I am not a cultist. I've been trained in science since a child in school. I built 3 hho gens & have tested all 3 in my '96 Ford Explorer 5 ltr V8 that was getting only 8-9 mpg in town and 10-12 mpg on highway trips. My last 2 highway trips w/ hho gen, logged 14.9mpg & 17.2 & my vehicle was not empty, I was carrying extra loads in the back of the suv -explorer. Real highway evidence, not lab numbers from static testing without a load. I also used smackbooster designs to build 2 of my devices.
@visionace ; Take my "HHO" challenge. Why don't you clowns ever test your claims and your devices properly? I suspect the reason is because you don't want to know the truth.
I got a strike for Privacy Violation for no more than re-upping a DesertPhile vid with the name[dustin pereslete], his channel [EletrikRide] & DesertPhile's claim that dp was a DMCA troll.
Thot experiment:
I show [uncopyrighted] image of Barak Obama, state his full name, and that the lives in the Whitehouse, and that his policies [for sake of argument] are contrary to the Constitution.Then this is a greater privacy violation because I give out the additional information, the address. Absurd?
Crap.. I tried posting something but it doesn't seem to have gone through, I'm afraid it'll come back and this will be a duplicate, but I'll try anyway.
This is a message to all the HHO true believers out there. I know you like to talk about how you've proven that this concept works. But it's very easy to fool yourself, especially if you want to believe. That's the reason for the need for independent tests like this.
You are making extraordinary claims, you claim to have devices which, depending upon the specific claim, violate conservation of energy or basic thermodynamics. You act offended when people are skeptical of the claims and ask for reliable independent verification.
If you really have what you claim to have, you have the basis for revolutionizing the auto industry. You should be running to be the first to prove the effectiveness of your concept.
Instead I see a bunch of people refusing to take their work out of their basement laboratories and into reputable testing centers. I'm constantly told that I just have to take the claims on faith.
Or, even better, I'm told to try it myself. Please, don't make me laugh. The moment I don't get the results you claim I should you'll just say I did it wrong. That's why it HAS to be one of your trusted devices that's tested.
"...you claim I should you'll just say I did it wrong."
That is exactly how "faith 'healing'"works, too. These "HHO" people have an easy out when they insist "You try it and see!" That is why I require them to produce an automobile with the device already working in it.
Here is some text I copied off an HHO scam site, I mean web site.
Remember the story about the man who invented the 200 mpg carburetor?
As soon as his patent was granted, the Oil companies began putting in lead and sulphur which PREVENTED the gas from vaporizing in his carburetor AND coated the inside of it effectively ruining it on the inside. It was useless and the oil companies kept an important invention out of the hands of the public.
Smack says he cannot verify others claims, only his, but then he says that there are thousands of others getting gains??? This is his proof? LOL. What an idiot. and whats worse is that there are ppl that actually believe him. It takes a village to raise an idiot. LOL
So I guess you are real smart like desertpedophile? It is easy to sit back in your lawn chair in mom's basement and act like a knowledgeable person using your computer to find research to support your ideas. It is much harder to build, test and verify research which fringes on heresy in the engineering community. The people you call idiots are running engines on water sir. Is this not monumental? Others improve efficiency of engines by adding HHO to the fuel (myself included).
The engines that are running on water are not useful for anything other than a parlor trick. A steam engine runs on water. The engine you refer to is taking massive amounts of electricity in and only getting a nominal amount out. Hardly enough to power a light. So no, this is not monumental. Its a waste of the electricity in, but nobody seems to account for that.
Let me give an example of a less exotic heat engine. The humble internal combustion engine. For this example I'm assuming that the engine has been adjusted to detonate rather than combust. Bad for the engine, but it makes the system easier to visualize.
Okay, you've got your cylinder with the gas/air mixture squirted into it. The piston rises, the pressure of the mixture rises. The spark plug (or plugs) fires near the top of the stroke (before it, actually) starting the gas mixture burning
Or in this case, exploding. The explosion happens quicker, completely burning the fuel while it's still in the cylinder. Now we're at the top of the stroke and you have a very hot, compressed gas mixture. The pressure (from the heat increase) pushes the piston down, and as the piston goes down the pressure goes down and the temperature drops with it. Energy is converted from heat into kinetic energy. Conservation of energy in action.
For a properly operating engine the combustion takes longer to occur, continuing into the exhaust pipe and finishing in the catalytic converter. So the heat transfer isn't as clean to visualize. But the principle is still the same. It is conservation of energy and thermodynamics in action.
This isn't an advanced concept, this stuff should have been covered in a basic high school physics class.
excellent, yes ... when we power an engine on 100% HHO we must advance the ignition timing a good bit after TDC due to the very rapid detonation of HHO ... we moderate the detonation and attempt to simulate combustion by injecting inert gasses such as CO2 or Argon ... though using 5 parts air to 1 part HHO seems to work nearly as well to moderate the detonation ... with HHO boosters and gasoline, only a modest timing adjustment and a leaner air:gas mix seems to work best ...
oops ... I misspoke ... when running an engine on just HHO, we do not "advance the ignition timing a bit after TDC", we do indeed retard the timing to a point well after TDC ... sorry for any confusion this might have caused ... the best timing settings seem to be in the range from about 10 deg to as much as 60 deg after top dead center ...
Guys, it's very simple. What you have here is a simple, reversible system. Conservation of energy says when you burn oxygen and hydrogen you get X amount of energy. To split the resulting water back into hydrogen and oxygen you have to spend a MINIMUM of X amount of energy. Plus the inefficiencies. There are no shadowy realms where extra energy magically springs forth. The entire process is fundamentally understood.
Kinetic energy??? You get that as a result of the HEAT. That's why these things are called heat engines. The heat is where ALL of the energy comes from. If you boil water you get expanding steam. But that doesn't mean the kinetic energy of the steam is a magical source of extra energy unrelated to the heat you've been pumping into the water. The energy of the heat has been transferred into the kinetic energy. Once again, CONSERVATION of energy.
I can give you example after example. Take a Sterling engine powered solar panel. The energy comes from the solar radiation. THERMAL. It is captured by the Sterling engine and transformed into kinetic energy. Which is then converted into electrical energy by a generator.
The fact that the source of the energy is thermal does not mean that the kinetic energy is a loophole. It doesn't come from an unknown source. The entire process is entirely understood and accounted for.
Yes indeed. YouTube, in their imminent wisdom, consistently responds to mass flagging campaigns by removing the attacked videos without so much as looking at them. We've seen it happen way too many times.
And when they're questioned about it? The response, of course, is that *every* flagged video is reviewed individually by a "specially trained" member of the "content review team" before any action is taken.
Think of it this way.. You either have consumable (usable) energy or the kinetic energy from the combustion of hydroxy(l) gases as a fuel.
If you rely solely upon the Law of thermal dynamics you are sadly mistaken. Thermal meaning heat. There is the kinetic energy that is released as well. which you do not account for. This kinetic energy is used is it not? AHH but wait is there more?
what I am really getting at is you are looking only at the HOD. Not the effects inside the ice. Extra energy? give me a break. Do you not understand that all things are interconnected. Energy thus is fluid like water, or electricity.. It is not taken from one thing to the next. An HOD is a pebble being dropped into the water generating an effect over multiple systems. wave starts small and isolated then spreads effecting more of an area. Perhaps you think the atom does not have additional
effects on the surrounding environment when it's energy is released. In essence creating a small chain of energy releases from different substances. Talk all the trash you want about it but the proof is there for all to see. Stay stuck in your little world. your choice. as Shakespeare put it. "There are more things in Heaven and earth Horiatio Than is dreamt of by your philosophies. Forgive the scramble but you now the meaning.
"what I am really getting at is you are looking only at the HOD."
Oh no, you said thermodynamics doesn't include kinetic energy.
That's a ridiculous statement to make. Thermodynamics has its origins in the beginnings of the steam engine. The first combustion engine. OF COURSE thermodynamics is concerned with kinetic energy.
And now you respond by quoting me SHAKESPEARE and trying to get all mystical by talking about ripples in a pond?
"Do you not understand that all things are interconnected"
Oh, I do. That's why I know that the kinetic energy doesn't come out of thin air. You on the other hand suggested that the kinetic energy that comes from burning fuel is unrelated to the heat and unaccounted for in the math of thermodynamics.
Yeah, and the HHO generation system is pissing away roughly three quarters of the energy it takes in, only returning a fraction of what it draws.
You want analogies? Okay, instead of a pond let's use a bath tub. You're getting your ripple by sucking water out of it and spitting it back in from a height. Only your plumbing is so bad that most of the water leaks out before it comes back in.
I think in short order you're left with an empty bath tub.
with a very primitive consumer grade apparatus I am able to get into the 50% range ... specifically, it takes roughly 1200 watts to power the electrolysis device that generates the HHO gas used to power a 3.5hp engine that spins an alternator from which 600 watts can be drawn ... so while your argument is valid, the performance is a bit better than you think even with the most primitive of experimental apparatus ... and I believe additional improvement in performance can be made ...
"with a very primitive consumer grade apparatus I am able to get into the 50% range"
Those numbers look a bit suspect. 50% efficiency of the water splitter alone is a rough maximum. For the engines, quick research suggests a thermodynamic limit of 37%, with 20% as more of an average number, but I'll give you 50%.
So, one water splitting loss of 50%, one engine loss, reduce the total by 50% again. You're down to 25% and we haven't even considered generator losses.
my "water splitter" operates at roughly 120% of Faraday ... no, not over unity, but certainly over Faraday ... I do not split water directly ... I encourage a chemical reaction where potassium splits the water ... dilute solution of KOH with roughly 20-40 grams per gallon of distilled water ... think electroplating, not electrolysis ...
"my "water splitter" operates at roughly 120% of Faraday ... no, not over unity, but certainly over Faraday"
The best numbers I could find for high powered industrial electrolysis units were around 70%. I doubt you're operating with that kind of scale of efficiency.
opinion noted ... but yes, it is indeed over Faraday and performs reliably for very long duration at that level ... and it is a remarkably simple device the design of which has been made available at no charge for anyone to replicate that might be interested ... Faraday was broken some years back and is sort of like the sound barrier at this point ... there are others working with devices much more efficient than my own ... mine is typical these days ...
I should be more complete in this response. When I run my device at very low output levels I am able to achieve 120% of Faraday. But productivity suffers. When I run it flat out as hot as I can run it, the device puts out 20 lpm volumes but efficiency is in the toilet, 70-75% Faraday. To run my small engine, I use a mid range setting where I produce roughly 7 lpm of volume at about 70F using roughly 1200 watts ... only a tiny bit over Faraday by maybe 2-7% ...
you are making a very reasonable argument. it is quiet nice to have a discussion with some one of the the opposite opinion in a civilized fashion.
your quick research is correct but that is where us hho researchers differ. put your theories to the test. you may be very suprized with what you discover.
yes, this fellow NomadSoul presents reasonable questions, sensible critique and seems intelligent enough to state his arguments without a dependence on foul language ... discourse of this type is helpful and will force us to be better about our data collection and reporting methods ... there is no fear of responsible critical review within this "cult" ... we welcome it ...
I ran into trouble getting reliable ignition when I tried the high compression head so the experimental results presented refer to the stock 8:1 compression. HHO conducts electricity and under high compression tends to short out the ignition spark. Higher compressions should yield better performance but we will need a more energetic spark to get reliable detonation of the fuel. D3adp001 is working on this and we hope to have a solution soon.
The most incredulous burden I see here is the lack of educated proof beyond the mere spouting of a Law. especially a law that deals with only one form of energy contained within an element of choice. Heat and the equilibrium of it alone. What of light, kinetic, or even the electromagnetic or nuclear forces therein? equate all of them or none your choice.
Find out the total sum of energy applied and consumed then you have grounds to spout your law.
"Find out the total sum of energy applied and consumed then you have grounds to spout your law."
Okay okay, quick example for you. You put X amount of energy into water to split it into oxygen and hydrogen. This energy is equal to the amount of energy contained in the chemical bonds, plus extra energy consumed by unavoidable inefficiencies.
You burn the hydrogen and oxygen and you get that energy back. The potential chemical energy that you created is being collected once again.
Minus, that is, the inefficiencies that once again, cannot be avoided.
So in both phases you are losing energy through inefficiencies which are an unavoidable part of the system.
How is this helping? Where does the supposed extra energy come from? Are you saying that you get extra power from the chemical bond? That you only spend X amount of power in breaking the bonds, but when you reform them you get X plus Y energy back? where does Y come from?
i love flipping gay chicks! Is good to have some fun...love it!(and of course,that is NOT A THIRD WORLD!) Next is hurling blades of grass from opposing golf fans!
L.A.M.E. That's the best 4 letters in order to describe the behavior of these people. Ya know: its better to violate freedom of speech than take a legitament challenge of your beliefs.
Post this video as well as the video that was removed over at dramatube or Vloggerheads. It might be a few days, but I am making a video about flagging and YouTube's screwed up implementation of it. I would like to link to it as an example of how easy it is to censor people on YouTube.
If you don't want to open an account on either place, then with your permission I will post the video that was deleted on dramatube.
man, now they start flagging about such bullshit? I think youtube should f**king check why a video got flagged before shutting it down. this system is just flawed out of its ass.
I have been running the engine with the lambda probe disconnected for a while now (the devices waterproof seal is broken, and rain makes the engine run a little erratic).
But, YES, fiddling with the lambda probe will also affect fuel mixture to some extent within certain limits. With it disconnected the engine seems to run fine, reverting to some safe predescided values I guess.
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No he isn't, and no it doesn't show....he is a nice guy and as far as I can tell, and I tried a few things, the numbers that he shows are reproduce able. Besides that, if he was a fraud, then why is he not arrested yet? Why didn't his clients get him charged for fraud?
He may be a nice guy? but you're both delusional if you believe the numbers are right. It's been calculated many times, it takes more energy to produce the HHO than what the HHO can supply back to the engine. Any reductions in fuel use are achieved by leaning the motor and can be done without the HHO device attached. This leaning process reduces power and can catastrophically damage the engine. It would be a wonderful world if all fraudsters were arrested instantly, sadly it never happens
"Does the "catalyst" effects of hydroxy on gasoline is calculated??"
It's not a catalyst. The sum total of oxygen and hydrogen injected from the splitter is exactly mixed, just enough to completely burn without interacting with the rest of the mixture. A catalyst is an entirely different concept altogether.
"they said that hydroxy fast flame speed enhance the combustion of gasoline dramaticly, even with small amount..."
I get the point that you're forwarding what you've heard, not putting forth the argument yourself, but.. this is just another vague suggestion. Saying "it does something that makes the fuel burn better in some way".
We're still at the point where the explanation is the gasses are added, some magic occurs, and the result is increased efficiency. Not a satisfactory explanation.
In any case we're back to the problem of an unending stream of post hoc attempts to come up with an explanation of how this stuff is supposed to work. As arguments are levied against it the explanation changes. I'm far more interested in the DP HHO challenge, or other attempts to provide for independent and verifiable testing of this concept. A convincing explanation would be one thing, a convincing demonstration quite another.
people dont understand that the 18% efficiancy averageof an IC is related to heat losses and the second law of thermal dynamics witch stipulates not only is it impossible to get more out then put in but you cant even get back what you put in the amount of unburned gas has very little effect on mpg at current operation temps even if you burn all the gas you only stand to gain .5 to 1 % gain
and that would take over ten years to pay for its self,lol
when I run the small engines on HHO my exhaust temps are only 200F where on gasoline under same load and at same RPM the exhaust temps are more like 600F ... now I really do not know for sure and can only give an educated guess ... but I think the HHO as a fuel is actually increasing the thermal efficiency of the small engine ... at least I have proven to myself that less energy is being wasted as heat in any case ... would love to have more eyes on it with other opinions to consider ...
well look at it like this hho is more flamable ,take a lighter and a try and burn a dollar bill thats rapped around a pipe
99% of the time it wont burn , so this describes the event in your engine wherin
small amounts of gas dont burn but with hho this may not be the case but for the most part the temp differance does play a role in the efficiancy eqaution but for the most part the specific heat may be the reason,any way im am willing to listen to any comments you have and i wont be a prik...
"when I run the small engines on HHO my exhaust temps are only 200F where on gasoline under same load and at same RPM the exhaust temps are more like 600F"
I've brought this up before. If you're running them overlean and are causing detonation your exhaust will be cooler. How do your cylinder head temps look, comparatively?
actually when we run them over lean things get very exciting .. the results made for a fairly entertaining YouTube video set to the 1812 Overture for reasons it appears you might appreciate ...
highest temps I get are right at the exhaust port on the head of the engine ... gas=600-650F ... hho=200-240F ... these were long duration runs of 6 hours with 400 watt load on the generator at steady 3600 rpm ...
oh my ... I may have misinterpreted what you were asking ... the experiments I describe were run with just air and HHO ... no gasoline at all ... so yes, from your point of view that would be a pretty darn lean mix ... the engine runs with as lean as 10:1 air:hho but when you start putting a load on it, you need the mix closer to a 5:1 ratio ... I have been able to "flood" the engine causing it to stall by trying a 3:1 ratio ... so between 5 and 10 parts air to 1 part HHO is the range ...
i can back ssc up on this matter. the engine temps are way lower than running on hho vr gasoline. infact i have to remove all of the cooling shrouds on my little engine in an attempt to get the engine up to opperating temp.
if you run a gassoline engine lean you will actually raise the combution temp. this higher temperature is what actually leads to detanation. the tattel tale sign of of a lean gasoline ice is a white coating on the spark plug.
You know very little of real world data. I built a vaporizer to find out how much fuel goes unburned, and posted the videos to show everyone. The gas in liquid form is only 50% utilized even at optimal injection.
Sorry to burst your bubble but it is a well known engineering fact that 98% of the fuel injected into a cylinder is burned. the catalytic converter converts the rest. Now out of that 98%, maybe only 30%, at best, is utilized as work. The rest of the energy is lost to heat.
If your "Fact" is truly Fact then vaporizing fuel should have no effect on efficiency. I can Prove that it does. Keep believing everything you read and testing nothing like a good little boy.
actuaky its 60% and disels are higher i think like 70 to 80% ,any way how could building a vaporizer tell you this,i cant find that vid thats why i left bad comments
You left bad comments because your an asshole. If you spent as much time building prototypes as you do being an asshole you might get something accomplished. All of my videos are posted on my page, I can't help you if your too stupid to look.
my understanding is that this is the most reasonable theory being floated to explain the measured mileage gains ... its a chicken and egg type thing ... you can measure the increased fuel efficiency easily enough ... but the reasons for the increases require explanation ... those involved in that area of research have put forward the argument that the increase is due to more efficient combustion ... like any theory, its open to discussion ... for me, verdict is still out on this one ...
". those involved in that area of research have put forward the argument that the increase is due to more efficient combustion"
That's not an explanation or a theory. It's still saying "we add the gas, something happens, and the engine is more efficient".
Mind you when you look into it and see that most applications also require leaning the mixture I think the conclusion is obvious. They're running their engines leaner and are shortening the engine lives but saving fuel.
it is a theory because it is an attempt to explain an observed phenomena ... it needs to be tested ... once it is tested and proven, it will no longer be a theory, but will be a fact ...
yes, leaning the mixture AND retarding ignition timing ... and in the more advanced work, direct water injection (ww2 mustang) and a high intensity spark ... these more advanced setups depend on custom computer controls beyond my skill level or understanding ...
You are wrong sir. I do not use any device other than my HHO cell on my van and several other cars. My results are very good usually averaging 30% increase in fuel economy on the highway.
Your understanding of "theory" is comical. I understand theory to be a postulation expressing an idea supporting the outcome. Theory will remain until the reason is nailed down.
"Theory will remain until the reason is nailed down."
It's statements like THIS that leaves me putting you into the crackpot territory with all the other HHO cultists. You like to talk science.. but your words.. they just don't quite work.
Theory is THE explanation. It's the highest level you get. It's not a temporary offering until the "reason" is worked out. It is the explanation of the phenomenon.
"Theory is THE explanation. It's the highest level you get."
Damn right; their hypothesis is that oxyhydrogen acts as a "catalyst" (that still cracks me up!) and makes atomized gasoline "burn faster." That ain't a theory--- for it to be a theory they would first have to observe it happening.
You are a seriously screwed up person if you think theory is fact. Just look up the definition of theory. The theory that the earth was round was theory until it was proven then it was fact. FACT is the highest level you get. I could care less about theory.
"The theory that the earth was round was theory until it was proven then it was fact."
Nothing in science is PROVEN, except in mathematics. You still do not understand the basic philosophy of science, I'm afraid, and are trying to bluff your way past areas in which you are ignorant.
Science does not have absolute certainty. It only has degrees of certainty. A theory is an idea that started out as a hypothesis, was put to tests capable of disproving it, and was instead supported.
Another example I like to use is string theory. It's not really a theory at all, because it cannot be tested yet. It would explain things we've observed if it were true, but until a way can be found to test it it cannot truly be termed a theory. It's more of a hypothesis. The fact that it fits current observations isn't enough, a way needs to be found to test it that makes it possible to disprove it if it's not correct.
Again, you seem to be rambling. The device working in a vehicle is what I have. After you have witnessed it or someone you trust has, you will be free to explain why it works. All I can do is offer up a theory as to why it works. I think having something working is much better than a theory.
I thought you had some intelligence until I saw you state theory is fact. I realize this is hard for you to grasp, but that doesn't make it any less real. I am ready to show off my system as soon as a prize is offered that is not a scam.
Speaking of someone's words not quite working.... You seem to be a bit tongue tied trying to explain your understanding of science. I am quite comfortable in what i know because I back up my claims with testing. I would be willing to bet that almost every one of the naysayers have no technical abilities and only know about science through books. That is great if you want to be a teacher, but if you are trying to accomplish something you need skills.
"I am quite comfortable in what i know because I back up my claims with testing"
Your own fallible testing, judging by your understanding of the scientific method I have little faith in your testing methodology. Once again, there's the randi website, go apply.
I'll repeat my earlier statement. "you waste three quarters of the energy the process uses to make a tiny amount of hydrogen and oxygen, you add that to the engine, something unexplained happens, and the mileage goes up" is NOT a theory. And everything offered up to try to explain it has been merely a post hoc rationalization formed in response to skeptical protests. I've watched the explanations evolve as the questions were asked.
me to when they figured out every one wasnt stupid enough to beleave the alternater sht they swithced to this catylist crok of sht,ya they evolve all write
You have been sidestepping the issue. I have said that I get results from HHO alone using no electronics. Explain that? I don't want to hear why it is impossible, I am past that. Even if you can't accept what I am telling you, try and explain what I am doing.
All right," onecraftydude " so you are going to take the Desertphile Challenge, Cool.
You have been to the web page, so you know what you have to do.
I will shut down my business for a few days, and make the all day drive so I can witness the test. I will have the $1,000.00 cash in my pocket, it will be yours if you win the Desertphile Challenge.
Note: My prize $ is independent of the Desertphile Challenge,
WOW, hooked on phonics worked for you. I am sure the scientific community is behind you 100% since you obviously have a grasp on the english language.
I almost feel bad making fun of an obviously illiterate person, but you make no qualms attacking me and my work. At least TRY and make a coherent argument in the future.
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your a con man what does science have to do with you ,and yes i am obviosly iliterate you powers of observation are of the charts,first of you must relize your lip started this,i commented on what a mechanic told me and stated this was the sorce of the data and your briliance swooped in and saved the day by saying
"you have no clue as to real world data "
lol,your a hoot bro whats it like being a complete shmuk ,hay did i spell smuk write you twerp
I am "willing". I am also married and trying to start a business and working on multiple experiments. I am also busy getting ready for the biggest HHO event in history this weekend. If my partners think it is worthwhile to drive to the middle of nowhere and take your crappy challenge I will drive out there or send a customer by there to pick up the money.
"If my partners think it is worthwhile to drive to the middle of nowhere and take your crappy challenge I will drive out there or send a customer by there to pick up the money."
Oh don't act coy. You know you're not going to take it.
"JREF: $1,00,000 prize for the first person showing "HHO" increases MPG by any significant amount (i.e., greater than testing error bars)."
Really? That's hilarious, I suggested to eletrikride (he started pm-ing me and we had a bit of a discussion) that Randi might be an appropriate person to plan a reliable test for HHO claims, but I didn't know if he really handled stuff like this. I think of him more for supernatural debunkings.
I have already told "eletrikride" and a half-dozen of his idiot ilk in YouTube to contact Randi and the JREF, and to watch the YouTube video from "Money Matters" where Randi stated their claims qualify for the one million dollars..... and they IGNORED me. Imagine--- ignoring one million dollars, and they insist they cannot get funding for their devices. Crock of shit!
if the 1 million still exists I will gladly take their money. If I drive to New Mwxico or wherever you are it will cost me about the same as the prize money plus a couple of bucks. I am ready to drive out there and claim the 2 k from you and noimw so if the million can be available at the same time thats great. Let me know if they can do the test at the same time and I am there. Noi need to pussy foot around, if the money is real I am ready to go.
"The JREF does not have any information on HHo." --- That is because there is no such thing as "HHO." If you are interested in the million dollars, write to Randi and state what claims you apply to your oxyhydrogen device, if any.
I did what you suggested and once again was met with denial. He told me to patent it and make a million. I told him I already did patent it. He said HHO does not apply to his challenge.
This is common with all of the naysayers, they use a huge amount of money to draw attention to themselves never intending to pay out a penny.
do the math an average car consumes 300 cfm of air so at 2 liters a min as most cells produce at around 300 watts and you will see that the amount of hho per ignitoin stroke is .02 % hho does nothing at such lean ratios .02 percent friend thats 2 hundreths of 1 %
thus I can agree but as you say most at 300w. not all do so poorly. And most of those are not very well engineered or thought out. This stuff is period in its infancy as is Fusion research. But the potential for more is still there. realistically never is a thing achieved without obstacles being overcome. And there is still more energy that is in a molecule that has the potential of being utilized yet is unaccounted for by most and why is that? i guess I am talking gibberish, goodnite
i didnt even get into hydrogen embrittlement ,,how do you explain the obviuos flaw in all this hydrogen fks metal up so any savings will be lost bying a new engine,also alternaters are onl 40 % efficiant so good luk friend i hope the second law is breakable but as it stands
im not convinced for many reasons so sorry i commented on hho again its a bad habbit of mine
i beleave you, seeing as i have no good info on the tolerance of these statments
but i have studied the subject and was convinced by what i saw thier are u tube
vids on this subject also and radarman
showed me some info as well,i was assuming the valve stem would go first
but i admit this is speculation ,i just dont like the hho cults they dont beleave in physics,they cant even measure thier output gas write ,not one has a vid describing vapor pressure,i like the torches thats it
agreed ... the HHO torch could be a viable commercial product now as it was in the early 1900's ... however, the process of getting stickers from Underwriter Labs and OSHA is long, contorted and very expensive ... EBN has four products of this type being processed now ... it may be a year before the "authorities" grant us their permission to offer you one for sale ... but we will get there eventually ...
just so you no the .5 to 1 % is probobly speculation the mechanic who told me this seems like the type to be full of sht half the time but it does sound about what one would expect,and i agree IC inefficiancy is a heat issue and paracitic losses issue the valve train alone probobly uses12 % of the output power maybe more ,im speculating agian of coarse,im intrested in your opinoin on this angle
yes, I have buried four small engines with honors over the years due to valve stem failure while running them on 100% HHO ... this is a materials problem that can be solved ... development continues using substandard consumer grade off the shelf sacrificial engines ... its the best we can afford for now ... but our methods are improving ... its a long learning curve but we are making rapid progress in the safe, efficient production, delivery and use of the gas as a fuel ...
agreed ... I keep hearing about this catalyst thing going on and I have some trouble with it ... the chemistry of it escapes me ... but I have done long duration stationary engine tests where a carefully measured volume of HHO was introduced along with a fixed volume of gasoline and run times at steady RPM monitored ... I got best results when about 20% of the total fuel ingested was HHO ... I am looking now for someone to replicate this experiment to see if similar results can be obtained ...
You are wrong. I show results of 30% all the time in my van. My son's car just showed 50% on a trip from fl to Mo a week ago. My wifes car is around 25% since she drives short trips. I have even gotten 100% improvement in my van, but cannot replicate the conditions that lead to that mileage yet. Still, I can handle 30%.
It would not be hard to shut us up. Im sure a local dealership or speed shop would give you access to thier facilities to prove your statements, probably for free or a small cost. And you could invite the local news channel down to film it. Can you do that? You dont have to drive anywhere except across town and then post the results with names and phone numbers of the shop and news crew. "Winner, winner, chicken dinner" as they say in Vegas
then why is your broke ass waisting time with na sayers you dont act like a gie who tells the truth you are an hho scammer pall ha haa stop sending me messages
i dont like lyers,and to say 50% of the gas in a car is unburned is total falicy ya real world data hu where the fk you get your info,o yA your dumm ass built aq vaporizer and posted the video,well all i seen was a bucnh of scam bullsht
You are wrong. As I have stated before my system is not using any electronic devices and I am getting 30-50% increases on the highway.
Feel free to stand on theory and bash the efforts of hard working enthusiasts like myself while you recline in your comfortable chair. In the meantime some of us have work to do.
Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.
The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s) and members (for example, the leader is considered the Messiah, a special being, an avatar—or the group and/or the leader is on a special mission to save humanity).
The group has a polarized us-versus-them mentality, which may cause conflict with the wider society.
The group is:
preoccupied with bringing in new members & with making money.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
you are not censored, your comment was rude and not accepted. If you where able to give a decent comment it would get accepted. Your behavior is wrong, and I wonder what it takes to make it clear for you so you can understand that you should take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself what the hell you are doing....but that is just my opinion. Desert....being skeptical is something else then being rude, unlike you, most other people do have a live and are social human beings with feelings.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
I also think that you should apologize to Eletrikride and all other youtubers for your wrong behavior. It is alright to disagree with things, but it is wrong to attack people on personal grounds.
I disagree, DP wasn't being unfairly rude, in a video, on his channel. People like Eletrikride were being arrogant and instead of proving their devices work they either wanted people to prove they don't work, by buying one first or wanting DP to waste his money to see them and in all fairness, if the devices worked they could drive to see him, which would be evidence they worked.
I am not a cultist. I've been trained in science since a child in school. I built 3 hho gens & have tested all 3 in my '96 Ford Explorer 5 ltr V8 that was getting only 8-9 mpg in town and 10-12 mpg on highway trips. My last 2 highway trips w/ hho gen, logged 14.9mpg & 17.2 & my vehicle was not empty, I was carrying extra loads in the back of the suv -explorer. Real highway evidence, not lab numbers from static testing without a load. I also used smackbooster designs to build 2 of my devices.
visionace 1 year ago
@visionace ; Take my "HHO" challenge. Why don't you clowns ever test your claims and your devices properly? I suspect the reason is because you don't want to know the truth.
Desertphile 1 year ago
A bunch of "get rich quick" kids who feel their apple cart has been upset.
KasparHauser4 1 year ago
There are people here who think you can drive to France. And as soon as they invent a water-powered car, I'm going with them.
4sineweaver2 2 years ago
I got a strike for Privacy Violation for no more than re-upping a DesertPhile vid with the name[dustin pereslete], his channel [EletrikRide] & DesertPhile's claim that dp was a DMCA troll.
Thot experiment:
I show [uncopyrighted] image of Barak Obama, state his full name, and that the lives in the Whitehouse, and that his policies [for sake of argument] are contrary to the Constitution.Then this is a greater privacy violation because I give out the additional information, the address. Absurd?
AtheistCitizen 2 years ago
I realy just cant stand the sound of your voice anymore
Rufe0 2 years ago
Please stop putting a heavy dramatic voice on like every 3rd word or so. Its annoying.
Funny though.
dodgydogman 2 years ago
Crap.. I tried posting something but it doesn't seem to have gone through, I'm afraid it'll come back and this will be a duplicate, but I'll try anyway.
This is a message to all the HHO true believers out there. I know you like to talk about how you've proven that this concept works. But it's very easy to fool yourself, especially if you want to believe. That's the reason for the need for independent tests like this.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
You are making extraordinary claims, you claim to have devices which, depending upon the specific claim, violate conservation of energy or basic thermodynamics. You act offended when people are skeptical of the claims and ask for reliable independent verification.
If you really have what you claim to have, you have the basis for revolutionizing the auto industry. You should be running to be the first to prove the effectiveness of your concept.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Instead I see a bunch of people refusing to take their work out of their basement laboratories and into reputable testing centers. I'm constantly told that I just have to take the claims on faith.
Or, even better, I'm told to try it myself. Please, don't make me laugh. The moment I don't get the results you claim I should you'll just say I did it wrong. That's why it HAS to be one of your trusted devices that's tested.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"...you claim I should you'll just say I did it wrong."
That is exactly how "faith 'healing'"works, too. These "HHO" people have an easy out when they insist "You try it and see!" That is why I require them to produce an automobile with the device already working in it.
Desertphile 2 years ago
Here is some text I copied off an HHO scam site, I mean web site.
Remember the story about the man who invented the 200 mpg carburetor?
As soon as his patent was granted, the Oil companies began putting in lead and sulphur which PREVENTED the gas from vaporizing in his carburetor AND coated the inside of it effectively ruining it on the inside. It was useless and the oil companies kept an important invention out of the hands of the public.
How is that for a big steaming pile of BullShit.
noimw 2 years ago
"Remember the story about the man who invented the 200 mpg carburetor?"
This story is STILL going around. A friend of mine who's learning to work on engines repeated it to me. It will not die.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Why I do NOT have an HHO device on my Vehicle .
It takes about 20 amps of current to produce 2 liters per min. of HHO.
My vehicle cruising at 2,000 RPM uses about 2,000 liters of air/fuel mix every minute. That is 2 parts HHO to 2,000 parts of air/fuel.
That reduced down is.....
1/10th of 1% or One part HHO to 1,000 parts of air/fuel.
Now logic and common sense should tell you that is not going to make any difference in MPG.
Now you have to subtract the power it took to make the HHO.
noimw 2 years ago 2
good point but actualy its more like 2 hundredths of 1 % that you would be using,i like the way you think
NOBOX7 2 years ago
"more like 2 hundredths of 1 %"
Tell me more. I can always use help with math.
noimw 2 years ago
Smack says he cannot verify others claims, only his, but then he says that there are thousands of others getting gains??? This is his proof? LOL. What an idiot. and whats worse is that there are ppl that actually believe him. It takes a village to raise an idiot. LOL
hhokiller 2 years ago
So I guess you are real smart like desertpedophile? It is easy to sit back in your lawn chair in mom's basement and act like a knowledgeable person using your computer to find research to support your ideas. It is much harder to build, test and verify research which fringes on heresy in the engineering community. The people you call idiots are running engines on water sir. Is this not monumental? Others improve efficiency of engines by adding HHO to the fuel (myself included).
onecraftydude 2 years ago
The engines that are running on water are not useful for anything other than a parlor trick. A steam engine runs on water. The engine you refer to is taking massive amounts of electricity in and only getting a nominal amount out. Hardly enough to power a light. So no, this is not monumental. Its a waste of the electricity in, but nobody seems to account for that.
hhokiller 2 years ago
Quit argueing with yourself and get back to playing Dungeons and Dragons. Your time will be much better spent in an fantasy world.
webovisionca 2 years ago
Let me give an example of a less exotic heat engine. The humble internal combustion engine. For this example I'm assuming that the engine has been adjusted to detonate rather than combust. Bad for the engine, but it makes the system easier to visualize.
Okay, you've got your cylinder with the gas/air mixture squirted into it. The piston rises, the pressure of the mixture rises. The spark plug (or plugs) fires near the top of the stroke (before it, actually) starting the gas mixture burning
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Or in this case, exploding. The explosion happens quicker, completely burning the fuel while it's still in the cylinder. Now we're at the top of the stroke and you have a very hot, compressed gas mixture. The pressure (from the heat increase) pushes the piston down, and as the piston goes down the pressure goes down and the temperature drops with it. Energy is converted from heat into kinetic energy. Conservation of energy in action.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
For a properly operating engine the combustion takes longer to occur, continuing into the exhaust pipe and finishing in the catalytic converter. So the heat transfer isn't as clean to visualize. But the principle is still the same. It is conservation of energy and thermodynamics in action.
This isn't an advanced concept, this stuff should have been covered in a basic high school physics class.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
excellent, yes ... when we power an engine on 100% HHO we must advance the ignition timing a good bit after TDC due to the very rapid detonation of HHO ... we moderate the detonation and attempt to simulate combustion by injecting inert gasses such as CO2 or Argon ... though using 5 parts air to 1 part HHO seems to work nearly as well to moderate the detonation ... with HHO boosters and gasoline, only a modest timing adjustment and a leaner air:gas mix seems to work best ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
oops ... I misspoke ... when running an engine on just HHO, we do not "advance the ignition timing a bit after TDC", we do indeed retard the timing to a point well after TDC ... sorry for any confusion this might have caused ... the best timing settings seem to be in the range from about 10 deg to as much as 60 deg after top dead center ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
Guys, it's very simple. What you have here is a simple, reversible system. Conservation of energy says when you burn oxygen and hydrogen you get X amount of energy. To split the resulting water back into hydrogen and oxygen you have to spend a MINIMUM of X amount of energy. Plus the inefficiencies. There are no shadowy realms where extra energy magically springs forth. The entire process is fundamentally understood.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Kinetic energy??? You get that as a result of the HEAT. That's why these things are called heat engines. The heat is where ALL of the energy comes from. If you boil water you get expanding steam. But that doesn't mean the kinetic energy of the steam is a magical source of extra energy unrelated to the heat you've been pumping into the water. The energy of the heat has been transferred into the kinetic energy. Once again, CONSERVATION of energy.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
I can give you example after example. Take a Sterling engine powered solar panel. The energy comes from the solar radiation. THERMAL. It is captured by the Sterling engine and transformed into kinetic energy. Which is then converted into electrical energy by a generator.
The fact that the source of the energy is thermal does not mean that the kinetic energy is a loophole. It doesn't come from an unknown source. The entire process is entirely understood and accounted for.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Yes indeed. YouTube, in their imminent wisdom, consistently responds to mass flagging campaigns by removing the attacked videos without so much as looking at them. We've seen it happen way too many times.
And when they're questioned about it? The response, of course, is that *every* flagged video is reviewed individually by a "specially trained" member of the "content review team" before any action is taken.
Yeah... right.....
anmoose 2 years ago
Think of it this way.. You either have consumable (usable) energy or the kinetic energy from the combustion of hydroxy(l) gases as a fuel.
If you rely solely upon the Law of thermal dynamics you are sadly mistaken. Thermal meaning heat. There is the kinetic energy that is released as well. which you do not account for. This kinetic energy is used is it not? AHH but wait is there more?
Correct yourself and your ass-ertions.
factor it all together. Then speak.
otherwise shutup.
whiterican74 2 years ago
"There is the kinetic energy that is released as well"
I'm sorry, you think that thermal dynamics leaves a loophole for kinetic energy? What drives this kinetic energy? It wouldn't be heat.. would it?
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
what I am really getting at is you are looking only at the HOD. Not the effects inside the ice. Extra energy? give me a break. Do you not understand that all things are interconnected. Energy thus is fluid like water, or electricity.. It is not taken from one thing to the next. An HOD is a pebble being dropped into the water generating an effect over multiple systems. wave starts small and isolated then spreads effecting more of an area. Perhaps you think the atom does not have additional
whiterican74 2 years ago
effects on the surrounding environment when it's energy is released. In essence creating a small chain of energy releases from different substances. Talk all the trash you want about it but the proof is there for all to see. Stay stuck in your little world. your choice. as Shakespeare put it. "There are more things in Heaven and earth Horiatio Than is dreamt of by your philosophies. Forgive the scramble but you now the meaning.
whiterican74 2 years ago
"Stay stuck in your little world"
It's called reality. The fantasy world inside your mind may have no limits, but it also has no bearing on the world that exists OUTSIDE your head.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"what I am really getting at is you are looking only at the HOD."
Oh no, you said thermodynamics doesn't include kinetic energy.
That's a ridiculous statement to make. Thermodynamics has its origins in the beginnings of the steam engine. The first combustion engine. OF COURSE thermodynamics is concerned with kinetic energy.
And now you respond by quoting me SHAKESPEARE and trying to get all mystical by talking about ripples in a pond?
NomadSoul76 2 years ago 2
"Do you not understand that all things are interconnected"
Oh, I do. That's why I know that the kinetic energy doesn't come out of thin air. You on the other hand suggested that the kinetic energy that comes from burning fuel is unrelated to the heat and unaccounted for in the math of thermodynamics.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago 2
good comment i like hho torches but cant stand hho gas saver cults
NOBOX7 2 years ago
"Energy thus is fluid like water"
Yeah, and the HHO generation system is pissing away roughly three quarters of the energy it takes in, only returning a fraction of what it draws.
You want analogies? Okay, instead of a pond let's use a bath tub. You're getting your ripple by sucking water out of it and spitting it back in from a height. Only your plumbing is so bad that most of the water leaks out before it comes back in.
I think in short order you're left with an empty bath tub.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
with a very primitive consumer grade apparatus I am able to get into the 50% range ... specifically, it takes roughly 1200 watts to power the electrolysis device that generates the HHO gas used to power a 3.5hp engine that spins an alternator from which 600 watts can be drawn ... so while your argument is valid, the performance is a bit better than you think even with the most primitive of experimental apparatus ... and I believe additional improvement in performance can be made ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
with a very primitive consumer grade apparatus I am able to get into the 50%
if this was directed at me i beleave you the primacy effect is possibly cloading my judgment im honest enough to say that
cognitif disonence never ,i disagree out of recalection,not speculation or stuberness
my extrapelation may be flawed id be a fool to say other wise but im not impossible to convince you know i do have an hho torch,im not noking that
why would i nok mpg hho for mo reason
NOBOX7 2 years ago
"with a very primitive consumer grade apparatus I am able to get into the 50% range"
Those numbers look a bit suspect. 50% efficiency of the water splitter alone is a rough maximum. For the engines, quick research suggests a thermodynamic limit of 37%, with 20% as more of an average number, but I'll give you 50%.
So, one water splitting loss of 50%, one engine loss, reduce the total by 50% again. You're down to 25% and we haven't even considered generator losses.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
my "water splitter" operates at roughly 120% of Faraday ... no, not over unity, but certainly over Faraday ... I do not split water directly ... I encourage a chemical reaction where potassium splits the water ... dilute solution of KOH with roughly 20-40 grams per gallon of distilled water ... think electroplating, not electrolysis ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
"my "water splitter" operates at roughly 120% of Faraday ... no, not over unity, but certainly over Faraday"
The best numbers I could find for high powered industrial electrolysis units were around 70%. I doubt you're operating with that kind of scale of efficiency.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
opinion noted ... but yes, it is indeed over Faraday and performs reliably for very long duration at that level ... and it is a remarkably simple device the design of which has been made available at no charge for anyone to replicate that might be interested ... Faraday was broken some years back and is sort of like the sound barrier at this point ... there are others working with devices much more efficient than my own ... mine is typical these days ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
I should be more complete in this response. When I run my device at very low output levels I am able to achieve 120% of Faraday. But productivity suffers. When I run it flat out as hot as I can run it, the device puts out 20 lpm volumes but efficiency is in the toilet, 70-75% Faraday. To run my small engine, I use a mid range setting where I produce roughly 7 lpm of volume at about 70F using roughly 1200 watts ... only a tiny bit over Faraday by maybe 2-7% ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
you are making a very reasonable argument. it is quiet nice to have a discussion with some one of the the opposite opinion in a civilized fashion.
your quick research is correct but that is where us hho researchers differ. put your theories to the test. you may be very suprized with what you discover.
BruteForcENGINEering 2 years ago
yes, this fellow NomadSoul presents reasonable questions, sensible critique and seems intelligent enough to state his arguments without a dependence on foul language ... discourse of this type is helpful and will force us to be better about our data collection and reporting methods ... there is no fear of responsible critical review within this "cult" ... we welcome it ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
is your 50% eff with a high compression head or with the stock 8:1 head.
BruteForcENGINEering 2 years ago
I ran into trouble getting reliable ignition when I tried the high compression head so the experimental results presented refer to the stock 8:1 compression. HHO conducts electricity and under high compression tends to short out the ignition spark. Higher compressions should yield better performance but we will need a more energetic spark to get reliable detonation of the fuel. D3adp001 is working on this and we hope to have a solution soon.
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
"Energy thus is fluid like water...."
No. Energy is an ability, not a thing.
Desertphile 2 years ago
The most incredulous burden I see here is the lack of educated proof beyond the mere spouting of a Law. especially a law that deals with only one form of energy contained within an element of choice. Heat and the equilibrium of it alone. What of light, kinetic, or even the electromagnetic or nuclear forces therein? equate all of them or none your choice.
Find out the total sum of energy applied and consumed then you have grounds to spout your law.
whiterican74 2 years ago
"Find out the total sum of energy applied and consumed then you have grounds to spout your law."
Okay okay, quick example for you. You put X amount of energy into water to split it into oxygen and hydrogen. This energy is equal to the amount of energy contained in the chemical bonds, plus extra energy consumed by unavoidable inefficiencies.
You burn the hydrogen and oxygen and you get that energy back. The potential chemical energy that you created is being collected once again.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Minus, that is, the inefficiencies that once again, cannot be avoided.
So in both phases you are losing energy through inefficiencies which are an unavoidable part of the system.
How is this helping? Where does the supposed extra energy come from? Are you saying that you get extra power from the chemical bond? That you only spend X amount of power in breaking the bonds, but when you reform them you get X plus Y energy back? where does Y come from?
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
wackos are wacky. False flaggins sucks.
PragmaticHeathen 2 years ago
i love flipping gay chicks! Is good to have some fun...love it!(and of course,that is NOT A THIRD WORLD!) Next is hurling blades of grass from opposing golf fans!
chick5581 2 years ago
He told me that E=mc2 was incorrect He then told Me physics were wrong I asked Him How it Work's and he said it Burns fuel differently
Eric Ride is A comment blocking fake
GodKillerAtheist 2 years ago
L.A.M.E. That's the best 4 letters in order to describe the behavior of these people. Ya know: its better to violate freedom of speech than take a legitament challenge of your beliefs.
getsmygoatseries 2 years ago
Well this just proves that 'EletrikRide' is an asshole.
noimw 2 years ago
"whats that tell us?"
Umm that they're creationists?
intelligentfalling 2 years ago
i have been hit twice form vote bots there ass holes freedom of speech is under attack every were it seems theses days...
CiphersSon 2 years ago
love the video responses!
rednecktrucker1969 2 years ago
Hail satan
kegs666 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Mirror'd.
Also, GRAVITY!
thumbsdownman 2 years ago 3
Comment removed
thumbsdownman 2 years ago
Post this video as well as the video that was removed over at dramatube or Vloggerheads. It might be a few days, but I am making a video about flagging and YouTube's screwed up implementation of it. I would like to link to it as an example of how easy it is to censor people on YouTube.
If you don't want to open an account on either place, then with your permission I will post the video that was deleted on dramatube.
themaskedanalyst 2 years ago 2
Cool shirt! Three anarchy-signs in one...
tmafkap 2 years ago
man, now they start flagging about such bullshit? I think youtube should f**king check why a video got flagged before shutting it down. this system is just flawed out of its ass.
wonderpope 2 years ago
I can't get over how awesome your voice sounds with the sweet new mic xD. As per any time else DP, great vid, too true.
Ethrock 2 years ago
LOL! you are both in some kind of agreement! XD
Paxmax 2 years ago 2
Cool shirt.
What are the words forming the pentangle?
Cnidarious 2 years ago
i like your videos.
i wanna see more of your every day life..
im weird like that.
BrianJunglist 2 years ago
Unlike Hydroxy Researchers, naysayers are always rude!!
This proved that those naysayers are @!#$*&...
What's wrong with you, dude??
Can't you ask us in good manner??
Instead of insulting us,
Go, get a life...
afdhalatifftan92 2 years ago 2
afdhalatifftan92 said: Can't you ask us in good manner??
DP stated earlier that fiddling with the MAF / MAP sensor will lean out the burn, hence saving fuel at the expense of engine longevity.
You'll save as much with or without HHO device.
When HHO'ers can't deal with facing the facts... they will have to deal with ridicule.
Paxmax 2 years ago
Thank you for being positive in your comment...
According to my experience, playin' with MAF/MAP sensors wont make any difference to FE...
Except, decreased throttle response...
If I'm not mistaken, those sensors are used to reads "driver's mood".
It's used to ensure the engine give its power when needed.
Some said that Oxygen Sensor are the most powerful sensor that control the FE...
I didn't confirm this yet.
What ya think??
Have a nice day...
afdhalatifftan92 2 years ago
I have been running the engine with the lambda probe disconnected for a while now (the devices waterproof seal is broken, and rain makes the engine run a little erratic).
But, YES, fiddling with the lambda probe will also affect fuel mixture to some extent within certain limits. With it disconnected the engine seems to run fine, reverting to some safe predescided values I guess.
Paxmax 2 years ago
"Unlike Hydroxy Researchers, naysayers are always rude"
The truth often stings.
Desertphile 2 years ago
"The truth often stings."
In this case it's down right painful... :)
mobiltec 2 years ago
I thought the truth are always sweet...
afdhalatifftan92 2 years ago
Yeah, the poor deluded fraudsters live in denial land all day long.... cuz evidence it's not their game.
Another fine vid DP!
Paxmax 2 years ago
Re-Uploaded.
dechha1981 2 years ago 2
Is it sad that I really want to see you without a hat on?
SomewhereInTheGray 2 years ago 2
There has been a lot of false flagging going on and apparently it seems to be spreading at an incredible rate. Not cool at all.
Roew 2 years ago
I'll mirror your video.
What is the status on the video that got hit with a DMCA?
OrionSyndicate910 2 years ago
i'll let you figure it out
djancak 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
No he isn't, and no it doesn't show....he is a nice guy and as far as I can tell, and I tried a few things, the numbers that he shows are reproduce able. Besides that, if he was a fraud, then why is he not arrested yet? Why didn't his clients get him charged for fraud?
insAneTunA 2 years ago
He may be a nice guy? but you're both delusional if you believe the numbers are right. It's been calculated many times, it takes more energy to produce the HHO than what the HHO can supply back to the engine. Any reductions in fuel use are achieved by leaning the motor and can be done without the HHO device attached. This leaning process reduces power and can catastrophically damage the engine. It would be a wonderful world if all fraudsters were arrested instantly, sadly it never happens
UbeefHooked 2 years ago 3
I admit that hydroxy needs more power to produce...
But,
Does the "catalyst" effects of hydroxy on gasoline is calculated??
It also would be wonderful if all naysayers become more polite.... LOL!!
Be cool dude... Just ask your opinion...
afdhalatifftan92 2 years ago
"Does the "catalyst" effects of hydroxy on gasoline is calculated??"
It's not a catalyst. The sum total of oxygen and hydrogen injected from the splitter is exactly mixed, just enough to completely burn without interacting with the rest of the mixture. A catalyst is an entirely different concept altogether.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
I believe what is meant by the "catalyst" is the fast flame front speed of hydroxy...
I din't confirm this yet.
I just watch few online experiment videos...
They said that hydroxy fast flame speed enhance the combustion of gasoline dramaticly, even with small amount...
What you think??
afdhalatifftan92 2 years ago
"they said that hydroxy fast flame speed enhance the combustion of gasoline dramaticly, even with small amount..."
I get the point that you're forwarding what you've heard, not putting forth the argument yourself, but.. this is just another vague suggestion. Saying "it does something that makes the fuel burn better in some way".
We're still at the point where the explanation is the gasses are added, some magic occurs, and the result is increased efficiency. Not a satisfactory explanation.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
In any case we're back to the problem of an unending stream of post hoc attempts to come up with an explanation of how this stuff is supposed to work. As arguments are levied against it the explanation changes. I'm far more interested in the DP HHO challenge, or other attempts to provide for independent and verifiable testing of this concept. A convincing explanation would be one thing, a convincing demonstration quite another.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"They said that hydroxy fast flame speed enhance the combustion of gasoline dramaticly, even with small amount..."
It does not; nor are ANY of them willing to prove it does.
Desertphile 2 years ago
even if hho did enhance the burn of gas
people dont understand that the 18% efficiancy averageof an IC is related to heat losses and the second law of thermal dynamics witch stipulates not only is it impossible to get more out then put in but you cant even get back what you put in the amount of unburned gas has very little effect on mpg at current operation temps even if you burn all the gas you only stand to gain .5 to 1 % gain
and that would take over ten years to pay for its self,lol
NOBOX7 2 years ago
when I run the small engines on HHO my exhaust temps are only 200F where on gasoline under same load and at same RPM the exhaust temps are more like 600F ... now I really do not know for sure and can only give an educated guess ... but I think the HHO as a fuel is actually increasing the thermal efficiency of the small engine ... at least I have proven to myself that less energy is being wasted as heat in any case ... would love to have more eyes on it with other opinions to consider ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
well look at it like this hho is more flamable ,take a lighter and a try and burn a dollar bill thats rapped around a pipe
99% of the time it wont burn , so this describes the event in your engine wherin
small amounts of gas dont burn but with hho this may not be the case but for the most part the temp differance does play a role in the efficiancy eqaution but for the most part the specific heat may be the reason,any way im am willing to listen to any comments you have and i wont be a prik...
NOBOX7 2 years ago
"when I run the small engines on HHO my exhaust temps are only 200F where on gasoline under same load and at same RPM the exhaust temps are more like 600F"
I've brought this up before. If you're running them overlean and are causing detonation your exhaust will be cooler. How do your cylinder head temps look, comparatively?
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
actually when we run them over lean things get very exciting .. the results made for a fairly entertaining YouTube video set to the 1812 Overture for reasons it appears you might appreciate ...
highest temps I get are right at the exhaust port on the head of the engine ... gas=600-650F ... hho=200-240F ... these were long duration runs of 6 hours with 400 watt load on the generator at steady 3600 rpm ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
oh my ... I may have misinterpreted what you were asking ... the experiments I describe were run with just air and HHO ... no gasoline at all ... so yes, from your point of view that would be a pretty darn lean mix ... the engine runs with as lean as 10:1 air:hho but when you start putting a load on it, you need the mix closer to a 5:1 ratio ... I have been able to "flood" the engine causing it to stall by trying a 3:1 ratio ... so between 5 and 10 parts air to 1 part HHO is the range ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
i can back ssc up on this matter. the engine temps are way lower than running on hho vr gasoline. infact i have to remove all of the cooling shrouds on my little engine in an attempt to get the engine up to opperating temp.
if you run a gassoline engine lean you will actually raise the combution temp. this higher temperature is what actually leads to detanation. the tattel tale sign of of a lean gasoline ice is a white coating on the spark plug.
BruteForcENGINEering 2 years ago
You know very little of real world data. I built a vaporizer to find out how much fuel goes unburned, and posted the videos to show everyone. The gas in liquid form is only 50% utilized even at optimal injection.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
Sorry to burst your bubble but it is a well known engineering fact that 98% of the fuel injected into a cylinder is burned. the catalytic converter converts the rest. Now out of that 98%, maybe only 30%, at best, is utilized as work. The rest of the energy is lost to heat.
hhokiller 2 years ago
If your "Fact" is truly Fact then vaporizing fuel should have no effect on efficiency. I can Prove that it does. Keep believing everything you read and testing nothing like a good little boy.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
hahaa who are you talking to you are full of sht bro ive seen your vids and building a vaporizer doesent tell you sht you fool
and bty you dont even have the vid you described ,also geet is another scam dum ass brought to you by hho scammers
NOBOX7 2 years ago
actuaky its 60% and disels are higher i think like 70 to 80% ,any way how could building a vaporizer tell you this,i cant find that vid thats why i left bad comments
NOBOX7 2 years ago
You left bad comments because your an asshole. If you spent as much time building prototypes as you do being an asshole you might get something accomplished. All of my videos are posted on my page, I can't help you if your too stupid to look.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
my understanding is that this is the most reasonable theory being floated to explain the measured mileage gains ... its a chicken and egg type thing ... you can measure the increased fuel efficiency easily enough ... but the reasons for the increases require explanation ... those involved in that area of research have put forward the argument that the increase is due to more efficient combustion ... like any theory, its open to discussion ... for me, verdict is still out on this one ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
". those involved in that area of research have put forward the argument that the increase is due to more efficient combustion"
That's not an explanation or a theory. It's still saying "we add the gas, something happens, and the engine is more efficient".
Mind you when you look into it and see that most applications also require leaning the mixture I think the conclusion is obvious. They're running their engines leaner and are shortening the engine lives but saving fuel.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
it is a theory because it is an attempt to explain an observed phenomena ... it needs to be tested ... once it is tested and proven, it will no longer be a theory, but will be a fact ...
yes, leaning the mixture AND retarding ignition timing ... and in the more advanced work, direct water injection (ww2 mustang) and a high intensity spark ... these more advanced setups depend on custom computer controls beyond my skill level or understanding ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
You are wrong sir. I do not use any device other than my HHO cell on my van and several other cars. My results are very good usually averaging 30% increase in fuel economy on the highway.
Your understanding of "theory" is comical. I understand theory to be a postulation expressing an idea supporting the outcome. Theory will remain until the reason is nailed down.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"My results are very good usually averaging 30% increase in fuel economy on the highway. "
Take my challenge; become a multimillionaire.
Desertphile 2 years ago
"Theory will remain until the reason is nailed down."
It's statements like THIS that leaves me putting you into the crackpot territory with all the other HHO cultists. You like to talk science.. but your words.. they just don't quite work.
Theory is THE explanation. It's the highest level you get. It's not a temporary offering until the "reason" is worked out. It is the explanation of the phenomenon.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"Theory is THE explanation. It's the highest level you get."
Damn right; their hypothesis is that oxyhydrogen acts as a "catalyst" (that still cracks me up!) and makes atomized gasoline "burn faster." That ain't a theory--- for it to be a theory they would first have to observe it happening.
Desertphile 2 years ago
You are a seriously screwed up person if you think theory is fact. Just look up the definition of theory. The theory that the earth was round was theory until it was proven then it was fact. FACT is the highest level you get. I could care less about theory.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"The theory that the earth was round was theory until it was proven then it was fact."
Nothing in science is PROVEN, except in mathematics. You still do not understand the basic philosophy of science, I'm afraid, and are trying to bluff your way past areas in which you are ignorant.
Science does not have absolute certainty. It only has degrees of certainty. A theory is an idea that started out as a hypothesis, was put to tests capable of disproving it, and was instead supported.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
And then it was changed to reflect new understanding...
onecraftydude 2 years ago
A fact is simply a measurement, a single data point. Such as "it is 70 degrees outside", or "the motor is running at 5,000 rpm". That is a fact.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"FACT is the highest level you get"
It absolutely is not. Let me explain. Free falling objects accelerate at a rate of 9.8 meters per second per second. That is a fact.
But why? Gravity. But do we understand gravity?
We do not. We understand WHAT it does, but not the mechanism under which it does what it does.
We have the fact. But we still have much to learn. There is a LOT higher of a level to reach.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Another example I like to use is string theory. It's not really a theory at all, because it cannot be tested yet. It would explain things we've observed if it were true, but until a way can be found to test it it cannot truly be termed a theory. It's more of a hypothesis. The fact that it fits current observations isn't enough, a way needs to be found to test it that makes it possible to disprove it if it's not correct.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
Again, you seem to be rambling. The device working in a vehicle is what I have. After you have witnessed it or someone you trust has, you will be free to explain why it works. All I can do is offer up a theory as to why it works. I think having something working is much better than a theory.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
Do you realize how crazy what you just said is?
onecraftydude 2 years ago
I thought you had some intelligence until I saw you state theory is fact. I realize this is hard for you to grasp, but that doesn't make it any less real. I am ready to show off my system as soon as a prize is offered that is not a scam.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
Speaking of someone's words not quite working.... You seem to be a bit tongue tied trying to explain your understanding of science. I am quite comfortable in what i know because I back up my claims with testing. I would be willing to bet that almost every one of the naysayers have no technical abilities and only know about science through books. That is great if you want to be a teacher, but if you are trying to accomplish something you need skills.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"I am quite comfortable in what i know because I back up my claims with testing"
Your own fallible testing, judging by your understanding of the scientific method I have little faith in your testing methodology. Once again, there's the randi website, go apply.
You won't like the results though.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
I'll repeat my earlier statement. "you waste three quarters of the energy the process uses to make a tiny amount of hydrogen and oxygen, you add that to the engine, something unexplained happens, and the mileage goes up" is NOT a theory. And everything offered up to try to explain it has been merely a post hoc rationalization formed in response to skeptical protests. I've watched the explanations evolve as the questions were asked.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
me to when they figured out every one wasnt stupid enough to beleave the alternater sht they swithced to this catylist crok of sht,ya they evolve all write
NOBOX7 2 years ago
You should have stayed in school.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
You have been sidestepping the issue. I have said that I get results from HHO alone using no electronics. Explain that? I don't want to hear why it is impossible, I am past that. Even if you can't accept what I am telling you, try and explain what I am doing.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"Explain that? I don't want to hear why it is impossible, I am past that."
That's great that you are past that, the rest of us are going to need concrete evidence. It's easy to fool yourself.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
All right," onecraftydude " so you are going to take the Desertphile Challenge, Cool.
You have been to the web page, so you know what you have to do.
I will shut down my business for a few days, and make the all day drive so I can witness the test. I will have the $1,000.00 cash in my pocket, it will be yours if you win the Desertphile Challenge.
Note: My prize $ is independent of the Desertphile Challenge,
I am looking forward to the trip.
noimw 2 years ago
you got it ingeneers know this so to avoid
constant maintnents they do things a sertan way
NOBOX7 2 years ago
WOW, hooked on phonics worked for you. I am sure the scientific community is behind you 100% since you obviously have a grasp on the english language.
I almost feel bad making fun of an obviously illiterate person, but you make no qualms attacking me and my work. At least TRY and make a coherent argument in the future.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
your a con man what does science have to do with you ,and yes i am obviosly iliterate you powers of observation are of the charts,first of you must relize your lip started this,i commented on what a mechanic told me and stated this was the sorce of the data and your briliance swooped in and saved the day by saying
"you have no clue as to real world data "
lol,your a hoot bro whats it like being a complete shmuk ,hay did i spell smuk write you twerp
NOBOX7 2 years ago
How do you explain the ones that do not use electronics?
onecraftydude 2 years ago
I am "willing". I am also married and trying to start a business and working on multiple experiments. I am also busy getting ready for the biggest HHO event in history this weekend. If my partners think it is worthwhile to drive to the middle of nowhere and take your crappy challenge I will drive out there or send a customer by there to pick up the money.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"If my partners think it is worthwhile to drive to the middle of nowhere and take your crappy challenge I will drive out there or send a customer by there to pick up the money."
Oh don't act coy. You know you're not going to take it.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
"Oh don't act coy. You know you're not going to take it."
Eric Krieg: $1,000 prize remains uncollected for five years, if I recall correctly.
JREF: $1,00,000 prize for the first person showing "HHO" increases MPG by any significant amount (i.e., greater than testing error bars).
If I were these clowns I would show up at Randi's house and demand that my device be tested.
Desertphile 2 years ago
"JREF: $1,00,000 prize for the first person showing "HHO" increases MPG by any significant amount (i.e., greater than testing error bars)."
Really? That's hilarious, I suggested to eletrikride (he started pm-ing me and we had a bit of a discussion) that Randi might be an appropriate person to plan a reliable test for HHO claims, but I didn't know if he really handled stuff like this. I think of him more for supernatural debunkings.
NomadSoul76 2 years ago
I have already told "eletrikride" and a half-dozen of his idiot ilk in YouTube to contact Randi and the JREF, and to watch the YouTube video from "Money Matters" where Randi stated their claims qualify for the one million dollars..... and they IGNORED me. Imagine--- ignoring one million dollars, and they insist they cannot get funding for their devices. Crock of shit!
Desertphile 2 years ago
if the 1 million still exists I will gladly take their money. If I drive to New Mwxico or wherever you are it will cost me about the same as the prize money plus a couple of bucks. I am ready to drive out there and claim the 2 k from you and noimw so if the million can be available at the same time thats great. Let me know if they can do the test at the same time and I am there. Noi need to pussy foot around, if the money is real I am ready to go.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
Eric Kreig has not answered me. The JREF does not have any information on HHo.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
"The JREF does not have any information on HHo." --- That is because there is no such thing as "HHO." If you are interested in the million dollars, write to Randi and state what claims you apply to your oxyhydrogen device, if any.
Desertphile 2 years ago
I did what you suggested and once again was met with denial. He told me to patent it and make a million. I told him I already did patent it. He said HHO does not apply to his challenge.
This is common with all of the naysayers, they use a huge amount of money to draw attention to themselves never intending to pay out a penny.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
@onecraftydude ok man email me iwill let you come and ride in my truck
luckieone2 1 year ago
do the math an average car consumes 300 cfm of air so at 2 liters a min as most cells produce at around 300 watts and you will see that the amount of hho per ignitoin stroke is .02 % hho does nothing at such lean ratios .02 percent friend thats 2 hundreths of 1 %
NOBOX7 2 years ago
thus I can agree but as you say most at 300w. not all do so poorly. And most of those are not very well engineered or thought out. This stuff is period in its infancy as is Fusion research. But the potential for more is still there. realistically never is a thing achieved without obstacles being overcome. And there is still more energy that is in a molecule that has the potential of being utilized yet is unaccounted for by most and why is that? i guess I am talking gibberish, goodnite
whiterican74 2 years ago
ya id agree on the jibberish part you see
i didnt even get into hydrogen embrittlement ,,how do you explain the obviuos flaw in all this hydrogen fks metal up so any savings will be lost bying a new engine,also alternaters are onl 40 % efficiant so good luk friend i hope the second law is breakable but as it stands
im not convinced for many reasons so sorry i commented on hho again its a bad habbit of mine
NOBOX7 2 years ago
"how do you explain the obviuos flaw in all this hydrogen fks metal up so any savings will be lost bying a new engine"
Fortunately for the clowns who use these devices, the amount of hydrogen is so tiny that it doesn't effect the engine at all.
Desertphile 2 years ago
i beleave you, seeing as i have no good info on the tolerance of these statments
but i have studied the subject and was convinced by what i saw thier are u tube
vids on this subject also and radarman
showed me some info as well,i was assuming the valve stem would go first
but i admit this is speculation ,i just dont like the hho cults they dont beleave in physics,they cant even measure thier output gas write ,not one has a vid describing vapor pressure,i like the torches thats it
NOBOX7 2 years ago
agreed ... the HHO torch could be a viable commercial product now as it was in the early 1900's ... however, the process of getting stickers from Underwriter Labs and OSHA is long, contorted and very expensive ... EBN has four products of this type being processed now ... it may be a year before the "authorities" grant us their permission to offer you one for sale ... but we will get there eventually ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
just so you no the .5 to 1 % is probobly speculation the mechanic who told me this seems like the type to be full of sht half the time but it does sound about what one would expect,and i agree IC inefficiancy is a heat issue and paracitic losses issue the valve train alone probobly uses12 % of the output power maybe more ,im speculating agian of coarse,im intrested in your opinoin on this angle
NOBOX7 2 years ago
yes, I have buried four small engines with honors over the years due to valve stem failure while running them on 100% HHO ... this is a materials problem that can be solved ... development continues using substandard consumer grade off the shelf sacrificial engines ... its the best we can afford for now ... but our methods are improving ... its a long learning curve but we are making rapid progress in the safe, efficient production, delivery and use of the gas as a fuel ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
agreed ... I keep hearing about this catalyst thing going on and I have some trouble with it ... the chemistry of it escapes me ... but I have done long duration stationary engine tests where a carefully measured volume of HHO was introduced along with a fixed volume of gasoline and run times at steady RPM monitored ... I got best results when about 20% of the total fuel ingested was HHO ... I am looking now for someone to replicate this experiment to see if similar results can be obtained ...
SmartScarecrow 2 years ago
You sound like you know what your talking about, sort of.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
You are wrong. I show results of 30% all the time in my van. My son's car just showed 50% on a trip from fl to Mo a week ago. My wifes car is around 25% since she drives short trips. I have even gotten 100% improvement in my van, but cannot replicate the conditions that lead to that mileage yet. Still, I can handle 30%.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
It would not be hard to shut us up. Im sure a local dealership or speed shop would give you access to thier facilities to prove your statements, probably for free or a small cost. And you could invite the local news channel down to film it. Can you do that? You dont have to drive anywhere except across town and then post the results with names and phone numbers of the shop and news crew. "Winner, winner, chicken dinner" as they say in Vegas
hhokiller 2 years ago
then why is your broke ass waisting time with na sayers you dont act like a gie who tells the truth you are an hho scammer pall ha haa stop sending me messages
i dont like lyers,and to say 50% of the gas in a car is unburned is total falicy ya real world data hu where the fk you get your info,o yA your dumm ass built aq vaporizer and posted the video,well all i seen was a bucnh of scam bullsht
onecrafty asshole
NOBOX7 2 years ago
You are wrong. As I have stated before my system is not using any electronic devices and I am getting 30-50% increases on the highway.
Feel free to stand on theory and bash the efforts of hard working enthusiasts like myself while you recline in your comfortable chair. In the meantime some of us have work to do.
onecraftydude 2 years ago
exactly.
djancak 2 years ago
I saw the video, what was so inappropriate? did you say fuck more than 100 times? I don't think so...
AbdultheImpailler 2 years ago
LMAO! If the product works then why is it not on the new "Green" vehicles. This HHO technology has been in the making for 30 + years now right?
Took less time to make an Ipod Nano.
CptUnknown 2 years ago 4
Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even punished.
The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself, its leader(s) and members (for example, the leader is considered the Messiah, a special being, an avatar—or the group and/or the leader is on a special mission to save humanity).
The group has a polarized us-versus-them mentality, which may cause conflict with the wider society.
The group is:
preoccupied with bringing in new members & with making money.
CHECK
djancak 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
you are not censored, your comment was rude and not accepted. If you where able to give a decent comment it would get accepted. Your behavior is wrong, and I wonder what it takes to make it clear for you so you can understand that you should take a good look in the mirror and ask yourself what the hell you are doing....but that is just my opinion. Desert....being skeptical is something else then being rude, unlike you, most other people do have a live and are social human beings with feelings.
insAneTunA 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I also think that you should apologize to Eletrikride and all other youtubers for your wrong behavior. It is alright to disagree with things, but it is wrong to attack people on personal grounds.
insAneTunA 2 years ago
I disagree, DP wasn't being unfairly rude, in a video, on his channel. People like Eletrikride were being arrogant and instead of proving their devices work they either wanted people to prove they don't work, by buying one first or wanting DP to waste his money to see them and in all fairness, if the devices worked they could drive to see him, which would be evidence they worked.
anonbehell 2 years ago