@Theo2kitty Interesting name. :) I usually try to relate my character's personality to their name's meaning. Let's take yours; Sayge, or sage stick, something strong smelling used in religious rituals and Andrews; Andrew means manly. Is there any relation? Still, I like the name. :)
've been thinking about this recently. In my work, the main character does something most people aren't going to like. The story starts off that way, so the first thing people will see about this character is the bad thing she's done. When I read, I mostly have complaints about main characters who whine or moan or complain in their narrative through the whole thing. How would you balance out the negative nellies? How can they explore emotion without the automatix "emo" card placed on them?
@MelinaPendulum U say mindreading iz a sue affiliated trait, but what if the reason she has these powers is because most characters in the book hav mindpowers & that's the type of power the story is based on:)?
Other names in my book. They range from completely normal 2 to kinda odd: Monroe (nickname. Also the characters last name), Chase (short for Charisse... His parents wanted a girl), Le Anne, Klay, Andreus (name he usually goes by is Andrew though), jacquelin aka Jackie, Reiko, Sienna, Mira short for Mirabela, Alyx, the twins Nicholas & Asher (Nick & Ash), & Cutter (this is the really odd one, I think imma change it)
Is the name Roxalyn Mary-sue-ish? Thats my characters name. I try to give mostmy characters names that r normal but more uncommon but I made up Roxalyn though. I looked it up... It's a wall sinkDX.
Some of my characters have unusual names but that's because a) it's a fantasy and some of my main characters are elves
b) There names match their ethnic background. For example on of my characters, a knight, kept appear to me with a rather Gaelic appearance, and in the sort of timeframe that my story is set in people's names were linked to their family's profession. Because of that his name is Gaelic for 'Noble warrior'
On the topic of powers, even if the character had a cool power, it should be really weak when he/she gets that power and then it should grow stronger with the character and not be overly powerful.
& this book called about a boy by nick hornby (also a movie... SO. FREAKIN. FUNNY.) does it really well. Marcus is a loser cuz his mom is a depressed hippie who sends him 2 school w/ hideous clothes & an ugly hair cut, & he sings aloud in class. His nerd friends even dump him he gets teased so much
Harry potter has a tragic situation but its done really WELL. Like the dursleys h8 him cuz they think hes a a freak. He has no friends & school cuz dudley will kill any1 who is nice 2 harry
@Maikkacrackshiper13 cindarella, oliver twist, peter pan, tom sawyer, huckleberry finn, pippy, david copperfield, the kids in Narnia, snowwhite, Lemony Snicket, etc. they are free to run amok, opportunity to authors for adventures. their mischievous self-sufficiency is probable without the supervision.
My characters have some very weird names but that doesn't make them Mary Sues. What makes a character a Mary Sue is how they are presented and characterized as well as what they're place is within the story. I'd go into more detail but I don't think I have enough room.
Why are Sarah/Amy/Sasha Sue names ? I'd like to hear why because to me they are average. I mean, a lot of girls are named Sarah and Amy ( not Sasha, though).
Sarah/Sasha/Amy etc are all mary-sue names. I alsi hate when people make fanfics of anime and dont use names within the theme, like DBZ the saiyans all have vegetable names but fancharacters have names like nick or Xicor or stupid shit.
I don't mind self-inserts if well-written, I can't stand it when the author does it ALL the time though. Like SMeyer.
I think what causes a char to be a Mary Sue is simply bad writing. It doesn't matter if the character is the opposite of you or similar to you, but if they are badly-written, then they can be Sues.
Meh, I don't have problems with people inserting themselves or Sues into a story, just when they put it in writing. Especially when the Sue falls in with the evil-canon group. Drives me insane.
Is Mizzy or Eden a mary-sue name? My fanfic character. I'm starting slow in writing and doing fanfiction first, then when I go to college (I wanna be an author) I'll come up with my own characters and my own plot.
Even better is when people destroy themselves and cry and whine about it even though they are given every chance in the world to save themselves and they spend that time crying about the fact that they still may not get to make themselves better! I tell them how I had to put up with foster care for 5 years and they say my life was nowhere near as bad as theirs for how they didn't get the xbox games they wanted because their parents couldn't afford 90 bucks for a game -_-'...
Ok my main characters name is Anais.I know this sounds like a Mary Sue name,but it's set in an alternate universe.It is not in the real world.I think this is exceptable.As for the name Ruby,that isn't too horrifically Sue.Anyway,great vid!This definitely explains Sues.
Wrote a short story of a hamster named Kenji and his owner named Elena. Elena is a whiny preppy person, But I really don't think it's a sue. If her name was Britney than she would be. Any ideas?
@PhoenixoftheLabyrnth The last name Desler is OK,but no sane parent would name their child Phoenix.Is he/she part of a fantasy setting,casue in realistic fiction this would not work at all.
Depends. What are PDs powers? Does PD make mistakes? Do other characters call PD out on his/her bs? Are PDs eyes described as jewels? If PD is male, does he get all the girls? If female does PD get the hot guys and is still a virgin and waiting for twoo wuv? If you answered yes to any of these questions, it's best to re-evaluate your character.
This is a brilliant video. Whenever I read a book I love a character that isn't one-sided. I like complexity in my characters, with some development throughout the story, and your tips have helped me with my writing, even though it's just a hobby. I love these writing videos, please keep them going! xxx
in house of night series theres a mary sue the main character zoey redbird has the best powers of controllings all the elements and has 3 bfs at a time and i hate her, but theres another character who has visions but they make her bleed from her eyes, shes a bitch and only has one lover and i rekon she is the best character.
I hate it when ppl don't give REAL names. Like I am reading this story were the title is named "Keepr" and at th same time the character is named Keeper.There is confusing flashbacks and the scene gets repeated! It's really weird..
You put down the good points about sues. the thing is, I have characters that flamers flame the heck out of me before they even get to know them. some trolls even use the term sue on an OC because they love to abuse it just to get some people on their nerves. as long as the OC is believable in a certain fandom, the character is fine. so you make good good points. *thumbs up*
I noticed that this video has a clip repeated at the end with the power (the buggers coming out of their eyes) and the normal/average mary sue. Thought you might want to edit that or something. ;P
I have a star named Veissade Saggitarius Kaliphonus. I made it up, but that is kind of Mary Sue ish because she's royalty. HOWEVER, she drowns and people call her Sadie. What do you think?
@angel2mosha Go with it mate. If you love the name enough, then just use it. Creating a new name can be fascinating; I created "Tarklovishki" as a last name for one of my own characters. If you love ... um (God, I wish my copy-paste thing was working :P) ... Veissade Saggitarius Kaliphonus enough, there should be nothing keeping you from using it. Or you could try and anagram names if you want? But I say stick with the original name.
Hi Melina, I've already posted a comment on one of your vids but this one is really worth it. So I'm making a book ( I know I'm really young but I'm at Chapter 5 ) and my main character name is Matilda Knox and her bruv Lennox. Are they Mary Sue-ish? Because I'm really doubting on her personnality ( she is a Mary Sue but I'm working on her personnality hard: I wanna make her a bit like my friend) but don't worry for Lennox: he's your teenage/brat. Thanks if you response me !
@JRockGrrl If they have those abilities JUST to be extra speshulful, then yeah. But if it's part of who they are, like if they're an opera singer or have loved ballet since forever, then it's perfectly fine. But those traits have to be important to the character, not just brought up out of nowhere (Ex: Oh by the way, even though it was not hinted at all earlier and does nothing for the story except make me look good, I can sing better than Sarah Brightman and I never had to take any lessons!)
Have you seen Fruits Basket (I'm kinda assuming cause of the Inuyasha and Bleach items :))? If so what's your stance on Tohru cause I've always felt she was a Mary-Sue but still liked her?
Is naming them after historical (mostly philosophers and authors in my case) figures ok? I've done it with all my characters to give a hint on their outlook on life, not hugely famous surnames though.
Does moving really count as a tragic situation? I mean sure it may be difficult for some people, but it's not exactly a tragedy. Can I get away with having a character move at the start if they do not complain about it too much?
I have a character who has a tragic life, but she's a supporting character, and I'm worried that I may make her the star of the show from her past, what should I do to not let a side character have the spotlight but still be a big role in the story?
If a Mary Sue gains super powers, she can't control them. She makes a lot of mistakes like bursting with powers when she shouldn't or something else. But everybody will say 'OMG, she is very very powerful even if she is a beginner'. Isn't it a bit anime-like :P ?
Actually I judge a book by it's cover, title, and then the summary (in that order). If i'm unsure of the summary, I check the themes it covers where are the copyright BS is located.
I'm likethis with you on the name bit, I feel the same way. I was actually creating a story and almost made this angsty girl named Raven and I had to catch myself.
what makes a sue is not what their name is, or what they look like, or their "abilities". What makes a sue is how all the other characters and the environment react to them.
I have characters with names like Emer, Luinae, Feolan, etc. But the whole entire freaking world has names like that because it is a Celtic/Welsh based fantasy world. It is weird in this world, but not in mine.
I feel main characters being orphans is being overdone to death - in my own fiction I try to avoid it (or at least try not to have them orphans from the start). I think it better to have the parents die DURING the story as it makes for a great source of conflict & opportunity for character development. Don't get me wrong, it's fine for main characters to be orphans, but it's just getting really overdone.
Anyway thanks so much for these videos! You give such great advice for aspiring writers.
@Jianlibao I have one character who's an orphan but I actually have a reason for her being an orphan. i hate the fact that most people are like yeah their orphans they don't know their parents etc. they kinda rush through it. Some don't even explain why their orphans. >.< leaves me confused did the parents die were they left on a porch etc.. Totally agree with you though it is getting overdone.
When main characters have Mary-Sueish names, it doesn't really bother me. It's when the main character AND their best friend have Mary-Sueish names that gets to me. I can buy that one person named their kid Ever,. I can't believe that one person named their kid Ever, and that another person named their kid Haven, and Ever and Haven happen to eventually become friends. Uh-uh. It just doesn't happen.
I completly agree with the powers thing, Wings by aprilynne pike is a really good book, because when the main character started getting powers, she hated them. It made it such a more interesting book than if she loved them.
No it's not really Sue-ish in that case (the custom of naming girls after plants). Unless the "significance" you are talking about is some sort of great huge huge huge huge unveiling of the story (Like she is named after some powerful goddess or something).
I figure as long as there is a reason behind it it should be ok. For instance, the era your storyline takes place or where she lives. If she lives in Ireland or is born there, shouldn't be an issue. If she is from Kansas, no. If it takes place in the early times, then it is definitely fine.
It really has no time period, One of those fantasy's you can't pinpoint when it is. But her mother grew up in Ireland and is very into her heritage so she wanted to use it in the original form.
I'll have to work a bit on the loner thing ... There are thre things you've made me look especially on at my own story: Love affairs, the loner, male characters. Even if I think I have pretty good male characters, I think it needs to be shown more. And the loner thing ... Yea, need to work on that, too. And especially the love affair. I was already pretty unsatisfied with that one.
Very good rant. I just wish I could easily convince this girl on Deviantart that her characters are total Sues.... I explained it to her as nicely as I could, yet she makes excuses, trying to sugar coat things with facts that don't make her characters any less of a Sue....
I dunno, shes seems sort of new to posting anime fandom and stuff. Her username is Princess-Kiyoko. Shes a sweet kid, but she just doesn't understand when I try to explain these sort of things to her. She takes bits and pieces of ideas from other series and movies and incorperates them into her characters, having them make no sence at all... Mainly she'll use pokemon in just about ALL of her OCs stories. She changed one thanks to my criteria though.
Yeah, hopefully.... but lately shes been making non-stop excuses about everything and its getting to where it probably wouldn't matter if i TRIED to give the oppinion she asked for herself.
Another thing you can do in regards to powers is for every positive power they have, also have a consequence for them, that way their power is not limitless and may not be useful everytime.
I enjoyed your video very much. It gave great insight on developing a character. One thing I think you should know is that it starts repeating itself around 7:54 . That's the only thing.
It's not completely true. The magic powers in Harry Potter are scientifically impossible and the series aren't science-fiction at all.
Science-fiction is a distortion of our world or an exploration of plausible worlds from actual knowledge (scientific, technologic, ethnological, etc) Most of the time, its elements are credible and they are put in a certain way to appear plausible.
Hi Melina! I really admire your words of literature wisdom, so I'm coming to you for advice. i really don't want a sue, and I would love it if you could analyze my character and point out any sue-like qualities. If you are willing to help me out with this, please message me, if you don't have the time though, I understand :)
Oh, that thing about power, reminds me of Supernatural, the TV series. Sam, one of the main characters, he can see things that are about to happen, but he cant control it and it gives him headaches and stuff. All the other evil persons get like awsome powers, its funny, becuse hes power sort of sucks in comparison. Which is great, really. x)
I have a character who's mother was killed, she was adopted and when she found out, she was sad of course, but she didn't get depressed, she just moved on with her life.
Um, would names like Andromeda, Persephone, Theseus and other mythological names be considered a Sue name? I'm a huge fan of names like that or names like Spica or Draco and other star/astrological names but are they ruining my stories? I'm sorry if you're sick of comments like this.
I know I'm not the girl who made the video, but I thought I'd give my opinion.
As long as the name of the character fits the setting -- like, ALL of the characters have mythologically based names or something, it's fine. But having an Andromeda in a world of Carls, Johns, Megans and the like would be a bit detrimental xD
I'm not the author of the vid but I'd thought I'd offer advice. :D
Ethnic names can sometimes be tricky, like the author of the video said, if it has some sort of extreme deep meaning, or in most commonly made up "Japanese" names, have some sort of first or last name that frankly doesn't EXIST and they made it up for the purpose of a plot device.
But since you mentioned they are relatively common from their countries, I doubt it is a problem
So smart :)you're putting honey on my heart by your rant!
For me, personally,a merysue was always mostly recognizable by the way other characters reacted to her-she could be a bitch with snotty comebacks and no respect for others(and those ARE flaws, and really big ones too!)yet everyone would still like her and want to be around her(and if someone didn't,he or she would be the BAD guy)...WTF!?Seriously, who likes people who act like that?!It makes me SO mad!;_;(sorry for my english ^^')
First, I just want to say I love your videos - they're so helpful and entertaining. Also, please keep writing that series of yours, because I REALLY want to read it.
I just wanted to ask a question - is it mary-sueish to give a character an unusual name if you are creating a different world? Because it seems unlikely that people in a completely different world would have developed names like ours.
Great video. In addition to having over the top names, a lot of Sues have, like, five middle names because the author couldn't settle for just 2 pretty names. They had to have ALL OF THEM. Ah, Mary Sues. I hate them so. I HATE THEM SO MUCH. AAAARGH.
ahem
I'm thinking of making a video response to this with my own Mary Sue thoughts. I need to have a nice, long rant.
I like your videos and agree with a lot of your points, but I wonder why exactly 'Bella Swan' is a Mary-Sue. I personnally like her name: I don't think it's too exotic and apparently comes from Isabella. And she does have a lot of flaws: I suspect BDD since she's obviously a beautiful girl, yet has an extremely low self-esteem; she's very bad in dealing with something tragic(in new moon), she likes people just because they're beautiful, she can't stand up for herself,...
She has flaws, but are very treated as flaws. People think her clumsiness is cute, and all the 'bad' things about her either not acknowledged, or those who comment on them are treated at evil.
Actually, characters that are strikingly beautiful but think they're average or ugly looking are more Mary Sueish than character that know they're hot. That's because the author is trying to have it both ways: the character is 'modest' which is considered a virtue, and it's supposed to make readers sympathize with her. ( "Oh, the poor dear! She's beautiful, but doesn't notice how wonderful she is!") It can be treated like a flaw, but rarely is.
your comments scare me becuase my charecters have powers and they have a lot of them but for two it's gentic and for one it was an inentinal alteration of his DNA so i think i'm saved from sue i think and 2 hate the powers and one likes them so i still think i'm safe....
My character doesn't have really anyone to lean on because of her insane paranoia.
And yeah, she's going insane. And even though I'm doing it from her perspective, I personally think she's the antagonist and the person that doesn't like her is the protagonist.
But Mary, the protagonist, has a really good reason to hate her. She killed her brother, and he was her rock. She leaned on him. Now, she's going insane and having bubbling fury going in her mind.
I think that people would judge your character as a sue by her name in all honesty. I think that if you find a name that means a sin would be more affective.
Me and my friend are writing an Inuyasha fanfic with *gasp* an OC. We've been praised for our characterization of her. What do you think? xD (if you have time) It is uploaded to three sites, including MediaMiner org and Fanfiction net. The title is "Because of Tomomi".
Ok melina I have a massive problem here my villain well 1 of thenm is called heidi its based of someone i know and her aspects that make her a villain should I alter it because i noticed that meyer named one of her a heidi I am scared, thanks melina
Nice video! I attempt writing every now and then, as well, but I wanna know your opinion on one thing.
How do you feel about names that foreshadow something? Do you think it takes away from the story, or do you think it adds another thing for readers to think about? Because I am never content with naming a character something just because it sounds good.
Um names that foreshadow things are good as long as they are not tense overly exotic names. Also, last names are better for foreshadowing than first, imo
God, I hated Evermore. I didn't get past the first thirty pages. And you're right, the name says a lot. I'm glad to see whenever I take the Mary Sue Litmus Test, my characters usually score low. It makes me feel accomplished. ^-^
lol everyone in my story has weird names xD
sakurafire7 1 day ago
Throughout this whole video I was thinking about Maximum Ride. James Patterson did nearly everything you said not to do.
DestinyHollow 3 weeks ago in playlist Melina On Writing
I have a character named Sayge Andrews-I don't think it's a mary-sue name, but I'd like someone els's opinion. :)
Theo2kitty 1 month ago
@Theo2kitty Interesting name. :) I usually try to relate my character's personality to their name's meaning. Let's take yours; Sayge, or sage stick, something strong smelling used in religious rituals and Andrews; Andrew means manly. Is there any relation? Still, I like the name. :)
HufflepuffPrince 4 weeks ago
Would Sophia Reyes be a mary sue name?
TheresaCullen97 1 month ago
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've been thinking about this recently. In my work, the main character does something most people aren't going to like. The story starts off that way, so the first thing people will see about this character is the bad thing she's done. When I read, I mostly have complaints about main characters who whine or moan or complain in their narrative through the whole thing. How would you balance out the negative nellies? How can they explore emotion without the automatix "emo" card placed on them?
hotwhire 1 month ago
@MelinaPendulum U say mindreading iz a sue affiliated trait, but what if the reason she has these powers is because most characters in the book hav mindpowers & that's the type of power the story is based on:)?
Maikkacrackshiper13 1 month ago
So is Roxalyn to odd 4 this list? (there r real ppl named Roxalyn, but still)
Maikkacrackshiper13 1 month ago
Other names in my book. They range from completely normal 2 to kinda odd: Monroe (nickname. Also the characters last name), Chase (short for Charisse... His parents wanted a girl), Le Anne, Klay, Andreus (name he usually goes by is Andrew though), jacquelin aka Jackie, Reiko, Sienna, Mira short for Mirabela, Alyx, the twins Nicholas & Asher (Nick & Ash), & Cutter (this is the really odd one, I think imma change it)
Maikkacrackshiper13 1 month ago
Is the name Roxalyn Mary-sue-ish? Thats my characters name. I try to give mostmy characters names that r normal but more uncommon but I made up Roxalyn though. I looked it up... It's a wall sinkDX.
Maikkacrackshiper13 1 month ago
Saying that name has anything to do with mary-sue-ism is very superficial.
HatiChantheWolfHog 1 month ago
Would Edna Adler be a Mary Sue type name considering I'm writing her for Sherlock Holmes and she is the sister of Irene Adler?
Sing4ever9 1 month ago
Some of my characters have unusual names but that's because a) it's a fantasy and some of my main characters are elves
b) There names match their ethnic background. For example on of my characters, a knight, kept appear to me with a rather Gaelic appearance, and in the sort of timeframe that my story is set in people's names were linked to their family's profession. Because of that his name is Gaelic for 'Noble warrior'
ElfmaidOfMirkwood 3 months ago
@ElfmaidOfMirkwood Sorry for the typos, I'm half asleep right now and I didn't catch them until after I'd posted.
ElfmaidOfMirkwood 3 months ago
Is Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way a mary sue name? XD
ShawneeObsessed 3 months ago
@ShawneeObsessed LOL
InsaneBookReviewer 2 months ago
On the topic of powers, even if the character had a cool power, it should be really weak when he/she gets that power and then it should grow stronger with the character and not be overly powerful.
TheSilentArtist1 4 months ago
@TheSilentArtist1 or strong but with kryptonite
Ishta5 2 months ago in playlist Melina On Writing
& this book called about a boy by nick hornby (also a movie... SO. FREAKIN. FUNNY.) does it really well. Marcus is a loser cuz his mom is a depressed hippie who sends him 2 school w/ hideous clothes & an ugly hair cut, & he sings aloud in class. His nerd friends even dump him he gets teased so much
Maikkacrackshiper13 5 months ago
Harry potter has a tragic situation but its done really WELL. Like the dursleys h8 him cuz they think hes a a freak. He has no friends & school cuz dudley will kill any1 who is nice 2 harry
Maikkacrackshiper13 5 months ago
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@Maikkacrackshiper13 cindarella, oliver twist, peter pan, tom sawyer, huckleberry finn, pippy, david copperfield, the kids in Narnia, snowwhite, Lemony Snicket, etc. they are free to run amok, opportunity to authors for adventures. their mischievous self-sufficiency is probable without the supervision.
Ishta5 2 months ago in playlist Melina On Writing
Is it bad that i named my Charackter Alex Cooper?!
Whitney2022 6 months ago
I think going for any feel in particular makes a name bad. Let the character's name be what natural comes up for them.
LicoriceLain 6 months ago
Rose, Lily and Violet are all normal human names
1998sara 6 months ago
My characters have some very weird names but that doesn't make them Mary Sues. What makes a character a Mary Sue is how they are presented and characterized as well as what they're place is within the story. I'd go into more detail but I don't think I have enough room.
HatiChantheWolfHog 6 months ago
I wonder if their really is someone named Mary-Sue...
CookieMonsterPro2 7 months ago
Is the name Pace Page sue-ish?? D:
samaimdeda 7 months ago
Sesshomaru poster!
Powers need to function on a 'level up' system.
I really only write fanfiction, and even then I have ridiculous planning stages.
DragonArbock 7 months ago
@hotwhire
Why are Sarah/Amy/Sasha Sue names ? I'd like to hear why because to me they are average. I mean, a lot of girls are named Sarah and Amy ( not Sasha, though).
MyiaSweetIcyCupcake 7 months ago
Sarah/Sasha/Amy etc are all mary-sue names. I alsi hate when people make fanfics of anime and dont use names within the theme, like DBZ the saiyans all have vegetable names but fancharacters have names like nick or Xicor or stupid shit.
hotwhire 8 months ago
I don't mind self-inserts if well-written, I can't stand it when the author does it ALL the time though. Like SMeyer.
I think what causes a char to be a Mary Sue is simply bad writing. It doesn't matter if the character is the opposite of you or similar to you, but if they are badly-written, then they can be Sues.
paladindragoongirl18 8 months ago in playlist Melina On Writing
Meh, I don't have problems with people inserting themselves or Sues into a story, just when they put it in writing. Especially when the Sue falls in with the evil-canon group. Drives me insane.
LonelyShades 8 months ago
Is Mizzy or Eden a mary-sue name? My fanfic character. I'm starting slow in writing and doing fanfiction first, then when I go to college (I wanna be an author) I'll come up with my own characters and my own plot.
ElenaTheMonster 8 months ago
@ElenaTheMonster No. They're nice names though:3 So I think you're good.
Heh, my favorite musician's son's name is Eden:P
TheOwlking1996 8 months ago
Would Natalie Vace or Natalie Rosa be a MarySue?
yarvh00 9 months ago
Is Ciara (pronounced See-Ah-rah) Black a mary sue name?
lilyvsstar5 10 months ago
Even better is when people destroy themselves and cry and whine about it even though they are given every chance in the world to save themselves and they spend that time crying about the fact that they still may not get to make themselves better! I tell them how I had to put up with foster care for 5 years and they say my life was nowhere near as bad as theirs for how they didn't get the xbox games they wanted because their parents couldn't afford 90 bucks for a game -_-'...
nekonya96 10 months ago
Ok my main characters name is Anais.I know this sounds like a Mary Sue name,but it's set in an alternate universe.It is not in the real world.I think this is exceptable.As for the name Ruby,that isn't too horrifically Sue.Anyway,great vid!This definitely explains Sues.
Moondust72580 10 months ago
Comment removed
RisuchanX4 10 months ago
Wrote a short story of a hamster named Kenji and his owner named Elena. Elena is a whiny preppy person, But I really don't think it's a sue. If her name was Britney than she would be. Any ideas?
DjHamHam411 1 year ago
Okay so my charactor's name is Phoenix Destler. Mary Sue?
PhoenixoftheLabyrnth 1 year ago
@PhoenixoftheLabyrnth It's a pretty name, but kinda....
TheOwlking1996 1 year ago
@PhoenixoftheLabyrnth The last name Desler is OK,but no sane parent would name their child Phoenix.Is he/she part of a fantasy setting,casue in realistic fiction this would not work at all.
SnitchSeeker 1 year ago
@PhoenixoftheLabyrnth
Depends. What are PDs powers? Does PD make mistakes? Do other characters call PD out on his/her bs? Are PDs eyes described as jewels? If PD is male, does he get all the girls? If female does PD get the hot guys and is still a virgin and waiting for twoo wuv? If you answered yes to any of these questions, it's best to re-evaluate your character.
ZeroMyHero99 11 months ago
This is a brilliant video. Whenever I read a book I love a character that isn't one-sided. I like complexity in my characters, with some development throughout the story, and your tips have helped me with my writing, even though it's just a hobby. I love these writing videos, please keep them going! xxx
MissJeVeuxUnAventure 1 year ago
Mary-Sues and Gary-Stus and every other F'ing Sue annoys me...
Theo2kitty 1 year ago
in house of night series theres a mary sue the main character zoey redbird has the best powers of controllings all the elements and has 3 bfs at a time and i hate her, but theres another character who has visions but they make her bleed from her eyes, shes a bitch and only has one lover and i rekon she is the best character.
mary sues annoy me -___-
ZOified 1 year ago
@ZOified
Aphrodite. Loved her.
ZeroMyHero99 1 year ago
@ZeroMyHero99 woops left her name out, agreed shes epic
ZOified 1 year ago
I hate it when ppl don't give REAL names. Like I am reading this story were the title is named "Keepr" and at th same time the character is named Keeper.There is confusing flashbacks and the scene gets repeated! It's really weird..
123naruhina 1 year ago
This video made me give my two leads some of the most boring names, and I love it XD
Lythya 1 year ago
For one of my characters, I kept the first name to something a little mordern-day-ish "Leo" but made up a last name called "Tarklovishki."
Is that good?
HellAngelsBells 1 year ago
OMFG a Sesshoumaru poster o_o you are now my favorite person. oh and thanks for this MAry Sue video! :D it's very helpful
Stinaisachibi 1 year ago
You put down the good points about sues. the thing is, I have characters that flamers flame the heck out of me before they even get to know them. some trolls even use the term sue on an OC because they love to abuse it just to get some people on their nerves. as long as the OC is believable in a certain fandom, the character is fine. so you make good good points. *thumbs up*
SKandDPfangirl 1 year ago
I noticed that this video has a clip repeated at the end with the power (the buggers coming out of their eyes) and the normal/average mary sue. Thought you might want to edit that or something. ;P
pichu10176 1 year ago 4
@pichu10176 Yeah, not anymore ;p
MelinaPendulum 1 year ago
@MelinaPendulum Nope, still repeating at the end...
Zukosbaby13 4 months ago
I have a star named Veissade Saggitarius Kaliphonus. I made it up, but that is kind of Mary Sue ish because she's royalty. HOWEVER, she drowns and people call her Sadie. What do you think?
angel2mosha 1 year ago
@angel2mosha Go with it mate. If you love the name enough, then just use it. Creating a new name can be fascinating; I created "Tarklovishki" as a last name for one of my own characters. If you love ... um (God, I wish my copy-paste thing was working :P) ... Veissade Saggitarius Kaliphonus enough, there should be nothing keeping you from using it. Or you could try and anagram names if you want? But I say stick with the original name.
HellAngelsBells 1 year ago
Hi Melina, I've already posted a comment on one of your vids but this one is really worth it. So I'm making a book ( I know I'm really young but I'm at Chapter 5 ) and my main character name is Matilda Knox and her bruv Lennox. Are they Mary Sue-ish? Because I'm really doubting on her personnality ( she is a Mary Sue but I'm working on her personnality hard: I wanna make her a bit like my friend) but don't worry for Lennox: he's your teenage/brat. Thanks if you response me !
MyiaSweetIcyCupcake 1 year ago
@JRockGrrl If they have those abilities JUST to be extra speshulful, then yeah. But if it's part of who they are, like if they're an opera singer or have loved ballet since forever, then it's perfectly fine. But those traits have to be important to the character, not just brought up out of nowhere (Ex: Oh by the way, even though it was not hinted at all earlier and does nothing for the story except make me look good, I can sing better than Sarah Brightman and I never had to take any lessons!)
YeMightyDespair 1 year ago
Have you seen Fruits Basket (I'm kinda assuming cause of the Inuyasha and Bleach items :))? If so what's your stance on Tohru cause I've always felt she was a Mary-Sue but still liked her?
Iamjustherek 1 year ago
SESSHOMARU!!!!!
BlueDolphin2011 1 year ago
Is naming them after historical (mostly philosophers and authors in my case) figures ok? I've done it with all my characters to give a hint on their outlook on life, not hugely famous surnames though.
TheManchesterLass 1 year ago
@TheManchesterLass I guess that's okay. It's been done with "Lost" (e.g. John Locke; Rousseau; etc.) and nobody seems to be complaining.
jusk8lp 1 year ago
Mary Sues aka "Bella Swan" XD
korikuulei 1 year ago
Would Arista be a MarySue name?
DragonKeyJones 1 year ago
@DragonKeyJones Last name?
MelinaPendulum 1 year ago
@MelinaPendulum Her last name is Strouse
DragonKeyJones 1 year ago
@MelinaPendulum Her last name is Strouse
DragonKeyJones 1 year ago
Does moving really count as a tragic situation? I mean sure it may be difficult for some people, but it's not exactly a tragedy. Can I get away with having a character move at the start if they do not complain about it too much?
SxcLilAussieBabe 1 year ago
Question: Would Aubrey Wayne be a Mary Sue name? It seems average enough, but it's also very catchy . . . a little too catchy?
xYuriBunny 1 year ago
@xYuriBunny Sounds good to me. For a second I thought she was related to Batman XD
MelinaPendulum 1 year ago 8
@MelinaPendulum maybe she IS related to batman *dun dun dunnnn*
xYuriBunny 1 year ago
Yay, you have a Sesshomaru poster on your wall!
TwilitDreamSpirit 1 year ago
don't judge a book by it's cover...or summary
ccrstarpanda 1 year ago
I have a character who has a tragic life, but she's a supporting character, and I'm worried that I may make her the star of the show from her past, what should I do to not let a side character have the spotlight but still be a big role in the story?
VioletTeen17 1 year ago
If a Mary Sue gains super powers, she can't control them. She makes a lot of mistakes like bursting with powers when she shouldn't or something else. But everybody will say 'OMG, she is very very powerful even if she is a beginner'. Isn't it a bit anime-like :P ?
Cainmak 1 year ago
Comment removed
sunnyxlove1990 1 year ago
Actually I judge a book by it's cover, title, and then the summary (in that order). If i'm unsure of the summary, I check the themes it covers where are the copyright BS is located.
antiXincorporated 1 year ago
I'm likethis with you on the name bit, I feel the same way. I was actually creating a story and almost made this angsty girl named Raven and I had to catch myself.
Africana3789 1 year ago
I have no friends and I'm not insane. :)
AllanahBrooks 1 year ago 2
what makes a sue is not what their name is, or what they look like, or their "abilities". What makes a sue is how all the other characters and the environment react to them.
moonlady3000 1 year ago 2
I have characters with names like Emer, Luinae, Feolan, etc. But the whole entire freaking world has names like that because it is a Celtic/Welsh based fantasy world. It is weird in this world, but not in mine.
LuinaeLove 1 year ago
I feel main characters being orphans is being overdone to death - in my own fiction I try to avoid it (or at least try not to have them orphans from the start). I think it better to have the parents die DURING the story as it makes for a great source of conflict & opportunity for character development. Don't get me wrong, it's fine for main characters to be orphans, but it's just getting really overdone.
Anyway thanks so much for these videos! You give such great advice for aspiring writers.
Jianlibao 2 years ago 18
@Jianlibao I have one character who's an orphan but I actually have a reason for her being an orphan. i hate the fact that most people are like yeah their orphans they don't know their parents etc. they kinda rush through it. Some don't even explain why their orphans. >.< leaves me confused did the parents die were they left on a porch etc.. Totally agree with you though it is getting overdone.
simbalolo 5 months ago
Comment removed
Ishta5 2 months ago in playlist Melina On Writing
When main characters have Mary-Sueish names, it doesn't really bother me. It's when the main character AND their best friend have Mary-Sueish names that gets to me. I can buy that one person named their kid Ever,. I can't believe that one person named their kid Ever, and that another person named their kid Haven, and Ever and Haven happen to eventually become friends. Uh-uh. It just doesn't happen.
If that makes any sense at all.
TheNerdyCanuck 2 years ago 6
I completly agree with the powers thing, Wings by aprilynne pike is a really good book, because when the main character started getting powers, she hated them. It made it such a more interesting book than if she loved them.
pinkiegirl55 2 years ago
who doesn't use 20000-names? :D
MamaLuigiXYZ 2 years ago
My cousin named his daughter Amber Jade, and she's a real person in reality.
He's a gemologist.
ScottieDM 2 years ago 7
No it's not really Sue-ish in that case (the custom of naming girls after plants). Unless the "significance" you are talking about is some sort of great huge huge huge huge unveiling of the story (Like she is named after some powerful goddess or something).
bahamut285 2 years ago
Would using the name Erin but spelled in the original Irish way, 'Eireann' be sue-ish? She is Irish btw.
basketCaseAnna 2 years ago
I figure as long as there is a reason behind it it should be ok. For instance, the era your storyline takes place or where she lives. If she lives in Ireland or is born there, shouldn't be an issue. If she is from Kansas, no. If it takes place in the early times, then it is definitely fine.
DarwinwasWrong 2 years ago
Okay, Cool, Thanks.
It really has no time period, One of those fantasy's you can't pinpoint when it is. But her mother grew up in Ireland and is very into her heritage so she wanted to use it in the original form.
basketCaseAnna 2 years ago
Lol lame powers love that!
Kersian1 2 years ago 3
I have a question. Is it considered a Mary-Sue when I just completely torture my main character and the shit just keeps hitting the fan for her?
AutumnTwilight06 2 years ago
Sorry for bumping in, but what do you mean by "just keeps hitting the fan for her"?
gruslen 2 years ago
basically it means that bad stuff keeps happening to her.
AutumnTwilight06 2 years ago
Well, that would really depend on you. I mean, what are you doing to her and why are you torturing your main character?
gruslen 2 years ago
I'll have to work a bit on the loner thing ... There are thre things you've made me look especially on at my own story: Love affairs, the loner, male characters. Even if I think I have pretty good male characters, I think it needs to be shown more. And the loner thing ... Yea, need to work on that, too. And especially the love affair. I was already pretty unsatisfied with that one.
Lythya 2 years ago
Very good rant. I just wish I could easily convince this girl on Deviantart that her characters are total Sues.... I explained it to her as nicely as I could, yet she makes excuses, trying to sugar coat things with facts that don't make her characters any less of a Sue....
iAyaChii 2 years ago 5
I think I know who you're talking about. What's her username?
gruslen 2 years ago
I dunno, shes seems sort of new to posting anime fandom and stuff. Her username is Princess-Kiyoko. Shes a sweet kid, but she just doesn't understand when I try to explain these sort of things to her. She takes bits and pieces of ideas from other series and movies and incorperates them into her characters, having them make no sence at all... Mainly she'll use pokemon in just about ALL of her OCs stories. She changed one thanks to my criteria though.
iAyaChii 2 years ago
Yeah, I know this chick. She has the same complex I had when I was a lot younger. Hopefully she'll grow out of that phase. Nice dA, by the way. ^_^
gruslen 2 years ago
Yeah, hopefully.... but lately shes been making non-stop excuses about everything and its getting to where it probably wouldn't matter if i TRIED to give the oppinion she asked for herself.
And thanks. o w o
iAyaChii 2 years ago
Another thing you can do in regards to powers is for every positive power they have, also have a consequence for them, that way their power is not limitless and may not be useful everytime.
Examples from my character:
Speed Healing = Imperfect/Creates scars
Nocturnal Vision = Blinded in Daylight
Telepathy = Drive someone insane
Immortality = Body still ages while alive
ChibiShan18 2 years ago 40
I definately agree with the fact that 'the loner' is actually very unrealistic.
In real life, in normal society, you /rarely/ RARELY see someone who is /completely/ alone...
I mean, I'm pretty weird (I'll admit) and well, out there and even I have a pretty good social network going for a high school student.
Different =/= Loner.
TheSteveTheSecond 2 years ago
I enjoyed your video very much. It gave great insight on developing a character. One thing I think you should know is that it starts repeating itself around 7:54 . That's the only thing.
Mangafreak111 2 years ago 2
XDD lmao that shows you how week bella really is (not that we really needed it defined or anything, lol)
whitehousesvc729 2 years ago
I want to write my own book and one of my characters is named my own made up name
The thing is she isn't a mary sue...lol
do you think people would take it the wrong way for my characters pretty much having my own made up name, not all of them but maybe 2 of them.
You think people would mistake them for mary sues
ronvins 2 years ago
This helped me out with my novel alot. Thanks.
And I got you on the thing about keepin her interesting but not the greatest effing thing ever.
Ilovemywhiteboy 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
im not done watching, but before i continue...
Sci-fi is Science-fiction. Science-FICTION. Anything that happens that is, in our world, scientifically impossible. IS SCIENCE FICTION.
Just thought you should... understand the word.
inventiveinsanity 2 years ago
It's not completely true. The magic powers in Harry Potter are scientifically impossible and the series aren't science-fiction at all.
Science-fiction is a distortion of our world or an exploration of plausible worlds from actual knowledge (scientific, technologic, ethnological, etc) Most of the time, its elements are credible and they are put in a certain way to appear plausible.
Veelez 2 years ago 2
Hi Melina! I really admire your words of literature wisdom, so I'm coming to you for advice. i really don't want a sue, and I would love it if you could analyze my character and point out any sue-like qualities. If you are willing to help me out with this, please message me, if you don't have the time though, I understand :)
alikokoro 2 years ago
wiki what a sue is.
Examine your self.
If others tell you how it is done, you'll never learn.
inventiveinsanity 2 years ago
Oh, that thing about power, reminds me of Supernatural, the TV series. Sam, one of the main characters, he can see things that are about to happen, but he cant control it and it gives him headaches and stuff. All the other evil persons get like awsome powers, its funny, becuse hes power sort of sucks in comparison. Which is great, really. x)
SquekyMice 2 years ago 4
alot of sue names are human. Its the meaning and symbolism of the name that makes it sueish
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago 3
I have a character who's mother was killed, she was adopted and when she found out, she was sad of course, but she didn't get depressed, she just moved on with her life.
Does this make her a Mary Sue?
KuramaKohaku 2 years ago
Ruby and Amber don't strike me as "exotic" names. Sapphire, maybe.
Wintermute01001 2 years ago
Um, would names like Andromeda, Persephone, Theseus and other mythological names be considered a Sue name? I'm a huge fan of names like that or names like Spica or Draco and other star/astrological names but are they ruining my stories? I'm sorry if you're sick of comments like this.
anjumaakafan 2 years ago
Name is only part of it, so it depends on the character. I have a character named Persephone. ^^
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
@MelinaPendulum That reminds me of a Roman God for
some reason. I also made a story about this girl who has
a tragic life. The name is creepy since it's my own name that
I created...which makes it fit into "mary sueness" then. Crap.
The name is Kikora, her love I need to decide still either her
best friend, and vampire, Chiro or her new founded one, and
warewolf Yuki, a new student. Right now I need new names
I think.Still figuring out the whole vamp in light thing,but I could explain it
123naruhina 1 year ago
I know I'm not the girl who made the video, but I thought I'd give my opinion.
As long as the name of the character fits the setting -- like, ALL of the characters have mythologically based names or something, it's fine. But having an Andromeda in a world of Carls, Johns, Megans and the like would be a bit detrimental xD
DarkfireDraco 2 years ago 3
thanks. ^^
anjumaakafan 2 years ago
in my current story ( I am writing for an animated project)
all of my characters are from other countries
their names are not particular uncommon in their respective countries, but are uncommon here
They don't seem exotic to me, but I am aiming my animation at the common viewer
will ethnic names work?
thoughts anyone?
Mermann87 2 years ago
I'm not the author of the vid but I'd thought I'd offer advice. :D
Ethnic names can sometimes be tricky, like the author of the video said, if it has some sort of extreme deep meaning, or in most commonly made up "Japanese" names, have some sort of first or last name that frankly doesn't EXIST and they made it up for the purpose of a plot device.
But since you mentioned they are relatively common from their countries, I doubt it is a problem
bahamut285 2 years ago
Kudos to you. :]
KillerLoli88 2 years ago
Comment removed
TurkeyMayor 2 years ago
I think just as long as she doesn't end up being able to control them fully and become OMFGAWESOME! At the end, it seems to be really good :)
bahamut285 2 years ago 3
So smart :)you're putting honey on my heart by your rant!
For me, personally,a merysue was always mostly recognizable by the way other characters reacted to her-she could be a bitch with snotty comebacks and no respect for others(and those ARE flaws, and really big ones too!)yet everyone would still like her and want to be around her(and if someone didn't,he or she would be the BAD guy)...WTF!?Seriously, who likes people who act like that?!It makes me SO mad!;_;(sorry for my english ^^')
TheBlackLady 2 years ago 3
That's what I thought a Sue was as well - a character who seems to be worshipped by everyone regardless of how she behaves.
TurkeyMayor 2 years ago
First, I just want to say I love your videos - they're so helpful and entertaining. Also, please keep writing that series of yours, because I REALLY want to read it.
I just wanted to ask a question - is it mary-sueish to give a character an unusual name if you are creating a different world? Because it seems unlikely that people in a completely different world would have developed names like ours.
Aoife379 2 years ago
If everyone in that world has odd names, then it is fine ^.^
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Thanks. :)
Aoife379 2 years ago
I'm sorry to bother you, but is "Irene" a Mary-Sue name?
vindictaaeternus 2 years ago
No, its not
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Hey, hey, how about this:
Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way
Sue or not?
lunaticgoblin 2 years ago 44
You might have something there. Run with it. XD
...away from the lawyers of course. XP
Otamamon 2 years ago
DUH!!
ras144 2 years ago
Great video. In addition to having over the top names, a lot of Sues have, like, five middle names because the author couldn't settle for just 2 pretty names. They had to have ALL OF THEM. Ah, Mary Sues. I hate them so. I HATE THEM SO MUCH. AAAARGH.
ahem
I'm thinking of making a video response to this with my own Mary Sue thoughts. I need to have a nice, long rant.
VoidStone 2 years ago
Hey,
I like your videos and agree with a lot of your points, but I wonder why exactly 'Bella Swan' is a Mary-Sue. I personnally like her name: I don't think it's too exotic and apparently comes from Isabella. And she does have a lot of flaws: I suspect BDD since she's obviously a beautiful girl, yet has an extremely low self-esteem; she's very bad in dealing with something tragic(in new moon), she likes people just because they're beautiful, she can't stand up for herself,...
Angel1988xxxxxxx 2 years ago
Bella Swan=Beautiful Swan.
She has flaws, but are very treated as flaws. People think her clumsiness is cute, and all the 'bad' things about her either not acknowledged, or those who comment on them are treated at evil.
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Actually, characters that are strikingly beautiful but think they're average or ugly looking are more Mary Sueish than character that know they're hot. That's because the author is trying to have it both ways: the character is 'modest' which is considered a virtue, and it's supposed to make readers sympathize with her. ( "Oh, the poor dear! She's beautiful, but doesn't notice how wonderful she is!") It can be treated like a flaw, but rarely is.
VoidStone 2 years ago
your comments scare me becuase my charecters have powers and they have a lot of them but for two it's gentic and for one it was an inentinal alteration of his DNA so i think i'm saved from sue i think and 2 hate the powers and one likes them so i still think i'm safe....
writter1211987 2 years ago
Melenie Stryder.
The Host, pretty much Stephanie Meyer.
Wanderer, aka Wanda.
-pokes both with sticks and they leak hot air-
Yep, Mary Sues.
~Kendall (Sorry, this is my last comment)
DarkKendall 2 years ago
What do you think about the name Katherine?
I've always thought it was pretty...
DarkKendall 2 years ago
I like it
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
My character doesn't have really anyone to lean on because of her insane paranoia.
And yeah, she's going insane. And even though I'm doing it from her perspective, I personally think she's the antagonist and the person that doesn't like her is the protagonist.
But Mary, the protagonist, has a really good reason to hate her. She killed her brother, and he was her rock. She leaned on him. Now, she's going insane and having bubbling fury going in her mind.
So, yeah...
DarkKendall 2 years ago
I enjoy listening to your rants while I write.
So, I changed a few things in my story. About my main character.
1) Her nickname changed from 'Snow' to 'Sin'.
2) Her allias changed from 'Ruby Snow' to 'Lissa Sin'.
Is there anything wrong with this? The main name she is called, Sin, is made by the fact that she was a mistake.
-shrugs-
~Kendall
DarkKendall 2 years ago
What is her real name?
I think that people would judge your character as a sue by her name in all honesty. I think that if you find a name that means a sin would be more affective.
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Her real name is Anne Key, I like the simplicity of it.
But her real name isn't revealed till the very end of the story even though it is hinted at in chapter nine.
DarkKendall 2 years ago
I've now kinda started this but, everytime I make an OC, I try to pick a name for her with a meaning that best fits her character.
Rafa means "well being or prosperity" which when I took a look at it... is kinda ironic for my OC. So I kinda left it on their to point out the irony
Phoenixangelgal 2 years ago
would alexa be a sue name
plus8game 2 years ago
Its a great name
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Me and my friend are writing an Inuyasha fanfic with *gasp* an OC. We've been praised for our characterization of her. What do you think? xD (if you have time) It is uploaded to three sites, including MediaMiner org and Fanfiction net. The title is "Because of Tomomi".
littlekitsune1 2 years ago
Ok melina I have a massive problem here my villain well 1 of thenm is called heidi its based of someone i know and her aspects that make her a villain should I alter it because i noticed that meyer named one of her a heidi I am scared, thanks melina
SteveeAlbino 2 years ago
No. Meyer did not invent the name Heidi therefore you should use it ^^. Besides the chick is only there for what...5 seconds.
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Quick question: is "Meadow" a mary-sue name?
lemonluver99 2 years ago
Yes, it is. The name doesn't make your character a sue, but by the name people might think she is.
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Thanks, but I'm working really hard in making all my characters equal. She's not even the main character, I just wanted to make sure.
lemonluver99 2 years ago
I see Sesshomaru in the backround. I LUV HIM!!! I also love your rant. Keep it up! =D
lemonluver99 2 years ago
Nice video! I attempt writing every now and then, as well, but I wanna know your opinion on one thing.
How do you feel about names that foreshadow something? Do you think it takes away from the story, or do you think it adds another thing for readers to think about? Because I am never content with naming a character something just because it sounds good.
bendude606 2 years ago
Thank you.
Um names that foreshadow things are good as long as they are not tense overly exotic names. Also, last names are better for foreshadowing than first, imo
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Thanks for the quick reply, and your input :) Really great tips.
bendude606 2 years ago
God, I hated Evermore. I didn't get past the first thirty pages. And you're right, the name says a lot. I'm glad to see whenever I take the Mary Sue Litmus Test, my characters usually score low. It makes me feel accomplished. ^-^
Rischan789 2 years ago
O_O
I was destracted by the sexy dog demon in the background. ;D
PinkXParade 2 years ago 2
Hey!
Sesshy is mine
MelinaPendulum 2 years ago
Oh-ok. o.o
*backs away and finds Koga* x3
PinkXParade 2 years ago