I have always liked the concept of the Graf Spee, but the 5 inch armor was insufficient to resist penetrating shells from a lowly treaty cruiser. If this ship ever tried to tangle with a full sized dreadnaught the outcome would never be in doubt. With a top speed of about 32 knots she could only barely outrun a battle cruiser and everything else could dog her down. It is difficult to find a proper role for this ship, fast but not fast enough, heavy but not heavy enough.
The earlier battle had done significant damage to the vessel and her seaworthiness was suspect, further her fuel system could not filter the fuel necessary to return home, so her fate was sealed.
The Graf Spee was of a unique design that would have served the US well in the Pacific campaign, plenty of deck space for AA would have given a ship like this staying power to park off an island and shell for days. I exaggerate the magazine would probably empty in a few hours.
@allyaster "Saluted the ship as we (HMS Chichester - RN) passed by it on our way up the river Plate in 1976. Just the top cross part was visible above the water." Great! Now nothing is over the surface.
They didn't fool the germans... there were enough british forces waiting outside of the harbor to sink the Graf Spee, and the german ship was almost out of ammo.
Infact it was the germans who fooled the british. Nobody discovered - until the explosion - that most seamen had left the ship. They had destroyed all interesting equipment and blew up the ship (not repaired yet). The captain Langsdorff took a very clever decision to save a lot of lives...
I am watching "The Battle of the River Plate" right now. It is ok, but the low budget gets in the way of the story. It does seem to be right on with the history of this.
graf spee cumplio su objetivo, tirarse embarcaciones inglesas en el mediterraneo fue lo mas sensato hundir el barco y salvar al tripulación, luchar contra el engaño ingles le hubiera significado su captura y su ensañamiento con el barco y con sus tripulantes.
like kajamix said, Langdorff was fooled to believed that more than 10, 15 ships were close... Langsdorff and the British Navy knew that Graf Spee would win both ships, even with few hours to repair... thats why the british tried to fool them...
@zetamanya - There had been a battle between Graf Spee and several British cruisers. Graf Spee was seriously damaged and fled to the nearest harbor for repair, but the British government forced Uruguay, not to allow the repairing of the ship. Captain Langsdorff knew, he wouldn't stand a chance against the cruisers which were waiting for him. So he decided, to sink his own ship rather than fight and risk the lives of his crew in a battle he could never win.
Estaba tratando de entorpecer el comercio de materias primas hacia inglaterra en el atlantico sur. El principal motivo de su auto destruccion no fue por los barcos ingleses esperandolo sino por la falta de combustible para enfrentar la batalla.
Kapitän zur See Hans Langsdorff took his own life with a pistol shot in the head and was found in his hotel chamber laying on the war flag of the ADMIRAL GRAF SPEE. He left a letter in which he gave his answer to the British propaganda:
"How a soldier of the German Reich knows to die for his fatherland..."
Wie ein Soldat des Deutschen Reiches für sein Vaterland zu sterben versteht.
This was a propaganda film. The truth is that the British cleverly fooled the Germans into believing that an entire fleet was awaiting the Graf Spee outside the Montevideo bay. This was not so, but the Germans decided to scuttle rather than fight what they thought was a suicidal battle. The Uruguayan government's decision not to allow the Germans time to carry out some necessary repairs, played a role in that decision.
@kajamix No matter my British forebears would have sunk it anyway. like they did to all the other German Capital ships, Captain Langsdorff was no Nazi but a man who knew the game was up and put his crew first, the Graf Spee had arado Seaplanes so could have done a recon to see what British ships were in the area. yes they were fooled but it was only a matter of time.
I guess it depends on how you look at it. I compared two of 'your' ships, the 'Hood' and the 'Dunkerque', British and French repectivley, yes? Both of the ships had larger diameter shells than the Graf Spee, but Graf Spee's caliber was larger, significantly so compared to the Hood. Even so, the Graf Spee could go further at more knots than either. Graf Spee -7500 nm at 19 knts (20,000 economically). Dunkerque- 7500 nm at 15 knts, and the Hood- 5170 at 18 knts. Cheers.
Ah, odinsssson! Or rather, Mr Quisling, I presume? And to think that our Royal Marines and Navy have spent so much time and effort training to help defend you lot in 'Norge". Never mind, that arctic training wasn't wasted. Came in very handy in the Falklands...
you must admitt they making propeganda out of it .... a brit wuld have gone down whit the ship bla bla bla
and yes i have been training whit brits in winterwarfare they bitching a loot , but are good learners and solidiers... hope i dont piss too many workingtrash heros off now.. cheers
A British captain would not have gone down with his ship because a. he would not have scuttled it and b. he would not have been conned into thinking he needed to. As for the Brits "bitching a lot" yes of course, we grumble while we get on with the job. British forces grumbled their way from Normandy to Berlin as I recall. And more recently from San Carlos Water to Stanley. By "workingtrash heroes " do you mean the blokes who had to salvage all those wrecked German destroyers at Narvik?
odin. The British didn't even win this by themselves. There was also a New Zealand ship involved, which they don't mention. One of the English ship is a great victor called the Exeter. In fact, it withdrew defeated from the battle. The two English ships got all the credit. The New Zealand one got none.
Swanning - although I'm a Brit I actually LIVE in New Zealand and am well aware of the NZ involvement. To say that the Achilles got no credit is unfair. Her part has been well documented over the years. The ship was part of the New Zealand Division of the Royal Navy and was technically a British ship and prefaced by "HMS". The Royal New Zealand Navy was not officially formed until 1st October 1941. Even then, cruisers were not commanded/manned exclusively by NZ personnel. (Smaller ships were.)
Tthough still technically an RN ship this in no way diminishes Achilles' contribution to the result. However to disparage Exeter because she withdrew is also unfair. The fact she was heavily hit, being clearly identified as the biggest threat, allowed the light cruisers to close, as Harwood had hoped. Without Exeter the other ships would have been badly mauled. Exeter's unusually tall topmasts may have led the Graf Spee into initially thinking the smaller ships were destroyers. Big mistake!
Odin - aren't you confusing Dunkirk 1940 with the replay in Normandy 1944? Anyway when you've only got one army you try not to lose it. Unlike Germany who had lots of armies and lost the lot. I never said Britain would have won on its own. But the war would not have been won without us. Germany would have focussed everything on Russia - no other fronts and no bomber campaign from British airfields to smash German industry. Eventually the USA might have nuked Germany after they'd dealt to Japan!
el graf spee se undio en costas de URUGUAY, el puerto de montevideo lo autorizo solo 45minutos estar parado ahi, el cual mismos los nazis lo destruyeron antes de ser encontrado por flotas de eeuu en costas de MONTEVIDEO, URUGUAY
aaaaa ok ok, serian 45 horas o mas!! es verdad lo que se que se undio aqui en Montevideo URUGUAY, mi tio me dice que se escucharon de 100km estampidos como una tormenta enorme!! estubo impresionante me decia, el vive a 100km de montevideo y dice que se escucho!!
Yo tuve un tío, ya fallecido, que lo vió hundirse desde la rambla. El capitán lo sacó primero del canal de entrada al puerto y luego lo hundió; un caballero. Pero según tengo entendido la gente recién se enteró a último momento que el barco salía, y eso a través de la BBC, que tenía un enviado trasmitiendo en vivo para el mundo. Como sería, que ese día hubo clásico (ganó nacional) y se jugó a estadio lleno...
jajaja bo moncho sos rabioso de nacional jaja, che todo montevideo vio undirse al barco y los relampagueos y fuertes estampidos que hacia!! yo vivo en el pueblo BARROS BLANCOS, dep. CANELONES... serca hay una ciudad que se llama SUAREZ.. en esa ciudad sin mentirte hasta hace como 15 dias vivia un aleman viejaso que era nazi, era del barco ese. El viejo rubio grandote siempre andaba con un perro en la plaza.... hace dias fallecio!!
Tu alemán ha de haber sido bien mayor, pobre viejo. Después que el barco se hundió los "internaron" en un cuartel militar en Durazno. Y cuando la guerra terminó, los reembarcaron para alemania, sin chistar. Hay un relato de esto escrito por el propio encargado del cuartel, es corto y de lo más entretenido.
Ja, si, rabioso del bolso, pero esto que hacen ahora de ganar en la auf lo que pierden en la cancha no me lo banco; vamos a terminar festejando tener los mejores delegados...
che posta era uno del barco graf spee, quedo aqui!! yo a nacional le tengo un ascoooo!!!! son unas nenas se tiran al pasto!! en mi pueblo BARROS BLANCOS hay una zona que se llama VILLA LOS AROMOS.... ahi antrenaba la auf, ahora PEÑAROL!! entre chacras, viñedos y algunas casas
Pero si te creo, muchos volvieron de alemania y se radicaron acá. Tengo amigos que viven por los aromos y son fanáticos enloquecidos del manya. Pobres...
Yo estoy en "ciudad de la costa", que, también en canelones pasó a ciudad hace unos añitos. Pero es un desastre, ja. Mucha gente se vuelve a mvdo por contribución alta y servicios lamentables. ¿Viste? El bolso volvió a perder puntos. Vamos a tener que hacer fuerza en la auf para que los empates con más de cuatro goles valgan al menos dos puntos...
a mira que bien che, BARROS BLANCOS es una ciudad tranquilaza gracias a dios!! solamente habran unos chorros que se cuentan con los dedos de la mano jaja, nacional no existe che!!! PEÑAROL es historia!!
Esta vez la suerte nos mimó a nosotros. ¿Viste el morro? Desconozco otro caso igual; estuvo tres minutos, se comió dos amarillas, le hicieron el penal que definió el partido y no llegó a tocar ni una bola... Increíble.
I have always liked the concept of the Graf Spee, but the 5 inch armor was insufficient to resist penetrating shells from a lowly treaty cruiser. If this ship ever tried to tangle with a full sized dreadnaught the outcome would never be in doubt. With a top speed of about 32 knots she could only barely outrun a battle cruiser and everything else could dog her down. It is difficult to find a proper role for this ship, fast but not fast enough, heavy but not heavy enough.
Zyworski 4 months ago
@Zyworski "It is difficult to find a proper role for this ship, fast but not fast enough, heavy but not heavy enough." Nice point of view.
gmansi 3 months ago
The earlier battle had done significant damage to the vessel and her seaworthiness was suspect, further her fuel system could not filter the fuel necessary to return home, so her fate was sealed.
The Graf Spee was of a unique design that would have served the US well in the Pacific campaign, plenty of deck space for AA would have given a ship like this staying power to park off an island and shell for days. I exaggerate the magazine would probably empty in a few hours.
Zyworski 4 months ago
I say only "look at the Hood" ;-)
halogen0815 5 months ago
they had two arado and didnt use them
batalion666 6 months ago
THEY WERE GOOD MEN.
michaelwright999 10 months ago
Saluted the ship as we (HMS Chichester - RN) passed by it on our way up the river Plate in 1976. Just the top cross part was visible above the water.
allyaster 11 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@allyaster "Saluted the ship as we (HMS Chichester - RN) passed by it on our way up the river Plate in 1976. Just the top cross part was visible above the water." Great! Now nothing is over the surface.
gmansi 3 months ago
It's really amazing this event partially because of this was done early in the war. Not too good of an omen to Germany's chances.
wrh61 1 year ago
wow, this is kinda like The Fox Propaganda Network version of what happened...
bblando65 1 year ago
They didn't fool the germans... there were enough british forces waiting outside of the harbor to sink the Graf Spee, and the german ship was almost out of ammo.
Infact it was the germans who fooled the british. Nobody discovered - until the explosion - that most seamen had left the ship. They had destroyed all interesting equipment and blew up the ship (not repaired yet). The captain Langsdorff took a very clever decision to save a lot of lives...
Vickzq 1 year ago
I am watching "The Battle of the River Plate" right now. It is ok, but the low budget gets in the way of the story. It does seem to be right on with the history of this.
brassbend 1 year ago
amazing, there was music best described as noise even before metal was born ;)
ichlebefuerflipflops 1 year ago
Thats some extreme propaganda right there.
calicheSCOT 1 year ago
graf spee cumplio su objetivo, tirarse embarcaciones inglesas en el mediterraneo fue lo mas sensato hundir el barco y salvar al tripulación, luchar contra el engaño ingles le hubiera significado su captura y su ensañamiento con el barco y con sus tripulantes.
JulioCarlos69 1 year ago
интересно , что бы уругвай мог сделать этому кораблю ?
romulanify 1 year ago
Buen material didáctico para los adolescentes gracias.
jeanpaul320 1 year ago
nice historical video
Hubispee 2 years ago
Awesome
tcrownprince 2 years ago
My father is so fucking stupid.
TheZuikaku 2 years ago
@TheZuikaku
Eh?
G777GUN 2 years ago
like kajamix said, Langdorff was fooled to believed that more than 10, 15 ships were close... Langsdorff and the British Navy knew that Graf Spee would win both ships, even with few hours to repair... thats why the british tried to fool them...
hitokijb 2 years ago
The principal problem was that the ship didndt have fuel for the future battle .
MrDoso39 2 years ago
could anyone tell me why sailed to Montevideo?
Podria alguien decirme que hacia este barco en montevideo?
zetamanya 2 years ago
@zetamanya - There had been a battle between Graf Spee and several British cruisers. Graf Spee was seriously damaged and fled to the nearest harbor for repair, but the British government forced Uruguay, not to allow the repairing of the ship. Captain Langsdorff knew, he wouldn't stand a chance against the cruisers which were waiting for him. So he decided, to sink his own ship rather than fight and risk the lives of his crew in a battle he could never win.
MegaLiopleurodon 2 years ago
Estaba tratando de entorpecer el comercio de materias primas hacia inglaterra en el atlantico sur. El principal motivo de su auto destruccion no fue por los barcos ingleses esperandolo sino por la falta de combustible para enfrentar la batalla.
MrDoso39 2 years ago
WOW
tcrownprince 2 years ago
Kapitän zur See Hans Langsdorff took his own life with a pistol shot in the head and was found in his hotel chamber laying on the war flag of the ADMIRAL GRAF SPEE. He left a letter in which he gave his answer to the British propaganda:
"How a soldier of the German Reich knows to die for his fatherland..."
Wie ein Soldat des Deutschen Reiches für sein Vaterland zu sterben versteht.
In memory of this hero: May he rest in peace!
runenwurf 2 years ago 11
@runenwurf he was laying on the 'Reichskriegsflagge'
xXGTAXxD 6 months ago
EPIC !!!
JAGDPANTHER20 2 years ago
This was a propaganda film. The truth is that the British cleverly fooled the Germans into believing that an entire fleet was awaiting the Graf Spee outside the Montevideo bay. This was not so, but the Germans decided to scuttle rather than fight what they thought was a suicidal battle. The Uruguayan government's decision not to allow the Germans time to carry out some necessary repairs, played a role in that decision.
kajamix 2 years ago 31
@kajamix i can't believe they are trying to raise her and turn her into a museum ship!
pramboy09 1 year ago
@pramboy09 they will make it into a nazi shrine. it will be visited every year by bush, family and others.
kajamix 1 year ago 2
@kajamix No matter my British forebears would have sunk it anyway. like they did to all the other German Capital ships, Captain Langsdorff was no Nazi but a man who knew the game was up and put his crew first, the Graf Spee had arado Seaplanes so could have done a recon to see what British ships were in the area. yes they were fooled but it was only a matter of time.
1965CAPTKIRK 5 months ago
@1965CAPTKIRK The British navy sunk all except Admiral Sheer. The film "submarine" you saw was in reality Admiral Sheer's story.
kajamix 5 months ago
@kajamix Prinz Eugen survive the war!
gmansi 3 months ago
@1965CAPTKIRK The Arado planes was destroyed on the battle before coming to Montevideo.
gmansi 3 months ago
More powerful than anything faster and faster than anything more powerful.
1olddavid 2 years ago
This is a myth - I can name at least five ships which were both faster and more powerful than the panzerschiffs:
HMS Repulse, HMS Renown, HMS Hood, Strasbourg, Dunkerque
jspeters75 2 years ago
I guess it depends on how you look at it. I compared two of 'your' ships, the 'Hood' and the 'Dunkerque', British and French repectivley, yes? Both of the ships had larger diameter shells than the Graf Spee, but Graf Spee's caliber was larger, significantly so compared to the Hood. Even so, the Graf Spee could go further at more knots than either. Graf Spee -7500 nm at 19 knts (20,000 economically). Dunkerque- 7500 nm at 15 knts, and the Hood- 5170 at 18 knts. Cheers.
1olddavid 2 years ago
@1olddavid Can you please elaborate on your technical points i.e. caliber v diameter
didsles 1 year ago
I hope this amazing footage can be enhanced into colour someday
ToonandBBfan 2 years ago
goog classic piece of history!
CrazyBoutThe40s 2 years ago 5
That ship was BAD ASS have you seen the big eagle and swastika they raised off of its bow in 2006 look it up on google.
ak47guru 2 years ago
It certainly had colossal firepower for its size.
11 inch guns on a cruiser sized ship was phenomanal.
ToonandBBfan 2 years ago
propeganda video form the brits
odinsssson 3 years ago
Ah, odinsssson! Or rather, Mr Quisling, I presume? And to think that our Royal Marines and Navy have spent so much time and effort training to help defend you lot in 'Norge". Never mind, that arctic training wasn't wasted. Came in very handy in the Falklands...
littmann03 2 years ago 2
you must admitt they making propeganda out of it .... a brit wuld have gone down whit the ship bla bla bla
and yes i have been training whit brits in winterwarfare they bitching a loot , but are good learners and solidiers... hope i dont piss too many workingtrash heros off now.. cheers
odinsssson 2 years ago
A British captain would not have gone down with his ship because a. he would not have scuttled it and b. he would not have been conned into thinking he needed to. As for the Brits "bitching a lot" yes of course, we grumble while we get on with the job. British forces grumbled their way from Normandy to Berlin as I recall. And more recently from San Carlos Water to Stanley. By "workingtrash heroes " do you mean the blokes who had to salvage all those wrecked German destroyers at Narvik?
littmann03 2 years ago 3
it is like the germans say "look at the brits running in normandy , we wold have fighted too the last man and bla bla bla"
and you did run in narvik too dident you and later you clame victory like your contry REALY wold have beaten the germans alone
odinsssson 2 years ago
odin. The British didn't even win this by themselves. There was also a New Zealand ship involved, which they don't mention. One of the English ship is a great victor called the Exeter. In fact, it withdrew defeated from the battle. The two English ships got all the credit. The New Zealand one got none.
swanningaround 2 years ago
Swanning - although I'm a Brit I actually LIVE in New Zealand and am well aware of the NZ involvement. To say that the Achilles got no credit is unfair. Her part has been well documented over the years. The ship was part of the New Zealand Division of the Royal Navy and was technically a British ship and prefaced by "HMS". The Royal New Zealand Navy was not officially formed until 1st October 1941. Even then, cruisers were not commanded/manned exclusively by NZ personnel. (Smaller ships were.)
littmann03 2 years ago
Tthough still technically an RN ship this in no way diminishes Achilles' contribution to the result. However to disparage Exeter because she withdrew is also unfair. The fact she was heavily hit, being clearly identified as the biggest threat, allowed the light cruisers to close, as Harwood had hoped. Without Exeter the other ships would have been badly mauled. Exeter's unusually tall topmasts may have led the Graf Spee into initially thinking the smaller ships were destroyers. Big mistake!
littmann03 2 years ago
Odin - aren't you confusing Dunkirk 1940 with the replay in Normandy 1944? Anyway when you've only got one army you try not to lose it. Unlike Germany who had lots of armies and lost the lot. I never said Britain would have won on its own. But the war would not have been won without us. Germany would have focussed everything on Russia - no other fronts and no bomber campaign from British airfields to smash German industry. Eventually the USA might have nuked Germany after they'd dealt to Japan!
littmann03 2 years ago
Great upload Skoblin! great historical and educational channel you have! keep up your good work. Regards from Montevideo.
101Dobermanns 3 years ago
el graf spee se undio en costas de URUGUAY, el puerto de montevideo lo autorizo solo 45minutos estar parado ahi, el cual mismos los nazis lo destruyeron antes de ser encontrado por flotas de eeuu en costas de MONTEVIDEO, URUGUAY
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
No aldo, no estuvo 45 minutos, estuvo dos o tres días...
Moncho1234 3 years ago
aaaaa ok ok, serian 45 horas o mas!! es verdad lo que se que se undio aqui en Montevideo URUGUAY, mi tio me dice que se escucharon de 100km estampidos como una tormenta enorme!! estubo impresionante me decia, el vive a 100km de montevideo y dice que se escucho!!
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
Yo tuve un tío, ya fallecido, que lo vió hundirse desde la rambla. El capitán lo sacó primero del canal de entrada al puerto y luego lo hundió; un caballero. Pero según tengo entendido la gente recién se enteró a último momento que el barco salía, y eso a través de la BBC, que tenía un enviado trasmitiendo en vivo para el mundo. Como sería, que ese día hubo clásico (ganó nacional) y se jugó a estadio lleno...
Moncho1234 3 years ago
jajaja bo moncho sos rabioso de nacional jaja, che todo montevideo vio undirse al barco y los relampagueos y fuertes estampidos que hacia!! yo vivo en el pueblo BARROS BLANCOS, dep. CANELONES... serca hay una ciudad que se llama SUAREZ.. en esa ciudad sin mentirte hasta hace como 15 dias vivia un aleman viejaso que era nazi, era del barco ese. El viejo rubio grandote siempre andaba con un perro en la plaza.... hace dias fallecio!!
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
Tu alemán ha de haber sido bien mayor, pobre viejo. Después que el barco se hundió los "internaron" en un cuartel militar en Durazno. Y cuando la guerra terminó, los reembarcaron para alemania, sin chistar. Hay un relato de esto escrito por el propio encargado del cuartel, es corto y de lo más entretenido.
Ja, si, rabioso del bolso, pero esto que hacen ahora de ganar en la auf lo que pierden en la cancha no me lo banco; vamos a terminar festejando tener los mejores delegados...
Moncho1234 3 years ago
che posta era uno del barco graf spee, quedo aqui!! yo a nacional le tengo un ascoooo!!!! son unas nenas se tiran al pasto!! en mi pueblo BARROS BLANCOS hay una zona que se llama VILLA LOS AROMOS.... ahi antrenaba la auf, ahora PEÑAROL!! entre chacras, viñedos y algunas casas
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
Pero si te creo, muchos volvieron de alemania y se radicaron acá. Tengo amigos que viven por los aromos y son fanáticos enloquecidos del manya. Pobres...
Moncho1234 3 years ago
son de mi pueblooo de BARROS BLANCOS cheee es uno de los ultimos pueblos de canelones que esta pasando a ciudad BARROS BLANCOS
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
Yo estoy en "ciudad de la costa", que, también en canelones pasó a ciudad hace unos añitos. Pero es un desastre, ja. Mucha gente se vuelve a mvdo por contribución alta y servicios lamentables. ¿Viste? El bolso volvió a perder puntos. Vamos a tener que hacer fuerza en la auf para que los empates con más de cuatro goles valgan al menos dos puntos...
Moncho1234 3 years ago
a mira que bien che, BARROS BLANCOS es una ciudad tranquilaza gracias a dios!! solamente habran unos chorros que se cuentan con los dedos de la mano jaja, nacional no existe che!!! PEÑAROL es historia!!
AldoAlonso89 3 years ago
Esta vez la suerte nos mimó a nosotros. ¿Viste el morro? Desconozco otro caso igual; estuvo tres minutos, se comió dos amarillas, le hicieron el penal que definió el partido y no llegó a tocar ni una bola... Increíble.
Moncho1234 3 years ago
BANG!
misterpeaky 3 years ago
Nice Video :D
Smogger911 3 years ago