China's Tiananmen square and its 'dark past' - 09 Aug 08

[MadmanMaple]

us china world war 3

[FarewelI]

Western media bias, it is indeed. The people in China do know about the incident that happened at the Tiananmen Square, but just don't talk about nor do they even bother to. Don't even dare to come up with the lame response of the government forbids them to do so.

[aah3504]

There was no massacre at T square. Read Gregory Clark's account, and he accuses Western media of propagating the myth. There was, however, a city wide riot that killed 100s of people.

[GroundZeroHiroshima]

【6/4天安門大虐殺の犠牲者のご冥福をお祈りします】Tien­anmen massacre murderer Mentality　＝　U.S. COINTELPRO Mentality　＝　Gangstalker Mentality どこの国の「政府」関係者もDemocracyなど望んでいない

てめえの欲望を満たすことだけが目標の民主主義のdestroy­erだ。

が、そのhuman rights violationsの実行にはmass mind controlにかかったバカ大衆を使う。「防犯」だの「テロ対­策」だのとでっち上げた理由で、ノゾキやストーカー、Elect­ric-harassmentなど変態行為をやらせて民主主義・­平和主義者の生活を破壊し弾圧させる。自分らは手を汚さず偽善を­とおす。

いつまでも本質的な問題から目をそらし、誤魔化しているかぎり何­も変わらない .

コンピューターを通して送られるmass mind controlerによるconditioningに依存するの­をやめ、己で己を鍛えるしかない。それが本当の勇気であり革命で­ある

[tSp289]

I can kind of understand the chinese govt.'s philosophy of maintaining harmony for the maximum number of people, and I am far from in love with capitalism, but there are clear limits. Life should never be allowed to be so cheap. You can not kill people for protesting, or for saying what they think, even if you seriously disagree.

A government's role should be to facilitate a wholesome life for its people: they should be representatives, not emperors and despots.

[blackjacklover70]

in 1989 the fall of the ussr was a thing all over the world, and most of the communist states people wanted to be free from the state, and in China saw the things that was going on in the ussr, and they saw the people of the ussr being freed by Gorbachev, and they too wanted to be freed from communism.

[starcorea]

"Sorry, I don't care about politics". It's sad that the CCP have managed to suppress information, or instilled so much fear into the people that they actually say that 2000 deaths are inconsequential and meaningless. At least we can be sure there will never be another incident like this again in China.

[blueguy1500]

@starcorea

Are you joking? There could be an event far more greater than that any time soon.

[blueguy1500]

@starcorea

Are you joking? There could be an event far more greater than that any time soon.

[Rocketeer1001]

@skatRdudes911 errr....what? it's not a matter of caring it's a matter of access, people in oregon may not care about crimes in Florida, but at least they have access to the news. not the case for the Tiannamen here.

[UyghurArmyInfo]

@SilentPainTears How can you care about something you know nothing about? What about those people who wanted to live their lives, but were shot in 1989?

[akirafactor]

@SilentPainTears The whole population didn't get a vote. That's why its censored.

[akirafactor]

Overthrow the Communist Dogs of Beijing. When is that last time you voted for your Communist Dictators? Your Communist Dictators will throw you in a reeducation camp or run over you with a tank if they don't like what you think. Tiananmen Square Massacre Chinese kill Chinese Tiananmen Square Massacre Chinese kill Chinese Tiananmen Square Massacre Chinese kill Chinese Tiananmen Square Massacre Chinese kill Chinese Tiananmen Square Massacre Chinese kill Chinese

[Phead128]

@akirafactor

lol, China hasn't even entered her golden age of development yet, and her stellar economic growth is just the beginning... and yet you retards are advocating the overthrow of Communist pigs.

GET REAL!!!!!!! REALITY IS NOT ON YOUR SIDE.

GTFO out of own butt.

[ManjuSu]

@akirafactor Is this what Japanese nationalists always point out when it comes to China? Are you that hypocritical?

[devilmagic]

@akirafactor your sir is one retarded man

[jessiechenfang]

People in China has the fear to speak truth and talk about the incident happened in 1989 4th June. I remembered some of the teachers in my middle school were sacked because of their supporting of students in Beijing and never heard of them any more. I was young but I knew the fear that even my parents and relatvies told me DO NOT TELL ANYONE WHAT WE SAY AT HOME.

[Mrasianpopmusic]

same here , i am chinese, i know it from my father, my father is a PLA comander, although he is not in that protest, he said his brother, which is my uncle went there for the reform, my uncle is also a PLA Marine at that time, he told me the truth is it is not only a students protest but a political Coup, the students are just one side of it, there are people behind it, they might be very high officers in the central government, some of them are very high rank generals that holds army

[Mrasianpopmusic]

and my uncle get order from his "boss", if the protest is success, they might rush into Beijing with their tanks and army( which is no longer controled by the government but the generals who wants to refrom), and then force the government to give power to the new leaders, that might be a new china, who knows? but history is history, they failed.

i kinda hope they win, then we will have more human rights in China. But China now it isnt that bad, it is getting better :)

[Mrasianpopmusic]

@Mrasianpopmusic sry for the grammar, i just want to help your guys get more imformation, i may not right, i just heard it from my father :)

[ShoeProtestor]

No change there then o_O

[FyzikalKemizt]

Does knowing the Tiananmen square incident makes Chinese people's life richer and raises the GDP per capita of China? haha! Chinese people are much smarter than that, they look into the future and work hard to bring more wealth and stablity to China.

[madman779sn]

limiting what you see on the computer is very important for a healthful life

[dgt0099]

every nation has its dark past, especially west nations

[hound4680]

people believe china is becoming a super power, but it wont ever be.

the united states rose to power the same way china did. with a laissez-faire of government, but of course the more powerful a country gets, the more the people will demand for fair treatment.

china is a century behind the USA. its in its industrial revolution, taking advantage of its people for economic growth.

its easy to view china in a one dimensional way.

soon it will deal with the challenge of guns or butter.

[ManjuSu]

@hound4680 China is already considered a great power and a potential superpower; we may be behind the US on some basis but not a century; this is how you could describe China in the 80's. For example; we surpassed the US in terms of Green energy investment, our train network is more advanced than that of the US, Our economy is in a much better shape and I can go on and on. If you think we are being taken advantage of then you should come here and see you'll think otherwise.

[drakemyboy]

@ManjuSu - You're so RIGHT. I have just obtained my multiple entry tourist Visa to visit your great country, to see your culture FIRST hand, not just through the visitors I see here. But, regarding the massacre at Tienanmen Square, I feel you are WRONG and that no soldiers were incinerated in their tanks. I think it is time you Han people quit leaning on your past, to support your bull$hit today. Seriously. I love all the Chinese poeple I know...but they see the world with only one eye.

[alen209]

@hound4680 quit reading out of your economic book

[hound4680]

@alen209

never

[Phead128]

@hound4680

lol, didn't the US take advantage of black people for economic growth?

China doesn't have a laissez faire government.

Yes, China will become a Superpower, just based on population alone.

China is freaking 5 times bigger than US in terms of population. China has more genius IQ's than IQs in US population. Do you know how ridiculous China's potential is?

[akirafactor]

@Phead128 Munch munch, Chinese love their sweet and sour dogs and cats. Lots of pets for them to eat in the US.

[wutong25a]

Want a friend, please put down the gun。The United States took the gun, what does it do？but，i have no

[ashutoshmikku]

Did Hitler embrace democratic reforms after Olympic?

[colguy11]

AlJazeeraEnglish

you are juste a small dog of western media. you are silly stupid and discusting.

fuck you! you bastard! son of bitch!

[YellowMagi]

@colguy11 ¨

Me bad English! Me learn bad words and use them on internet.

[kkkk5793]

rehabilitate the event!

[shshzh]

FUCK THE WEST!

[nwpuboshi]

they know

but they do not say

[amos0002]

中國完了,世世世代代完了,一党专政,不服從就殺....chi­na is end forever,one party policy,obey or be killed..

[TheFreemanUSA]

Chinese people are happy with they have now. No need to discuss about Democracy.

[bananian]

just like ppl in the matrix.

[SE2046]

From an objective point of view, this journalist is trying to set up people, he is as evil as what hes talking about,

[rollingsagit]

and I am sure you have a righteous mind

[gluvuv]

This is more civilized compared to, say, Iraq. The video selectively missed too many details.The Christian West must learn to look at this with rationality.

The Chinese speaker has naïve faith on the West. He is used.

[taxibandit13]

Chinese government just wants power for their country at any cost. They're getting it too, but the country is polluted beyond belief and so many people are living in poverty.

Makes you appreciate America a lot more, where we value freedom of speech and quality of life as much as we value our country's power.

[iammrlee]

A group of over 20, 000 World War I veterans who marched on Washington, D.C., to receive their World War I bonus during the summer of 1932. They peacefully camped and rallied in parks and military bases. When the Senate defeated the bill on June 17, 1932, the veterans refused to leave. Troops ordered by President Herbert Hoover and led by Gen. Douglas MacArthur entered several buildings and the main camp, setting tents on fire and forcing an evacuation.

Google it if you haven't heard about it?

[drakemyboy]

Forcing an evacuation? I think forcing them to leave is NOT the same as SHOOTING THEM IN THE HEAD, covering it all up, confiscating film, arresting people without trial and holding the for DECADES. The Chinese CCP NEED to admit, apologize, reconcile and move on. Build a memorial! History unacknowledged is bound to repeat itself. There is no excuse for a brutal government oppressing its own people in 2009 either...and it continues.

[iammrlee]

Commanded by Gen. Douglas MacArthur, the 12th Infantry Regiment, Fort Howard, Maryland, and the 3rd Cavalry Regiment, supported by six battle tanks commanded by Maj. George S. Patton, Fort Myer, formed in Pennsylvania Ave while thousands of Civil Service employees left work to line the street and watch the U.S. Army attack its own veterans. The Bonus Marchers, believing the display was in their honour, cheered the troops until Maj.Patton charged the cavalry against them

4 dead 1,017 injured

[bobhoward111]

Mistakes of the past can not justify events of today. Amerian cavalary and white settlers killed millions of native American Indians and took their land and habitat. To this day, it is spoken of in muted tones. Nothing justifies that.

[ab3k1nz]

but you can find all the history off those days in america.. people in china have no access to the Tianamen mascre what so ever

[Chopin742]

Muted tones. HAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!  Take a look at the Crazy Horse monument you idiot. Settlers didn't kill millions of indians. Some in the military handed out blankets with small pox to the Indians. It isn't the same as shooting every one like in So much of PRC history.

[Chopin742]

So you are saying 4 dead in 1932 is the same as hundreds to thousands dead in 1989? Are you saying 20,000 protestors is the same as a million? It might not be PC to talk about numbers, but the difference is pretty large, wouldn't you agree?

[bobhoward111]

What happened then 1932 does not justify killing peaceful protestors 800 killed and 10,000 wounded at Tiananmen, the actual numbers will never be known as the CCP refuse to release the facts. I guess because of this and that, shooting civiilians with machien gun fire is justified forever. Not true. The next Pres. of USA Roosevelt, initiated massive projects to employ the veteratns.

[iammrlee]

No one said anything about justifying any killings. The main point here is how so many people are brainwashed into thinking that this only happens in china.

"The pot calling the kettle black."

[bfayer]

wow thats messed up, they censor their own past to keep people in line... scary

[drakemyboy]

The CCP in China does SUCH a good job on some things. They're great! In other areas, they enslave their citizens w/o trial (forced labor re-education camps), ban networking sites, etc. I'm AMAZED at how normal, kind, intelligent Chinese people that I known that are either ignorant of their governments CRIMES or simply AGREE with that behavior. Apparently, if you speak your mind in China, the rest of the country WANTS you to get locked up.

A GOVERNMENT should FEAR its people!

[SirCharles1985]

If the rest of the country want you locked up, then you get locked up, this is democracy isn't it?

[purelego]

well china is undergoing their revolutions right now so give it some time eventualy it will become democratic beside just look how much it changed already, people have a much bigger freedom in China than ever bef4. After another 20 years China might be another democratic super power.

[Spahi77]

Its all politics....they don't want China free....you figure out who they is

[purelego]

well the russian gov't don't want russia free and see they become democracy anyways.

[howthefukdougetanid]

Students in all major cities there participated in the protest by not attending school, and then university students have been sent to military training because of it, how can they forget in 19 years?

If you really want to know how they think, go there, make some friends, and ask them in PRIVATE. After all, China does not have free speech, that is true.

[SekyinB]

I'm from China. I didn't know it until I was in high school. Some of my friends gave me a VCD recording some documentaries about Tiananmen Square. When my father saw me watching it, he was kind of angry and told me not to do it anymore....Back then he didnt really care about how I did in school, but he knew that it could be dangerous for me to just know the truth....

Yes we dont have free speech, but we have FEAR of speech and FEAR of knowing the truth.

[UyghurArmyInfo]

@SekyinB Don't stop, spread the word. Truth is a precious thing.

[Shinhaquro]

@SekyinB my spouse and I had a Chinese student renting a room from us. She was a very pleasant person to live with, but denied Tienanmen utterly, dismissing it as a myth and thought it was a form of western propaganda. Naturally not wanting to make her feel uncomfortable, we did not press the issue. I wonder how she will feel if one day she finds that this was a factual event?

[howthefukdougetanid]

So many people commenting here have no clue and yet thinks others have no clue like they do.

You won't get what people think about this topic by asking them this question on the square, are you so stupid to realize that? All those talks about people don't know/cannot remember are either liars or just think they know something by watching videos like this.

[bobhoward111]

The biggest culprit is yourself, your statement only shows you are like the Chicoms, deny others to speak. If you really have something to say, say it, Do not insult or attack other users. I only criticize your criticism, but you have the right to speak nonsense,

[howthefukdougetanid]

When did I deny others to speak? Ask yourself whether you know what you are talking about, OK?

It is people like you who deny people the right to speak, I say something you don't like and immediately I get the name "Chicoms". That is "only" criticizing my criticism? Which sense do you have?

By the way, Chicom though is your own making, is not only insulting communist but ordinary Chinese. I see people like you commenting all the time, as if you care about Chinese, yet you use derogatory terms.

[deedee1067]

Democracy and Human Rights for China !

[Rakkasans2006]

why is it that aljazeera is being broadcast by a British guy

[The249]

Why would the Chinese want democracy when they've seen what it has done to the US under Bush?

China is modernising more than ever under it's current government, unlike India under their democratically elected one.

[The249]

I'm not anti-democracy but I just hate it when Western reporters talk in such a bias condescending way.

And let's be honest, would China be advancing so rapidly under a American-style democracy?

[shzywansui]

Do you think the crazily fast modernisations are really good for China ? Too much development is a bad thing. Furthermore, China's rural population is being left far behind.  It is sickening how much capitalist China has become...

[S1587915G]

***My dear friend, no one is being oppressed in the People's Republic of China.***

Show me some evidence. From non-CCP sources.

[teemuruskeepaa]

lol touché

[banzaidawan]

China today is a DIFFERENT country from that during the Tiananmen Incident in 1989. The size of the Chinese economy is NINE times of that 19 years ago, and there is a huge middle class now. (Beijing in 1989 had 2000 private cars, today there are 2 Million).

Also, many of the students that took part in Tiananmen are now senior management in Chinese or multi-national corporations in China. They've moved on with their lives, as did the rest of China.

[Terrakinetic]

Prove it.

[teemuruskeepaa]

I sense from the Olympics videos that the Chinese talk with the same kind of make-belief hype as their government. The communist party has a hard nut to crack with such an open international event in their capital. The oppressed proletariat, ordinary Chinese, in a false communist system, might learn too much of their political system and their history. The games could spark huge conflicts inside China or internationally.

[banzaidawan]

teemuruskeepaa:  You live in a fantasy world. The hosting of the BEST OLYMPICS EVER has united the 1.4 Billion Chinese people around the world, more than ever.

[teemuruskeepaa]

Claim made by one message, that its writer is living in a fantasy world, is the real fantasy. The Olympics, good or not, did not prove anything about the Chinese masses, 1,4 billion or 100. The Chinese live under a threat of violence by their government and are forced to give up their political and social interests, not to cross the elite, whose system of violence in only intented to guard their dictatorial powers

[66QQ66]

oh dear sociology master, I understand it is hard to locate a decent job with your degree, but if you want to do research on China. I understand you are poor and may not be able to afford American text books. But you can google "China modernizes: the threat of the West or the model of the rest." you can get a free ebook to update your knowledge.

[BlackHandler]

Half of the Chinese population don't know about the Tiananmen square massacre? What a bunch of ignorant fools for not knowing there own countries history.

[ubuibiok]

A survey taken in 2006 asked the same Question about Tank Man...no one under 22 Had a Clue as to even what the man was doing....Not One, out of 500 asked....I wish every Airport in the Free World had a copy of it on display and the story told. They even believe Tibet was always part of Chine even when there shown the films of the armies invasion...they claim it was to free the people from the monks. But ask them about the mass defection with the Dalai Lama and that dont know about that.

[bobhoward111]

The CIA has been playing games in Tibet since 1950's non-stop till 1975 or thereabouts. On the day they quit a last shipment of arms was delivered, enough for a division worth. They also trained about 150 Tibeten guerrilas in the Ca. mountains, to go back and fight. Kinda like the bay of pigs idea. Tibet is a long story, alternatively it was independant, tributory, subject and independant of China proper. Tibetans must have China tea to survive. The cultural revolution was equal opportunity.

[howthefukdougetanid]

Please provide a link.

Are you telling me Chinese have free speech? Otherwise how can such a survey take place in China?

[ubuibiok]

Get real....for links...go to Wikipedia...by the way, did you catch any of the non-main stream media during the Oly. ??? Go looking for your answers and don't Question me over a year after the fact...

Here ya go Lazy -"For the 20th anniversary of the event in 2009, there was a growing will by Chinese people to talk openly about the event, and to start an inquiry.[86] " Now Buzz off.

[howthefukdougetanid]

Get real about WHAT?

I ask you for the proof of such a survey and you point to the Le Monde article, a soldier's look back at the past.

Is that a survey you monkey? Go buzz off your ahole.

[Phead128]

@howthefukdougetanid

Have you ever been to China or spoken to a person in China about pre-Tiananmen and post-Tiananmen freedom of speech?

If not, then please stop spewing false rhetoric, for you own sake, because us Chinese people think you are ignorant...

[howthefukdougetanid]

@Phead128

Haha, so you represent the Chinese? Why you think I cannot be American Chinese myself? Being such a judgmental person, and you label me ignorant?

[teemuruskeepaa]

So when people have problems, it is always inevitably their own fault, and never can other people cause problems? Even in a totalitarian communist state? Sounds like hypocritical, fascist and lie-your-eyes-out-of-your-head kind of lie. I bet user blackhandler thinks that the only problem in his life are other people.

[ThelandIIove]

True number is 187, not thousands! Chinese govt said 241 (including 54 polices, Chinese govt didn't lie)

Billion of Chinese were starving at the time, surviving is more important than freedom.

AlJazeera picked a right time to show this video, it is a good promotion for their company.

Actually, not many people pay attention the Los Angel's riots in 1992, 53 ordinary peoples were killed. US's troops controlled the situation.

[bobhoward111]

Yopu must be a liar or stupid, sorry to affront you direclty. China at the time 1 billion population, how can 1 billiong be starving? "Billion of Chinese were starging at the time." again the statement is either stupid or you lie. I think you are stupid, but not a liar.

[pakhtooni]

China should be left as it is. The current system in China is excellent. The americans and europeans should not interfere because they want to have a law and order. The europeans and the americans trying to divide china just like USSR. They should be very careful, tibet is a part of a china and should remain part of a china.long live chana

[ubuibiok]

I dont think so, The Canadian Health System and A few people in England were on the receiving end of Human Body parts harvested in China. The U.N. puts the Death Rate at no less than 400,000 in Darfur. The Genocide if funded by China with Weapons for Oil, now there moving into Chad with the same deal. Every effort needs to be made to get the Chinese people informed about there History just as we here in the west try to stay informed about our leaders attempts to mislead us.

[S1587915G]

China SHOULDN'T be left as it is. Everything China does is going to have major consequences for the rest of the world. Just look at the tainted milk powder incident. I really don't think this can come from a country whose system is 'excellent'.

[ManjuSu]

@S1587915G Do you know that there are more things than just tainted milk powder?

[S1587915G]

@ManjuSu

Are you talking about good or bad things? Coming from China or elsewhere?

[rollingsagit]

I bet there will be at least 1 billion Chinese people out of the 1.3 billion population who will disagree with you. Or maybe not - either they are illiterate or they have better things to worry about, such as how to make a minimum living.

[pakhtooni]

The 1.3 billion population who disagree with one another or me is probably the lack of education. Which is better, disagreement amongst themselves or let them kill each other. Brianwash then in the name of freedom. China have a great tradition and culture. China will become a super power. Of course I agrtee with you, equal rightsd, minimum wages bbut all this will come in time. The last thing we want is to interefere in china.

[elyfronda]

its relly ashame that half of the peolpe in china don't know what happened in Tiananmen square and a lady in the report says she doesn't care about politics.... well government should be protecting their people and not killing them..

[Gemm73]

The 'tank man' is indeed iconic these days.

[hogendorn]

he dosn´t know that he´s n icon? 1:48

may be i didn´t heard right; may be u don´t know, what u r saying...

best wishes!

thanks for those objective informations at all,

love ´n´ peace

[bobhoward111]

You must read in context. The entre news of Tiananmen massacre is blacked out in China. The Tank Man. Wang Wei Lien, most certainly doesn't know, the picture or film was never shown in China. You are a typical icon yourself of simplicity.

[hogendorn]

ok u r so right

[howthefukdougetanid]

Boy you just like to call everybody whose comment you remotely don't like name don't you?

Yes it is blocked in China. But there are so many Chinese abroad as well as those older generation, not to mention those who knows how to use tunneling technology to get around the firewall.

[rileinc]

5,000th video from AlJazeeraEnglish!

[wrongloop]

It's a shame that such a great global power, behaves like that, opressing its own people.

[cooldude91801]

Please me, how would you manage 1.3 billion people?

[djcobolt]

Controlling information to the point where its own citizens don't recognize that image is sad. the answer to managing people is not stricter control cause when 1.3 billion people as you said realize they are being oppressed its even harder to manage the uprising.

[wrongloop]

it's not like killing all the ones that don't agree with your policies, will get you to a heavenly place.

And running a country is no job for one man.

[drakemyboy]

How? Use night sticks and tear gas...not tanks and bullets. And then, if there are criminals there...give them a TRIAL by jury. Not one by a corrupt old government employee you call a judge. You have the OLDEST society on Earth! By now you really need to demand your basic, universal rights! Forget the past? No! Embrace it; learn form it.

[Chopin742]

Oldest? I think some people in the Middle East and Central Asia/India might have something to say about that.

[ManjuSu]

@drakemyboy Then what about those soldiers that got incenerated in their own trucks when those students throwed molotov cocktails? Yes we are the oldest society on earth but do you know what our norms and values are or what our basic philosophy is?