In addition, I would like you to answer the following additional questions 1.) Which historian living in Jesus' time, by name, would have interest in his story and why? 2.) Please tell me why it's not possible to compile an accurate account of an event in history based on accurate source material? Must you be an eyewitness in order to have your facts straight if you're relying on accurate source material? Do explain ...
This sir is easy! Many historian of the time would show great interest in a man who turn water to wine, walked on water raised the dead created many pieces of bread out of thin air and the various other miracles attributed to Jesus Christ. Not to mention the fact that he cause trouble to both the roman and the Jewish community buy questioning the practice in the great temple on the Sabbath. you see these thing did happen because hes not real.
The only piece of evidence that I have seen that actually dates from the day of Jesus that actually have any reference to a Jesus brother to Joseph is a coffin that could have been faked. The truth of the matter is that Josephus supposed references to Jesus where more or less references to Christianity witch had just began to form toward the end of his life 60-85 year after death.
someone NAME ONE historian from the time of jesus not 100 years later that spoke of him in any historical sence the truth is there isnt one know hisotian from that time that spoke of a man that fits any of the stories from the bible about jesus
How much of Phaedrus works still exist? How much of Paterculus works still exist? Of what stil exist from 1st cent would it by it's own topic mention Jesus?
-George Wells "... absence of evidence is no evidence of absence"
Yes but we do have large amount of historical references from these time in tact for example Pontius Pilate, kept record of who he killed how and what they did. Not even one mention of a man who claimed to be the son of god let alone the king of the Hebrew people. So in this case there is no absence of evidence there plenty of evidence that proves my point without a shadow of a doubt.
Sorry it was roman record not Pilate directly. It is well known the roman kept strict record of all trial in the Jerusalem area. What funny is they speak of hundred of other Jews who clamed to be the messiah but not one made a mention of any man named Jesus. The dates they where found i do not recall if you would like to now more just Google Pontius Pilate reports( he himself didnt make them) after you get passed all the evangelical bullshit you will find actual historical record.
ok Joe Smith, I'll go look for this Golden Execution List that your the only person I've ever heard of it from, of all the scholars Ive read, amazingly youre the only one to mention it yet you dont seem to know much about it perhaps after you translate it we can call it the Book of Stantheman
Are you fucking stupid it well known that the roman kept list of most the thing they did especially trials in Judah so you can ignore the fact but that doesnt make Jesus suddenly exist. I am sorry to tell you the men who wrote the new testament(80 years after death) just ripped of the stories of more then 100 other deities. Did you even Google roman record my poor misinformed peer sure you have to go threw 2000 Christian pages that make blatant assumption but the information is there.
wow, Joesph-stantheman-Smith, you've got anger isues, you make refrance to a unknown Pilate execution list, that no one but you knows about, I call you out on it and you resort to four letter words... LOL
Thank for the good laugh reading a religious person say some shit about angels giving me back these golden books I was rolling on the floor. I mean when your books that you think prove Jesus exist where given to man bye god threw angel who were his messengers. you cant get more ironic then that no matter how hard you try.
Hey Joseph stantheman Smith, were done. 1) your misrepresenting my view of inspiration with a childish limerick 2)your appeal to evidence was a hoax and 3) you have the intellectual capacity for civil conversation as a middle schooler
Nice try but we are far from done i would still like to hear your rebuttal concerning the various other god that mimic his story if you base your historical Jesus on a few references years after his death or the bible then you evidence is lacking I have given you book example and shot down all your supposed references. So what do you say about these Jesus like gods millennia before Jesus was resurrected. There are literally hundreds of them so im waiting for you answer.
So you have no answer to that many other god that fit his story or that fact that Josephus in under hot debate. The fact is that you cant answer my question you have no answer to the hundreds of god . I find it hilarious that you wont touch the fact that there are so many god that fit Jesus story its mind numbing. When an early Christian historian wrote of these god he just said the devil did it and if that you answer then its you who has the debate skill of a middle schooler.
Said nothing about him being a god. Particular passages of Josephus have been written off as interpolations, not the whole thing (including allusions to jesus which are not disputes, see the syriac post).
You base your historical Alexander on on a few Greek translations of secondary sources which surfaced 2 centuries after his death. If you wish to deny the references to Jesus, apply your standards across the board and stop being a hypocrite. You have made no reference to the book you talk about. I dont believe you have even read it. If you have, paraphrase it here in rebuttal. This is an argument, not a reading list.
@stantheman42069 Silence isn't evidence. What makes you think they weren't lost? Must one be an eyewitness in order to give an accurate account? IE Josephus. Give me reasons Josephus can't be trusted even though he used ind. sources in his research and 3-1 scholars believe the Test. Flav. to be trustworthy and therefore confirms the historical existence of Jesus the Christ of Nazareth. I'm waiting ...
There is not one scrape of actual evidence that there ever was a man named Jesus Christ of Nazareth, I am sorry to tell you but the bible doesnt count as proof. All the gospels where written more then 80 years after his supposed existence. not to mention the fact that there are more then 100 deities that have stories so similar to Jesus it mind-blowing. In fact these gods where around thousands of years before Jesus ripped off there tales. Im waiting.........
@stantheman42069 "more than 80 yrs. after his supposed existence?" Where do you get that figure from? I would like the source material you used, because it's not true, not even close! 1. Cor 15 was written within YEARS of Christ' death!!! Conservative scholars say within months - 2, maybe 3 years, more liberal say within 8, but no where close to 80!!!!!! And 1. Cor. 15 shows at that time the basic's of the beliefs of the Xians.
@stantheman42069 Ref. the "risen god's" scholar Mike Licona did an excellent rebuttal to "The God Who Wasnt There" and another by some wack job named "Acharya S" which can be found in the articles section at R I S E N J E S U S D O T C O M - under "resources."
I hate to break it to you but not one piece of Jesus life story is even original. Let take the sun god Horus for example he was born of a virgin mother on the 25 of December. He preached as a child had twelve disciples raised a guy from the dead and was know as the son of god. He was even crucified and then resurrected three day later. If that not the Jesus myth told a thousand year before Jesus then I dont know what is.
You are about as right as a cat in the Cambrian explosion my poor friend! Not one of the new testament book where written within 50 years of Jesus death let alone in his life time. General historians understand that the gospels at best where written between 80-120 years after death. I hate to say it but a source isnt credible if it was written 80 years after the fact.
I looked up you Josephus testimonial flavium most scholar agree that it was rewritten with a Christian perspective when it was found so nice try. This reference has been I hot debate since the 1700 and considering that fact that we have no copy of said document from the time in question this can not be considered a good source for the Jesus of Christ. Nice try Christians but your sources are comical at best.
Stan- evidence for this claim please. Provide me with a link by adding in parenthesis. Regardless, according to the feldman bibliography (1986, pp. 677), the paradigm opinion regarding the aforementioned passage is in fact nowhere near what you are suggesting.
Both Latin and Syriaic translations of the Greek manuscripts exist which are identical to one another (Syrian, World Chronicle), prooving that there was an unaltered version of the testimonium which was translated by both Latin and Syriac writers, since no contact between the translators occurred in antiquity.
If they say The truth, the way and the life of is Jesus Christ and there's no other way to God. They believe in a Mythical God or Man created by sect trying to make a messiah. A mythical figure to make it stronger sect and get away from the burden laws the Jews had. Like stoning woman to death shopping there hands and killing just for the sins. Now that a Fact. Me to I'll go with people won't kill you for your sins. But when the Roman took the sect religion they started to punish the Jews.
Whatever you say, sir, doesn` change the fact that outside the gospels and christian writings, your whole evidence comes down to a mere couple of sentences.
All of those books have been debunked, and why did they even HAVE the da vinci code? And for those of you think Jesus never lived, please get a brain check. compare documents we have on jesus to ANY other historical people and you would be surprised. The laughable jesus-myth theory is NOT accepted in NT scholarship.
If that sounds intolerant or exclusivist well i am sorry, but it is true. If you feel insulted or as offended as though your intelligence is disrespected i am sorry and all i can say is what i have just said is True and if you disagree you are wrong.You are loved anyway.Repent before it is too late and have a nice day.
As far as poor scholarship goes. Those books hold all the earmarks. The assumptions made and the claims are not only outrageous(and not in a good way)but altogether false. I am generally a bookworm but its stuff like that that makes me sick to my stomach. Why post anything that would promote such lies under the guise of "scholarship"?The Truth, The Way, and The Life is Jesus Christ. There is no other way to GOD. There is no other expression of the fullness of Truth.
Did Jesus really exist? .... probably not. What I do find quiet funny is that followers of the 'Birther Movement' in the USA are close to 100% Christian. Any atheist Birthers out there to prove me wrong? I won't hold my breath. So they insist on more proof than a validated birth certificate, but on the other hand believe that 2000 years ago some guy was crucified and rose from the dead. and was a god. All from 2nd and 3rd hand writtings decades after the fact. starting to see the irony?
GawdOfThunder 10 months ago
I have a series in three parts on Jesus incl. the passage in Flavius Josephus' Jewish History
dazsyx 10 months ago
Human will allways need to invent new teories and facts about nature and spiritual word but for God all times of history and evolutions are at one moment...
MrKlemenko 1 year ago
Jesus is God...we don't need historical proof or evidence...The Holy Spirit inside us believers is the only thing we need....
calvingmail 1 year ago
@calvingmail "Holy Spirit" inside you is just a absurdity.
Perunfolk 1 year ago
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@Perunfolk
If you are destined, you will see the light else you will die in your darkness..
calvingmail 1 year ago
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God, Our Lord and King Jesus Christ let bless You!!!
It`s the TRUE and everyone should compare that 3d picture(Manoppello) to the 2d. shroud of Turin to be sure not some fictional models!!!
Poor face of God beaten to death for our sins!
How people can say they don`t love Him-they dont have heart?
JezusSlave 1 year ago
Embarrassing apologetics.
NorthwardEquinox 1 year ago
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Imaginefree69 1 year ago
@ stantheman42069: You keep harping that others are avoiding your claim of "more then 100 other deities" which fit Jesus' story. I challenge you to enlighten us of the names or any other details of these 100... nay, let's say 10 to make it easy for you. Mind you, you can spare us the spiel about Mithras being a perfect example of a "Sun God" who had a miraculous "virgin birth", since a cursory investigation reveals that his mythology claims he was born spontaneously from a "rock", not a woman.
PhilipSneyd 2 years ago
when are any of you people even going to touch the other deities like Jesus years before him. Josephus himself is under contest there is a good amount of scholar who think his work was rewritten in more of a pro Christian mindset. the reason i dont think Jesus existed is based on the lack of historical evidence the similarities between him and the myths of god before. He is just the same sun god stories repacked to sedate the masses.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
sorry man but you re guided by false knowledge the sun god has nothing to do with jesus and the things in zetgeist about jesus are completely false and you just have to study egypt gods to know that this shit was almost completely made up
roflzi 2 years ago
Is the only source you people have Josephus i mean a his writing werent even discovered till the 14 century( maybe sooner I cant recall) these sources are under hot debate in fact most historian believe it was rewritten when it was discover in a more Christian mind set. Much like these historians in this video that have vested interest in saying these non historical facts. Why you ask because they are Christians them selfs and they dont want to go against there own faith.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
In addition to Josephus we have Tacitus (Annales 15.44,), Seutonius (12 caesars-"Iudaeos, impulsore Chresto, assidue tumultuantes Roma expulit"), and Pliny in his letters to Trajan, among other less credulous sources. I have vested interest in saying non historical facts? Excuse me but I am not a christian, I am a student of history, and frankly I find your flagrant disregard for the objective application of historical standards to be as dogmatic as that of any christian I've ever come across.
pagancornflake 2 years ago
god dam it you Christian are the most blinded arrogant group of people to ever walk this earth when you die and go to your god he will cast you to your hell for being so damn closed minded. Can one of you explain how Jesus story mimic perfectly more then 100 god more then 1000 year before his non excitant birth. You people can ignore all the fact you want it doesnt make Jesus magically exist sorry to tell you.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Ok, Joseph-stantheman-Smith Google doesn't help your roman-crucifixion-list either... so where did you hear about it? when was it found? where is it today? and why does it seem that no scholar has ever sited it.
Well, I can't wait to read it once you've translated the Book of Steantheman from this golden list... do you have to give the list back to the angel?
Undertaker202 2 years ago
did you actually click on any of the websites or are you just saying you googled this subject. There are actual book on the subject Jesus never existed written by Ken Humphrey it detail all the thing I am talking about. By the way I do find it funny that you arent even touching the fact that Jesus "real" story isnt even original. What is your answer to these fact how will you twist the fact that more then 200 deities have similarities with Jesus story 1000 year before him.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
I still stand by my statment that jesus is as real as santa with just as many "eye witness" books writen year after to suport santa story as well.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
You must be an eye witness to be creatable source and even then eye witness within a few year will have major discrepancies in there stories. So to say that a references made 50- 80 years after death or a book written 80-120 years after death could be considered accurate is logically bankrupt. Now if your showed me a scholar that live in that time and could show why so many other god fit the same story many years before Jesus then I would be glad to retract my previous statement.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 V V V Notice, he didn't answer any of my questions with references to where he got the dates from or what his sources are, he just makes this stuff up. P.S. Did you even read what I wrote or do you just like to watch yourself type?
Brian685 2 years ago
@Brian685 I answered all of your question it you who have yet to answer mine I have given you name example and even shot down your supposed historian Josephus whose only reference to Jesus was 60-80 years after death and where more or less references to Christianity not Jesus himself. Jesus is as real as unicorns or the idea that the world is flat. I have yet to hear you explanation for the hundreds of god whom stories mimic Jesus fable let hear it I am waiting.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Josephus 'Testimonium Flavium' 18.3.3. =>direct reference to jesus himself. With regard to the 60 year gap, the only evidence we have concerning alexander the great comes 200 years after his death in the form of latin translations of greek sources which are lost entirely. Would you deny that alexander the great existed?
pagancornflake 2 years ago
Alexander the great did exist for there are building in his honor and when are one of you people going to address the issue of the 100 or so other deities that perfectly mimics Jesus story. There is not one scrap of credible evidence what one man say years after his death doesnt count if that your case then I will like to add that we could easily say the Egyptian god horus exist because his story is identical to that of Jesus the only difference is the names.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
There are buildings built in honour of Jesus. Is this evidence that he existed? No, unless you concede that the same standards of evidence exist for both alexander and jesus as historical figures. The stories of other deities mimicking jesus' story are irrelevant. These myths surrounding the man occurred posthumously, and are irrelevant for ascertaining whether or not a person existed or not. I am not talking about whether the man had super powers or not. I am arguing that he existed.
pagancornflake 2 years ago
@Brian685 hey where did you go no rebuttle come on i finaly felt like we where geting somewhere. I hate that ever time i start to get into a construtive debate the other person wimps out check and mate
stantheman42069 2 years ago
there is no jesus he as real and santa or the easter bunny it hrd to hear but it true
stantheman42069 2 years ago
and I look up Josephus he was born 5 years after death. Not to mention the fact that he never spoke of the gospels till the end of his life which was when they were written more then 55-80 years after the fact. There also a large discrepancy amongst scholars on weather or not these supposed Jesus references where actually written buy Josephus so nice try my friend but you must do you homework a bit better.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 What proof do you have of their being a large discrepancy amongst scholars regarding the Test. Flav. in Josephus works? Actually, thats not even close! MOST JOSEPHUS SCHOLARS accept the Test. Flav. as genuine, they just dont accept the parts which were interpolated which is two phrases!!!
Brian685 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 And BTW when I say scholars Im not talking about Jesus myth Holocaust denying quacks Im talking about actual Josephus scholars. Statistically, thats 3-1. Maybe you missed kindergarten that day, but last time I checked 3-1 was the MAJORITY!!!
Brian685 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 You mentioned Tacitus. Before I forget ... Tacitus mentions Jesus Ref. Annals 15.44. Lest I forget about Josephus, he also mentions John the Baptist and James, the BROTHER of Jesus elsewhere, both of which are not doubted. Ref. Ant 18.5.2 116-119 and Ant. 20.9.1 200-203, circa 62 C.E.
Brian685 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 In addition, I would like you to answer the following additional questions 1.) Which historian living in Jesus' time, by name, would have interest in his story and why? 2.) Please tell me why it's not possible to compile an accurate account of an event in history based on accurate source material? Must you be an eyewitness in order to have your facts straight if you're relying on accurate source material? Do explain ...
Brian685 2 years ago
This sir is easy! Many historian of the time would show great interest in a man who turn water to wine, walked on water raised the dead created many pieces of bread out of thin air and the various other miracles attributed to Jesus Christ. Not to mention the fact that he cause trouble to both the roman and the Jewish community buy questioning the practice in the great temple on the Sabbath. you see these thing did happen because hes not real.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
The only piece of evidence that I have seen that actually dates from the day of Jesus that actually have any reference to a Jesus brother to Joseph is a coffin that could have been faked. The truth of the matter is that Josephus supposed references to Jesus where more or less references to Christianity witch had just began to form toward the end of his life 60-85 year after death.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
someone NAME ONE historian from the time of jesus not 100 years later that spoke of him in any historical sence the truth is there isnt one know hisotian from that time that spoke of a man that fits any of the stories from the bible about jesus
stantheman42069 2 years ago
How much of Phaedrus works still exist? How much of Paterculus works still exist? Of what stil exist from 1st cent would it by it's own topic mention Jesus?
-George Wells "... absence of evidence is no evidence of absence"
Undertaker202 2 years ago
Yes but we do have large amount of historical references from these time in tact for example Pontius Pilate, kept record of who he killed how and what they did. Not even one mention of a man who claimed to be the son of god let alone the king of the Hebrew people. So in this case there is no absence of evidence there plenty of evidence that proves my point without a shadow of a doubt.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Please site your source for this Pilate execution list. Where is? When was it found?
Undertaker202 2 years ago
Sorry it was roman record not Pilate directly. It is well known the roman kept strict record of all trial in the Jerusalem area. What funny is they speak of hundred of other Jews who clamed to be the messiah but not one made a mention of any man named Jesus. The dates they where found i do not recall if you would like to now more just Google Pontius Pilate reports( he himself didnt make them) after you get passed all the evangelical bullshit you will find actual historical record.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
@stantheman42069
ok Joe Smith, I'll go look for this Golden Execution List that your the only person I've ever heard of it from, of all the scholars Ive read, amazingly youre the only one to mention it yet you dont seem to know much about it perhaps after you translate it we can call it the Book of Stantheman
Undertaker202 2 years ago
Are you fucking stupid it well known that the roman kept list of most the thing they did especially trials in Judah so you can ignore the fact but that doesnt make Jesus suddenly exist. I am sorry to tell you the men who wrote the new testament(80 years after death) just ripped of the stories of more then 100 other deities. Did you even Google roman record my poor misinformed peer sure you have to go threw 2000 Christian pages that make blatant assumption but the information is there.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
wow, Joesph-stantheman-Smith, you've got anger isues, you make refrance to a unknown Pilate execution list, that no one but you knows about, I call you out on it and you resort to four letter words... LOL
Undertaker202 2 years ago
Thank for the good laugh reading a religious person say some shit about angels giving me back these golden books I was rolling on the floor. I mean when your books that you think prove Jesus exist where given to man bye god threw angel who were his messengers. you cant get more ironic then that no matter how hard you try.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Hey Joseph stantheman Smith, were done. 1) your misrepresenting my view of inspiration with a childish limerick 2)your appeal to evidence was a hoax and 3) you have the intellectual capacity for civil conversation as a middle schooler
Undertaker202 2 years ago
Nice try but we are far from done i would still like to hear your rebuttal concerning the various other god that mimic his story if you base your historical Jesus on a few references years after his death or the bible then you evidence is lacking I have given you book example and shot down all your supposed references. So what do you say about these Jesus like gods millennia before Jesus was resurrected. There are literally hundreds of them so im waiting for you answer.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
I refuse to waist time bantering with you for the reasons Ive already stated. If you want to play, play with yourself.
Undertaker202 2 years ago
So you have no answer to that many other god that fit his story or that fact that Josephus in under hot debate. The fact is that you cant answer my question you have no answer to the hundreds of god . I find it hilarious that you wont touch the fact that there are so many god that fit Jesus story its mind numbing. When an early Christian historian wrote of these god he just said the devil did it and if that you answer then its you who has the debate skill of a middle schooler.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Said nothing about him being a god. Particular passages of Josephus have been written off as interpolations, not the whole thing (including allusions to jesus which are not disputes, see the syriac post).
pagancornflake 2 years ago
You base your historical Alexander on on a few Greek translations of secondary sources which surfaced 2 centuries after his death. If you wish to deny the references to Jesus, apply your standards across the board and stop being a hypocrite. You have made no reference to the book you talk about. I dont believe you have even read it. If you have, paraphrase it here in rebuttal. This is an argument, not a reading list.
pagancornflake 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 Silence isn't evidence. What makes you think they weren't lost? Must one be an eyewitness in order to give an accurate account? IE Josephus. Give me reasons Josephus can't be trusted even though he used ind. sources in his research and 3-1 scholars believe the Test. Flav. to be trustworthy and therefore confirms the historical existence of Jesus the Christ of Nazareth. I'm waiting ...
Brian685 2 years ago
There is not one scrape of actual evidence that there ever was a man named Jesus Christ of Nazareth, I am sorry to tell you but the bible doesnt count as proof. All the gospels where written more then 80 years after his supposed existence. not to mention the fact that there are more then 100 deities that have stories so similar to Jesus it mind-blowing. In fact these gods where around thousands of years before Jesus ripped off there tales. Im waiting.........
stantheman42069 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 "more than 80 yrs. after his supposed existence?" Where do you get that figure from? I would like the source material you used, because it's not true, not even close! 1. Cor 15 was written within YEARS of Christ' death!!! Conservative scholars say within months - 2, maybe 3 years, more liberal say within 8, but no where close to 80!!!!!! And 1. Cor. 15 shows at that time the basic's of the beliefs of the Xians.
Brian685 2 years ago
@stantheman42069 Ref. the "risen god's" scholar Mike Licona did an excellent rebuttal to "The God Who Wasnt There" and another by some wack job named "Acharya S" which can be found in the articles section at R I S E N J E S U S D O T C O M - under "resources."
Brian685 2 years ago
I hate to break it to you but not one piece of Jesus life story is even original. Let take the sun god Horus for example he was born of a virgin mother on the 25 of December. He preached as a child had twelve disciples raised a guy from the dead and was know as the son of god. He was even crucified and then resurrected three day later. If that not the Jesus myth told a thousand year before Jesus then I dont know what is.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
You are about as right as a cat in the Cambrian explosion my poor friend! Not one of the new testament book where written within 50 years of Jesus death let alone in his life time. General historians understand that the gospels at best where written between 80-120 years after death. I hate to say it but a source isnt credible if it was written 80 years after the fact.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Yes, it is. Do you even have any credentials in the field of history?
pagancornflake 2 years ago
I looked up you Josephus testimonial flavium most scholar agree that it was rewritten with a Christian perspective when it was found so nice try. This reference has been I hot debate since the 1700 and considering that fact that we have no copy of said document from the time in question this can not be considered a good source for the Jesus of Christ. Nice try Christians but your sources are comical at best.
stantheman42069 2 years ago
Stan- evidence for this claim please. Provide me with a link by adding in parenthesis. Regardless, according to the feldman bibliography (1986, pp. 677), the paradigm opinion regarding the aforementioned passage is in fact nowhere near what you are suggesting.
pagancornflake 2 years ago
Comment removed
pagancornflake 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Both Latin and Syriaic translations of the Greek manuscripts exist which are identical to one another (Syrian, World Chronicle), prooving that there was an unaltered version of the testimonium which was translated by both Latin and Syriac writers, since no contact between the translators occurred in antiquity.
pagancornflake 2 years ago
"Contrary to what most people have been indoctrinated with, Judaism,
Christianity and Islam are relatively new religions. Humanity goes
back tens of thousands of years. These three have worked relentlessly
to keep us from spiritual knowledge and using this power, of which all
of us have."
w w w . e x p o s i n g c h r i s t i a n i t y . c o m
(with out the spaces)
JOSCHILD 3 years ago
fabrizico009 3 years ago
Whatever you say, sir, doesn` change the fact that outside the gospels and christian writings, your whole evidence comes down to a mere couple of sentences.
Philos2006 3 years ago
All of those books have been debunked, and why did they even HAVE the da vinci code? And for those of you think Jesus never lived, please get a brain check. compare documents we have on jesus to ANY other historical people and you would be surprised. The laughable jesus-myth theory is NOT accepted in NT scholarship.
braino2000 3 years ago
notice these theologians have no real credibility...the christain religion like most others is a scam to peddle fairytales to idiots..
starwriter 3 years ago
And why couldn't they get a non christian to debate against it?
It's a sermon without anyone to to disprove their "facts".
jmikejapan 3 years ago
If that sounds intolerant or exclusivist well i am sorry, but it is true. If you feel insulted or as offended as though your intelligence is disrespected i am sorry and all i can say is what i have just said is True and if you disagree you are wrong.You are loved anyway.Repent before it is too late and have a nice day.
KnightOfTheHoly1 4 years ago
LOL. I love your hubris and pride. You proclaim a statement of faith and then tell the channel owner he's damned, then say have a nice day. LOL.
NuclearRadio 3 years ago
As far as poor scholarship goes. Those books hold all the earmarks. The assumptions made and the claims are not only outrageous(and not in a good way)but altogether false. I am generally a bookworm but its stuff like that that makes me sick to my stomach. Why post anything that would promote such lies under the guise of "scholarship"?The Truth, The Way, and The Life is Jesus Christ. There is no other way to GOD. There is no other expression of the fullness of Truth.
KnightOfTheHoly1 4 years ago
KnightOf: I smell underlying fanaticism.
Philos2006 3 years ago
well said
draconusrex33 2 years ago
Very nice! Thanks for posting this- there is WAY too much poor scholarship going around in todays world. It's really quite ridiculous
brothertodd7 4 years ago